Pedals vs. Amp OD

[Reincaster]

On another forum, I commonly see people say

"I don't see what's the point of using a distortion pedal with a tube amp, just get the amp with the distortion you want"

Bull, that's what I say. Especially if your favorite amp doesn't have certain things, like dual channels, Effects loops, etc. I don't think it's useful to put a delay before an amp's distortion/od. Lots of artists use distortion pedals, and not to tighten up the sound, but as a main effect, like Cobain, Frusciante, and more, right?

Anymore reasons why there's nothing wrong with using OD/Distortion pedals and tube amps?

[dave_mc]

^ I suspect i know which forum you're talking about, lol.

I'd say it depends on the player and what they want it for.

If you know you're playing modern death metal all the time, i wouldn't get a fender and put a pedal through it...

but that's an extreme.

[derek_32999]

Funny, this was just (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?t=247399) in the effects forum recently.

[Reincaster]

^ I suspect i know which forum you're talking about, lol.

I'd say it depends on the player and what they want it for.

If you know you're playing modern death metal all the time, i wouldn't get a fender and put a pedal through it...

but that's an extreme.

Yeah, I see you're here too, haha.

Oh definaitely, extreme metal should be done with power amp and tube distortion etc, but for most applications, many pedals can do the job.

[that_brianm_guy]

On another forum, I commonly see people say

"I don't see what's the point of using a distortion pedal with a tube amp, just get the amp with the distortion you want"


yeah, that's great if you can play at whatever volume you want ...

and even then, there isn't an amp out there that sounds like a fuzz face into a Marshall.

Unless you're modelling that sound - in which case, enjoy the approximation.

[Vintage]

I think alot of folks like to use an OD with a tube amp to get a looser feel, almost like a sag.

[dosmun]

It all comes down to the players taste. I personally use OD to add just a little different character to my amp but a stand alone dirt box just doesn't quite get it for me like my amps distortion does.

[Phil Harmoneeek]

Get the right pedals & tailor your amp (tubes/speakers/NFB/attenuator/etc.) for them & you can get awesome "tube amp" distortion with way more flexability (different realms of overdrive/distortion/fuzz whatever ... even clean ... :rotflmao ).

Randall

[Dale]

It is a matter of context to me ... and hearing loss. How loud is realistic? How happy is the front of the stage (or home inhabitants) with loud? Is there only one sound in your head?

[jazzguitarplay]

It is a matter of context to me ... and hearing loss. How loud is realistic? How happy is the front of the stage (or home inhabitants) with loud? Is there only one sound in your head?

when setting up on stage, I never just aim my amp straight ahead. I have a leaning amp stand that tilts my amp back so it doesent hit and over power the people in the front rows or the whole house in general. Sometimes I face the amp towards me and away from the audience since the sound crew is miking it and controlling the volume thru the stage moniters and house P/A. But still, Id rather play thru my amp and pedals. To me a big part of the fun of playing Guitar is feeling the connection between my tubeamp thru my fingers into my body, i dont get playing only amp/clean with pedals but Id still rather have that then just playing a multi efx modeler like a Pod or Boss gt-8, where to me, theres practically no or very little physical connection. Im starting to think it takes having all the right equipment from a quality guitar, good cables, good amp that has GREAT clean and GREAT amp od/distortion all by itself, then add some Great quality pedals including ods/distortions/fuzz and at least one boost pedal. If you combine all of this, you should have many options iand get closer to achieving that sound in your head

[gregory49]

i think its hard to find an amp that has both thats perfect for what you want unless your A- a fusion or B- a Metal Player..... maybe thats stupid i dunno but one amp can't cover every dirty and clean tone i need... maybe the JVM or a FUCHS .. thats probably it. ahhh i dunno.. what a senseless post lol

[derek_32999]

i think its hard to find an amp that has both thats perfect for what you want unless your A- a fusion or B- a Metal Player..... maybe thats stupid i dunno but one amp can't cover every dirty and clean tone i need... maybe the JVM or a FUCHS .. thats probably it. ahhh i dunno.. what a senseless post lol


Why do you NEED so many different tones? Is the question I have been asking myself lately.

[Occam]

For me I run my amp really hard so I've got a really nice crunchy rhythm tone naturally...I use pedals to either take me over the top for more saturation or for a colored type of saturation. Some songs I want something really thick and syrupy and sometimes I want and aggressive chunky...I like variety. There are times where I just want to crank my amp up even more and just plug straight in but that rarely suits my music.

[jezzzz2003]

On another forum, I commonly see people say

"I don't see what's the point of using a distortion pedal with a tube amp, just get the amp with the distortion you want"

Bull, that's what I say. Especially if your favorite amp doesn't have certain things, like dual channels, Effects loops, etc. I don't think it's useful to put a delay before an amp's distortion/od. Lots of artists use distortion pedals, and not to tighten up the sound, but as a main effect, like Cobain, Frusciante, and more, right?

Anymore reasons why there's nothing wrong with using OD/Distortion pedals and tube amps?

Heres a few, Randy Rhoads, Yngwie Malmsteen, EVH, Brian May just to name a few.

[Reincaster]

Heres a few, Randy Rhoads, Yngwie Malmsteen, EVH, Brian May just to name a few.

Which pedals do they use? And I don't mean for boost or anything, but main distortion/od. I think Brian May uses a treble booster to get his tone, doesn't he? I'm not really sure, but I remember reading that somewhere, and I think Yngwie's OD is a booster for his amp. What did Eddie use? Wasn't he more famous for using a 5150?

Also guitar geek's old unupdated files show that Duan Allman used a MT2. . . . Seriously?

[jazzguitarplay]

i think its hard to find an amp that has both thats perfect for what you want unless your A- a fusion or B- a Metal Player..... maybe thats stupid i dunno but one amp can't cover every dirty and clean tone i need... maybe the JVM or a FUCHS .. thats probably it. ahhh i dunno.. what a senseless post lol
Its a modded Hot Rod Deville or Hot Rod Deluxe. For a 250.00 mod, you can have a Blackface type Fender, a Dumble on the 1st drive channell and a hot Marshall on the more drive channell, check it out here------www.omegaamps.com

[jazzguitarplay]

Heres a few, Randy Rhoads, Yngwie Malmsteen, EVH, Brian May just to name a few.

how about Eric Clapton and Jeff Beck and Frank Gambale and Al Demeola

[Teahead]

how about Eric Clapton and Jeff Beck and Frank Gambale and Al Demeola

Not to mention that Jimi guy! :JAM

[JeffreyC]

All I can say is every single great guitar player that I admire has used a combination of both with great results. Honestly, I can't think of many great guitar players that didn't use at least one pedal in conjunction with their amp.

[Brewtone]

I play a Marshall Silver Jubilee as my main amp but for some reason the effects loop really kills the tone. So, If I want to use delay or things like that I'll use a distortion pedal with the delay right behind it. However 75 of the time I just use the amps dirt channel with a MI Audio Boost N Buff if I want a little extra.

Does it really matter what you use to get "your sound" as long as you're happy???

I really don't think so.

[JB]

I was talking to one of the guys that designs and makes Diamond pedals. He says that he hates Tube overdrive and much prefers all his od to be from pedals.

[jazzguitarplay]

I was talking to one of the guys that designs and makes Diamond pedals. He says that he hates Tube overdrive and much prefers all his od to be from pedals.

interesting, As a warrior of Guitar, Ill use any weapon I can. Humbuckers, single coils, Pedals,Amp OD, Volume pedals, Boosters. Then suddenly, I appear out of no where and whip out my acoustic guitar, LOL

[Laroosco!]

If I can crank the right amp it sounds great. My Tweed Bandmaster kills for certain applications, but doesn't suit every gig I do.

Many say,"there's no pedal that sounds and feels like a cranked amp"

I say, "there's no cranked amp that sounds or feels like my pedals

[david henman]

...this is all very good, but to put things back into perspective, the very reason that pedal and pre-amp o/d was created was because of the undeniable fact that cranked tube amps are just too loud in most situations.

but, thanks to debates like this, i have cranked a tube amp occasionally to see what i might be missing. it wasn't pleasant. my blues jr just sounded asthmatic, and my current traynor ycv40wr combo sounds strained, at best.

still wondering what i'm missing...

-dh

[Oddos]

Amp or amp+pedals are two totally different things. Pushing your pre with different frequencies isn`t the same as adjusting or changing caps in your amp. The interaction in all the different chains make for different results. Then you have the pedal sound that comes through on a clean amp, which can be cool for other things. It also gives different types of response and sustain on tap. My pedals to me, are part of the amp. They also make it possible to do any type of gig on any type of amp.

I understand that a Dumble deals with this, but really, his boost is a pedal type design inside the amp. I like to be able to choose. Not all of us want to sound like Robben Ford. Amd ooops... Now Robben is using a pedal, too. :moon ;)

[that_brianm_guy]

...this is all very good, but to put things back into perspective, the very reason that pedal and pre-amp o/d was created was because of the undeniable fact that cranked tube amps are just too loud in most situations.

but, thanks to debates like this, i have cranked a tube amp occasionally to see what i might be missing. it wasn't pleasant. my blues jr just sounded asthmatic, and my current traynor ycv40wr combo sounds strained, at best.

still wondering what i'm missing...

-dh

try it with an older design. crank a Fender Bassman or a marshall, or an AC30, or a Deluxe, or a champ... yowza!

[gitpicker]

For me I run my amp really hard so I've got a really nice crunchy rhythm tone naturally...I use pedals to either take me over the top for more saturation or for a colored type of saturation. Some songs I want something really thick and syrupy and sometimes I want and aggressive chunky...I like variety. There are times where I just want to crank my amp up even more and just plug straight in but that rarely suits my music.

+1 to this - this is exactly how I do it. As far as the pedal thing goes, I understand the purist point of view - I did it myself for 20+ years. After entering the wonderful world of pedals, I can't see myself going back. I play so many different kinds of music that one amp just can't cover it all by itself, unless I spend time between songs changing amp settings and guitars and volumes. On a live stage that is not very practical.

Some players will talk about chasing "thier tone", a signature sound. IMO a style is more recognizable than a tone. A lot of people can cop SRV's tone, but how many actually sound like him??

[david henman]

try it with an older design. crank a Fender Bassman or a marshall, or an AC30, or a Deluxe, or a champ... yowza!


...that i get. i started out in the late 60s running a bassman head through a couple of PA columns! then it was an ampeg v2 half stack. i still have live video footage that shows me playing a p90 sg plugged straight in.

clean to scream with just the guitar volume.

sigh...

-dh

[that_brianm_guy]

...that i get. i started out in the late 60s running a bassman head through a couple of PA columns! then it was an ampeg v2 half stack. i still have live video footage that shows me playing a p90 sg plugged straight in.

clean to scream with just the guitar volume.

sigh...

-dh

OK, so we're on the same page.

My take is that the Blues Jr and the Traynor aren't really designed to pushed the same way. I don't own either, but I'd guess part of the issue might be speakers, and/or output transformers. I do have a 2xEL84 amp, (Vox AC15CC) which loves to be cranked.

Have you tried them through a different cab?

And not every amp's sweet spot is on 10 :)

[JazzHessian]

Single-channel amp with a great clean sound, and a clean boost pedal to send it into overdrive.

[jazzguitarplay]

Why do you NEED so many different tones? Is the question I have been asking myself lately.

I knpw what your saying. How many colors do you need?. I think more then one o/d and fuzz or distortion is overkill, but whats wrong with having even more colors at hand. thru a clean amp. i use Zen for jazzy/fusion lead tones, a Eternity for bluesy/rock solos, a Keeley rat for thick marshall leads and a Mayo for over the top prince type stuff. You really dont need this much but these various sounds inspire my playing in different ways. Im soon getting my amp modded so ill be able to cut back on a couple of those pedals. If your a home or hobbyest, you might not require as many sounds, but to be able to have your amp produce those quality of sounds is pure luxury. So after I get my Omega modded amp, ill cut my pedalboard back a bit. Dont you know, this is all called Obessive high gain bevavior disease. Lifes short, enjoy it

[Jesse]

I use a hotplate to drive my Marshall, and it is awesome, but it's the same damn tone all the time. I like to use overdrive pedals for some different flava.

What I find funny is people who use a "Marshall in a box" pedal through a Marshall. Nothing like using something to simulate a sound of an amp that is already capable of producing a much better sound. Lol!