Badass bridge

[Y-roc?]

I have a Fender MIM Jazz bass and am thinking about switiching out the stock bridge with a Badass bridge. If you have a Badass bridge, can you tell me why you bought it and how you like it? Was the swap worth the time/money/hassle?

Also, I am getting a Fender American Deluxe Jazz bass soon and was wondering how that bridge compares to the Badass. The FADJ bridge seems to be more solid than the MIM kind, and it's grooved so the saddles won't slide around. Anyone with personal experience on this bridge?

Thanks!

[JohnSS]

My brother's '79 P-Bass has a Badass bridge. Don't know if swapping it is worth the hassle, since you do have to cut the body cavity to fit the bridge properly. Intonation is about the same, thought the Badass is a bit heavier, so there's some tonal difference. If I have to get a new bridge for a Fender type bass, the Hipshot is the most versatile and easiest to install.

[The Golden Boy]

Personally, if your bridge intonates properly, doesn't rattle or cause you problems, or isn't broken- IMO, the Badass isn't much of any "upgrade" to a functional bridge.

A while ago I lost a height adjustment screw off one of my saddles on my Jazz with the old "bent piece of metal" bridge. I used that as an excuse to "upgrade" my bass. After the bridge was on, I expected to hear the "improved sustain" or the "better tone" or *something*. I just didn't. Aside from a big, shiny bridge on my bass, I can't tell any improvement (or change for that matter), and I don't notice the difference with anything- even the difference in weight is inperceptible. Over the past 6 years or so, I've replaced the bridge back and forth with the old stock one, and I can't tell the difference between them in terms of playability, tone or sustain. The Badass is only on there because I paid for it-

On paper, the theory behind the Badass makes it clearly superior. It's got a longer saddle traverse, a larger footprint, troughs to eliminate saddle drift, more mass... It just doesn't make much of a difference from a functional bridge.

http://images.lilypix.com/albums/userpics/10038/normal_jazzbody.jpg

[The Golden Boy]

since you do have to cut the body cavity to fit the bridge properly.

There was no modification to the body needed for mine- even the mounting screw holes lined up perfectly.

[JohnSS]

There was no modification to the body needed for mine- even the mounting screw holes lined up perfectly.

My brother's bass had the mod done in the early 80's. Guess that was an earlier version; I think it was installed by Carlo Greco on W.48th St. in NYC.

[MuseCafeChris]

I put a Badass on my Indonesian Squier because somebody was selling a brand new one for dirt cheap, and I just assumed the stock bridge was crap:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v156/ono_rocks/basses4sale/basses4sale004.jpg

In the process I swapped out the pickups, so any improvements in the tone can't really be pinpointed to the bridge. Probably beneficial to add one to an import bass, but I wouldn't go out of my way to make the change to a USA Fender.

[Y-roc?]

If I have to get a new bridge for a Fender type bass, the Hipshot is the most versatile and easiest to install.

JohnSS,
Glad you reminded me about the Hipshot bridges. I much prefer the look of the Hipshot A Style bridge over the Badass. Thanks!

[The Golden Boy]

My brother's bass had the mod done in the early 80's. Guess that was an earlier version; I think it was installed by Carlo Greco on W.48th St. in NYC.

You know- as I recall, the original Badass was meant to replace the 3 point Gibson assembly.

In that case, the block might have been higher or something, and in order to get things set correctly you'd either have to carve out the body or mill down the bridge.

I don't know any of that for fact though...

[Y-roc?]

Personally, if your bridge intonates properly, doesn't rattle or cause you problems, or isn't broken- IMO, the Badass isn't much of any "upgrade" to a functional bridge.

Golden Boy,
Thanks for this honest advice. And, the pic is great. Also thanks to MuseCafeChris for posting a pic of his Badass, too. Both really help me get a sense of how it would sit on my bass. Honestly, though, just based on pure aesthetics, they kind of make a Jazz bass look a bit cluttered down there, no? I've always been a fan of big beefy bridges, but they're not looking as good as I thought they would on a Fender Jazz.

But, I think, ultimately, I will have to side with the "if it aint broke, don't fix it" advice that everyone is offering. I thought there would be a huge difference in sound, or at least that your strings would sustain twice as long or something. :NUTS If that's not the case, maybe I should just stick with the ole metal bendo bridge.

Thanks for your input everyone!

[mainsale]

I added a Badass III to my American Ash P-bass when I redid the electronics. It was a nice addition but certainly not a critical one. The electronics upgrade with Jason Lollar pickup, Hoveland tonecap and 50's wiring made a much bigger and improved difference, over stock.

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b61/Mainsale/Guitars181.jpg

[The Golden Boy]

But, I think, ultimately, I will have to side with the "if it aint broke, don't fix it" advice that everyone is offering. I thought there would be a huge difference in sound, or at least that your strings would sustain twice as long or something. :NUTS If that's not the case, maybe I should just stick with the ole metal bendo bridge.



The only way I'd really want to switch out are the old stud mounted 2 and 3 point Gibson bridges- I think the studs are fine for guitar tone- it's just different with bass.

[Y-roc?]

What about the Gotoh 201 bass bridge? It's essentially a slightly beefier version of the bent-o-metal bridge, but is slotted so the saddles don't move around. Anyone have any experience with this bridge?

[ChrisThompson]

For the record, there's two different types of Badass bridges.

The "Badass" is very tall and was designed for "new construction or some such." I have one on the very first bass I ever owned, a Yamaha BB200. I had to route a spot on the face of the guitar to make it sink low enough to actually make the action playable. Never occurred to me to shim the neck.

The "Badass II" and now, I guess the "Badass III", are both
short, and are bolt on replacements for a fender bridge. The saddle height stays the same.

I changed the bridge and replaced the crappy yamaha P style pickup with an Alembic P/AE-1. Afterwards the guitarist in my band said it was like "The sound of God farting." How much of that was the result of the pickup, and how much the bridge is unknown.

[MuseCafeChris]

Afterwards the guitarist in my band said it was like "The sound of God farting."

Was that a compliment? LOL

[Y-roc?]

Well, I just ordered a black Gotoh 201 bridge, $35 + shipping. Sorry to all you Badass fans but I wasn't completely sold on the look or the sonic results of the Badass. Plus, I wanted to save a few bucks. I mean, my only real complaint about the bent-o-metal Fender bridge is that the saddles slide around. Everything else seemed to be fine, except that they look wimpy. With the Gotoh grooves sliding is eliminated and the Gotoh 201 is slightly beefier so it might improve the look, too. Who knows. I'll let you know when it comes in.

In the meantime, a question about black. Will a black bridge just get all scratched up? Is that why you don't see too many?

[The Golden Boy]

Will a black bridge just get all scratched up? Is that why you don't see too many?

You'll see a lot of black hardware around- I don't see any having shiny spots on them. But I don't know from first hand experience.

What I'd do- post a thread in the Guitars section about black hardware...

[1radicalron]

The Bad Ass Bass Bridge makes a stunning difference in tone compared to a stock Fender Pot metal bridge. All The Bad Ass bridges are made of cold rolled Hardened Steel. The Intonation, and Height adjustment are far superior to a standard bridge. The Gotoh Version is a nice quaility, but it is a copyright infringment. Leo Quann has been fighting them in court to retain his original design's.

[The Golden Boy]

The Bad Ass Bass Bridge makes a stunning difference in tone compared to a stock Fender Pot metal bridge. All The Bad Ass bridges are made of cold rolled Hardened Steel. The Intonation, and Height adjustment are far superior to a standard bridge.
I believe the Badass is a fine bridge...

What are these superior advantages?

I didn't hear a "stunning difference in tone."

How is the height adjustment superior? Are the set screws different?

How is the intonation superior? Granted, there's greater saddle traverse, but within the range of a standard bridge (as most basses are)- what's superior?


I agree, on paper, the Badass is far superior, and it is a well made, well designed and well functioning bridge- however in my experience, in terms of sound, playability, and practicality the Badass is no "upgrade" to a functional stock bridge.

If your saddles are drifting off to the side, the Badass is a good solution (but I think a tighter spring would be a much more cost effective solution). If your bass won't intonate in the distance of saddle traverse on a standard bridge- you've got something wrong with your bass- the Badass will compensate for that though.

Plus the Badass is around $70, so it must be better than the stock bridge.

[1radicalron]

The Screws are a finer thread! allowing for a finer detail in adjusting height and intonation! Also, the screws are a harder metal. = They wont strip like the screws used on bridges on current Fender production Basses.
The Saddles are a thicker, denser metal allowing for more vibration into the wood body.
The Base of the Bridge is also made of thicker, denser metal, providing more mass. This also allows more vibration into the body.
The Bad Ass bridge is Superior in every way to current production bridges used by Fender!
If you cant comprehend this, then you should just continue believe that your current bridge is good enough for you. = Dont spend the extra $70 for something that you cant hear!

[ghoti]

You don't necessarily hear a difference between 4 and 6 bolts on a bolt-on bass neck, but I'll take the 6.

Unless it's a cheapie you plan on abusing, I'd get what most of the bassists I respect says is the best item for the bass, especially when the price difference is negligible ($70? That's maybe one lesson!)

[PB+J]

A "stunning difference in tone?" The badass bridge is a waste of money, IMHO--there's little, if any difference in tone in my experience. There's little, if any, difference in adjustability. The stock fender bridge is fine--I've ever stripped out a screw on a fender bass bridge in 30 years of playing. But of you feel restless, try the badass--it won't hurt anything.

In college, a many years ago, I spent some of my very limited pennies on a badass bridge and put it on my pbass. I could never hear a difference. After many years I took it off and put the stock bridge back on--no difference. The badass bridge is a textbook case of fixing something that ain't broke. I totally agree with what Golden Boy posted

[frankencat]

Thanks guys. I have been thinking of putting a Badass on my old 70's Jazz but I think I will just leave it and upgrade the pickups instead. I have only had it for like 25 years and it's worked fine with the stock bridge so far ;)

[deluxemeat]

All The Bad Ass bridges are made of cold rolled Hardened Steel.

i thought some were made of zinc?

[Chuck King]

Putting a Badass on a MIM Fender shows the whole world, "I have modded my bass," which may result in getting more respect from gear snobs than you would get with a stock-looking MIM. Query whether that is a worthwhile goal.

There seems to be a pattern, and I can't throw stones because I did it myself, of installing a Badass in conjunction with other mods, making it difficult if not impossible to determine just what difference the new bridge made as opposed to any other change. I have a MIM Jazz Bass onto which I bolted a Badass II, but at the same time I replaced all the electronics, changed pickups, and installed a new bone nut. It sounds better than it did, but I couldn't tell you how much of that was due specifically to the bridge.

It does look cool.

[The Golden Boy]

If you cant comprehend this, then you should just continue believe that your current bridge is good enough for you. = Dont spend the extra $70 for something that you cant hear!

I don't have too much of a comprehension problem. Read my reply in post #3 of this thread.

I have a Badass II on my bass. I have switched it back and forth several times in the past 7 or so years between the stock bridge and the Badass. I percieve no discernable difference whatsoever.

I spent the $70 because I bought into the "superior in every way" and "stunning difference" bullshit.

Yeah. It makes sense on paper, but if it doesn't come out in the wash- even a little- it doesn't matter how "superior" it is.

[Y-roc?]

My black Gotoh 201 bridge just arrived today. Looks great, feels solid. I'll take some pics, install it and then let you know what I think.

[Y-roc?]

Here's a review I wrote on the Gotoh 201 bass bridge for the Warmoth site (below). I'll post some pics as soon as I get around to taking some.

[Two caveats: 1) The following review is only to follow-up with my initial post and is not intended to promote or endorse a product. In other words, I'm not getting paid by anyone for this:o 2) The review is based on my initial impressions of the Gotoh 201 bridge. I have not yet spent a significant amount of time with this bridge to comment on its performance over a long period of time.]

Gotoh 201 bridge, black
-$35 + shipping
-Came with bridge, 5 matching screws and a hex key for the bridge screws.

The Gotoh 201 bridge (Gb) is a straight replacement bridge for the Fender Standard Jazz Bass (MIM) bridge. The screw holes lined up exactly with my existing bridge holes and no modifications were necessary. I just unscrewed the old bridge and screwed-in my new one. Piece of cake.

The Gb looks gorgeous, feels solid, is well crafted, and I think looks "sexier" than the stock Fender bridge (sFb), although the visual differences are slight. I don't know if I care so much for my choice in color (black) and would probably go for the chrome if I got another one. But it looks great and is not "flat" black like I thought it was going to be but a "glossy" black...a good thing in my mind.

The Gb hangs out toward the butt of the body a pinch further because the string insert point is about 4x the thickness of the sFb. The metal where the bridge lays on the body is only slightly thicker and therefore sits off the body only a hair higher than the sFb. But, in my case, this was a good thing because the saddles on my sFb were almost maxed out. The extra height of the Gb puts the saddle pieces at the middle point of the adjustment screws. I now have plenty of room if I need to raise the string height, a luxury I didn't have with the sFb.

Besides the bridge metal being a little thicker all the way around, the major difference between the Gb and the sFb is that the Gb has grooved slots for the saddle screws to sit in so it won't move around and change the intonation of the string. Now, this wasn't a problem I ever heard in the sFb, and you probably get more pitch bending from just your fingers pressing the frets. But just the fact that the sFb saddle pieces could and did slide around bothered me. Other than that, the Gb saddles are slightly fatter (bigger radius) than the sFb and the string slots appear to be better grooved for the strings.

As far as the sonic differences between the two, the first thing I noticed was that the Gb immediately improved sustain. The strings seem to ring out longer, with a more gradual amplitude drop-off. Whether this is a real or imagined improvement is hard to say. In other words, the improved sustain of the Gb is slight. Plus, what music requires that notes ring out on the same pitch for more than 10 seconds? Still, just knowing that my sustain has improved because of the Gb helps me feel a little more confident when I do need to let a note ring out for a while.

The bridge screws on the Gb are easy to adjust and my only complaint is that they seem a little loose. Not that they wiggle inside the threads or anything, but I just hope they don't "self-adjust" with a little string vibration. I tried to make sure that there was equal pressure on each bridge screw so this won't happen, but we'll see. The intonation screws work just like they should and glide a little easier than the sFb. It hasn’t happened yet, but I do worry that the saddle screws will scratch the black off the grooves. We’ll see…

In summary, if you want to keep the general look of the Fender bent-piece-of-metal bridge but want something slightly beefier that improves sustain and intonation for less money than a BadAss bridge, this is the bridge for you.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

So far I'm very happy with my purchase, but only time will tell if that happiness endures.

Hope this helps someone who needs more information about the bridge upgrade problem. And, just because I bought and like the Gotoh bridge doesn't mean that I don't like or would not endorse the BadAss bridge. I'm just stoked that I could get something better than what I had for cheaper than a BadAss. I'll post again if I run into any problems with my newest purchase.

[The Golden Boy]

The bridge screws on the Gb are easy to adjust and my only complaint is that they seem a little loose. Not that they wiggle inside the threads or anything, but I just hope they don't "self-adjust" with a little string vibration. I tried to make sure that there was equal pressure on each bridge screw so this won't happen, but we'll see.


A little dab of clear fingernail polish should "set" the screw.

Fingernail polish is great because it's cheap, it's relatively strong, but it'll break and chip away easily enough if you want to break it.

[Y-roc?]

A little dab of clear fingernail polish should "set" the screw.

Good tip, thanks!!! Any tips for preventing the saddle screws from scraping off the black from the grooved slots? It hasn't happened yet, but...

[The Golden Boy]

Good tip, thanks!!! Any tips for preventing the saddle screws from scraping off the black from the grooved slots? It hasn't happened yet, but...

I'm trying to think of something that won't compress over time, but still protect the finish.

If'n it were me, I'd just let it do what it does.

[Y-roc?]

Sorry it's taken me so long to post some pics, but here they are in all their blurry glory :rotflmao:
Old stock Fender bridge
http://a245.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/91/l_21e904c3bb35f74c2c217146c2a2abcc.jpg

sFb up close and blurry
http://a18.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/94/l_e792beb5d98d1a89807bece2522f6ee9.jpg

Here's the new Gotoh 201 bridge
http://a911.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/77/l_2ac3c9bc52f73a907d06ec498c112fae.jpg

Gotoh 201 up close and blurry
http://a451.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/125/l_d1eacd53f1ab50f559c0ad255d5e08d2.jpg

Gotoh 201 again
http://a151.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/117/l_f8951a42cbf82311ecf8dd992c59fd56.jpg

and last one featured in blurryvision
http://a321.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/87/l_30e19b0f9097102d4d5f73d00376e820.jpg


And, I'd have to say that the increase in sustain that I thought I heard is very real. Subtle but real. And no saddle screw slippage either. I'm a happy man. Now, once my black control plate arrives I'll be set!