TAD EL84's How have they worked for ya?

[aarondavis]

My main question is: Can I expect these to last a bit longer than the JJ's?

I know this is amp and situation dependent, but just curious about others experience. BTW, right now I'm playing gigs about twice a week at moderate to loud levels, but without really any breakup in the power section at all (little if at all).

I've been using JJ EL84's in my TopHat's. I'm not going to claim I can tell huge sonic differnces in tubes; at least not the ones I've used. But I can say that the JJ's always sounded more rubust to me (compared to Ei's and EHs and Groove Tubes). Well, I've only really been able to get about 6 months out of them, so I decided to go a step further and pick up the TAD EL84's.

It may very well be mental, but they seem to have a bit more beef to them and exibit the same robust tone as the JJ's but up a notch. What do you guy's think of them?

[DanD]

aarondavis,
I use the JJ's also.
Tried GTEL84 - THey just about blew up.
Tried EH(sovtek) - They sounded losey.
Tried Mullard - Unbelievable tone, but at $100 a piece retail. I only use them for recording.
Never tried the TAD.

I'm looking forward to reading reviews.

DanD

[jlummaa]

There are at least 3 types of EL84s offered by TAD. Which ones do you have?

EL84-R
EL84M
EL84-Cz (JJ i believe)

Never tried any them but you may want to specify the type. I have used only JJs so far.

[martyncrew]

I just re-tubed a Vox Pacemaker with JJs - very nice. "Robust" is a really good description of the tone. They are very balanced and crunch nicely thru the North Coast Blackdog 10". I replaced the original Mullards which sounded great but were pretty weak - subjectively the JJs boosted volume by about 20%.

[Moods]

There are at least 3 types of EL84s offered by TAD. Which ones do you have?

EL84-R
EL84M
EL84-Cz (JJ i believe)

Never tried any them but you may want to specify the type. I have used only JJs so far.

And the TAD EL84-STR

[aarondavis]

And the TAD EL84-STR

Sorry, I didn't know there were different types from TAD. These are what I have, the EL84-STR.

[myles111]

Six months on a set of EL84's in a cathode biased amp?

Try this sometime .... replace the output set after just 50 hours of use ans see of you notice a difference. You might be surprised how things have changed in such a short period of time. Then again ... you might think things are still fine and dandy.

[aarondavis]

Six months on a set of EL84's in a cathode biased amp?


I can assume what you're saying... but it's not exactly clear. You're saying I *shouldn't* get six months out of them? I tried to lay it out that I don't crank the amp like a lot of people would. Usually only run it as loud as it will stay clean (fairly clean). I understand a cathode biased amp is hard on tubes, but not as hard as "true class A", correct?

Basically, I replace my tubes when I start hearing noises. In most cases it is a crackling sound.

[paulg]

I think his point is: that's not very long. I've had lots of 60's Fenders on the bench with original tubes. Definitely ready for replacement, though they still worked!

[gilmutt]

Hi,

I appreciate that the company that produced this report, Watford Valves, is based in the UK and it might not be feasible for many of you to use them but they are (1) probably the best UK guitar valve company, (2) very knowledgable and (3) in my experience very honest in their reports.

http://www.watfordvalves.com/cgi-bin/documents/testreport_47.pdf

This report compares a selction of EL34 valves including the JJ and the TAD.

I would add that part of the advantage in using this company is that they are very careful in selecting their valves and their views in the report is on their selected tubes and not necessarily on all those on the markets.

Hope this helps.

[myles111]

I can assume what you're saying... but it's not exactly clear. You're saying I *shouldn't* get six months out of them? I tried to lay it out that I don't crank the amp like a lot of people would. Usually only run it as loud as it will stay clean (fairly clean). I understand a cathode biased amp is hard on tubes, but not as hard as "true class A", correct?

Basically, I replace my tubes when I start hearing noises. In most cases it is a crackling sound.


Cathode biased amps, where single ended class A or not, run the output tubes at 100% no matter what the volume setting is on the amp.

I am saying that after 100 hours you will probably notice a difference. On Brad Paisley's amps they are changed after every 10 shows .... 30 or so hours, and he hears a difference.

I have also had folks run them for years ... sound comes out of the amp and if that is the criteria then I suppose it's fine for those players.

[myles111]

I think his point is: that's not very long. I've had lots of 60's Fenders on the bench with original tubes. Definitely ready for replacement, though they still worked!

Yes ... and those Fenders were not cathode biased amps and the tubes (6V6 and 6L6) have a much longer service life.

I have seen 6,000+ hours out of a set of 6L6's in many Fender black face era amps where they still sound pretty darn nice.

[klaetos]

I really like the STR. I have had a couple issues with microphonics, bur for new issue I really like the sound of the TAD the best so far. I have a set of the new Mullards on order. We'll see how they sound.

[HipKitty]

We've retubed a ton of EL84 amps with the TAD's and have had no problems.

[tfunster]

I really like the STR. I have had a couple issues with microphonics, bur for new issue I really like the sound of the TAD the best so far. I have a set of the new Mullards on order. We'll see how they sound.

Please let us know about the Mullards!!!

[Dave_C]

Cathode biased amps, where single ended class A or not, run the output tubes at 100% no matter what the volume setting is on the amp.

I am saying that after 100 hours you will probably notice a difference. On Brad Paisley's amps they are changed after every 10 shows .... 30 or so hours, and he hears a difference.

I have also had folks run them for years ... sound comes out of the amp and if that is the criteria then I suppose it's fine for those players.

I played my Maz 18 for two years every day plus loud gigs every weekend before I realized something didn't sound right. I popped in new EL84s and was astounded at how I had just experienced the frog in the boiling pot of water effect. Sound will indeed come out, but the tone gets away from you insidiously.

[FFTT]

As soon as pocket change allows, I'm getting a Weber Browner to help control
line voltage, which in turn should help my tubes last longer.

https://amptechtools.powweb.com/browner.htm

[78tsubaki]

TAD EL84s worked for about a month in my amp. Really sounded nice, then they went brittle and a little fizzy so I am back with JJs. Your mileage may vary. I crank my Reinhardt 18 up!

[klaetos]

Please let us know about the Mullards!!!

I will keep you posted. Hopefully they should be in the mail today or tommorrow. Doug's Tubes has them in stock, but when I ordered they weren't on the website yet.

[JMP2203]

i think TAD EL84 STR are very good tubes, probably my favorite new production EL84, at least in my amps. sure i prefer Mullards but they cost way more money.

[klaetos]

I received my new tubes from Doug's yesterday. Put in the new issue Mullards. Pretty good so far. At this point I like them better then JJ's but not sure yet if I like them better then the TAD STR. We were playing pretty much strait out rock most of last night so I want to see how they sound with some cleaner, more articulate to light OD sound.

...to be continued...

[klaetos]

Took out the Mullards and put in the TAD STR finally last week. After having a chance to play with both I think I like the TAD's better. Mullards IMO are better then the JJ's but not better then the TAD.

I don't know how to explain it, I just know what I hear.

[Dave_C]

Just posted this followup to an earlier thread on Z-Talk.

This is an update to my earlier thread, "New TAD EL84 Is Great". Well, as I should have learned from earlier similar experiences, I should have waited till the gig before reporting. I got the TADs out to the gig last Saturday and ended up going home disappointed. I just played this place last month with exactly the same gear, except using GT-EL84S #6 tubes in the Maz 18 (which I've been using in the amp since getting it in mid 2002).

In my living room, the TADs sounded amazing, better than the GT-tested JJs. They were warmer and didn't have any trace of harshness which the JJs can sometimes get if not careful with EQ. Well, this gig was proof once again that what works alone in the living room or bedroom may not work all that well in a band context in a club. The TADs were kinda' muddy and mushy and didn't have the articulation and clarity of the JJs. I even got to hear both tubes out in the house as the club owner sat in again in the 3rd set, just like last time. The difference was commented on by both the club owner and my girlfriend. The tone just wasn't as good as with the GT-EL84S #6. The TADs were indistinct and "blurry". They just didn't have the articulation of the GT-EL84S #6. It was pretty plain to hear.

So, I'm wondering now if it's a hardness thing or a design thing. I had a similar experience with GT-EL84S #3 vs. #6. The #3s sounded great in the living room, but too muddy in a band context. So, how would the TADs compare if hardness rated via the GT process and then compared to JJ......#6 to #6......apples to apples? Well, it's all rhetorical for now. So, for me, it's back to the trusty old tried-and-true GT-EL84S #6.

[saucyjack]

I retubed my Maz jr with the TADs...wore out set of NOS Tesla finally.Practiced twice and gigged last nite with the TADs

Is it me are the TADs thin sounding?
They seem to have a nice upper mid bite and sparkle but seems like I'm missing tight low end and punch....Bass tone knob on the Z has little effect.

[Blue Strat]

Took out the Mullards and put in the TAD STR finally last week. After having a chance to play with both I think I like the TAD's better. Mullards IMO are better then the JJ's but not better then the TAD.

I don't know how to explain it, I just know what I hear.

For clarity, it's worth mentioning that the "Mullards" referred to here are Russian made, new production, "Mullard Reissues" as sold by New Sensor (the same company that produces Sovtek, Electro Harmonix, Tung Sol Reissues and others).

REAL Mullards were made in Great Britain from the '50s until the '70s and are unmistakably of higher quality than new production tubes.

[Slideman]

aarondavis,

I think the quality is good, but the break-up on the TAD were very quick -- very compressed and dark. I also have a Top Hat CR like you, but I tend to prefer the EH rather than the JJ's. The JJ's I found to "glassy" on the top end and with a Strat/Tele was a bit much. I though the EH were right between the TAD and the JJ with the same reliability and sound really good with the CR. Just my two cents.

[klaetos]

For clarity, it's worth mentioning that the "Mullards" referred to here are Russian made, new production, "Mullard Reissues" as sold by New Sensor (the same company that produces Sovtek, Electro Harmonix, Tung Sol Reissues and others).

REAL Mullards were made in Great Britain from the '50s until the '70s and are unmistakably of higher quality than new production tubes.

Yes, these are the new production. I don't think I could afford the real deal. :eek:



I think the quality is good, but the break-up on the TAD were very quick -- very compressed and dark. I also have a Top Hat CR like you, but I tend to prefer the EH rather than the JJ's. The JJ's I found to "glassy" on the top end and with a Strat/Tele was a bit much. I though the EH were right between the TAD and the JJ with the same reliability and sound really good with the CR. Just my two cents.

Now that you mention it, this might also be one of the reason I like the TAD better. I play mostly at lower volumes and I can get a nice little light hair going when I dig in with HB's. When I swap back to the new prod. Mullard I will have to re-compare the early break up.

[JasonG]

I've tried 2 different sets of TAD EL84 STRs recently in my Maz 18jr. and they only lasted a few hours. I have no problem with Sovtek, EH or JJs in the same amp and with the TADs I have had no problem in other amps but the Z is a true class A. Stick with JJs. They are the best and what the good Dr. chose for his amp.

[DanR]

I've never used the TADs, but I'm posting anyhow. I bought a pair of both JJ EL84s and EIs a couple of years ago to put in my TopHat Club Royale. I bought 12AX7s of both brands also. I did a little taste test one day and found I preferred the tone of the EI EL84s and the JJ 12AX7s, although the difference to my ear was quite subtle. The EIs didn't last very long until they bit the dust, though. The JJs had a much better longevity.

That said, I currently am using NOS Tesla (not JJ) EL84s and, so far, so good.

[Spudman]

TADs came in my H&K and they didn't last very long at all. I was not happy. While they worked they sounded brilliant in the amp but the longevity factor will keep me from buying them in the future.

[arthur rotfeld]

I'm liking them, but I haven't done any A/B testing with new tubes. I did test them against the old tubes (not TAD's, forget what) and there was a considerable volume and brightness difference, but that's against old tubes......

[aarondavis]

I've used the TAD and JJ's quite a bit. Neither lasting more than a few months in my TopHat Club Royale (cathode biased 18'ish watter). I recently put some Sovtek EL84M's ("M" for military grade) in to see if they last. That are actually a bit brighter, so I turned the highs down a bit... hopefully I can get more than a few months out of them. I'm really tired of the sad state of affairs we have in tube production these days. :nuts

I'd gladly pay double what most of these companies charge (JJ, Sovtek, TAD, EH) to get high quality new production tubes. If only someone would start the dang company. I know that a small high quality tube company would last, even with the smaller market of tube amp users and hi fi aficionados, so don't start in on that... That Techtube company wanted to reinvent the wheel instead of building high quality tubes. What the heck?

[zombiwoof]

From what I've read, the TAD's supposedly have a bit of 6V6 sound at lower levels, but break up nicely when pushed.

If I were you, I would also consider a pair of tested EI EL84's (the last time I looked Doug's Tubes had some). A few years ago these were the only EL84 to get, and all of the Vox guys were using them in their AC30's. I replaced the Sovteks in my brother's Crate Vintage a few years ago and tried the JJ's and the EI's, the EI's won out by a large margin. Great tone and harmonics, the JJ's sounded bland by comparison. Too bad they aren't making them any more, but you can still find them around.

Al

[DGDGBD]

I tried TAD el84's and didn't like them. they sounded to mushy and "blah" for lack of a better term.

[aarondavis]

FYI, I've had the Sovtek EL84M's in for about 3 weeks... already popping...:bounce
Damn! I guess I'm going to simply live with it. I'm tired of buying crappy tubes, they're *all* crappy. Also, it's funny. I didn't realize when I posted in this thread, I started it back in 2007. So as you know I didn't have much luck with the TAD's either. So far, the JJ's have seemed to last the longest without making noise. Obviously, I simply need to plan on changing tubes ever 3 or 4 months.

TopHat's aren't supposed to be harder on EL84's, are they?

[zombiwoof]

Sounds like you might want to get some NOS tubes. I got a nice NOS pair of Raytheons from Ebay for about $30 but haven't used them yet. There are nice Sylvanias and other brands out there for not much money, if you check around. And I'd repeat myself about the EI's, to me they are the best EL84's to come out in the last 20 years, and you can still find them. Just get them from a seller that tests them.

Al

[cthroatgtr]

I actually would say TAD is to 6L6 as JJ is to EL34. The TAD is more crunchy and the JJ more rounded. I actually was comparing tubes in a cheapo crate vintage club which had Sovtek tubes. I tried both and I am undecided which I like but they are different. I could almost see using the TAD for rhythm and JJ for lead. I am going to do a comparison on an Egnater Rebel 20 which I bought used and had TADs in there. The crunchy TAD tone is definitely there as it shows in both amps. I originally thought it was the preamp tubes in the Egnater but it is the power tubes. Ultimately I think I will end up with the JJ tubes since I am more an EL84 guy but I can see using either.