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saxophonist56
09-02-2013, 05:54 AM
i just don't get it. got to be permanently disfiguring. edit....

newking70
09-02-2013, 06:00 AM
:munch

StompBoxBlues
09-02-2013, 06:11 AM
Why do people do anything? Or anything that I or you don't understand?

There is no meaningful answer you could get to that question. People do different things that you don't get, because we are all different, and some re very different, and some just want desperately to be different, others actually are out of the norm.

It has always been that way, and I guess always will be. It's a good thing to remember...I forget it sometimes, but there's quite a range of things we humans do, for a huge range of reasons.

Davyc
09-02-2013, 06:22 AM
I'm thinking the OP is referring to tunnels, not hoops. Tunnels go through the ear and are often stretched larger over time as larger tunnels are popped in to replace the smaller ones. As to why, why not? They obviously like the look. It's simply fashion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flesh_tunnel

newking70
09-02-2013, 06:45 AM
Because the hoops were too large for their penis.


http://www.ladodgertalk.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/prince-albert-in-the-can.jpg

partytrain
09-02-2013, 06:50 AM
An attempt to look different.....which in turn makes them look like everyone else who is trying to look different.....

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 07:35 AM
An attempt to look different.....which in turn makes them look like everyone else who is trying to look different.....

Ah yes, this old line.



It is a type of fashion, just like not putting loops in one's ears, or getting a tattoo, or a piercing, or a hair style, or wearing Hawaiian shirts, or a mustache, or a beard, or being clean shaven, and so on.

Flogger59
09-02-2013, 07:38 AM
It's called "guaging".

tonegangster
09-02-2013, 08:00 AM
I saw a guy not too long ago at Starbucks whose holes were so big without the gauge in, it looked like puppy dog ears. I understand fashion and pushing the norms of society but, I just felt sorry for this guy. Now that I'm a little older I can't help but think what this guy will have to go through. Not getting a great job, being made fun of, and eventually painful surgery to correct it.

Tom CT
09-02-2013, 08:06 AM
The difference in this case is that it's permanent, so it's hard to classify as a fashion or style. Fashion changes, and people often adopt whatever's currently in vogue. It's not like switching from bell bottoms to skinny jeans, dying one's hair or even multiple piercings. Ear gauges are with you for life, even more so than tattoos.

I have no opinion on the matter, but it's a somewhat more radical and extreme road to take while trying to convey individuality and uniqueness.

Rockyrollercat
09-02-2013, 08:07 AM
They didn't get enough hugs.

Ron_R
09-02-2013, 08:40 AM
So a plastic surgeon can make lots of money fixing their ears when they enter "the real world" and realize that they will never get a "real" job with those monster loops in their ear lobes.

TheRockDoc
09-02-2013, 08:41 AM
http://thechive.com/2009/05/01/insane-body-piercings-skip-this-post-its-disgusting-20-photos/

StompBoxBlues
09-02-2013, 08:41 AM
The difference in this case is that it's permanent, so it's hard to classify as a fashion or style. Fashion changes, and people often adopt whatever's currently in vogue. It's not like switching from bell bottoms to skinny jeans, dying one's hair or even multiple piercings. Ear gauges are with you for life, even more so than tattoos.

I have no opinion on the matter, but it's a somewhat more radical and extreme road to take while trying to convey individuality and uniqueness.

I agree but I think only SOME that do it are trying to convey that. Some do it for other reasons, maybe not even sure WHY but they want to do it.

I'm guessing, from experience, some also do it to sort of "lock themselves" out of a mainstream future. As you say, you can cut your long hair you had in the 70s, but this is a little harder to change once it's done.

But then, you do see older folks tht are tattooed all over the place, and they maybe never wanted that corporate job, etc. and many still don't seem to have had bad lives from it. They hang with friends that are of a like mind, and look, and still...when a "straighter" person meets them, it isn't like you recoil in horror.

They are just people, that for whatever reason (probably many different reasons) decided "That is for me".

I'm glad I never did anything like that, because when I look back at what I thought was cool, etc. I tend to think "how did I once think THAT was cool?" but many people are not like me, or you, and for them maybe it is a good thing to do.

s2y
09-02-2013, 08:41 AM
So a plastic surgeon can make lots of money fixing their ears when they enter "the real world" and realize that they will never get a "real" job with those monster loops in their ear lobes.

Or they just work at Trader Joes.........:p

Rick Lee
09-02-2013, 08:43 AM
It makes me sick to look at it. Yesterday I had a hard time making eye contact with a clerk at the GC who was ringing me up. It's just disgusting and unsightly.

The Golden Boy
09-02-2013, 08:47 AM
Some people feel the same about tats.

Ron_R
09-02-2013, 08:54 AM
Or they just work at Trader Joes.........:p

ROFLMAO!!

Tom CT
09-02-2013, 09:00 AM
Because they want to look like some lady from a tribe in Africa....and have roughly the same earning potential.

Really? Really? :facepalm

Ron_R
09-02-2013, 09:00 AM
Some people feel the same about tats.

Gaudy tats on the neck and face I agree. But tats you can cover if they are on another parts.

aynirar27
09-02-2013, 09:00 AM
So a plastic surgeon can make lots of money fixing their ears when they enter "the real world" and realize that they will never get a "real" job with those monster loops in their ear lobes.

You need to get out more.
Tatoos, gauges, etc arent stopping anyone from getting work. Or "real jobs" as you so eloquently put it.

Ron_R
09-02-2013, 09:01 AM
You need to get out more.
Tatoos, gauges, etc arent stopping anyone from getting work. Or "real jobs" as you so eloquently put it.

It was a joke, lol.

UnfilteredDregs
09-02-2013, 09:03 AM
It is a type of fashion, just like not putting loops in one's ears, or getting a tattoo, or a piercing, or a hair style, or wearing Hawaiian shirts, or a mustache, or a beard, or being clean shaven, and so on.

Tan pants?

DivineTones
09-02-2013, 09:07 AM
You need to get out more.
Tatoos, gauges, etc arent stopping anyone from getting work. Or "real jobs" as you so eloquently put it.

Maybe, but a real job shuffling coffee at Starbucks is not the same as a real job in law enforcement/military/organizational leadership/etc where they hold either explicit or unspoken standards. They also pay a lot more $, provide better benefits, and offer greater opportunity to make significant impact upon society.

Steeltoe
09-02-2013, 09:08 AM
There's nothing quite like self-mutilation. Another sign of the degradation of society.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 09:16 AM
There's nothing quite like self-mutilation. Another sign of the degradation of society.

Please, altering ones body is as old as society itself, it is not a sign of anything.

pete100ca
09-02-2013, 09:32 AM
Please, altering ones body is as old as society itself, it is not a sign of anything.

I'm not a fan but this is true.

KeithC
09-02-2013, 09:58 AM
I agree it's unsightly, and because it's a permenant disfigurement I do feel sorry for their poor choice. The root of the issue is a theological and moral one, involving one's understanding of self image and other things. That's about all I can say.

I think you attach way more significance to it with your assumptions and inclusions of theology and moral failings.

One of the ladies in my office has 3 sons and the oldest has them. They are a very religious family and although she doesn't particularly like them she knows her son for what he truly is.
As far as self image and this 25 year old fellow, I should be so lucky! He has the other women and girls in our office in the vapors every time he comes in. Even the ones that don't like the rings in his ears fawn over him.
Also, he works in the oil field on a rotating schedule making a lot of money now at least and works with supposed "tough" guys that might be inclined to attach a feminine label on him for that choice.
He gets on fine with everyone and is polite and easy going and again does so well with the ladies he shuts up the assumers in short order.

Personally I don't like them and understand all the normal arguments against but knowing him and this family helps me keep an open mind.
After all according to my Dad back in the 70's with my long hair I was destined to be a pot dealer or a musician. He was only half wrong of course!

CatGut
09-02-2013, 10:12 AM
It's not for me. Heck, I don't even like getting something stuck between my teeth.

flatfinger
09-02-2013, 10:14 AM
on some level it seems to be a way to prove just how bold one is . That you are willing to go further than the rest , which as pointed out earlier , is kind of pointless cause there are always plenty of folks who will go there along with you ( plank walking swashbucklers!!)

How much can you set yourself apart from six billion other people ?? Actions and accomplishment would logically go further than fashion statements but who knows . So many of us go off first impressions and judge books by covers . The funny thing is that I always remind myself that we live in a world of individuals and that I shouldn't pre judge . But certian things just make the hair on the back of my neck stand up no matter how hard I try . I think it's almost pre-concious .


I have a good sorta-buddy at a store who I always joke around with when I infrequently see him . I know he is a good guy cause I've known him for over a decade. He has a very out going , friendly a and flair- full personality. I know he just likes to express himself and doesn't try to look different just to freak others out ...


That's about it I guess..


.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 10:14 AM
However you look at it, there is very little, if any, good to be had from such a choice.


How are you valuing it? If the person likes it and derives some personal satisfaction from it, is still able to make a living, has friends, is not sad or depressed because of it, why is it a bad thing?

1) I don't make assumptions. I make evaluations upon set standards.

2) You can love your kid, even when they're engaged in poor decision making (and you should!)

3) pragmatic evaluations never determine moral goodness. You could have been discussing a drug dealer with the same benefits.

It seems like you do make assumptions, based on appearance, I can only assume what "set standards" you are referring to, again still not sure what is so inherently evil about it.

Teleplayer
09-02-2013, 10:21 AM
Wannabees. If any of these cats had any cajones, they wold get a good surgeon to sew a third arm onto the middle of their backs. Now THAT'S a fashion statement. Plus, if it's long enough, just think of the potential for playing both necks of a doubleneck guitar....by one's self. Nothing wrong with that.

Tom CT
09-02-2013, 10:25 AM
I thought religion was a no-no on TGP? Or is it OK if you're sneaky about it?

R3deemed
09-02-2013, 10:29 AM
Wannabees.

You might be joking, but this is how I see it. Not always, of course, but often. Like tattoos they started as something different, rebellious, cool. But after a while almost everyone has them, and instead if being different, they're just one of the crowd.

I guess it could be liking the fashion, but worse than tattoos I sort of feel for the kid who didn't quite know what he was doing, grows up a little then regrets what they did.

flatfinger
09-02-2013, 10:29 AM
Ya ! What about the Holy (ear) Hoops of Antiock ??? Those shouldn't be mentioned no matter what !!!!


:anon

McShred
09-02-2013, 10:51 AM
Old man in khaki pants yells at cloud while listening to John Mayer

nsureit
09-02-2013, 10:51 AM
Ah yes, this old line.

It is a type of fashion, just like not putting loops in one's ears, or getting a tattoo, or a piercing, or a hair style, or wearing Hawaiian shirts, or a mustache, or a beard, or being clean shaven, and so on.

Items in bold can be undone...

What do these kids/adults with the extreme bodily modifications do for a living? :rolleyes:

A-Bone
09-02-2013, 10:57 AM
That is your unbacked assertion, and although a false one, it's not something we can debate here. Pretty much everything in life, personal thought/behavior, decision making, relationships, etc. has a connection to those two categories; but you're also speaking to somebody with a post-graduate degree in pastoral theology and ethics.

However you look at it, there is very little, if any, good to be had from such a choice.

When the only tool you have is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. This just to suggest that your post reads as if you are processing all human decisions through the same, solipsistic lens.

Also, what do you mean by a "post-graduate degree?" Do you mean an MDiv?

A-Bone
09-02-2013, 11:02 AM
Items in bold can be undone...

What do these kids/adults with the extreme bodily modifications do for a living? :rolleyes:

Tattoos can typically be undone now, and my guess is there is a surgical method of addressing gauging, too.

I certainly can't speak for all of them, but in my neck of the woods some of those "kids" have really high paying tech jobs at companies like Google, Apple, Facebook, and the like. They aren't all barristas and checkout clerks.

KeithC
09-02-2013, 11:03 AM
Items in bold can be undone...

In this case they are bold but not as bold as the others as far as a statement I guess.

Neither tattoos or hoops are for me and I do figure at some point later in life many of the hoopers will regret them.

But I see plenty of older people now that I am old that live with and proudly display tattoos.

I wouldn't have even opened this thread if I didn't know the lady in question and her son and know that he is by all other measures a great guy who is well liked and very comfortable in his skin as it were.

My point mainly being that as I get older and styles change sometimes I have to relearn and reaffirm what I usually try to live by. Don't judge the book by the cover.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 11:05 AM
I certainly can't speak for all of them, but in my neck of the woods some of those "kids" have really high paying tech jobs at companies like Google, Apple, Facebook, and the like. They aren't all barristas and checkout clerks.

Not in my part of the world.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 11:06 AM
This just to suggest that your post reads as if you are processing all human decisions through the same, solipsistic lens.

Say, does Nikon make one of those?

semore butts
09-02-2013, 11:07 AM
Remember how smart you thought you were when you were 14? Then when you were 18 you looked back and realized what a dumb a$$ you were?

Well, they are no different. It's there "time". Yeah, I think it looks stupid as hell. But hey, I'm not out there trying to find myself, they are.

in 20 or 30 years they will be looking back at the "virtual review of their lives (completely digital with full dolby sound if it's still around) and
be shaking their heads saying what was I thinking?

I can just see two people sitting on a freighter commuting to Mars for their jobs! Hey, check it out! Yeah, that's my kid, he just had another arm mounted to his back! (As a previous poster pointed out) Hey! My kid did that too! These kids now a days!!!! Bwahahahahahahha!!!!!!

Take care, Semore

Johnny V.
09-02-2013, 11:07 AM
OK-I'll be the grumpy old guy and cut to the chase: Pointless, stupid and ugly........

Full disclosure-I do have on off white shorts, but I'm NOT listening to John Mayer.

A-Bone
09-02-2013, 11:08 AM
Not in my part of the world.

Are you in or around Austin, or another part of Texas? My guess is that you would see some of what I describe in Silicon Gulch.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 11:10 AM
Are you in or around Austin, or another part of Texas? My guess is that you would seem some of what I describe in Silicon Gulch.

I know for a fact that Mr. Dell does not hire folks as described by the OP.

KeithC
09-02-2013, 11:11 AM
OK-I'll be the grumpy old guy and cut to the chase: Pointless, stupid and ugly........

Full disclosure-I do have on off white shorts, but I'm NOT listening to John Mayer.

Any affectation for "beauty" could be considered pointless and stupid. Ugly I guess does allow for some interpretation.

I happen to like off white shorts! You should be listening to John Mayer though:phones

Flinx
09-02-2013, 11:13 AM
i just don't get it. got to be permanently disfiguring. why not just cut their ears off at least they'd be more streamlined. :p

Cause they wanna be different than everyone else that is doing it...duhh! ;)

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 11:13 AM
What do these kids/adults with the extreme bodily modifications do for a living? :rolleyes:

Lots of things, not sure how it would impact their ability to do a lot of different jobs competently, perhaps it could be an issue if one meets a lot with clients, but for behind the scenes stuff who cares? I know quite a few making good money in the IT realm.


Also consider that there are lots of retail positions where it might not be that out of the normal, there is a big world out there with lots of different people.

Celebrate diversity.

wrshpgtr60
09-02-2013, 11:13 AM
http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/000/540/685/b1d.png

Flinx
09-02-2013, 11:15 AM
OK-I'll be the grumpy old guy and cut to the chase: Pointless, stupid and ugly........

Full disclosure-I do have on off white shorts, but I'm NOT listening to John Mayer.

Amen!!

A-Bone
09-02-2013, 11:16 AM
I know for a fact that Mr. Dell does not hire folks as described by the OP.

Okay. Is Dell the only tech company in Texas, or Austin?

I don't imagine IBM hires folks that have more extreme looks, either, but I know among software developers, engineers, and the like, an awful lot of them do have appearances removed from the mainstream, and I also know that by and large, and especially for non-customer facing roles, that tech companies are much more interested in hiring the best qualified applicants, rather than hiring folks based on how they look.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 11:24 AM
Lots of things, not sure how it would impact their ability to do a lot of different jobs competently, perhaps it could be an issue if one meets a lot with clients, but for behind the scenes stuff who cares? I know quite a few making good money in the IT realm.


Also consider that there are lots of retail positions where it might not be that out of the normal, there is a big world out there with lots of different people.

Celebrate diversity.

OK, I'll give you the IT thing, and that's a huge industry. How many folks as described by the OP are: doctors, lawyers, CPAs, teachers, newscasters, bankers, cashiers, firemen, policemen, bus drivers, insurance underwriters, nurses, salesmen, engineers, architects, scientists (except the chick on NCIS) or ANY client facing employee? How many are executives or managers? Why box yourself into a limited corner, career-wise?

Structo
09-02-2013, 11:44 AM
So a plastic surgeon can make lots of money fixing their ears when they enter "the real world" and realize that they will never get a "real" job with those monster loops in their ear lobes.

Bingo!

I saw a story about a doctor that is getting wealthy fixing those ear lobes.:D

The Golden Boy
09-02-2013, 11:44 AM
I don't care who I'm speaking to. However you may wish attribute anything in your life to whatever you wish to attribute things to- doesn't make it objective truth.

I don't care for tats, piercings or other forms of body art. I don't object to them from any sort of unbacked assertion of theology or morality- it's more based on a sociological conditioning on what I view as attractive or acceptable.

Rick Lee
09-02-2013, 11:45 AM
I've also seen a few kids who had since decided to remove those hoops and who then looked like they had giant rubber bands hanging from their ear lobes. It's so disgusting. I can't imagine how anyone would hire such a person in a customer-facing role. I can't stand to look at it and I'm not that squeamish. I have three tats and had three earrings at one time, though you'd never know from looking at me in business attire.

Peteyvee
09-02-2013, 11:45 AM
So a plastic surgeon can make lots of money fixing their ears when they enter "the real world" and realize that they will never get a "real" job with those monster loops in their ear lobes.

Hmmm.... I have two younger friends (both in their late 20s) that have those things in their ear lobes and they have no trouble pulling down 6 figures at their "real" jobs in the "real world" because their skills are in high demand. In fact, they're both members here, but don't post very often anymore. With threads like this, it's no wonder why.

It's simply fashion. Nothing more, nothing less.

Killcrop
09-02-2013, 11:49 AM
I did all kinds of stuff when I was a kid that I regret. Fortunately for me, non of it was disfiguring. My tastes and interest when I was 18 are vastly different than now. I missed the whole tattoo craze by a year or two. Otherwise I would probably have a tattoo of KK Downing on my arm.

The hoops can easily be fixed, what's up with neck tattoo guy? You pretty much are throwing in the towel on life with that move.

FiestaRed
09-02-2013, 11:52 AM
It makes them more aerodynamic. Less wind resistance and all.

FiestaRed
09-02-2013, 11:57 AM
Dr. Tweedbucket is going to start selling his extra tubes at outrageous prices so these people can thread a tube through each ear.

michael.e
09-02-2013, 12:07 PM
Why are people compelled to do anything, really...



Frikken people.

Flyin' Brian
09-02-2013, 12:09 PM
70 posts in this thread. Just about 1/3 of them are blatantly judgemental, a couple are out and out deplorable.

Strange figures for a group of open minded "musicians and artists".

Then again it's just like the common assertion that "If I don't like this artist/musician/gear/tone, then it sucks".

crunchman
09-02-2013, 12:14 PM
As an 80's dude from N.Y. It seems a bit odd, but I hear it is somewhat reversible.We only wore earrings in our rt ear too, what do I know! Its the same as wearing long hair, just more extreme I guess.

A-Bone
09-02-2013, 12:14 PM
70 posts in this thread. Just about 1/3 of them are blatantly judgemental, a couple are out and out deplorable.

Strange figures for a group of open minded "musicians and artists".

Then again it's just like the common assertion that "If I don't like this artist/musician/gear/tone, then it sucks".

You are making the assumption that this forum and this thread represents musicians and artists, let alone open-minded ones. This forum has some members who are musicians and artists, but most posting on TGP are more accurately guitar and guitar gear enthusiasts, collectors, and hobbyists.

Guitar55
09-02-2013, 12:15 PM
I believe there is a certain size one can go up to and still have the hole close up later if wanted. So they are not ALL permanent or disfiguring.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 12:15 PM
OK, I'll give you the IT thing, and that's a huge industry. How many folks as described by the OP are: doctors, lawyers, CPAs, teachers, newscasters, bankers, cashiers, firemen, policemen, bus drivers, insurance underwriters, nurses, salesmen, engineers, architects, scientists (except the chick on NCIS) or ANY client facing employee? How many are executives or managers? Why box yourself into a limited corner, career-wise?

Maybe there are things that are more important to them than careers, not everyone is the same or has the same goals from life. Variety is the spice of life.

A-Bone
09-02-2013, 12:15 PM
Why are people compelled to do anything, really...



Frikken people.

People are the worst.

Flyin' Brian
09-02-2013, 12:16 PM
You are making the assumption that this forum and this thread represents musicians and artists, let alone open-minded ones. This forum has some members who are musicians and artists, but most posting on TGP are more accurately guitar and guitar gear enthusiasts, collectors, and hobbyists.

I know. I was just being a bit more stealthy about it. ;)

KeithC
09-02-2013, 12:17 PM
People are the worst.

As far as sentient beings go I have to agree. :agree

Peteyvee
09-02-2013, 12:17 PM
70 posts in this thread. Just about 1/3 of them are blatantly judgemental, a couple are out and out deplorable.

Strange figures for a group of open minded "musicians and artists".

Then again it's just like the common assertion that "If I don't like this artist/musician/gear/tone, then it sucks".

It happens. I invited my two younger friends with the hoops to an open jam another friend was hosting near Clearwater, FL and when they walked in the bar, you could have heard a pin drop. I told the host that the three of us were gonna play some rockabilly and he said "sure, you are". His drummer refused to play with us at first, until I explained what we were going to play and he grudgingly agreed to do it. After the first song, people were dancing, having a good time and the host joined in for two more songs. All of a sudden, folks were buying my younger friends drinks, and everyone was happy. The host later apologized to them and me for prejudging them solely based on their looks...

I reminded him of when we were that age in the late 70s and older people assumed because we had long hair we were gay or drug addicts or both...

michael.e
09-02-2013, 12:18 PM
That is your unbacked assertion, and although a false one, it's not something we can debate here. Pretty much everything in life, personal thought/behavior, decision making, relationships, etc. has a connection to those two categories; but you're also speaking to somebody with a post-graduate degree in pastoral theology and ethics.

However you look at it, there is very little, if any, good to be had from such a choice.


This is pretty bombastic in some kind of assertion that the line of thought proposed is some kind of common truth. Well, maybe with all "good" people, eh? Frankly, it gave me a chuckle. Then topping it off with the education "bit", is showing just where parameters and limitations lie. IMO.



Frankly, by setting up parameters for your vision, you are not going to be able to see a larger picture. There are people out there, well beyond your admitted scope of vision, that are GREAT human beings.

If the ability to make money is an aspect of this conversation, then, those that are saying that it will hamper one's ability to have a job beyond Starbucks, you need to open your eyes and expand a little. That is absolutely not the case, not at all.

muffinMan74
09-02-2013, 12:20 PM
Dr. Tweedbucket is going to start selling his extra tubes at outrageous prices so these people can thread a tube through each ear.

You may have just sold me on the idea of joining this thrilling new trend and sporting a pair of Sylvania NOS 12AX7's... then my tone would truly be in my ears

mattball826
09-02-2013, 12:21 PM
They didn't get enough hugs.

lol

2leod
09-02-2013, 12:25 PM
I work with a young kid who has one in his ear - smart guy, works in the engineering dep't, has a good future ahead of him. He's also an avid surfer and mountain biker which is probably where his sense of style radiates from - I find it discouraging that some try and attach personal bias value judgements to body art, when a simple interest in the lives of people this thread is about most often illuminates the fallacy of those prejudices.

R3deemed
09-02-2013, 12:26 PM
70 posts in this thread. Just about 1/3 of them are blatantly judgemental, a couple are out and out deplorable.

Strange figures for a group of open minded "musicians and artists".

Then again it's just like the common assertion that "If I don't like this artist/musician/gear/tone, then it sucks".
As sort of an elder statesman of TGP (please don't take that the wrong way), I usually pay a little more attention to your posts, Brian, but really I don't see a lot of open-mindedness here :anon

Maybe it's my perspective. I'm a curmudgeon in training, but I'm trying to quit.

telefactor
09-02-2013, 12:41 PM
You need to get out more.
Tatoos, gauges, etc arent stopping anyone from getting work. Or "real jobs" as you so eloquently put it.

Actually, I own a business and hire people for "real jobs"...and I wouldn't hire someone with "tunnels" in their ears...and (this is the kicker)...I'd tell them so...

Business owners I deal with feel the same way...you can say it doesn't effect their career advancement...I wouldn't bet my career on it if I were them...

nsureit
09-02-2013, 12:44 PM
It happens. I invited my two younger friends with the hoops to an open jam another friend was hosting near Clearwater, FL and when they walked in the bar, you could have heard a pin drop. I told the host that the three of us were gonna play some rockabilly and he said "sure, you are". His drummer refused to play with us at first, until I explained what we were going to play and he grudgingly agreed to do it. After the first song, people were dancing, having a good time and the host joined in for two more songs. All of a sudden, folks were buying my younger friends drinks, and everyone was happy. The host later apologized to them and me for prejudging them solely based on their looks...

I reminded him of when we were that age in the late 70s and older people assumed because we had long hair we were gay or drug addicts or both...

Hmmm. Good thing they can play in a band.

Hmmm.... I have two younger friends (both in their late 20s) that have those things in their ear lobes and they have no trouble pulling down 6 figures at their "real" jobs in the "real world" because their skills are in high demand. In fact, they're both members here, but don't post very often anymore. With threads like this, it's no wonder why.

It's simply fashion. Nothing more, nothing less.

Wow, you know two! 5% of Americans earn $100,000+. I wonder what percentage of them have hoops in their ears? I'm sure the Department of Labor will create a new demographic for them.

I have two daughters. They have all sorts of tats and probably 5 piercings in each ear...one has a small gemstone in her nose. When they were younger and doing all this decorating, I reminded them that they will one day have an 8-5 job.

One is a labor attorney, the other is a forensic anthropologist/genetic scientist. You can't see any of their adornments while in business attire. Smart kids.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 12:44 PM
Actually, I own a business and hire people for "real jobs"...and I wouldn't hire someone with "tunnels" in their ears...and (this is the kicker)...I'd tell them so...



Why not? What if they could do the job better than other applicants?

2leod
09-02-2013, 12:46 PM
Actually, I own a business and hire people for "real jobs"...and I wouldn't hire someone with "tunnels" in their ears...and (this is the kicker)...I'd tell them so...

Business owners I deal with feel the same way...you can say it doesn't effect their career advancement...I wouldn't bet my career on it if I were them...

While it may be true for your company, your sample size is too small to attach meaning. The company I spoke of earlier is a large multinational with sales in the 2.5 billions and a target to reach 6 billion in three years.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 12:46 PM
Maybe there are things that are more important to them than careers, not everyone is the same or has the same goals from life. Variety is the spice of life.

I feel sorry for their kids.

Why not? What if they could do the job better than other applicants?

If they don't have to deal with clients in person, fine.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 12:47 PM
Hmmm. Good thing they can play in a band.



Wow, you know two! 5% of Americans earn $100,000+. I wonder what percentage of them have hoops in their ears? I'm sure the Department of Labor will create a new demographic for them.



I wonder what percentage of guitar players make 100k a year?


BTW who cares? Maybe they find value in other things in life than money. Good for them.

I feel sorry for their kids.

I feel sorry for people with closed minds, and their children.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 12:52 PM
I wonder what percentage of guitar players make 100k a year?

The ones with the ear hoops and tattoos all over their bodies, I imagine. http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r305/nsureit/gifs/dude.gif


I feel sorry for people with closed minds, and their children.

Mr. Eric, it's just reality...right or wrong.

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6k8q5rhjZ1qemaclo1_500.jpg

Knavery
09-02-2013, 12:56 PM
The character of TGP just slipped another notch. Congratulations!

nsureit
09-02-2013, 12:57 PM
The character of TGP just slipped another notch. Congratulations!

Why? Because there's a social debate?

Knavery
09-02-2013, 01:00 PM
Why? Because there's a social debate?

It's not a debate. It's a judgment. People can do whatever the hell they want. What is it to you? Is your day completely and utterly ruined when you see a guy with a hoop in his/her ear? Seriously, get over yourselves.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 01:02 PM
Mr. Eric, it's just reality...right or wrong.

Lots of things used to just be reality, until we thought about them and fought against "reality" for example racism, religious intolerance, ageism, sexism, etc.

Again what exactly is so bad about gauging? I get that you may not like it aesthetically, personally I dont either, but I am not going to judge someone as a bad human being because they do.


http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6k8q5rhjZ1qemaclo1_500.jpg

Looks like a happy, loving family. :)

nsureit
09-02-2013, 01:10 PM
Looks like a happy, loving family. :)

Yes, they do. We'll just have to see what the future portends for the little one.

telefactor
09-02-2013, 01:11 PM
BTW who cares? Maybe they find value in other things in life than money. Good for them.


Who cares? Well, if they are trying to move ahead I would hope they would. If you are saying they don't care, then why would I want that attitude working at my business?

Let the value they find in things other than money pay the bills, provide for their family...let's pass on that "who cares" attitude to their kids and see how that works for them also.

Whether we like it or not, society will eventually absorb the non-conformers..."conforming" behavior will be rewarded...the people with the businesses (read money) ultimately decide who works and who doesn't...however distasteful that is...I am not judging...I am stating my position as a coach to my kids...

Tunneled ears don't make somebody good or bad...but they do influence closed-minded people like myself who deal with the public...until my generation and mindset has died out, the fact remains that "making your statement" with your ears can create a lot of unnecessary headaches, no pun intended...thanks for listening, Eric...;)

Knavery
09-02-2013, 01:12 PM
Yes, they do. We'll just have to see what the future portends for the little one.

Good lord... He'll be fine. Go take a cold shower or something.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 01:16 PM
Who cares? Well, if they are trying to move ahead I would hope they would. If you are saying they don't care, then why would I want that attitude working at my business?



I think you are missing what I am saying, I work in a field where if I wanted to, I could make twice what I make now, I choose not to, why? Because I like to go on a hike every now and then, I enjoy going on a walk with my wife in the evenings, I enjoy listening to music, playing guitar, and so on. If I were to forgo these activities I could spend my time billing and making a lot more money, I chose not to. I am comfortable with how much I make, and in return I get free time to pursue other interests.


Perhaps they value these other things to, as opposed to money, I suspect most people do.


I also employ people, and honestly, we try to employ like minded people, we work hard then we rest and enjoy life and pursue hobbies.

Frankee
09-02-2013, 01:19 PM
That is your unbacked assertion, and although a false one, it's not something we can debate here. Pretty much everything in life, personal thought/behavior, decision making, relationships, etc. has a connection to those two categories; but you're also speaking to somebody with a post-graduate degree in pastoral theology and ethics.

However you look at it, there is very little, if any, good to be had from such a choice.

And your assertions are backed by what?
That's a rhetorical question by the way. I would wager my life-savings and the house my children live in that the prime-motivator for which the basis of your views are founded on would disagree. I base that on the historical profile.

You seem like a genuinely intelligent and articulate guy......which makes me feel sorrier for you than for the garden-variety, ignorant bigot.

derekd
09-02-2013, 01:35 PM
Why not? What if they could do the job better than other applicants?

Come on, Eric, you are a bright guy.

Just because this has become a fashionable and somewhat counterculture thing to do doesn't mean this is the look businesses want as the face of their company. In a culture where perception and image is everything, we should just accept these kids and their urge to disfigure themselves?

Sorry, not buying it. While I can respect their right to tatt it up, pierce till their hearts are content and grow facial hair until they could be stunt doubles for ZZ Top doesn't mean I'm interested in them representing my company.

Of course it doesn't speak to who they are or what they can do, but they willingly engaged in this behavior after all the responsible adults in their lives (assuming there are such) told them it wasn't the best of ideas and would limit their opportunities in business. They chose to anyway. We all make choices and they all have various consequences. Part of growing up.

So when you are in the courtroom, you got your freak flag flyin (sorry, a really old phrase) because the judge needs to see you as a competent attorney no matter your appearance?

CatGut
09-02-2013, 01:38 PM
Why would people stick holes in themselves? Why would people distort a perfectly good clean guitar sound? Life is filled with such questions.

derekd
09-02-2013, 01:42 PM
It's not a debate. It's a judgment. People can do whatever the hell they want. What is it to you? Is your day completely and utterly ruined when you see a guy with a hoop in his/her ear? Seriously, get over yourselves.

Uhm, you just described a debate. I take one side, you take another. I've judged the circumstances and decided I like this side better. You did the same. We have opposing views and are now debating the various facets of our particular point of view. Judging situations is part of human nature. You and I do it constantly, just like the judgement you made on the post you quoted. We all do it.

Of course people can do whatever the hell they want. No one is questioning that. What is being questioned is the potential consequences of this particular choice.

It is limiting, no matter what you would would say to counter it, but it doesn't say anything about someone's character. Come to the Midwest with that look and you will have fewer employment options. Perhaps on the West Coast it is not a big deal. Here, where there are more conservative values, it matters. But you know this, you live in Minn.

Knavery
09-02-2013, 01:42 PM
Who cares? Well, if they are trying to move ahead I would hope they would. If you are saying they don't care, then why would I want that attitude working at my business?

Let the value they find in things other than money pay the bills, provide for their family...let's pass on that "who cares" attitude to their kids and see how that works for them also.

Whether we like it or not, society will eventually absorb the non-conformers..."conforming" behavior will be rewarded...the people with the businesses (read money) ultimately decide who works and who doesn't...however distasteful that is...I am not judging...I am stating my position as a coach to my kids...

Tunneled ears don't make somebody good or bad...but they do influence closed-minded people like myself who deal with the public...until my generation and mindset has died out, the fact remains that "making your statement" with your ears can create a lot of unnecessary headaches, no pun intended...thanks for listening, Eric...;)

Here's the thing... It's not up to you to decide. Maybe these folks own a record shop or a recording studio. Perhaps they are artists. You seem to focus only on professional, corporate careers where it'd be impossible to get ahead with tattoos or hoops in the ears (and I certainly don't argue the contrary). Well let me tell you.... There are a lot more things in life than the corporate world. It seems your world view is somewhat limited to this avenue of success. Personally, I wish I didn't work in the corporate world, but I do. I didn't have the fortitude and patience to try and make it in the things I love.

michael.e
09-02-2013, 01:44 PM
Why not? What if they could do the job better than other applicants?

Exactly. Does not make much sense from a business perspective.

michael.e
09-02-2013, 01:46 PM
I feel sorry for their kids.



If they don't have to deal with clients in person, fine.

Wow, talk about broad strokes and generalities. I know quite a number of heavily tatted and pierced/gauged parents. You will be glad to know that their kids are just fine.

FiestaRed
09-02-2013, 01:48 PM
Wouldn't that look cool though? A guy walking around with a 12AX7 threaded through each ear lobe?

michael.e
09-02-2013, 01:48 PM
The ones with the ear hoops and tattoos all over their bodies, I imagine. http://i147.photobucket.com/albums/r305/nsureit/gifs/dude.gif


W



Mr. Eric, it's just reality...right or wrong.

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m6k8q5rhjZ1qemaclo1_500.jpg


Wait... Are you saying that there is something wrong with this picture?



Oh, I do see a ring on that tatted [MOD EDIT] finger. Right?

FiestaRed
09-02-2013, 01:49 PM
Wait... Are you saying that there is something wrong with this picture?


Sure. Those curtains are atrocious!!!

Maybe that's wrapping paper.

michael.e
09-02-2013, 01:52 PM
LOL Hahahaa!

JamesT
09-02-2013, 01:58 PM
[QUOTE=michael.e;16241026]Wait... Are you saying that there is something wrong with this picture?

QUOTE]
Oh-Em-Gee those curtins are attrocious...

I like guaged ears on chicks and tattoos also. I thiink they are hot and I stereotype them as freekee and would be lots of fun...

not too too big just s bit big. Used to work with receptionis that has about 1/4" holes with cupic zerconia donuts or what ever you call them. They had holes not plugs. She had short white bleached hair, looked like Gwin Steffani at time and wowee she was hot, but ost wimmin are at 25...

chinaski
09-02-2013, 02:00 PM
[QUOTE=EricPeterson;16240835] I work in a field where if I wanted to, I could make twice what I make now, I choose not to, why? Because I like to go on a hike every now and then, I enjoy going on a walk with my wife in the evenings, I enjoy listening to music, playing guitar, and posting 22,000 times on TGP.
fixed:p

Frankee
09-02-2013, 02:00 PM
Anyways, earlobe gauging is for wusses.

There are some guys in the Philippines who go way more hardcore.....every year around springtime.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 02:13 PM
Come on, Eric, you are a bright guy.

Just because this has become a fashionable and somewhat counterculture thing to do doesn't mean this is the look businesses want as the face of their company. In a culture where perception and image is everything, we should just accept these kids and their urge to disfigure themselves?

Sorry, not buying it. While I can respect their right to tatt it up, pierce till their hearts are content and grow facial hair until they could be stunt doubles for ZZ Top doesn't mean I'm interested in them representing my company.

Of course it doesn't speak to who they are or what they can do, but they willingly engaged in this behavior after all the responsible adults in their lives (assuming there are such) told them it wasn't the best of ideas and would limit their opportunities in business. They chose to anyway. We all make choices and they all have various consequences. Part of growing up.

So when you are in the courtroom, you got your freak flag flyin (sorry, a really old phrase) because the judge needs to see you as a competent attorney no matter your appearance?

I cant help a judges perception and obviously I have a duty to my client, but as an employer I can personally choose to do my part to get past visual prejudice. Further, you act like they dont know their look is "counter culture" or that it might foreclose certain opportunities in employment or otherwise, I am sure they are well aware and this is a choice they made.

But my point is just because others have a prejudice against someone because they have gauges or tats, I know better, and I think many here know better to, we can and should be the change we want to be. :)

voorhiessa
09-02-2013, 02:14 PM
Down here in the South, I'd be afraid it would possibly limit my opportunities (business-wise). Sad, but a legitimate concern..

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 02:16 PM
Wow. Just when I thought TGP could not be wound any tighter, well, here we are. I have no tattoos, no piercings, and no gauges. I have no plans to either. That being said, MOST of my friends do. Some have 2 inch gauges, some have full sleeves, all the way up their necks. Some own clothing companies, a few own tattoo shops, online merch companies, and a LOT are absolute geniuses with high paying jobs in tech related fields. I also have some that have made bad decisions, and now can't get a job. Guess what, I know plenty of people, that are super clean cut in the same boat!!

I also have graduate degrees in theology, and had a career in that field for several years, before going in another direction. If I learned anything, it was that a person's character, not their appearance, determined who they really were. In many ways I trust a person who has the "odd" appearance more than the straight looking business man with the suit on. I now play death metal, have really long hair, and a long goatee and would probably not pass the mustard for some of the more self righteous folks here. I still also have my core beliefs, just approach from a different angle than before.

I have to address this as well, all the hate for Starbucks, and assuming anyone employed with them is some sort of loser. What I do for a living now, is tech work for all of the Starbucks in Iowa and parts of Illinois. My wife is a store manager and makes good money, with great benefits, and excellent health insurance. She makes 60K a year, not including bonuses and stock every year. I make 2 times what she makes, with a company vehicle, expense account, and per diem. I am a fan of Starbucks, I met her through Starbucks, and married her.

If you ever see me in a Starbucks in Iowa or Illinois, feel free to say hi, and I will buy you a beverage. I will be hard to miss, the old, fat, hairy guy. If you have a problem with my views or appearance, you are welcome to address it then as well. Most folks rarely do, when in person. If you got to know some of the folks with body modifications, you would probably meet some really cool people, that have a different way of expressing themselves. Sorry for the long rant, but this discussion is from some folks who clearly have no idea what they are addressing. I will not even judge you if you have tan shorts, socks with sandals on, or a great Hawaiian/bowling shirt. I think this applies to everyone when meeting someone.

"I have a dream that my four little children will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the color of their skin but by the content of their character."

Rev. Martin Luther King Jr.

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 02:21 PM
Uhm, you just described a debate. I take one side, you take another. I've judged the circumstances and decided I like this side better. You did the same. We have opposing views and are now debating the various facets of our particular point of view. Judging situations is part of human nature. You and I do it constantly, just like the judgement you made on the post you quoted. We all do it.

Of course people can do whatever the hell they want. No one is questioning that. What is being questioned is the potential consequences of this particular choice.

It is limiting, no matter what you would would say to counter it, but it doesn't say anything about someone's character. Come to the Midwest with that look and you will have fewer employment options. Perhaps on the West Coast it is not a big deal. Here, where there are more conservative values, it matters. But you know this, you live in Minn.

I live in Illinois on the border of Iowa, and it does not get more Midwest than that. Not a big deal here at all, most I know are very successful, and good family folks.

flatfinger
09-02-2013, 02:24 PM
The world will soon be a perfect place....NOT!

Appearance is a factor and no romantic Pollyanna wishes can change it. There are studies that show that there are evolutionary , unconscious forces at work . Hell one study showed that facial symmetry could be shown to have a correlation in preferences in the choice of mate...

SO , My recommendation ; Make sure you do BOTH ears !!!!!!!!!!!



.

flatfinger
09-02-2013, 02:28 PM
Nothing hyperbolic about bringing photos of lynchings into this little ear hoop/tat discussion .
( Ya , I know you'll say slippery slope ................... One that's a couple of miles long though !)

nsureit
09-02-2013, 02:30 PM
So, we can conclude that if one is self-employed, a rock star or works in IT, then tats and hoops are fine.

The new 1 percenters!

Frankee
09-02-2013, 02:33 PM
Nothing hyperbolic about bringing photos of lynchings into this little ear hoop/tat discussion .
( Ya , I know you'll say slippery slope ................... One that's a couple of miles long though !)

I think he was illustrating some of the "taboos" we've historically gotten over as a nation.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 02:35 PM
[MOD EDIT]

My cousin bobby tried the gay thing, he and his partner joe are now celebrating their 3rd wedding anniversary

LDS22
09-02-2013, 02:38 PM
point made. lynching pics unnecessary.

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 02:42 PM
So, we can conclude that if one is self-employed, a rock star or works in IT, then tats and hoops are fine.

The new 1 percenters!

Or a machinist, a mechanic, a store owner, a technician, factory worker, chef, restaurateur, business person, bar owner, smoke shop owner, real estate investors, furniture makers, investment broker, cycle shop, motorcycle dealer, art dealer, museum curator, music promoter, and "insert career field here". These are all jobs people I personally know have, and many more I have forgotten. They are happy with their choices, careers, family and lives. Sounds like you are offended by their appearance, it seems we know where the problem lies.

luv
09-02-2013, 03:20 PM
Really? Really? :facepalm

No, Tom, not really. I was completely joking. There is plenty of earning potential for guagers.

wstsidela
09-02-2013, 03:28 PM
I'm all for it. The wind whistling through their ears as they ride their fixed-gear bikes in traffic makes for better safety. We all win.

DGTCrazy
09-02-2013, 03:30 PM
Look, there's a way to discuss this or any other topic...........but it doesn't include referencing Religion, using Vulgarities, or engaging in any number of unacceptable forms of communication among and/or aimed at members.

I've removed Reported Posts, Edited existing posts, Issued Infractions/Warnings, and now feel compelled to monitor this thread to ensure it remains respectful, (if that's even possible based on how judgmental it seems), and within our rules.

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 03:30 PM
I'm all for it. The wind whistling through their ears as they ride their fixed-gear bikes in traffic makes for better safety. We all win.

That was pretty funny.

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 03:33 PM
I'm all for it. The wind whistling through their ears as they ride their fixed-gear bikes in traffic makes for better safety. We all win.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3nMnr8ZirI

Ron_R
09-02-2013, 03:41 PM
LOL everyone needs to calm down.

What I said way back was a joke. I DO know some plastics guys making a killing, lol.

I hope that the ones that decide to do this to themselves are lucky enough to find an employer that will give them six figures to do what they do best, regardless of how they look. Kudos to them.

If you're in the workforce, you will know that this is the exception and not the rule. Everyone knows "a guy who...", but the reality of it is that people are rarely judged by the merits of their talent, but on how they look, first. The rest comes later. Regardless how good your CV is.

Whether it is sad, prejudicial, judgmental...etc is beside the point. It just IS, whether you or we like it or not.

Go ahead and do whatever it is you want with your looks. The fact of the matter is that you WILL be judged by it. We all know this, and arguing here isn't going to change that.

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-02-2013, 03:44 PM
I didn't read back through all the responses, so this may have already been covered. I think those who get extreme piercings, whether its just quanitity, size, location, and the whole gauging/stretching thing, have the same sort of self image issues/condition as people who get repeated plastic surgeries. To push it a bit more you could perhaps even put in the same realm as anorxia or bulemia. Its self imposed disfigurement as a psychological response to something having to do with their physical self image. Not judging, just my observation and opinion on it.

Ron_R
09-02-2013, 03:47 PM
I didn't read back through all the responses, so this may have already been covered. I think those who get extreme piercings, whether its just quanitity, size, location, and the whole gauging/stretching thing, have the same sort of self image issues/condition as people who get repeated plastic surgeries. To push it a bit more you could perhaps even put in the same realm as anorxia or bulemia. Its self imposed disfigurement as a psychological response to something having to do with their physical self image. Not judging, just my observation and opinion on it.

I don't know about that. Many tribes people in Africa do it to show various milestones in their lives.

That being said, it IS a way for someone to separate themselves. As someone pointed out earlier, so many people have done it, it is not really considered "different" anymore.

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 03:54 PM
I didn't read back through all the responses, so this may have already been covered. I think those who get extreme piercings, whether its just quanitity, size, location, and the whole gauging/stretching thing, have the same sort of self image issues/condition as people who get repeated plastic surgeries. To push it a bit more you could perhaps even put in the same realm as anorxia or bulemia. Its self imposed disfigurement as a psychological response to something having to do with their physical self image. Not judging, just my observation and opinion on it.

Or maybe they like it? A psychological disorder? This thread keeps getting more and more bizarre.

michael.e
09-02-2013, 04:03 PM
Look, there's a way to discuss this or any other topic...........but it doesn't include referencing Religion, using Vulgarities, or engaging in any number of unacceptable forms of communication among and/or aimed at members.

I've removed Reported Posts, Edited existing posts, Issued Infractions/Warnings, and now feel compelled to monitor this thread to ensure it remains respectful, (if that's even possible based on how judgmental it seems), and within our rules.

Sorry about that Herb.

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-02-2013, 04:07 PM
Or maybe they like it? A psychological disorder? This thread keeps getting more and more bizarre.

I don't find anything "bizarre" about what I said. I never used the word disorder. Yes, perhaps they do like it, because it satisfies the need motivating them to it. Sometimes there's compulsiveness and extremeness involved with it, that's what I'm addressing. You can't tell me that someone who puts 50 piercings in their face and deforms their earlobes purposely doesn't have something other than "liking" motiving them to do so. Again, I'm not judging, its just an observation and opinion, which I'm entitled to, just like EVERYONE else here.

DonW
09-02-2013, 04:09 PM
Caught a show last year that had a cosmetic surgeon repairing the ears of a 40ish year old guy due to wearing through the bottom lobe by gauging. It was dangling there in two pieces. Moderation may be appropriate if one wants to avoid that kind of result. The doctor said they were to be cut, I guess lobe rebuilding isn't perfected yet.

Flyin' Brian
09-02-2013, 04:11 PM
I never used the word disorder

It's implied when "putting it in the same realm" as anorexia or bulemia

nsureit
09-02-2013, 04:19 PM
According to my tatoo'd labor attorney daughter, discrimination is legal in the US as long as it does not involve:
Age
Disability
Equal Pay/Compensation
Genetic Information
National Origin
Pregnancy
Race/Color
Religion
Retaliation
Sex
Sexual Harassment

telefactor
09-02-2013, 04:31 PM
I like guaged ears on chicks and tattoos also. I thiink they are hot and I stereotype them as freekee and would be lots of fun...



Just exactly how I want people to view my mother...Jeez...does anybody wonder what a train wreck that girl is gonna look like at 50? Live for the moment? All I can say is there's gonna be a helluva lot of closed caskets in the next 60 years...

Newest craze? Freekeest widow on the 4th floor contest!!

telefactor
09-02-2013, 04:36 PM
This thread keeps getting more and more bizarre.

Bizarre behavior require bizarre threads...

telefactor
09-02-2013, 04:40 PM
According to my tatoo'd labor attorney daughter, discrimination is legal in the US as long as it does not involve:
Age
Disability
Equal Pay/Compensation
Genetic Information
National Origin
Pregnancy
Race/Color
Religion
Retaliation
Sex
Sexual Harassment

So (intention is to remain totally respectful to your daughter and you), your daughter could have been NOT hired for her position because of visible tattoos if employers had chosen to follow that path?

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-02-2013, 04:48 PM
It's implied when "putting it in the same realm" as anorexia or bulemia

You conveniently left parts of that out. Like the "To push it a bit more you could perhaps..." Implies hypothetical.

I was trying to be nice and look at it from some logical viewpoint. I'll just be blunt now and say why I really think people do it.....because mainly they're attention seekers with extremely poor judgement. It will probably implied that I'm a total prick now :D

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 04:56 PM
Bizarre behavior require bizarre threads...

I think people have the right to hire who they want, and if piercings, gauges, or tattoos are not wanted, then, by all means, do not hire that person. I will 100% agree with that. It is choices people make, and there are consequences. My point is to call them names, assume they have a disorder, or are not decent folks is a different matter. To say they cannot get good jobs, and be productive is also not correct. Maybe they won't have a job similar to yours, but does not mean they don't get good jobs. The job market is MUCH different than it used to be, and the old ways of doing things are as well. My guess is some folks here are a joy to be around, with the narrow scope they view people who seem different than themselves.

derekd
09-02-2013, 05:00 PM
I live in Illinois on the border of Iowa, and it does not get more Midwest than that. Not a big deal here at all, most I know are very successful, and good family folks.

I love Starbucks, too!

I'll give you an example. For 15 years I ran the Midwest branch of a company that taught sports to kids. We served 8000 or so kids in a 5 state area and had 100+ people working part-time who were teaching the sports.

It was part of my job to do the hiring and firing. One day I interviewed a bright, college kid who was applying for a martial arts teaching position. I found him funny and he seemed to know what he wanted out of life for a 21 year old.

However, he had a rainbow hair dye job and looked like a fishing lure, he had so many piercings all along both ears. I chatted with him a bit to get to know him, all the while I was trying to justify hiring him, but knew most parents of the little kids he would be teaching wouldn't come back after week 1.

Did I know that for a fact? No, not really, but I'd been doing this job long enough to know how protective parents are of their children and how judgmental they could be with someone who looked out of the ordinary.

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 05:01 PM
You conveniently left parts of that out. Like the "To push it a bit more you could perhaps..." Implies hypothetical.

I was trying to be nice and look at it from some logical viewpoint. I'll just be blunt now and say why I really think people do it.....because mainly they're attention seekers with extremely poor judgement. It will probably implied that I'm a total prick now :D

Some do have poor judgment. So do folks everywhere. You are certainly entitled to your opinion. Most folks I know view it as art, and a way to express themselves. I do think some modifications become really bizarre, and wonder what they are thinking. Gauges and tats do not bother me much. Bizarre face tats, and face mods puzzle me a bit.

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 05:06 PM
I love Starbucks, too!

I'll give you an example. For 15 years I ran the Midwest branch of a company that taught sports to kids. We served 8000 or so kids in a 5 state area and had 100+ people working part-time who were teaching the sports.

It was part of my job to do the hiring and firing. One day I interviewed a bright, college kid who was applying for a martial arts teaching position. I found him funny and he seemed to know what he wanted out of life for a 21 year old.

However, he had a rainbow hair dye job and looked like a fishing lure, he had so many piercings all along both ears. I chatted with him a bit to get to know him, all the while I was trying to justify hiring him, but knew most parents of the little kids he would be teaching wouldn't come back after week 1.

Did I know that for a fact? No, not really, but I'd been doing this job long enough to know how protective parents are of their children and how judgmental they could be with someone who looked out of the ordinary.

I would say, if the appearance does not fit the job, or that person is not willing to cover up/clean up, then they should not be hired. I would have done the same thing when I worked with teenagers/kids during my religious employment.

derekd
09-02-2013, 05:07 PM
It's implied when "putting it in the same realm" as anorexia or bulemia

Wow, that was a leap. If it matters, I completely agree it is a psychological response. And frankly, it isn't really debatable.

Same as if you got a tatt or chose the same haircut or decided to go mohawk (a style that alas, is beyond my ability).

When people chose to engage in most any appearance altering activity, they are doing so from a psychological motivation, that is their perceived image, or who they want to be. Pretty simple.

To take that and go eating disorder...

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 05:08 PM
According to my tatoo'd labor attorney daughter, discrimination is legal in the US as long as it does not involve:
Age
Disability
Equal Pay/Compensation
Genetic Information
National Origin
Pregnancy
Race/Color
Religion
Retaliation
Sex
Sexual Harassment

For sure, gauged ear lobes is not a protected class, and it is within your right to discriminate against them, doesn't mean you should.

2leod
09-02-2013, 05:17 PM
Nor does it protect the employer from potential lawsuits brought against them simply because it's not a protected class.

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-02-2013, 05:27 PM
Wow, that was a leap. If it matters, I completely agree it is a psychological response. And frankly, it isn't really debatable.

Same as if you got a tatt or chose the same haircut or decided to go mohawk (a style that alas, is beyond my ability).

When people chose to engage in most any appearance altering activity, they are doing so from a psychological motivation, that is their perceived image, or who they want to be. Pretty simple.

To take that and go eating disorder...

I said if you really wanted to push the psychological issue you could perhaps get into that realm...as in people's body image issues and their psychological responses to them. Eating disorders are whole seperate and much more serious issue. The "realm" that I meant was body image. Hope that clears it up.


Edit: Sorry, and thanks derekd.

crambone
09-02-2013, 05:36 PM
For sure, gauged ear lobes is not a protected class, and it is within your right to discriminate against them, doesn't mean you should.

meh.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 05:38 PM
Nor does it protect the employer from potential lawsuits brought against them simply because it's not a protected class.

In most every state I'm aware of, such a suit would be summarily dismissed with prejudice according to my consiliere.

Anybody can sue for anything. So what?

Knavery
09-02-2013, 05:41 PM
My guess is some folks here are a joy to be around, with the narrow scope they view people who seem different than themselves.

Or not...

derekd
09-02-2013, 05:45 PM
Once again, someone who didn't read the full statement. I didn't "take that and go eating disorder" I said if you really wanted to push the psychological issue you could perhaps get into that realm...as in people's body image issues and their psychological responses to them. Eating disorders are whole seperate and much more serious issue. The "realm" that I meant was body image. Hope that clears it up.

This is what happens when someone paraphrases here (or only quotes parts of what someone said) and the responders only read that, and not the original statement.

Er...speaking of not reading.

I was defending you Mr. guitar playing zombie. Yes, eating disorders are a whole nutter thing, which is what I was trying to say to Brian.

Apparently, I didn't do a very good job.

2leod
09-02-2013, 05:52 PM
Well, I remember this suit that was brought by a former Marine who was fired for his tatoo -

Here (http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/article/20120827/NEWS/208270315/Former-Marine-fired-tattoo-quoting-Mattis)

This one sticks out in my mind because I would wager that a few who are against tatoos would support this lawsuit, but I also think it underscores how cases like this are never as black or white, cut and dried as some folks would like to make things.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 05:59 PM
Well, I remember this suit that was brought by a former Marine who was fired for his tatoo -

Here (http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/article/20120827/NEWS/208270315/Former-Marine-fired-tattoo-quoting-Mattis)

This one sticks out in my mind because I would wager that a few who are against tatoos would support this lawsuit, but I also think it underscores how cases like this are never as black or white, cut and dried as some folks would like to make things.

You are citing out of context. That is a well known case for retaliatory firing. It is the retaliation that is the nexus of the suit, not the tattoo. If there was no allegation of retaliation, there would be no suit because he could be fired solely for the perceived offensive tattoo.

EricPeterson
09-02-2013, 06:00 PM
meh.

An employer could discriminate against guitar players, they are not a protected class, seems like a dumb idea to me, but it would be their right.

Chuck Snider
09-02-2013, 06:02 PM
They didn't get enough hugs.

Or,Too many hugs!

Knavery
09-02-2013, 06:07 PM
An employer could discriminate against guitar players, they are not a protected class, seems like a dumb idea to me, but it would be their right.

Exactly! Of course, they're probably just crass enough to say, "Yes! Yes they have that right to discriminate against guitar players as well..."

I hope things come around full circle for these folks when they end up in a nursing home 5-10 years from now. Because there's no excuse for having this stance unless you're old, decrepit, and pissed off with the world. :) But as others have pointed out... It's just an opinion, and everyone has a right to an opinion.. Just like many white folks that lived in the south during the civil rights movement.

nsureit
09-02-2013, 06:09 PM
An employer could discriminate against guitar players, they are not a protected class, seems like a dumb idea to me, but it would be their right.

No, never. I only discriminate against drummers...and sometimes the bass players. ;)

Ampegasaur
09-02-2013, 06:44 PM
No, never. I only discriminate against drummers...and sometimes the bass players. ;)

Well we agree on one point.....

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-02-2013, 06:45 PM
Er...speaking of not reading.

I was defending you Mr. guitar playing zombie. Yes, eating disorders are a whole nutter thing, which is what I was trying to say to Brian.

Apparently, I didn't do a very good job.

I realize that now. Thank you. Sorry, sometimes connecting the dots is hard on the ol' interwebnet thingamajig you know? ;)

2leod
09-02-2013, 06:49 PM
You are citing out of context. That is a well known case for retaliatory firing. It is the retaliation that is the nexus of the suit, not the tattoo. If there was no allegation of retaliation, there would be no suit because he could be fired solely for the perceived offensive tattoo.
Respectfully, I propose it does fit the context of this thread - while the focus of the suit is the tattoo (apologies for my prior misspellings) the intents and bias behind the dismissal are where the suit will be won or lost. Here, the discussion of guages reveal underlying biases and and pre-judgements. (I use this word to hopefully skirt some of the emotional context the word prejudice evokes)

Ron_R
09-02-2013, 07:21 PM
Nor does it protect the employer from potential lawsuits brought against them simply because it's not a protected class.

Okay. So, some kid comes in to my office and applies for a Medical Assistant job looking like a pin cushion, with tats all over his neck and face, hands...etc. I don't hire him and he turns around and tries to sue me. How exactly does he know why I didn't hire him? The burden of proof i on him as he has brought the lawsuit to me. "I didn't like him" is all I have to say. I don't have to give a reason why, y'know.

Ultimately, it's my business and I am free to chose who I hire and who I don't. My clientele is now a little more conscious of what I and my staff look like. If you're not sensitive to that, why exactly would I hire you?

As I've said, that's how people judge. Right, wrong, insane...whatever. It is what it is.

derekd
09-02-2013, 08:00 PM
I realize that now. Thank you. Sorry, sometimes connecting the dots is hard on the ol' interwebnet thingamajig you know? ;)

No worries, man.

Enjoy what's left of your labor day. The ribs that have been smoking all day are calling my name!

stingrey1978
09-02-2013, 08:24 PM
Lil late to the thread but,
I have a "real" job. I also have 1/2 sized "holes" in my ear. Actually I work at an international The International Baccalaureate world school. Been there quite a while and got hired with guages and hair down to my ass.
I believe employers are getting to be more understanding that appearance doesn't mean everything, in fact some of the greatest teachers are rather "different." And I don't say this to brag, I really just want to bring a perspective from someone such as myself, who has also been a teacher of the year finalist and works as a worship leader at a southern baptist church.

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-02-2013, 08:48 PM
No worries, man.

Enjoy what's left of your labor day. The ribs that have been smoking all day are calling my name!


Smokey ribs.....
:drool

standard24
09-02-2013, 09:20 PM
For you TGP members who don't find the tatts and gauges ugly....

What would you find ugly or unattractive???

What about removing the nose?
What about large wooden plates in the lips?
What about binding feet of young girls so their feet won't grow to adult size?
What about cutting large notches around the ears?
What about female genital mutilation?
What about dying the whites of the eyes?
What about a large bone through the nose?
What about forking the tongue?
What about installing flashing LEDs under the skin?

Is there nothing that would seem unpleasant or ugly to you?

To say these could never become popular is short sighted.

As an old geezer, I hope I live long enough to see today's "enhanced" people reach a "what was I thinking" point in life.

s2y
09-02-2013, 09:22 PM
70 posts in this thread. Just about 1/3 of them are blatantly judgemental, a couple are out and out deplorable.

Strange figures for a group of open minded "musicians and artists".

Then again it's just like the common assertion that "If I don't like this artist/musician/gear/tone, then it sucks".

If you think the posts are judgmental and/or deplorable, you should meet some of my previous bosses. Now ya gotta be devoid of any visible tattoos and large piercings. You also need a bunch of additional credentials to get your foot in the door, if we're hiring. :huh

cmatthes
09-02-2013, 09:27 PM
Lil late to the thread but,
I have a "real" job. I also have 1/2 sized "holes" in my ear. Actually I work at an international bachelorette world school. Been there quite a while and got hired with guages and hair down to my ass.
I believe employers are getting to be more understanding that appearance doesn't mean everything, in fact some of the greatest teachers are rather "different." And I don't say this to brag, I really just want to bring a perspective from someone such as myself, who has also been a teacher of the year finalist and works as a worship leader at a southern baptist church.

Sorry, but I have no idea what an "international bachelorette world school" is. Could you explain?

I take it you don't teach English, correct?

;)

Rick Lee
09-02-2013, 09:29 PM
If you think the posts are judgmental and/or deplorable, you should meet some of my previous bosses. Now ya gotta be devoid of any visible tattoos and large piercings. You also need a bunch of additional credentials to get your foot in the door, if we're hiring. :huh

That's how every place I've ever worked has been. If you're in client-facing sales, it's a no-brainer. You will have a hard time getting a job if you look like you fell into a tackle box or have visible tats above the ankle. I got a job offer on Fri. and I'm pretty sure my professional appearance at the interview played a large part in that. Some of the slobs I saw on the way out made me almost feel sorry for them. Almost.

mdog114
09-02-2013, 09:35 PM
An attempt to look different.....which in turn makes them look like everyone else who is trying to look different.....

Bingo

DGTCrazy
09-02-2013, 09:40 PM
Sorry, but I have no idea what an "international bachelorette world school" is. Could you explain?

I take it you don't teach English, correct?

;)



http://www.ibo.org/who/slidee.cfm ;)

s2y
09-02-2013, 09:50 PM
That's how every place I've ever worked has been. If you're in client-facing sales, it's a no-brainer. You will have a hard time getting a job if you look like you fell into a tackle box or have visible tats above the ankle. I got a job offer on Fri. and I'm pretty sure my professional appearance at the interview played a large part in that. Some of the slobs I saw on the way out made me almost feel sorry for them. Almost.

I hear ya. If my competition wants to do stuff like that, I'm not going to stop them. I'm surprised there's a bit of an attitude against conformity given that most of us clearly don't have the upper hand.

This is where someone will argue they have the upper hand.

derekd
09-02-2013, 10:04 PM
http://www.ibo.org/who/slidee.cfm ;)

Thanks for the link, Herb.

I wondered about that, too.

2leod
09-02-2013, 10:10 PM
For you TGP members who don't find the tatts and gauges ugly....

What would you find ugly or unattractive???

For me, personal likes or dislikes matter less than finding common ground with people much younger or different than I.

McShred
09-02-2013, 10:25 PM
I find judgemental, close minded people to be about the ugliest, most offensive variety.

For you TGP members who don't find the tatts and gauges ugly....

What would you find ugly or unattractive???

What about removing the nose?
What about large wooden plates in the lips?
What about binding feet of young girls so their feet won't grow to adult size?
What about cutting large notches around the ears?
What about female genital mutilation?
What about dying the whites of the eyes?
What about a large bone through the nose?
What about forking the tongue?
What about installing flashing LEDs under the skin?

Is there nothing that would seem unpleasant or ugly to you?

To say these could never become popular is short sighted.

As an old geezer, I hope I live long enough to see today's "enhanced" people reach a "what was I thinking" point in life.

?&!
09-02-2013, 10:58 PM
I have a great job that I love, and I make a pile of money. I deal with customers face to face daily. I'm married to my high school sweetheart, and we've been together for 25 years. I also have two full sleeves of tattoos. Nobody seems to care. I'm not into gauging, but I could give a $hit if someone else is. One of the reasons I got extremely visible tattoos was to make sure I would never work for someone who judged me negatively because of it. I have no interest in that. So, keep on judgin', y'all! It makes it easier to choose who I deal with in my life.

cmatthes
09-02-2013, 11:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cmatthes View Post
Sorry, but I have no idea what an "international bachelorette world school" is. Could you explain?

I take it you don't teach English, correct?


http://www.ibo.org/who/slidee.cfm ;)

Well, that's COMPLETELY different!

A-Bone
09-02-2013, 11:32 PM
According to my tatoo'd labor attorney daughter, discrimination is legal in the US as long as it does not involve:
Age
Disability
Equal Pay/Compensation
Genetic Information
National Origin
Pregnancy
Race/Color
Religion
Retaliation
Sex
Sexual Harassment

Some states add a category or two (like sexual orientation).

Also, it is interesting to note that some tattoos and the like might have a component that touches on national origin or religion, which is just to suggest that it is not necessarily as cut and dry as that post might suggest. This does not mean that employers necessarily have to tell someone why they are not hiring them or making some other adverse employment decision, however.

Knavery
09-02-2013, 11:57 PM
I have a great job that I love, and I make a pile of money. I deal with customers face to face daily. I'm married to my high school sweetheart, and we've been together for 25 years. I also have two full sleeves of tattoos. Nobody seems to care. I'm not into gauging, but I could give a $hit if someone else is. One of the reasons I got extremely visible tattoos was to make sure I would never work for someone who judged me negatively because of it. I have no interest in that. So, keep on judgin', y'all! It makes it easier to choose who I deal with in my life.

And that's a good way to determine your friendships. I don't think anyone here would ever admit in person that they have a problem with tattoos and gauging, which makes it even worse IMO. Only on the internet do I see people open up and REALLY explain how they feel. It's really become ugly... And I find it very sad that people can be influenced so easily by what is deemed acceptable or unacceptable in our society. Their beliefs confine them to live within this little box, and if they experience anything outside of that box, they want it destroyed.

Hell I'm not perfect. There are things that bother me too, but not the personal decisions of other individuals. Unless that decision effects my life in any way, I don't really care. Not my business. Anyway, I have enough self image problems of my own to worry about. I don't need to be worrying about others... And if I was an employer, I'd hire the most qualified person period end of story...

Turbo Gerbil
09-03-2013, 12:20 AM
"They're all doing the same thing so they can be different" is apparently still different enough to get 90% of TGP's and polite societies panties in a wad.

You all hang out at bars with an abundance of Chinos and wine goblets don't you? ;)

Porrig
09-03-2013, 12:38 AM
I have a great job that I love, and I make a pile of money. I deal with customers face to face daily. I'm married to my high school sweetheart, and we've been together for 25 years. I also have two full sleeves of tattoos. Nobody seems to care. I'm not into gauging, but I could give a $hit if someone else is. One of the reasons I got extremely visible tattoos was to make sure I would never work for someone who judged me negatively because of it. I have no interest in that. So, keep on judgin', y'all! It makes it easier to choose who I deal with in my life.

I'm in a very similar boat: 2 full sleeves, professional job etc. Well said.

standard24
09-03-2013, 01:07 AM
I find judgemental, close minded people to be about the ugliest, most offensive variety.

Would that make you judgmental and closed minded against people who don't have the same values as you?

PaganBeef
09-03-2013, 02:10 AM
A basic rule that I apply to these kinds of matters: Does it pass the eyeball test?

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Gauges_zps6e626d5f.jpg

Sure.

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Piercings_zps559d10bd.jpg http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Mohawk_zpsc796671b.jpg

Works for you, why not?

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Issues_zpsfa3947fd.jpg

Issues.

JamesT
09-03-2013, 03:59 AM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/rf/image_404h/2010-2019/WashingtonPost/2013/09/02/Local/Images/Merlin_6542980.jpg

stingrey1978
09-03-2013, 08:01 AM
Sorry about my autocorrect, but yea, that link on IB is accurate. What it doesn't say is that if your student attends on IB school, they will have the opportunity to graduate high school as a junior in college. IB is also very similar to a magnet school. And no, I do not teach English, none the less, one of our English teachers has full sleeves, and many of our teachers have piercings and or tattoos. I'm not trying to fight, but geez, I'm really surprised reading some of the responses I've seen on this thread...

nsureit
09-03-2013, 08:06 AM
And I find it very sad that people can be influenced so easily by what is deemed acceptable or unacceptable in our society. Their beliefs confine them to live within this little box, and if they experience anything outside of that box, they want it destroyed....

Destroyed? Where did you get that? I believe most of us just said we would not hire them.

Drama much?

Stike
09-03-2013, 08:29 AM
Just exactly how I want people to view my mother...Jeez...does anybody wonder what a train wreck that girl is gonna look like at 50? Live for the moment? All I can say is there's gonna be a helluva lot of closed caskets in the next 60 years...

I say good, open casket ceremonies are even creepier than excessive piercings.

EricPeterson
09-03-2013, 09:03 AM
Would that make you judgmental and closed minded against people who don't have the same values as you?

Oh this old card, yep, I am intolerant of intolerance, I hate racism, sexism, religious prejudice, ageism, and all forms of bigotry as well. When your last resort to defend your prejudice is to accuse someone else of being intolerant of your intolerance you are grasping.


If someone could articulate an actual reason for why gauging is so bad I guess would reevaluate, but merely saying that it is wrong because of others being irrationally intolerant of it seems hollow to me. YMMV.

semi-hollowbody
09-03-2013, 09:05 AM
An attempt to look different.....which in turn makes them look like everyone else who is trying to look different.....
I dont need to read any further

I do like tats and subtle piercings..especially on the girls...but those ear hoops...where there is a giant gaping hole and the ear lobe starts to sag until its supported by the shoulder...looks absolutely ridiculous:anon

standard24
09-03-2013, 11:09 AM
If someone could articulate an actual reason for why gauging is so bad I guess would reevaluate, but merely saying that it is wrong because of others being irrationally intolerant of it seems hollow to me. YMMV.


I re-read my post, and I didn't see where I said tatts, piercings and gauges are wrong. I just asked if there was a point where those who like them, would consider the enhancements "ugly and unattractive". How far would they have to go before You would think... "Yuck"?


I did say that I felt many people might eventually regret the permanent changes they've made to their bodies. This is only my opinion, and I believe I'm right. (I've lived long enough to see some very popular fashions/trends/fads become a very big joke).




Oh, one more thing.... When I see guys/girls with those big gauges, the first thing that comes to my mind, is how cute they would look if they had little finches perched in them. Now before you condemn me for making such a statement, who says that can't become a new style, and very, very popular? Might be nice...

circusinthesky
09-03-2013, 12:02 PM
Not too long ago many people didn't hire people with tattoos.
Or men with ear rings.
Or people with a streak of blue dye in one's hair.
Or gay/lesbian people.

I work at a Business Casual type place, and we have a few people with moderate (but not extreme) loops. I imagine we've hired them because they're good at their jobs, and represent themselves well despite other people's opinions on fashion. Further, with the ability to Work From Home, people's fashion choices are much less of an issue.

Bluedawg
09-03-2013, 12:41 PM
Not too long ago many people didn't hire people with tattoos.
Or men with ear rings.
Or people with a streak of blue dye in one's hair.
Or gay/lesbian people.

I work at a Business Casual type place, and we have a few people with moderate (but not extreme) loops. I imagine we've hired them because they're good at their jobs, and represent themselves well despite other people's opinions on fashion. Further, with the ability to Work From Home, people's fashion choices are much less of an issue.

I don't think these things are the job killers today that they would have been even 10 years ago ... barring extreme tattoos that could be interpreted as supporting violence or hate


but I'm still in the camp of wondering why someone would do something that is pretty much a permanent lifetime body mod for the sake of fashion. :huh

But I figure it's not really any of my business, either.

:dunno

circusinthesky
09-03-2013, 01:01 PM
but I'm still in the camp of wondering why someone would do something that is pretty much a permanent lifetime body mod for the sake of fashion. :huh



Well, I used the word fashion, but I realize its deeper that that for many people. (Although, there are always trend followers.) For a lot of people body art in all forms is an expression of identity. Its not just a shallow display of fashion.

standard24
09-03-2013, 02:32 PM
For a lot of people body art in all forms is an expression of identity. Its not just a shallow display of fashion.

http://www.statisticbrain.com/tattoo-statistics/
This site says 45 million US citizens have at least one tattoo.
I'm sure most were inked to fulfill a profound personal expression. Considering what P.T. Barnum said about people, what percent would you guess were just following a popular fashion trend.

2leod
09-03-2013, 02:37 PM
C'mon standard, just go on and get your own tattoo already!




You know you want to...

:)

MGT
09-03-2013, 02:39 PM
http://www.statisticbrain.com/tattoo-statistics/
This site says 45 million US citizens have at least one tattoo.
I'm sure most were inked to fulfill a profound personal expression. Considering what P.T. Barnum said about people, what percent would you guess were just following a popular fashion trend.

I have two tattoos and their meaning is important to me....what anyone else thinks doesn't matter and if someone else had ink done that is meaningless, it's their business/stupidity. My oldest daughter got one a couple of weeks ago. The quote on her shoulder has been something associated with her for many years. She waited a long time to make sure it was something she really wanted and chose a place that she could cover it up easily.

Bluedawg
09-03-2013, 02:55 PM
Well, I used the word fashion, but I realize its deeper that that for many people. (Although, there are always trend followers.) For a lot of people body art in all forms is an expression of identity. Its not just a shallow display of fashion.


Yup .... if it has a deeper meaning the term fashion doesn't really apply ....

I'm not a tattoo person, but I can understand why someone would do a tattoo to commemorate their military service, birth of a child, etc.


:banana

MGT
09-03-2013, 02:59 PM
For you TGP members who don't find the tatts and gauges ugly....

What would you find ugly or unattractive???

What about removing the nose?
What about large wooden plates in the lips?
What about binding feet of young girls so their feet won't grow to adult size?
What about cutting large notches around the ears?
What about female genital mutilation?
What about dying the whites of the eyes?
What about a large bone through the nose?
What about forking the tongue?
What about installing flashing LEDs under the skin?

Is there nothing that would seem unpleasant or ugly to you?

To say these could never become popular is short sighted.

As an old geezer, I hope I live long enough to see today's "enhanced" people reach a "what was I thinking" point in life.

I am struggling to find the relationship between ear rings, gauges and tattoos (things that an individual can choose to do that are only visual changes to the body) and things like genital mutilation or binding feet....

Besides that, what some people find ugly is not really the point. I am 49 and when I was in my early twenties, I had two ear rings in my left ear. Some people thought I was a freak (grew up in a small conservative town and hair like Robert Smith didn't help!)....to others it was no big deal. I had my first tattoo at 22 and the second at 37 (both are small). I'm been a professional software developer for well over 20 years. When I started, lots of "older" guys had ponytails (hippies). In this field, individuality and the ability to be a free thinker is quite often valued although there are many consulting companies who deal with conservative customers, so it's a different environment altogether.

At the end of the day, I'd rather express myself in whatever way I chose & look at my body art, etc as an expression representing a certain time in my life. I have my own limits and that's fine with me.

standard24
09-03-2013, 03:22 PM
I am struggling to find the relationship between ear rings, gauges and tattoos (things that an individual can choose to do that are only visual changes to the body) and things like genital mutilation or binding feet....

I had my first tattoo at 22 and the second at 37.


I just chose those different permanent body changes as examples of how far one could take body art/modification. The genital mutilation and feet binding were thrown in, because some cultures really value these changes. I was wondering at what point some body art fans would be repulsed. I realize there is a vast difference between having your wife's name tattooed on your bicep, and a total sideshow geek, monster makeover. But I suspect there is a point for most people when seeing some very extreme type of alteration would make them cringe. (I cringe when I see a beautiful woman with tatts. Like a cathedral with graffiti).

With your situation of 15 years between tattoos, I would imagine you have had plenty of time to make a well considered decision. Very different from the chick friends who are having a great night in Cozumel, and stop in to get matching tattoos before going back to the hotel. NTTAWWT

David Simpson
09-03-2013, 03:50 PM
A basic rule that I apply to these kinds of matters: Does it pass the eyeball test?

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Gauges_zps6e626d5f.jpg

Sure.

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Piercings_zps559d10bd.jpg http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Mohawk_zpsc796671b.jpg

Works for you, why not?

http://i851.photobucket.com/albums/ab74/tacit911/Issues_zpsfa3947fd.jpg

Issues.


Last Dude looks like he fell face first into a tackle box.

Knavery
09-03-2013, 03:54 PM
...I cringe when I see a beautiful woman with tatts. Like a cathedral with graffiti.


See for me it's a huge turn-on.

Stormface
09-03-2013, 04:53 PM
I have no piercings so I can't speak to the gauge trend, but I do have several well done tattoos including a half-sleeve that peaks over the "edge" of my elbow onto my forearm.

I generally keep them covered at work though not always. Most of my coworkers know I have them but haven't seen them extensively.

I'm a younger guy, only 27. I work in Silicon Valley as a hardware engineer for a Fortune 100 company. I'm not a barista, not a grocery store bagger, not a Guitar Center employee. I'm not a loser, dropout, or felon. The salary range for my position, not including stock, bonuses, or benefits, is $95k-$120k, so I think I'm doing OK.

I love my tattoos and will likely get more over time. When I look at them I'm reminded of various things. I felt great about paying for them and love wearing them. To me they are a sign to myself that I did something completely for myself, for no one else, to be enjoyed by me only or anyone else I choose to share them with. I paid an artist with whom I have a unique relationship (dude is basically etching into my body for hours and hours at a time - no one else has handled my blood as much as him!) to design custom artwork for me exclusively. I don't really do things like that for myself in other areas of my life, my therapist could elaborate, so getting tattoos and showing them off in the right venues makes me feel, for lack of a better word, awesome.

EricPeterson
09-03-2013, 05:06 PM
The genital mutilation and feet binding were thrown in, because some cultures really value these changes. I was wondering at what point some body art fans would be repulsed.

How about this, when someone starts gauging someone else's ears against their will I will be repulsed, of course I will be repulsed at the perpetrator.

derekd
09-03-2013, 05:55 PM
See for me it's a huge turn-on.

I agree. When tastefully done, they are very cool.

I just haven't found something I will still want on my body when I'm 70. However, I have plenty of friends who have them.

My favorite is a buddy who trains with me at the same dojo. He has a full back dragon with a tail that wraps around his hips and end close to his knee. Has flown out to San Fran several times to get parts done by some Japanese tattoo artist.

He's a high end programmer here in KC. However, you'd never see it in his work clothes.

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-03-2013, 06:27 PM
http://www.washingtonpost.com/rf/image_404h/2010-2019/WashingtonPost/2013/09/02/Local/Images/Merlin_6542980.jpg

RIP Josh. This guy was a fixture at 930. Just found out about his passing :(
Had you heard when you posted this pic of him?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/going-out-guide/wp/2013/09/02/josh-burdette-the-face-of-the-930-club-has-died/

DGTCrazy
09-03-2013, 07:05 PM
RIP Josh. This guy was a fixture at 930. Just found out about his passing :(
Had you heard when you posted this pic of him?
http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/going-out-guide/wp/2013/09/02/josh-burdette-the-face-of-the-930-club-has-died/




Sad news. R.I.P.

Just a gentle reminder that regardless of what Josh looked like, he was a well liked, well educated person that enjoyed life, so please keep any comments regarding his passing respectful.

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-03-2013, 07:21 PM
Sad news. R.I.P.

Just a gentle reminder that regardless of what Josh looked like, he was a well liked, well educated person that enjoyed life, so please keep any comments regarding his passing respectful.

Excellent advice. Kinda puts this whole thread into perspective. Wish it wasn't under such sad circumstances.

Ron_R
09-03-2013, 08:36 PM
I know that this will be unpopular, but that kid in that picture with the mohawk, tats on his head and multiple ear lobes things and piercings will never get a job in a professional office where he will have to deal with the public.

I don't care that it's mean or not fair or whatever, but seriously? Someone who does that to themselves as a teen or in their young 20s is looking for a life of difficulty. It's just the way of the world.

If he has aspirations to become a doctor, lawyer, accountant or simply just about anyone who will be in a professional service industry with customers/patients/clients to deal with, it will be very difficult for this person to transcend their appearance.

Do I think it's cool? Maybe, sure. Would I hire this person to be a medical assistant in my office and deal with 50-60 per day and represent my practice? Nope. My clientele would run screaming. Right or wrong, again, it's the way of the world.

Rick Lee
09-03-2013, 08:42 PM
Ditto above. This isn't a matter of moral character. Bottom line is, if you are in a public-facing role, you have to look professional. Maybe not if you work in a tattoo parlor or Starbucks or even at the GC. But if you want a real job that has anything to do with representing a company to its paying clientele, messing up parts of your body you can't cover with normal attire is gonna be a severe career limiter.

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-03-2013, 08:44 PM
I know that this will be unpopular, but that kid in that picture with the mohawk, tats on his head and multiple ear lobes things and piercings will never get a job in a professional office where he will have to deal with the public.

I don't care that it's mean or not fair or whatever, but seriously? Someone who does that to themselves as a teen or in their young 20s is looking for a life of difficulty. It's just the way of the world.

If he has aspirations to become a doctor, lawyer, accountant or simply just about anyone who will be in a professional service industry with customers/patients/clients to deal with, it will be very difficult for this person to transcend their appearance.

Do I think it's cool? Maybe, sure. Would I hire this person to be a medical assistant in my office and deal with 50-60 per day and represent my practice? Nope. My clientele would run screaming. Right or wrong, again, it's the way of the world.

His parents might be worried about that but its pretty obvious he's not losing sleep over it :D

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-03-2013, 08:53 PM
Ditto above. This isn't a matter of moral character. Bottom line is, if you are in a public-facing role, you have to look professional. Maybe not if you work in a tattoo parlor or Starbucks or even at the GC. But if you want a real job that has anything to do with representing a company to its paying clientele, messing up parts of your body you can't cover with normal attire is gonna be a severe career limiter.

A bit short sighted don't you think? :) Define "real" job. What if he opened his own piercing and tattoo parlor? Or became a rep for a company that manufactures piercing supplies? Or any number of "blue collar" jobs....electrician, plumber, truck driver, manager of a music venue. What's not "real" about those? Who's to say what that person aspires to that allows them to also look the way they want. Every job involves representing a company to its paying clientele....that's pretty much every job out there. I consider tattoo artists, baristas, and GC "real" jobs. Might not be what everyone aspires to, not you, nor I for that matter, but you can't diminish them as not being "real".

s2y
09-03-2013, 08:54 PM
Ditto above. This isn't a matter of moral character. Bottom line is, if you are in a public-facing role, you have to look professional. Maybe not if you work in a tattoo parlor or Starbucks or even at the GC. But if you want a real job that has anything to do with representing a company to its paying clientele, messing up parts of your body you can't cover with normal attire is gonna be a severe career limiter.

There's a guy I know who installs security systems. He complains that he has a hard enough time finding guys without criminal records and that'll show up for work. He installs security systems in multi-million dollar homes and needs to cater to that clientele.

EricPeterson
09-03-2013, 08:56 PM
I know that this will be unpopular, but that kid in that picture with the mohawk, tats on his head and multiple ear lobes things and piercings will never get a job in a professional office where he will have to deal with the public.

I don't care that it's mean or not fair or whatever, but seriously? Someone who does that to themselves as a teen or in their young 20s is looking for a life of difficulty. It's just the way of the world.

If he has aspirations to become a doctor, lawyer, accountant or simply just about anyone who will be in a professional service industry with customers/patients/clients to deal with, it will be very difficult for this person to transcend their appearance.

Do I think it's cool? Maybe, sure. Would I hire this person to be a medical assistant in my office and deal with 50-60 per day and represent my practice? Nope. My clientele would run screaming. Right or wrong, again, it's the way of the world.

Ditto above. This isn't a matter of moral character. Bottom line is, if you are in a public-facing role, you have to look professional. Maybe not if you work in a tattoo parlor or Starbucks or even at the GC. But if you want a real job that has anything to do with representing a company to its paying clientele, messing up parts of your body you can't cover with normal attire is gonna be a severe career limiter.


I am sure they never considered that. :)

Ron_R
09-03-2013, 08:59 PM
Define "real" job. :) What if he opened his own piercing and tattoo parlor? Or became a rep for a company that manufactures piercing supplies? Or any number of "blue collar" jobs....electrician, plumber, truck driver, manager of a music venue. What's not "real" about those? Every job involves representing a company to its paying clientele....that's pretty much every job out there.

Okay, I'll play.

How many people make a living opening their own tattoo shops? What's interesting is just because the guy has tats and piercing, means he is talented enough to make a living at it?

"Blue Collar" jobs are real for sure. They will earn you great money in the right circumstances. I'm not saying this person can't be a success at anything he wants. He will have something major to overcome, though. I hope for him that he realized this when he permanently altered his appearance the way he did. Can he do it? SURE!!! All I'm saying is that he would have any easier job at it if he didn't do that to himself. It's reality.

Ron_R
09-03-2013, 09:00 PM
I am sure they never considered that. :)

I'm sure they didn't either!

SIX STRING ZOMBIE
09-03-2013, 09:08 PM
Okay, I'll play.

How many people make a living opening their own tattoo shops? What's interesting is just because the guy has tats and piercing, means he is talented enough to make a living at it?

"Blue Collar" jobs are real for sure. They will earn you great money in the right circumstances. I'm not saying this person can't be a success at anything he wants. He will have something major to overcome, though. I hope for him that he realized this when he permanently altered his appearance the way he did. Can he do it? SURE!!! All I'm saying is that he would have any easier job at it if he didn't do that to himself. It's reality.


I was just throwing some what-if's out there, that's all.

I would say that anyone who does pierce themselves in that manner probably enjoys a challenge and knows what they're up against.

telefactor
09-03-2013, 09:15 PM
Bottom line is the excessively tatted or tackle box faced person will never admit that it is limiting their job prospects or hindering career moves...I can't see them ever asking themselves "You don't suppose the bone through my nose could be preventing me from advancing, do you?"

Look how many people in these threads say they have tats or piercings, or people they know do, BUT IT'S COVERED BY CLOTHES AND NO ONE CAN SEE IT! If it wasn't a hinderence, why cover it? Because it is.

You can play it off and say, that's not important to them, but if you are going to work hard, don't you want to reap the benefits of that?

Sorry...most of the things that I thought were super cool and I just had to have at 20 look pretty stupid to me at 50...

MGT
09-03-2013, 09:21 PM
I just chose those different permanent body changes as examples of how far one could take body art/modification. The genital mutilation and feet binding were thrown in, because some cultures really value these changes. I was wondering at what point some body art fans would be repulsed. I realize there is a vast difference between having your wife's name tattooed on your bicep, and a total sideshow geek, monster makeover. But I suspect there is a point for most people when seeing some very extreme type of alteration would make them cringe. (I cringe when I see a beautiful woman with tatts. Like a cathedral with graffiti).

With your situation of 15 years between tattoos, I would imagine you have had plenty of time to make a well considered decision. Very different from the chick friends who are having a great night in Cozumel, and stop in to get matching tattoos before going back to the hotel. NTTAWWT

Genital mutilation has nothing to do with body art - it's insecure men taking away a woman's ability to enjoy a satisfying sexual relationship.

I think we're all wise enough to know that having a lot of tattoos/piercings can limit career choices....I bet that the people making the choices to get those more extreme body art will not be going into those businesses where they'd be frowned on anyway. There are still a LOT of well paid professions where tattoos don't make a difference at all & no one cares what you have on your arm, back, legs or ass for that matter.

DrumBob
09-03-2013, 09:22 PM
Just another disfigurement adopted by today's young people that I find ridiculous and unsightly. I sound like my old man, I know, but I find those ear gauges completely stupid. The big ones make the wearers look like jungle dwellers. Most of the kids with gauges will have to have surgery to rectify their ear lobes.

s2y
09-03-2013, 09:24 PM
Genital mutilation has nothing to do with body art - it's insecure men taking away a woman's ability to enjoy a satisfying sexual relationship.


What kind of job interview are we talkin about...... :anon

MGT
09-03-2013, 09:27 PM
Bottom line is the excessively tatted or tackle box faced person will never admit that it is limiting their job prospects or hindering career moves...I can't see them ever asking themselves "You don't suppose the bone through my nose could be preventing me from advancing, do you?"

You can play it off and say, that's not important to them, but if you are going to work hard, don't you want to reap the benefits of that?


How do you know what their thought process is? What makes you think that they might be interested in career choices where they can't be pierced, etc?

And who is to say that working hard in their chosen field won't pay off for them? It really depends on the field they are in, doesn't it?

Turbo Gerbil
09-03-2013, 10:47 PM
not everybody's ideal life consists of a management, marketing, or sales job while having 2.3 kids and a house in the burbs. The problem is that many people here are projecting their own ideas of "the good life" on others and expecting that is what they also want.

Knavery
09-03-2013, 11:55 PM
not everybody's ideal life consists of a management, marketing, or sales job while having 2.3 kids and a house in the burbs. The problem is that many people here are projecting their own ideas of "the good life" on others and expecting that is what they also want.

That's pretty much it. There are a lot of avenues and levels of success depending on the individual.

Stormface
09-04-2013, 12:01 AM
And BTW... isn't this a guitar forum? Aren't we supposed to be rebels?

Rick Lee
09-04-2013, 12:09 AM
not everybody's ideal life consists of a management, marketing, or sales job while having 2.3 kids and a house in the burbs. The problem is that many people here are projecting their own ideas of "the good life" on others and expecting that is what they also want.

That's fine. But unless you run an Internet business, you're gonna have to face people now and then. And like it or not, people make business decisions on first impressions and personal appearance. I found a guy in CL to come put window tinting on Mrs. Lee's car. The guy was all tatted and pierced up. He had a ring in his nose like a bull. It was really hard to make eye contact with the guy. I'm not a fuddy duddy. I have tats and had earrings. I just can't stand to look at gross facial piercings and I always look at people in the eye when I talk with them, especially when conducting business. I won't call the guy to do my next car because I can't stand to look at him.

Jiffy_Jeff
09-04-2013, 01:16 AM
Ive heard this question a few times. It makes me think of the scene from Airplane..

Striker says: what can you make of it? ..
Other guy: well I cqn make a hat , a broach....

something along those lines.

They can make sling shots, beer holders, chin straps, etc..

The Last Rebel
09-04-2013, 01:26 AM
And BTW... isn't this a guitar forum? Aren't we supposed to be rebels?

In all my life I've never seen anywhere less rebellious than TGP.

oldtelefart
09-04-2013, 01:29 AM
Stupid-looking ears, but it makes it easier to hang 'em out to dry.

S.W.Erdnase
09-04-2013, 02:10 AM
Last Dude looks like he fell face first into a tackle box.

Boggles the mind.

S.W.Erdnase
09-04-2013, 02:13 AM
not everybody's ideal life consists of a management, marketing, or sales job while having 2.3 kids and a house in the burbs. The problem is that many people here are projecting their own ideas of "the good life" on others and expecting that is what they also want.

The only person with a "problem" is the guy with tin poking out of his head like Hellraiser, and sub-Saharan hula hoop ear lobes, when he tries to get a job in my corporate business. Which he won't.

I'm not a hater, but that guy wont fit in and would be bad for business. That's the reality unless you run a company marketing body art.

Flyin' Brian
09-04-2013, 02:45 AM
The only person with a "problem" is the guy with tin poking out of his head like Hellraiser, and sub-Saharan hula hoop ear lobes, when he tries to get a job in my corporate business. Which he won't.

I'm not a hater, but that guy wont fit in and would be bad for business. That's the reality unless you run a company marketing body art.

As has been mentioned before, maybe he doesn't want a job in your corporate business. Maybe that's not his idea of life fulfilment. And he can get a job other than at a company marketing body art. It's not my thing either, but I'm not gonna judge somebody on appearance.

Turbo Gerbil
09-04-2013, 02:55 AM
I fully admit that as an IT guy with no tattoos I fit comfortably into the machine. I guess I shouldn't be surprised at how many of us completely buy into the notion that making sure you can always fit in as a cog is the best way of life. Cultural brainwashing certainly has worked. Certainly my parents beat into my head that going to school and getting a good job was the right way of life, many of you were taught the same, and now you are passing that same thing onto your kids.

I'm not saying that counter-culture people won't have a more difficult time, but that is their choice and plenty of them are living more fulfilling lives then a lot of us are because they live on their terms.

saxophonist56
09-04-2013, 03:11 AM
sixteen pages later......got to love it~!:anon

StompBoxBlues
09-04-2013, 04:24 AM
I fully admit that as an IT guy with no tattoos I fit comfortably into the machine. I guess I shouldn't be surprised at how many of us completely buy into the notion that making sure you can always fit in as a cog is the best way of life. Cultural brainwashing certainly has worked. Certainly my parents beat into my head that going to school and getting a good job was the right way of life, many of you were taught the same, and now you are passing that same thing onto your kids.

I'm not saying that counter-culture people won't have a more difficult time, but that is their choice and plenty of them are living more fulfilling lives then a lot of us are because they live on their terms.

That was nicely put. I agree. There are (and should always be) more than one path for a person to live a life. Being scared of being different, seems oppressive to me. So many people are so quick to judge ANYONE with a tattoo, this or that, as "just trying to show how different they are" when there are any number (with that included of course, there are certainly SOME that do for that reason) of reasons people do things like that, including some just plain have a passion for it.
Imagine if folks here that had a passion for music, somehow that was seen as being "out there" even though it isn't a permanent marking on you. That you might have to be afraid you wouldn't get hired if they found out you have a passion for music, or this or that. Some folks just love that stuff...not to show the world, but just for themselves. Again, some may do it to shut off a path they are afraid they might be tempted to take but don't want to.

But so many just lump all into one mindset. That never works out.

It seems like now its gaugeing (if it's called that) before that it was tattoos, etc. that were "looked down on", yet nowdays tattoos are so common...at least seems to me they are not a big deal anymore.

YET...in some areas, some social circles, etc. it's like they are still back in the 50's as to what is "acceptable". Like we pretend a salesperson seem like he (cause back then it wouldn't have been a she, right) stepped out of 1953, etc.

I can't really understand why we still use neckties, which for some are about as permanent as a tattoo, are accepted though, but have no purpose, are uncomfortable, where we aren't sure if they even had some connection in the past with nooses, etc. a waste of fabric, even dangerous (can get caught in machinery, etc.) yet...

I know, I'm off on several tangents, but seriously I don't get why it provokes so many so hard? Some see it as a sign of "something else", instability, criminal, weirdness, etc. and READ way too much into it...I gotta admit, I fight some of that myself but I know it is BS and it simply is just a variation that someone likes to have. I got to know a guy that is covered in tattoos when I first moved here. It took a while, I assumed all kinds of things (he also had a skinhead look) that were totally wrong. He wasn't a skinhead, just liked the style of short clipped, and tattoos. Was actually a really nice, progressive guy. I was wrong to assume. We ought to work on our built-in prejudices, more than demand everyone look the same, with only approved by all differences.

S.W.Erdnase
09-04-2013, 05:02 AM
As has been mentioned before, maybe he doesn't want a job in your corporate business. Maybe that's not his idea of life fulfilment. And he can get a job other than at a company marketing body art. It's not my thing either, but I'm not gonna judge somebody on appearance.


Maybe, but I was responding to the post suggesting some of us have a problem. No problem for me at all: these people are oddities and nothing more.

Dr. Tweedbucket
09-04-2013, 05:38 AM
They didn't get enough hugs.



I think this is the only correct answer :cry:

Dr. Tweedbucket
09-04-2013, 05:56 AM
I see it like this :red

Vintage cars are worth a lot more money in original condition. It says the owners were smart and knew the value of the original design.

Vintage guitars are worth much more in original condition. It says the owners were smart and knew the value of the original design.

It says a lot if you yourself made it a number of years and are still in good original condition. It says that you were smart, took care of yourself and knew the value of the original design.

That is only my opinion, other opinions in this thread both written or expressed may not reflect the opinion stated in this post and may or may not have more or as much value. Void where prohibited.

Ivan Durak
09-04-2013, 07:00 AM
Please, altering ones body is as old as society itself, it is not a sign of anything.

I'm not a fan but this is true.

Not in western societies, for the past 2000 years or more. Tattoos and body mutilations were part of outcast, fringe populations. It was both a sign that they were not totally part of society, but that they belonged together.
Tattoos were somewhat common among soldiers and seaman, as it could easily denote rank or experience when they were constantly among strangers (nomadic populations). Same thing for thieves in Russia, for example.

In other societies it might designate a function and rank in the social order within a very stable group of people, maybe nomadic but who live together as family units, neighbours etc.

In most western societies, painting yourself or mutilating your face often means you don't want to be part of society, you'd rather be in the fringe. It also means you don't care about being like other people in your social groups.

Tattoos and piercings have a lot to do with wanting, preferring or accepting to be an outcast, with refusing to fit in, maybe with finding "freedom", and certainly with refusing dialogue.

That doesn't mean people with tattoos are bad.

However, when larger percentages of the population take on these signs, it means that fitting in is not perceived as good anymore. Plenty of conclusions to draw from that.

EricPeterson
09-04-2013, 07:40 AM
However, when larger percentages of the population take on these signs, it means that fitting in is not perceived as good anymore. Plenty of conclusions to draw from that.

I am sure lots of people will draw lots of simplistic conclusions from that. In fact, your statement assumes they dont want to fit in.

Perhaps the reason more people get piercings or tattoos is because people are more accepting of these forms of body art and getting one no longer means you wont fit in.

homerayvaughan
09-04-2013, 07:52 AM
I think it's yucky. They smell funny and don't look good. At least I can't smell a tatoo.

Fred Farkus
09-04-2013, 08:35 AM
I'm glad I never did anything like that, because when I look back at what I thought was cool, etc. I tend to think "how did I once think THAT was cool?" but many people are not like me, or you, and for them maybe it is a good thing to do.

Yeah, with me it was short denim cutoffs and long white tube socks with the stripes at the top- in the 70s.

I'm glad that wasn't permanent...

:rotflmao

JDW3
09-04-2013, 08:40 AM
It's called "guaging".

Gauging or gouging?

EricPeterson
09-04-2013, 08:40 AM
I think it's yucky. They smell funny and don't look good. At least I can't smell a tatoo.

You can smell gauged ears? :huh


I think that might be something else.

Fred Farkus
09-04-2013, 08:53 AM
70 posts in this thread. Just about 1/3 of them are blatantly judgemental, a couple are out and out deplorable.

Strange figures for a group of open minded "musicians and artists".

Then again it's just like the common assertion that "If I don't like this artist/musician/gear/tone, then it sucks".

You are making the assumption that this forum and this thread represents musicians and artists, let alone open-minded ones. This forum has some members who are musicians and artists, but most posting on TGP are more accurately guitar and guitar gear enthusiasts, collectors, and hobbyists.


I am in another forum with musicans and artists. Although there are a sprinkling of those here and there, overall this forum is nowhere close. This is a forum of narrow-minded consumers, more than anything else. That's about all you can say.

One of the things I find hilarious in these kinds of threads is the number of people whose whole goal in life is to "get a job with good benefits" and nothing more. And naturally they project that mindset on everyone and everything else. How un-rock&rolll...

homerayvaughan
09-04-2013, 08:54 AM
You can smell gauged ears? :huh


I think that might be something else.

Yeah, they smell like feet!

jtm622
09-04-2013, 09:16 AM
Seriously - no offense to anyone, but:
The "living in the REAL-WORLD no bullsh#t" anthropological reason is that they think that it will offer them much-needed assitance in attracting a little poontang from within their specific peer group...


:)

themightyjay
09-04-2013, 09:26 AM
I know that this will be unpopular, but that kid in that picture with the mohawk, tats on his head and multiple ear lobes things and piercings will never get a job in a professional office where he will have to deal with the public.

I don't care that it's mean or not fair or whatever, but seriously? Someone who does that to themselves as a teen or in their young 20s is looking for a life of difficulty. It's just the way of the world.

If he has aspirations to become a doctor, lawyer, accountant or simply just about anyone who will be in a professional service industry with customers/patients/clients to deal with, it will be very difficult for this person to transcend their appearance.

Do I think it's cool? Maybe, sure. Would I hire this person to be a medical assistant in my office and deal with 50-60 per day and represent my practice? Nope. My clientele would run screaming. Right or wrong, again, it's the way of the world.

I'm pretty sure he couldn't give a rats ass about working in a customer facing professional office.

As other people have said, wearing a shirt and tie and having a mid salary job selling toilet roll holders or whatever in a soul less office on some industrial estate is maybe not everybody's idea of being successful.

EricPeterson
09-04-2013, 09:30 AM
VEgu7jdc_fs

It is good to have dreams. :)

Ron_R
09-04-2013, 09:50 AM
As other people have said, wearing a shirt and tie and having a mid salary job selling toilet roll holders or whatever in a soul less office on some industrial estate is maybe not everybody's idea of being successful.

That's not my idea of success either!!!

That being said, I wonder if that person ever really thought about his future options at all, which is a HUGE part of the issue right there. He won't be 20 forever.

Ron_R
09-04-2013, 09:51 AM
I see it like this :red

Vintage cars are worth a lot more money in original condition. It says the owners were smart and knew the value of the original design.

Vintage guitars are worth much more in original condition. It says the owners were smart and knew the value of the original design.

It says a lot if you yourself made it a number of years and are still in good original condition. It says that you were smart, took care of yourself and knew the value of the original design.

That is only my opinion, other opinions in this thread both written or expressed may not reflect the opinion stated in this post and may or may not have more or as much value. Void where prohibited.

Awesome!

2leod
09-04-2013, 09:58 AM
i just don't get it. got to be permanently disfiguring. edit....

sixteen pages later......got to love it~!:anon

Now that the OP has been edited, I don't know what the big deal is...

http://glambistro.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/18k-white-gold-hoop-earrings.jpg

themightyjay
09-04-2013, 09:58 AM
That's not my idea of success either!!!

That being said, I wonder if that person ever really thought about his future options at all, which is a HUGE part of the issue right there. He won't be 20 forever.

While I can't speak for that particular person, I started getting tattoo's in my early 20's.

I know have most of my body covered, am 33, living with my partner and expecting our first child.

I genuinely don't regret getting tattoo's for one second.

EricPeterson
09-04-2013, 09:59 AM
I genuinely don't regret getting tattoo's for one second.

But you will, I mean how can you have an open casket? :sarcasm

Ron_R
09-04-2013, 10:01 AM
While I can't speak for that particular person, I started getting tattoo's in my early 20's.

I know have most of my body covered, am 33, living with my partner and expecting our first child.

I genuinely don't regret getting tattoo's for one second.

Awesome! Congrats!!

I'm 40 and about to get my first tattoo which is exceptionally meaningful to me. It will be in a place no one will see unless I want them to. Upper right scapular area.

Fred Farkus
09-04-2013, 10:09 AM
I genuinely don't regret getting tattoo's for one second.

But you will, I mean how can you have an open casket? :sarcasm

How do you ever expect to get that middle-management position as a cog at Spacely Sprockets for the next 40 yrs until you retire and drop dead 2 years later? :sarcasm

GuitarKidd
09-04-2013, 10:10 AM
You need to get out more.
Tatoos, gauges, etc arent stopping anyone from getting work. Or "real jobs" as you so eloquently put it.

Not happening where I work. And I don't think Trader Joes, Guitar Center, comic book shop, bar tender, job is going to get you 6 figures unless you own the joint. Not saying that 6 figures is where the line is drawn between real jobs and not, but the earning potential is there where I work and you won't see anyone sporting gauges here. If you want to make 10-15 bucks an hour, and happy with that and can live comfortably on that.. .so be it.. be happy.

themightyjay
09-04-2013, 10:16 AM
Awesome! Congrats!!

I'm 40 and about to get my first tattoo which is exceptionally meaningful to me. It will be in a place no one will see unless I want them to. Upper right scapular area.

Thanks! And good on you, I hope you're very happy with it!

I think people miss the point when they go on about "trying to be different", to me it's a form of self expression in the same way that playing guitar is.