West Coast Blues Thread - Version 2.0

[pete kanaras]

i saw the juke jumpers the first time i went to dallas, when zu zu bollin had come out of retirement and just put out that killer album on dbs records. grrreat band. sold out show at a big club in deep ellum, forget the name. i remember zu zu sitting at a big round table between sets surrounded my lovelies (ouch), drinkin' a huge-ass Texas Tea and just having a ball. someone (either hash brown or sumter) got on mike and went (paraphrasing, memory ain't as good...) "look at him folks. a few months ago he was sitting on his front porch waiting to check out and now he's sitting like a king with all his honeys!" man the whole place fell out. so much love. an unforgettable, beautiful night.

[fretshop]

i saw the juke jumpers the first time i went to dallas, when zu zu bollin had come out of retirement and just put out that killer album on dbs records. grrreat band. sold out show at a big club in deep ellum, forget the name. i remember zu zu sitting at a big round table between sets surrounded my lovelies (ouch), drinkin' a huge-ass Texas Tea and just having a ball. someone (either hash brown or sumter) got on mike and went (paraphrasing, memory ain't as good...) "look at him folks. a few months ago he was sitting on his front porch waiting to check out and now he's sitting like a king with all his honeys!" man the whole place fell out. so much love. an unforgettable, beautiful night.

I just found the autographed copy of Zu Zu's "Texas Bluesman" that I thought I had lost. Here's one for ya....a guitarist of note, some one close to us, someone who rarely keeps a guitar more than two weeks, produced the album. Who is it?

[Dave Orban]

I just found the autographed copy of Zu Zu's "Texas Bluesman" that I thought I had lost. Here's one for ya....a guitarist of note, some one close to us, someone who rarely keeps a guitar more than two weeks, produced the album. Who is it?The Dukester...?

[S.W.Erdnase]

Yeah---I'm glad I got my Beaufort with a 15" speaker in a pro size cabinet (a mini pro???) when I did---It's a great little amp for sure!---Congrats on your Penrose!---let me know how the volume works for you in a live situation---I thought about that amp, but really needed less wattage---still can be plenty loud in a smallish-medium club!---what speaker did you get? Mine came with a Weber P15N copy (w/ enhanced treble, 'cause I find Webers a bit too dark---and guess what--it's STILL too dark of a speaker, for my tastes...)---it now has a 61' Jensen P15N---well--it DID---that speaker's in the shop for repairs---sigh---my never ending story--

CONGRATS, S.W.!

ac

Don't know what the speaker is (apart from a 15" Weber something or other) but it has an attenuator - however Dave thinks it's not necessary. Of course, I play harp, so who knows exactly how it will behave? Still, I have Weber Deluxe and Super kit amps that have stock tube set ups and sound dandy for harp, so I am sure the Pro config will be fine (indeed, it's the same amp used for my favourite harp tone on CD of all time, Kim Wilson on "Pine Top's Boogie Woogie").

Here's Dave's (Groovekings's) thoughts after gigging with it....

-------------------------------
Dude

I did the gig with the Pro last night ... and I don't know how to tell you this ...

dude, the amp is a POS.

No tone. No volume. Hard to to get any decent sound out of it at all. The Weber speaker is crap - all farty and woofy.

I feel really bad for you that you bought this piece of crap, so here's what I'm gonna do ...

I'll buy it off you for a vastly reduced price, just so you can have it off your hands and move on with your life ...









Now, all seriousness aside ...


IT'S ****ING AWESOME!!!!

In fact it's so ****ing good that I think there may be something wrong with my amp. Like I told you on the phone, it's nowhere near as loud as my amp, which is good, but there is still PLENTY of volume there. I rarely run my amp at more than 4, but I had the Pro wound up to 6-7 (which doesn't indicate anything, really as the pots could be calibrated differently, etc.) but the Pro had dripping tube tone and mucho responsiveness to picking dynamics and volume knob twiddles. When I tried it out at home yesterday arvo, I was amazed at how 'reverberant' the cab/speaker combo is. I knew the gig was in a glass walled/timber floored venue so I plugged straight in - no reverb or delay pedal and the ****ing sound was heavenly! I used the Les Paul all night and I was switching from clean funky sounds to vintage BB King on steroids tones to fat Otis Rush neck pup tones. I was knob twiddling all night to get the full range of sounds out of one guitar and one amp. And I didn't even touch the attenuator. To be honest, I can't think that it would even be needed. The amp just feels 'right' as it is. And the 15" speaker is a blast! Very chimey, plenty of top end and not woofy at all in the bass, very tight, but still very responsive. Mitch described the speaker as 'focused', but I thought the opposite - it just bloomed and filled the room. Maybe he was referring to the high end stuff (which may settle down after the speaker has broken in a bit).

Like I said, I think there may be something wrong with my amp. Mine just feels really stiff and unresponsive in comparison to yours. At first I thought it was my playing, you know, not playing very much and having my chops go blunt, but last night because the sound was THERE it made playing much, much easier so the ideas came easily.

I've got quite a few gigs coming up (Old Canberra Inn, Yacht Club, OJO, Press Club etc), so it'll get a workout in a bunch of different places. I'll keep in touch about how it's performing. And like I said, I'll get some JJ 12ax7s to put in it and get rid of the Sovteks, so it'll be sweet when you pick it up (that is, if you can find me, hehehe).

Also, did you deal directly with Michael Clark, or did you go through Bob at Perfect Note? Reckon Clark would be up for building one more before he retires? ;-)

-Dave-

[pete kanaras]

The Dukester...?

yep

[mikelaw]

paul size is DEFINEATELY butthead!!!!! DUKESTER!!!!!!!!

[fretshop]

The Dukester...?

Corrrrecto-Mundo !!! Which hint was the give away (ahem)?

Dave: We checked out the menu at Sotto128...very impressive. Have you eaten there?

[Dave Orban]

Corrrrecto-Mundo !!! Which hint was the give away (ahem)?

Dave: We checked out the menu at Sotto128...very impressive. Have you eaten there?
I haven't, but friends who have eaten there have all lived to tell about it...

[pete kanaras]

oh i knew that george, i wore that record out!

[Strat-O]

I just sold my Penrose. Great amp but way too much headroom for me. I couldn't use it for anything. AC's deluxe with a 15 would be the ticket for me and the gigs I play. Its just easier for me to run two low wattage amps together for more volume when I need than to keep a higher wattage amp around that I never use.

To replace it I got lucky enough to find a Magnatone Triplex 180 like Hubert used to use. What an amp.
:drool

[S.W.Erdnase]

Yeah, but for harp, you can never get as much volume out of them as with a guitar. And I'm not one of the donkey-pullers who has the amp dimed and on the edge of feedback...

:horse

[Strat-O]

Oh man, do doubt. I'm sure it would sound incredible for harp. Even if you had it wound up. It was a great sounding amp, just like it was supposed to sound, you know.

[jetlag]

PSA: I was on Mike Clark's site the other day and noticed that he has many of the amps back up on it. Not sure what that means, but apparently he's still making stuff besides deluxe clones. Another PSA: I saw where he has a pretty good deal on ebay right now - a deluxe chassis (only), complete, but with no tubes for $410 BIN. Maybe a good deal for do-it-yourselfers.

Strato - sounds like a cool amp. I guess that was the one in the Hubert pic that Frank posted here a few months ago? What's in it (power tubes, speakers)?

Hubert's tone and phrasing has always fascinated me.

[btg]

Fretshop - I know Dave, he is out of the Delbert McClinton school of players. There are alot of Fort Worth guys that played with Delbert such as Dave, Steve Bruton, Bill Coleman, Freddie "Little Junior One Hand" Cisneros and James Pennebaker. These guys all cut there teeth on the Jacksboro Highway and in the Bluebird Club in Fort Worth watching guys like Robert Ealey and U.P. Wilson. As a matter of fact Cornell Dupree came out of the Fort Worth scene several years before but is a big influence on these guys. Matter of fact SRV and JLV used to show up and play the Bluebird often. Somewhere, I have a tape of some old T-Birds stuff Jimmie accidently left at Sumters house one night of some unreleased studio sessions some of which came out on Different Tacos years later.

Regarding Alan Haynes - of all the guys who have ever tried to emulate or were accused of emulating SRV you never hear Alan's name. To me he has the same kind of style and feel but with slightly different twist in that he is a Houston guy rather than a Dallas/Austin guy like SRV and was really influenced by Johnny Winter and Joey Long. He is a very underrated player who can blow several big name blues/rock guys out of the water.

That ZuZu Bollin CD is one of my alltime favorites to listen to a great album with a great story behind it. Chuck Nevitt of DBS went to extraordinary lengths to get that record made. ZuZu was a wild cat I have great picture of him hanging at home.

[fretshop]

Posted by btg:

Regarding Alan Haynes - of all the guys who have ever tried to emulate or were accused of emulating SRV you never hear Alan's name. To me he has the same kind of style and feel but with slightly different twist in that he is a Houston guy rather than a Dallas/Austin guy like SRV and was really influenced by Johnny Winter and Joey Long. He is a very underrated player who can blow several big name blues/rock guys out of the water.

That ZuZu Bollin CD is one of my alltime favorites to listen to a great album with a great story behind it. Chuck Nevitt of DBS went to extraordinary lengths to get that record made. ZuZu was a wild cat I have great picture of him hanging at home.

In the Spring 1984, just after Alan's album release, "Alan Haynes & The Step Children", I received a hysterical call from him. He'd returned home from some errands to find his house ransacked...and all his equipment GONE. He lost a great playing early 60's Strat with a Tortoise pick guard and early Di Marzio SDS Strat pups that he just loved, and some great old amps....Steve Blucher and I immediately sent him out a set of custom wound pickups, and Billy Gibbons responded generously by giving Alan a Strat from his personal collection. In a few days...Alan was up and running again. Wayne Bennet guested on that album I mentioned.

Alan's old voice mail song/message : "Leave a message, I can't come to the phone right now"...(repeat) I'm in the shower with a couple a' French girls, and I'm really gettin' down"

IMO: You can hear alot of the Houston/Dallas/Fort Worth influence in both Todd Sharp and Buddy Whitington.

What ever happened to The Blue Bird ? Guitar Gabriel played there too, from what I can remember. Man, he was a wild fella !!!

[btg]

The Blue Bird is open under a new owner, I was going to try to get booked there but I went by there to see Mike Morgan and he had no crowd as had many others I talked to. Seems soul blues is what goes over there now. Last I heard Tutu Jones was playing there every Saturday night.

[pete kanaras]

Guitar Gabriel

oh man i love guitar gabel! one of my all-time faves. i'm a long time excello records freak. been doing "congo mambo" a lot lately, but set to the original groove of "big boy". fun stuff

[fretshop]

Awright awright, enough about the FDP awlready.

I've heard good things about the Juke Jumpers, but have never heard them. Reading their history page, I see that Mike Judge played bass with them for a while. Har! He also played with Hummel in the early 80's; the bass player in my band took over his spot when he left, so I'm three degrees removed from Beavis and Butthead!

Cool Scott,

I recorded with Beavis, (Anson Funderburgh)
I never met Butt Head.


KBR: Do you still have your Reverberocket 2 ? Mine is a late '66 in black tolex...are you running the stock speaker ? Any mods ?

[jetlag]

Guitar Gabriel

oh man i love guitar gabel! one of my all-time faves. i'm a long time excello records freak. been doing "congo mambo" a lot lately, but set to the original groove of "big boy". fun stuff

Anyone ever heard Gable's Gumbo Mambo? I'd love to hear that sometime. File Guitar Gable on the "someone needs to compile his 50's sessions and put it on a single CD" list.

[Scott Miller]

You guys are confusing me. Random Googling reveals that there is a Guitar Gabriel, country blues, and a Guitar Gable, swamp boogie blues. I can't find any Guitar Gabby, though, except for Pahinui.

[Strat-O]

I don't remember that picture you mentioned but I've got several photos of him with one. And, you can see it with him on stage in the 'Howlin Wolf Story' DVD in the Sam Carr home movie segment that he filmed at Sylivio's where Wolf and his band are performing with Sonny #2 and others in the audience watching. He also mentions it in an interview I have, saying he played it until someone borrowed it and blew the 15" speaker...wish I could remember who he said blew it, I'll have to look that up. Its got the leather corners on it. I need a badge/logo to go on the front and am trying to figure out where to get one made. Its supposed to have blue on it, and its the blue part that's tough to get these days.

That's about all I know about the technical part of the amp though. I think its got 6L6 or 5881's in it and the 15 and an 8" speaker. No reverb or tremelo. Sounds killer and has these cool switches on it with all these lights that look like a Christmas tree. When I get the logo done I'll post some photos. The volume is perfect and the sound is along the lines of the Penrose, just not so freakin' loud.

I can't see how folks use late 50's ('59) tweed amps in a typical small club/blues joint. They just have too much headroom for me to use. After reading these TQR interviews with Watson and Holmstrom, its clear that they prefer early to mid 50's lower power tweed amps too for the same reason that I'm talking about.

Anyway, I'm thrilled to have this baby. Hubert Sumlin is a major hero of mine. Just the embodiment of electric blues guitar for me; raw, unpolished and pure blues.

[jetlag]

You guys are confusing me. Random Googling reveals that there is a Guitar Gabriel, country blues, and a Guitar Gable, swamp boogie blues. I can't find any Guitar Gabby, though, except for Pahinui.

Scott, I can understand. I have no idea if Fret meant Guitar Gable or Gabriel - I assumed he meant Gabriel, but Guitar Gabriel was located in GA?? Then Pete ran with Gable, to which I had a comment - the Mambo/Mombo/Rhumba series of instrumentals. Let's confuse things more with this - I believe there were two Guitar Gables - Thomas Gable and Gabriel Perrodin. Kinda like Sonny Boy I and II.

I love Guitar Gable and like to quote some of his solo in "This Should Go On Forever" over "Honest I Do" when Lee calls it - it keeps the band on their toes as the changes are different.

[fretshop]

You guys are confusing me. Random Googling reveals that there is a Guitar Gabriel, country blues, and a Guitar Gable, swamp boogie blues. I can't find any Guitar Gabby, though, except for Pahinui.


It was my mistake...It's Gable, not Gabriel that I should have posted. I had a little of each performer's material. BTW: Gabriel Perrodin was the "Real" Guitar Gabel. Thomas Gabel assumed the name by what Sam Myers described as "unlikely means". Gabriel, on the other hand was a real country blues pioneer, who unfortunately never received the exposure he deserved.

[THINSOCKS]

I don't remember that picture you mentioned but I've got several photos of him with one. And, you can see it with him on stage in the 'Howlin Wolf Story' DVD in the Sam Carr home movie segment that he filmed at Sylivio's where Wolf and his band are performing with Sonny #2 and others in the audience watching. He also mentions it in an interview I have, saying he played it until someone borrowed it and blew the 15" speaker...wish I could remember who he said blew it, I'll have to look that up. Its got the leather corners on it. I need a badge/logo to go on the front and am trying to figure out where to get one made. Its supposed to have blue on it, and its the blue part that's tough to get these days.

That's about all I know about the technical part of the amp though. I think its got 6L6 or 5881's in it and the 15 and an 8" speaker. No reverb or tremelo. Sounds killer and has these cool switches on it with all these lights that look like a Christmas tree. When I get the logo done I'll post some photos. The volume is perfect and the sound is along the lines of the Penrose, just not so freakin' loud.

I can't see how folks use late 50's ('59) tweed amps in a typical small club/blues joint. They just have too much headroom for me to use. After reading these TQR interviews with Watson and Holmstrom, its clear that they prefer early to mid 50's lower power tweed amps too for the same reason that I'm talking about.

Anyway, I'm thrilled to have this baby. Hubert Sumlin is a major hero of mine. Just the embodiment of electric blues guitar for me; raw, unpolished and pure blues.

This amp?
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/frankiethetut/IMG_4437.jpg

[KBR]

Yo George,

I am selling my 66 RR 2, I hate to, but I have to.
I got a Weber 12F150 (C12N) 50 watter and it was 3 times louder than the Emminence P12R type. Not good if you goin for dist O, 50's stuff, but I like Clean, also.
Ampeg makes a great old Amp, but they scare me when goin to Gigs, they rattle like a MOFO...
Me, I like this Allen Brown Sugar cathode Biased 30 watt Head w/ Verb and I just got back my old `1x15 Brown tolex Pine Cab, or I can go w 2 P12Ns, an awesome tone, IMO.
The Allens have a Raw control you can dial in some Tweed.
I want a 3x10 Cab next and a Bandmaster Head, 2 bad discs makes Piggy Back Amps work best for me, Hell I'm 56, soon 57. (1/11/50)

A P12N ought to be good in the Rocket, but the C12N wails in it.
Merry Christmas to all Blues Men & Women.

[fretshop]

Yo George,

I am selling my 66 RR 2, I hate to, but I have to.
I got a Weber 12F150 (C12N) 50 watter and it was 3 times louder than the Emminence P12R type. Not good if you goin for dist O, 50's stuff, but I like Clean, also.
Ampeg makes a great old Amp, but they scare me when goin to Gigs, they rattle like a MOFO...
Me, I like this Allen Brown Sugar cathode Biased 30 watt Head w/ Verb and I just got back my old `1x15 Brown tolex Pine Cab, or I can go w 2 P12Ns, an awesome tone, IMO.
The Allens have a Raw control you can dial in some Tweed.
I want a 3x10 Cab next and a Bandmaster Head, 2 bad discs makes Piggy Back Amps work best for me, Hell I'm 56, soon 57. (1/11/50)

A P12N ought to be good in the Rocket, but the C12N wails in it.
Merry Christmas to all Blues Men & Women.

Does the C12N have a better sweet spot? The P-12 is just a tad more efficient than the C12Q that came stock. The Rocket is LOUD....and has a real greasy 50's Chicago tone to it...it's awesome for a big fat, clean harp tone as well, but I'm having trouble using it in small club situations.
I haven't been able to find a C12 Q that isn't beat to S**t.

All the best,

G-Man

[btg]

What string guages are ya'll using on your ES-5's and archtops. Any particular preference for brand. Wound or unwound G strings.

[Dave Orban]

Does the C12N have a better sweet spot? The P-12 is just a tad more efficient than the C12Q that came stock. The Rocket is LOUD....and has a real greasy 50's Chicago tone to it...it's awesome for a big fat, clean harp tone as well, but I'm having trouble using it in small club situations.
I haven't been able to find a C12 Q that isn't beat to S**t.

All the best,

G-ManGeorge, have you ever tried putting something in front of the amp to block the beaminess...? I sometimes use my drummer's hard-shell cymbal case right in front of my amp. Lets me crank it a bit more, without alienating the owner/patrons...

[Dave Orban]

What string guages are ya'll using on your ES-5's and archtops. Any particular preference for brand. Wound or unwound G strings.
I'm typically using 13-56 on my 175. Sometimes a plain 20 on the G, otherwise it's a wound 26...

[jimfog]

without alienating the owner/patrons...

Ummm...isn't that our job???

One of my first gigs, I remember loading our gear into a PACKED fancy /fern bar, and commenting to our crusty old seen-it-all bass player......"Wow....nice crowd tonight"

He shrugged......"No worries....we'll take of THAT problem once we start."

:BEER

- Jim

[Strat-O]

Thinsocks? Hi there! That is the one!:BEER

KBR - That sounds like a cool rig...the cathode biased Brown Sugar head with the raw control and all. 6V6's would probably be about right volume wise. It has a tone control for the reverb eh? Can it get the cool west coast reverb tone?

[jetlag]

Strato - your maggie sounds way cool. That's a great configuration. Must have cost Hubert a lotta coin back then.

What I've noticed is that old tweeds seem to break up a little earlier and they compress a little more than alot of the repro counterparts. While this helps keep the volume down, you make a good point. With small rooms (or light winter crowds) it's hard to get away with cranking a narrow panel pro.

[RickyKing]

I have a 12" Naylor in my 60's RR-2.
Works great!
I use D'add. xl115 on my ES 350.
In the trio setting the 12's & 13's were too much work over the corse of the night...

[KBR]

STRAT-0

The 6V6s are also Very Good, The Verb has 2 knobs, My Man.
Reverb & Tone...i Like 50's original Tung Sols or RCA Blackplate 6L6GCs...Tone For Days.

[musicofanatic5]

What string guages are ya'll using on your ES-5's and archtops. Any particular preference for brand. Wound or unwound G strings.

I use the same strings on all my electric gtrs: GHS Burnished Nickle (#BNRM), .011-.050., unwound G.

[mikelaw]

amen jon!

[RickyKing]

Yea Jon, I like those too espically on a Fender!

[mikelaw]

i have a set for eric im trying to turn him onto them. i recently put them on my h44 and we played last week... just amazing noticeably different tone, not to mention the feel too!!! with these now and my recent teachings from eric to throttle jockey the tone knob alot i think ill be using my h44 alot more LIVE now! i swear most of that is the strings though! :)

but like jon says...dont tell TOO many people about them.

[HappyValley]

What string guages are ya'll using on your ES-5's and archtops. Any particular preference for brand. Wound or unwound G strings.

Hi Boys...been a prolific week on TGP!

Any how, I use GHS 11-52 set on all my guitars, incl. the ES-5.

As far as the '59 vs. earlier tweed thing for clubs , it depends on a number of factors IMHO. I have a Clark '59 Bandmaster (Tyger) and had the 2x10 Pro/Super Holmstrom amp and they both sounded great, but the Tyger has much more versatility and doesn't heat up as much. The BEST small club rig I've ever owned is my blonde Pro Jr. - Warm, low maintenance, low volume, but decent headroom....mic' it if you need to.

[zappafrank]

OK guys---


My New (to me) toy.....

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h271/64strat/106_0694.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h271/64strat/106_0696.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h271/64strat/106_0695.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h271/64strat/107_0701.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h271/64strat/106_0700.jpg

http://i66.photobucket.com/albums/h271/64strat/106_0699.jpg


Fully refinned, otherwise all ORIGINAL (spent half the day getting this verified for sure at different guitar gurus..)--possible repair at the jack, per the gurus---

1955 Gibson ES-350

Lawd hep me---I got a ter'ble addiction!!!:crazy

Now---time to sell some gear---!!!:eek:

ac

[zappafrank]

PS---there is no 'red ring' on the actual guitar---just a nice 'burst---

ac

[dukeh62]

Good god almighty AC......good god almighty.

Is that the one that was in the Emporium last week???

Congrats.

[HappyValley]

Lawdy Miss Clawdy.......what a great looking '350!! Congratulations!!! In all seriousness, there is nothing more artistically and aesthetically beautiful than a well preserved Gibson archtop.........besides vintage Marilyn Monroe nudies...
But I digress.... Enjoy it!

[jetlag]

AC, that's a beautiful guitar! They sure did a nice refin on it, it looks great! The pickups look nice 'n high too, bet it sounds great. I'm not sure what is nicer, your yard or the guitar!

BTG - I use a 12-54 set on my boxes but usually sub an unwound G. Lately I've been trying these Newtone/Burns strings that are just about like pyramids but $5 a set less.

[zappafrank]

AC, that's a beautiful guitar! They sure did a nice refin on it, it looks great! The pickups look nice 'n high too, bet it sounds great. I'm not sure what is nicer, your yard or the guitar!

BTG - I use a 12-54 set on my boxes but usually sub an unwound G. Lately I've been trying these Newtone/Burns strings that are just about like pyramids but $5 a set less.


jetlag...I don't really HAVE a yard---I live in an apartment---as I have all my life!---the pics were taken by the guy who sold it to me---HE'S got a nice yard!---and a collection of ridiculously outrageous archtops---good player of the jazz, as well--

Eric---yep---same one as in the Emporium---sold my Clark Reverb/Trem, raided the savings, ate tuna for 2 weeks and saved most of a paycheck, put some on a CC, and there I was!---I'm just weak---that's all!

Thanks for the comments guys!---I'll write more later---

all this talk about strings---I use E. Ball .11 -.49 gauge---THIS guitar needs something new---I Like the GHS suggestion from Jon---I'll look for those---the EB's on all guitars has just been for less hassle, and it works great so far---how do the GHS compare???

[musicofanatic5]

Pretty groovy! '55 is the second to last year before they squished it down to the thin-line, short scale 350T. Interesting how the back of the peghead is 'bursted; they're usually black. I always thought it curious how the earlier three-knob 350's had the p.u.s closer together, and when it went four-knob, the p.u.s were relocated right up against the end of the fingerboard and bridge. Wonder what precipitated the re-spec'ing? They relocated the p.u. on the L.P. jr. after a coupla years of production, too. Sonic considerations? Cost-cutting measure? Who knows what level of genius motivated the Ted McCarty braintrust? Time to put some milage on that gtr! Have fun.

[jimfog]

Hey kids,

Here's a cool jazzy blues chord lick I was showing one of my students the other day......lifted from Ron Eschte. Dig those sliding 13th chords, and how the different inversions resolve. Hip!

- jim

Cool chord Lick - Audio (http://www.jimfogarty.com/sale/chord%20lick.mp3)

http://www.jimfogarty.com/sale/chord%20lick.jpg

[fretshop]

A.C.

I'm awestruck. What a treasure !!! My God, it must sound delicious !!!

Although I like the versatility of an ES-5, the ES-350 was the guitar that I've lusted over. Not that I wouldn't like to have both.

[fretshop]

George, have you ever tried putting something in front of the amp to block the beaminess...? I sometimes use my drummer's hard-shell cymbal case right in front of my amp. Lets me crank it a bit more, without alienating the owner/patrons...

Dave,

I'm just bummed. My '66 RR2 is factory mint and has marvelous tone, but it surprized the heck out of both Carlos and me at sound check the other night. With the volume on 3, it had already over powered the rest of the band, so I shoved it in the corner and fired up the Jet. I'm gonna try it out in a less lively room and see what happens. Other wise, I'll drop it off at the studio and have Arnie E-Bay it out. I'm sure, as stunning as the amp is cosmetically and tonally, somebody will snap it up. Before you arrived at the club, I warmed up with Roy Buchannan's version of "Sweet Dreams", and then an old crowd pleaser "Jeff's Boogie" (Jeff Beck) using the Tele and the RR2....the touch sensitivity was awesome and it sustained forever, but Walter immediately bitched at me about the volume level.

[zappafrank]

A.C.

I'm awestruck. What a treasure !!! My God, it must sound delicious !!!

Although I like the versatility of an ES-5, the ES-350 was the guitar that I've lusted over. Not that I wouldn't like to have both.

ya know---i'm here at work, looking at other 350 pics, and TwoFeets earlier one has a much more pronounced deep-carve, where the 'dish' of the top flows down into the binding---hmmm---mine is very shallow, and subtle---i like that 'depth' on TwoFeets--Take a look at mine and TwoFeets and compare---

Plus, he has a lot more flame on the neck---hmmm...what do ya think George---is that common that a 55 would be a bit less 'dished' and flamey?---and I'm pretty sure when they did the refin, the should NOT have 'bursted the back of the headstock---oh well


Oh, and mine has a laminate SPRUCE top, which is odd---I've heard of/seen a couple SOLID Spruce tops, but never laminate----curious---

whaddya think George (and others)---still kosher to you?

ac

[fretshop]

[quote=zappafrank;1889559]ya know---i'm here at work, looking at other 350 pics, and TwoFeets earlier one has a much more pronounced deep-carve, where the 'dish' of the top flows down into the binding---hmmm---mine is very shallow, and subtle---i like that 'depth' on TwoFeets--Take a look at mine and TwoFeets and compare---

Plus, he has a lot more flame on the neck---hmmm...what do ya think George---is that common that a 55 would be a bit less 'dished' and flamey?---and I'm pretty sure when they did the refin, the should NOT have 'bursted the back of the headstock---oh well


Oh, and mine has a laminate SPRUCE top, which is odd---I've heard of/seen a couple SOLID Spruce tops, but never laminate----curious---

For a mid 50's model, Yep, it's fine. I've seen some natural 350's from around the model's introductory period where the wood quality was spectacular, and the top contours were a bit curvier. Acoustically and action wise, some played way better than others. And...I've had some real show pieces in here that were absolute boat anchors. If it plays well and responds well both acoustically and electronically....take a deep breath and thank God its yours.

The finish work is excellent. BTW, most finishers don't adhere to "exact" period specifications....even a factory Mojo custom shop, blessed by the Pope restoration can be surprizingly "off".

[pete kanaras]

Other wise, I'll drop it off at the studio and have Arnie E-Bay it out.

gee george you just got it! it sounds like a perfect amp for when you've got a bigger stage or some bodies in the room. ya don't find 'em that clean often. but, if you're gonna cut it loose i may be interested by around february. always wanted one of those...

[zappafrank]

For a mid 50's model, Yep, it's fine. I've seen some natural 350's from around the model's introductory period where the wood quality was spectacular, and the top contours were a bit curvier. Acoustically and action wise, some played way better than others. And...I've had some real show pieces in here that were absolute boat anchors. If it plays well and responds well both acoustically and electronically....take a deep breath and thank God its yours.

The finish work is excellent. BTW, most finishers don't adhere to "exact" period specifications....even a factory Mojo custom shop, blessed by the Pope restoration can be surprizingly "off".

Oh believe me, I'm very grateful!---I just always obsess over things when I plunk out that kinda dinero---I appreciate your insight a LOT!

It is no boat anchor at all!---Very light, actually---I was surprised! It seems to be very responsive, but I can tell it's used to more 'manly' strings and flatwounds---I'll have to do some experimenting with strings --all recommendations welcome---I'm still basically a roundwound guy, though---I'll track down the GHS strings that a bunch of you folks have mentioned---this one needs something more special than Ernie Balls!

ac

[TwoFeets]

Pretty groovy! '55 is the second to last year before they squished it down to the thin-line, short scale 350T. Interesting how the back of the peghead is 'bursted; they're usually black. I always thought it curious how the earlier three-knob 350's had the p.u.s closer together, and when it went four-knob, the p.u.s were relocated right up against the end of the fingerboard and bridge. Wonder what precipitated the re-spec'ing? They relocated the p.u. on the L.P. jr. after a coupla years of production, too. Sonic considerations? Cost-cutting measure? Who knows what level of genius motivated the Ted McCarty braintrust? Time to put some milage on that gtr! Have fun.

I've been looking at ES350's for a long time now and I've noticed the same differences in the pickup location; however I didn't notice a pattern between three knob and four knobs. I've seen three knobbers with the neck pickup right at the end of the board too (Bay State Vintage had one like that for a while I think). I've asked a few dealers about the same thing including Joe at archtop.com and they said the same thing, they thought maybe it was up to whoever happened to be working on that particular day that the holes were routed. An interesting bit of miscellany for sure!

[TwoFeets]

Oh believe me, I'm very grateful!---I just always obsess over things when I plunk out that kinda dinero---I appreciate your insight a LOT!

It is no boat anchor at all!---Very light, actually---I was surprised! It seems to be very responsive, but I can tell it's used to more 'manly' strings and flatwounds---I'll have to do some experimenting with strings --all recommendations welcome---I'm still basically a roundwound guy, though---I'll track down the GHS strings that a bunch of you folks have mentioned---this one needs something more special than Ernie Balls!

ac

You know, I've had really good luck with the Power Slinky's myself. Gibson shipped my 350 back with a 12's set with a wound 3rd string but it's a light wound third and I kind of like this set on this guitar.

[fretshop]

Oh believe me, I'm very grateful!---I just always obsess over things when I plunk out that kinda dinero---I appreciate your insight a LOT!

It is no boat anchor at all!---Very light, actually---I was surprised! It seems to be very responsive, but I can tell it's used to more 'manly' strings and flatwounds---I'll have to do some experimenting with strings --all recommendations welcome---I'm still basically a roundwound guy, though---I'll track down the GHS strings that a bunch of you folks have mentioned---this one needs something more special than Ernie Balls!

ac

AC: Why did I use the term boat anchor ? I've been on duty since before 6:00AM and I'm fried already. What I meant was "Dud", like in dead. Some of those guitars were more "lively" than others and played better. They are getting rarer every day, so If you got a good one...take good care of it. You'll probably go nuts trying to find another one. Those guitars were designed to be used with the popular strings of the day. ...need I say more ? I can't play with 12's all night...so 11's would be my choice, and I'd go with the GHS Burnished Nickels. Arnie and I have used the Burnished Nickels on and off for session work. We both just discussed the topic and feel that they seem to go dead quicker than regular formula strings, although they have a tremendous tonal quality.

[mikelaw]

11's burnished nickel--ghs. the bombs!!!!!! i also use ghs flats on my 51 precision, ronnie james and jeff berg turned me onto them....amazing! im convinced ghs makes the best strings for the money.

the burnished have a slightly polished feel on the wound strings and a tiny core for more tone! they feel great and sound better! not like THEY need more money, i just think they do things the old school way. the right way!

[Dave Orban]

11's burnished nickel--ghs. the bombs!!!!!! i also use ghs flats on my 51 precision, ronnie james and jeff berg turned me onto them....amazing! im convinced ghs makes the best strings for the money.

the burnished have a slightly polished feel on the wound strings and a tiny core for more tone! they feel great and sound better! not like THEY need more money, i just think they do things the old school way. the right way!I've had a set of D'addario 13-56 half-rounds on my 175 for the last month or so. Prior to that, I'd always used round-wounds, which I think I prefer. I'm going to change them back over before Friday night's gig.

The problem with flats, for me at least, is switching back and forth between the 175 and the Tele during gigs, the flats just don't "slide" the same way under my left hand, and it's a bit disconcerting to me... The half-rounds help to mitigate that a bit, but I still think I prefer the rounds, which just "feel" better and also give me a bit more "ring" on the wound strings (which I can always dial-out, if I want to...)

[jetlag]

They relocated the p.u. on the L.P. jr. after a coupla years of production, too. Sonic considerations? Cost-cutting measure? Who knows what level of genius motivated the Ted McCarty braintrust? Time to put some milage on that gtr! Have fun.

In early '56 gibson deepened the tp post anchors to stop the tp from leaning. At the same time they moved the pickup forward to stop the stress cracks you commonly see running from the high E-side post to the pickup on the '54 and '55 guitars. With the 350's, who knows? Obviously it had nothing to do with the cracks in the juniors and specials.

AC, I wouldn't sweat the details on your new ride. Back then, gibson didn't have CNC machines, just master craftsmen. So enjoy! If you decide you need to phase flip on this guitar, Fretshop was worked out a cool pickguard mini-switch arrangement that you might consider.

Jimfog - I hate it when stuff like this is posted and I don't have a guitar available. The sound clip was beautiful. Thanks.

[jetlag]

With all of this golden era at Gibson talk, I thought it was a good time to post this:

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g237/jetlagslim/Gibson_lg-1.jpg

[Scott Miller]

Bitchen picture! No dust-control system, though. Poor guys. Man, now I feel guilty about my old archtops. Coming soon to a theater near you: diCrappio in "Blood Guitars."

Currently listening to Piazza's Live in 1975. The rhythm section knocks me out, Taylor and Innes. A classic example of that West Coast choppy-yet-swingy beat. You can swing and fly with it, but you can also dig in hard. Thank God for the bass players and drummers who know how to do that.

[Dave Orban]

Thank God for the bass players and drummers who know how to do that.Amen to that. We just started working with a drummer who REALLY "gets it", and it's a real pleasure...!

[Poppa Stoppa]

Twofeets, AC, those are two of the most fabulous guitars ever...congratulations!

Jimfog, thanks for that very cool chord lick. Very nice cool jazzy thing, could develop those ideas...

Re Strings, I have a question - at the risk of sounding ignorant - how much nickel is there in any of these 'nickel' strings? I bought some green Pyramids, only to see that the top three are just normal steel flash-coated with silver - & they sound no different from standard modern steel strings. The bass strings are nickel wound however and do sound different. Are GHS, snake oils or any of the others on the market radically different in the top 3 of the set?

Re pickup placement, I've been thinking lately 'nearer the neck = more string movement and less treble = more output, more badass archtop tone'. Maybe that's a slight over simplification...I also like the sound of a bridge pickup that's not too close to the bridge for similar reasons. You get cut but with a sweeter raunch.

[TwoFeets]

Are GHS, snake oils or any of the others on the market radically different in the top 3 of the set?



I believe Snake Oils are the only ones that are really nickel. There are articles out there and you can also throw an email I think the fella's name is Dean Farley.
An article about Snake Oils:

http://www.guitarplayer.com/story.asp?sectioncode=6&storycode=16272

Honestly I found little tonal difference but others swear by them. To me they were "just strings."

[valcotone]

Re pickup placement, I've been thinking lately 'nearer the neck = more string movement and less treble = more output, more badass archtop tone'. Maybe that's a slight over simplification...



Poppa - Maybe that's why Junior Watson moved the neck pickup in his duo-H44-Stratotone right up close to the neck? Hmmm....


AC - Absolutely stunning guitar! Congrats!

[btg]

I ordered some Snakeoils yesterday for my ES-5 a set of 11' and a set of 12's. I am going to try some of the GHS burnished nickels and will let you know how they work out.

[aja]

That Piazza cd makes my mouth water. So good.

[jetlag]

Junior moved the front pickup up by the neck because he feels it makes his strato sound more like an archtop when on the front pickup.

The snake oils sounded nice and were fine, but I didn't think they really lasted any longer than anything else. They did feel a little bit nicer than "normal strings" but just incrementally so. I liked the pyramids alot better if you're intent on buying expensive strings. To be fair, I think the pyramids are ~$3 more than the SOBs. Hell, I'm happy using those gibson vintage reissue pure nickel strings or those GHS rollerwound nickels. I tried those burnished ones a LONG time ago and the stuff I got had this rough finish to it. They had more friction and grabbed your fingers kind of like phosphorus/bronze acoustic guitar strings. Sounds like they aren't like that now? Or maybe they were mislabelled?

Regarding nickel content, I thought it was like this : if strings say "nickel wound" they are nickel plated steel, if they say "pure nickel" then they are just that. Or at least as close to pure nickel as it comes these days.

All this archtop talk is making me miss my ES5 (even though I never played it). I sold it to a good friend last year:


http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g237/jetlagslim/ES5top_small.jpg

[Strat-O]

Damn you guys have some nice guitars! I'm the pieces and parts guitar man. Except the for the H62.

[musicofanatic5]

Thank God for the bass players and drummers who know how to do that.

Yeah, all six of 'em. Why don't the rest of 'em get it?!?

[THINSOCKS]

Yeah, all six of 'em. Why don't the rest of 'em get it?!?

To bad you can't play bass and drums at the same time, Jon.

~ Frank

[Schwalbe]

Yeah, all six of 'em. Why don't the rest of 'em get it?!?I've tried to work on that...for years. I believe it's the reason half my hair is gone.

[THINSOCKS]

Alright, since we are talking ES-5's and 350's. Here's my 1950 ES-5.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/frankiethetut/IMG_4993.jpg

[zappafrank]

Alright, since we are talking ES-5's and 350's. Here's my 1950 ES-5.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/frankiethetut/IMG_4993.jpg

WOW!---Very, Very nice!!! BEAUTIFUL top!!

Tell us more, THINSOCKS---and BTW, welcome to the best thread on the TGP for hard core blues fans---

---and very cool to see the Crayton Crown album peaking out back there...


Thanks for all the nice comments, guys----hmmm---it's always 'guys' on this thread---where are all the beautiful women out there playing West Coast-style Blues guitar and harp?------I mean, c'mon!!:crazy

ac

[zappafrank]

I have to admit---I DO like the no-switch, 2 or 3 volumes/Master tone thing a lot---but I can get used to the switch thing on mine, I'm sure--

I'll have to hit up George 'bout that phase switch on the 'guard thing---

ac

[TwoFeets]

Gigged mine for the first time tonight. Going to take a little while to dial in and get used to but it's got great tone, that's for sure.

[THINSOCKS]

Zappafrank - Thanks for the welcome, but I've actually been on here for awhile now. My old profile use to be "Jankety". I recently deleted it and created a new one. ~ Frank

[jimfog]

Thanks for all the nice comments, guys----hmmm---it's always 'guys' on this thread---where are all the beautiful women out there playing West Coast-style Blues guitar and harp?------I mean, c'mon!!:crazy

AC,

She may not play guitar or harp.....but here's the singer and leader of my band "Melissa Martin and the Mighty Rhythm Kings". She's all you could ask for in a "chick singer"......great vocalist....nice person.......good-looking......and MOST importantly, she books the gigs AND helps load the gear!!! (sorry boys, she's married! lol) - Jim

http://www.mightyrhythmkings.com/images/live_jm.jpg

[jetlag]

I have to admit---I DO like the no-switch, 2 or 3 volumes/Master tone thing a lot---but I can get used to the switch thing on mine, I'm sure--

I'll have to hit up George 'bout that phase switch on the 'guard thing---

ac

AC, there you go dissin' your new guitar again. 4 knob + switch arrangement is just fine. It lets you do the Robert Junior both pickup thing (which you can't really do with the 3 knob setup).

Jezzus Frank, the quilt flame on that thang ....................

[musicofanatic5]

To bad you can't play bass and drums at the same time, Jon.

~ Frank
No one could afford me!

[Scott Miller]

Here's my boss, Amy Lou:

http://www.amylousblues.com/picture_library/amy_mojo_kbr.jpg

[DonM]

Hey guys,
I got an Eastwood Strat0tone here.. Black two pickup..

those pups are actually KILLER -- loud and Hot --about 16-17k Firebird mini humbuckers.. with Good quality Alnico 5 magnets..
actually In there own way they kinda mimic what those Stratotones can do.. Its a fun guitar to use just as is.. there COOOOL!

But we can't resist playing Mr. Potato Head with ours here..

So I'm winding some experiments for Junior & Ricks Eastwood Stratotones..
first is going to be like a non potted mini filterTron 4k & 5K on 100k pots to see if I cannot get that 3.5k 50k pot Vintage Strat0tone sound but minius the hum..

The wood on the Black one here sounds super good and it really does have a natural Strat0tone sound resonating from it, and just the feel of these things in your hands sorta evokes all that cool stuff all these artist are doing on them.. ya sorta catch the spirt of the thing if ya know what I mean?

The goal here is to convert Ricks and Juniors over to what may become a more expensive top of the line signiture Watson/Holmstrom model Strat0tone

[zappafrank]

Gigged mine for the first time tonight. Going to take a little while to dial in and get used to but it's got great tone, that's for sure.

I took mine out for a spin tonite, too---and exactly as you said---I have to dial it in, too---

I used the Rambler on 14 watts, and I KNOW this thing is begging for tweed and a Premier tank-----It is dictating me right now---will take me a while to lord over IT---But, those tones are ALL THERE!!!

ac

[zappafrank]

Zappafrank - Thanks for the welcome, but I've actually been on here for awhile now. My old profile use to be "Jankety". I recently deleted it and created a new one. ~ Frank

Aww, crap---now I feel dumb---love your new name---and THINSOCKS, you have some of the most eclectic music knowledge of anyone I've ever (met?) heard, read, whatever---right up there with good old Jack Cook, of The Phantoms of Soul fame---thanks for sharing it all with us! Now---tell me more about that ES-5...

And jetlag---why, oh why, did you sell that one???---it's gorgeous too!---You never played it? how come?

BTW, jammed with J. Bott and Paris Slim (Frank Goldwasser) at my old gig tonight (Stein Haus/The Haus Kats)---and had some kinda fun w/ that 350---and Fred, (Goldenstrat)---Tom H. was there too---we talked a bit, but not enough!--he had a cool little recorder---I wanted to ask more 'bout it, but maybe next time---he's a super nice dude---I owe him a couple beers by now--

ac

[zappafrank]

AC, there you go dissin' your new guitar again. 4 knob + switch arrangement is just fine. It lets you do the Robert Junior both pickup thing (which you can't really do with the 3 knob setup).

Jezzus Frank, the quilt flame on that thang ....................

Well---sorry to sound like I'm dissin'---I'm very happy---just always liked that earlier setup, 'cause of my friend's ES-5 and another friend's 350---

Can you explain what you mean by the 'Robert Jr' thing??? Is there a certain middle switch position and tone/volume adjustment that's cool I need to be schooled about???

and yep---that quilt flame is :eek:

ac

[zappafrank]

DonM!!!!

Your pickups in my parts tele is a true awakening for me re: the Telecaster---THANK YOU!!!!!!!

I have yet to have anyone compliment my tone as much as they have with those pickups you re-wound in this tele---just awesome---no jive...they LIVE for tweed!!!

THANK YOU!!!

ac

[zappafrank]

No one could afford me!

LOL!!!---Jon, I hope I get to meet you when you are in PDX next Thursday (after I see Zappa Plays Zappa;) ) ---I'll be there after 11pm, maybe closer to Midnite, if at all possible---I'll be the eh-hem...LARGE guy with the short hair---hopefully sober (I will be---for awhile)---I'd love to hear you play---call me when you get to town---

ac

[Poppa Stoppa]

Hey guys,
I got an Eastwood Strat0tone here...Black two pickup...So I'm winding some experiments for Junior & Ricks Eastwood Stratotones...The goal here is to convert Ricks and Juniors over to what may become a more expensive top of the line signiture Watson/Holmstrom model Strat0toneSounds interesting Don! On the last page I was ruminating about the best place to position the pickups, and Skilback & Jetlag chimed in and said Junior had moved the pickup on his towards the neck to get a better archtop tone. Are you gonna be changing the position of the pickups at all for Junior and Rick?

[Dave Orban]

Hey guys,
I got an Eastwood Strat0tone here.. Black two pickup..

those pups are actually KILLER -- loud and Hot --about 16-17k Firebird mini humbuckers.. with Good quality Alnico 5 magnets..
actually In there own way they kinda mimic what those Stratotones can do.. Its a fun guitar to use just as is.. there COOOOL!

But we can't resist playing Mr. Potato Head with ours here..

So I'm winding some experiments for Junior & Ricks Eastwood Stratotones..
first is going to be like a non potted mini filterTron 4k & 5K on 100k pots to see if I cannot get that 3.5k 50k pot Vintage Strat0tone sound but minius the hum..

The wood on the Black one here sounds super good and it really does have a natural Strat0tone sound resonating from it, and just the feel of these things in your hands sorta evokes all that cool stuff all these artist are doing on them.. ya sorta catch the spirt of the thing if ya know what I mean?

The goal here is to convert Ricks and Juniors over to what may become a more expensive top of the line signiture Watson/Holmstrom model Strat0toneCool! Keep us posted! :dude

[fretshop]

I have to admit---I DO like the no-switch, 2 or 3 volumes/Master tone thing a lot---but I can get used to the switch thing on mine, I'm sure--

I'll have to hit up George 'bout that phase switch on the 'guard thing---

ac

At least one P-90 must be rewired so that hot and ground are separate leads...not the typical arrangement where the ground lead is soldered to the outside shielding on the hot lead. The old lead has to be discarded, and two new leads carefully soldered to the hot and ground wires coming out of the pickup. A third lead should be soldered onto a Sta-Kon clip or a retainer clip that can be attached to one of the screws holding the metal plate on to the pickup's underside. You'll be able to get O-O-P, AND O-O-P in series, whatever you prefer. If you're not VERY experienced with a soldering pencil (no more than 15-20 watts for this application), have a pro do it. The leads coming off the pickup are old, short and fragile...kinda like my...

If any one wants a copy of my bracket and switch set up, I can fax it to you. I don't have a scanner, so I can't make a document out of the diagram. E-Mail me.

I've got an F-hole switch in NC slim's H-62 (appeared in the Junior Tone Quest Report...the black H-62 at the fountain).

[Stringmaster]

Thanks for the input Don--are you talking about Eastwood producing a Jr/Holmes model, or your outfit modding the stock Eastwood to those specs?

Just picked up the limited ed. Road Tested v.1 CD from Delta Groove--buy it before they're gone!!
DD

[Stringmaster]

Since we're sharing archtop pics--here's my old faithful. I've owned this longer than any other guitar--and I've been through a lot!! It's a 1954 Guild X550 (my birth year guitar). Had her since the early '80's. I love the pickups--kind of an underwound P90--lots of twang when needed--pretty much a do-all guitar for me.
DD
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/2541/guild1um5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[TwoFeets]

I took mine out for a spin tonite, too---and exactly as you said---I have to dial it in, too---

I used the Rambler on 14 watts, and I KNOW this thing is begging for tweed and a Premier tank-----It is dictating me right now---will take me a while to lord over IT---But, those tones are ALL THERE!!!

ac


I used it with the usual tank and 5E5-A setup. I think Gibson set it up with 12's. It has a wound 3rd on it. Playability wise it felt a little stiff. I'm going to swap out for my usual set of strings (EB Power Slinkys, 11's). The wound 3rd was throwing me off because I'd forgotten how much it affects the volume output of that string.

I've also got to figure out a way to bring up the bridge pickup volume-wise. Probably need to get it up closer to the strings. You can set your amp up so everything is fine with the neck pickup but when you switch to the bridge there's a significant difference. How do you guys with ES5's and things combat that? An extra spacer under the bridge pickup? Last night I jacked up the amp volume, and just backed the guitar volume off when I would go to the neck pickup, but then you lose some of the neck pickup's character.

Maybe I'm just spoiled because I've been playing guitars with bridge P90's overwound by about 15% over the neck pickup to compensate for this.

[TwoFeets]

Since we're sharing archtop pics--here's my old faithful. I've owned this longer than any other guitar--and I've been through a lot!! It's a 1954 Guild X550 (my birth year guitar). Had her since the early '80's. I love the pickups--kind of an underwound P90--lots of twang when needed--pretty much a do-all guitar for me.
DD
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/2541/guild1um5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Those Guilds are purty. I had a 59 X175 for a while.

[TwoFeets]

Hey guys,
I got an Eastwood Strat0tone here.. Black two pickup..

those pups are actually KILLER -- loud and Hot --about 16-17k Firebird mini humbuckers.. with Good quality Alnico 5 magnets..
actually In there own way they kinda mimic what those Stratotones can do.. Its a fun guitar to use just as is.. there COOOOL!

But we can't resist playing Mr. Potato Head with ours here..

So I'm winding some experiments for Junior & Ricks Eastwood Stratotones..
first is going to be like a non potted mini filterTron 4k & 5K on 100k pots to see if I cannot get that 3.5k 50k pot Vintage Strat0tone sound but minius the hum..

The wood on the Black one here sounds super good and it really does have a natural Strat0tone sound resonating from it, and just the feel of these things in your hands sorta evokes all that cool stuff all these artist are doing on them.. ya sorta catch the spirt of the thing if ya know what I mean?

The goal here is to convert Ricks and Juniors over to what may become a more expensive top of the line signiture Watson/Holmstrom model Strat0tone

Would it work to rip the guts out of one of the black hollow Stratotones with the same looking pickups as the H44's and stick the whole shebang in the Eastwood version?

[fretshop]

Since we're sharing archtop pics--here's my old faithful. I've owned this longer than any other guitar--and I've been through a lot!! It's a 1954 Guild X550 (my birth year guitar). Had her since the early '80's. I love the pickups--kind of an underwound P90--lots of twang when needed--pretty much a do-all guitar for me.
DD
http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/2541/guild1um5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

EVERYHING as Gibson is ...and MORE !!!!

[Dave Orban]

Alright, since I'm seeing all these cool archtops, here's mine for anyone who hasn't seen it. It's a '53 175, and it's hands-down the best guitar I've ever played! I've had it for about 5 years now, and it is my main gigger.

http://oydesign.com/gypsies/pictures/53es175case3.jpg

[fretshop]

I used it with the usual tank and 5E5-A setup. I think Gibson set it up with 12's. It has a wound 3rd on it. Playability wise it felt a little stiff. I'm going to swap out for my usual set of strings (EB Power Slinkys, 11's). The wound 3rd was throwing me off because I'd forgotten how much it affects the volume output of that string.

I've also got to figure out a way to bring up the bridge pickup volume-wise. Probably need to get it up closer to the strings. You can set your amp up so everything is fine with the neck pickup but when you switch to the bridge there's a significant difference. How do you guys with ES5's and things combat that? An extra spacer under the bridge pickup? Last night I jacked up the amp volume, and just backed the guitar volume off when I would go to the neck pickup, but then you lose some of the neck pickup's character.

Maybe I'm just spoiled because I've been playing guitars with bridge P90's overwound by about 15% over the neck pickup to compensate for this.

You can buy P-90 spacers at Allparts

[TwoFeets]

You can buy P-90 spacers at Allparts

I actually have a set at home already that I bought for a previous guitar but never used. Thing is there's already a spacer under the bridge pup, it's just still not high enough.

[pete kanaras]

An extra spacer under the bridge pickup?

bingo. riasing the polepieces ups the output slightly and gives an a edgy thinner tone, but raising the whole pickup ups the output while keeping it fat sounding.

[fretshop]

I actually have a set at home already that I bought for a previous guitar but never used. Thing is there's already a spacer under the bridge pup, it's just still not high enough.

Keep going until the bridge pickup balances with the neck pup.

Keep the pole piece screws adjusted as close to the bobbin as possible. Re: old P-90s : Raise the High E and B string screw slightly higher than the rest.

[Strat-O]

Don - Ooh, la, la, that sounds great. Nice to know Eastwood did a pretty good job putting it out in the first place.

[Dave Orban]

An extra spacer under the bridge pickup?

bingo. riasing the polepieces ups the output slightly and gives an a edgy thinner tone, but raising the whole pickup ups the output while keeping it fat sounding.
I have the oversized thick plastic spacer PLUS two of the thinner ones under my bridge pickup.

[TwoFeets]

I have the oversized thick plastic spacer PLUS two of the thinner ones under my bridge pickup.

Good to know - I'm going to do that ASAP.

How's the response on the bass strings on your 175?

[Dave Orban]

Good to know - I'm going to do that ASAP.

How's the response on the bass strings on your 175?
Fabulous. Thickest-sounding guitar I've ever played.

[jetlag]

Twofeets - sounds like you need an extra shim that goes between the spacer and the pickup. Try either Lollar or Ian at Lentz guitars (he posts here at the TGP too). Like Pete said, try leaving the pole pieces DOWN, raise the whole shibang UP. Get that back pickup up there about 1/16" or 3/32" from the strings (with the strings depressed at the last fret) and you'll be amazed. BTW. the Lentz guy had two different heights to help dial in the height you need.

AC/Fretshop - Regarding flipping phase on P90's - you can also get away without replacing the lead (since the P90 is vintage and you may prefer not mess with it too much) by wrapping the lead in black electrical tape. Just make sure you keep that pickup low enough to where the poles never touch a string when your bonking it real good (it should be that low anyway). Replacing the lead is preferable and superieor in every way, but if you don't want to go that route this is an option.

AC - Regarding the Robert Junior thing, you put the guitar on both pickups turned all the way up. Roll the back pickups tone control completely off to just "almost" off (whatever sounds better). Next experiment with rolling one pickup's volume off about a quarter turn, then try it the other way. See which way sounds best on your guitar. I forgot now which pickup Charlie turned down, but it's varied with each guitar I've tried ..... Once you hear a sound that very similar to the early Robert Junior stuff on JOB, Chess you're there I saw it first on this Charlie Baty online lesson at guitar.com. I'd link the lesson/interview, but they are in reconstruction of the site right now.

To answer your other question - once I got a phase flip on my H62, I quite playing my ES5 and had no need for it. The H62 has ~ .5" shorter scale, so 12's weren't hard to play on it. The combo of that and it's construction versus the ES5's, made it a fatter sounding guitar than my particular ES5. More mids. To my ears, that's what I really wanted. Plus that way I wasn't taking out such an expensive axe. Latter I got a late 40's ES150 ($700) that just killed all of those guitars for the front pickup sound so those two things made the ES5 collect dust. A good friend really wanted the ES5 so I sold it to him. As a bonus, the wife was happy.

Don, Junior was telling about your work w/ the strato pickups - I anxiously await! I'm also crossing my fingers that Eastwood will listen to Junior and Rick and make a two pickup model with the dot fingerboard. That would seal the deal for me. Does anyone know where I can get 100K full sized, audio taper pots?

Dave - the blond is GORGEOUS. I had one just about like that - and I let it go. This was back in college, again paid $700 for it. A bitter, bitter, chapter in my gear acquisition history. Did I mention I'm bitter about that whole deal? (I traded it for a bunch of CRAP)!!

Stringmaster - gorgeous Guild! I've played some X175's with those pickups and they are great. Especially the back ones - they made the guitar sound like a 9000 pound telecaster. Incredible sounding back pickups.

Here's the 150, purportedly it came directly from an elderly East St. Louis bluesman. The pic doesn't show the age, wear, abuse and checking. Not pretty, but a true cannon and gut bucket :

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g237/jetlagslim/ES150incase.jpg

[pete kanaras]

Does anyone know where I can get 100K full sized, audio taper pots?

believe it or not radio shack. that's where i got mine years ago for a dano project. they have a long solid shaft, so i simply sawed the shaft to taste.

regarding no extra ground wire for phase mods, yeah it'll work as long as the string does'nt touch the pup. my H19 is wired that way. big pita when it does touch 'cause it'll cut the guitar off. and for me it's always at the most inopportune moment! when i pop the rivets out for that p'up mount and add a spacer underneath i'll then do the extra ground. what a freak of a guitar, and it's the best 'bone tone i've ever had by far. fretshop's gonna re-fret that bad boy early next year.

[aja]

Whoa that 150 is gorgeous !!

[TwoFeets]

Twofeets - sounds like you need an extra shim that goes between the spacer and the pickup. Try either Lollar or Ian at Lentz guitars (he posts here at the TGP too). Like Pete said, try leaving the pole pieces DOWN, raise the whole shibang UP. Get that back pickup up there about 1/16" or 3/32" from the strings (with the strings depressed at the last fret) and you'll be amazed. BTW. the Lentz guy had two different heights to help dial in the height you need.


Very cool - thanks a lot. I'm going to see if I can stack an Allparts spacer on top of the existing one and if that doesn't work I'll hit up Lollar or Lentz.

The one fabulous thing about this 350 and these old P90's that seems practically non-replicable, at least in aftermarket P90's I've tried, is that woody semi-acoustic tone when you roll off some volume. I hear Holmstrom use it a fair amount and also Joel Patterson.

[valcotone]

hi guys... here's my ES-255 with some *ahem* slight modifications.

Neck and Bridge pups are original 50's P90s and the middle one is a Duncan Antiquity. Pickup balance is quite good.

http://www.kilback.net/pics/es225-5.jpg

[jetlag]

Two feets - I know what you mean on the old P90s. At least the good ones. You do get this cool ass acoustic tone over the top of the note. Kind of like a built-in Holmstrom studio trick (mic on guitar, second mic on amp). I have a P90 in a GT that's so microphonic you can hear your strap creak on the button thru the amp. It's a double edged sword on solid bodies though - you gain a cool openness at the expense of focus. Hard to explain. Right now I'm working with a guy to replicate just that though. If successful, I'll let you all know.

Pete, thanks man. I'll check out RS. Online I could only find miniature 100Ks. I figured I'd have to track down old 50's, 60's pots. I'll try that though. And yes, good points on grounding out the guitar if you bonk the strings into the pickup etc etc. That's the caveat for sure. Your H19 is a beast - front and middle bone sounds are superb. When you get the back pup jacked up, it'll be equally nice (although it's a pretty bad ass twangin' sound as is).

Sean, nice! I remember that ES 255-back. The pickups there is similar to what I did on my ES5. I used the back P90 spacer for the middle pickup and had a new, taller back one made for the back P90. With that middle one up high where it sounds good but I had to be careful when picking. There isn't alot of available real estate if you know what I mean.

Sorry about all the pics, I'm a hopeless punk with a new toy. Here's the H62 that rendered my ES5 to mothball status (it now has the stock wood bridge back on). You can see some (drinking) straw thru the circle part of the F hole that's insulating the back pup when in phase-o-rama and the tall back pup spacer in the pic. From the sound of this one, I think this H62 might be an earlier one without the cardboard between top laminations. The top on it sunk like the Titanic though, which is why the dogears are on there :

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g237/jetlagslim/H62_enhanced.jpg

[GOLDENSTRAT]

Just saw where AC's buddy gave B.B. King the Medal of Freedom award which is pretty cool. yall got some groovy archtops, i've got an Airline Rocket that honks on the neck pu. fred

[Schwalbe]

Man, all this talk about archtops!!
I stop by the local vintage shop today and found a Heritage 575 TDC with P90s. It's a 175 type but thin like a 225 I almost bought many years ago.
I brought it home on trial so I've got a of couple days to play it and think about.
It's this one here http://www.williesguitars.com/index.cfm?sector=user&page=detail&prodID=1617

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/tdc.jpg

[pete kanaras]

a Heritage 575 TDC with P90s

wow, that's the first photo of a heritage with factory p90's i've ever seen. and it's a thinline rounded cut full hollow to boot??? you killin' me man

schwalbe that box is WAY sweet, ouch!

[Dave Orban]

a Heritage 575 TDC with P90s

wow, that's the first photo of a heritage with factory p90's i've ever seen. and it's a thinline rounded cut full hollow to boot??? you killin' me man

schwalbe that box is WAY sweet, ouch!Jay Wolfe at www.wolfeguitars.com has 'em...

[TwoFeets]

Man, all this talk about archtops!!
I stop by the local vintage shop today and found a Heritage 575 TDC with P90s. It's a 175 type but thin like a 225 I almost bought many years ago.
I brought it home on trial so I've got a of couple days to play it and think about.

A few years ago I had Jay Wolfe quote me on a Heritage 550 box with dogear P90's and finished in gold bullion, like a goldtop. The quote was pretty reasonable for a custom job, I recall it was around $2200. Pretty cool guitar there!

[musicofanatic5]

That Guild puts me in the mind of Dave Gonvalez of the Paladins. I believe he has a matching set. He's such a sweet guy, but I can't believe how LOUD he plays. Saw him at a festival in Belgium a few years back. He was plugged into a tweed Bassman, a Vibroking, and a Twin (yes, all three at once!!)!!! Anytime he stopped playing for a second, or took his hands off the strings, that Guild howled like the soundtrack to WWIII!

re: out of phase P-90's: isn't there some trick where you flip the magnets in one p.u. to achieve that sound? I can't remember exactly (perhaps one of our resident experts...?), but I did it years ago on a 225, and it was instant T-bone. With this, of course there's no switchable options, but it's an easily reversible mod; no soldering, etc. My '51 ES5 came with the back p.u. O-O-P to the other two, and I'm presuming it's factory. Any other "fivers" with this setup?

[valcotone]

...My '51 ES5 came with the back p.u. O-O-P to the other two, and I'm presuming it's factory. Any other "fivers" with this setup?


The early 50's ES-5 I played at Austin Vintage Guitars a few months ago was like this too...

[pete kanaras]

so cool, i have always wanted a box with exactly those features. very resonable price. this is great news, thanks guys. is it a 16 inch or 17 inch body? ya know, i think gibson really missed the boat in not putting out a thin 350 style with P90's. that setup has just got the best of everything for me. only thing i'd do is find a yamaha push/push pot so i could phase the bridge pu when i want to, then go back to normal wiring when i'm done with the 'bone stuff. those yamaha pots are the bomb; a full size pot with a full size dpdt switch. alex schultz hipped me to them many years ago. well made, about $20 i think. the only p/p worth a shit. they are hard as hell to find though...

[valcotone]

...re: out of phase P-90's: isn't there some trick where you flip the magnets in one p.u. to achieve that sound? I can't remember exactly (perhaps one of our resident experts...?), but I did it years ago on a 225, and it was instant T-bone. With this, of course there's no switchable options, but it's an easily reversible mod; no soldering, etc. ...



To change the "phase" of a P90, I believe you just roll both magnets like you'd roll a log (which is unlike a caber toss (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caber_toss)). Roll them both the same way and you're done.

[Stringmaster]

[quote=musicofanatic5;1895600]That Guild puts me in the mind of Dave Gonvalez of the Paladins. I believe he has a matching set. He's such a sweet guy, but I can't believe how LOUD he plays. Saw him at a festival in Belgium a few years back. He was plugged into a tweed Bassman, a Vibroking, and a Twin (yes, all three at once!!)!!! Anytime he stopped playing for a second, or took his hands off the strings, that Guild howled like the soundtrack to WWIII!

Funny you should mention Dave Gonzalez! Yeah it's the same model that he plays--an X550. A few years back I was playing at a party and Dave came in--he kept staring at the guitar!! At break he said he was checkin' it out to see if it was his, and almost went home to look under the bed! In all of his travels, he had only seen 3 other blondes--and he had two of them--so it's a pretty rare guitar. Yeah, you can make it sound like a Tele too!
DD

[DonM]

Sounds interesting Don! On the last page I was ruminating about the best place to position the pickups, and Skilback & Jetlag chimed in and said Junior had moved the pickup on his towards the neck to get a better archtop tone. Are you gonna be changing the position of the pickups at all for Junior and Rick?

Naw... Junior moved it I think from needing a darker tone because he went from 50k pots to 500K..
(without him understanding that the 50k pot was designed to make the 3.5k pickup sound archtop-ish..) Rick & Junior now understand the 50k pot on bright 3.5 K pups equates to Arch Top tone theroy ... Rick said he was finally hearing the diff.. between his stock Strat0 and his 500k green Strat0...

I'm busy right now... cause its holidays and NAMM looms... and lots & lots of orders came down the pipes for Strats & Teles this month.. so it will be January before I get to play The Hasbro Potato Head Game...

[jetlag]

Dave is a sweet guy. You should check him out with the Hacienda Bros. Totally different deal and his rig reflects it. I think now all he uses is a RI Vibrolux Rev with celestions and doesn't turn it up past 4. Now it's all twang - either fender planks or dano bari's. When I was typin' that deal up on guild P90's, I was thinking about that time I saw him play at a wedding with a X175 with those pups. Killer tone. In that environment, he played completely different than the way he plays in the Paladins. When I saw it I was thinking "this guy should be fronting roomful."

BTW, my '53 ES5 had that setup - the back pickup was OOP with the others. What I realized was that with it combined with any other pup, and the volumes up all the way, it was humbucking! My theory is that's the reason they did it - as opposed to tones or sound. But who knows?

[jetlag]

Naw... Junior moved it I think from needing a darker tone because he went from 50k pots to 500K..
(without him understanding that the 50k pot was designed to make the 3.5k pickup sound archtop-ish..) Rick & Junior now understand the 50k pot on bright 3.5 K pups equates to Arch Top tone theroy ... Rick said he was finally hearing the diff.. between his stock Strat0 and his 500k green Strat0...


Just relating what the man said to me. But that makes sense. To me, with a 50K, the thing sounds as archtop as you'd ever want it to be.

[zappafrank]

Just saw where AC's buddy gave B.B. King the Medal of Freedom award which is pretty cool. yall got some groovy archtops, i've got an Airline Rocket that honks on the neck pu. fred

Hey---anytime the Blues gets serious national attention, and someone like BB King is honored, I am ALL for it! Congrats to BB, no matter who was pinning it to his chest...(my 'buddy'---fred, THAT is a funny one!!....I live in the city that his daddy called 'Little Beirut' due to our not happily going along with the status quo....I'm rather proud of that!---It's a Portland thing---)

Those Stratotones with the DonM mods sound very cool---and Stringmaster---yeah baby!--just a great looking Guild!

Thanks for OOP tips---I don't know if I'm going to change that, although I'm very hip on doin the push/pull pots on my other p90 guitars---this one may stay stock----EXCEPT---I WILL find those spacers, and probably try and set it up like Dave O. has done his---some great info on all that, especially keeping the screws in on the pups---I did not know that...

ac

[mikelaw]

dave IS loud, but i dig it! he played the hotrod rumble in east hartford one year. an old chopper was peeling out smoke show in front of the stage and dave yells over.....i wish my amp was that loud!!!!!

actually i have a friend with 2!!!! of those gonzalez blonde guilds but one of them is a sunburst though. unfortuneately he plays it through a new mesa boogie lonestar or something silly like that so you can barely hear what the axe really sounds like!

anyone in here play an amp with a negative feedback loop and have the loop on a pot OR had the loop bypassed completely?

[mikelaw]

i know the 5e5a's and 5f4's have the loop, as well as the 5f6a's which im sure SOMEONE must has in here!

[ReddRanger]

Wow the Paladins. I haven't heard them mentioned in a while. What a great band. I used to go see they whenever them came to the Bay Area. Dave plays his ass off. He had varying set ups over the times I saw them. The first couple of times he had a small tweed combo and a reverb tank. Cranked up and miked the combo and put his road case lid in front of it. The last time I saw them he had that Bassman and Twin Stringmaster mentioned. Yeah, it was a lot louder that time. Great band. Are they still around?

[TwoFeets]

BTW, my '53 ES5 had that setup - the back pickup was OOP with the others. What I realized was that with it combined with any other pup, and the volumes up all the way, it was humbucking! My theory is that's the reason they did it - as opposed to tones or sound. But who knows?

My initial thought on the 350 since it wasn't all original was to convert it into an ES5 via the Gibson people. When they declined I asked if they'd switch the pickups out of phase and they told me they couldn't, it wasn't a simple matter of switching a couple of wires around. I then asked how they accomplished getting the out of phase tone on the old ES5's without a switch, and couldn't they duplicate that wiring on the 350, and their answer was thus:

"in talking to some of our resident vintage geeks (I don't mean that in any disparaging way) the general consensus seems to be that when it happened that one of the pickups was out of phase it was more than likely an accident and either the magnet was mistakenly flipped or the coil form was wound in the reverse."

[jetlag]

Mike - Yup, I've messed with killing the NFB loop on amps. It can be awsome in some amps. In a BF pro reverb it just killed. I tried it on a buddies BF concert and it howled. Disconnecting it made the amp unstable. What I later learned is that I should have just put a resistor in there to DECREASE NFB substantiallly instead of killing it altogether. What you can do on an amp is wire in a pot and then listen to it. See where you like it, pull the pot out and measure the resistance it's set at. Then pop a resistor in series with the existing NFB loop resistor equal or close to that and you're set. Doing that adds a cool rawness to the amp, more low mids, and output section distortion that's touch responsive. It also makes the speaker looser or flop around a little bit easier - which is nice in some tight amps. All of this depends on how much you decrease NFB. A typical resistor value in a BF amp like a Pro Rev, VR, TR, SR might be to increase the 870 ohm resistor to 1500 ohms. You would then increase or decrease from that value depending on your amp and what you like.

Caveats - if your amp has presence you'll diminish the presence knob or defeat it all to together. If your amp is cathode biased, then it likely is already got no NFB - with some exceptions.

[mikelaw]

thanks jetlag. well see, i have a brown concert. '62. i may add a pot as a rheostat and put it in the ext. speaker jack slot. completely reversible too. a friend mentioned a 10k pot. 0 as stock, full up=alot less neg. feedback!

that way if a room is a 4.5 volume room i can crank the nfb pot. if its a 12 volume room i can turn off the pot.!

[jetlag]

Mike,

Screwing w/ NFB is definitely cool and I bet you'll dig it. I think the 10K pot is sort of the magic number for bf amp circuits. Your brown concert is a little different in the NFB circuit. If I understand how the circuits work correctly (not sure yet), I'm afraid the 10K pot may not do much. My math is showing to get the same effect as the 10K in the bf, you end up needing at least a 100K pot (155K to be exact). So you might try disconnecting the wire to hear it completely w/o feedback first. If, after putting the 10K pot in, it doesn't sound like much is going on, then you'll know why. In the meantime, I'll ask my amp tech if I'm on the right track or not and get back to you.

[musicofanatic5]

My initial thought on the 350 since it wasn't all original was to convert it into an ES5 via the Gibson people. When they declined I asked if they'd switch the pickups out of phase and they told me they couldn't, it wasn't a simple matter of switching a couple of wires around. I then asked how they accomplished getting the out of phase tone on the old ES5's without a switch, and couldn't they duplicate that wiring on the 350, and their answer was thus:

"in talking to some of our resident vintage geeks (I don't mean that in any disparaging way) the general consensus seems to be that when it happened that one of the pickups was out of phase it was more than likely an accident and either the magnet was mistakenly flipped or the coil form was wound in the reverse."

Typical Gibson...(Gibson shop foreman: "Oh no, there's a lot of very complex science involved with switching phase on P-90's. Whattaya think this is, M.I.T.?!").
So far, preliminary results on my "survey", seem to say, "lotta accidents out there".
As concerns converting a 350 to an ES-5: if someone brought a real 350 into my shop and asked me to chop another hole in the top for a third p.u., I dunno if I'd do it. Ain't that many of 'em out there. Would I do it to a 225? Suuuure (right Sean?)!

[musicofanatic5]

Latter I got a late 40's ES150 ($700) that just killed all of those guitars for the front pickup sound so those two things made the ES5 collect dust. A good friend really wanted the ES5 so I sold it to him. As a bonus, the wife was happy. Here's the 150, purportedly it came directly from an elderly East St. Louis bluesman. The pic doesn't show the age, wear, abuse and checking. Not pretty, but a true cannon and gut bucket :

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g237/jetlagslim/ES150incase.jpg

Very cool early 150. Is it a script logo? Maple or mahogany? Some of the early ones were all mahogany, as with the 125. I know what you mean about the sound of these. I had a late '47-early '48 one-p.u. ES-300N (yeah, blonde, with psycho-flame in the top, too!), which I unloaded when I got my ES-5. Big mistake. The front p.u. on the 5 has nowhere near the roar that the 300 had. But no, I hadda have a cutaway and a coupla more p.u.s! Whatta schmuck!

[musicofanatic5]

To change the "phase" of a P90, I believe you just roll both magnets like you'd roll a log (which is unlike a caber toss (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caber_toss)). Roll them both the same way and you're done.

Thanks, Sean. I always get those mixed up-one time I was trying to go to a Lumberjack Fest and ended up at the Highland Games!

Hey-you refered to your gtr as a 255; was that intentional? If not, that should be the model #: 225 meets 5, no?

[mikelaw]

perfect! thanks jet let me know!

[jetlag]

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g237/jetlagslim/DSC01020.jpgVery cool early 150. Is it a script logo? Maple or mahogany? Some of the early ones were all mahogany, as with the 125. I know what you mean about the sound of these. I had a late '47-early '48 one-p.u. ES-300N (yeah, blonde, with psycho-flame in the top, too!), which I unloaded when I got my ES-5. Big mistake. The front p.u. on the 5 has nowhere near the roar that the 300 had. But no, I hadda have a cutaway and a coupla more p.u.s! Whatta schmuck!

Thanks Jon. Yeah, it's the late 40's all mahogany one. It's the second one that's passed thru my hands (first is owned by a buddy, had it on loan) and they looked and sounded identical - same weather checking, both owners had adjusted the poles up high. The poles are now real corroded and I'm afraid to lower them, plus it sounds so damn fat as it is. I don't think it's a script logo - it looks just like the modern logo except that it's gold (poo brown now) paint. I love those all mahogany archtops. I do have a banner/script logo LG0 that was all kicked in and repaird, got it cheap. It's incredible sounding too. Any advice on a LOW DOWN pickup I could put in it's sound hole?



Mike, when I find something out I'll let you know.

[pete kanaras]

mike, messing with nfb loops can be cool indeed. having A value in there (as opposed to just taking the loop out) is definitely the way to go. i removed the loop on an early ri bassman once. turned the ground switch into a loop in/out switch. but i did'nt dig it; it just made the amp too hot and gainy sounding. no loop is a big reason i never really bonded with a vibro-king. hmm, put a loop in in a VK and make it cathode biased, betcha that would be incredible. anyway, mess around with values and see what works for you.

regarding oop on es5's, every one i've ever played (which is a lot of 'em) is wired that way. old or ri, gibson or epi. the weird thing about epi ri es5's is that they phased the middle pup instead of the bridge, sounds like ass. that and they're surprisingly heavy guitars.

[pete kanaras]

jet, a lowdown pup for the gibby acoustic? a 5pole "elmore" DeArmond! oh yeah....

all this paladins talk is making me nostalgic. one of the greatest bands i have ever seen. absolutely killin'.

[jetlag]

jet, a lowdown pup for the gibby acoustic? a 5pole "elmore" DeArmond! oh yeah....

all this paladins talk is making me nostalgic. one of the greatest bands i have ever seen. absolutely killin'.

Pete, thanks for the response. Really, those 5 pole dearmonds will break up nasty? I was afraid they would be too clean. I was looking for something that sounds like those old lightnin' recordings where he and the guitar are pegging out those tube mics/pres. You know? Maybe something MORE distorted than what they actually had. Kinda like taping a green bullet element in the soundhole. Hmmmm .......... :NUTS

BTW Pete - it's nice having you off the road. You come around here more often. I heard from Cleanhead and hear you two had a good chat. He's stoked right now as he in the middle of a 4 gig stint in Chi with Spector and Beady Eyes (Big Eyes son, a mutha drummer).

[pete kanaras]

like those old lightnin' recordings
--------------------------------
it's a 5pole dearmond on that stuff, and most all the elmore stuff too. nothing else will give you that sound. once you get that tone in your head you go "aha!" when you hear it. it is the classic amplified acoustic blues tone. simply plug that sucker into any ratty-assed amp and voila.

yeah, i'm enjoyin' the self-imposed break, my first since '87. i may be going out in the spring with someone for an east coast thing but so far nothing's been nailed down; we'll see. karl, if you like, pm me your street addy and i'll get you a copy of the shambells' live stuff from our "final" gig last year. the mixes came out great.

[jetlag]

Pete, will do. I would love to hear that live stuff.

Mike, regarding the concert - is your the 5 12AX7 one (6G12) or the 6 12AX7 one (6G12A)? It makes a difference. If you have the 6G12 - use a 50K or 100K pot. If you have the 6G12A, double that - use a 100K or 250K pot. I think a linear pot will work better. The key is to leave the existing feedback resistor in there so that the pot is just adding resistance to it (I think you already knew that - just being careful here since you playing with hot stuff). Good luck, hope it works as well on the brown concert as it does on bf amps.

[Poppa Stoppa]

Talking of OOP pickups, what guitar is Andreas playing in this video clip? Sounds / looks kind of like a modded ES330 wired out of phase to me, with the pickup switch on the lower bout:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=imEg6uyCW6U&mode=related&search=
Nice playing - I think it's off their website.

[TwoFeets]

Typical Gibson...(Gibson shop foreman: "Oh no, there's a lot of very complex science involved with switching phase on P-90's. Whattaya think this is, M.I.T.?!").
So far, preliminary results on my "survey", seem to say, "lotta accidents out there".
As concerns converting a 350 to an ES-5: if someone brought a real 350 into my shop and asked me to chop another hole in the top for a third p.u., I dunno if I'd do it. Ain't that many of 'em out there. Would I do it to a 225? Suuuure (right Sean?)!

Yeah - after that reply I thought, bah, I'll just have my local guy do it.

Believe me, I'd have never considered the conversion if it hadn't been for the fact that the guitar was already dubiously refinished, with a hacked fingerboard and replacement tailpiece and tuners. Where I was having the board replaced anyway I thought why not just have an ES5 fingerboard put on and the third pickup cut in... or even have a 350 fingerboard put on and the third pickup, since the first ES5's were ES350's with a third pup anyway. This guitar has the unbound F-holes too which would have made a nice "tribute" to those prototype guitars, like the 3-P90 ES350 Harman had stolen from him a couple of years back.

[THINSOCKS]

Very cool early 150. Is it a script logo? Maple or mahogany? Some of the early ones were all mahogany, as with the 125. I know what you mean about the sound of these. I had a late '47-early '48 one-p.u. ES-300N (yeah, blonde, with psycho-flame in the top, too!), which I unloaded when I got my ES-5. Big mistake. The front p.u. on the 5 has nowhere near the roar that the 300 had. But no, I hadda have a cutaway and a coupla more p.u.s! Whatta schmuck!

Jon, - Ouch. You should have kept the 300. I have a '44 ES-300 and it's a really great guitar. I'll never sell it. It's all mahogany too w/ a script logo and one of those wierd factory p-90's without the pole pieces.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y2/frankiethetut/IMG_4996.jpg

[Dave Orban]

I just LOVE these all-mahogany guitars. The acoustic sound is so dry and crisp, and they're a real treat to play!

[TwoFeets]

I played Felix's ES300 when we visited him in Chicago back in February. He put in an original CC lapsteel pickup.

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h183/itchytwofeets/1487742998_l-2.jpg (http://thegearpage.net/board/%3Ca%20href=)">

[jetlag]

Man, what a cool pic (Felix). Super nice cat and great player too. I love the lizzard green suit and the guitar. What are those knobs on there? Epi's or something?

[TwoFeets]

Man, what a cool pic (Felix). Super nice cat and great player too. I love the lizzard green suit and the guitar. What are those knobs on there? Epi's or something?

No idea. I think they're old radio knobs or something... but he was definitely going for that 30's ES150 vibe when he put them on there. The CC pickup is NOS Gibson he got when touring the Heritage factory, from a buddy of his that has worked there since the Gibson days.

[mikelaw]

its a 6G12-A. thanks fellas. ill bring it to my amp tech when he has some time so we can try different setups... should be great! i play harp through it too so that will be cool for that as well.

i tell ya though, on 12 (big rooms) the amp is just amazing. glad to know messing with the nfb at a lower volume ill be able to get THAT tone! i think its 40 watts. if that is the case, 40 vintage 'brownfenderwatts' pinned is right where my holy grail is! love-e-ly :)

[Birdseye]

Speaking of NFB in brown amps, I like the NFB pot I put in this one. It's nice to be able to play with it on the brown amps. I woudn't say it gives you the effect of the amp cranked up at lower volumes, but it will add a different kind of raw crunch. It is nice to be able to dial it in just where it sounds good to your ear.

http://www.flatbrokebluesband.com/album/brown%20twin.jpg

[Schwalbe]

I found a crack in the top of the Heritage
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/Heritage/DSCN11302.jpghttp://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/Heritage/DSCN11332.jpg
Maybe it's minor, I don't know. Maybe I'll knock 2 or 3 hundred of their asking price. Any expert advice?

And since this is the Gear page, how's about some gear pictures? Here's the guts of my Weber 5E5A
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/DSCN0894.jpghttp://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/DSCN08992.jpg
Gears heads love amp porn!http://thegearpage.net/board/%5BIMG%5Dhttp://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/Heritage/DSCN11302.jpg%5B/IMG%5D

[valcotone]

Thanks, Sean. I always get those mixed up-one time I was trying to go to a Lumberjack Fest and ended up at the Highland Games!

Hey-you refered to your gtr as a 255; was that intentional? If not, that should be the model #: 225 meets 5, no?


hey Jon... haha, ya got me. Yeah, it should have read ES-225, or as I actually call it ES-225/5... :roll

[THINSOCKS]

What are those knobs on there? Epi's or something?

Those are just Gibson knobs. You see them often on 30's Gibson electric guitars like the "Charlie Christian" ES-150 and sometimes on the Gibson steels from that era.

[Birdseye]

Schwalbe,

Nice work on that amp. It looks real clean. I like the oxblood knobs too. How's that weber speaker?

ML

[Schwalbe]

Nice work on that amp. It looks real clean. I like the oxblood knobs too. How's that weber speaker?
Thanks Birdseye. The Weber 15A150-O sounds really good, fat and greasy.

[dddelta]

Holstrom on youtube -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBYBqAo9JJ8

This guy also has some other cool vids.

[Poppa Stoppa]

Holstrom on youtube -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tBYBqAo9JJ8

This guy also has some other cool vids.Thanks dddelta!

By the way (1) I downloaded Audacity as recommended a while back by Ryan H and found this evening that it will record the audio track on these youtube videos...if anyone is wondering (like I was) how to do that...so I can now make a little practice CD of the clips of Junior, Rick, etc etc. No doubt some of you guys are more sophisticated but I'm happy to have got one up on the technology for a change...

By the way (2): has Rick got 2 concentric pots on his Strat-O in that video clip? If so anyone know what make/ohmage etc? 50k like DonM recommended?

[musicofanatic5]

I found a crack in the top of the Heritage
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/Heritage/DSCN11302.jpghttp://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/Heritage/DSCN11332.jpg
Maybe it's minor, I don't know. Maybe I'll knock 2 or 3 hundred of their asking price. Any expert advice?

And since this is the Gear page, how's about some gear pictures? Here's the guts of my Weber 5E5A
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/DSCN0894.jpghttp://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/DSCN08992.jpg
Gears heads love amp porn!http://thegearpage.net/board/%5BIMG%5Dhttp://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/Heritage/DSCN11302.jpg%5B/IMG%5D

Hey Dan-is that gtr a 16 or 17 inch wide body? 25 1/2" or 24 3/4" scale? I agree about Gibson missing the boat. If they had evolved the 350 into the 350T, but kept the 25 1/2 scale instead of that unplayable Byrdland scale...
Nice shots of your typically super-sano work inside an amp chassis. Say, what're those yella caps you got in there? Reason I'm asking is I've got a Tremolux with a board full of those orange-blob 715P's, and wondered if there's a better quality cap I should have in any of those applications?

[fretshop]

I found a crack in the top of the Heritage
http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a122/RockinDaddy/Heritage/DSCN11302.jpghttp://i10.p