Boutique Tone, Montreal

[candypants2000]

Hey everyone
I wanted to share a negative experience I had with Boutique Tone, a retailer with an online presence based in Montreal. They sell excellent boutique guitars and amps, and have staff that are very accomodating and will let you play pretty much anything you want there.

I was in Montreal last February with a good friend of mine that also plays guitar. He had never been to Boutique Tone, and was thrilled to get the chance to go. I was looking for a small, 15-30 watt amp to play at home and always liked the brands they carried. I sat and played a Cornford Roadhouse 30 and was pretty impressed with what it could do. Great tones, excellent price, very impressive. My friend played it as well, and although he liked it, he said he had his reservations. I slept on it, went back and played it the next day, and bought it for $1500 including tax and shipping.

When I received the amp, i plugged it in at home and thought it sounded "off". The boost switch made everything buzz, even at a low setting. If the gain knob was turned past 12 o'clock, an audible and distinct buzzing was heard. Add the boost function, and it was virtually unplayable. I called Boutique Tone right away, and they gave me some suggestions. Finally, they recommended I get the amp checked by a third party of their recommendation. I did this, it was determined that there was a preamp tube malfunctioning, and the amp was shipped back and a new one was sent to me.

When I received the new amp, the same issues were present. I tried the amp with many different guitars. I tried the amp in different electrical outlets in my home. I tried it at different peoples houses with their guitars. I tried it next to other amps and still the Cornford buzzed much louder than all of them. Frustrated, I called Boutique Tone looking for some resolution. Most of their other amps that I was interested in were more than $1500, so an exchange wasn't really ideal for me. It was eventually determined through a series of emails that my money would be refunded to me. It wasn't their policy, but there were willing to make an exception and do what was right for the customer. I thanked them and was very impressed with their customer service.

However. The asked to send me 5 postdated cheques of $300 each, and I accepted. Two of the five cheques bounced. Calls have not been returned. The store has now closed and they are devoting their business to online sales only. The phoneline has been disconnected. Emails have not been returned. Not only am I without an amplifier, I am now out $600.

I would caution you against purchasing from this company. Their equipment is great, but their service is poor. Their owner has gone back on his word and is not willing to pay his debts.

let the buyer beware.

[NickZ]

I'm not entirely surprised - any time I tried contacting them in the past to ask about stock or purchase something was a painstaking experience that took multiple emails and calls just to get a basic yes or no answer. And this is to sell - not reimburse - best of luck - I hope that it works out for you.

[Tim Plains]

You picked it up in person and they still charged you with shipping? That should have been your first warning flag right there. :rotflmao

Sorry, couldn't resist. Hope everything works out for you. Keep bugging them until it's sorted out...or contact the Better Business Bureau.

[candypants2000]

no no.....i bought it and had them ship it instead of carrying it on a plane. Sorry if this wasnt clear.

[gixxerrock]

Bummer experience. The post-dated cheques request is a pretty clear sign they are losing money and have a real cash flow problem. Tough call though... at that point your only other option would have been to keep the amp and fix/sell privately, still being out a bunch of money.

[Phuckgoose]

Weird from their part, I bought from them multiple times with great service and no problems. I bought a used 65 London from them and a speaker was blown when it came in and they paid me a new Celestion blue to replace it. Anyhow, hope everything works out, never know what can happen! Keep on trying to contact them!

[pattste]

They have a Facebook page and posted as recently as July 10th. You may want to post something on it and see if you get a reply.

http://www.facebook.com/boutiquetone

Worst case you can call Montreal police at 514-280-2222 and file a complaint.

[candypants2000]

its really unfortunate because the staff was very helpful, and they had amazing equipment. its too bad the owner can't pay his bills.

[TresGatos]

Worst case you can call Montreal police at 514-280-2222 and file a complaint.

The cops sure would be busy if everyone with a bounced check were to call them up (my wife is a Montreal 911 operator, she'd ask you what exactly you expect the police to do.) .
Depending where you live, even getting a lawyer involved doesn't make sense.

It's rough but if they are in bankruptcy or collection, you are outta luck.
Do they have the amp? Technically it's still yours until they've reimbursed you. (more lawyer crap)

[pattste]

The cops sure would be busy if everyone with a bounced check were to call them up (my wife is a Montreal 911 operator, she'd ask you what exactly you expect the police to do.) .

I didn't tell him to call 911. I gave him the non-emergency number. Writing two checks that are not funded could fall under the "false pretense" and be considered a criminal offense. It carries a possible sentence of up to 10 years in jail. It is fraud. Ask your wife if Montreal police investigates fraud.

[imonabuss]

Multiple small checks makes it possible for them to bounce a few and keep it out of being a felony. Pretty well planned by true scumbags, I'd say.

[Boutique Tone]

As the owner of Boutique Tone, I am very disappointed in the comments that were made here and I'd expect more from such a knowledgeable group of people. Just to clear things up, the customer and I have had email communications about this issue and it is being resolved to his satisfaction. Those communications are not represented on this thread. Boutique Tone had always acted honourably and will continue to do so.

This forum is a very powerful tool but can be a very dangerous place when all the facts aren't presented.

I can confidently say no customer has EVER lost money or been cheated at Boutique Tone and never will.

I thank you for listening and hope this puts an end to this issue.

Yours truly,

Jeremy Stern
Boutique Tone

[candypants2000]

I can truthfully say that Mr. Stern has communicated that he will resolve this issue. I have no issue with the resolution that has been put forth.

I have clearly and accurately represented the issues in my original post.

I have always been a fan and supporter of Boutique Tone, and have repeatedly referred people to their store. I do wish them future success, as they are the type of music retailer that this country sorely needs.

[candypants2000]

this issue is still open....still waiting.

[BlindLUCK]

Went there once, the first 3 amps I tried had something wrong with them. Cool to try them out there, but I don't think I'd ever purchase an amp from them...

[GasMask]

... it was determined that there was a preamp tube malfunctioning, and the amp was shipped back and a new one was sent to me.

Seems extreme for just a bad tube.

I second the suggestion of filing a complaint with the BBB or similar. Also re-seller ratings.com. Easy to do and will help apply a little pressure to get a resolution. You could try reporting the bad checks to the proper authorities too. Good luck.

[raja]

I think that as of now Mr. Stern is attempting to resolve this issue...I never dealt with them and/or their outfit, but he does acknowledge the power of these forums and I imagine for the sake of his reputation and that of his business, he'll do the "right thing".
Candypants2000, I wish you complete and expedient positive results with resolution of this situation....and DO KEEP THE INTERNET COMMUNITY INFORMED.

[Pantone 333]

Just to provide a little balance here. I'm a Montrealer and have spent a lot of $$$$$ at Boutique Tone. I have also put up a lot of gear on consignment there. The service I received was excellent - from the dudes behind the counter to the owner. You were left to feel that your business really mattered. Even if you there just to talk about gear.

Never a bad experience ... best music store I've ever been to. Sad that it's gone.

[candypants2000]

i agree with you Patone333. Ive visited the store many times, and had the opportunity to try out amazing gear. The staff I dealt with were always knowledgeable (Sam, in particular), as well as friendly and very helpful with equipment.

Again, i hope this is resolved soon. This store has too good a reputation and too much quality equipment to lose their credibility.

[xxvga]

As the owner of Boutique Tone, I am very disappointed in the comments that were made here and I'd expect more from such a knowledgeable group of people. Just to clear things up, the customer and I have had email communications about this issue and it is being resolved to his satisfaction. Those communications are not represented on this thread. Boutique Tone had always acted honourably and will continue to do so.

This forum is a very powerful tool but can be a very dangerous place when all the facts aren't presented.

I can confidently say no customer has EVER lost money or been cheated at Boutique Tone and never will.

I thank you for listening and hope this puts an end to this issue.

Yours truly,

Jeremy Stern
Boutique Tone


I’m not even sure of how to take your comment Jeremy but I am a bit insulted by it. You’d ‘expect more from such a knowledgeable group of people’?????.
We’re knowledgeable because we share information with each other. Including both positive and negative experiences.
Forums and social media outlets are our last resort for keeping businesses honest. In fact sometimes business won’t even respond to us poor customers until they feel they have more at risk than the opinion of one person….i.e. their reputation online.

I’ve been to your store and thought it was a great place. It gave me the ability to play some amazing equipment and only wish that I was made aware of your place well before you shut it down.

However, in this case, I think the OP's post is completely fair and seeing some of the replies it looks like people aren’t overly surprised. It’s unfortunate that you had to shut the store but the OP is out for $600 at what appears to be no fault of his own. You may consider this issue closed but clearly this has not been resolved.

[candypants2000]

...still waiting.....

[petty1818]

I have always had good luck with them! I only order stuff online but I have never had a problem. I was wondering about the website though, it doesn't really have that much on it anymore. I assume it's just going through some changes but I miss seeing the used gear.

[candypants2000]

...and waiting....

[Arc Angel]

Sad story. I hope that you get it resolved.

I had heard that they were having a difficult time of it (industry rumours going back a year or so), which is too bad. Thought they were friendly and very welcoming the times I've been in but did realize that a lot of gear was also there on consignment. Hope that they pull through and settle up.

It's tough out there ...

[Mikeroesoft]

They were always nice to me in person when I went into the store. I did inquire about a few items that I was interseted in buying and got no response so they lost my business on a Carol Ann amp and a Huber guitar! It's tough out there, but it's even tougher if you don't help people buy your stuff.

[Gris Gris Man]

Hmm, so the merchant comes here to scold everyone for concluding that they aren't doing the right thing and then exits and the original complaint still isn't addressed over a month later. Wow. Seems like in the time it took to log on and post he could have written a check and sent it and this would all be over with. It's called priorities. As a former music store manager I can tell you it takes a lot of time and effort to overcome the bad press from incidents like this. You have to move fast, make it right, and win the customer back over before word spreads. Everybody makes mistakes or has problems. It's the response to those situations that creates the reputation of a merchant.

[cherrick]

Honourable people don't bounce checks. And honourable people make a stiffed client financially right immediately.

I think I've got the Canadian spelling of "honourable" correct.

Dude, call the Montreal police. Now. You've been patient long enough.

[Carol-AnnAmps]

Honourable people don't bounce checks. And honourable people make a stiffed client financially right immediately.

I think I've got the Canadian spelling of "honourable" correct.

Dude, call the Montreal police. Now. You've been patient long enough.

You want his head on a stake too ?

Clearly the Dealer is in financial trouble, calling the Police isn't going to get the money or do anything to help the situation.

The problem with these threads is they often become a witch hunt and not at all helpful to the customer having issues.

Was the amp not under warranty from the Manufacturer ??? We all do have a legal responsibility to the products we make in the form of a warranty assuming it was brand new and not used.

It seems to me BT tried to go beyond they current limited means to keep the customer happy and ultimately made it worse. I highly doubt that was an intentional move. No communication just makes things viral.

I do hope the customer gets resolution and I also hope BT get back on their feet again too.

[candypants2000]

i agree with all thats been said. I wish BT would have been more forthright with their resolution. ive given every opportunity for them to save face, but it hasnt worked yet. its important for Canadian music stores to survive, and i hate to see a good one dishonouring their clientelle.

[plain-boy]

calling the Police isn't going to get the money or do anything to help the situation.


Kinda seems like he's exhausted all the other options.

[Mikeroesoft]

i agree with all thats been said. I wish BT would have been more forthright with their resolution. ive given every opportunity for them to save face, but it hasnt worked yet. its important for Canadian music stores to survive, and i hate to see a good one dishonouring their clientelle.

It is too bad, it was my favourite music store for a while.

[nkjanssen]

I have bought stuff from Boutique Tone in the past. They were always good to me and Jeremy struck me as a good guy. That was a while ago, though.

It sounds like they got into financial trouble and you unfortunately ended up suffering as a result. That sucks for both sides. Not that it's any comfort at all, but that does happen every single day to all kinds of businesses.

Oh, and unless you can give the police reason to believe that they were deliberately defrauding people, the police are not going to care about this at all. Customers/suppliers/employees get caught up in insolvencies all the time. Not being able to repay money you owe someone is not a crime. That's a civil/bankruptcy matter. If they are indeed bankrupt, you might want to look at filing your claim with the trustee, though.

[Mr Boggie]

this is why i love the forums.

[Tim Plains]

There is no way BT will ever get a dime from me now. Tough times or not, not refunding a customer's money is completely unacceptable in my books.

[Nathan]

I was very surprised that BT opened in Montreal. When your Steve's and Ital are pretty big box stores selling the mainstream crap all the kiddies buy (scratch that -their parents buy) and the know-nothing lawyers/dentists' girlfriends for way more than it should go for AND adding our amazing 15% tax on everything. To think there was a market for high end stuff in this town? I was skeptical from the start. I did like the shop and they were stocked with plenty of tasty gear, but from a business point of view, I always wondered how they would stay open. Guess now I know! All the best Jeremy, but give this guy his money back as a priority! And Montrealers: just buy your gear online from the States. Affordable shipping is there if you look for it and find somebody near the border to ship to (Freeport Forwarding). No physical store in our city is going to be able to compete. Even if you get to try stuff out in person it's not worth the inflated prices! All the pawn shop owners and Craigslist sellers know how to use the internet too, so you don't find many deals on used gear either. Go for the larger market where there is healthy competition driving the prices down somewhat. No stores here have ever heard of a sale! (rant off)

[Carol-AnnAmps]

The Police are not an option. They will not get involved unless some form of criminal activity is taking place. THere isn't, clearly. Guy bought something, returned it, the business quite clearly can't afford to refund.

I would say a compromise would be to get the amp back for the money owed and get on to the manufacturer to have it fixed properly by a tech THEY recommend...again...it's THEIR responsibility under warranty terms if it's a new item thats duff. Everyone is passing over this and beating the crap out of a Dealer who clearly did attempt to resolve the stuation and couldn't afford to.
If it's used then the money returned is by far enough to cover the costs to get it working correctly.

I know it's a pain in the ass, but trying to get blood out of stone is more a pain and all the legal routes in the world ain't going to be worth it for $600. I was owed 8 times that amount by a Dealer that went out of business a couple of years ago. Filed a claim to the insolvency agent involved and my amount was so much less than some of the amounts owed I got absolutely nothing.

I do hate to read about these things. Right now I'm owed money from a Dealer in Austraila and I know I probably won't get it. It's a sad sign of the current climate.

I say try and get the amp back for the money thats owed or as close to and take it from there. Then contact the Manufacturer to get the repair work carried out PROPERLY under their warranty.

[Arc Angel]

Good points above. A couple of comments.

Montreal: surprisingly not a bad market for higher end gear. I disagree that a "boutique" store can't exist in that city and do well.

Moog Audio is one of our dealers, and they've been fantastic to deal with ... good supply of higher end amps, effects, etc., as well as their core DJ/Audio/Synth, etc., market. It's very well run IMO.

I don't think that Italmelodie or Steve's compete in this marketplace. Both strong stores that serve their markets well, but not into higher end boutique gear.

I believe that lots of stock at BT was there on consignment (i.e. the Diffusion Audio / Suhr stuff used to be at Moog prior to moving over the BT up the street). I think that Jeremy was a nice guy who meant well, but its tough out there at the best of times. Not being able to willing to make good on the $600 is a sad sign. Hope it all works out in the end.

As for recovering the $600 via legal or police routes. I doubt it will be worth the time, effort or expense.

I do know that plenty of dealers (especially online) owe smaller suppliers money and often look for foreign companies to ship to them on "terms" or "spec" only to never pay. Not naming names, but we've been approached by a few who have tried to use this approach ...

Be careful out there ...

[Gris Gris Man]

I love how so many solutions seem to say tough luck to the consumer and give the merchant a pass. It's not as simple as first stated. The dealer here on this very forum commits to making it right to protect his continued on line presence and then ignores the commitment. If they're still doing business at all they need to address this situation. However, they have done us all a great service by revealing their true level of commitment to customer service which seems to be essentially they don't feel obligated to customer satisfaction at all.

You're only as good as your word. Integrity develops from observed behavior, not just hollow claims.

[Arc Angel]

Nobody is saying "tough luck to the customer". BT should make things right in this case.

However, pragmatism states that trying to resolve this issue legally and from a distance would be both expensive and (probably) futile.

Ask yourself why BT hasn't made it right yet in order to avoid this bad publicity. Most probable answer, financial problems might be pretty severe ...

All the best to OP.

[Count_Chocolat]

I was very surprised that BT opened in Montreal. When your Steve's and Ital are pretty big box stores selling the mainstream crap all the kiddies buy (scratch that -their parents buy) and the know-nothing lawyers/dentists' girlfriends for way more than it should go for AND adding our amazing 15% tax on everything. To think there was a market for high end stuff in this town? I was skeptical from the start. I did like the shop and they were stocked with plenty of tasty gear, but from a business point of view, I always wondered how they would stay open. Guess now I know! All the best Jeremy, but give this guy his money back as a priority! And Montrealers: just buy your gear online from the States. Affordable shipping is there if you look for it and find somebody near the border to ship to (Freeport Forwarding). No physical store in our city is going to be able to compete. Even if you get to try stuff out in person it's not worth the inflated prices! All the pawn shop owners and Craigslist sellers know how to use the internet too, so you don't find many deals on used gear either. Go for the larger market where there is healthy competition driving the prices down somewhat. No stores here have ever heard of a sale! (rant off)

I stopped going to music montreal stores years ago... Between the sales people who act like their doing you a favor by serving you, the traffic and the pricing...no thanks! I can get it delivered to my door at the same price or less.

[nkjanssen]

I love how so many solutions seem to say tough luck to the consumer and give the merchant a pass.

I don't think anybody's giving BT a pass. Because of what I've learned in this thread, I won't be doing business with them again even though I've had very positive experiences with them in the past. It's moot, though, if they're not in business anymore.

[beorn]

The Police are not an option. They will not get involved unless some form of criminal activity is taking place.

Not even then, unless Sting knows you personally.

[xxvga]

they seem to be in business. the website is up, they have expensive gear for sale, why can this guy Jeremy not give the op his $600 back???? it makes no sense
it's costing him many thousands in lost revenue. I wont buy from there anymore either.

Boutique Tone, why are you ignoring this guy. He did not wrong you, you owe him money back.

deal with it.

[Arc Angel]

Sadly, it appears that they haven't posted on Facebook, or Twitter since Sept. 11.

All of the Diffusion Audio gear (Suhr, Reverend) and Premier Builder's Guild gear is no longer on the website.

Curious, however, that there still appears to be a lot of inventory available for sale, and one assumes in-stock, so the OPs $600 outstanding will hopefully be settled ...

[Carol-AnnAmps]

Sadly, it appears that they haven't posted on Facebook, or Twitter since Sept. 11.

All of the Diffusion Audio gear (Suhr, Reverend) and Premier Builder's Guild gear is no longer on the website.

Curious, however, that there still appears to be a lot of inventory available for sale, and one assumes in-stock, so the OPs $600 outstanding will hopefully be settled ...

I spoke to Jeremy recently over FB to ask what was going on there as we were never notified the shop was closing down. There were at one time quite an active Dealer for us but it died off about 3 years ago. The competition with US made it almost impossible for them to make a profit.
I ship all over the world and Canada is the biggest pain in the ass customs we have ever dealt with. Getting product in Thailand, Japan and Singapore is easier. Things go into the black hole in the Canadian customs and don't appear for weeks sometimes and no-one ever seems to be able to help.
I even tried to restrict grey exporting to Canada from US Dealers as much as possible to give TM a fighting chance, but people just end up buying used from the US.

The odds were stacked against them. It's a similar state in the UK right now too. Most of the rest of Europe seems OK.

Anyway good luck to the OP. I'm sure it will work out. Jeremy will put it right I'm sure.

[Carol-AnnAmps]

they seem to be in business. the website is up, they have expensive gear for sale, why can this guy Jeremy not give the op his $600 back???? it makes no sense
it's costing him many thousands in lost revenue. I wont buy from there anymore either.

Boutique Tone, why are you ignoring this guy. He did not wrong you, you owe him money back.

deal with it.

Inventory may as well be coal if it's not moving. Money comes in when stock is sold. If nothing is sold nothing is coming in. Calling him out doesn't make money appear and people saying they will never shop there again most certainly won't help turn over or the OP.

It does pose the question if there's stock then an alternative product could possibly be offered to cover the debt, but the OP has got to want to do that. If he wants money and there is none, then thats pretty much that as sad as it may be.

I've made two practical suggestions now.......

[Arc Angel]

I spoke to Jeremy recently over FB to ask what was going on there as we were never notified the shop was closing down. There were at one time quite an active Dealer for us but it died off about 3 years ago. The competition with US made it almost impossible for them to make a profit.
I ship all over the world and Canada is the biggest pain in the ass customs we have ever dealt with. Getting product in Thailand, Japan and Singapore is easier. Things go into the black hole in the Canadian customs and don't appear for weeks sometimes and no-one ever seems to be able to help.
I even tried to restrict grey exporting to Canada from US Dealers as much as possible to give TM a fighting chance, but people just end up buying used from the US.

The odds were stacked against them. It's a similar state in the UK right now too. Most of the rest of Europe seems OK.

Anyway good luck to the OP. I'm sure it will work out. Jeremy will put it right I'm sure.

Well, we operate from Athens, Greece (home town and manufacturing) and Toronto, Canada. We get shipments coming in from Europe weekly.

In my experience, Canada Customs is not an issue. Athens - Toronto is a week to 10 days, by Hellenic Post, including Customs clearance. Its been steady the past 4-5 years.

The economy hasn't helped ... but I don't think that Canada is a problem. Lots of custom shop and boutique stuff moving from well positioned dealers (especially those with solid financing options).

Jeremy was always very nice as was the staff. No snobbery or attitude at all for such a high end shop. Here's hoping that it all ends well for the OP and BT and Jeremy get up and running again with a healthy business.

[Carol-AnnAmps]

Well, we operate from Athens, Greece (home town and manufacturing) and Toronto, Canada. We get shipments coming in from Europe weekly.

In my experience, Canada Customs is not an issue. Athens - Toronto is a week to 10 days, by Hellenic Post, including Customs clearance. Its been steady the past 4-5 years.

The economy hasn't helped ... but I don't think that Canada is a problem. Lots of custom shop and boutique stuff moving from well positioned dealers (especially those with solid financing options).

Jeremy was always very nice as was the staff. No snobbery or attitude at all for such a high end shop. Here's hoping that it all ends well for the OP and BT and Jeremy get up and running again with a healthy business.

Our last two shipments to BT had major hold ups with no explanation.

It may not be the same for lower priced items like pedals wher e the differential isn't as much, but there are some large cost savings to be had when people from Canada buy higher price goods like boutique amps and guitars from US Dealers. Sadly for shops like BT, it happens a lot. I know for a fact. I've a ton of Canadian customers and I'm buggered if they all came from BT. you make a very good point with the financing options however. I would say that plays a major role. It does in the UK.

It would seem after this thread we sadly need a new Canadian Dealer......

I agree, Jeremy was always cool with us too and they paid on time. But we haven't sold anything to them in a couple of years now.

[theelectic]

Call me paranoid, but I suspect Boutique Tone has been setting up a flash sale type site, that's where all their time/funds are going. I just got this email about this site in my regular email box, which I never use for those type of sites. The only possible way they could have gotten my email address is from the order I placed with Boutique Tone years ago.

http://www.musicianscountdown.com/

The address on the site points to a Montreal/Westmount location. Also notice the similarity in the pages compared to the Boutique Tone site, and some of the products look familiar.

[candypants2000]

**update**

i received an email from Jeremy today along with some funds through Paypal. He apologized and admitted that its been a tough struggle.

I am glad he has kept his word and I repsect that he is honouring all of his outstanding transactions. I wished him well for the future.

[cherrick]

...
Anyway good luck to the OP. I'm sure it will work out. Jeremy will put it right I'm sure.

You could reimburse the OP and then have Jeremy reimburse you. I'm sure.

[nkjanssen]

You could reimburse the OP and then have Jeremy reimburse you. I'm sure.

Huh?

:confused:

[Custom50]

just like to add 2 cents here.

yes, i work for Canada post.

yes, they are quite often a colossal pain the ass to deal with.

trust me. I get to hear all about it.

[Carol-AnnAmps]

You could reimburse the OP and then have Jeremy reimburse you. I'm sure.

Why didn't I think of that...oh thats why, it's ridiculous....

Well if I built the amp that failed I would probably have done that given the situation.

Glad to hear it is getting resolved however.