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nealpolitan
03-23-2013, 11:06 PM
We had our first gig in a few years tonight at a friend's birthday. Once upon a time, we gigged quite regular, but most of the places we played then are gone and so is the time we had to practice. Anyhow, we did this for fun and it was only one extended set (a little more than an hour), so it was easy.

In our previous gigging life, we almost always had a sound guy/gal to run our sound, either hired, a friend of the band, or provided by the house. The times we had to run our own sound were in super small places so we just brought whatever fit and went with it. It was never satisfactory because we really didn't know what we were doing. Feedback was a constant demon. In fact, the disappearance of all the places we once played with house PAs is one of the reasons we quit gigging.

Fast forward a few years and here we are. When we knew we were going to play this show, I knew I didn't want to use our old PA. It's huge, heavy, and I imagined the same old problems. So I started looking around at "easy" solutions. I read all the reviews, bad and good, on the Bose systems but what solved it was seeing a classic rock band like ours using two L1 systems in quite a large place. Everyone but the drums was going direct into the two Bose. It sounded awesome. From everywhere in the joint. It wasn't too loud and it was super clear.

So I started shopping. I found a killer deal on a used L1 Model 1 with one B1 sub (from a Guitar Center in New Jersey). They shipped it to me and we've been using it in practice for a few weeks. Sounded great there, but that's a room maybe 20x20.

The show was in a bar with a good size performance room, maybe 60 by 80. The ceilings were high (at least 15 feet) but it appeared they'd done quite a bit of sound treatment. Lots of foam and what not on the walls. Still, it was a large space to fill for us. The single L1 with sub was all the PA I brought. We were going old school, only the vocals through the Bose PA. The drummer used a Roland E-kit through a large Peavey Keyboard amp (KB300, 1x15 Black Widow w/horn - sounds awesome). The bass was a GK 400RB through a single 15 Ampeg cab. The two guitars were a Marshall TSL60 through a 1960 4x12 and a SF Bandmaster Reverb through a 2x12.

Honestly, I thought the vocals sounded amazing. Almost too amazing. I'm still not used to hearing myself so clearly.

Because of the shape of the stage (in a corner) and the fact the drum riser was farthest back into the corner, we couldn't put the L1 directly behind us. We put it on one side, angled sort of across the stage and out into the audience, and hoped the advertised 180 degree coverage could hit us all, and still cover the room. No problem. In fact, the drummer appeared to be behind the L1 slightly but claimed he could hear the vocals great.

We ran our vocal mics into a mixer and then came out of the mixer into the L1. I had the L1 on about 4 and it kept up with our amps just fine and I probably didn't have the gain structure optimized between the mixer, the channel, and the master volume (probably should have read the manual, huh?)

I'm no Bose fan boy but if we can get rid of our 10 year old traditional PA (which cost way north of twice what I paid for the Bose), this is well worth it, especially on the used market. The fact that it's super easy to set up and transport is even better. Again, I'm no pro and I'm sure pros would laugh, but we sounded good, it was easy to set up, and we didn't have to futz with it once we were going. To me that's worth a lot. I think this system is a definite contender for small bar PA for those of us who are soundman-skills deficient.

It would have sounded even better had we run the guitars into the PA, even just a little for monitoring purposes (either micing or using a line out). The drummer did complain a bit about not being able to hear the guitar and we ended up turning up so he could hear. We'll have to play around with that in practice. Now if I can just convince everyone in the band (me included) that we don't need big old amps anymore, we could mic smaller amps and sound even better. One step at a time.

Overall, I count this gig as a success. The PA was a non-issue, a first for us in gigs where we run our own sound. Say what you will about the Bose, in my opinion, it's a great piece of kit. Especially for novice's like us.

The Kid
03-24-2013, 01:12 AM
I'm shocked.

hellbender
03-24-2013, 02:20 AM
I think the difficulties you encountered in the first club with coverage were due to the heavy sound padding necessary to dampen the brutal effects of a typical bar PA. I'm happy to see another person taking initiative to find something that works better for them.

modulusman
03-24-2013, 08:53 AM
I'm sure the bass drum would sound awesome through one.:rotflmao

hubberjub
03-24-2013, 09:01 AM
I'd love to try one out. Yes, I've heard that the bass modules are lacking in output, but they look so convenient for their size.

nealpolitan
03-24-2013, 02:28 PM
Yeah, I think those bass bins are basically to cover the lower range of voice and mid-range instruments. Bose mentions using up to 4 bass units with each L1 for bass heavy instruments. I'm skeptical until I see it in action (plus each L1 only supports 2 bass units, you need another special amp for the other 2). There is a dedicated bass out on the Bose that you could run to a more substantial sub if you wanted. We have a larger Wharfedale powered sub that we might try that with. I couldn't see running bass and drums through this unless it were supported by bigger subs. Also, I think if you're running the whole band through it, you'd need a minimum of two systems, which gets the cost of entry quite high. But as I said, I spent quite a bit less than 1/2 what it cost for our traditional PA on one used L1 system, so if I could find another one for that price, I'd still come in cheaper. I could probably add a nice powered sub and come out about equal.

This is all moot for us as we aren't really gigging anymore, but I could easily rent another L1 system if we did have to fill a bigger place.

modulusman
03-24-2013, 02:41 PM
Our Bandleader is thinking about buying a bose compact for a solo gig he has. IMO that is what the bose poles are really good for.

nealpolitan
03-24-2013, 04:40 PM
I was at a wedding where a guy used just the compact for his solo voice/acoustic guitar music. It did sound phenomenal and this was on a wide open beach. I was also at a coffee shop that used a Fishman pole for open mic night and that also sounded awesome. Oddly, one guy brought his own K12 and went through that and I thought it was harsh sounding and uneven. Then again, it looked like he plugged right into the k12 and it was just a single speaker in a stand.

That said I'm convinced the bigger Bose systems have a place in small time bar bands like ours as an "easy" solution.

southpaw pete
03-24-2013, 06:32 PM
My father-in-law recently purchased two L1 systems, with two B1 subs and one B2 sub. The B2 sub has a LOT more oomph. Last weekend I performed with him at a local pub for St Paddy's day, we set up two sticks, each with one B1, and ran 4 vocals, acoustic guitar, accordion, tinwhistles, bass, keys, percussion (bodhran and djembe) and a drum machine. It took a little more time to set our sound, just because we were used to setting up with his big JBL speakers in previous gigs. Once the sound was set, it really performed well, and we were able to hear ourselves better in that venue than we had ever before - and heard from a lot of people who had heard us there before that it sounded great and had a lot more clarity.

I had also tried the systems out in my church to see if we should switch over to Bose in our sanctuary - we tried numerous setups and lots of eq adjustments, and while the sound guys and musicians were very happy with the sound, the responses I got from various people throughout the room were very varied: some said it sounded better than our normal setup, some said it sounded worse, others said they could hear some things but not others, and some said my voice lacked warmth and my acoustic sounded harsh... I'm sure with a lot more work we could have gotten a better sound, but I don't think we're going to go that route for the church after those weeks trying it. Our sanctuary is a pretty challenging acoustic space anyways. I've installed acoustic panels to attempt to deaden some of the reverberant reflections in the room. It made a difference, but is still challenging to get a good clear sound for the whole room.

I'm really glad to hear you guys had a good experience with it - thanks for posting!

Pitar
03-24-2013, 07:36 PM
I A/B'd the L-1 and SA220 for an hour. The SA220 won. I could not get from the the L-1 the tonal qualities I could get from the SA220. I could get the SA220 to give me much of the qualities the L-1 could give. The L-1's sub was too big in the mix. The acoustic guitar I use is running a K&K onboard preamp for the PWM p'up array installed in it.

A couple nights back I was at a venue where the player was using the Bose. It was in a corner next to him. He was not getting what I would call good trebles from his guitar. I could not see the make of his guitar but the system it had was probably factory with it's own onboard EQ. It had a cut so I'm assuming factory onboard. I think he just didn't know to adjust it up. I thought I might tell him but didn't want to come across wrong. Otherwise, it sounded good.

The L-1 can't be adjusted (EQ, etc) unless you buy the $500.00 Tone Match Audio Engine accessory or some other chained EQ. I think the EQ can be had cheaply enough but throwing a cheapo device at the L-1 is counter-intuitive to me. You might end up with an expensive amp giving cheap sound. Plus, one of the reviews I read on the L-1 pointed to a significant power reduction with a chained EQ accessory plugged in. That one I could not figure out. I'm thinking something might have been rolled off but the dood sounded savvy.

The Fishman SA220 has everything built in. Out of the box it's performance ready. The Bose L-1 I tested had nothing but the ins/outs and power/volume controls that I could see to use. Some of us do not have the onboard and/or outboard EQ they probably used for testing. Another way of saying it, Bose assumes the player will provide chained accessories of a quality that maintain the sonic integrity of their product. I will right after I teach shrimp how to whistle.

I was impressed by the presence of the vocal nuances from both of them. Like your critique of that feature, they will force you to sound better because of their nearly lossless in/out signal. I was using a Shure SM57. I've never heard myself like that before and that alone was a confidence boost. By that I mean I can much better hear vocal nuances giving me the reference I need to adjust my delivery. House near-field monitors have never been as good.

nealpolitan
03-24-2013, 08:29 PM
The L1 Model 1 comes with a plug in remote that has the EQ bits on it (for the first two channels, channels 3-4 cannot be EQd). Without the remote plugged in, the EQs are set to flat. The only thing you can set are Bose's preset EQs for certain mics/instruments. Otherwise, all you can control is the volume on the channel. That is a weakness but I suppose they did that to save space on the main access panel. Again, that's the Model 1. I haven't ever looked at a Compact up close.

Yes, Bose's Tonematch mixer/doodad thing is crazy expensive for what is essentially a 5 channel mixer with onboard effects. I'd maybe pick one up if it were 1/2 that much but $500 is just crazy.

I A/B'd the L-1 and SA220 for an hour. The SA220 won. I could not get from the the L-1 the tonal qualities I could get from the SA220. I could get the SA220 to give me much of the qualities the L-1 could give. The L-1's sub was too big in the mix. The acoustic guitar I use is running a K&K onboard preamp for the PWM p'up array installed in it.

A couple nights back I was at a venue where the player was using the Bose. It was in a corner next to him. He was not getting what I would call good trebles from his guitar. I could not see the make of his guitar but the system it had was probably factory with it's own onboard EQ. It had a cut so I'm assuming factory onboard. I think he just didn't know to adjust it up. I thought I might tell him but didn't want to come across wrong. Otherwise, it sounded good.

The L-1 can't be adjusted (EQ, etc) unless you buy the $500.00 Tone Match Audio Engine accessory or some other chained EQ. I think the EQ can be had cheaply enough but throwing a cheapo device at the L-1 is counter-intuitive to me. You might end up with an expensive amp giving cheap sound. Plus, one of the reviews I read on the L-1 pointed to a significant power reduction with a chained EQ accessory plugged in. That one I could not figure out. I'm thinking something might have been rolled off but the dood sounded savvy.

The Fishman SA220 has everything built in. Out of the box it's performance ready. The Bose L-1 I tested had nothing but the ins/outs and power/volume controls that I could see to use. Some of us do not have the onboard and/or outboard EQ they probably used for testing. Another way of saying it, Bose assumes the player will provide chained accessories of a quality that maintain the sonic integrity of their product. I will right after I teach shrimp how to whistle.

I was impressed by the presence of the vocal nuances from both of them. Like your critique of that feature, they will force you to sound better because of their nearly lossless in/out signal. I was using a Shure SM57. I've never heard myself like that before and that alone was a confidence boost. By that I mean I can much better hear vocal nuances giving me the reference I need to adjust my delivery. House near-field monitors have never been as good.

walterw
03-24-2013, 11:36 PM
in the OP's situation the bose kinda makes sense, as it's just for vocals. it's just a big pile of money for what you get. (OT, but now if the guitar player just ditched the silly 4x12 cab for like a 1x12, you guys would be all set for these small gigs.)

+1 to the fishman stick being a home run; i gig with a guy who uses it as his acoustic guitar monitor with a full band and it kills, plus he can use it by himself for his solo gigs where it does just fine for guitar, vox and monitoring.

The Kid
03-25-2013, 01:59 AM
I'd take a small mixer and two QSC K10's over a BOSE L1. Even for a solo acoustic gig.

The L1 lacks punch and headroom IMO. It can't keep up with a hard hitting drummer either.

TimmyP
03-25-2013, 03:16 AM
I've mixed on the L1M2 in a variety of rooms (both size and acoustical properties), as well as outdoors.

Is setup quick and simple? Yes.

Can it sound good? Yes, but not without just as much fiddling as a good standard box (some of which sound MUCH better).

Does the sound change less with distance than "normal" speakers? No.

Is it better than a similarly priced "normal" system? It's not as good, let alone better. Especially if the musical genre "requires" a lot of kick.

At the price, I can't think of any reason to recommend it for any application.

The Kid
03-25-2013, 03:40 AM
I've mixed on the L1M2 in a variety of rooms (both size and acoustical properties), as well as outdoors.

Is setup quick and simple? Yes.

Can it sound good? Yes, but not without just as much fiddling as a good standard box (some of which sound MUCH better).

Does the sound change less with distance than "normal" speakers? No.

Is it better than a similarly priced "normal" system? It's not as good, let alone better. Especially if the musical genre "requires" a lot of kick.

At the price, I can't think of any reason to recommend it for any application.

:agree

You put it into words better than I could. :aok

nealpolitan
03-25-2013, 03:53 AM
in the OP's situation the bose kinda makes sense, as it's just for vocals. it's just a big pile of money for what you get.

But would it be at 1/2 the price of new (which is essentially what I paid for a used system)? That still doesn't fix the fact that SOMEONE had to shell out full price for me to get it used, but I think once the price drops to $1000 and below, these systems approach reason.

(OT, but now if the guitar player just ditched the silly 4x12 cab for like a 1x12, you guys would be all set for these small gigs.)


Tell me about it. I've tried for years to get him to downsize. He has a JCM2000 TSL60 stack he bought brand new in 2002 when his previous JCM900 rig was stolen. He has literally not changed the settings (other than volume) since. He never even changes channels. I keep hoping a tube will go south (he's never had it serviced either) or something so we can try something else, but that thing just keeps on trucking, and to be honest, it does sound pretty good. Oh well. A few years ago, I did manage to get him to sell off the other 4x12 of his full stack (he was storing it at my place), so perhaps there is hope.

The Kid
03-25-2013, 08:18 AM
Another issue I have with these Bose L1's is that adding on to that system gets really expensive if you need more firepower.

They're fine for acoustic solo and duo acts, but even at a used price, I'd still take one QSC K10 and a small mixer.

DRS
03-25-2013, 08:20 AM
I've heard the L1 system with a singer/songwriter playing his Martin and he had a keyboardist who also had his own L1. They both had the subs and the little mixing gizmo. They sounded fantastic in a 3000 sf church. I think this kind of gig, churches, coffee shops, small theatres, is what Bose had in maind. I believe the OPs situation worked because of the electronic drum kit. I suspect if it had been an acoustic kit with the average Sam the Simian drummer, it may have had issues. Every body would be turning up and the Bose wouldn't have kept up.

phishintrip007
03-25-2013, 08:31 AM
While I have little experience with working/running PA equipment period. I will say that I saw a band play a few months ago at a local pizza/beer joint and they were using this system. They ran two mic's through it and then everything else was stage volume, two DRRI's and I am not sure what the bass player was running, he may have been running it through the L1. The drummer wasn't killing it either, if he had it would of been unbearable in this place though. But it sounded great for a small restaurant gig. I could see where that system would fall short as you moved to larger rooms though.

hellbender
03-25-2013, 01:04 PM
For singers who value their craft and groups that spend a lot of time developing harmonies, do yourself a big favor and invest in the Bose system.

One of the best and highest uses for the Bose are high fidelity sources, such as voice, acoustic guitar, harp and other acoustic instruments. Putting vocals thru a cheap $1500 box on a stick system is just talent and hard work in, garbage out.

Those systems are set up to withstand the need for some to inflict brutality on their audiences. Fine. To that end they are typically very unresponsive to nuanced sources and for a vocalist or acoustic player, these are your bread and butter. They are built to last first, and sound good second.

Even if you have a typical rock band, get those vocals out of the boxes and into the Bose. Leave all those brutal mid heavy sources like lead guitar and drums in the boxes where they belong.

You will be able to hear yourself startlingly well and so will your bandmates and audience as well. You will gain a lot of confidence in your sound when you know you are hearing exactly what the audience hears. You will never again have to rely on the word of the sound guy as to how your sounded.

In fact you can fire his ass:rotflmao

modulusman
03-25-2013, 02:29 PM
For singers who value their craft and groups that spend a lot of time developing harmonies, do yourself a big favor and invest in the Bose system.

One of the best and highest uses for the Bose are high fidelity sources, such as voice, acoustic guitar, harp and other acoustic instruments. Putting vocals thru a cheap $1500 box on a stick system is just talent and hard work in, garbage out.

Those systems are set up to withstand the need for some to inflict brutality on their audiences. Fine. To that end they are typically very unresponsive to nuanced sources and for a vocalist or acoustic player, these are your bread and butter. They are built to last first, and sound good second.

Even if you have a typical rock band, get those vocals out of the boxes and into the Bose. Leave all those brutal mid heavy sources like lead guitar and drums in the boxes where they belong.

You will be able to hear yourself startlingly well and so will your bandmates and audience as well. You will gain a lot of confidence in your sound when you know you are hearing exactly what the audience hears. You will never again have to rely on the word of the sound guy as to how your sounded.

In fact you can fire his ass:rotflmao
So you drank the Bose Kool-aid.;)

bbrunskill
03-25-2013, 02:43 PM
For singers who value their craft and groups that spend a lot of time developing harmonies, do yourself a big favor and invest in the Bose system.

One of the best and highest uses for the Bose are high fidelity sources, such as voice, acoustic guitar, harp and other acoustic instruments. Putting vocals thru a cheap $1500 box on a stick system is just talent and hard work in, garbage out.

Those systems are set up to withstand the need for some to inflict brutality on their audiences. Fine. To that end they are typically very unresponsive to nuanced sources and for a vocalist or acoustic player, these are your bread and butter. They are built to last first, and sound good second.

Even if you have a typical rock band, get those vocals out of the boxes and into the Bose. Leave all those brutal mid heavy sources like lead guitar and drums in the boxes where they belong.

You will be able to hear yourself startlingly well and so will your bandmates and audience as well. You will gain a lot of confidence in your sound when you know you are hearing exactly what the audience hears. You will never again have to rely on the word of the sound guy as to how your sounded.

In fact you can fire his ass:rotflmao


This made me laugh. Iím not calling Bose stuff crap, in fact I think in certain situations itís great.

But to state that a $1500 Ďbox on a stickí canít handle vocals is just ridiculous.

southpaw pete
03-25-2013, 05:30 PM
This made me laugh. Iím not calling Bose stuff crap, in fact I think in certain situations itís great.

But to state that a $1500 Ďbox on a stickí canít handle vocals is just ridiculous.

:agree

hellbender
03-25-2013, 07:22 PM
The handwriting is in the wall for all. I have recorded artists live using both systems. In a rock setting and acoustically. Same artist, same material. There is absolutely no comparison as to how well the Bose disperses the sound of hi fidelity sources. 5 years from now, all major PA box on stick mfgr's will have a Bose like system for sale.

Fishman tried to scoop this first but any engineer will tell you that it is simply just the box on a stick, point source design all over again, dressed up to look like a Bose and deliberately lower in price to scoop the market. Don't be fooled. Bose will LEND you a system for 30 days, no obligation whatsoever, to convince you how well it works.

Listen to me now, believe me later vocalists!!

StratGuy22
03-25-2013, 08:20 PM
Buy
Other
Sound
Equipment

bbrunskill
03-26-2013, 12:21 AM
Buy
Other
Sound
Equipment

I disagree with that. In itís place, the Bose L1 is a great product.

In fact when used in context, I like Bose gear, I.E. my home stereo with the sub and bookshelf speakers.

My ears tell me that the sub doesnít go very low, that the mids are scooped, and even the high end is rolled off substantially past maybe 15K.

But damn for such a little system it sounds amazing watching movies. Listening to music DVDís it also sounds great, clarity for days and due to the way Bose speakers disperse, the sound does feel really wide.

I bet the L1 is the same. Acoustic low volume stuff, great. Coffeehouse gigs, singer songwriter stuff, itís probably amazing. But when you need some real oomph, say for a live rock band, I wouldnít use one.

I would never buy one, because Iíd rather get something versatile.

Flogger59
03-26-2013, 06:54 AM
In Bose's mind the ultimate application would have each sound source with its' own L1 module, which makes sense from a psychoacoustic point of view, when the sound sources are amplified with separate devices for each, the listeners ear discerns much more clarity and separation. Of course, any brand of PA gear would accomplish that part of the equation, if we ignore the point source ( no crossover) aspect of the Bose system.
Needless to say, this approach also enhances the bottom line for Bose.

billyguitar
03-26-2013, 09:14 AM
Carvin had up on their website their version of the Bose stuff. It was only up for few days and then gone.

buddaman71
03-26-2013, 09:24 AM
i've owned the L1 and currently own QSC K series rigs.absolutely zero comparison and the Bose isn't faster or easier to transport or set up in my pretty extensive experience with the product...either way, i don't care what anyone uses...to each his own...

my biggest complaint with Bose is their beyond absurd marketing BS..."every seat in the room ears the exact same sound and volume"

um...no...that is a violation of the laws of physics...SPLs decrease 6dB for each doubling of distance from the source...play a tone through ANY system and measurement from 20' away will measure 6dB less SPL than the measurement from 10' away...period...

loudboy
03-26-2013, 09:29 AM
i've owned the L1 and currently own QSC K series rigs.absolutely zero comparison and the Bose isn't faster or easier to transport or set up in my pretty extensive experience with the product...either way, i don't care what anyone uses...to each his own...

my biggest complaint with Bose is their beyond absurd marketing BS..."every seat in the room ears the exact same sound and volume"

um...no...that is a violation of the laws of physics...SPLs decrease 6dB for each doubling of distance from the source...play a tone through ANY system and measurement from 20' away will measure 6dB less SPL than the measurement from 10' away...period...

Didn't you know - they've changed the laws. It's patented and double-secret, tho. <g>

I've heard acoustic solo acts use these and they do sound good.

For everyone in a 5-piece band to have their own would be upwards of $10K, and you could put together a traditional system for that kind of dough that would be way better.

RGB
03-26-2013, 09:47 AM
Too bad every attempt at a positive L1 thread has to end up with all the smart assed Bose haters spouting their "oh so clever" bose acronyms...grow up, fellas...it's beyond tired.

Glad to hear the system worked well for you, OP...I have an original L1 Classic that I've gigged extensively without issue for almost 10 years. I also have a QSC K10 system that I use as well. Both have their place and best uses. I prefer the L1 for more intimate venues where the audience is very close to the "stage"...for outdoor stuff in the summer and bigger rooms, I tend to prefer the K10s...sometimes use them both, but have never had anything but sincere compliments on our sound with either system.

StratGuy22
03-26-2013, 10:42 AM
I disagree with that. In itís place, the Bose L1 is a great product.

In fact when used in context, I like Bose gear, I.E. my home stereo with the sub and bookshelf speakers.

My ears tell me that the sub doesnít go very low, that the mids are scooped, and even the high end is rolled off substantially past maybe 15K.

But damn for such a little system it sounds amazing watching movies. Listening to music DVDís it also sounds great, clarity for days and due to the way Bose speakers disperse, the sound does feel really wide.

I bet the L1 is the same. Acoustic low volume stuff, great. Coffeehouse gigs, singer songwriter stuff, itís probably amazing. But when you need some real oomph, say for a live rock band, I wouldnít use one.

I would never buy one, because Iíd rather get something versatile.


My buddy has one that he uses for open mic nights. He has a secondary sub. It sounds pretty good in the space. He sometimes has feedback issues as there just isn't as much control over everything.

Handy though, in the right situation.


:aok

nealpolitan
03-26-2013, 11:41 AM
I've never bought into the Bose hype. I've never actually bought anything new from them. That said, I do have Bose computer speakers which are the best computer speakers I've heard bar none (got them second hand). And now I've got the L1 bought used. I'm satisfied, for my purposes.

As a side note, I've been experimenting with running a Pod XT Live and a Digitech RP500 straight in to the L1 the last few days. I'm struggling to find a good sound.

RGB
03-26-2013, 12:39 PM
For what it's worth, I've never really cared for the L1 as an FRFR modeling amp either...although, I haven't taken the time to go through all of the presets. The K10's sound great for that purpose, so I haven't really bothered, but if I do run electric guitar through the L1 for a little FOH support, I use preset 00.

Nelson89
03-27-2013, 04:51 AM
As a side note, I've been experimenting with running a Pod XT Live and a Digitech RP500 straight in to the L1 the last few days. I'm struggling to find a good sound.

Yeh...i've found the Bose L1 is great for acoustic guitar and vocals, but i wouldn't use it for electric guitar purposes...fine as a last resort thing, but i guess i like to look at my Bose L1 as the best "Amp" i've ever had for vocals and acoustic guitar. To my ears it doesn't colour the sound at all, and it's extremely clear.

n8cjohn
04-24-2013, 11:49 AM
I've had great success setting up patches in my RP1000 (and my older RP500) to work very well with an L1/T1 combo. As a second banana guitarist/singer in a cover band with material spanning too many decades - I love the flexibility that approach affords. I use several amp and speaker combos (twins, JCM900, plexi, soldano, the acoustic model, etc) - in several configurations that are essentially set up in banks - to make it easy to navigate through each set.

I use the POD pre-set on the T1.

Our previous L. guitarist also went down this road with his Line 6 modeler (the one prior to the HD series - cant recall the model). Our present l. guitarist prefers to lug around heavy combo amps and run a mic to the nearest L1 that he shares with our drummer.

I am wireless and wander out into the audience for sound check. Both guitars sound great, IMO.

Teleking
04-24-2013, 02:24 PM
My question is how do you "monitor" with these systems? Do you have to buy monitors as well as these sticks?

I do some acoustic stuff, and I've been intrigued, but I'm not sure how you'd monitor. If I have to bring powered monitors as well, not sure what the purpose of these would be?

hellbender
04-24-2013, 11:53 PM
My question is how do you "monitor" with these systems? Do you have to buy monitors as well as these sticks?

I do some acoustic stuff, and I've been intrigued, but I'm not sure how you'd monitor. If I have to bring powered monitors as well, not sure what the purpose of these would be?

One of the main advantages with this system is that the "sticks" are placed behind the band, try that with a traditional PA, and provide monitoring for the artists. You hear what the crowd hears. You can leave your monitor equipment at home...for the sound guy to play with.:roll

southpaw pete
04-25-2013, 12:23 PM
One of the main advantages with this system is that the "sticks" are placed behind the band, try that with a traditional PA, and provide monitoring for the artists. You hear what the crowd hears. You can leave your monitor equipment at home...for the sound guy to play with.:roll

Yup.
Although, as I mentioned earlier in this thread, I tried them out at my church (a few different layouts for a few different weeks) and found I still missed having a more traditional monitor near me. Maybe it is because the frequency waves of the sub are of course longer than the highs and mid highs coming from the stick and I wasn't able to hear the full spectrum from where I was standing - the sound may have balanced out nicely off the stage, but from where I was it was lacking fullness and warmth for my voice and acoustic guitar. I could hear the clarity, but not the oomph, and found myself pushing my voice harder than normal to try to get that oomph.

Since we were borrowing the systems (it is a very wide and shallow stage, so I had to set up two systems to cover the width of the room), I've since returned them to their owner and we've gone back to our normal setup. I ended up moving my stage monitor over in front of some of the other musicians, and am standing pretty much right in front of one of the stage speakers (12"x horn) - it is on a stand a little off to the side, right above/behind me. Sounds rich and full, I can hear what the congregation hears, and... no feedback... not even a hint of it.

I like Bose. We were borrowing them to see if they would be worth buying for the church. I REALLY REALLY wanted to like them. But, I heard numerous varying reports following each service - some great, and some not so great. I think they definitely added clarity to the sound overall, but we couldn't manage to get the warmth and fullness we wanted. Some people even said my guitar sounded harsh and tinny! And there wasn't as much consistency throughout the room as I had hoped (and as is advertised).

I think the Bose sounded WAY better than our normal PA for the spoken word and preaching, but I wasn't as impressed as I'd hoped in regards to the music. I would like to try them again sometime with a few other adjustments and see how it comes together.

I imagine they are ideal for some venues and bands (I've run through them at another church and performing at a pub with good results). But I don't know about being the magic cure to all live audio problems. ;)

BadAssBill
04-25-2013, 02:06 PM
For the record, I love BOSE. I had a pair of interaudio speakers in HS that I took to college, they lived thoough more than a human liver could. I also have a wave radio at home. No hate here...

We used one at a band tryout that the bar had setup. Long story short...it scored high points for ease of use and low feedback, but it just didn't have enough power for what we needed. It sounded decent....just not enough power. I think it's a good start....

billyguitar
04-26-2013, 08:49 AM
I always thought the little speakers should be something bigger than a 2-1/2". Something more in the 4", to maybe 6", range. I could never think that a lower male singing voice would have the "chestiness" I want to hear from those little speakers. I realize that everything gets exponentially bigger with the bigger speakers in the columns but I'd sure like to hear that kind of rig.

frankencat
04-26-2013, 09:18 AM
For what it's worth, I've never really cared for the L1 as an FRFR modeling amp either...although, I haven't taken the time to go through all of the presets. The K10's sound great for that purpose, so I haven't really bothered, but if I do run electric guitar through the L1 for a little FOH support, I use preset 00.

L1 Classic, preset 83 with the HD500 sounds really good. :)

southpaw pete
04-26-2013, 10:13 AM
I always thought the little speakers should be something bigger than a 2-1/2". Something more in the 4", to maybe 6", range. I could never think that a lower male singing voice would have the "chestiness" I want to hear from those little speakers. I realize that everything gets exponentially bigger with the bigger speakers in the columns but I'd sure like to hear that kind of rig.

:agree

mattball826
04-26-2013, 03:53 PM
our wedding/event band uses 4 l series bose sticks and subs. sounds fantastic. room coverage is impressive.

single stick and sub for a band wont cut it. good for solo performers.

frankencat
04-26-2013, 06:37 PM
I am right now listening to some kings x on my L1 with 2 B1s and the QSC K12 with the deep and vocal boost switches on and it sounds frikkin AMAZING in my little studio. Also Beethoven string quartet no 7 in f major sounds really really nice as well. This is a nice sounding setup right here. I was going to sell the L1 setup but now I think I will hold onto it.

Flogger59
04-26-2013, 06:56 PM
Systems with larger drivers exist from ther manufacturers, but if you find the Bose pricey, don't look at a Renkus Heinz Iconyx rig.

hellbender
04-26-2013, 10:28 PM
I always thought the little speakers should be something bigger than a 2-1/2". Something more in the 4", to maybe 6", range. I could never think that a lower male singing voice would have the "chestiness" I want to hear from those little speakers. I realize that everything gets exponentially bigger with the bigger speakers in the columns but I'd sure like to hear that kind of rig.

Having small speakers such as the Bose concept, makes the speaker much more compliant to a complex instrument like the voice and acoustic instruments. Larger diaphragm speakers have more mass and take more time to get in motion and to stop and reverse, thus the nuances suffer. The small speaker concept was not just a lark, it had a real purpose.

The cool thing about the bass or chestiness that you mention, is that it can come from a completely separate source and your ear will not know the difference because of the omnidirectionality of low frequencies. This is a tremendous acoustic plus that Bose takes great advantage of.

Separating the frequency bands keeps everything clean and neat without the muddle of larger speakers.

billyguitar
05-01-2013, 09:07 AM
Having small speakers such as the Bose concept, makes the speaker much more compliant to a complex instrument like the voice and acoustic instruments. Larger diaphragm speakers have more mass and take more time to get in motion and to stop and reverse, thus the nuances suffer. The small speaker concept was not just a lark, it had a real purpose.

The cool thing about the bass or chestiness that you mention, is that it can come from a completely separate source and your ear will not know the difference because of the omnidirectionality of low frequencies. This is a tremendous acoustic plus that Bose takes great advantage of.

Separating the frequency bands keeps everything clean and neat without the muddle of larger speakers.
I'm sure you're correct. My newest Carvin catalog shows their version of a Bose stick. Carvin uses nine 3" speakers in each cab for $500. That's still too much for an unpowered cab to me.

billyguitar
05-01-2013, 09:11 AM
Here's the new Carvin speakers.

http://www.carvinguitars.com/trx3000/

hellbender
05-01-2013, 11:30 AM
The design, at least in form, is starting to show up with more frequency. The are still point source designs, although they look to embrace the separation concept a bit.

huzzah!

Yossi
05-01-2013, 11:39 AM
I picked one up used with the Bose control module and two subs.
For acoustic guitar, vocals, and keyboard, the sound is excellent.

It is portable and eliminates the need for monitors as it sits behind you.

One thing that I discovered was that with the speaker column, which is two pieces, stacked, that it is too high for my basement studio.

Fortunately, It works with only one of the speaker columns, though not as well as it does with two. Something to consider before buying one.

JoeSimple
05-01-2013, 12:26 PM
I think the only real draw back is that they don't look rock and roll. Personally I dig the modern look and would push a drummer to go electronic to fill out that image, have everyone on stage go Axe/Modeller.

PVia
08-02-2013, 12:25 AM
How is the Bose if you just want to put vocals through it with a 5 piece blues-rock band?

n8cjohn
08-02-2013, 07:06 AM
How is the Bose if you just want to put vocals through it with a 5 piece blues-rock band?
Like most systems - it will sound fine if you take the time to understand the approach, the capabilities and limitations of the system. I've been using L1 systems since 6/10 for a 4 pc rock cover band and we absolutely love them. I've also used my L1 when sitting in with a band using a traditional system - with traditional backline gear - and it worked very well.

Other folks seem to struggle - for various reasons, I suppose - or have an altogether different idea on how sound should be reinforced at a given venue or setting. To each - his own - you would think. Many people around Knoxville use L1s and I actually prefer to listen to those acts when I go out. So does the wife.

For the record, we use the system darn close to how it was intended to be used (one L1 for each performer) - so that would account for some of our success. We have three L1s, three T1s, 8 B1s and two A1s. Bass and b/u vocals go into one L1 - with usually 3 B1s hooked up. My L1 has lead vocals and R. Guitar - usually with 2 B1s. The third L1 carries the kick drum, b/u vocals and a mic'd guitar cabinet. My guitar and the bass feed their systems via modelers. If our L. guitarist would ditch his combo amp for a modeler - then we'd buy a fourth L1 system. Not going to happen soon, though. NBD.

It is easy enough for you to find out if you like the approach - because you can return a new system within 45 days for a full refund if you do not bond with it. You can also go the used route and you will be able to sell the thing for what you paid for it - no problem.

I actually prefer the Model 1 (discontinued) vs the Model 2 (presently available) - I own two Model 1 systems and one Model 2. Used Model 1 systems go for between $800 and $1200. B1(s) will set you back $125 - $175 used. T1(s) go for $450ish used - so it makes no sense to buy one of those in any condition but new.

You don't need a T1 or a B1 with a Model 1. You have to have a B1 or B2 with the Model 2 (as well as the newly offered Model 1s - with which I have no experience) - and if you don't get a T1 for that (those) system(s) - then you will not have access to any of the ToneMatch stuff. The Model 1 has some tonematch stuff built in.

Best of luck to you - whatever you decide.

Flyin' Brian
08-02-2013, 07:21 AM
Too bad every attempt at a positive L1 thread has to end up with all the smart assed Bose haters spouting their "oh so clever" bose acronyms...grow up, fellas...it's beyond tired.


This is the absolute truth. It's a typical situation here on TGP and really a shame. Of course it's not just Bose, it's common to most subjects.

To the OP, I'm happy to hear that you got a set up that works for you.

It worked very well as a monitoring tool for this guy, but then again he gets hated on around here too.

2CEozzi-ng8

I think the only real draw back is that they don't look rock and roll. Personally I dig the modern look and would push a drummer to go electronic to fill out that image, have everyone on stage go Axe/Modeller.

Form over function is the norm these days. I can only imagine the trash talking that would be going on if this were 1974-79 and Skunk Baxter was doing his turn in The Doobie Brothers .... horrors .... SITTING DOWN!!!

With most people looking rock & roll is more important than sound according to this recent thread.

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=1288298

HeeHaw
09-06-2013, 11:46 AM
We just bought the larger bose pa for our acoustic act. It wasn't cheap, but we love it! After five years of using a cheap $300 pa shaped like an egg, we almost didn't know how to act after hearing ourselves in the Bose.

Best money we ever spent on a piece of gear.

billyguitar
09-06-2013, 12:34 PM
Thinking about the Carvin version: I wonder if two of the 9 speaker cabs and one 15" sub would cut it with a band?

n8cjohn
09-06-2013, 12:55 PM
Thinking about the Carvin version: I wonder if two of the 9 speaker cabs and one 15" sub would cut it with a band?
Carvin gives a 10 day trial period - with a return policy. Easy enough for you to figure it out.

Report back here, please.

billyguitar
09-06-2013, 03:00 PM
Carvin gives a 10 day trial period - with a return policy. Easy enough for you to figure it out.

Report back here, please.

My curiosity isn't that great! Good idea though.

tochiro
09-07-2013, 02:25 AM
:agree

You put it into words better than I could. :aok

I've mixed on the L1M2 in a variety of rooms (both size and acoustical properties), as well as outdoors.

Is setup quick and simple? Yes.

Can it sound good? Yes, but not without just as much fiddling as a good standard box (some of which sound MUCH better).

Does the sound change less with distance than "normal" speakers? No.

Is it better than a similarly priced "normal" system? It's not as good, let alone better. Especially if the musical genre "requires" a lot of kick.

At the price, I can't think of any reason to recommend it for any application.

+2! :agree

dporto
09-10-2013, 12:25 PM
I've done a duo gig a few times with a keyboard player who uses one of these BOSE set ups (1 column, 1 bass/sub unit). In this instance he prerecords/sequences drums/bass/horn lines and we basically play along with that - I play guitar through a regular amp/effects setup and he plays various keyboard sounds (organ, piano, synths etc.). A few people came down and sat in last week so I was able to get some "audience" time to check the sound. I found that the sound out front was very light in the bass frequencies - he found this hard to believe, because from where he was sitting it sounded fine (he was practically sitting on the sub...). Once he took my word for it and adjusted the mix a bit it was much better. I find it a little challenging to get a good guitar sound that blends with his mix, but not impossible. The BOSE sound is very "polished" sounding- I don't know if there is some kind of compression involved in their processor or what but it's definitely not your basic raw P.A. sound. Projection? I can't really comment because it's a fairly small room (20 x 50 or so) judging by the sound, I can't imagine that this system would do much in a outdoor setting - maybe with a few more columns and the bigger subs... So overall, I think for a solo or small combo gig I think they're pretty cool and could work really well if properly spec'd and setup. Price to value? I can't comment because I don't own it...

dank
09-11-2013, 06:00 PM
I play in a Classic Rock and current Top 40 dance band. Here's my setup for our 6-person band: two L1 Classics, each with two original bass bins. Two powered monitors on the floor for the vocalists. An additional powered monitor for the keyboardist. I run the guitar (Axe FX), keyboards (2), 6 drum mics and three vocal mics into a Presonus Studiolive 16.0.2. The Presonus goes out to the L1s.

The sound is absolutely superb. People always tells us they love our sound. Never a bit of feedback.

Great system.

vinney57
09-15-2013, 08:06 AM
um...no...that is a violation of the laws of physics...SPLs decrease 6dB for each doubling of distance from the source...play a tone through ANY system and measurement from 20' away will measure 6dB less SPL than the measurement from 10' away...period...

This is precisely the point. The 6dB rule only applies to spherical wave fronts - i.e. from point sources like your typical horn. For line arrays, of which the Bose is one of many available, the wavefront is cylindrical and the loss over distance doubling is only 3dB

SarasotaSlim
09-17-2013, 05:20 PM
I always thought the little speakers should be something bigger than a 2-1/2". Something more in the 4", to maybe 6", range. I could never think that a lower male singing voice would have the "chestiness" I want to hear from those little speakers. I realize that everything gets exponentially bigger with the bigger speakers in the columns but I'd sure like to hear that kind of rig.

If you move beyond the consumer grade stuff and spend more money you can get to the bigger better stuff. The columns alone are actually less money than the Bose but by the time you power them properly and get a real sub to go with it they cost more. I've used those Bose sticks on several occasions and the only thing they're good for is lite stuff - no heavy hitting. I own some Ramsdell Audio stick things with 5 inch speakers and they sit on a single 18. They will handle a hard hitting full band outside and they have similar characteristics to the Bose but bigger and better. (Bigger and better is an understatement - they are the best sounding speakers I've ever used) I'll try posting a pic from another forum here - http://soundforums.net/attachments/product-reviews/4928d1349058937-tall-skinny-speakers-577311_4721663481209_1509740681_n.jpg.att

dank
09-17-2013, 08:02 PM
The problem is, who is going to carry those 18" subs?

SarasotaSlim
09-18-2013, 04:42 PM
The problem is, who is going to carry those 18" subs?

I do - they're Faital loaded neo's and they weigh 55 lbs. each. (Actually I use a hand truck for most stuff.) There are still plenty of people that like to hear a little thump when they have a venue that will allow it.

billyguitar
09-19-2013, 10:52 AM
I think the Carvins might be a step between Bose and the Ramsdell. That's more my niche.

n8cjohn
09-19-2013, 11:01 AM
I think the Carvins might be a step between Bose and the Ramsdell. That's more my niche.
Does that mean that you have decided to try them out? Curious to what you end up hearing.

billyguitar
09-19-2013, 11:05 AM
Does that mean that you have decided to try them out? Curious to what you end up hearing.

No. I'm very interested but I'm a chicken!! I'll stick with my EV SX300s on a stick. They are pretty hard to beat because I don't need disco thump.

SarasotaSlim
09-19-2013, 11:40 AM
I think the Carvins might be a step between Bose and the Ramsdell. That's more my niche.

I looked up the Carvin skinny speaker and if it's this thing http://www.carvinguitars.com/products/TRX3903 it would probably be more of a sideways move for less money than the Bose stick thingy. Size matters and the Carvin is only sporting 3 inches. We played a club in Panama City that had 5 Bose stick things each with 2 of the Bose little sub things. We hooked them all together and used them as one main speaker using my board and admittedly it did sound pretty good - but. When you bear down with hard hitting dynamic players the Bose can't keep up even when used as just a vocal PA. Here's another bigger better tall skinny speaker

http://www.slsloudspeakers.com/LS8695.jpg

6" cones and ribbon tweeters - much bigger - much heavier - a lot more money

I've heard them and actually prefer the cheaper product that local speaker builder Ramsdell makes.

billyguitar
09-19-2013, 02:02 PM
Yea Carvins are 3" , Bose are 2-1/2". Both sound small to me!

billyguitar
09-19-2013, 03:07 PM
So we know how much the Bose and Carvin speakers are. How much are the Ramsdell?

n8cjohn
09-20-2013, 06:48 AM
Played a private affair at a local racquet club last night. We did our best to keep it down coming out of the gates but were still asked to lower the volume a skoache - until folks got used to it.

There was a real nice volume all around the pool area - and after the show - some folks who were playing tennis on the courts behind and to the left of the band made their way up to tell us how much they enjoyed the show.

Here are some mostly pre-show pix:

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy249/SunDog3478/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174154_zps10ac03ec.jpg (http://s796.photobucket.com/user/SunDog3478/media/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174154_zps10ac03ec.jpg.html)

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy249/SunDog3478/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174206_zps60d012ed.jpg (http://s796.photobucket.com/user/SunDog3478/media/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174206_zps60d012ed.jpg.html)

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy249/SunDog3478/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174221_zpsfae56ca2.jpg (http://s796.photobucket.com/user/SunDog3478/media/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174221_zpsfae56ca2.jpg.html)

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy249/SunDog3478/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174242_zps01683333.jpg (http://s796.photobucket.com/user/SunDog3478/media/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174242_zps01683333.jpg.html)

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy249/SunDog3478/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174305_zpsa596a740.jpg (http://s796.photobucket.com/user/SunDog3478/media/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19174305_zpsa596a740.jpg.html)

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy249/SunDog3478/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19184316_zps83ee5752.jpg (http://s796.photobucket.com/user/SunDog3478/media/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19184316_zps83ee5752.jpg.html)

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy249/SunDog3478/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19185607_zps0c9f88c0.jpg (http://s796.photobucket.com/user/SunDog3478/media/KRC%20Player%20Party/2013-09-19185607_zps0c9f88c0.jpg.html)

Club owner booked us for another private party on 10/26.

SarasotaSlim
09-20-2013, 08:17 AM
So we know how much the Bose and Carvin speakers are. How much are the Ramsdell?

The Ramsdell skinny columns with 5 inch plus 1 inch horn are around $1000 each. (or less if you are getting other things as well) The Ramsdell 18" Faital loaded subs are 800ish each and the Crown Xti 6002 power amps are about 2000 each times 2 so it's not in the same money league and far from being in the same performance league. Apples and oranges - no comparison. These will walk away from any of the consumer type skinny speaker offerings. As a point of reference I'll compare the output with the powered Mackie 2x12 tops coupled with the powered mackie 18 subs but these of course sound better to me and are much lighter to carry smaller to pack and actually perform better.

The one thing that all skinny speakers have is the stealth factor. You can bring them in to a venue without people freaking out about a mountain of gear.

loudboy
09-20-2013, 10:19 AM
The Ramsdell skinny columns with 5 inch plus 1 inch horn are around $1000 each. (or less if you are getting other things as well) The Ramsdell 18" Faital loaded subs are 800ish each and the Crown Xti 6002 power amps are about 2000 each times 2 so it's not in the same money league and far from being in the same performance league.

You could cut serious corners on the power amps, and still have a great system. Get some used QSC 3002s for $400/ea., and they'd be great.

Does that stuff need a processor?

Price is comparable or cheaper than what n8cjohn spent on his Bose rigs...

Justin Hitchborn
09-20-2013, 11:18 AM
Subscribed.

n8cjohn
09-20-2013, 11:22 AM
Price is comparable or cheaper than what n8cjohn spent on his Bose rigs...
Interesting. I Don't mind sharing the number. This is no big dork contest for me and I have no huge hard-on for Bose as a company.

I have about $7,200 into the system consisting of 2 L1 M1, 1 L1 M2, 2 T1, 8 B1 and 2 A1. The drummer also has his own T1 - so that's another $500 for the system. Two of our B1s were free. The M2 was bought used - as were 4 of the B1s and one of the A1s. I prefer the M1 sound over the M2 - but the M2 is more portable.

It works for us quite well. No monitors or backline necessary (though our current L guitarist prefers to have his amp on stage) - so I save that cash/PITA - and I can scale down to small solo gigs quite easily.

I would guess that by the time any performing club band sets up and plays most venues around our town - that there's roughly $18K - $22K worth of sound stuff/instruments/gadgets on the stage - depending on how nice the guitars and amps and drums and mics and effects are. We probably fall right into that category on most nights with our 4pc. On the low side if we bring one guitar each. High side if two. American Fenders and PRS (used CEs and Mira).

It does my heart good to see when other folks find solutions that work well for them as well as ours works for us. Whatever the cost.

billyguitar
09-20-2013, 11:31 AM
Either way that's a whole lot of money. The clubs here don't want to pay over $300 a nite so we're mostly doing it for fun as it is. Private parties are much better but we only get about 4 of those a year. I'd rather spend the money on geetars and amps!!

billyguitar
09-20-2013, 11:45 AM
Interesting. I Don't mind sharing the number. This is no big dork contest for me and I have no huge hard-on for Bose as a company.

I have about $7,200 into the system consisting of 2 L1 M1, 1 L1 M2, 2 T1, 8 B1 and 2 A1. The drummer also has his own T1 - so that's another $500 for the system. Two of our B1s were free. The M2 was bought used - as were 4 of the B1s and one of the A1s. I prefer the M1 sound over the M2 - but the M2 is more portable.

It works for us quite well. No monitors or backline necessary (though our current L guitarist prefers to have his amp on stage) - so I save that cash/PITA - and I can scale down to small solo gigs quite easily.

I would guess that by the time any performing club band sets up and plays most venues around our town - that there's roughly $18K - $22K worth of sound stuff/instruments/gadgets on the stage - depending on how nice the guitars and amps and drums and mics and effects are. We probably fall right into that category on most nights with our 4pc. On the low side if we bring one guitar each. High side if two. American Fenders and PRS (used CEs and Mira).

It does my heart good to see when other folks find solutions that work well for them as well as ours works for us. Whatever the cost.
One night in a band I had in the 90s, we looked up on stage and with three Selmer horns from the 50s, my L5CES, my 1957 tweed Bassman, the organ players B3 and Leslie, the upright bass, and then PA and misc. we figured we had over $40K on stage to play a $250 gig!

SarasotaSlim
09-20-2013, 12:31 PM
You could cut serious corners on the power amps, and still have a great system. Get some used QSC 3002s for $400/ea., and they'd be great.

Does that stuff need a processor?

Price is comparable or cheaper than what n8cjohn spent on his Bose rigs...

No processor needed it only needs to be crossed over at around 100hz and like all skinny speakers they need subs. I went over kill on the subs and amps but that's 'cause the amps are part of my bigger rig. (They power 4 2x18 cabs) I'm not a Bose hater other than they are priced kinda crazy for what they do. Looking at the pics and remembering my few run ins with them you can see that they actually have a bigger footprint when you include the "subs" than the single 18 I use and space is always an issue with the kind of gigs we wind up with. All tall skinny speakers by default have a very wide pattern and I really like not having to bring monitors. I place mine like in the photo with the tops about even with the mics - not in back of us - too much power for that - they will squeal.

Gas-man
09-22-2013, 08:12 AM
Currently using two Bose L1's with two 15" subs.

One guy uses in-ears, one earplugs (me) and one rides bareback.

The great thing about the Bose is you can hear yourself sing without a monitor since the sound is dispersed.

Load in is amazingly easy and fast. This set up has been working for years--highly recommended and a lot cheaper than a regular PA.

jcarpenter
09-22-2013, 09:08 AM
My two projects have been using them for the last three years. The guy that ownes them he has been gigging them for even longer. We have a great sound that is never too loud because we can hear clearly. Based on compliments from management and the staff we work for, I think the clarity of the system and volume control ousted other bands and got us more work.

We work really light. We can break down and set up in less than 15mins. We both play Blues Jr. amps and the bass player uses a Mark Bass 1x10 combo that is smaller and lighter than our guitar amps. Combine that with a drummer that knows how to play light and you got a sound man that can fill the whole room evenly at about 105 db on his meter. Vocals are clear and the bar tenders and servers can still here the customers orders.

I love the big cabs, but the rooms that can support that kind of volume are dissapearing. To work consistantly I believe the bose is the best way to go.

ComanchePlayer
09-22-2013, 04:45 PM
I'm shocked.

I'm not, I saw a 3 piece using one at a small club here and it was very impressive.

I want one.

kinmike
09-24-2013, 11:56 AM
My band uses three L1's. I have no complaints about the sound but there's one problem. Since they are meant to be behind you, in some of the smaller bars there's no room for all three. Trying to fit them all in the back with the drum kit and still have access to guitar and bass amps sometimes doesn't work well.

Mike

frankencat
09-24-2013, 12:00 PM
Still using my single L1 and 2 B1's for small/coffe-house sized gigs and practice. Love it. On the lookout for another L1 Classic. I still have the QSC K12 as well but I mainly use that for guitar when I am modeling ;) :)

Seegs
09-27-2013, 04:18 AM
These are quite expensive over here...

2000 euros for the L1 and 2500 euros for the L1 with the Tonematch port...I can't comment on these as I havn't heard them but based on my experience below I'm not sure I need to...

1000 euros for the L1 compact...

Of the 3 systems I have demo'd the L1 Compact for my acoustic and got far more satisfying tones from a Shertler Unico...

Chow,
Seegs

RGB
09-27-2013, 05:47 AM
Don't judge the L1's based on the Compact...it was pretty useless compared to the Classic in real world use...my opinion, of course. I sold mine to my sis-in-law...she uses it for her home entertainment system. (Works ok for that purpose). For me, it was only ok and just in the smallest venues.

Gas-man
09-27-2013, 06:06 AM
My band uses three L1's. I have no complaints about the sound but there's one problem. Since they are meant to be behind you, in some of the smaller bars there's no room for all three. Trying to fit them all in the back with the drum kit and still have access to guitar and bass amps sometimes doesn't work well.

Mike

They work fine on the sides too.

If you are a 4 piece, run two, one on each side--you'll still be able to hear yourself sing.

We don't use them as a "Each guy gets his own Bose" like they want you to--total overkill. One on each side, ditch the Bose subwoofers for something bigger, decent board, done.

frankencat
09-28-2013, 02:04 PM
^ this. Works great.

Lucidology
11-25-2013, 10:08 PM
In this youtube I'm playing a Vox Tonelab through a Bose L1 system live with a loud bandÖ.
See if you like it Ö


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