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View Full Version : Strat - wiring neck and bridge tone together


street
02-16-2007, 08:46 PM
Anyone know how to do this, or if it can be done?

I'm considering wiring the bridge to the neck tone knob so the first tone knob would work neck and bridge and the second tone knob (middle p/u) would stay the same.

Would adding a jumper from the neck to the empty bridge lug on the pot side of the switch do it?

I have a 60's RI Strat.

Any help would be appreciated.

brattmoore
02-16-2007, 09:06 PM
"Yes" to all your questions.

street
02-16-2007, 10:30 PM
Thanks!

street
02-17-2007, 11:25 AM
Did the mod. For anyone who's interested in an easy way to get a tone control on the bridge PU, this seems to be the least invasive and easiest mod.
Overall tone hasn't changed and there doesn't seem to be an increase in hum or anything that would affect the basic original tone.

Don't know why this mod has never been posted on any of the mod sites. I did a search and couldn't come up with anything like it.

crbirdx
03-30-2007, 08:35 AM
Where does the jumper go on the neck side? to the top of the tone pot or the empty lug or to the wire coming off the switch?
thanks
c

brattmoore
03-30-2007, 09:03 AM
To the empty lug.

Jim Collins
03-30-2007, 09:53 AM
The problem with this is that both inbetween positions, neck+middle and middle+bridge, now have two tone controls affecting the tone. This does not result in an individual tone control for each pickup, in those positions. It amounts to too much of a load, in those positions. If you find that the two inbetween positions are too muffled, particularly as you turn the volume down, this is why.

Ideally, you'd like one, and only one, tone control in each of the five positions. The EJ and JV guitars addressed this condition, somewhat, in the cheapest way possible, while still using two tone controls. By eliminating the tone control for the middle pickup, and using that control for the bridge, the two inbetween positions each only have one tone control. The drawback is that the middle position has no tone control, at all.

A lot of players simply wire the middle control as a master tone control, for all positions, and leave the outside control disconnected. If the thought of an unused control goes against your grain (it goes against mine), you can replace the outside control with a blender control. (This is a no-load pot.) Now, you get a variety of extra tones, because it is a blender, not a switch, and you still have only one tone control in each position.

Another approach would be to replace the stock switch with a superswitch -- a true 4P5T switch. With this, you can give each position a single tone control, and you can do it however it makes sense, to you. In fact, if you wanted to, you could set it up so that the two inbetween postions (or even only one of them) has no tone control. This appeals to a lot of folks who think any tone control, at all, robs those positions of punch.

crbirdx
03-30-2007, 10:13 AM
thanks jim for the info where's the best place for a blender. does the shack have them?

Jim Collins
03-30-2007, 10:36 AM
You can find one at Acme Guitarworks -- http://www.acmeguitarworks.com/250K_Split-Shaft_Blender_CTS__P32C14.cfm.

Here is a diagram for the wiring -- http://www.acmeguitarworks.com/pdf/strat_wiring_blender.jpg.

Dana Olsen
03-30-2007, 11:26 PM
I'm just gonna jump in here and put in my $.02 worth.

I find that hooking up more than 1 Strat p/u to a tone control sucks the highs - that's on any two pickups. The missing highs are much more noticeable in the split positions.

For that reason, I'm starting to like the super switches. You can get all combos of pickups with only one tone control on any position.

I think that helps the highs in all 5 positions on a Strat, all 6 if you include the neck/bridge option.

As always, YMMV. I just write this because I've spent a lot of time with Strats and tone controls, and I think one can get the best of all worlds this way.

Dana O.

Stratman76
10-10-2008, 03:17 PM
The problem with this is that both inbetween positions, neck+middle and middle+bridge, now have two tone controls affecting the tone. This does not result in an individual tone control for each pickup, in those positions. It amounts to too much of a load, in those positions. If you find that the two inbetween positions are too muffled, particularly as you turn the volume down, this is why.

Ideally, you'd like one, and only one, tone control in each of the five positions. The EJ and JV guitars addressed this condition, somewhat, in the cheapest way possible, while still using two tone controls. By eliminating the tone control for the middle pickup, and using that control for the bridge, the two inbetween positions each only have one tone control. The drawback is that the middle position has no tone control, at all.

A lot of players simply wire the middle control as a master tone control, for all positions, and leave the outside control disconnected. If the thought of an unused control goes against your grain (it goes against mine), you can replace the outside control with a blender control. (This is a no-load pot.) Now, you get a variety of extra tones, because it is a blender, not a switch, and you still have only one tone control in each position.

Another approach would be to replace the stock switch with a superswitch -- a true 4P5T switch. With this, you can give each position a single tone control, and you can do it however it makes sense, to you. In fact, if you wanted to, you could set it up so that the two inbetween postions (or even only one of them) has no tone control. This appeals to a lot of folks who think any tone control, at all, robs those positions of punch.

This could be one of the most informative, mis-information breaking posts I've seen in months! This thread is well worth resurrecting.

Tonefish
10-10-2008, 04:29 PM
Man I gotta say...why mess with the best part of a strat, the neck and in-betweeners?

Stratman76
10-10-2008, 04:58 PM
The problem with this is that both inbetween positions, neck+middle and middle+bridge, now have two tone controls affecting the tone. This does not result in an individual tone control for each pickup, in those positions. It amounts to too much of a load, in those positions. If you find that the two inbetween positions are too muffled, particularly as you turn the volume down, this is why.

Ideally, you'd like one, and only one, tone control in each of the five positions. The EJ and JV guitars addressed this condition, somewhat, in the cheapest way possible, while still using two tone controls. By eliminating the tone control for the middle pickup, and using that control for the bridge, the two inbetween positions each only have one tone control. The drawback is that the middle position has no tone control, at all.

In a standard Stat wiring scenario, where tone one is to neck and tone two is to middle, wouldn't the same load condition you describe exist in switch position 4 (neck+middle)? There are two tone controls involved in this position 4 scenario as well. Fender also offers "no load" tone pots.

SLBlues
10-10-2008, 11:36 PM
Check out: http://www.deaf-eddie.net/tonecharts.html

Gives you all the standard pup combinations, plus several more usable combinations. I have the Fat-O-Caster switch, along with a RS Wiring Kit (only need 1 tone pot) and Lollar pups. It is wired for master tone control. I like it a lot for the versatility it offers. A couple of my buddies who play professionally tried it and were impressed with the different tones available from the various combination of pups. The neck and bridge in series is very much like a humbucker.

Stratman76
10-11-2008, 04:43 AM
Check out: http://www.deaf-eddie.net/tonecharts.html

Gives you all the standard pup combinations, plus several more usable combinations. I have the Fat-O-Caster switch, along with a RS Wiring Kit (only need 1 tone pot) and Lollar pups. It is wired for master tone control. I like it a lot for the versatility it offers. A couple of my buddies who play professionally tried it and were impressed with the different tones available from the various combination of pups. The neck and bridge in series is very much like a humbucker.

VERY cool stuff! I think I'm going to try the Memphis Fat because it offers a Bridge/Middle in series.

walterw
10-11-2008, 05:01 PM
In a standard Stat wiring scenario, where tone one is to neck and tone two is to middle, wouldn't the same load condition you describe exist in switch position 4 (neck+middle)? There are two tone controls involved in this position 4 scenario as well.
yes, which is why that setting is the darkest and least popular on a strat. this issue, along with the lack of a tone control on the bridge, are what the no-load pots, the tbx pots and the JV mod all try to address.

rockford
10-15-2008, 08:04 PM
I'm piggy backing on this thread, if you wanted some tone control for a strat bridge pickup , could you not just connect a resistor and a capacitor to the
bridge pickup ? Anyone ever done this, and know how to hook it up ?

Bo Faulkner
10-15-2008, 08:09 PM
I like moving the middle tone to the bridge and leave the mid without...

Stratman76
10-16-2008, 11:13 AM
I like moving the middle tone to the bridge and leave the mid without...

Did you otherwise keep it stock? Did you change cap values and/or pickups?

Dana Olsen
10-16-2008, 11:53 AM
I like moving the middle tone to the bridge and leave the mid without...I agree Bo - that's how my Strats are set up.

What you get: Pos 2 and 4 are slightly brighter and more open sounding, and you get tone on the bridge pickup alone, which is really useful if you like to use the bridge pickup alone; in fact, wiring a Strat this way makes using the bridge pickup alone possible without compromise, IMHO.

What you lose: No tone on the middle pickup. If you play jump blues and love the middle pickup alone, it's gonna be a little brighter than stock.

I don't know how to wire Super switches, but I know that you could wire one so that no matter which pickup combo you use, you get only one tone control in the signal path, which would give a lot of flexibility.

IMHO, the best bang for the buck mod is to switch the bottom tone control from the middle to the bridge - no switching caps or pots, just move the wire. Pos 2 and 4 will be clearer and more open, but you give up tone on the middle pickup.

Hope this helps, Dana O.

Kingbeegtrs
10-24-2008, 05:01 PM
Some guys call it a "blower" switch

here's the schematic: http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/wiring-diagrams/schematics.php?schematic=switch_f_bp

The last time I did it I just used one tone pot and put the toggle in the third hole on the pickguard...The one tone pot controlled the tone on all three pickups which made it nice and simple...of course you could just use a push/pull pot and get the same effect. The toggle makes it look kinda cool.

bek
10-24-2008, 05:32 PM
Back to Deaf-Eddie as the guy with the answers on all this, for me. I set up my Strat originally as he recommends -- standard 5-way, Fat-O in the next spot, master volume, master tone. Looks stock (unless you change the knobs, as I like to sometimes use a chicken-head on the Fat-O), but is anything but, and avoids the already-stated tone-suck of other schemes. Lately I rewired yet again with Eddie's help and a sensational SSH set of VintageVibe low-output pickups. Eddie wired up a superswitch to give me various killer combos (no bridge-bucker coil-splitting; I just didn't want it, but I'm sure you could), master volume, tone on the neck only, tone on the bridge only, middle pickup straight in. Looks dead stock; NOT! Fabulous!

Kingbeegtrs
10-24-2008, 09:35 PM
Back to Deaf-Eddie as the guy with the answers on all this, for me. I set up my Strat originally as he recommends -- standard 5-way, Fat-O in the next spot, master volume, master tone. Looks stock (unless you change the knobs, as I like to sometimes use a chicken-head on the Fat-O), but is anything but, and avoids the already-stated tone-suck of other schemes. Lately I rewired yet again with Eddie's help and a sensational SSH set of VintageVibe low-output pickups. Eddie wired up a superswitch to give me various killer combos (no bridge-bucker coil-splitting; I just didn't want it, but I'm sure you could), master volume, tone on the neck only, tone on the bridge only, middle pickup straight in. Looks dead stock; NOT! Fabulous!


that sounds pretty nice...I'm going to have to try that some time. I'm always looking for different schematics that are still simple.

bek
10-25-2008, 09:36 AM
It is dead simple, too. Five switch positions, volume, tone, tone. That easy. Neck and neck/middle (quack), like normal Strat. Straight up is QUACK! like a really big duck (pumped up by the bridge bucker). Next over is the bridge bucker with a lot of beautiful single-coil chime. Then the bridge bucker. Those two different notches are fabulous additions to the palette, and nothing like any other Strat I've heard. Much may have to do with the great VV pickups, but the switching/pots scheme is the thing that makes the most of them.

Stratman76
10-25-2008, 09:51 AM
Some guys call it a "blower" switch

here's the schematic: http://www.seymourduncan.com/support/wiring-diagrams/schematics.php?schematic=switch_f_bp

The last time I did it I just used one tone pot and put the toggle in the third hole on the pickguard...The one tone pot controlled the tone on all three pickups which made it nice and simple...of course you could just use a push/pull pot and get the same effect. The toggle makes it look kinda cool.

Re: Duncan schematic- The difference here is that the bridge pickup is either full on or off whereas a blender allows you to blend output levels in or out. It's a cool option though as you can add the bridge pup and still have two tone spots open on your pickguard. I would be real tempted to use a Tonestyler in tone 2 and a stock 250K audio taper in tone 1. Wire those as one master tone and you would have a stock 250K tone load with the variable capacitor switching the Tonestyler provides. If you made tone 1 a push/pull or no load, you could also take tone controls out of the circuit.