Taylor questions

[angus99]

Hi, we're thinking of buying a Taylor cutaway for our son. He's in his early 30s and into bluegrass, blues, classic rock and free-soloing. He's been playing a Takamine cutaway and likes the access to the upper neck, but much prefers the tone of my D28. He's a talented, self-taught player who's getting more serious about taking lessons, learning to read music and taking it to the next level.

I've read some threads about Taylors and always liked their sound and craftsmanship, but I really don't know much about them. I'm reading the specs on the Taylor site, but would like to know--from players--what the differences between the various lines are and how noticeable and significant they are. I've seen where models from the 80s & 90s are well thought of. Is that across the board for Taylors or just specific series? How, for instance, does a 414CE differ from a 714CE or a 600 or 800 series tonally and for playability?

Bottom line, to get a great sounding Taylor, with volume and ringing tone across the sound spectrum, should I be looking at all model lines or just a few? Certain years or any year?

Only certainties: it will be a used Taylor cutaway; budget is $,1500 +/- (but I'm also fine spending less); should have on-board electronics and he'll have to sit down with it before we buy.

Finally, we won't be buying immeidately; most likely several months from now.

Thanks!

Angus

[jbgordon]

I personally have a 414ce from 2004 that I took the ES out of and put in a K&K Trinity pickup system. This guitar, in my opinion, as well as all the other 400 series guitars have played, have the best tonal balance. They have very clean lows and mids with those shimmering Taylor highs. This guitar isn't quite as loud as say, a rosewood guitar, but to me, it has the best tone(obviously, thats why I bought it!).

The one feature about Taylors that I love more than ANY other guitar, electrics included, is that the neck is the most comfortable neck I have ever played.

All in all, to get into a used Taylor for under $1500, you're looking at between the 300 series up to possibly and older 700 series, and most stuff in between. If you want the rosewood tone without spending a lot of jack, look into the 400 series limiteds. One of my best friends has the Taylor 414RCE, which has the cosmetics of a 400 series guitar with the rosewood back and sides instead of the Ovangkal. This makes the guitar much more in your price range.

[lfyost]

The Acoustic Guitar Forum with a specific Taylor sub forum resides here: http://69.41.173.82/forums/index.php

[TYY]

To me, taylors sound absolutely nothing like a D28, or any other martin for that matter. (personally I find taylors horrid sounding) I'm sure somebody makes a d28 style guitar with a cutaway. If the cutaway isn't a deal-breaker, you'd have access to a lot more/better guitars.

[Figher53]

In that price range, it might be hard to find a used one in the higher series to play before you buy. If you bought of ebay, you might be able to, but buying used from a dealer the prices are usually several hundred dollars higher.

I have to disagree with the post above, not in that he finds Taylors to be horrid sounding (that's his right to an opinion), but that 'better' guitars are available. He is indeed right that Taylors are nothing like Martins (and vice versa!!). They are completely different animals, BUT neither is better than the other. Just different.

I personally find Taylors to be wonderful guitars. That is of course for my style of music and my playing. Their clarity is wonderful, and they match up to the very best in playability. I myself play a 2000 810ce. Oh, and their customer service is a HUGE plus. My guitar had some significant wear and the finish was suffering because of very high humidity conditions. I brought it to Taylor and they refinished the guitar and made it look like new for the sum of ZERO dollars. But since that's a lifetime warranty to the original owner I guess that won't be part of your package.

I'm sure you're very aware with your D28 that Martins are also wonderful guitars. They have a warmth that very characteristic and unlike any other brand of guitar. If your son particularly enjoys your Martin, why not look at a Martin instead?

[gainiac]

I've owned an 814CE for close to 9 years now, played quite a bit and has broken in nicely. From a $ for $ POV It's my opinion that the 800 series is the most guitar for the money from Taylor.

As far as tone goes my guitar is incredibly piano like with rich overtone content and girthy lows. It is an instrument that caters more to articulate styles versus just a strumming guitar. Even with that being said great results are easily achievable with minor adjustment of technique. To me thats the inherent beauty of the instrument, it is so tonally rich that it responds dramatically to subtle changes of technique/ approach. I have never been a fan of Martins (dull and inflexible in my experience, I've tried many and wanted to like them but never found one that worked for me) and tonally they are definitely a completely different breed.

A great many people say Taylors are "too bright" but I wholeheartedly disagree. They can be I guess if played improperly without an ear for the sound. IMO a more appropo description would be that they're extremely complex/rich in the highs, very airy and shimmery. I find that my Taylor responds beautifully to changes in right hand technique or plectrum materials. If you take advantage of that inherrent quality of the instrument dramatic tonal changes literally lie at the tips of your fingers.

I'm a very happy Taylor owner, but take this into context, I bought mine 9 years ago and haven't looked back. I have no experience with any of their more recent offerings. I really dug some of the cedar topped instruments as well as the walnut 12 string they make last itme I played them. It's been a few years since I've played any new Taylors though.

[angus99]

First, thanks for the thoughts and apologies for not being clearer. My son likes the quality and volume of the D28 over his Takamine (not bashing Takamines either, but . . . ). I just mean to say it's great to hear him play with a quality instrument and he, very likely, would be happy with either guitar. I, of course, love my D28 but I also appreciate the Taylors I've heard. I'm leaning toward Taylors because I think they'll suit his style and technique and because they make some great cutaways. He'll definitely make the final call.

Thanks again, this will get me started.

Angus

[jbgordon]

A great many people say Taylors are "too bright" but I wholeheartedly disagree. They can be I guess if played improperly without an ear for the sound. IMO a more appropo description would be that they're extremely complex/rich in the highs, very airy and shimmery. I find that my Taylor responds beautifully to changes in right hand technique or plectrum materials. If you take advantage of that inherrent quality of the instrument dramatic tonal changes literally lie at the tips of your fingers.

I find the statement about different pick materials to be very much true with my Taylor. Also, I stopped using the standard Elixirs that they come with and changed to D'Addario Phosphor Bronzes and it completely opened up my instrument. Much warmer and a much more complex tone with these strings.

[gainiac]

Could you elaborate on what you meant by played improperly and without an ear for the sound? From my experience there is a difference between airy and bright. You can't deny the fact that Taylor uses a bolt on neck which does change the tone (slightly brighter) from say a dove tail joint construction. This is not to say that bright is all together bad, alot depends on the application.

If you bash on my Taylor without any regard for how it sounds it'll sound brash. I also use pretty much straight up bronze strings, no phosphor. It's not the kind of guitar you should just wang away on.

I don't see how categorically a "bolt on" design is brighter. Personally I don't even know if mine has the bolt neck or not, I have never bothered to rip open the manufacturers label. In my experience body/board wood is a much bigger player in that arena.

Bright and airy are two different things for me as well. Airy is good because according to my definition it's accompanied by balanced mid and lows with overtones. Bright to me means lack of bottom and mids and toothy higs.......

[waxnsteel]

I say get HIM to play them, and find out what HE likes if it's for him.

[gainiac]

I say get HIM to play them, and find out what HE likes if it's for him.

Well yeah, that's the easy way!!! :D

[Avenger]

You've probably seen it, but Taylor's web site does have quite a bit of information. All the models are explained fairly well.

http://www.taylorguitars.com/guitars/

Personally I like the sound of the Dred sized Taylors better than the smaller bodied Taylors. You may want to look at one of the Dred sized cutaways like the 510ce for mahagany or the 710ce for rosewood. You may also be able to find a used special edition 410ce in rosewood or koa. I don't like the ovangkol back on the regular 400 series as much as the mahagany, rosewood or koa backed Taylors.

The 400 series would definitely come in under $1500. Though it can probably be done, it might be harder to find one in the 500 or 700 series for under that price point.

FWIW I have a 410 with koa back and sides. I don't find it too bright at all. In fact I've not found a guitar that I'd rather have in the past six years.

I've just never understood the "Taylors are too bright" claims. I think they sound different than Martins, but the too bright description is inapt I think. It just strikes me as such strange thing to say, like, "All Telecasters are too bright, only Les Pauls are real guitars....":confused:

[Iralovesguitars]

i've been a taylor faithful since 2000. i bought a brand new 310ce (sapele/sitka) and loved it's clarity, warmth, and it wasn't too bright. if a guitar is too bright you can modify your saddle a little bit to fill out the tone. i even wen to making a graphite saddle for both of my taylors. in the area of a bolt on neck---Taylors have had bolt ons for many years. in 99-2000 they switched to what they call the NT neck system. It is amazingly adjustable and versatile. i have had ZERO problems from my NT equipped taylors regarding action, adjustability, and stability. i only made new saddles because i found that existing tusq or bone saddles had too much of a radius for my liking. also, don't stray away from the 300/400s as if you're wanting a cedar top then a 500/700 will be the route you can take unless you find a custom cedar/maple 614 like i've only seen two of in my life, but some 500s, 700s, and 800s have sitka tops. also, in recent years Taylor did a revoicing of their lines. some had forward shifted x-bracing to increase bass response. 3db louder than previous guitars. am i dissatisfied with my 7 y/o 310ce? absolutely not. and it's not for sale :) there are lots of great options out there. knowing what you want in a guitar can help you to find some really special instruments and make others regret their selling of them! Good luck and God Bless.


Best,


Ira

[GuitarsFromMars]

I play a 59 Martin 0-15,that being said,I think the best guitar Bob Taylor is currently building is a 514CE with a cedar top and Fishman electronics, has fidelity in a Grand Auditorium sized accoustic that is not to be believed,it is so great and has enough bottom end-less than a D sized Martin,not much less.The mids and top end are the best I have ever heard in an accoustic guitar including my own.It is priced around 2K$ but I believe it can be has for less.Do NOT accept the Rupert Neve expression system,even if you have to order direct from Taylor,to get the Fishman system in it.It is amazing.

[High Voltage]

Ive had both a 410-ce and a 514-ce and both have been great guitars. The 514-ce is by far the nicer guitar. I got mine for 1500 so im sure you could find some within your price range. Although bluegrass and blues are not its specialty IMO, thats more Martin territory. But all in all definetly a great guitar with amazing action too.

[Turbo Gerbil]

I have a 414ce. I play mostly fingerstyle on acoustic, and this guitar works great for that because the notes have good definition and separation and fairly "leap" off the soundboard. OTOH, I don't think it works as well for strumming chords as the dreadnaught Taylors, as the bass response and volume arn't as good. The 414 is an "auditorium" shape body.

[Don L]

I have a 2000 or 2001 limited edition 810-BCE, Legends of the Fall model with Brazilian rosewood, and it is the best sounding and the easiest playing acoustic I've ever tried and owned. I've tried their less expensive and more expensive models, and all of them were pretty decent to excellent.

[waxnsteel]

Ganiac-I would think maybe you meant to attack the poster which stated that Taylor guitars sounded horrid? Now thats a bash!
You are the one who started the personal attack which was uncalled for. Instead of dropping snide remarks re-read the posts and you will see there was no bashing on my behalf and if you think there was highlight where you think I was bashing you or your guitar and let's see who the moderators agree with.


Enough with the "let's see what the mod's think" crap. I didn't see any personal attacks. Was there a deleted post? Let's just talk guitars.

I don't think Martins have tons more bass than Taylors. Definitely more, though to me, just a bunch less mids than the Taylors. I'm not a big dread guy though.

I Love Taylors. I have a 412, 514, 614, 655, and a 914, and my girlfriend has a K14. I really dig the GA sound and shape. And the Taylor neck. SOOO comfortable. I've gotten to play a couple GS's, and dig those, too. I do some strumming, some finger-picking, some picking (No bluegrass), and they work great for me. I never feel like I want more or less of anything.

I hate the ES, though. IMO Magnetic pickups are for electric guitars. ES is just a really fancy complicated mag. Gimme the Fishman blenders, Baggs dual source, or K&K systems any day.

I've played other brands that had "it" for me too. Played some good Breedloves, Morgans, Lakewoods - great guitars. None of those has a model that sounds/feels anywhere near as good as a 400 series Taylor for the money.

[john3:16]

The build quality from the Taylor 300 series to the 900 series are identical. The differences are in the woods used and in the finish (e.g. Abalone, koa etc..)

For the tops, the options are Sitka, Engelmann and Cedar. In my experience, Sitka is the loudest/strongest. Englemann is more mellow sounding. If your son likes fingerpicking styles consider a cedar top (e.g. 514ce).

For the back and sides of the taylors, there is little differences between the standard 700, 800 or 900 rosewood series. The 300 and 500 are also similar to each other depending on the tops.

I doubt any of the range will disappoint. Best to have your son try some out.

Regards,
Gerry

[angus99]

Really helpful, everybody. Thanks very much.

Angus

[gainiac]

Yes a bolt on neck makes things slightly brighter all else being equal-NOT A BASH, fact. How it is constructed plays a huge part in the sound do some research. All of this info on bolt on neck can be attained by reading a Taylor brochure, no need to rip anything apart. Playing gypsy style jazz on an acoustic is hardly what I would call wanging away.

Huh?

When I said "BASH" :Spank that was regarding how the guitar is "played" I don't have stock in the Taylor company.

Re: bolt on construction:

I call bologna on that. Really. In general I call bologna on most "discrete" statements that "X construction style will always result in X tone". In my experience too many other variables and the amount of difference across the board in even a series of the same guitar speaks to that.

Anyhow, back to your normal cranky-ass TGP programming.

[gainiac]

Ganiac-I would think maybe you meant to attack the poster which stated that Taylor guitars sounded horrid? Now thats a bash!
You are the one who started the personal attack which was uncalled for. Instead of dropping snide remarks re-read the posts and you will see there was no bashing on my behalf and if you think there was highlight where you think I was bashing you or your guitar and let's see who the moderators agree with.

:rolleyes:

[BigRed51]

Hi, we're thinking of buying a Taylor cutaway for our son. He's in his early 30s and into bluegrass, blues, classic rock and free-soloing. He's been playing a Takamine cutaway and likes the access to the upper neck, but much prefers the tone of my D28.

Only certainties: it will be a used Taylor cutaway; budget is $,1500 +/- (but I'm also fine spending less); should have on-board electronics and he'll have to sit down with it before we buy.

It is ashamed that any time Taylor is mentioned, it starts an argument, and is followed by childish name calling.

You mention several styles of music that he plays, and that makes the plot a little thicker than if he focused on one style. Since I play primarily bluegrass, I would like to comment from that perspective.

Taylor builds very fine quality guitars, but they simply do not build one that is adequate for bluegrass. The closest that I have played is a K-10 ... one that is seldom mentioned in the Taylor community for some reason. They lack the low end necessary for both good rhythm and leads. They are excellent recording guitars, since the balance that is lacking can be corrected by a good sound guy. Also, you will find that almost every Taylor with a cutaway has electronics. That is because with all other factors equal, a cutaway will compromise the acoustic tone and projection.

Still from a bluegrass flatpicking perspective, two guitars in your price range you may want to consider are the Tacoma DM-14 and Blueridge, either a BR-180 or a BR-1060. The Tacoma is available as a standard dreadnought, or with a cutaway, and eith or without electronics ... I think they have 3 choices of electronics available. The Blueridge models are only available as standard dreadnoughts, and electronics would have to be added ... which is often less expensive than having them built in at the factory. All three will dramatically outperform even the highest end Taylors in a bluegrass environment ... better balance, and MUCH better projection.

If you are interested in used, then many guitars come into play. My personal favorites would include a Gibson Advanced Jumbo, perhaps the most versatile dreadnought on the market today, and a superb flatpicking guitar, and a standard Martin D-18. The Martin can be found used with plenty of room to add electronics ... the AJ will be pushing it to the limit without electronics. The Gibson Songwriter Deluxe is another very good option ... very versatile, comes with or without cutaway, and has electronics ... and should fit your price range used ...

Finally, unless the cutaway is a deal breaker, an amazing guitar to watch for in the used market is a Gibson CL-30 ... and with electronics, it will be in your price range. Problem is, they were only built in 1997 and 1998, and very seldom have I seen one for sale. It would be great for all of the styles you mentioned.

Mostly, have fun shopping, and don't be in a hurry ... play lots of guitars, and it will soon be clear what he will enjoy the most ...

[waxnsteel]

Taylor builds very fine quality guitars, but they simply do not build one that is adequate for bluegrass. The closest that I have played is a K-10 ... one that is seldom mentioned in the Taylor community for some reason. They lack the low end necessary for both good rhythm and leads. They are excellent recording guitars, since the balance that is lacking can be corrected by a good sound guy. Also, you will find that almost every Taylor with a cutaway has electronics. That is because with all other factors equal, a cutaway will compromise the acoustic tone and projection.


Not a bluegrass or dread guy, but you'd be might be surprised to find that bass is almost always subtracted from acoustic guitar recordings. More so when part of a group than solo.

Koa is great wood, no question, but honestly any of the X10 series Taylors is in that same ballpark. Most likely that one K10 you played spoke to you. If you played a few 4, 5, or 710's you might have a similar experience. The maples (600's) can be bright/thin, especially when they're brandy new. There are audible differences between woods, but they're so subtle when compared to changing body style.

It's really hard to get a bluegrass guy to pick up a a guitar that doesn't have an M on it. No question, though, they do make some guitars that are very suited to the style.

[BigRed51]

Not a bluegrass or dread guy, but you'd be might be surprised to find that bass is almost always subtracted from acoustic guitar recordings. More so when part of a group than solo.

Thank you for making it clear you are not a bluegrass or dread guy ... I feel confident that if you had been around any bluegrass recording, you would know that adequate bass either requires the right guitar or a great deal of manipulation. Maybe the fingerstyle players need it subtracted ...

Koa is great wood, no question, but honestly any of the X10 series Taylors is in that same ballpark. Most likely that one K10 you played spoke to you. If you played a few 4, 5, or 710's you might have a similar experience.

I am interested that you assume that I have not played those models. I should have made it clear that the night I played the K-10, I was comparing it directly to a new 710, a used 810, and a GSRS. I can think of at least 5 710s that I have played in the last year. They are all excellent guitars for some styles and applications ... but totally inadequate for bluegrass.

It's really hard to get a bluegrass guy to pick up a a guitar that doesn't have an M on it. No question, though, they do make some guitars that are very suited to the style.

HMMM ... maybe you didn't read my post after all. I recommended 7 models, only one of which was a Martin. If you were a 'bluegrass guy,' you would know that Martin is no longer a requirement. I can't think of a single major flatpicker who plays a new Martin on stage today ... though there are some that still play 30's and 40's models. While that was true for many years, it is no longer the case today. I did not see this as a Martin vs. Taylor battle ... I saw it as a search for the best guitar, regardless of the name on the headstock, within a certain budget and for a certain application. There is no manufacturer, big or small, that makes a guitar that is perfect for every application ...

[waxnsteel]

lol FAIR ENOUGH! If you say you noticed a much greater depth in a K than in the other 10's, you must have. I have not.

Not every bluegrass guy is keeping up with the times. I never assumed you weren't, just making a generalization based on what I've seen around here, and like you say, not NEW martins, they are the old ones.

I still have to try one of the Gibson Advanced jumbos you're talking about.

[texasdave]

You can't deny the fact that Taylor uses a bolt on neck which does change the tone (slightly brighter) from say a dove tail joint construction.

I gotta jump in here and say that this comment and the ensuing comments on whether it's the main reason "Taylors are brighter" is probably quite off the track. Taylors are voiced the way Taylor wants 'em to be. Collings and Bourgeois both use a bolt neck construction, and yet manage to voice quite traditional. At best it's a nuance and one that could most certainly be countered by other adjustments in body and bracing. I'm not buying it.

[Honzo]

I think that Martin does make a D-28 cutaway, perhaps as a special order. There are other Martin cutaway models as well that are worth checking out. I agree that you ought to let your son play as many Taylors, Martins and others that he can and then decide. My experience with Taylor has been great -- I have a 95 model 810 dreadnought which is considered a close competitor to the D-28, and it has served me quite well over the years. Wonderful combination of tone and playability. I personally would go "pure" acoustic (i.e., w/o electronics) unless he really wants/needs amplification. I have used a soundhole pickup (seymour duncan) when necessary to amplify and I'm glad I didn't opt for the electronics but of course opinions will vary on this.

[angus99]

Thank, Honzo. I've looked the DC-28Es on Martin's site and they are probably wonderful--but with a big pricetag! Doesn't seem they've been out long enough for a used market to emerge. Part of my goal here is to keep my son from lusting after my D28, so it may be worth it . . .

Angus

[Jeff Flowerday]

I find the new GS series to be closer to Martin than the x14 x12 or x10 Taylors. Now in reality they don't sound anything like a Martin to me, but relatively speaking.

If your son need the volume acoustically maybe look at a 710CE over a 714CE.

I'd recommend a GS over everything else but cutaway isn't an option on them.

[Honzo]

Of course, this could be the opportunity for you, Angus, to pass that Martin on to your son and shop for a new one for yourself........and see if Taylors (or others) work for you! Back in 1995, I went out in search of a Martin and came back with the Taylor 810, which really surprised me with its quality, features and price relative to others I checked out. Course, if I were in the market for a traditional bluegrass guitar I am sure I would have stayed in the CFM camp, or perhaps checked out Collings, Huss & Dalton and some other makers of traditional dreads.......I have not played any of the revoiced Taylor dreads (price sure has gone up since I got mine!) but I have heard that they compete pretty well with Martin in a bluegrass context, but BigRed and others may have something to say about that!

[Honzo]

Angus, FYI I noticed that Elderly Instruments just listed a used DC-28. I have bought and sold several guitars through Elderly before and hold them in high regard.

[angus99]

Angus, FYI I noticed that Elderly Instruments just listed a used DC-28. I have bought and sold several guitars through Elderly before and hold them in high regard.

Much obliged, Honzo. It'll be a little while before I'm ready to move on one, but I'll definitely add them to my favorites list.

Angus

[Dr.Tom]

angus99,

You never did say what model Takamine your son presently plays. To try and answer your question it would be good to know what we are comparing. I own both Tak's and Taylors and could give you some comparisons. However sound is very subjective so you would only be getting my opinion.

Regards,

Tom
ELECTRICS : 2006 PRS CU 22 12 String Ch. Sunburst; 2004 PRS Hollowbody II McCart Sunburst; 2005 PRS Modern Eagle 20th Ann. Charcoal, 2005 PRS CU24 20th Ann.Artist Blue Matteo,; 1997 PRS Santana 1 ,Sunburst ; 1965 SG Special - White ; 1963 Fender Strat- sunburst ; 1964 Gretsch Country Gent-dark walnut ; 1998 Gretsch Country Classic Jr. ; 2001 Gibson ES-335 - natural ; 2004 Gibson Firebird - white ; 1966 Fender Electric XII ; 1989 Fender Strat Plus Deluxe - greyburst ; 1969 Fender Tele- Blonde ; 1969 Fender Esquire - Blonde ; 1969 Fender Tele Bass - Blonde ; 199? Jackson Randy Rhodes V - black ; 199? Peavey Wolfgang - cognac burst ; 200? Gretsch Duojet 1957 RI - black w/bigsby ; 2005 Gibson SG Special - black ; 1968 Vox Sidewinder Bass- cherry ; 1965 Silvertone amp-in-case 2pickup - red sparkle; 1965 Hagstrom I(powder blue)
ACOUSTICS : 2006 Takamine TAN 15C; 2006 Ovation 1858LX 12 String ; 2001 Takamine SW341SC(Steve Wariner Signature); 1989 Takamine EF360S ; 2004 Taylor 314CE ; 2004 Taylor 814CE ; 1990 Takamine FP400SC 12 String ;197? Bruno Royal Artist acoustic

Amps:
1965 Pro Reverb,1966 Vibrolux Reverb, two 1968 Super Reverbs, two 1968 Vibrolux Reverbs,1968 Princeton Reverb, 1968 Deluxe Reverb, 1968 Bandmaster Reverb, two 1969 Bandmaster Reverbs, Vox AC15 2x10, Vox AC15TBX, Marshall DSL 401,Mesa Boogie Mark IV, 1964 Ampeg Gemini 1 ; 1970s Ampeg V4 ; Vox AC30CC1

Pedals:
ADA Flanger w/RI Foot pedal(Vintage),Analogman Stereo Chorus, (2) Analogman ,Bi-Comprossors,Analogman SunFace(NKT 275),BJF Honey Bee Overdrive,Boss Line Selector LS-2,Boss Equalizer GE-7,Boss PN-2 Tremolo/Pan,Boss Power Supply PSM-5,(5) Boss Chromatic Tuners TU-2,Boss DD-20 Giga Delay,Boss Metal Zone MT-2,Boss BF-1 Flanger(Vintage),Boss DM-2 Delay,Boss Delay DM-3,(2) Boss CE-1 Chorus Ensemble,Boss Bass Chorus CE-2B,Digitech Whammy II,Digitech FX-17 Wah/Vol,Digitech Bass Driver(X-Series),Digitech Jam Man,(5) Ernie Ball Volume Pedals,EH Screaming Bird Treble Booster,EH Small Stone Phase(Vintage),EH Big Muff PI(Vintage),FoxRox Captain Coconut II,Fulltone ’69 Fuzz,Fulltone Clyde Wah,Gibson Maestro Fuzztone (FZ-1A),Hermidia Zendrive,Hermidia Mosferatu,
Ibanez CS-9 Stereo Chorus,Ibanez TS-9 RI,(2)Ibanez TS-9DX,Ibanez TS-9DX Keeley Mod,Ibanez TS-9 Analogman Mod,Ibanez TS-9DX Analogman Mod,Ibanez Original TS-9(Analogman upgrade),Jim Dunlop Crybaby Wah,Keeley 3-Way Rat,Keeley Rangemaster,(2) MXR Distortion+ (Vintage),MXR Phase 100 (Vintage-Script),MXR Dynacomp (Vintage-Script),MXR Noisegate Linedriver(Vintage),MXR Micro Flanger(Vintage),
MXR Loop Selector(Vintage),MXR Power Converter(Vintage),Paul Cochrane Timmy,
Peterson Strobo Stomp,Peterson VS-II Virtual Strobe Tuner,Pro Analog Dual Drive,Radial ToneBone Classic Distortion,Time Machine Boost,T.C. Electronics Stereo Chorus,Vox Big Ben Overdrive,Whirlwind Selector A/B Box,Teese RMC-3 Wah,Teese Picture Wah

[Curly]

I have a 714CE, as well as a D-28 I've had since the early 70s, bought it new.

I tested models quite a bit before I got my 714, and my next favorite was the 514CE. I love the warm tone of cedar tops, but they aren't for everyone -- more of a fingerpicker than flatpicker's guitar.

From what you've said, it sounds like you should be looking at the 314 - 514CEs.

Also, Martin has the D-16GT and D-16RGT, and they are fairly affordable.
I live fairly close to Buffalo Brothers, (http://www.buffalobrosguitars.com/) and they have a custom D-16RGT with an Adi top -- worth checking out. (I believe they have a used one.)

[SteilbergString]

I have an 810 that I've owned for about seven years now. I chose it because of it's tonal balance on the high end with substantial lows as well but I must say, this thing has opened up like you wouldn't believe. I do a lot of bluegrass playing these days, and this guitar does not back down from any banjo! One of my students has a 710 and I really dig that instrument's sound, especially for a lot of the fingerstyle style stuff he does.

I know that the store where I teach is about to put several models of new Taylors at ridiculously great prices, so it might be worth a call to see what they could do on a new 510ce or 712 or something, as I know these models will be great deals. Link: Steilberg String Instruments (http://www.stringinstruments.com)

Joe

[angus99]

Thanks again, everybody.

Wish I had the dough right now to jump on one of these deals. But I'm still paying for my recent "upgrades."

Funny how the wheel turns. For years I piddled around with bluegrass while my son worked on Zeppelin & such. Now that he's in his 30s, he has a passion for bluegrass, while I'm spending most of my time learning electric blues, Green Day and harder stuff. But, when we play together, it's bluegrass.

When we finally pull the trigger on one of these, he'll love it.

Angus