West Coast Blues Thread - Version 2.0

[RickyKing]

We're in the middle of a Spring/Summer playing a lot of outdoor venues, some on the big side. I have a hard time playing festivals for a lot of reasons. How do you get a good sound outside? How do you connect with an audience that is 30 feet away and 4 feet below you? How do you get the maximum amount of impact into a 30-45 minute set? What do you do to warm up before you play so you are KILLING from the first note?

Hey Ryan,
Well,you can try to do as they do on Broadway,make everything big!
Take the Ethel Merman approach and double your rig,set up closer together,make sure you make eye contact with the 1st 4 rows,move around the stage a bit so the folks out back know you are alive.
Get a good warm-up back stage,and make sure your set is paced well.
The rest is in your hands...

[TwoFeets]

Happy 5,000! Actually I think we're at close to 10,000 when you consider all the posts back at the other forum, plus the fact that we lost a whole bunch of posts in a previous version of this thread before the server crashed...

Jon, it's very likely I'll take you up on that one! Will PM as it gets closer.

Anyone fly with a guitar recently? I won't have one up there if I don't.
I'd take the Esquire apart and bring it, but it's not quite dialed in yet anyway.

[Dave Orban]

Worse than a drummer who speeds up: A drummer who slows down. It's a horrible feeling, like slowly dying.LOL!

We had one of those for a (thankfully short) while.

I remember the first rehearsal, the bass player and I both glanced at each other thinking "hey, this guy's not even speeding up," which had been a problem with our prior two drummers. LOL! Boy, were WE in for a surprise...! You'd start up a song right on tempo, and end up playing a dirge, after about 8 measures...! :eek:

We tried SO hard to work with this guy, because he was a really nice guy, and even let us rehearse in his finished basement, served us vintage wines, the whole nine yards.

We even bought him a metronome... but he couldn't even use it, it was "too distracting...!" :jo

He'd make copius notes about rhythms, breaks, changes, etc., then never look at them again.

One gig, he showed up without a rug -- and the stage had a linoleum floor! -- and I spent the entire gig trying, using my right foot (while playing and singing) to try and keep his bass drum from crawling up my ass...! LOL!

That was, thankfully, our last gig together. :rotflmao

[btg]

I experienced a new one last saturday night. I did a pickup gig with a country band who also had a new drummer. The drummer kept asking what key every song was in before each song and he was just drumming no vocals or anything.

[Dave Orban]

I experienced a new one last saturday night. I did a pickup gig with a country band who also had a new drummer. The drummer kept asking what key every song was in before each song and he was just drumming no vocals or anything.
He HAD to be f*cking with ya...

[TwoFeets]

We had the same problem with another drummer. He eventually got so disgusted with us griping at him that he bought one of those Beat Bug things. It measures bpm based on the frequency of snare drum hits or something. At any rate, we'd all settle on a tempo we were comfortable on at rehearsal, he'd note the bpm for that particular tune, and when we played out, he'd make sure to keep the bpm right there or very close to it. (it shows the bpm on a LED readout) That way we were happy that things stayed pretty even, and he had ammunition to back himself up, telling us we didn't know what the hell we were talking about if we griped at him. It worked out pretty well.

[btg]

He HAD to be f*cking with ya...


No to be honest, I know the guy plays guitar too some so the only thing I can figure out is he was just filing the tunes away in his mind for future reference. Pretty good drummer though my band has been on hiatus since I drummer flipped out a few months ago and I have not felt like dealing with another one.

[musicofanatic5]

Anyone fly with a guitar recently? I won't have one up there if I don't.
I'd take the Esquire apart and bring it, but it's not quite dialed in yet anyway.
I fly with a fender bass in a gig bag all the time. No need to dissasemble your gtr. Only the littlest puddle-jumpers won't accomodate a gtr in the overhead storage. Hope to see ya.

[Scott Miller]

A new experience last night, a guy who "danced" by running from one end of the bar to the other, including out the front door. Back and forth, for at least half of "Flip Flop and Fly." This was at JJ's, which is a long narrow room, so he could work up some speed. It's always nice to see people responding to your music. I guess.

[jetlag]

Anyone fly with a guitar recently? I won't have one up there if I don't.
I'd take the Esquire apart and bring it, but it's not quite dialed in yet anyway.

Within the last 18 months or so I've flown on AA and SWA with a les paul. On the former, they have a closet right when you are entering on most of their narrow bodies. You can usually talk a flight attendant (don't say "stewardess" ) into letting you put it there. That helps, because you may not have control when you get to board (although AA and many airlines now let you change your seat online - if you put yourself in a seat in back, you board right after first class, elderly etc). If you are on SWA, their 737s have no front closet, but their overheads will accomodate about anything but an archtop. Make sure you get online 24 hrs out and get an A pass - getting to board in the first group allows you ample room to stow your axe. On AA, I was able to approach a gate attendant early and talk her into letting me board with the first group (after first class) so I could stow the guitar away. I used the line " I'd like to get it in the front closet (early) so it doesn't take up a bunch of room in the overheads. I don't care about boarding early, I'd be happy to leave the plane and board with my group. " That makes sense to them and makes them think you are concerned about "others". It's too much of a hassle to deplane, so they let you stay onboard. That ploy, and it's allowing me to board earlier has been successful enough to make me contemplate using a guitar case for luggage when traveling so I can board early! I think it's the smell that my clothes would have that keeps me from doing it - that bar stank. Probably stating the obvious but ........... I'm into getting on plane early because if you board later, the overheads fill up. Once they do, all the remaining bags get checked and your f#cked.

[cigpow]

Anybody want some semi-vintage Junior Watson!?!??!

here ya go

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EQ-Cx05sTyk


Ian

[mikelaw]

look
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBUAA:US:11&Item=220119010420

[saggybottom]

Wow!!!

Almost $2000.00 and it doesn't even have F-holes!!!:NUTS

I hope the neck is straight on that thing!

[Echo Are]

A new experience last night, a guy who "danced" by running from one end of the bar to the other, including out the front door. Back and forth, for at least half of "Flip Flop and Fly." This was at JJ's, which is a long narrow room, so he could work up some speed. It's always nice to see people responding to your music. I guess.

Sounds like one guy I see sometimes at the Sunday night Old Princeton Landing jam,who has his own whacked-out dance steps, like "The Reciprocating Engine", "The Nervous Windshield Wiper", and "The Break Dancing Harp Seal"(if I were to name his unique dance steps).

[nc slim]

anybody know years watson was w Canned heat. did he play woodstock reunion 89.

[zappafrank]

look
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=ADME:B:EOIBUAA:US:11&Item=220119010420



Oh man---that's just one of those new reliced Eastwood copies...What? You have'nt seen those yet?---Yeah, you can get a new one for under 5 bills...:rolleyes:


just unbelievable what those are going for---I guess like a bunch of other guitars these days!

Just wow....



GREAT gig tonite---it's been so long since I did a full gig, I felt like a bull let out from it's stall!---Admittedly, although the energy was DEF there, my timing was suffering occasionally---ok, a lot:messedup
But I don't really mind---at least I was back on the saddle for a bit--and it felt REAL good, and no one asked for ANY requests!:BEER

L. walter, Muddy, some originals, K. Burrell, T-Birds, Blasters, Red Devils, A. Collins, Sun Ra, (ok...that's a lie:YinYang)---and some swingy stuff like "She Used To Be Beautiful" and such---it was just a good night---my bi-polar meter must be on the upside, tonite!:crazy

and we had some excellent jammers---when my friend's CD is re-released (re-mastered/mixed---he just got signed a short time ago,(a deal on DeltaGroove Records---Chortkoff's label--)---you ALL should grab a copy ---"Left Coast Blues" is the title, big release party late August---and features yet another young guy that can REALLY play the swing style--with great tone, great songwriting, good vocals---not Nick Curran good--yet---but def still good vocals! etc...Vyasa Dodson is the leader's name, and he is fantastic---I could'nt keep up with him melodically and idea wise, so I just had to get weird---it was a blast...he's a killer on that 51 Broadcaster that was passed down in his family--

ac

[zappafrank]

anybody know years watson was w Canned heat. did he play woodstock reunion 89.


I think he was more, like, around 93 or so??--i have Reheated and "live in Australia"---just great---

nite, y'all--

ac

[TwoFeets]

AC, why not hop a plane and meet me at Jon's jam in Manchester NH on Sunday night?

[zappafrank]

AC, why not hop a plane and meet me at Jon's jam in Manchester NH on Sunday night?


can't sleep!

Ya know, If I did'nt have to work sunday and monday night, and I could get a fair price, and my buddy from eugene was'nt staying at my place this weekend---I'd SERIOUSLY consider it---if you could pick me up!---I hear Boston a b***ch to get around if you don't know the town---I gotta semi-fresh Credit Card--and I could surely use some new sights---let's talk about planning a future encounter out---say, a Friday thru monday jag---I ain't been on a plane since I got the 'Rock Star' treatment: a paid puddle jumper to Idaho and some good money about 5-6 yrs ago---woohoo--

ac

[valcotone]

GREAT gig tonite---it's been so long since I did a full gig, I felt like a bull let out from it's stall!---Admittedly, although the energy was DEF there, my timing was suffering occasionally---ok, a lot:messedup
But I don't really mind---at least I was back on the saddle for a bit--and it felt REAL good, and no one asked for ANY requests!:BEER



AC.... great news man! I'm happy for ya!! :RoCkIn

[afenderman67]

have any of you guy's ever heard of ron thompson, well he's a good friend of mine and one of the most gifted guitar player i know or seen!i think he one of the best slide players around, and i dont even like slide all that much!

those of you who live on the westcoast should check him out if you can!

i went to see him last night and he let me set in for afew songs, to me its great honor to play with a guy who has played with or for the best!

[TwoFeets]

Florida guys. Damon Folwer is playing my local blues club Monday. Is he good?

Frank, I forgot to catch back up with you. Did you go? If so, what did you think?

[musicofanatic5]

have any of you guy's ever heard of ron thompson, well he's a good friend of mine and one of the most gifted guitar player i know or seen!i think he one of the best slide players around, and i dont even like slide all that much!

those of you who live on the westcoast should check him out if you can!

i went to see him last night and he let me set in for afew songs, to me its great honor to play with a guy who has played with or for the best!

Yeah, I remember that name from some years back. Bay area, right? If I recall correctly, he was doing some Magic Sam Jr. thing, or something like that...?

[zappafrank]

ok---a contribution to the WC thread entertainment council---can't say no to this, baby---

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GGLmZCZ1sXY&mode=related&search=

ac

[zappafrank]

have any of you guy's ever heard of ron thompson, well he's a good friend of mine and one of the most gifted guitar player i know or seen!i think he one of the best slide players around, and i dont even like slide all that much!

those of you who live on the westcoast should check him out if you can!

i went to see him last night and he let me set in for afew songs, to me its great honor to play with a guy who has played with or for the best!

He does a killer version of "13 women"!

Paris Slim is totally into Ron's playing, from our conversations-----


Jon---I have that one WEIRDASS CD that claims to be a Magic Sam record, but it's Ron playing all the guitar---I'm pretty damn sure Ron had nothing to do with it---I thought it was some Sam I did'nt have, and was all excited, then I listened---WTF???

Someone schooled me that it was Ron--I think some unhuman producer did a jive thing with it, but I'll ask Slim about it---it's def a rarity/weird thing!

ac

[Scott Miller]

Ron's a fine player. Those "Magic Sam" records... I think the story was that they were released as Magic Sam, and Ron didn't even know about them. Some weird thing like that.

AC, one thing you'll find as a day-poster, this place gets real dead at about 3 PM, after everyone on the east coast gets off work!

Another H-44 sold recently for $700 something. I think the seller made the fatal mistake of saying it was good for slide.

[valcotone]

Here are a couple demos of the Eastwood H44 by Vince Lee in the UK who regularly plays vintage Harmony guitars.

What I REALLY dig about this is his playing (and not so much the tone of the 2nd one)....!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNZbteXwzA8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWlDSV94V28


...light years beyond the official Eastwood demos, IMO!

[zappafrank]

AC.... great news man! I'm happy for ya!! :RoCkIn

Thanks, sean--I def needed it---let's say it's the next best thing!:p

ac

[zappafrank]

Ron's a fine player. Those "Magic Sam" records... I think the story was that they were released as Magic Sam, and Ron didn't even know about them. Some weird thing like that.

AC, one thing you'll find as a day-poster, this place gets real dead at about 3 PM, after everyone on the east coast gets off work!

Another H-44 sold recently for $700 something. I think the seller made the fatal mistake of saying it was good for slide.

Scott---you think 3pm's dead---it's a tad dead at 3 AM! :rotflmao

'good for slide'---yep, that's the kiss-o-death right thar---
--and thanks for the info about those infamous fake 'sam' records---what a DRAG to carry that around as dead weight for Ron!

ac

[THINSOCKS]

That H-44 also went for $700 becuase it was listed as a "Statotone". It was missing the "R".

[mikelaw]

That H-44 also went for $700 becuase it was listed as a "Statotone". It was missing the "R".

ooooooooooooooh, thatll do it!

[rjkohrs]

Junior Watson played the '89 Woodstock reunion with Canned Heat. Video of the band's entire performance exists. He did two stints with Canned Heat, '88-'90 and '93(maybe '94...?)-'97. There is a documentary disc that comes with the Canned Heat at Montreux 1973 dvd that has film footage of the Hollywood Fats era Heat playing at the '79 Woodstock anniversary. Sadly, other than a few still shots of pubilicity photos and a snippet of "Hucklebuck" playing in the background, there is no mention of Junior......

[afenderman67]

He does a killer version of "13 women"!

Paris Slim is totally into Ron's playing, from our conversations-----


Jon---I have that one WEIRDASS CD that claims to be a Magic Sam record, but it's Ron playing all the guitar---I'm pretty damn sure Ron had nothing to do with it---I thought it was some Sam I did'nt have, and was all excited, then I listened---WTF???

Someone schooled me that it was Ron--I think some unhuman producer did a jive thing with it, but I'll ask Slim about it---it's def a rarity/weird thing!

ac

your right, ron told me the whole story just like you said it!

i've ever heard this recording of ron,does any one have it?

[Poppa Stoppa]

Here are a couple demos of the Eastwood H44 by Vince Lee in the UK who regularly plays vintage Harmony guitars.

What I REALLY dig about this is his playing (and not so much the tone of the 2nd one)....!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kNZbteXwzA8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWlDSV94V28


...light years beyond the official Eastwood demos, IMO!I like that first one - blues and then rhythm changes. B'n'r instead of r'n'b...also he seems to be playing with the guitar turned down somewhat compared to the second clip. Wonder what kind of amp he's got.

Those Airline H44s sound amazing at about half volume - filthy underneath but with that archtop overlay, like a Harmony should. Above that the sound becomes more recognisably humbucker-ish and less characterful.

[nc slim]

Thanks For The Info On Watson I Have The Video Of Fats W Canned Heat At Woodstock And Som Heats Tapes W Watson But Did Not Know When He Played W Him. Saw watson few weeks ago w nemeth,loved his unpredictable playing. He starts at pluto goes to mars and finishes in West Memphis. Its a shame he is not a household name buts thats the Blues I guess.

Any of you guys remember Arthur Wright,w Jonny Taylor(Part time love) clearly a big in fluence on JLV. I only have one great record fantastic playing. Any other records by him??

[jumpnblues]

Excuse me for straying off topic for a moment but I need some feedback on the Amps And Cabs forum from my blues playin' buddies here familiar with Louis Electric amps. I feel it's relevant here as they're used primarily by blues and roots music people and that's who I need the feedback from. So, I'd appreciate it if anyone familiar with L.E. amps, EL-34 vs 6L6 tubes, and going with just a 12" vs both a 12" and 10" speaker in a combo cab would check out my post and respond. Dang, I wish there was a whole separate forum for blues/jazz guys. But that's a whole different discussion. OK...at ease...carry on. :cool::cool:

Tom

[afenderman67]

anyone know where i can get a road case for my fender reverb tank at a fair price?

and does anyone know anything about sound amps, it combo with 6v6 power tubes and a 15 inch speaker?


thanks!

[zappafrank]

Excuse me for straying off topic for a moment but I need some feedback on the Amps And Cabs forum from my blues playin' buddies here familiar with Louis Electric amps. I feel it's relevant here as they're used primarily by blues and roots music people and that's who I need the feedback from. So, I'd appreciate it if anyone familiar with L.E. amps, EL-34 vs 6L6 tubes, and going with just a 12" vs both a 12" and 10" speaker in a combo cab would check out my post and respond. Dang, I wish there was a whole separate forum for blues/jazz guys. But that's a whole different discussion. OK...at ease...carry on. :cool::cool:

Tom

Hey Tom---thanks for the PM---I will respond in kind when I have a bit more time--

But--I think the man on here that can really give you the lowdown on those L.E. amps has'nt posted in quite awhile---but you can search for his TGP name and give him an email/PM (I'd email, if I were you)

That would be 'Fretshop'----aka George---he knows a LOT 'bout those amps and the maker---

good luck..

ac

[zappafrank]

Junior Watson played the '89 Woodstock reunion with Canned Heat. Video of the band's entire performance exists. He did two stints with Canned Heat, '88-'90 and '93(maybe '94...?)-'97. There is a documentary disc that comes with the Canned Heat at Montreux 1973 dvd that has film footage of the Hollywood Fats era Heat playing at the '79 Woodstock anniversary. Sadly, other than a few still shots of pubilicity photos and a snippet of "Hucklebuck" playing in the background, there is no mention of Junior......

very intersesting rj---i di not know that---cool info!

ac

[zappafrank]

your right, ron told me the whole story just like you said it!

i've ever heard this recording of ron,does any one have it?

I have it---I THINK I still do, anway---I'll have to look later---

ac

[musicofanatic5]

Excuse me for straying off topic for a moment but I need some feedback on the Amps And Cabs forum from my blues playin' buddies here familiar with Louis Electric amps. I feel it's relevant here as they're used primarily by blues and roots music people and that's who I need the feedback from. So, I'd appreciate it if anyone familiar with L.E. amps, EL-34 vs 6L6 tubes, and going with just a 12" vs both a 12" and 10" speaker in a combo cab would check out my post and respond. Dang, I wish there was a whole separate forum for blues/jazz guys. But that's a whole different discussion. OK...at ease...carry on. :cool::cool:

Tom

Duke Robillard uses 'em. Go to his website and email him. He usually enjoys talking about this stuff if you catch him in the right mood.

[afenderman67]

have you guy's heard the new release of junoir wells live at theresa's in 1975?

this is a cool cd, probably very much like it was is the black blues sceen in chicago in 70's!

good stuff!

[TwoFeets]

Our current bass player was Jr. Wells's bass player shortly after that was recorded. He also spent a couple of years as the house bass player at Theresa's.

Of course that has nothing to do with that recording whatsoever, I'm just banging the drum for him because he's a nice guy and a super bass player.

[GOLDENSTRAT]

This could get real interesting : http://cgi.ebay.com/Harmony-Stratotone-Guitar-Model-H44_W0QQitemZ200119250612QQihZ010QQcategoryZ119094 QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[S.W.Erdnase]

Boy. That's one ugly mo fo guitar...

[Poppa Stoppa]

H88 for ya:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=017&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=270133500878&rd=1&rd=1

[Strat-O]

The Louis Electric amps look cool and I'm sure they sound good but, man are they expensive. I mean all of those hand wired, well made amps are expensive nowadays, but they are like top dollar. I've got several great amps of my own but play these two Blues Juniors 90% of the time. Its crazy.

[jumpnblues]

Strat-O,

Man, you are sooo right. I had to swallow hard to make the Paypal transfer from plastic. But I'm starting to work my way through "buyer's remorse". Strangely enough, I've found when I do seemingly stupid stuff like this I usually end up glad I did as long as I know I can eventually pay for it. But I did do my homework on this amp and for the styles of music I play (jazz, West Coast jump/swing blues, Chicago blues) this should be (for me) just about the ultimate amp. And if I can get anywhere near the tone on the website sound samples I'll be a very happy guitar player. I do already have 2 pretty darn good sounding amps in their own right...40 watt Allen Encore head and 4x10" cab and Victoria 35115T Tweed Pro. But I think this will fill a void for a single, more versatile, relatively low powered amp, with a master volume, that I can use in small to medium venues. Those are some of my rationalizations anyway ;). Take Care.

Tom

[Dave Orban]

H88 for ya:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=017&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=270133500878&rd=1&rd=1
I can only imagine what that sucker will go for... :eek:

[THINSOCKS]

H88 for ya:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ih=017&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWA%3AIT&viewitem=&item=270133500878&rd=1&rd=1

Anyone who has owned one of these will tell you the stock pickups on those guitars are not that great. It's not the same pickups as the H-44.

[KBR]

Had a good Gig last night with Jim Wallace & AC comin out to play the last set.
He brought a Good homemade Tele with Don Mare's pickups, I got to try it out on an Albert Collins Groove and Nailed that old Truckin Tone on say Frosty.


Don,
You got a bridge pup like that for KBR?

[rhartt1234]

Check out this hack job!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320125743518

I can't imagine what would make someone use turnbuckles!

[Dave Orban]

Check out this hack job!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320125743518

I can't imagine what would make someone use turnbuckles!They didn't have any duct tape...?!? :confused:

[Poppa Stoppa]

Check out this hack job!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320125743518

I can't imagine what would make someone use turnbuckles!The high bid was $1567 for a long time up to less than 30secs before the auction closed, when it zipped up to $2162. What do you think it would cost to restore from that condition, and what would it be then worth?

[zappafrank]

Had a good Gig last night with Jim Wallace & AC comin out to play the last set.
He brought a Good homemade Tele with Don Mare's pickups, I got to try it out on an Albert Collins Groove and Nailed that old Truckin Tone on say Frosty.


Don,
You got a bridge pup like that for KBR?

Finally---I get to post about playing w/ someone from this thread, like all those east coast boys get to do all the time...

KBR---I'll talk w/ Don and pull that pickup out to see what he etched on the bottom as far as ohmage/output---it's a custom wind, and I forgot the specs, and I wanna know anyway---it's a rewind of a standard Fender USA 52' RI tele set I had him do, so I know he had to magnetize it to get it up to where he felt comfortable, but it does have the correct alnico 'number' (3?---5?---can't remember) for a 52' tele---he does magic, don't he??:D

----AND you kicked my a** last night, man---I can only dream of having such a handle/mastery of playing in the styles of the 2 Alberts (and MANY others!) as you have---I'm just too lazy/distracted to devote all the time i'd need to REALLY nail my fave blues stylists like that---I can just cop a little of some of my hero's general vibe, but not their actual licks, and then just hope it comes out with some kind of aural stamp that says 'that's ac'---but you are in a whole different arena---you sounded GREAT!

(Too bad my reverb was non-functioning on the Carr Rambler last night!---I felt so...so...so...NAKED!!!):o

ac

[zappafrank]

Check out this hack job!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=320125743518

I can't imagine what would make someone use turnbuckles!

Ryan---never again shall you post a link to such PORNOGRAPHY!! BLASPHEMY!!!:nono:crazyguy


Ouch!!:FM

ac

[jumpnblues]

ac,

I've posted many times on a couple different forums about Kenny. He is a bona fide blues monster. Waayyyy underrated and is always true to the blues. Also, a great guy. Keep doin' it Kenny!! :AOK:AOK:cool:

Tom

[Strat-O]

[quote=zappafrank;2608044]RyanPORNOGRAPHY!! BLASPHEMY!!!:nono:crazyguy


Damn. That's like some kind of guitar bondage, freak shit. I won't be able to sleep tonight. :Spank

[KBR]

AC,

You play some Great Stuff, yo bad self...I see why you get some work.

I am an Old Cat, been doin Collins/The Kings since about 66..before that I was
tryin to do Freddie King, before that tryin Surf/ or the Stones in 64/65, got Hip to Butterfield and BB/Albert then I was on the Road to the Tone/Soul Avenues.

[zappafrank]

Kenny---Thanks man---that's quite a compliment coming from you---I KNOW you've heard hundreds and hundreds of great blues players over the years---I'm just striving to be a "Good 'un", as Muddy used to say---lot's of work left to do to get there, and I know that 'there' will keep changing and get further away the more I learn---and that's the fun and the hell of it, ain't it?---

ac

[RickyKing]

Hello all,
I just thought i'd chime in on my own weekend tone quest report here.
This weekend my band played @ The Onset Bay Blues Cafe (a little joint in Onset MA, almost on the Cape),anyway Great tone from my Allen Hot Fudge W/Nuts and the Blackguard Tele put together from a body from our own Thin Socks powered by Lollar vintage set. TONE HEAVEN!

[RickyKing]

BTW I have a pair of P-13's that have to go....
If any body needs them we can talk.
http://s156.photobucket.com/albums/t32/RickyKing_album/

[btg]

I know the subject of the Red Devils has come up here before, here is a post from Joel Foy from another board regarding the origins of the band.

The band that became known as the Red Devils started out as a four-
piece with a weekly gig at the King King. L.A.'s got a million
stories of these kinds of clubs that spring up out of nowhere, get
trendy very quickly, and then die out when the next trend starts.
The original band, which was called the "Blue Devils..Blue
Shadows..........Blue Flames......." or something along those lines
featured Lester Butler on harp and vocals, Greg "Smokey" Hormel (yes,
as in Hormel Meats) on guitar, Bill Bateman from The Blasters on
drums, and Johnny Ray Bartell on bass. It was a killer little blues
combo playing through small amps and sounded about as close as you
could get to what you might have heard in the Southside clubs with
Jr. Wells or Little Walter in 1954 or 55 - no effects on the amps -
Smoky on an arch-top and Lester both playing through small single-
speaker amps, Smoky a Fender, Lester, a Gibson. People on the blues
scene started noticing them very quickly, and so did some of the
Hollywood party crowd. At some point, somebody stole Lester's small
Gibson, and he replaced it with a Bassman. The band got a little
louder, and no longer had quite the same vibe. Lester's tone was
never as raw and cool after that. Then Johnny Ray's older guitar-
playing brother, who looked a little like a cross between Andy Warhol
and Jack Nicholson (I know, I know-kind of scary to think about)
started hanging out and pestering Johnny Ray to get him in the band.
Johnny and Lester relented, and this guy came in and suddenly the
band was much louder, and quite a bit stiffer sounding. The much
higher volume, and obvious change in groove was frustrating to
Smokey, who eventually just walked away. By this time the band was
generating enough buzz to attract pretty good crowds on whatever
nights they were down there....forget now whether it was a weeknight
or weekend. There were a few music industry folks checking them out,
too. Jr. Watson filled in for Smokey for a little while, and the
industry goons were complaining to Lester that they didn't like Jr's
look, he was too old, didn't fit, etc., etc...one of the greatest
blues guitarists on the planet, and as usual, the record guys were
tone-deaf and clueless. At some point Paul Size showed up in town,
maybe to work some with Hook Herrera, I'm not really sure why, or
how, or maybe he was brought out by Bill and Lester. At any rate,
Jr. was keeping pretty busy with Canned Heat, and Paul jumped in and
it became The Red Devils a very energetic and quite a bit more
commercial rockin' blues band. That was when guys like Bruce Willis
and Mick Jagger started getting interested. Most of what happened
after that is pretty well documented......recordings with Jagger,
huge weekend crowds at the King-King, etc. Lester kind of spun out
eventually, started partying all the time, missing gigs, and
ultimately didn't survive the celebrity status, unfortunately.
Anyhow, there's some background from one who was there.

[valcotone]

Anyone who has owned one of these will tell you the stock pickups on those guitars are not that great. It's not the same pickups as the H-44.

I owned an Aldens H88 just like the one Wiley is auctioning... I agree, they really don't sound as good as an H44. I love that black + gold fleck finish though.

I documented mine when I got it: http://www.kilback.net/aldens/

[rjkohrs]

"from another board regarding the origins of the band."

Thanks for the info on the Red Devils. Which board is this?

[THINSOCKS]

I know the subject of the Red Devils has come up here before, here is a post from Joel Foy from another board regarding the origins of the band.

The band that became known as the Red Devils started out as a four-
piece with a weekly gig at the King King. L.A.'s got a million
stories of these kinds of clubs that spring up out of nowhere, get
trendy very quickly, and then die out when the next trend starts.
The original band, which was called the "Blue Devils..Blue
Shadows..........Blue Flames......." or something along those lines
featured Lester Butler on harp and vocals, Greg "Smokey" Hormel (yes,
as in Hormel Meats) on guitar, Bill Bateman from The Blasters on
drums, and Johnny Ray Bartell on bass. It was a killer little blues
combo playing through small amps and sounded about as close as you
could get to what you might have heard in the Southside clubs with
Jr. Wells or Little Walter in 1954 or 55 - no effects on the amps -
Smoky on an arch-top and Lester both playing through small single-
speaker amps, Smoky a Fender, Lester, a Gibson. People on the blues
scene started noticing them very quickly, and so did some of the
Hollywood party crowd. At some point, somebody stole Lester's small
Gibson, and he replaced it with a Bassman. The band got a little
louder, and no longer had quite the same vibe. Lester's tone was
never as raw and cool after that. Then Johnny Ray's older guitar-
playing brother, who looked a little like a cross between Andy Warhol
and Jack Nicholson (I know, I know-kind of scary to think about)
started hanging out and pestering Johnny Ray to get him in the band.
Johnny and Lester relented, and this guy came in and suddenly the
band was much louder, and quite a bit stiffer sounding. The much
higher volume, and obvious change in groove was frustrating to
Smokey, who eventually just walked away. By this time the band was
generating enough buzz to attract pretty good crowds on whatever
nights they were down there....forget now whether it was a weeknight
or weekend. There were a few music industry folks checking them out,
too. Jr. Watson filled in for Smokey for a little while, and the
industry goons were complaining to Lester that they didn't like Jr's
look, he was too old, didn't fit, etc., etc...one of the greatest
blues guitarists on the planet, and as usual, the record guys were
tone-deaf and clueless. At some point Paul Size showed up in town,
maybe to work some with Hook Herrera, I'm not really sure why, or
how, or maybe he was brought out by Bill and Lester. At any rate,
Jr. was keeping pretty busy with Canned Heat, and Paul jumped in and
it became The Red Devils a very energetic and quite a bit more
commercial rockin' blues band. That was when guys like Bruce Willis
and Mick Jagger started getting interested. Most of what happened
after that is pretty well documented......recordings with Jagger,
huge weekend crowds at the King-King, etc. Lester kind of spun out
eventually, started partying all the time, missing gigs, and
ultimately didn't survive the celebrity status, unfortunately.
Anyhow, there's some background from one who was there.

I have a cassette tape somewhere of the early Red Devils with Smokey on guitar. Smokey is a favorite of mine. My friend who saw them a lot around this time told me that Smokey was using a TV Pro. He also mentioned the same thing about the volume getting louder as time went on, etc.

[THINSOCKS]

Hello all,
I just thought i'd chime in on my own weekend tone quest report here.
This weekend my band played @ The Onset Bay Blues Cafe (a little joint in Onset MA, almost on the Cape),anyway Great tone from my Allen Hot Fudge W/Nuts and the Blackguard Tele put together from a body from our own Thin Socks powered by Lollar vintage set. TONE HEAVEN!

I'll have to see a picture of that guitar sometime, Rick. I think that was the first body I ever cut.

[btg]

"from another board regarding the origins of the band."

Thanks for the info on the Red Devils. Which board is this?


North Texas Blues on Yahoo

[zappafrank]

North Texas Blues on Yahoo


btg---I was stunned reading your posts on this (I know joel---I doubt he remembers me...)

The Red Devils, as 'most' regular folks know them, is a huge influence on what I'd wish I could do if i was a BLUES/rock band/guitarist, not a ROCK/blues guitarist---I really wish I could have heard the 'formative' years/vibe...

I'd heard Smokey, of course---but really did'nt know his bag until I saw him w/ T. Waits on the 'Get Behind The Mule' tour, w/ banjo's, Danelectro's, and a great tone from an old Silvertone Twin---just one of THE best shows EVER performed, IMO, at the Eugene, Oregon Silva Concert Hall---luckily---SOMEONE made a 'boot' of that show---and I have it as a 'document'---un-freaking-believable---Waits is....well, YOU fill in the blank--indescribable---and Hormel SMOKED (pun intended---BIG TIME!);)

ac

PS---I still wanna be a Red Devil---and a WC blues band stylist---I'll be wishing that until I'm 6 feet under---

btg---that was AWESOME!----THANKS!
:AOK

[dukeh62]

If any of you guys are interested in a white JLV strat with Callaham block/saddles, shoot me an email. Going to be unloading mine.

[RickyKing]

I'll have to see a picture of that guitar sometime, Rick. I think that was the first body I ever cut.
It is really light and rings like a bell.....:AOK

[THINSOCKS]

That's good to know, becuase I have a few other bodies that are cut from the same board and about the same weight.

Also, didn't your Tweed Bandmaster have a changed 4 ohm BF or SF output transformer in it? How did that sound?

[aja]

i just got back from playing with Preston and los carnales what a great bass player and band. the best I've ever played with. it was an amazing week. and i'm moving out their tomorrow for good.

[aja]

that junior watson vid is killer !! love the reverb !!!

[DonM]

Don,
You got a bridge pup like that for KBR?

YIPPIE! :RoCkIn

KBR, Always dug yer' playing, glad to help ya' gets' some tones anytime!



PM me..
Don Mare..

[mikelaw]

If any of you guys are interested in a white JLV strat with Callaham block/saddles, shoot me an email. Going to be unloading mine.

And to that point, I will be unloading a 62-63 brown concert 4-10 combo amp. Let me know if interested.

[Strat-O]

Mike - I may have a cohort who might want it. I've sent you several emails and PM's over the past month on other topics but haven't heard anything back from you. How do I get in contact with you?

[Scott Miller]

What we have here is the sound of an H-44 played pretty darn clean and mellow. Kind of different. It's my Juniortone, the pedigree of which goes back to Thinsocks, I believe, when it was a mere plank o' wood.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wg2DXwgMBiQ

And if you simply can't get enough of me, there's more at:

http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=hebjo11

[RickyKing]

That's good to know, becuase I have a few other bodies that are cut from the same board and about the same weight.

Also, didn't your Tweed Bandmaster have a changed 4 ohm BF or SF output transformer in it? How did that sound?
That one didn't really have it,too many changed parts,so Gil Southworth got it... and i'd get those bodies together...I bet I could sell one for ya!

[THINSOCKS]

What we have here is the sound of an H-44 played pretty darn clean and mellow. Kind of different. It's my Juniortone, the pedigree of which goes back to Thinsocks, I believe, when it was a mere plank o' wood.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wg2DXwgMBiQ

And if you simply can't get enough of me, there's more at:

http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=hebjo11

Yeah, that I sold him for $100.

[KBR]

AC,

tell me what ohms and what model Don Mare Tele bridge pup y'll use..I got to have one!
Kenny Blue Ray

[Dave Orban]

AC,

tell me what ohms and what model Don Mare Tele bridge pup y'll use..I got to have one!
Kenny Blue RayI've got a set of Don's "Roy Nichols" winds in a Swamp Ash parts Tele, and let me tell you, it sounds REALLY sweet...! :dude

[KBR]

Yeah, Man

after using and selling alot of Van Zandts, I am switching over, asafp.

[zappafrank]

AC,

tell me what ohms and what model Don Mare Tele bridge pup y'll use..I got to have one!
Kenny Blue Ray

Kenny---I will---as soon as I get to my friends ohm meter---give me until friday--i'm sadly still working the vampire shift---BUT---only 6 more work days of that s**t!!---I'll PM you my phone number, ok?---Call ANY time, bro:AOK---I'm SUPER glad you played that tele and dug those Don Mare pickups as much as I do---pretty much validates everything I've felt about those pickups and that guitar---and I know you have heard ALMOST everything out there---Mare really has something special going on---he figured the 'magic-secret recipe' out through hard work and diligence and experimentation---I hope he is super-successful---but not so much that just EVERYONE has to have a set--- I wanna have SOME kind of 'edge' in the tone wars!!:D

anyone know where I can get aged nickle 'bucker covers and aged nickle Grover Rotomatics, aged lightweight tailpiece and an aged Les Paul P. Guard, switchring, and pickup surrounds without breaking the bank??:D

Dear God---it just NEVER f'n ends, does it!!??

ac

---nighty night, fellas--

[Strat-O]

KBR - I use the 0038 set. Both pickups are outrageous.

[KBR]

Thanks all y'all..I'm gonna get some, as much as I play Albert Coliins and some Soul Stuff...I got to.

AC call me Friday, I left the # on your machine, & Strat O tell me about the 38's..

[TwoFeets]

Happy Wednesday, y'all. Just got back from Boston, where, due to the uncertain nature of family events, I utterly failed to hook up with Jon for a bit of jamming. I see you guys have been fairly busy for a few days while I've been gone - some cool videos posted and so on!

[Strat-O]

KBR - I posted a relatively lengthy description last night, and its not here. Crazy. I'll have to give it another shot later.

Scott - Your band sounds good. Nice guitar playing!

[nc slim]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3DQLR9OmJrw&mode=related&search=

[TwoFeets]

Heads up AC, aged nickel Grover rotomatics in the classifieds:

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=258341

[zappafrank]

Heads up AC, aged nickel Grover rotomatics in the classifieds:

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=258341

Thanks, man---I owe ya one!:AOK

ac

[zappafrank]

Oh well---already gone---sleeping days SUCKS!

ac

[dddelta]

Just Swingin'!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4S0-UBjeJ4

[TwoFeets]

Just Swingin'!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4S0-UBjeJ4

Percolatin', even!

That was my phone ringtone for a while.

[zappafrank]

Just Swingin'!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4S0-UBjeJ4

that was---RIDICULOUS!!!

Perhaps, arguably, the best alive for what we love on this thread--just cookin', greasy, melodic, funky, energized, rhythmically interesting, inspired improvisation, passion, great sound and tone, and ALWAYS going for something new---my GD hero, man--

(along w/ Fats, Watson, Earl, BB, Zappa!:BEER)

THANK YOU DDELTA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ac

[zappafrank]

Excuse me for straying off topic for a moment but I need some feedback on the Amps And Cabs forum from my blues playin' buddies here familiar with Louis Electric amps. I feel it's relevant here as they're used primarily by blues and roots music people and that's who I need the feedback from. So, I'd appreciate it if anyone familiar with L.E. amps, EL-34 vs 6L6 tubes, and going with just a 12" vs both a 12" and 10" speaker in a combo cab would check out my post and respond. Dang, I wish there was a whole separate forum for blues/jazz guys. But that's a whole different discussion. OK...at ease...carry on. :cool::cool:

Tom


Hey Tom (from Denver???---Do I know ya??)

Did you get that Louis amp??---what's the story, morning glory?:crazy


ac

[Poppa Stoppa]

Just Swingin'!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4S0-UBjeJ4
That was great - loved the Charlie Parker-isms. Also the Mighty Flyers clip with Alex Schultz doing 'Black Night' you posted a while back was excellent...

Also BTG - thanks for Joel Foy's story about the origins of the Red Devils.

[GOLDENSTRAT]

Some great commentsand observations from Sean Carney in the new Blueswax. Haven't heard him yet, I have to check into him. fred

[Schwalbe]

Just Swingin'!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P4S0-UBjeJ4

DANG!! And I gotta open for that guy in a week. Not nearly enough time to practice.

[DonM]

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=261111

I hope this is OK, that I link this over here in the westcoast thread, you guys need to know these things.. is why I felt it was a good idea.

Just a little extra effort on my part, for a good cause, (TONE!) to provide folks who care with some_very special_ Harmony H44 Stratotone "Reissue" pickups.

cheers
Don

[rjkohrs]

Don, this is great news!! I've always heard that the manufacturing of the pickup covers is the expensive part of the operation and that is (was) why makers stayed away from trying to recreate hershey bars. The "reissues" you make, should go out the door like hotcakes!!
Randy

[zappafrank]

Sigh---there I go again getting in trouble with my big mouth in the 'Ana Popovich' thread---I should know better---it's TRULY only 'safe' in THIS THREAD!---They dare not speak of what they know not! LOL!


I'm like a new Dad (apologies to those that really ARE Dads!)---I got my #1, my baby, my muse, my...whatever...back today--the 1966 ES-335!--It's been in my luthiers shop since 10/13/06!!!!

I know long time ---I told him to finish evertyhing on his plate so he could really spend all the time he needed, physically and psychologically, to fix that cracked-and-badly-repaired (by some other bozo) headstock that had begun to separate---

It was TOTALLY WORTH THE WAIT!!!---It's fantastic, and I cannot tell, in ANY way, that he has done work, except for an extra half an inch length or so on the 'stinger' he painted on the back, and under really bright light along the side of the headstock---just a very feint shadow--

And I took it for a spin Thursday night, w/ Paris Slim on the other guitar---the rhythm section was doing some incredible ESP type locking---I played one full set and just had a s--t eatin' grin the whole time---I even named it tonite---but I'm NOT telling what it is---that would be VERY bad luck at this time---but I know it, and that's all that matters...TwoFeets probably has a clue..heh heh...

Slim did 'Think I'll Go Shopping Blues"---all minors, and was cracking me up so bad during my solo--"Play SAD AC---Hmmm---I don't know Jim---he sounds too happy to me---dude needs to get some blues---sounds like Rory Gallagher---"--that kinda bag---then he dropped the whole band out at a weird-ass spot, and I was on my own for about 2 full go-arounds, while he was doing this rap---I was dyin'!!--It was freakin' hilarious, but I kept it together enough for the audience to show a little love---then it was his turn and I said " Well Jim, I admit it--Paris sounds more SAD than me---In MORE WAYS THAN ONE!---Hmm---he just came back from Cali---he's sounding like---uh---Tommy Castro"--etc--and HE almost lost it (no offense meant AT ALL to Rory or Tommy, who are fantastic players, in fact I own CD's/albums by both of em'--- we could have said anyone's name, and that would have cracked us up ---it was all in good fun)

OK--you had to be there---the set was KILLER and fun--

Saturday night, I intend to crash KBR's and Suburban Slim's little party at the Trail's End---thanks for the invite, Kenny!--I'll call ya Friday afternoon or so--

long post---sorry-

ac

[Dave Orban]

Sounds like a LOT of fun to me...!

[zappafrank]

Sounds like a LOT of fun to me...!

It was, Dave, I assure you!--:D

time for a nap--

ac

[HappyValley]

Warning to any New Englanders who plan on seeing Sugar Ray & the Bluetones at Gilreins in Worcester Saturday...it's not too late for a refund!! LOL.
Myself and Duke H62 will be manning the guitar seat(s) to fill the very large shoes of Mike Welch and what is usually Anthony Geraci in the piano spot. Reed/ Taylor & Lockwood/Tucker time!!

In the "what are the chances...." category:
EnRoute to the Darrell shows in Canada we hit a random service area somewhere outside Buffalo for some grub and to loosen the legs. Leaving the gentlmen's room we stumble into Senor Welch & the entire Bluetones clan!
Turns out they were going to play the Festival on Saturday that we were doing on Sunday....small-ass world.
(Retrospectively, I wish I hadn't followed Darrell's lead and tried the biscuits-n-gravy. Eeech).

[Dave Orban]

Warning to any New Englanders who plan on seeing Sugar Ray & the Bluetones at Gilreins in Worcester Saturday...it's not too late for a refund!! LOL.
Myself and Duke H62 will be manning the guitar seat(s) to fill the very large shoes of Mike Welch and what is usually Anthony Geraci in the piano spot. Reed/ Taylor & Lockwood/Tucker time!!

LOL!

You guys will do FINE, I'm certain!

FWIW, I'll be backing up Harman and Nathan James on some August dates, in Pennsylvania and Delaware... :eek:

I can tell you that I'm just a wee bit anxious about THAT.

[KBR]

Yo Don,

as soon as AC hips me to the tele set he has from you, I am gonna order a set!

Maybe a Strat neck Pup, too.

[jackrudy]

The Blue Shadows plus The Blasters

I'm a bit player in the Red Devils saga, and for those interested, at the new King King in Hollywood, the Blue Shadows and the original Blasters are performing for a live taping of a film.

Monday June 25, 2007
9pm
King King
6555 Hollywood Blvd, Hollywood, CA 90028
$12

The Blue Shadows are:
Bill Bateman, Johnny Bazz, Javier Matos, Jack Rudy

The Original Blasters are:
Dave Alvin, Phil Alvin, Bill Bateman, Johnny Bazz

Radio: The Blue Shadows will be live on "Watusi Rodeo with Chris Morris" this Sunday from 9 a.m.-11 a.m. on Indie 103.1 in Los Angeles.

P.S. My apologies if posting gigs is against the rules. I'm new here, and a harmonica player so my learning curve is a little slow.

[Dave Orban]

The Blue Shadows plus The Blasters

I'm a bit player in the Red Devils saga, and for those interested, at the new King King in Hollywood, the Blue Shadows and the original Blasters are performing for a live taping of a film.

Monday June 25, 2007
9pm
King King
6555 Hollywood Blvd, Hollywood, CA 90028
$12

The Blue Shadows are:
Bill Bateman, Johnny Bazz, Javier Matos, Jack Rudy

The Original Blasters are:
Dave Alvin, Phil Alvin, Bill Bateman, Johnny Bazz

Radio: The Blue Shadows will be live on "Watusi Rodeo with Chris Morris" this Sunday from 9 a.m.-11 a.m. on Indie 103.1 in Los Angeles.

P.S. My apologies if posting gigs is against the rules. I'm new here, and a harmonica player so my learning curve is a little slow.Post away, bro... post away! :dude

[RickyKing]

Tonight!!
Ricky"King"Russell Trio W The Memphis Rockabilly Band
Johnny D's Somerville (Boston) MA
TMRB has my bud Billy Coover in the guitar chair doin' the Sun Era thing.
He's amazin at this stuff...and we get to do a thang @ the end !!
A rockin night ahead!

[TwoFeets]

We opened for the Cramps here at the Orlando HOB a couple of years ago and they had Bill Bateman on drums. That guy's outrageous!

[HappyValley]

Tonight!!
Ricky"King"Russell Trio W The Memphis Rockabilly Band
Johnny D's Somerville (Boston) MA
TMRB has my bud Billy Coover in the guitar chair doin' the Sun Era thing.
He's amazin at this stuff...and we get to do a thang @ the end !!
A rockin night ahead!

Go git 'em Rick-o!!

(I talked to RickyKing on the phone the other day as he was noodlin' around with his recently set up H62 through his amp du jour and WOW was there some happenin' tone and playing going on....when you can still pickup TONE o'er the digito-transistorized phone lines - lookout!)

[afenderman67]

hey guy's i'm going to be selling or maybe open for trading a Epiphone Emperor Regent guitar with case, its like new. $450 or OBO, if anyone is interested in it e-mail me?

chrishttp://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa101/afenderman67/th_mygear056.jpghttp://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa101/afenderman67/th_mygear055.jpg

[Strat-O]

KBR - The short story on the 0038's is they are kind of a beefy Tele pickup set. Both pickups are killer.

The neck does hollow body tone extremely well. Kinda like a P90 neck pickup, but it does sound like a Tele. The great thing about it is that its not all muddy like other Tele neck pickups I've used. Not too bright, but plenty of top end. Killer T-Bone sound too.

The bridge isn't really a thin nasally tone like some Tele bridge pickups. Has a nice fat tone like BB King did in the 50's on alot his recordings. Like on "Three O'clock Blues" you know, cranked up. Turn it down and it goes all 50's chicago or 50's gatemouth/johnny gtr. Gets a nice Otis Rush, "Your Turn to Cry" tone too. They can sing too for Otis Rush tunes like "Me". I don't do any Albert Collins or Albert King type playing though, not intentionally anyway.

The middle position is cool as crap. Does that clucky thing real well, but the way the two pickups blend is totally cool. With the gtr volume cranked you get this cool overdrive from the bridge pickup mixed in with the neck.

Anybody who's ever played my Tele or heard it is blown away by it. Everybody's different though, so I don't know how you hear things. I wanted an early 50's sounding Tele and they sound just as advertised. I should warn you that I run all my amps with the treble all the way up and the bass (and mids if there's a mid knob) all the off. Amp volume is usually just above a grind level. I use the guitar volume/tone controls alot.

What I find amazing about the 0038's is that I always get a surprise with the tone at gigs. Its very cool to discover some new cool tone. Nothing harsh or brittle about these thing. Not hi-fi sounding either. Hope this helps some. Don's figured something out about pickup making and tone, that's for sure.

[KBR]

Hey Thanks, Strat-0

That is a good description, I do T Bone, a little Otis Rush, and Like all the Cats you mentioned, what is the ohms of the neck & bridge pups read...
I use the tone control all night long, only using it wide open on a few cut through leads.

AC gave me his readings and I may go with his Bridge pup and you're neck pup reading to make my own trip happening, but I am gettin a Feather Pine tele and gonna wail on that Mo~Fo fo shore!

[HappyValley]

Strat-O
I have the old Holmstrom White Tele which has a real 50's bridge PUP and a custom wound neck pup which sounds close to the specs you gave regarding Don's stuff....I'm still tempted however! Do you know the "k"values on these?

[jetlag]

KBR - The short story on the 0038's is they are kind of a beefy Tele pickup set. Both pickups are killer.


Strato - that sounds really cool. Do you know what your back pup ohms is? Is the front pup as loud as the back pup?

KBR - what did you decide on for a bridge pup? What were the readings and/or which model was it?

Oops, sorry. I didn't see Nick's post there (hadn't refreshed browser).

[KBR]

I'm gonna use AC's tele first set tonight and check the Neck pup, the Bridge pup I am thinging of going like AC's around 6.6K-6.9K...
I have used alot of Van Zandts bridge pups from 7.2K-7.8K they sound good but not as good as Don Mare's.

Neck pups I generally use a weird Tele neck pup like P94s, Mini HBers, or a Strat pup.
I am gonna go w/ regular Tele neck pup as I crib on the Bridge pup and use Tone controls for variation of Tones.

[jumpnblues]

Kenny and ac,

I ordered a set of the Rick Holmstroms based on what I heard on the website (youtube?). They sound like they pretty much drip fat. I ordered a new light weight USACG swamp ash Tele body and maple neck/fretboard and will be ordering a Callaham hardware kit to go with it. The Mare-Holmstroms are going in that guitar. It'll be Mary Kaye with a black guard and have the same exact neck profile as my other 3 USACG guitars. About a week and a half ago I gave Lou Rosano the "go ahead" on a new Louis Electric one off KR-12 with both a 12" and a 10" speaker and tweed cab with brown piping. He was so excited about the amp he called me yesterday and...it's DONE! He built it so fast I'll need to hustle to get the remainder of the cash together for it. I've sent him a little more than half the coin for the amp. Lou said he tried his Gretsch through it and the amp sounds lethal. That's good because it was designed especially for my Gibbie ES-5 Switchmaster with Lollar P-90's but should sound fabulous with about anything plugged into it.
He's going to try and catch Duke Robillard who'll soon be in the local area and have him play through it. Duke already has an amp or two made by Lou. It'll be interesting to hear what Duke thinks of it if he gets a chance to play through it.
Anyway, just thought I'd toot my ax a little. Well, I gotta' go try and figure a way to get the balance together for my amp a little sooner than expected. See ya's on the boards. :AOK:cool::cool:

Tom

[zappafrank]

Tom---that sounds like a DANGEROUS rig---man, too cool--Congrats

We will wanna see that Tele---oh yeah---that L.E. amp too, of course!

Dave O.---Aww man---you will be killin' with James and Nathan---I mean, that's just a dream gig---you dig in and have fun!!!! ALSO Congrats---!


Nick and others---I'll give up the 'k' values after another short chat with Don first to make SURE I got things right and give you guys the very best info I can---soon---like, within a day or two---

ac

[zappafrank]

I'm gonna use AC's tele first set tonight and check the Neck pup, the Bridge pup I am thinging of going like AC's around 6.6K-6.9K...
I have used alot of Van Zandts bridge pups from 7.2K-7.8K they sound good but not as good as Don Mare's.-----



Yeah, I kinda suspect that although perhaps the K readings are important, there's something else going on in those pickups that just make them sound so special and put out the juice the way we all want em, lower or higher K's!:AOK

See ya tonite Kenny---I may have to show up around 2nd set---is that still cool with you? If I need to be there earlier, I can---let me know!

ac

[zappafrank]

jackrudy---WELCOME to the coolest blues thread on the TGP---Nay, in tHE WORLD!!!

I am a huge Red Devils/Lester Butler and Blasters fan---as some here can attest---

Nice to have you aboard!---keep us updated and tell us some good stories, Jack!

ac

[KBR]

AC,

just bring the Amp & Tele in and plug in, I'll end the song and bring y'all up!~

ps
don't forget That Tele!!

[KBR]

Anyone know what a Les Paul Recording Guitar is worth?
I am a Pro, but never owned one, bad back... yellow w/ great checking (Nitro) serial # starts with a 3, 83? 93? 73?
LP Custom inlays on headstock..
?
TIA,

[zappafrank]

AC,

just bring the Amp & Tele in and plug in, I'll end the song and bring y'all up!~

ps
don't forget That Tele!!

Kenny---Don't ya worry, mang---I won't forget---in fact I just had the intonation touched up and I'll put a fresh set o' strings on it for ya---I'll play the ES-335----should be fun---just don't tear me a new one TOO bad, ok?:nono:o:D

ac

[mikelaw]

stratotone nut width is 1 3/4" Im thinking of doing that PLUS fatback for my strat. anyone ever do a 1 3/4 for a strat or tele?

[DonM]

Unbelievable but 100% true,
the wind pattern here breaks all the set rules as we once knew about reproduction aftermarket pickups,
I can wind 1.5k to 20k by changing gauges and the usual things we once could repetitively predict- Just prior to me discovering this old unique Fender winder's pattern -aka. Rosie Wrap-

( the bad stuff ) does not ever seem to occur --
never are they - thin - shrill - ear biting- or flabby on the bass or obnoxiously thick in the mids --

Fender was smart enough to leave this lady alone- rumor is Leo knew one winder sounded better then the others, I seen his first advertisement for the Tele and in it he wrote BEST SOUNDING SINGLE COIL PICKUPS IN THE WORLD.. ( her name is not actually, Rosie) ( wished I was able to locate who she was - she deserves to be recognized for her accomplishments _ not me_ all I did was copy her pattern) anyways Leo always let her wind them her way.. the first one i discovered was a 1951 then a 56 and 57 and a 61..
all the pups came here with the same stories.. they sounded better then other vintage guitars all those years while they were alive working, --
the pattern whooped my butt... 8 months of learning curves... pickups once flew into snaggly birds nest - I was cutting up 2-to-3 pickups to get one done, friends that were hanging out here worried about me- that I was not going to be able to produce these things and have 10 minutes to myself - they would come here to visit as usual and end up leaving because I was stuck on the winder, answers came in my sleep and i woke up with ideas a few times that really helped.. after 8 months I could finally wind a "Rosie Wrap" start to finish without stopping the machine and with perfect results - tight _ LOUD_ coils just like she wound.. the pattern is that different that it requires months of dedication to fully encapsulate and produce..

it was her unique way of doing things -- it really just looks like a short -cut fool proof way for her to have been able to set there for entire days and get them done.. after learning the pattern it very much was done with ease of operation in mind..

an engineer would have argued she was messing them up, todays boutique winders think I'm making all this up to fool you guys, and that there is no Rosie wrap..

I think my customer history is proving who's in the know and who is not around here and there.

just like there were vintage guitars that dropped your jaws and others not so great.. the pickups were at the heart and soul of the sound,,, yet still today most people are fussing way too much over this fabled sacred old wood "a fashionable statement".

when in truth we have all learned that hand wound pickups from Boutique winders don't sound like the other boutique winders...

there were 3-to 6 winders at Fender, yet somehow without thinking we will lot them all into the same barrel -- and expect variances in Vintage Fender Single Coil Guitars to be solely impart to the wood..

this is utterly ridiculous...

the pickups have so much more to do with the total equasion the the wood, sure the wood matters but allot of it if not all of is boils down to weight and grain -- we have learned formulas to choose bodies and necks here while working closely with several name blues artist --

bodies need be under 5 pounds blank.. preferably 4 and a hair so they will sustain..
grain -- on the body - when viewed at the ends.. ( life rings of the tree log) the tree should have been watered every year and the space between life rings-(grain) should maintain a min. of 1/8" up to 1" but the more consistent 1/8' stacks the better.

grain thats far apart and very light over all, may just act as a spounge
grain thats tight like pages in a book may act like a plastic brick _dead_

The necks, tighter then 1/8" at the heel and tip top of the head stock, and some angle as if quatersawn is best, and FAT BACK as you can take..

Tele Bridges, and saddles, ( avoid reissue Vintage fender bridges and threaded steel saddles) those bridge plates are Hot Rolled steel and will introduce harsh spikes, get the Cold Rolled Blackgaurd from Glendale Guitars $99.00 but worth every penny! the original Teles were Cold Rolled, then Leo discovered it was easier to work with Hot Rolled --and overtones that make spiky bright sounds come into the mix making the player reach for the tone knob prematurely.

next the old vintage threaded steel ( made from long Threaded steel Bolt Stock ) are great for the ONLY REAL Bakersfield sound there was..
Todays Bolt Stock is a different grade of steel then the 50's and the sound is a mess on these reissues.. ( throw those away- LOL)

big 50's Broadcaster looking solid steel barrels and big brass barrel saddles is best.

finally we get to a real important things thats highly overlooked..

TONE CAPS.... invest heavily in real old tone caps.. before there all $200.00 each.. it is the difference between sounding like your farting from inside a cardboard box or sounding like your pressing down a key on the worlds most musical sound organ --- money is no object with caps.. snag them up ASAP! and horde them..

Cheers
my friends!

keep up the TONE! it's all that really matters -- Right?

[zappafrank]

Kenny and all others interested---my Neck on my Don Mare rewinds (they were stock USA Fender 52' RI pickups before I sent em' to Don) reads out at 7.8---and the Bridge is at 6.6

---Don said that was right at his tolerances he allows for all his winds---said sometimes he'll compensate for other varying factors of the pickups, if he thinks he needs to, during the winding and 'Rosie' wrap process to make it all work out--

Now, I know you guys are saying---'wait, that neck has more output than the bridge? is it balanced?'---

YES it is---I wanted a SLIGHTLY more present neck pickup on this, as for my style, I've always thought the necks on Tele's I've had (and always sold...) were pretty darn boring and anemic, and I dig that p90 neck thing a lot (don't worry---THIS TELE NECK DOES NOT SOUND OR DRIVE LIKE A P90!!!!!!)

That was NOT my intention, and these sound like a rich, warm, bluesy, complex, vibrant and lively neck pickup that sounds real cool and fat when you roll the tone knob down, as well!

And that in-between position Strat-O talked about is absolutely right on---cluck and coolness---I'll have to try it with that bridge overdriving a hair while it's mixed with the neck---THAT sounds like it would have some happening stuff going on---thanks Strat-O!

So IT IS a balanced set---don't let the numbers I gave ya fool ya---it was custom wound for my particular tastes, but I think ANY of us would really dig that neck pickup for the West Coast/Chicago/Texas blues styles---I'll never swap it out, and I'll be keeping THIS tele for a LONG time---but I'll loan it out to certain friends to try out---Kenny Blue Ray and Vyasa Dodson among them.

Hope the above helps you guys in any way when you finally just break down and order a set---I figured others can rave about the BRIDGE pickup---that's an obvious 'gimme', but I wanted to really hip you to what I thought about the NECK pickup.

ac

[zappafrank]

OK---I just looked at the wiring on my tele control plate---and my luthier used just a plain, cheap looking small round brownish looking cap for the capacitors!---And it STILL sounds this F'n good??? Wow!

I am replacing that asap with a good oldie---any recommendations??

ac

[TwoFeets]

Anyone seen this one?

Very cool guitar, if the quality is as good as my goldtop.

http://thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=261635

[frank62]

^Mr Mare, very kind of you to share this information and your thoughts on great Tele tone! I find it very intresting that with todays technology we still are finding that the original designs of Fender are still the very heart and soul of great electric guitar sound.

[DonM]

technology can add to vintage, but we must acquire what made great vintage - great-- and then reproduce it -- with real results.
some of those old guitars are still available to A&B with... vintage stores and vintage show booths have always been kind to me in theses regards..

Once you have the ability to reproduce 100% vintage guitar tones -- its cool to customize and take it to the limit! "technology"

prior to winding i used to hang out on lots of forums and the rule of thumb was this; you cqan only hit 80%, -- 80% close to vintage sometimes, 90% with boutique... but that 10%-to-20% eventually left a large amount of tone-seekers "like myself" -wanting more! like! 100%...

On many of the recent trips to A&B not only did I like my guitars better then most of the Vintage ones but so did the owners.

I felt thats because were dialing them in further, better matching the bridge pup with the necks, using really cool specs.. great wood and nice parts,
not just random wood and random DC's ohms like the oldies. ( where it was hit or miss - and from the spec in Nacho's Blackgaurd Book allot of them old Blackgaurd Tele's "Missed")...

Its nice being able to make guitars for myself and friends that mean so much to them..
But a little piece of my heart longs to own at least one untouched real Blackgaurd tele -- stuff from the f50's is just plain cool, and the fact that its real gives off that vibe that can't ever be duplicated!

cheers
Don

[Scott Miller]

"keep up the TONE! it's all that really matters -- Right?"

Well, maybe timing and rhythm matter a little more.

[GOLDENSTRAT]

Just got in from seeing JW Jones and band, he had an organist instead of a bass player. They were playing great. fred

[Poppa Stoppa]

Fascinating stuff about pickups and the wind pattern, Don. You ever try the 'Rosie wrap' on hersheys, P90s, and humbuckers?

Scott Miller is right too - a good player with great timing can sound good on anything. Great tone is so inspiring to start off with however.

Everybody quotes the D.C. resistance of a p/u coil as being representative of the output of the thing. However pickup wire comes in different gauges (as Don said). I would have thought that the number of turns must be more important, combined with the strength & shape of the magnetic field.

[HappyValley]

"keep up the TONE! it's all that really matters -- Right?"

Well, maybe timing and rhythm matter a little more.

I think all of the above matter, but particularly in Blues, one's tone is his/her defining statement because it's their "signature", their individual stamp on the music. Timing and Rhythm are , or should be , prerequisites PRIOR to hitting the studio, or working gig circuit (if there still is such a thing),IMHO.

Now, one phemomenon that has become all too prevalent (again, imho ) is the focus on tone/gear/look taking precedent over musical ability and idea development. The huge overamped 50's Memphis tone that has become synonymous with 'West Coast guitar' has resulted in tons of players/guitar owners who can (afford) & get that SOUND via Kays, Harmony H44's, H62's, Gibson LP GT's, etc. through tweeds,old PA heads, 50's lunchboxes, etc. but the question remains, what are they PLAYING? When you take away the hip gear and put 'em on a Fender through a semi clean amp, what's left ? The real players 'stuff' should translate well through any rig. Maybe not as effectively as through the old cool stuff, or new boutique stuff, but it should still make it. Our current heroes Baty, Holmstrom, Watson, Anson, etc. all sound great playing through anything. I've heard Ronnie playing through a transistor amp with an 8" speaker with no band to a group of special ed kids and sound amazing.

I'm done.(see what you started Scott?) LOL
P.S. This rant comes from a hypocritical guy who played a 1950 ES-5 through a Clark Tweed 3x10 for a portion of the show last nite....:Spank

[zappafrank]

I think all of the above matter, but particularly in Blues, one's tone is his/her defining statement because it's their "signature", their individual stamp on the music. Timing and Rhythm are , or should be , prerequisites PRIOR to hitting the studio, or working gig circuit (if there still is such a thing),IMHO.

Now, one phemomenon that has become all too prevalent (again, imho ) is the focus on tone/gear/look taking precedent over musical ability and idea development. The huge overamped 50's Memphis tone that has become synonymous with 'West Coast guitar' has resulted in tons of players/guitar owners who can (afford) & get that SOUND via Kays, Harmony H44's, H62's, Gibson LP GT's, etc. through tweeds,old PA heads, 50's lunchboxes, etc. but the question remains, what are they PLAYING? When you take away the hip gear and put 'em on a Fender through a semi clean amp, what's left ? The real players 'stuff' should translate well through any rig. Maybe not as effectively as through the old cool stuff, or new boutique stuff, but it should still make it. Our current heroes Baty, Holmstrom, Watson, Anson, etc. all sound great playing through anything. I've heard Ronnie playing through a transistor amp with an 8" speaker with no band to a group of special ed kids and sound amazing.

I'm done.(see what you started Scott?) LOL
P.S. This rant comes from a hypocritical guy who played a 1950 ES-5 through a Clark Tweed 3x10 for a portion of the show last nite....:Spank


That, my friend-I-Have'nt-Met-Yet, is not a rant---it's gospel, bro--

And I'm a hypcrite too---sat in with KBR (who was more than generous and let me just sing on a couple w/out a silly ornament-guitar-in my hands---like that tele o' mine Kenny?:dude--it sure seemed to dig you!), without my own amp---I had a heck of time getting it on with it---just was not my thing, but Suburban Slim ate it alive--(it's his amp, but he's THAT kind of player/singer, too!)---audience seemed to dig what I was doing, but in the back of my head the whole time was that nagging thing saying "c'mon man, get some tone out of this---it's a killer 335, after all"
Oh---there will be no naming of that axe at this time. Oh well, c'est la vie!:crazy

Anyway--I have a long way to go to get to where Nick says a good player should be---my timing has ALWAYS need work---that's this years goal--- to get solid on that so I can play almost any tempo and common rhythmic variation---you just don't get hired if your rhythm is suspect---my Achille's heel---not ALWAYS, but enough to p**s me off--

ac

[HappyValley]

Anyway--I have a long way to go to get to where Nick says a good player should be---my timing has ALWAYS need work---that's this years goal--- to get solid on that so I can play almost any tempo and common rhythmic variation---you just don't get hired if your rhythm is suspect---my Achille's heel---not ALWAYS, but enough to p**s me off--

ac
Zappa my man-- BELIEVE ME-
My inane banter did not intend to imply that I'm at that level by ANY stretch!! I was merely making an observational commentary on my perception of the state of things on the fledgling scene today. My time, *idea flow*, overall facility.....the list goes on....all need plenty-o-sheddin'!! Ask anyone who's heard me- :jo

[Echo Are]

With all due respect, folks, it's nice to have a break from the pickup-winding posts, lol. Interesting stuff, but after a while........ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ:o.

But then, to be fair, I'm Mr. Quick-N-Dirty, Mr Jimmy and Mr. Rig when it comes to gear. Got a Tele that ya love playing, but its pickups don't have much output? F*** it, get a Boss EQ pedal, turn up its output level slider, and stick that in front of it. Done. Problem solved. Go play.

"Well, but, um, well, they didn't have EQ stompboxes back in 1956..."

Well, I ,uh, can't help ya there, dude,lol...

[Scott Miller]

Timing is my bane of existance, which is why I brought it up. At least with tone you can change a damn pickup or something. Speaking of which... nah, I think we already covered the humbucker situation.

OK fine, anyone tried Lollar Imperials?

[musicofanatic5]

He's going to try and catch Duke Robillard who'll soon be in the local area and have him play through it. Duke already has an amp or two made by Lou. It'll be interesting to hear what Duke thinks of it if he gets a chance to play through it.


Hi-if Lou brings your amp to a Duke gig (I think we're in NY next week) I'll let you know how it sounds and Duke's reaction. Duke just got another one from Lou with a single 15". Thing is about Duke; he always sounds like Duke, no matter what he plays through, whether he's using an Explorer on a jazz tune(!), or getting Albert Collins tone on the back p.u. of a Tal Farlow(!!), L.E. or reissue D.R....amazing!

[HappyValley]

Thing is about Duke; he always sounds like Duke, no matter what he plays through!


Now, THAT'S what I'm talkin' 'bout!!

[KBR]

I've been playing a Black face Super with AC's Tele!!
and My Burst Hard tail w/ Lollar Imperials, (Scott) and ask AC, the Tone is there.
I am leaning toward Tele's like AC's, but the Tone is in one's touch as much as anything, Rhythm Guitar is under appreciated, (not by me) I am off to teach, but AC and Suburban Slim were very strong last night.
I had a good time, despite the pipe and cigarette smoke...

[THINSOCKS]

stratotone nut width is 1 3/4" Im thinking of doing that PLUS fatback for my strat. anyone ever do a 1 3/4 for a strat or tele?

Mike, - I have a USACG Tele neck that's 1 11/16ths (Like a older Gibson), so it's only 1/16th off of being 1 3/4ths (pretty darn close). I'm sure you would dig a 1 3/4 if you like playing your stratotone.

[jumpnblues]

Guys, sorry to stray a little here but I (once again) need a blues player's answer to this question...Is there a good reverb pedal out there yet that will compete with the Holy Grail for "Fender reverb tank authenticity"? I don't have room for a tank and my three Holy Grails are starting to get noisy. Has anyone come up with anything as good as the HG? Someone on the TDPRI recommended the Marshall Reflector and Line 6 Verbzilla but most of those guys are country or rock players and don't care about having tank reverb tone. Thanks. :cool::cool:

Tom

[TwoFeets]

Guys, sorry to stray a little here but I (once again) need a blues player's answer to this question...Is there a good reverb pedal out there yet that will compete with the Holy Grail for "Fender reverb tank authenticity"? I don't have room for a tank and my three Holy Grails are starting to get noisy. Has anyone come up with anything as good as the HG? Someone on the TDPRI recommended the Marshall Reflector and Line 6 Verbzilla but most of those guys are country or rock players and don't care about having tank reverb tone. Thanks. :cool::cool:

Tom

Well, the short answer to that question is, "you can't get there from here." Of the small, regular-guy pedals out there, the best of the lot are the Verbzilla and the Digiverb. I owned a Digiverb briefly but returned it; it sounded much better in the store than in an actual band situation. The Verbzilla sounded decent but is pretty bulky and heavy as far as pedals go.

Bill Barnard is out of town right now but he owns a VanAmps Reverbamate and says it's very good. However they're pretty pricey (close to the price of a new tank), and they're kind of big for a pedal from the looks of it.

My problem with a lot of the digital pedals is this really weird "sproink" sound many of them make right before the note. It drives me absolutely bananas!

[frank62]

^Alesis Nanoverb or Microverb.

[zappafrank]

jumpnblues---only one REAL answer to your question, IMO---

I have had a few different outboard reverb tanks over the years---a Kendrick, a Clark Wateree (very much like a Victoria Reverberato w/ Trem, too), a fake Fender 'blackface' asian rip-off tank, complete with Fender silkscreening(that's the one used on the CD with Jimi Bott--you can really hear that one on 'My First Crime')---various pedals (no thanks---sorry!)
but never owned my own real Fender early-mid 60's tank...YET!

But I have now my second Premeir Reverb, and am very happy with it---I did need to have it serviced when I got it to be sure it was reliable, but they are KILLER when functioning right---different than a vintage Fender, adds a bit of grit to the front-end of your amp, and is perfect for trad blues styles, IMO.

hope this helps ya

Here's one on Ebay now: Looks almost identical to mine--

http://cgi.ebay.com/Premier-Tube-Reverberation-Guitar-reverb-unit_W0QQitemZ120134133412QQihZ002QQcategoryZ1288Q QssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

here's one on Ebay that has already sold, to help you with price ranges:--a bit more more trashed than mine, but older styling, too--

http://cgi.ebay.com/Vintage-Premier-Reverb-Unit-60s-Harp-P-A-Surf_W0QQitemZ320126914853QQihZ011QQcategoryZ11899 4QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

you can find these out there in the 200 to 275 range quite often, but they are creeping up a bit

ac

[zappafrank]

Oops--I missed the part about 'not having room for a tank'---too bad, 'cause that's the shiz!

in that case, I might be tempted to go with frank62's suggestions---but that tubey splash might be missing--good pedals for clean 'verb, tho, from what I've heard--

ac

[musicofanatic5]

Guys, sorry to stray a little here but I (once again) need a blues player's answer to this question...Is there a good reverb pedal out there yet that will compete with the Holy Grail for "Fender reverb tank authenticity"?

One word answer: no. I've tried most of all listed here (nanoverb, digiverb, etc.) and the problem is DIGITAL. It's not the tubes, it's the analog circuitry that makes or breaks it. The smallest reverb tank available is the fender solid state unit, but may be pricey due to it's "collectability". I'm not sure what dictates your "space limitations", but I'd say you're screwed unless you don't mind that awful digital sound. G'luck.

[jimfog]

Best of the lot, by far, is the Verbzilla.......not too bad, really, with lots of adjustability. I actually liked it BETTER than the expensive boutique tank I had.......

But you MUST, no excuses or exceptions, use it on it's own power supply or a PedalPower....no daisy-chain, etc.......otherwise all those Line 6 tonecores are hiss-city.......

The EchoPark rocks, too.......and you can tap in rhythmic slap back (dotted 8ths, etc).

- Jim

[zappafrank]

The EchoPark rocks, too.......and you can tap in rhythmic slap back (dotted 8ths, etc).

- Jim

Yeah---that's an amazingly diverse pedal with decent sound, I agree--

ac

[RickyKing]

Well, the short answer to that question is, "you can't get there from here." Of the small, regular-guy pedals out there, the best of the lot are the Verbzilla and the Digiverb. I owned a Digiverb briefly but returned it; it sounded much better in the store than in an actual band situation. The Verbzilla sounded decent but is pretty bulky and heavy as far as pedals go.

Bill Barnard is out of town right now but he owns a VanAmps Reverbamate and says it's very good. However they're pretty pricey (close to the price of a new tank), and they're kind of big for a pedal from the looks of it.

My problem with a lot of the digital pedals is this really weird "sproink" sound many of them make right before the note. It drives me absolutely bananas!
As far as the HG goes one thing that really worked for me was having the
power supply receptacle changed from a female to male fixture so as you can use a better power supply, like a one spot,for instance.
also make sure the input and output jacks are tight as they ground to the box.
all these things have made my HG much more usable....:AOK

[RickyKing]

I think all of the above matter, but particularly in Blues, one's tone is his/her defining statement because it's their "signature", their individual stamp on the music. Timing and Rhythm are , or should be , prerequisites PRIOR to hitting the studio, or working gig circuit (if there still is such a thing),IMHO.

Now, one phemomenon that has become all too prevalent (again, imho ) is the focus on tone/gear/look taking precedent over musical ability and idea development. The huge overamped 50's Memphis tone that has become synonymous with 'West Coast guitar' has resulted in tons of players/guitar owners who can (afford) & get that SOUND via Kays, Harmony H44's, H62's, Gibson LP GT's, etc. through tweeds,old PA heads, 50's lunchboxes, etc. but the question remains, what are they PLAYING? When you take away the hip gear and put 'em on a Fender through a semi clean amp, what's left ? The real players 'stuff' should translate well through any rig. Maybe not as effectively as through the old cool stuff, or new boutique stuff, but it should still make it. Our current heroes Baty, Holmstrom, Watson, Anson, etc. all sound great playing through anything. I've heard Ronnie playing through a transistor amp with an 8" speaker with no band to a group of special ed kids and sound amazing.

I'm done.(see what you started Scott?) LOL
P.S. This rant comes from a hypocritical guy who played a 1950 ES-5 through a Clark Tweed 3x10 for a portion of the show last nite....:Spank

+1 Nicky,I recently played a cruise ship gig to Bermuda and the luggage monkeys wrecked my Reverb-Rocket,so I spent the week playing my customized Chinese Dot through the PA. A Very Character Building experience. Still you gotta' olay the gig!

[zappafrank]

+1 Nicky,I recently played a cruise ship gig to Bermuda and the luggage monkeys wrecked my Reverb-Rocket,so I spent the week playing my customized Chinese Dot through the PA. A Very Character Building experience. Still you gotta' olay the gig!

I wanna play a cruise ship gig!--(albeit a blues cruise, if at all possible!):)

ac

[Buckshot]

I know the subject of the Red Devils has come up here before, here is a post from Joel Foy from another board regarding the origins of the band.

The band that became known as the Red Devils started out as a four-
piece with a weekly gig at the King King. L.A.'s got a million
stories of these kinds of clubs that spring up out of nowhere, get
trendy very quickly, and then die out when the next trend starts.
The original band, which was called the "Blue Devils..Blue
Shadows..........Blue Flames......." or something along those lines
featured Lester Butler on harp and vocals, Greg "Smokey" Hormel (yes,
as in Hormel Meats) on guitar, Bill Bateman from The Blasters on
drums, and Johnny Ray Bartell on bass. It was a killer little blues
combo playing through small amps and sounded about as close as you
could get to what you might have heard in the Southside clubs with
Jr. Wells or Little Walter in 1954 or 55 - no effects on the amps -
Smoky on an arch-top and Lester both playing through small single-
speaker amps, Smoky a Fender, Lester, a Gibson. People on the blues
scene started noticing them very quickly, and so did some of the
Hollywood party crowd. At some point, somebody stole Lester's small
Gibson, and he replaced it with a Bassman. The band got a little
louder, and no longer had quite the same vibe. Lester's tone was
never as raw and cool after that. Then Johnny Ray's older guitar-
playing brother, who looked a little like a cross between Andy Warhol
and Jack Nicholson (I know, I know-kind of scary to think about)
started hanging out and pestering Johnny Ray to get him in the band.
Johnny and Lester relented, and this guy came in and suddenly the
band was much louder, and quite a bit stiffer sounding. The much
higher volume, and obvious change in groove was frustrating to
Smokey, who eventually just walked away. By this time the band was
generating enough buzz to attract pretty good crowds on whatever
nights they were down there....forget now whether it was a weeknight
or weekend. There were a few music industry folks checking them out,
too. Jr. Watson filled in for Smokey for a little while, and the
industry goons were complaining to Lester that they didn't like Jr's
look, he was too old, didn't fit, etc., etc...one of the greatest
blues guitarists on the planet, and as usual, the record guys were
tone-deaf and clueless. At some point Paul Size showed up in town,
maybe to work some with Hook Herrera, I'm not really sure why, or
how, or maybe he was brought out by Bill and Lester. At any rate,
Jr. was keeping pretty busy with Canned Heat, and Paul jumped in and
it became The Red Devils a very energetic and quite a bit more
commercial rockin' blues band. That was when guys like Bruce Willis
and Mick Jagger started getting interested. Most of what happened
after that is pretty well documented......recordings with Jagger,
huge weekend crowds at the King-King, etc. Lester kind of spun out
eventually, started partying all the time, missing gigs, and
ultimately didn't survive the celebrity status, unfortunately.
Anyhow, there's some background from one who was there.

Just my own little aside - I sold Paul Size his first Squier Strat when he was a kid. Paul & Johnny Moeller would come in together to the store I worked at a few times a week - we were blown away with how quick they were learning to play. I run in to Johnny at gigs about once a year, but I haven't seen Paul since he left home. Even though I'm a Texas blues guy, I have been entertained & educated by watching this thread for months. Thanks guys:AOK

[KBR]

Get a RI Fender tank, have the one mod done add an RCA 6K6 and a Mullard 12AT& and a 5751 and they sound pretty dang good, much better than any pedals, Tom. weigh 13lbs, and can run all night. I sold mine to Robin Gibson, or I would have looked for a bassman or 3x10 and went with that rig.

or
two many trips loading in the rain from crib to gig to car to crib..
using a Black Face Super Reverb lateley, good early JLV/ Anson tones, AC,
too.

[valcotone]

Now, one phemomenon that has become all too prevalent (again, imho ) is the focus on tone/gear/look taking precedent over musical ability and idea development. The huge overamped 50's Memphis tone that has become synonymous with 'West Coast guitar' has resulted in tons of players/guitar owners who can (afford) & get that SOUND via Kays, Harmony H44's, H62's, Gibson LP GT's, etc. through tweeds,old PA heads, 50's lunchboxes, etc. but the question remains, what are they PLAYING? When you take away the hip gear and put 'em on a Fender through a semi clean amp, what's left ? The real players 'stuff' should translate well through any rig. Maybe not as effectively as through the old cool stuff, or new boutique stuff, but it should still make it.


HEY!!! I resemble that remark! But I'm tryin'... :D

[valcotone]

Guys, sorry to stray a little here but I (once again) need a blues player's answer to this question...Is there a good reverb pedal out there yet that will compete with the Holy Grail for "Fender reverb tank authenticity"? I don't have room for a tank and my three Holy Grails are starting to get noisy. Has anyone come up with anything as good as the HG? Someone on the TDPRI recommended the Marshall Reflector and Line 6 Verbzilla but most of those guys are country or rock players and don't care about having tank reverb tone. Thanks. :cool::cool:

Tom

Tom - I have a Verbzilla that I use when I don't want to haul my Fender tank. It's a pretty good replication of that old tube & spring unit. Sounds better to me and quieter than the 2 Holy Grails I had. Just turn down the tone knob on the pedal to add some funkiness.

[TwoFeets]

I wanna play a cruise ship gig!--(albeit a blues cruise, if at all possible!):)

ac

LOL I will add a "character building experience" to Ricky's post!

We played a Casino boat cruise out of the Cocoa Beach area. They set us up in the bar area, which was detached from the gaming floor. We had a captive, receptive audience until we reached the 3-mile limit from shore when the gambling could commence...that place emptied out faster than if you'd yelled "Fire!" We ended up playing to the bar staff for two sets, in choppy seas. The seas were so choppy that you had to stand with your feet spread several feet apart so you didn't fall over.

When it came time to come back in to shore and we once again hit the 3-mile limit and gambling ceased, many many drunken people, most of them poorer than they had been at the beginning of the night, staggered back into the bar area. The choppy seas didn't help - several people puked right on the carpet. One guy narrowly missed our bass player's amp.

No more casino boats for me!

[valcotone]

OK---I just looked at the wiring on my tele control plate---and my luthier used just a plain, cheap looking small round brownish looking cap for the capacitors!---And it STILL sounds this F'n good??? Wow! I am replacing that asap with a good oldie---any recommendations?? ac


AC - Email me and I'll hook you up with a nice one.

[TwoFeets]

Get a RI Fender tank, have the one mod done add an RCA 6K6 and a Mullard 12AT& and a 5751 and they sound pretty dang good, much better than any pedals, Tom. weigh 13lbs, and can run all night. I sold mine to Robin Gibson, or I would have looked for a bassman or 3x10 and went with that rig.



Agreed that the Fender RI tank is a great sounding rig for the money compared to a real old one, but I had a HORRENDOUS experience quality-wise with one (Power tranny went, reverb cables went later, tube sockets went...) and the other guitar player in the band I was in at the time also had issues with his, and I know of a few other people who had problems with theirs. So even though they sound good, I can't really recommend the reissue tank, at least not if you plan on gigging one heavily.

(actually the reason I tried all those pedals was because I was looking for a backup for my reissue Fender tank - even though it kept giving out, I couldn't imagine parting with it... that was until I found my '64 at a real good price)