Have You Ever Just Moved To A Foreign Country To Live For A Few Months???

[RAILhead]

LONG STORY SHORT...

My wife and I are actually, seriously, thinking of just taking off to Ireland or France, finding a little apartment, and living there for 2-3 months. We're still a 6-12 months away off from doing this, but it's coming.

Has anyone here ever done anything like that? How did you go about finding a place? Pick a random realtor/apartment locator? Make a short trip and look for yourself?

[wcraven]

Does the whole "house swap" thing only exist in movies? That would seem like an easy way to exchange some experiences.

[Orville Greco]

Be careful, I did that in the fall of 1991 & I am still here, planned on 6mths maybe a yr, now going on 2+ decades & counting LOL!

[hamstrat]

I did the Ireland 3 month stays twice when I was younger (and single). I do have dual citizenship Ireland/U.S.A. so I felt I should get to know my other country and relatives. Still try to go every 3 or 4 years.

Lived in England for work and traveled all over western Europe. In my case each time after about a few months I was missing home an awful lot. I knew it was time to go home when the little things started to bother me- crappy service everywhere, shite plumbing in tiny bathrooms, had to wear a sweater or jacket most everywhere because everyone keeps the temperature around 60. Oh yeah, "Mind Your Head", I'm 6'2" but most doorways are about 6' in older places-of which there are many. The food is France is magnificent. Ditto for Spain. At least those were my experiences.

I'd recommend going over for awhile to anyone if they have the opportunity. You will never forget it and it will give you a new take on life in Europe.

All in all I love visiting but it does make me appreciate home much more.

[mcdes]

me and the wife are contemplating the same thing, for a season, but a long enough one that ill have to close my business down, which is huge, but...... yea, bigger picture.

[mslugano]

Yes, do it if you can. I wish more Americans would do this, really, because it opens your mind to other cultures/mores. It is a wonderful way to learn tolerance (or else, for the less open-minded, just get frustrated and tuck tail and run).

Over the last 15 years, I have lived for extended periods in Switzerland, London, Glasgow, Dubai, Kuwait and Ramallah (Palestine) and have traveled extensively throughout the Middle East and North Africa, eastern Europe and south Asia. Next month, I have travel plans for Cairo, Amman and Almaty, Kazakhstan. My kids are well on their way to speaking five languages and I truly feel like a citizen of the world.

World travel and especially extended stays are very good for the soul, IME.

[playsarobin]

How do peoPle (in general) afford to do something like this??
Gotta be self employed or easily contracted I guess. Or have the ability to work from any location.

I'd love to see the world but just packing and going for 3 months just seems, well, impossible to me.

[Orville Greco]

yes you really need to bring a job along so to speak, get transfered overseas, win the lottery or just be young single & a bit crazy to p/u & move!

[cradlerock]

If you're planning on not working, and you have a decent amount of cash, I'd say go for it. Labour law in France and the EU generally, makes it difficult for US citizens to find employment. The French employment market being as it is, makes it really difficult to get a decent job, unless you really know the ropes. Unemployment in France is at 10%, Ireland 14%. There is a crisis going on.

I'm Irish and I've been living in France for 8 and a half years. If you want to meet friendly folk, sit and shoot the breeze in truly great pubs, and don't mind the rain, go to Ireland. You won't get that in France. Food is good tho', the wine is incredible.

Renting a place in France can be quite complicated, I wouldn't exactly call it a free market; so many protection mechanisms in place so as poor people don't get kicked out on the street for not paying their rent, that the owner class protect themselves against being ripped off by creating huge barriers to decent housing. PM me if you've any questions, I know these two countries pretty well.

Oh, finally, I wouldn't recommend coming for a few months and looking for work - come with money in your pocket and have a good time. Unless of course you can sort out a job before coming, then by all means, I'm sure it'll be quite a blast.

[RAILhead]

We won't need to work, thankfully -- though I plan on being able to build and ship my effects pedals from there.

We've been to Europe before, as well, but only Paris, London, and Italy...spent 3 weeks weeks over there. We also go to Cambodia twice a year for our non-profit (http://www.compassion4.org), so going to and staying in a foreign country isn't foreign to us.

There's just a lot of things going on around here at home that has us seeking an escape/mental rest, and further, I don't plan on staying in the US forever. We plan to retire and live out our last days in the countryside of France, Ireland, or Italy, far enough away from people to have peace and quiet, yet close enough to get what we need to live. We're thinking it'd be great to "try out" some of these retirement options by living there for a couple/few months.

Tot hat end, I'm just not sure how to go about finding a place. I would guess there are firms in the US that have connections to firms in the other countries, then appointments are setup, etc...???

[gillman royce]

that the owner class protect themselves against being ripped off by creating huge barriers to decent housing.

Not at all a fair or accurate picture. I've lived in France and own property there. The country is rent controlled. You can't raise rents whenever you want and when you can, if it keeps up with inflation, you're lucky. You can't pass on the costs of maintenance or repairs. You can't evict someone for non payment of rent, even 6-12 months on, let alone for any other reason. This "creating huge barriers to decent housing " statement is crazy. The country has a Socialist Government which dictates everything. There are so many layers of bureaucracy you have to deal with - and buy off - it will make your head spin. EVERYONE is on the take, beginning with the cops. It's almost impossible to fire someone from their job and you are required to take people back - mother OR father - after their year+ maternity leave. Try running a business under those circumstances, especially a sales force - which is why everyone tries to get a government job.The country operates on a 35 hour work week with two months paid vacation. Every September the illegal strikes start before the ' legal ' strikes, usually of transportation and education start in October. Every year over 30,000 cars are torched. Many apartment buildings throughout the country are well over 100 years old and unless you are willing to find and pay for temporary housing for your renters, you aren't going to be pulling down buildings and putting up modern housing. " Owner class " ?? Last election which Sarkozy won the opposition was talking about raising income taxes to 60% on top of city building-ownership taxes. I'm sorry, but I'm still laughing at this ' owner class ' comment. That's like calling any middle class American with a mortgage Landed Gentry. The only people who discuss class warfair in France are those who usually are unemployed/unemployable, ride the system for all the free perks and when that dries up, call for the country to go communist. You should see the fakers who con the disability game to collect lifetime public assistance - who do you think pays for that ? If you drove a bus you can retire at age 50 with 90% pension. I have to wonder why the author of this reply left Ireland - for the longest time it was the boom of Europe. If there's one thing that coming from America that will drive you crazy about living in France for any period of time is the total lack of efficiency - everything can wait til they get around to it and what is this thing you Americans keep referring to - ' Customer service ' ?

[RAILhead]

Let's try to stay on topic so this doesn't devolve into a political flamewar, please. I understand the desire to clear up a potentially poor generalization, but this thread is about how an American can go about finding a 2-3 month rental property in Ireland or France...

[jpftribe]

I have two suggestions for you, and a third recommendation on what not to do.

First, check long term rental vacation sites.
Second, there is a home exchange website that I have used when we had a 2nd vacation home. I drew a lot of interest from Ireland, Scotland and England. Unfortunately I was never able to use it because we lost the second home in a fire, long story.

The thing I wouldn't do is try and rent residential property. Setting up utilities, bank accounts are things you take for granted in the states, but very difficult to do without residency and visa's. Even getting a mobile phone account is a big deal. You have zero credit outside the US.

If you can secure a valid address ahead of time, I would try and set up an overseas account well in advance. Transfer money before you go in bulk and draw out of a local account. You'll get much better exchange rates on a large transfer. Using US credit or debit cards overseas for an extended period will be expensive.

If you have a mobile phone with data usage, ie iphone, android or BB, plan on getting a local phone or plan on not using data. Data usage for US accounts is extraordinarily expensive.

Edit:
Check the visa requirements wherever you are planning to go. Most countries won't let you stay longer than 90 days without a visa, and getting one without sponsorship or a ton of dough that you are willing to bring with you, is not easy.

[RAILhead]

I have two suggestions for you, and a third recommendation on what not to do.

First, check long term rental vacation sites.
Second, there is a home exchange website that I have used when we had a 2nd vacation home. I drew a lot of interest from Ireland, Scotland and England. Unfortunately I was never able to use it because we lost the second home in a fire, long story.

The thing I wouldn't do is try and rent residential property. Setting up utilities, bank accounts are things you take for granted in the states, but very difficult to do without residency and visa's. Even getting a mobile phone account is a big deal. You have zero credit outside the US.

If you can secure a valid address ahead of time, I would try and set up an overseas account well in advance. Transfer money before you go in bulk and draw out of a local account. You'll get much better exchange rates on a large transfer. Using US credit or debit cards overseas for an extended period will be expensive.

If you have a mobile phone with data usage, ie iphone, android or BB, plan on getting a local phone or plan on not using data. Data usage for US accounts is extraordinarily expensive.

Edit:
Check the visa requirements wherever you are planning to go. Most countries won't let you stay longer than 90 days without a visa, and getting one without sponsorship or a ton of dough that you are willing to bring with you, is not easy.

Vacation home rental is where I was thinking. Thanks for the insight and thoughts! I agree that while a residential might be nice as it could put us further from the city, it would be more trouble than it's worth. I think a 2-3 month immersion in the city center-ish area, in an apartment (or something along those lines) would probably be best. This would let us "try out" the city and help us decide on a place to retire.

[coldwaternights]

Yes, do it if you can. I wish more Americans would do this, really, because it opens your mind to other cultures/mores. It is a wonderful way to learn tolerance (or else, for the less open-minded, just get frustrated and tuck tail and run).

Over the last 15 years, I have lived for extended periods in Switzerland, London, Glasgow, Dubai, Kuwait and Ramallah (Palestine) and have traveled extensively throughout the Middle East and North Africa, eastern Europe and south Asia. Next month, I have travel plans for Cairo, Amman and Almaty, Kazakhstan. My kids are well on their way to speaking five languages and I truly feel like a citizen of the world.

World travel and especially extended stays are very good for the soul, IME.

What was it like living in Ramallah?
I've always been curious about that but figured it's just too dangerous and volatile there. I admire your traveling experiences though, that's pretty amazing and i agree about trying be a citizen of the world. So much out there to see and experience.

[mslugano]

Vacation home rental is where I was thinking. Thanks for the insight and thoughts! I agree that while a residential might be nice as it could put us further from the city, it would be more trouble than it's worth. I think a 2-3 month immersion in the city center-ish area, in an apartment (or something along those lines) would probably be best. This would let us "try out" the city and help us decide on a place to retire.

My brother owns a surfing/fishing B&B on the Pacific in Nicaragua and uses the following site to book long term guests. Perhaps you can find something in the EU here. http://www.vrbo.com/

[mslugano]

What was it like living in Ramallah?
I've always been curious about that but figured it's just too dangerous and volatile there. I admire your traveling experiences though, that's pretty amazing and i agree about trying be a citizen of the world. So much out there to see and experience.

That's a great question.

I am originally from Texas and we like to pride ourselves on "southern hospitality" but the people of Ramallah and Syria (where I've also spent a lot of time) put us to shame. These people are truly and genuinely some of the most gracious, hospitable, honorable, loving and generous people I have ever had the pleasure of getting to know.

The food is perhaps the best on the planet (yea, including bar-b-q and Tex-Mex) and you'll find that you must stop eating with a full plate in front of you or it WILL be refilled to the hilt again and again and again... Then, they'll insist upon putting you up in their home for as long as you want and, of course, they will throw a party on your behalf at the drop of a hat...very, very fun folks.

Crime is non-existent (in Ramallah, the murder rate is less than one person per year) and I never felt even remotely scared/intimidated even though I am an obvious 6'4" American gringo. I was always treated with the utmost respect.

Bottom line is I love that part of the world and the people that live there are truly wonderful. It's an awful, pitiful shame that both normal Palestinians and Syrians are having to live with the shameful attacks (financial, emotional, political and personal) that they are currently experiencing but, please understand, it is not an indication of who they are but instead it's a result of the people that have the might to inflict these shameful crimes upon them.

[coldwaternights]

That's a great question.

I am originally from Texas and we like to pride ourselves on "southern hospitality" but the people of Ramallah and Syria (where I've also spent a lot of time) put us to shame. These people are truly and genuinely some of the most gracious, hospitable, honorable, loving and generous people I have ever had the pleasure of getting to know.

The food is perhaps the best on the planet (yea, including bar-b-q and Tex-Mex) and you'll find that you must stop eating with a full plate in front of you or it WILL be refilled to the hilt again and again and again... Then, they'll insist upon putting you up in their home for as long as you want and, of course, they will throw a party on your behalf at the drop of a hat...very, very fun folks.

Crime is non-existent (in Ramallah, the murder rate is less than one person per year) and I never felt even remotely scared/intimidated even though I am an obvious 6'4" American gringo. I was always treated with the utmost respect.

Bottom line is I love that part of the world and the people that live there are truly wonderful. It's an awful, pitiful shame that both normal Palestinians and Syrians are having to live with the shameful attacks (financial, emotional, political and personal) that they are currently experiencing but, please understand, it is not an indication of who they are but instead it's a result of the people that have the might to inflict these shameful crimes upon them.

I'm with you 110% on this one.
Id elaborate, but there's no need and plus i'd get in trouble anyway.
That doesn't surprise me though to hear about their hospitality. I know someone who stayed in Gaza and said the same thing. As for the crime rates, i wasn't referring to that i was referring to possible violence from the occupying forces.
So, what prompted you to start leading this kind of life? How do your kids handle it ? It sounds enriching but also challenging too, i would imagine especially for kids.
Anyway, cheers to you and your travels and perspective. :)

[Glowing Tubes]

What a great thing to do. I had planned on exactly doing that but the wife changed her mind when we were preparing for it. I still wish I could have done it. Especially France.

[mslugano]

[/B]

I'm with you 110% on this one.
Id elaborate, but there's no need and plus i'd get in trouble anyway.
That doesn't surprise me though to hear about their hospitality. I know someone who stayed in Gaza and said the same thing. As for the crime rates, i wasn't referring to that i was referring to possible violence from the occupying forces.
So, what prompted you to start leading this kind of life? How do your kids handle it ? It sounds enriching but also challenging too, i would imagine especially for kids.
Anyway, cheers to you and your travels and perspective. :)

It's getting late here and, you're right, I too don't want to take this down a political path much further so I will pm you tomorrow after I get some shut-eye. Suffice it to say that a great deal of my political and social views have changed over the last 15 years and I think I am better for it.

I really do enjoy sharing my experiences living in funky places with people coping/surviving with dramatically different challenges than most of us gringos could ever imagine and am happy that you appear level-headed about political/social/financial challenging spots in these increasingly challenging times (I wish more of my compatriots felt similarly.) I've found these unusual travels account for some of my richest, most memorable life experiences...by far! (BTW, I think my most challenging MENA visits may take place in the next few months and will include traveling to places that even I consider more than just a little bit on the edge...should be fun!)

Kids are kids and they cope much better than their elders in many cases. My kids are happy, healthy, safe, multi-lingual, tolerant and loved so everything is cool there. Plus, they don't go everywhere with me. ;)

[Midnight Lady]

Sorry if someone said this already, I didn't have time to read the whole thread.

Read everything you can about the place you'd like to go. It wouldn't hurt to contact the U.S. Embassy where you plan to go - that's what they're there for.

[fetishfrog]

It's getting late here and, you're right, I too don't want to take this down a political path much further so I will pm you tomorrow after I get some shut-eye. Suffice it to say that a great deal of my political and social views have changed over the last 15 years and I think I am better for it.

I really do enjoy sharing my experiences living in funky places with people coping/surviving with dramatically different challenges than most of us gringos could ever imagine and am happy that you appear level-headed about political/social/financial challenging spots in these increasingly challenging times (I wish more of my compatriots felt similarly.) I've found these unusual travels account for some of my richest, most memorable life experiences...by far! (BTW, I think my most challenging MENA visits may take place in the next few months and will include traveling to places that even I consider more than just a little bit on the edge...should be fun!)

Kids are kids and they cope much better than their elders in many cases. My kids are happy, healthy, safe, multi-lingual, tolerant and loved so everything is cool there. Plus, they don't go everywhere with me. ;)

Hey mslugano, I'd love to read your thoughts on these things as well. If you'd be so kind as to CC me on your PM, I'd be grateful.

[Buzzard Luck]

Teaching English is another career path to consider, one which allows you to travel, as well as pay the bills.
HOwever, to be successful, it does require exceptional interpersonal skills.

[cradlerock]

Not at all a fair or accurate picture. I've lived in France and own property there. The country is rent controlled. You can't raise rents whenever you want and when you can, if it keeps up with inflation, you're lucky. You can't pass on the costs of maintenance or repairs. You can't evict someone for non payment of rent, even 6-12 months on, let alone for any other reason. This "creating huge barriers to decent housing " statement is crazy. The country has a Socialist Government which dictates everything. There are so many layers of bureaucracy you have to deal with - and buy off - it will make your head spin. EVERYONE is on the take, beginning with the cops. It's almost impossible to fire someone from their job and you are required to take people back - mother OR father - after their year+ maternity leave. Try running a business under those circumstances, especially a sales force - which is why everyone tries to get a government job.The country operates on a 35 hour work week with two months paid vacation. Every September the illegal strikes start before the ' legal ' strikes, usually of transportation and education start in October. Every year over 30,000 cars are torched. Many apartment buildings throughout the country are well over 100 years old and unless you are willing to find and pay for temporary housing for your renters, you aren't going to be pulling down buildings and putting up modern housing. " Owner class " ?? Last election which Sarkozy won the opposition was talking about raising income taxes to 60% on top of city building-ownership taxes. I'm sorry, but I'm still laughing at this ' owner class ' comment. That's like calling any middle class American with a mortgage Landed Gentry. The only people who discuss class warfair in France are those who usually are unemployed/unemployable, ride the system for all the free perks and when that dries up, call for the country to go communist. You should see the fakers who con the disability game to collect lifetime public assistance - who do you think pays for that ? If you drove a bus you can retire at age 50 with 90% pension. I have to wonder why the author of this reply left Ireland - for the longest time it was the boom of Europe. If there's one thing that coming from America that will drive you crazy about living in France for any period of time is the total lack of efficiency - everything can wait til they get around to it and what is this thing you Americans keep referring to - ' Customer service ' ?

Perhaps I was being unclear. I agree with most of what you say. What I mean is that the bureacracy stopping evictions means that landlords have to be extremely choosy about who they will rent their properties to. All kinds of bank statements and letters from employers, tax returns etc are needed before rental accomodation can be secured. This precludes certain people from ever getting decent accomodation. A huge number of flats in Paris are left empty for this very reason, and rent is ridiculously high for places that are rented out.

By "owner class" I simply mean those who own property as a means of earning income, which I would have presumed is something beyond the reach of middle class Americans. Correct me if I'm wrong

[stvnscott]

Perhaps I was being unclear. I agree with most of what you say. What I mean is that the bureacracy stopping evictions means that landlords have to be extremely choosy about who they will rent their properties to. All kinds of bank statements and letters from employers, tax returns etc are needed before rental accomodation can be secured. This precludes certain people from ever getting decent accomodation. A huge number of flats in Paris are left empty for this very reason, and rent is ridiculously high for places that are rented out.

By "owner class" I simply mean those who own property as a means of earning income, which I would have presumed is something beyond the reach of middle class Americans. Correct me if I'm wrong

I lived in France for 6 months. Everything both of these gentlemen (cradlerock and gillman royce) have said is absolutely true.

I don't know about vacation home type opportunities, however.

[Millul]

It's getting late here and, you're right, I too don't want to take this down a political path much further so I will pm you tomorrow after I get some shut-eye. Suffice it to say that a great deal of my political and social views have changed over the last 15 years and I think I am better for it.

I really do enjoy sharing my experiences living in funky places with people coping/surviving with dramatically different challenges than most of us gringos could ever imagine and am happy that you appear level-headed about political/social/financial challenging spots in these increasingly challenging times (I wish more of my compatriots felt similarly.) I've found these unusual travels account for some of my richest, most memorable life experiences...by far! (BTW, I think my most challenging MENA visits may take place in the next few months and will include traveling to places that even I consider more than just a little bit on the edge...should be fun!)

Kids are kids and they cope much better than their elders in many cases. My kids are happy, healthy, safe, multi-lingual, tolerant and loved so everything is cool there. Plus, they don't go everywhere with me. ;)

MSlugano...which career path brought you to all this travelling?
Getting in touch with different cultures/heritages does indeed open up your mind and soul.

[mslugano]

MSlugano...which career path brought you to all this travelling?
Getting in touch with different cultures/heritages does indeed open up your mind and soul.

Nothing terribly exotic...investment advisory and entrepreneurship mostly though in most places I was also able to find a performing gig, as well. I have ended up carving out a niche specializing in emerging markets by accident.

[stratzrus]

LONG STORY SHORT...

My wife and I are actually, seriously, thinking of just taking off to Ireland or France, finding a little apartment, and living there for 2-3 months. We're still a 6-12 months away off from doing this, but it's coming.

Has anyone here ever done anything like that? How did you go about finding a place? Pick a random realtor/apartment locator? Make a short trip and look for yourself?I lived in Holland for a month a few years ago. I'd been there before so I had a good idea where I wanted to live. I did some research and found a reputable real estate agent who specialized in finding apartments for foreigners. Specified that I wanted an apartment that was centrally located in a safe neighborhood.

The place he found for me was spectacular...three story two bedroom apartment with washer/dryer, TV, cable, internet, and a rooftop office that had a glass wall that opened up to the rooftop garden. I couldn't have been happier.