High end Strat users, what makes them better than regular production Strats Tonewise.

[michael.e]

I know about the looks and playability. What makes them sound better. What are you hearing? How does it translate to what you hear out of your amp. When you are solo'ing, what do you hear when you are digging in? Can you give me your overall impression as to why you decided to go high end.
In your opinion what and how big is the difference between a $700.00 production Strat, a used $1,600.00 Strat and a used $2,300.00 Strat.

Where do resonant qualities and overtones sit within these models?

Play the same lead line through the same amp, using each guitar, what do you hear is the difference.

Thanks,

M.E.

[Colt]

I think playability should be given as much consideration as sound. You have to feel good on it to play good on it. My opinion anyway...

looks...I don't really care. I'm getting ready to get a Nash tele (black, maple board) don't care how reliced etc......and then a month or so later...I'm getting a nash strat...don't even care what color, as long as it has a fat back and lindy fralin's...hahha....

[VaughnC]

In my journey through Strat-o-land, I've learned that each guitar has to be judged on its own merits, especially with less consistent Fender's. High end Strats will generally have better fit, finish, etc. but tone, while being very subjective, is generally all over the place. I've played $500 Strats that I felt sounded better than $2000+ boutique Strats....so that tells me that, when the right peices come together in one guitar, magic can happen....irregardless of price. IMO, there's not any one thing that makes Strat A sound better than Strat B....it's a sum of the parts thing. Even Strats with the same exact specs can sound very different.

The bottom line is: only YOU know what a good Strat sound is to YOU. Some will agree with you and others won't....but it's your ears that need satisfied. Play 'em all and decide for yourself....but IMHO, you don't need to spend $2000+ (or even $1000 for that matter) for a good Strat. Run the racks....the gems are there....you just have to spend some time to let them find you.

[cr8z4life]

In my journey through Strat-o-land, I've learned that each guitar has to be judged on its own merits, especially with less consistent Fender's. High end Strats will generally have better fit, finish, etc. but tone, while being very subjective, is generally all over the place. I've played $500 Strats that sounded better than $2000+ boutique Strats....so that tells me that, when the right peices come together in one guitar, magic can happen....irregardless of price. IMO, there's not any one thing that makes Strat A sound better than Strat B....it's a sum of the parts thing. Even Strats with the same exact specs can sound very different.

The bottom line is: only YOU know what a good Strat sound is to YOU. Some will agree with you and others won't....but it's your ears that need satisfied. Play 'em all and decide for yourself.

That about sums it up!!

[dave s]

Live playing behavior is my yardstick for measurement. My boutique strat stays in tune, plays great, sounds fantastic and behaves exactly as I expect a guitar should. And I paid accordingly for the service upgrade over an off-the-shelf F***er.

What makes it perform like this? Better pickups, better electronics, higher quality tuning system, better trem system, better frets, bone nut--all of which translates to the better playing, better sounding guitar I wanted.

My biggest beefs with MOST strats I've played are these: volume and tone controls don't work like I think they should, pickups are really difficult to balance if you want to use all three, (like I do) stock fender pickups are ice-picky at the bridge, most strats have no tone control there either, frets aren't dressed nearly as nicely as most of the boutique guitars, cheap plastic nuts, lower grade tuners and trem systems adversely affect tuning.

I'll gladly pay the extra cash to have a better playing, better sounding guitar anyday!

dave

[Seegs]

I've had a few strats over the years...some cheap and some expensive...one was made for me to my specs and the other was made for my ex-bandleader that I fell in love with and acquired via a trade which I still have...both used premium aged wood and had/have fat necks and would be considered expensive for a strat style guitar...I have nothing against inexpensive guitars if they are right but the cheap ones tended not to feel right and didn't stick around very long...

I shot my strat out against all manner of custom shop Fenders and Warmouth parts guitars...some costing more and some less...and my custom build wasn't miles better than the others in terms of tone...

but it kills em by miles as far as playability goes which is why I paid the extra premium...the neck my guy cuts great necks...right now I am still searching for the right set of pickups that will complete the deal and put my strat over the top tonally...I am pretty close but not quite there...when I get the pus right then I believe my guitar will hang with any and all comers...


if I had to do it again I would get an ash body/maple boat neck strat with a hardtail which would kinda put it in tele land...

Chow,
Seegs

[Thwap]

More selective about wood used. Better attention to detail concerning quality. Maybe the Finish. Better quality electronics.

I don't know really. As has been stated Strats, even of the same price level/category can sound/feel quite different.

When I bought my EJ, I played it alongside a 60's closet classic, and the '54 50th Anniversary model. They all were good, the EJ was just the best for ME. You may have chosen one of the other two and been just as happy with your purchase.

I did play all three through the same amp, a Mesa Lonestar, and IN THIS CASE, the 54 sounded warm and darker than the other two, not so much articulation, kinda creamy...for a strat anyway.

The closet classic was a really nice guitar sounded just...well classic. Did all the standard strat stuff really well, sounded to my ears anyway much smoother that my American Standard, and played much nicer as well...almost bought it.

The EJ was a lot better than both unplugged. Startling acoustic quality to that model. It sounded...I guess Raunchier than the other two when pushed, and once again...to my ears, more bell like when cleaned up. It's all such a personal thing, the tone quest. But all 3 of those guitars killed my American Standard, and I really love that guitar.

[B Vance]

In my journey through Strat-o-land, I've learned that each guitar has to be judged on its own merits, especially with less consistent Fender's. High end Strats will generally have better fit, finish, etc. but tone, while being very subjective, is generally all over the place. I've played $500 Strats that I felt sounded better than $2000+ boutique Strats....so that tells me that, when the right peices come together in one guitar, magic can happen....irregardless of price. IMO, there's not any one thing that makes Strat A sound better than Strat B....it's a sum of the parts thing. Even Strats with the same exact specs can sound very different.

The bottom line is: only YOU know what a good Strat sound is to YOU. Some will agree with you and others won't....but it's your ears that need satisfied. Play 'em all and decide for yourself....but IMHO, you don't need to spend $2000+ (or even $1000 for that matter) for a good Strat. Run the racks....the gems are there....you just have to spend some time to let them find you.

+1...

I completely agree. I played more than 100 different Standard Strats before I found "The One" for me. However, I haved found several "The One" when it came to the botique type Fenders. It's much easier to play the number game there as far as a higher percentage of "The Ones" per items produced. They have a much higher level of playability for me. Just my opinion.

[MVrider]

High end Strat users, what makes them better than regular production Strats Tonewise.

The price.

Your odds are better with the pricier stuff, but some of thsoe are dogs. Really expensive dogs. But eventually somebody buys 'em all.

[hendrix2430]

I've had a few strats over the years...some cheap and some expensive...one was made for me to my specs and the other was made for my ex-bandleader that I fell in love with and acquired via a trade which I still have...both used premium aged wood and had/have fat necks and would be considered expensive for a strat style guitar...I have nothing against inexpensive guitars if they are right but the cheap ones tended not to feel right and didn't stick around very long...

I shot my strat out against all manner of custom shop Fenders and Warmouth parts guitars...some costing more and some less...and my custom build wasn't miles better than the others in terms of tone...

but it kills em by miles as far as playability goes which is why I paid the extra premium...the neck my guy cuts great necks...right now I am still searching for the right set of pickups that will complete the deal and put my strat over the top tonally...I am pretty close but not quite there...when I get the pus right then I believe my guitar will hang with any and all comers...


if I had to do it again I would get an ash body/maple boat neck strat with a hardtail which would kinda put it in tele land...

Chow,
Seegs
The infamous pink Shinderhuette? :BEER

Ash/maple hardtail? I would go for alder/maple RW and trem...pfff, you have no taste sir! :o

[mischultz]

Playability (that's *so* not a word, but we all can agree on what it means) is a key factor for two reasons: first and foremost, you're gonna get more out of the primary tone generator - yourself - if you're more comfortable. Second, a properly built and adjusted instrument will intonate better and will have maximized the snap and sustain you can get by dialing in the saddle height and break angle.

The other piece that I find tremendously important is fit and coupling. The more you spend, the higher the probability (not certainty or inevitability) of someone not only having chosen premium woods, but invested time in making certain that the loss of string energy is minimized. You're far less likely to find an ill-fitting neck pocket, a poorly adjusted tremolo or a nut that's pinching and dampening a string, all factors that can lessen a Strat's tonal responsiveness.

Now, all those things will come together in a Mexican Strat on occasion, and if you have the patience to play through 30 or 40 in a sitting at GC, you may find a gem. You'll still want to replace hardware and such, but the point is it's not impossible at the lower end; but it is increasingly probable as you move up the ladder and as someone's personal reputation (John Suhr, Don Grosh, Gerard Melancon - they're not merely company logos) gets attached to your experience of a particular instrument.

Best,

Michael

[jtw]

Excellent post Michael. That was one of the most thought-out and reasonable posts i've read in a while.

[riverastoasters]

What makes them sound better.

They don't all sound better.

If you want the best sounding Strat, go sort through as many as you can find - high end, low end, middle.

You will probably find that the high end ones are more consistent, but the very best sound can come from anywhere.

[jpage]

Amen to the idea of playing a bunch. I think 30 or 40 might be a bit extreme but not a futile exersize. The more strats you play the more you will realize what you like/dislike about the instrument.

For my first strat, I used Guitar Center to my advantage. Always having been a Gibby guy, I really didn't know what I wanted out of the strat. So I went over to GC one Sunday and picked up a Squier Strat w/maple. The next Sunday I brought the Squier back and brought home an American Standard/rosewood (this was before Mexico). The next Sunday I tried a MIJ Reissue and decided that the vintage specs and rosewood board were more to my liking and kept that guitar for 5 years before going on a CS spree. You simply can't get the feel of a guitar (IMO) in a store setting. Take the thing home, crank it up, find out if there are any dead spots (very common in all strats). Try several different models.

When you find the right one, you will know it.

[jpage]

I've played a few Tylers and they played like a good strat--nothing more or less. To each his own I guess...

Although yours is one of the few attractive Tylers I've seen I have to say.

[sanhozay]

The running the racks game is fun but I think it's a huge placebo that's influenced by a variety of factors. There's a simple law that goes something like - pay more / get more. Defy it all you want but thieving bastards aside, it's sageness to the powah of ten.

[mattmccloskey]

if you compare a higher end strat, fender or otherwise, you tend to hear a few things that stand out:
1) intonnation- a guitar with better nut cut, fret work, saddles and tuners, and set-up, will simply hold tuning and be more 'in-tune' all over the neck than a typical cheapy. This is a major component of sound obviously, and the perception of tone, as you really can't hear the tonal quality when playing chords and double stops if the thing is out of tune and beating all over the place.
2) Most high end strat-types have a slightly beefed up or warmed up bridge pick-up, which makes the bridge only position more useful and less harsh, to most people it seems. Additionally most suhr, anderson, grosh etc, come wired with a tone pot to the bridge, whereas stock standard strats or re-issues won't, so you can more easily smooth out the sound of the bridge pu further.
3) The higher end strats frequently have more 'fundamental' in the notes, or maybe less ghosting, unpleasant overtones, stratitis, hollow low notes,etc. - the notes just seem more solid.
just a few differences I notice very consistently.

[jpage]

There's a simple law that goes something like - pay more / get more.


In this hobby, you will go broke and insane thinking like that.

[sanhozay]

In this hobby, you will go broke and insane thinking like that.

There's the hierarchy of needs and then there's hobbies. I buy the best that I can afford and cross my fingers. I’m no elitist but I’ve learned my lessons fussing with bush league.

[jpage]

I’ve learned my lessons fussing with bush league

Sure, I can agree to that. But there are some who will preach all day long about how a Gibson or a Fender is horrible off the wall. Some? Sure. But to tell a guy looking for a good strat that he's going to have to drop $2500 or so in order to find quality is wrong I believe. If you know what you are looking for and know tone and know a good neck when you play it, a very serviceable strat can be had for under a grand. Heck, I've played a few Jimmie Vaughans that were great and they run $600 or so. And this from a man with a $2000 strat.

Believe me, the difference between a $2000 strat with special order hand wound pickups/a brazilian board/nitro finish/Callaham hardware and a good JV strat off the wall isn't as pronounced as you might think. Is there one? Yes. Is a little more talent going to make up for that difference? You betcha.

[GuitarsFromMars]

well.....
i've never played any strat that felt better to me than my tyler classic, at any price, so.
it's extremely resonant (1-pc ash body, 1-pc maple neck) and dynamically responsive, both acoustically and (of course) plugged-in.

are there great strats available from fender?
probably so --- i just never found one that interested me enough to buy it (other than my pal's '65, which he'd rightfully never sell);
previous to the tyler, i'd given up on strats:
wasn't interested, didn't even wanna know about 'em:
the last good strat i had --- a tokai --- i gave to a friend who totally loved it, about 4 yrs ago.
now, this tyler is really something else.....
ymmv.
dt / spltrcl

Hey splatt-you got a picture of this Tyler you play? I'd like to see what it looks like....GFM

[sanhozay]

Sure, I can agree to that. But there are some who will preach all day long about how a Gibson or a Fender is horrible off the wall. Some? Sure. But to tell a guy looking for a good strat that he's going to have to drop $2500 or so in order to find quality is wrong I believe. If you know what you are looking for and know tone and know a good neck when you play it, a very serviceable strat can be had for under a grand. Heck, I've played a few Jimmie Vaughans that were great and they run $600 or so. And this from a man with a $2000 strat.

Believe me, the difference between a $2000 strat with special order hand wound pickups/a brazilian board/nitro finish/Callaham hardware and a good JV strat off the wall isn't as pronounced as you might think. Is there one? Yes. Is a little more talent going to make up for that difference? You betcha.

Agreed - there's many ways to get to the promise land.

[Wizard of Ozz]

http://www.kelloggs.com/keebler/images/faq-elf.jpg

Why elven magic of course. :rolleyes:

[michael.e]

I really appreciate the replies guys. Due to some family medical emergencies, I have had to liquidate the majority of my amp and guitar harem. I am really thankful that I have been such a gear slut.

When I can recoup, I am planning on making a few select purchases. One of the thoughts is a Tyler Strat. I have a Fender Japan Kotzen "Ninja Monkey" Strat that I absolutely love. I am finding that I am in want of a bit more acoustic resonance in my amplified tone in both clean and overdriven modes. Hence, my line of questioning.

DT, how are you liking the Humbucker in the bridge position? I know that you are not [thankfully imo] a purveyor of "trad" tones or more accurately, ideas. I tend to wander this road myself and though I desire the very essence of my tone to harken back to some idea of tradition, I wish not to linger.

Thank you all again, this excercise has proven to be both theraputic and very helpful. M.E.

[michael.e]

http://www.kelloggs.com/keebler/images/faq-elf.jpg

Why elven magic of course. :rolleyes:

Thanks for the reply. Please correct me if I am misunderstanding of course, but do you have anything productive to contribute?

Thanks again, M.E.

[GuitarsFromMars]

sure, here's one:

http://pic14.picturetrail.com/VOL554/1684866/9265904/129951909.jpg

dt / spltrcl

That is very nice-very VERY nice!:JAM

[Rama]

Play a bunch of em and find one that sounds good..and don't be afraid to start at the low end....my favorite is a Mexi and I have some high end stuff...

Question is....will your ego allow you to play a cheap guitar even if it sounds like God??:)

[michael.e]

Play a bunch of em and find one that sounds good..and don't be afraid to start at the low end....my favorite is a Mexi and I have some high end stuff...

Question is....will your ego allow you to play a cheap guitar even if it sounds like God??:)

Well, my Kotzen, which sent my CS Relic up to Canada, cost me about $250.00. I dunno.............

M.E.

[beNsteR]

Well, in the world of strats, you won't go wrong (in any price range) as long as you adhere to the following recipe:

-solid (not veneered) lightweight (preferred) swamp ash or alder body, 2 piece body (preferred)

-thin finish (doesnt inhibit resonance)

-tight neck-to-body fit VERY important

-high quality hardware, vintage-style or otherwise

-quality pickups

you CAN find a great strat within a budget if you take the time to play as much of them as you can.. they are out there :D

[Seegs]

The infamous pink Shinderhuette? :BEER

Ash/maple hardtail? I would go for alder/maple RW and trem...pfff, you have no taste sir! :o

you sir...crack me up:D only real men have pink guitars!!

Chow,
Seegs

[danyeod]

Lots of great points have been brought up already. Guitars HAVE to be judged on an individual basis. Just because you spend $2000 on a Suhr or Anderson doesn't me you are getting a great sounding guitar. I have heard $400 Ibanez guitars that sound as good as anything that SUhr has made.

[Lex Luthier]

Best advice is run the racks and play a bunch and listen with your ears, and not the wallet.

I wasn't even in the market for a Strat when I bought my EJ. I had played a few previously that I liked but not enough to pull the trigger until I tried this particular one. I A/B'ed it with some boutique and CS Strats and I thought this particular EJ sounded better than the much more expensive guitars, even compared it to a couple vintage Strats and it held its own against them as well.

I have a '83 big head MIJ Squier Strat that I paid $20 for that sounds as good as any Strat I've ever owned, newer or vintage. It has gaps in the neck pocket, mystery body wood, 3 bolt neck, thick-ass poly finish on the body, all the stuff that some would believe should make it sound like crap, yet it sounds wonderful.

I appreciate the quality of a lot of the boutique Strats, but many of them seem to have a Hi-Fi tonal quality to them, not the more organic vintage style sound that I prefer.

[VaughnC]

Best advice is run the racks and play a bunch and listen with your ears, and not the wallet.

I wasn't even in the market for a Strat when I bought my EJ. I had played a few previously that I liked but not enough to pull the trigger until I tried this particular one. I A/B'ed it with some boutique and CS Strats and I thought this particular EJ sounded better than the much more expensive guitars, even compared it to a couple vintage Strats and it held its own against them as well.

I have a '83 big head MIJ Squier Strat that I paid $20 for that sounds as good as any Strat I've ever owned, newer or vintage. It has gaps in the neck pocket, mystery body wood, 3 bolt neck, thick-ass poly finish on the body, all the stuff that some would believe should make it sound like crap, yet it sounds wonderful.

I appreciate the quality of a lot of the boutique Strats, but many of them seem to have a Hi-Fi tonal quality to them, not the more organic vintage style sound that I prefer.
Good points and I agree. However, it seems like Strat style guitar builders fall into two general catagories: they either voice their guitars for a modern hi-fi flatter mids type of sound or the classic slightly scooped mid sound. Beyond the sonic differences from guitar to guitar, it's important that you to select the Strat with the right basic voice because, in my experience, an amps tone controls won't make the modern voiced Strat sound classic or vice-versa.

[blong]

The amp that you plug them into and how you set the amp, and then your technique. I've heard players make junky equipment sound incredible, and other players take $10K worth of guitar and amp and make it sound like caca!

There are some neat appointments on the high end guitars, possibly better pots and attention to some details. If you learn to set up a guitar and do some very minor work (change some pots, maybe, if at all), you can have a killer strat at a very reasonable price.

Especially as men, most of us get in our head that something that is "high quality, top notch" stuff makes us imagine it will feel or sound better than something considered by most to be average. Turns out, many times, the average stuff is just as good, sometimes better. We tend to do the same thing when we look at beautiful women on TV. We get all worked up and think, "wow, it would be great to date her," when often all those little "details" end up being high maintenance. It is a big psychological factor, in my opinion.

Does that mean that a Suhr or Melancon isn't worth the extra coin? Not necessarily. The chances you are going to get a dog made from a custom builder is probably lower, but the name on the headstock does not guarantee it will feel good in your hands and you will bond with it. Look at all the boutique gear people buy and when the honeymoon is over they end up selling it at a loss and usually end up with a solid Fender or the likes.

Just my thoughts, different strokes for different folks.

Bob

[mattmccloskey]

I don't think it is all that random though; I think if you know exactly what you want and like in a strat someone like suhr can deliver without any doubts. I have custom ordered 5 suhrs and played 3-4 others and there are zero duds or dogs. I think if the wood is good, picked right, the build is accurate, the finish thin, and the hardware the right choice for your taste, it can be right every time, because suhr won't let it go if it is not.
The trick is to know exactly what the factors are that go into your ideal strat. If you can narrow down every detail a great guitar can be built every time. The key is knowing exactly what you want and choosing the specs carefully.

[DrSax]

In my journey through Strat-o-land, I've learned that each guitar has to be judged on its own merits, especially with less consistent Fender's. High end Strats will generally have better fit, finish, etc. but tone, while being very subjective, is generally all over the place. I've played $500 Strats that I felt sounded better than $2000+ boutique Strats....so that tells me that, when the right peices come together in one guitar, magic can happen....irregardless of price. IMO, there's not any one thing that makes Strat A sound better than Strat B....it's a sum of the parts thing. Even Strats with the same exact specs can sound very different.

The bottom line is: only YOU know what a good Strat sound is to YOU. Some will agree with you and others won't....but it's your ears that need satisfied. Play 'em all and decide for yourself....but IMHO, you don't need to spend $2000+ (or even $1000 for that matter) for a good Strat. Run the racks....the gems are there....you just have to spend some time to let them find you.

+1, that's what I would have said, too. Reminds me of Martin acoustics, to me they are all over the map, even the expensive ones. But when you find the ONE....boing!!!!

[Rich]

However, it seems like Strat style guitar builders fall into two general catagories: they either voice their guitars for a modern hi-fi flatter mids type of sound or the classic slightly scooped mid sound.

Seems to me that you are overdoing this quite a bit.

They all offer a range of body, neck and fb woods and pickups so that the player can select (or mix and match on a "custom" order) depending on his or her own desired tone.

If there were only two camps, there'd be a lot fewer builders and / or strat models around.

[rusmurf]

One main point for going against low-end, is the amount of money invested in part upgrades over-time. Everyone does it, so do some quick calculations in your head when shopping, too figure out what the guitar is really going to cost.

Also, nowadays there are too many people to go to for a custom built strat, unless a specific namebrand is important. You can do pretty well for a good bit less then 2k. Totally custom, expertly done!

[guitaryy]

I just recievd my melancon pro artist.hand made by one person,gerard melancon.very light swamp ash,tone chambers,dimarzio melancon pickups,rosewood fretboard,a 25db demeter mid preamp boost that is controlled by the lowest knob so that you can boost a little and gradually work your way up to maximum.the guitar is a custom one off color ,a take off of porsche red.the guitar is SUPER LIGHT AND SUPER RESONANT.the PLAYABILITY is awesome ,the tone is beutifull.its very harmonically rich and smooth but with just the wright amount of attack ,and of course looks great.i have played quite a few of the american series strats but i would say it compares to a fender custom shop.

[8lbs8k]

I've owned about 6 strats over the last 20 years. Lots of Japanese and Korean Squiers, one 90s MIJ 62 style, and one Cunetto CS relic. The top 3:

#3: Mid-80s Japanese Squier. Not a JV, nor an early big-headstock 3-bolt. This is the standard fare 2-string-tree, mystery body wood, maple neck, crummy bridge job. Skinny fast neck. This guitar plays really great and has a mysterious warmth to the sound. No matter what pickups I put in, it's clear and warm, not a lot of overtones. Lots and lots of fundamental. Therefore, not very stratty. Also, this guitar doesn't really care so much how hard I dig in. I think something about the lack of overtones and high-treble response also means it's not as picky about how it's played. This is good if you're sloppy, but ultimately not very expressive, and the reason I like strats so much is because of their touch response and the range it gives your phrasing. But it's great and it holds a note so well, clean or overdriven. Great feel, despite my preference for bigger necks. $210 4 years ago in NYC (i.e. not the cheapest place to buy anything).

#2: 98 Cunetto CS '62 Relic. Amazing. Kinda perfect. Almost too perfect. Alder/Rosewood. Giant C neck. By far the most playable. Stays in tune. Really well intonated. No buzzing. And get this: I never break strings. Ever. I find that even properly set up strats will break strings over the saddles. It's a pretty tight turn to make, you know. I've filed out all the burrs, etc, but I do break strings a lot more than on, say, a Les Paul or Dano, where the strings never make that hard turn. It never happens on this one. For this reason, it's really a perfect show guitar. Very light, and I never have to worry about anything but playing. Tonally it's very, very good. Everything you want out of a strat really. Quite touch responsive. Something like $2K used.

Here's the thing: #1 favorite strat ever: early 90s MIJ 60s RI. Alder/Rosewood. A little heavy. Breaks D strings after like 3 hours. A lot of "fight" in the neck and string tension. But it just sounds like absolute heaven. More responsive than any guitar I've ever played. Dig in and you really feel and hear it. Extended highs and lows. Lots of bottom. Just enough of that strat rattle/choogly/sugary/is-that-fret-buzz-I-don't-care-it's good/slightly-metallic thing. I play it through any amp (we're talking from roachy Yamaha solid states to Peavey fake bassmen to $2K Germino monsters) and it just has that thing. Clean, dirty, full-on fuzz. But it's ornery, doesn't hold tune as well as the Cunetto, and I can never quite get the intonation right. When all's said and done, it's my favorite guitar ever and it cost < $700 on ebay. Fralin vintage hots and Sperzel locking tuners. Refined with thinner nitro.

Sorry for the long post, but this is an excellent thread. Would I swear off the high-end stuff? Nope. Is it automatically the best? Nope. As many have pointed out, with strats especially, there's so much variation from one to the next, even one serial # apart, you've really got to play some (although I did buy my #1 off ebay, sight unseen)(this is not recommended). I can't help but hope that somewhere there's the best-sounding strat out there and it's a Chinese squier or something.

Also FWIW I've noticed a surprisingly consistent level of quality in 90s Japanese Fender stuff. Teles too. And if you like that wide neck with a slight D shape at the 12th fret, you're in business.

[guitarlix]

Pick the best mex strat that you can find, do a proper setup and maybe swap out the pups. You're there.

[riverastoasters]

you sir...crack me up:D only real men have pink guitars!!
I have an original Schecter PT which has a trem bridge. It is almost Pepto-Bismol pink but it has a little yellowish cast possibly due to age. We were considering it for this alt-country player to take with him to SXSW, and the sound was really right. But he just could not handle the idea of being seen in public playing that guitar.

The one that really annoyed me is that he used this guitar:

http://www.zen-pharaohs.com/guitars/Fender/Gene_Baker/gene.htm

all over his album. So I naturally assumed that would be the guitar to take. Silly me. Apparently you can't be seen to play a guitar like that in alt-country even if you DO play a guitar like that in alt-country. So he took this one instead:

http://www.zen-pharaohs.com/guitars/Gretsch/gretsch.htm

Wow. Not exactly like blazing your own trail and taking risks with confidence because your act is a bigger deal than what your guitar looks like.

That same Baker tele was used all over this nu-metal demo project, and that guy also quailed at the idea of taking the stage with it.

Can you tell I'm impressed?

[guitarlix]

i've played some mexican strats;
i've owned a great tokai strat, that cost approx. $700., and needed no alterations.
played an awful lotta cheap instruments, both good and bad.
played an awful lotta expensive vintage instruments, both good and bad.
played and owned some remarkable g&L strat-types, back in the days when they were not expensive:
still, no strat i've played --- to date --- has come close to equalling my tyler classic, as far as my own playing needs are concerned.
so?
no;
no offense is intended, here, but:
you're wrong:
what apparently works for you did not work for me.
maybe one day i'll accidentally find a mexican strat that feels better than this tyler.
dt / spltrcl

No offense taken but I don't think I can be "wrong" when we're discussing what makes a guitar "great". It's subjective, just like music.

You can ask Tyler to make 10 guitars with the exact same configuration as yours and I can guarantee that they'll all sound slightly different from each other. So if one of them is better than the other, then one is worse than another and every single Tyler out there can't be all that great as people proclaim, right? Surely there's a mex-strat out there that's the equal of the "least" tyler and maybe even the "greatest" Tyler.

Judge each guitar, boutique or mass produced, on it's own merit. Boutique manufacturers may be able to achieve better QC simply because of the smaller numbers being produced, but with CNC manufacturing, many of the guitars being made on a large scale are equally good. The quality of the parts being used for tremolos and pots may not be as good and that can definitely affect the playability but many manufacturers are utilizing very good hardware nowadays.

While that's my view on electrics, as far as acoustics go, I'm a true believer in handmade guitars - True North, Goodall, Froggy Bottom, H&D, Ryan, Traugott etc. There, the skill of a luthier, wood selection and voicing of the soundboard are of far greater significance compared to an electric.

I'm still puzzled when people comment about how loud their electrics sound unplugged (a comment I've even read you make Torn). That to me is no indication whatsoever of the way a guitar sounds plugged in. If anything, to me, there would be an inverse relationship. If an electric guitar sounds louder acoustically, that means there is a greater amount of energy being transferred from the strings to the body, robbing the strings themselves of energy. And we all know that pickups can't sense vibrating wood. Yes the wood affects the vibration of the strings but louder unplugged is surely not a good thing. By extension, if the strings transferred all their energy, that'd be one dead electric plugged in.

If you want to record some of the acoustic sounds with a mic (like on an archtop), that's a whole different story.

[guitarlix]

I share the same view when it comes to pickups and vintage guitars.

[hendrix2430]

I have an original Schecter PT which has a trem bridge. It is almost Pepto-Bismol pink but it has a little yellowish cast possibly due to age. We were considering it for this alt-country player to take with him to SXSW, and the sound was really right. But he just could not handle the idea of being seen in public playing that guitar.

The one that really annoyed me is that he used this guitar:

http://www.zen-pharaohs.com/guitars/Fender/Gene_Baker/gene.htm

all over his album. So I naturally assumed that would be the guitar to take. Silly me. Apparently you can't be seen to play a guitar like that in alt-country even if you DO play a guitar like that in alt-country. So he took this one instead:

http://www.zen-pharaohs.com/guitars/Gretsch/gretsch.htm

Wow. Not exactly like blazing your own trail and taking risks with confidence because your act is a bigger deal than what your guitar looks like.

That same Baker tele was used all over this nu-metal demo project, and that guy also quailed at the idea of taking the stage with it.

Can you tell I'm impressed?

Love this one! :RoCkIn

http://www.zen-pharaohs.com/guitars/Fender/Gene_Baker/images/gb78fr.jpg

[Rich]

If an electric guitar sounds louder acoustically, that means there is a greater amount of energy being transferred from the strings to the body, robbing the strings themselves of energy. And we all know that pickups can't sense vibrating wood. Yes the wood affects the vibration of the strings but louder unplugged is surely not a good thing.


Wow. Talk about going against the grain.........

I guess all the electric builders are wrong in being concerned with the resonance of the different woods they use.

[Luke V]

I really appreciate the replies guys. Due to some family medical emergencies, I have had to liquidate the majority of my amp and guitar harem. I am really thankful that I have been such a gear slut.

When I can recoup, I am planning on making a few select purchases. One of the thoughts is a Tyler Strat. I have a Fender Japan Kotzen "Ninja Monkey" Strat that I absolutely love. I am finding that I am in want of a bit more acoustic resonance in my amplified tone in both clean and overdriven modes. Hence, my line of questioning.

DT, how are you liking the Humbucker in the bridge position? I know that you are not [thankfully imo] a purveyor of "trad" tones or more accurately, ideas. I tend to wander this road myself and though I desire the very essence of my tone to harken back to some idea of tradition, I wish not to linger.



Thank you all again, this excercise has proven to be both theraputic and very helpful. M.E.

Sorry to hear about the medical problems in the family. I truly wish you and your family the best.

Good Luck, hope everything works out well.

Luke

[riverastoasters]

Love this one! :RoCkIn

http://www.zen-pharaohs.com/guitars/Fender/Gene_Baker/images/gb78fr.jpg

And if you played it, you would probably love it more. Bill Lawrence was in some sort of trance when he wound those pickups. I have no idea what Gene Baker was thinking when he made it, but this guitar does personality transformation tricks. Someday we may find someone lit up enough to take it on stage.

[Seegs]

I'd be happy to take that on stage and wouldn't need to be lit up to do it...

Chow,
Seegs

[hendrix2430]

I bet you wouldn't... ;)

[hendrix2430]

And if you played it, you would probably love it more. Bill Lawrence was in some sort of trance when he wound those pickups. I have no idea what Gene Baker was thinking when he made it, but this guitar does personality transformation tricks. Someday we may find someone lit up enough to take it on stage.

By the way, is this a custom shop dating back when Gene used to work as a master builder?

[Seegs]

I bet you wouldn't... ;)

How much:AOK ??

Chow,
Seegs

[hendrix2430]

How much:AOK ??

Chow,
Seegs
Ha!

If you don't do it: For you next gig, you'll have to play the shinderhuette while wearing a color-matching tank top and high heels... (which in turn whould most likely make you reconsider gigging with that seafoamer!!!)

If you do it: I'll learn from my mistake.

:D

[Seegs]

Ha!

If you don't do it: For you next gig, you'll have to play the shinderhuette while wearing a color-matching tank top and high heels... (which in turn whould most likely make you reconsider gigging with that seafoamer!!!)

If you do it: I'll learn from my mistake.

:D

Look I gots a reputatioin to uphold...the stakes are too high:o

All bets are off!!

so whats with this high heel sh**:dude

Chow,
Seegs

[EADGBE]

...cheap plastic nuts...These should be outlawed! :shock:

[EADGBE]

...cheap plastic nuts,These should be outlawed! http://mcs.acidpit.org/images/smiles/icon_eek.gif

[Lucidology]

I just recievd my melancon pro artist.hand made by one person,gerard melancon.very light swamp ash,tone chambers,dimarzio melancon pickups,rosewood fretboard,a 25db demeter mid preamp boost that is controlled by the lowest knob so that you can boost a little and gradually work your way up to maximum.the guitar is a custom one off color ,a take off of porsche red.the guitar is SUPER LIGHT AND SUPER RESONANT.the PLAYABILITY is awesome ,the tone is beutifull.its very harmonically rich and smooth but with just the wright amount of attack ,and of course looks great.i have played quite a few of the american series strats but i would say it compares to a fender custom shop.

I have one a Melancon Pro Artist with EMG's & it is a totally great guitar...
You can't go wrong with it .. I'll bring it up one of these days if ya want to check it out through your gear Michael ..


http://i92.photobucket.com/albums/l12/lucidology/CroppedMel2.jpg