Playing AND Singing

[timbo]

Ok so after about six years now I'm back in a band. I've played guitar for 30 years and have sang lead on some tunes in the past while playing guitar. This go around however I find myself singing lead on many more tunes. The frustrating thing it seems is that I've developed a handicap from my hiatus that has me fumbling on certain tunes while singing and playing at the same time. But independently I can do either with no problem.

Would anyone care to share any tips or techniques that you use to help me overcome this? It seems I lost the left/right brain thing.

Thanks.
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[jrm]

at the risk of sounding like a smart alec (which is not my intent at all).... the only thing I've found that works is massive amounts of practice and repitition. For me, they both need to become muscle memory at some point, and then its much easier to pick up new tunes and sing and play at the same time. But this is an interesting topic! Thanks for posting this up. I am interested in the various responses that hopefully come through as well.

[lhallam]

My singing is terrible so no allusions here however I do sing because I like it.

I can sing some things better than others but there are certain songs I simply can't play & sing at the same time. "Let It Roll" by the Doors for example.

[dave s]

If you look back on ALL the songs that you are singing (and playing on at the same time) you'll probably find that the songs that have 'familiar' chord progressions aren't giving you the trouble. It's a song like The Real World by John Mayer that gives the singer/guitarist fits due to the odd chords and progression. The harder songs require more practice.

What I've figured out over the years is that singing takes up about 70% of available brain power leaving only 30% for playing the guitar. This means you better be able to just about play in your sleep to be successful holding down both chores!

dave

[57tele]

Depends on the material, but for anything but simple rock and blues, I've always found it helpful to chart it out. I write out both parts and walk through it about 1000 or so times, starting very very slowly and gradually getting up to tempo. We covered a ton of Yes, for example, when I was a kind and it was the only way I could remotely pull it off. "Along the drifting cloud, the eagle searching down on the land..."

even if you don't know standard notation, you can write it down in terms of beats and accents, etc.

[jcground]

Some songs are definitely easier than others. For me, syncopation between the vocal melody and the guitar (or bass or keyboard or whatever instrument I'm playing) is what gives me fits.

I remember reading an article about GIT where the instructor (I think it was Paul Gilbert) dared his students to do the guitar and vocals from the beginning of the AC/DC song TNT. Both the vocal ("Oi, oi, oi, oi...") and the guitar part are insanely easy, but they are syncopated with each other. You have to have a great sense of rhythm to do both at once. The article said that most students thought it would be easy, but very few could do it.

I remember talking to a drummer about the same sort of thing. When you start on the drums, he said, the real wall to get past is getting your limbs to act independently. You have this innate tendency to want to keep the same time for your right arm and leg if you're right handed, for example, so you have to train yourself to split them up.

[Lance]

For me, it's more of knowing the chord structure, and being able to play that so well, that I can utilize any, or all brain RAM on vocals. Which does fall into the repetition category. Yeah, and having things charted out so that you're doing sort of guitar/vocal karaoke is key.

[bendix]

I have found that if I treat my voice as another instrument, I tend to do better. Because then it is almost as if my voice is another string on my guitar. It sounds strange to say it that way, but it seems to work for me. I think the other key is to stay relaxed about it, because anxiety seems to make me more linear in what I'm focused on. Singing and talking have similar parts of the brain that are used, but talking is n0t necessarily conducive to playing and sitting in the groove. Again, talking seems to pull more to the linear approach to things; A then B then C then D, etc.
But a more global view or associative view allows me to perceive how two, or more strings of rhythms and melodies work together as a whole, and by being more relaxed, I can play from that whole instead of trying to decide which is more important to focus on; the vocal or the guitar part.

Tim

[Stratophile]

The things that has always worked for me is learning the MUSIC first. I get the guitar part DOWN. Then I start tryign to add vocals.

The idea is to get the guitar part second nature so that it's like NORMAL guitar playing....NO THINK. Cause if you're thinking....you're stinking anyway.

To me it's more demanding of MYSELF (YMMV) to sing than play guitar. I am not a natural singer by ANY stretch of the imagination.....I tend to do alright.

Beyond that.....it's practice practice practice. Pick ONE song and really give it hell. Work on it till you got it.

[DanD]

Ok so after about six years now I'm back in a band. I've played guitar for 30 years and have sang lead on some tunes in the past while playing guitar. This go around however I find myself singing lead on many more tunes. The frustrating thing it seems is that I've developed a handicap from my hiatus that has me fumbling on certain tunes while singing and playing at the same time. But independently I can do either with no problem.

Would anyone care to share any tips or techniques that you use to help me overcome this? It seems I lost the left/right brain thing.

Thanks.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/images/misc/progress.gif

Timbo,
In the beginning it took me six months sitting in front of the wall singing and playing before I felt confident enough to try it standing up.
If you plan on doing a whole night of it, you being the only singer and guitar player it could take longer.
You might surprise yourself and find that on stage it comes back quicker than you think.

DanD
www.sweetclaudette.com/
www.sunnygirl.us/

[NitroLiq]

I usually learn the song first so I don't even have to think about it...then work in the vocals. If there are spots that are giving me trouble, I just work on those particular areas, starting slowly to see where I'm going wrong then repeat...repeat..repeat. Sometimes it feels like it'll never come but eventually it does. There are a few King's X songs that still give me grief. Even a few simple pop songs become a bear...listen to the song "'Round Here" by the Counting Crowes...very simple song but singing the verse parts over the little guitar melody I find very difficult because of the weird syncopation. It's kind of like rubbing your tummy and patting your head...you just have to train yourself to detach your thoughts from one to the other.

[CrazyFingers]

The things that has always worked for me is learning the MUSIC first. I get the guitar part DOWN. Then I start tryign to add vocals.

The idea is to get the guitar part second nature so that it's like NORMAL guitar playing....NO THINK. Cause if you're thinking....you're stinking anyway.

To me it's more demanding of MYSELF (YMMV) to sing than play guitar. I am not a natural singer by ANY stretch of the imagination.....I tend to do alright.

Beyond that.....it's practice practice practice. Pick ONE song and really give it hell. Work on it till you got it.

Agree with this. If the singing part still troubles you, try "talking" the song while playing (preferably in the privacy of your own home). Gradually speed-up and before you know it: voila! This worked for some Dave Matthews tunes I tried.

[donnyjaguar]

I don't have this problem because not only do I sing dreadfully, I can't remember the lyrics!

[Vaachek]

[the only thing I've found that works is massive amounts of practice and repitition.


I like to use a boom mic stand so I could set it up to be able to sing and watch my left hand at the same time. Good luck!

[ABKB]

+1 on just about everything mentioned here already, about the only thing I can add is to really MEMORIZE those vocals to where you can do them in your sleep (along with the guitar part in your sleep as well). It's hard enough doing guitar+Vocals without having to search your brain for the next line.

Another thing as well, one of the hard thing I have always found while playing/singing is to remember to breath correctly. Most guitar players dont think about that until they have to sing, and by then they have built up years of bad habits and tend to hold their breath while doing some parts (like me :() So work on your breathing as well.

[µ¿ z3®ø™]

as many have mentioned, repetition is really the key.
i'm a 'visualiser' as well. when i'm doing mundane things (dishes, showering, mowing the lawn) i imagine myself singing and playing songs. works well.