Bankruptcy Filing Reveals What Dozens Of Mid-Level Touring Acts Get Paid

[sahhas]

from this article:
http://www.hypebot.com/hypebot/2012/02/bankruptcy-filing-reveals-what-dozens-of-mid-level-touring-acts-get-paid.html

Butthole Surfers $24,000.00
Clap Your Hands Say Yeah $22,000.00
Hanson $20,000.00
k.d. lang $20,000.00
Ozomatli $20,000.00
Bobby Womack $15,000.00
Gayngs $13,000.00
Peaches $12,800.00
Lil' Jon $10,000.00
Tapes 'n Tapes $10,000.00
Art Brut $8000.00
Arthur Adams $6000.00
Charles Bradley $5500.00
Dum Dum Girls $5000.00
Helmet $5000.00
Rooney $5000.00
The Growlers $5000.00
The Melvins $3300.00
Butch Walker & the Black Widows $3000.00
EC Twins $3000.00
The Original Vandellas $2500.00
Kim Weston $2250.00
Brenda Holloway $1500.00
DJ Trent Cantrelle $1500.00
Morgan Page $1500.00
Natalia Kills $1500.00
The Hundred Days $1250.00
400 Blows $1000.00
Cary Brothers $1000.00
Madi Diaz $1000.00
Soft Pack $1000.00
The Rescues $1000.00
DJ Swedish Egil $800.00
DJ Lazr Tag $750.00
DJ Reflect $750.00
He's My Brother She's My Sister $750.00
Lemon Love $750.00
The Stripminers $750.00
Chris Pierce $650.00
Arm The Animals $550.00
DJ David Palmer $500.00
DJ Drew $500.00
DJ Fashen $500.00
LA Derby Dolls $500.00
Lady Danville $500.00
Nick Waterhouse $500.00
Shadow Shadow Shade $500.00
Sunny War $500.00
The Belle Brigade $500.00
The Fling $500.00
Vanaprasta $500.00
Vaud And The Villains $500.00
Art vs Science $480.00
DJ Derterous $450.00
30 Years After $350.00
Carina Round $350.00
Jim Bianco $350.00
Milo Greene $350.00
Barrio Tiger $250.00
Cinderella Motel $250.00
Greylag $250.00
Hands $250.00
Holly Conlan $250.00
Lesands $250.00
Nicole Eva Emery $250.00
Olin & The Moon $250.00
The Bitter Branches $250.00
The Steelwells $250.00
The Three Degrees $250.00
Ruby Summer $200.00
The Damselles & The TC4 $200.00
Buddy $150.00
Erin McLaughlin $150.00
Yellow Red Sparks $150.00

[hank57]

And you posted this because? To shame? To Troll? To educate? To have thunder by having info?

[pickaguitar]

I assumed he posted it as simply informational...are those fees per show op?

[Lance]

You git'em, Johnny!

[DRS]

KD Lang $20,000
If you do 100 nights a year, that could be OK $$$.

[Melodyman]

lol at some of the responses. :rotflmao

[DRS]

And you posted this because? To shame? To Troll? To educate? To have thunder by having info?
I'm interested. In fact, I'm fascinated. Why not?

[circusinthesky]

I like living in a world where The Butthole Surfers would have been the top paid band at the event.


_iVSGenjQLY
John was a little crippled midget lesbian boy, but he stood ten foot tall with a knife.

[saltydogg]

Is that annual or, per show?

[travisvwright]

Paid per? Show Tour Year?

[hank57]

I was curious.

In the late 80s I think the Dead got under 40K per, playing the outdoor smaller fairground locations.

Lance! I might play with Stu Allen one of these days...maybe bass.

[circusinthesky]

Its for one specific event in LA. Does no one click on the OP's included link?

After LA's Sunset Junction Neighborhood Alliance was denied permits and forced to cancel their event, they filed for Chapter 7 bankruptcy protection. Included in the $900,000 of liabilities are the unpaid fees of 74 artists.

[liquidswords]

Is that annual or, per show?

My question too. I hope it's per show. Butch Walker certainly deserves it after his home burned down.

[A-Bone]

Its for one specific event in LA. Does no one click on the OP's included link?

After LA's Sunset Junction Neighborhood Alliance was denied permits and forced to cancel their event, they filed for Chapter 7 bankruptcy protection. Included in the $900,000 of liabilities are the unpaid fees of 74 artists.

Short answer, "no".

[mannish]

I never heard of most of those people

[bicktrav]

Considering that some wedding bands charge in the area of $5,000 - $10,000 for a performance, it shouldn't be surprising that a band like Clap Your Hands And Say Yeah or the Butthole Surfers are getting around $20,000. But it still is.

[Dave Orban]

Per show, and probably with the promoter/venue providing backline, sound, etc., and possibly even transpo/lodging.

[Zounds Perspex]

hard to believe Melvins only get $3300 per show.

[Jahn]

Helmet only gets 5 grand to perform? Man.

[twoheadedboy]

This doesn't tell us what the bands were being paid for (e.g., single booking, multiple bookings). I don't think there's enough information to make any reasonable conclusions.

[jtm622]

If the guys on that list are considered "mid-level", then we can only speculate what acts are on the "low-level" list... :)

[xjojox]

Wonder if any of those were "balance due" after an advance.

$250... that's not even a decent bar gig. But younger acts would probably do it for, as the agent would say, "the great exposure".

[sws1]

You mean I can hire the Melvins for my wedding...and SAVE a few bucks? SWEET

[John Hurtt]

I never heard of most of those people

You and me both...and they are "mid-level" acts?

[axuality.com]

I just read the the Beatles only got $3000 for each Ed Sullivan show appearance. And the average for a performer on that show was $7500. Same place said they got about $190,000 for playing Shea Stadium the second time. 160k the first time. Tickets were $4, 4.50 and $5.

http://www.beatlemoney.com/beatles6467touring.htm

[tiktok]

Yeah, man--but the real money is in the T-SHIRTS AND MERCH!

[Shiny McShine]

I'm thinking that musician should be a euphemism for bankrupt. It just goes without saying. Like this:

"Have you ever declared bankruptcy?"
"Hey, I'm a musician."
"Oh, that's right, sorry."

[gillman royce]

I just read the the Beatles only got $3000 for each Ed Sullivan show appearance. And the average for a performer on that show was $7500. Same place said they got about $190,000 for playing Shea Stadium the second time. 160k the first time. Tickets were $4, 4.50 and $5.

http://www.beatlemoney.com/beatles6467touring.htm

A lot of this doesn't sound right. The FAbs got $10k ($71K in today's money) for the three appearances on Ed. I seriously doubt the average pay on Sullivan was $7500 in 1964 - that would be a little over $53K in today's money - for roughly what , 10 minutes work ? Seattleites chime in but to my knowledge, no such promotor named Mighty Mitch Mitchell was involved in the two Seattle stops of The Beatles. Know for a fact Pat O'Day handled the '66 stop.

[hearmecrybaby]

queue the troll thread railing against The Yellow Red Sparks for hurting musicians everywhere by agreeing to play for $150.

[EricPeterson]

queue the troll thread railing against The Yellow Red Sparks for hurting musicians everywhere by agreeing to play for $150.

I feel so devalued.

[fjblair]

Interesting, but few of the artists/bands listed are what I consider mid-level. I have a friend who books 3-4 small outdoor festivals a year(mostly country/bluegrass/southern rock) and it's really surprising what some bands are asking. They throw out all kinds of numbers depending on the time of year and how it fits their schedule.

$25k-$75k for what I would call mid-level.

[paranoid70]

There is a band called 30 Years After. Did they form 20 years before 10 Years After?!

[arthur rotfeld]

Sounds like a festival that didn't get off the ground, but contracts were signed and booked bands want to get paid.

Some of these acts are local, probably second or third stage type thing. My guess......

[Jon C]

I can tell you in the mid 70s the Allman Bros. were getting $25k; Stevie Wonder $10k; Loggins & Messina ~7500-10k; Steely Dan $7,500 ... I have a notebook full of quotes from our booking agent from '74-76. Oh, BTW, in '74-75 Bruce Springsteen & the E St. Band: $1,750-3,500 (dep. on venue &c.), I booked him for $1,750.

John McLaughlin/ Mahavishnu Orch. - $3,500; Weather Report - $3,500; New Riders of the Purple Sage - $8k; ....

[Jonnygeetard]

I need to up my performance fee of beer and chicken wings.

[Sweetfinger]

Sounds like a festival that didn't get off the ground, but contracts were signed and booked bands want to get paid.

Some of these acts are local, probably second or third stage type thing. My guess......

Yup.
"After LA's Sunset Junction Neighborhood Alliance was denied permits and forced to cancel their event, they filed for Chapter 7 bankruptcy protection. Included in the $900,000 of liabilities are the unpaid fees of 74 artists."

[jayn]

KD Lang $20,000
If you do 100 nights a year, that could be OK $$$.

She gets more than that in some locations...sometimes, much more.

[Scooter Burbank]

Sounds like a festival that didn't get off the ground, but contracts were signed and booked bands want to get paid.

Some of these acts are local, probably second or third stage type thing. My guess......

The Sunset Junction was a great festival here for many years. They block off Sunset Blvd. in Silver Lake and usually have four or five stages. For local acts, this was a very coveted gig and it usually was a pretty LA centric thing. X played one year. Circle Jerks. The festival got bigger and they started getting more out of town acts. Always a great time at the Sunset Junction. There was always an electronic stage, an R&B stage, an indie stage and so on. It was rumored that it wasn't going to continue a couple of years ago but it did. Then finally last year it was canceled.

My guess is those figures are not necessarily typical for these artists, but I don't know.

[OOG]

She gets more than that in some locations...sometimes, much more.

She deserves it
She also takes very good care of her bands

[Floyd Eye]

Helmet and The Melvins are underpaid.

[Zingeroo]

I'm interested. In fact, I'm fascinated. Why not?

Isn't it ridiculous to have your motives questioned? Like artist pay is some big secret, and you just blew the lid off the whole thing. I'm fascinated also.

[Gas-man]

Fwiw, I know a promoter who wanted to book Rascal Flatts a few years ago.

One mil.

Hits matter folks. That is why Hanson can get $20k.

*Begins singing Mmmbopp*

[EricPeterson]

Fwiw, I know a promoter who wanted to book Rascal Flatts a few years ago.

One mil.

Hits matter folks. That is why Hanson can get $20k.

*Begins singing Mmmbopp*

I will sing Mmmm-Bop for half that, I guess I have a price.

[michael stuart 57]

How much if the Beatles get back together?

[Manic Manager]

not very good as a measure of the acts value. with every tour you are filling in holes or certain markets are stronger for an act. from experience I can tell you in a long three month tour we could make a few hundred in a small market, were we had very little recognition or a opening slot....then at a later date on the same tour pull in 30-50k...(major label act of course). But at the end of the day (or tour) it all goes in the one big pot (the bank)...lot's of folks get paid from it....lawyers, booking agents, managers, biz managers, hired keyboard player, sound man, tour manager, merch person, bus driver, guitar tech, and assistant....did I leave anyone out...oh yah...the IRS. and now that deals are 360 the label takes a huge cut.


in regards to tv appearances...most are dictated by the union standards which are ridiculously low. That's another story....but the musicians union ain't no SAG (screen actors guild). Playing on a show like....Letterman, each player will get a few hundred. Not thousands! Much of this is consider promo and an investment in your business...that's what your manager will tell you.

it is complicated and this doesn't tell the story of a bands income from shows.

[hearmecrybaby]

Fwiw, I know a promoter who wanted to book Rascal Flatts a few years ago.

One mil.

Hits matter folks. That is why Hanson can get $20k.

*Begins singing Mmmbopp*

hanson has a small but incredibly dedicated fanbase that follows them all over the US. its a whole subculture.

[sahhas]

i did not mean to offend or do anything about posting this.
i saw it posted on FB. this info came out of a bankruptcy proceedings.
(public record)
there have been posts in the past of folks wondering about the $$ involved w/ the music industry...i just thought this was interesting.
we always hear about how much the top artists make touring, etc...
just found this interesting.
yes, my comment to when this was posted, was seeing the
melvins fee or what was owed them. the fact that kurt cobain loved
the melvins, tried out to be in the band, dreamed of it, that's all he
originally wanted....
just found it interesting....

[reverendfrankie]

And you posted this because? To shame? To Troll? To educate? To have thunder by having info?

Ummm - I'm sorry I don't actually find anything demeaning about this thread, it's kinda educational.

Rev.

[tsar nicholas]

I like living in a world where The Butthole Surfers would have been the top paid band at the event.



^ My thoughts exactly. Best news I've heard all year.





I can't believe HELMET gets only $5000 though

[tsar nicholas]

hanson has a small but incredibly dedicated fanbase that follows them all over the US. its a whole subculture.

^ is this for real?

[PAF]

wtf with the sub $1000/night acts - "mid level touring" my a$$

[yoyoyoseph]

In the late 80s I think the Dead got under 40K per, playing the outdoor smaller fairground locations.

Further now makes well into the 6 figures to play a festival. They each have their own buses.

[diagrammatiks]

that post really didn't say anything informative.

not the sets, who was headlining...

nobody actually worked the festival because there was no festival.

[TimSt.L]

And you posted this because? To shame? To Troll? To educate? To have thunder by having info?
I think it's pretty informational and sheds light on the idea that once your "signed" or "on tour" then you've "made it". I know there are many kids that pretty much think the music biz just hands you a bottomless credit card or something as soon as you tour.

I played St.louis' Verizon amphitheatre a couple times at festivals and have gone out on small tours. I remember a kid approached me at the gas station and recognised who I was, but I was in my work uniform. And he said, "what happened?" With this really concerned look on his face.I asked what he meant and he said, "why are you still working? You guys played Verizon amphitheatre! " I just kinda laughed.

.. then got in my car and cried like a little girl.

(Just kidding on that last line)

[TimSt.L]

hard to believe Melvins only get $3300 per show.
I think it's believable, but kinda a shame.
They're coming to St.L soon! I know I'll be there!

[tsar nicholas]

^ Yeah, Melvins are titans artistically speaking, but no pop hits and their major-label heyday was like 15 years ago or more. They should be up there with the B. Surfers at least, but no accounting for the public's taste.



On the other hand, getting paid $3300 to play avant-garde metal is pretty awesome in its own right

[Hunterdog]

Lil' Jon was seriously being overpaid.

[Gas-man]

Lil' Jon was seriously being overpaid.


At least I recognized his name on that list.

[greggorypeccary]

hanson has a small but incredibly dedicated fanbase that follows them all over the US. its a whole subculture.

That's a scary thought.

[dunara]

Hits matter folks. That is why Hanson can get $20k.
I think that's probably true; but why then can you get the Three Degrees for $250? :confused:

[Antelope]

I don't think you can deduce from this that this is what these acts get paid per performance. It's a bankruptcy filing, so it reflects what is owed, not necessarily what the full fee was. It's entirely possible that some or all of the acts were already paid something, just not the entire amount for which they contracted, with these amounts representing the balance.

[B Money]

That's a scary thought.

I don't want to derail this thread, but I gotta say; Hanson is really good. They're way more than "Mmmm bop".

[Rockledge]

How pathetic has music become that the top paid is "butthole surfers". Sheeeeesh......

['58Bassman]

My question too. I hope it's per show. Butch Walker certainly deserves it after his home burned down.

What does his house burning have to do with how much he should be paid? He should have been insured and if not, it's his problem, not the paying audience. Sure, he may have lost irreplaceable items but that could happen to anyone- how will more money make up for that?

Unless he kept his life's savings in his house and lost everything, he's not in bad shape, financially. If he has a mortgage, he HAS to have homeowner's insurance.

[Rockledge]

What does his house burning have to do with how much he should be paid? He should have been insured and if not, it's his problem, not the paying audience. Sure, he may have lost irreplaceable items but that could happen to anyone- how will more money make up for that?

Unless he kept his life's savings in his house and lost everything, he's not in bad shape, financially. If he has a mortgage, he HAS to have homeowner's insurance.
That is what I was thinking. Normally benefit concerts are thrown by someone other than the benefactor.

[mrdavek]

What does his house burning have to do with how much he should be paid? He should have been insured and if not, it's his problem, not the paying audience. Sure, he may have lost irreplaceable items but that could happen to anyone- how will more money make up for that?

Unless he kept his life's savings in his house and lost everything, he's not in bad shape, financially. If he has a mortgage, he HAS to have homeowner's insurance.

Not to be a downer...but he lost EVERYTHING in the house...he was renting it from the owner (Flea) while they were finalizing the sale of the home..and therefore he only had "renters insurance"...It covered 2%!

It's actually a very sad story..all his vintage guitars, master tapes, studio equipment , personal possessions...everything was gone!

And TRUST me..he gets paid more than $3000!

[Stike]

My question too. I hope it's per show. Butch Walker certainly deserves it after his home burned down.

As good as he is live he deserves more.

[harpinon]

Yes it is per show. I feel sorry for mclaughlin and yellow red sparks.
I thought $250 a show was terrible with my old band.

[chrisjw5]

I dated a girl who did event planning for big corporations.

Now, I know corporate gigs pay more, but I was still blown away that Hootie and the Blowfish were getting $225,000 for 90 minutes back in 2007.

[Zingeroo]

How pathetic has music become that the top paid is "butthole surfers". Sheeeeesh......

I'm guessing you never listened to the Butthole Surfers.

[tim gueguen]

Hell, the Surfers have been around long enough that they almost qualify as classic rock.

[djdrdave]

I dated a girl who did event planning for big corporations.

Now, I know corporate gigs pay more, but I was still blown away that Hootie and the Blowfish were getting $225,000 for 90 minutes back in 2007.

I ended up having a small wedding, no music or anything. Glad I didn't hire Hootie and the Blowfish for the wedding, that would have really blown the budget.

[hearmecrybaby]

^ is this for real?

true story. I met this girl who has seen them in like 5 states. She has a whole group of "hanson" friends too. It's actually pretty interesting.

[Veritas]

All those sub-$1000 acts must have been small stage, local acts. I doubt this one event is very indicative of what most of these acts actually make on a nightly basis. Guarantees are generally variable depending on the event, how much travel is involved, the amount of people they are expecting...are you getting a cut of the ticket sales?, etc... I wouldn't use this one festival as too much of a barometer.

To those who don't know...Butch Walker is a big deal in the world of producing these days. So...in a way, it is surprising that he was only getting $3000. His solo project, I suppose, isn't his bread and butter. He is, however, making a killing in producing and writing. Bummer to hear about his house burning down. That sucks...especially with all his awesome gear stored there.

[soulohio]

I'm guessing you never listened to the Butthole Surfers.

....or seen them...like I did in Cleveland circa 1988. That groove was wide and thick, me boy....I actually expected much less and they blew the doors off the place...

[spamsponge]

I dated a girl who did event planning for big corporations.

Now, I know corporate gigs pay more, but I was still blown away that Hootie and the Blowfish were getting $225,000 for 90 minutes back in 2007.

Someone has to pay Antares for all that autotune gear...

[Lukeling]

No way KD Lang is only getting $20 000 a gig so obviously some payments had been made but I am shocked that Butthole Surfers get paid that much !! Good on them !

[mwc2112]

No way KD Lang is only getting $20 000 a gig so obviously some payments had been made

Maybe someone here who has done promotions can clarify, but I would think that there might be a 'cancellation fee' that is independent of (or based on a percentage of) their 'performance fee'. So the liabilities to these artists are those cancellation fees as opposed to the full amount they would have been paid had they actually performed.

Maybe? Or am I :bong?

[travisvwright]

Maybe someone here who has done promotions can clarify, but I would think that there might be a 'cancellation fee' that is independent of (or based on a percentage of) their 'performance fee'. So the liabilities to these artists are those cancellation fees as opposed to the full amount they would have been paid had they actually performed.

Maybe? Or am I :bong?
My thought also. This is the fee due for not playing. Maybe maybe not related to the fee for actually playing.

[guitarz1972]

There is a band called 30 Years After. Did they form 20 years before 10 Years After?!

:rotflmao


I never heard of most of those people


+1. I went through the entire list (and I did open the link as well). I recognized no more than ten names, some just vaguely.

[aliensporebomb]

Some illuminating fee structures.

For some reason I remember Art Brut as being from around here but they're a UK band? Paltry to travel all that way and then not get even that.

[disfrontman]

My understanding, from the last time I checked booking fees, was that a reliable rule-of-thumb is that any band who ever had a Top 40 hit of any kind was usually able to get a minimum of $10k per gig. Anyone with a Top 10 hit is looking at a $25k floor at the worst.

At this level artist booking fees only cover the artist's appearance. Transportation, lodging, and show production are not included. The booking fee is essentially the artist's take-home pay (musicians + management).

[autonomous]

This is the reason people try to write songs that are catchy and poppy! So they can make a living in the music industry. Would you rather be poor or "sell out." My guess is that you would sacrifice a bit of your artistic values for the millions that others may of made in the music industry. I don't think Lady gaga is thinking about where her mortgage is going to come from this month. As much as I hate her, I'm happy she's successful.

[disfrontman]

Sometimes that pop single can finance the rest of an artist's career. "Brown-Eyed Girl" and "Werewolves of London" certainly don't typify the lifetime artistic contributions of Van Morrison and Warren Zevon, but they helped pay the bills for the headier material.

[dancehall]

in regards to tv appearances...most are dictated by the union standards which are ridiculously low. That's another story....but the musicians union ain't no SAG (screen actors guild). Playing on a show like....Letterman, each player will get a few hundred. Not thousands! Much of this is consider promo and an investment in your business...that's what your manager will tell you.

Until this thread I actually had no idea bands got paid at all to play shows like that. I thought it was all just publicity. I'd certainly do Letterman for free!

[Lution]

ponders hiring The Melvins for a local show. . . and opening for them.