Sunface users: "correct" setting for Sundial?

[JRC4558Dude]

I just got an Analogman Sunface with the Sun dial option. So far, i find it sounds best with the Sundial turned all the way down (CCW), rather than setting it with the face turned straight (as Analogman recommends). When i turn it up, i find the tone gets a little too mid-rangy for my ears. I was just curious as to where others turned their Sundial...

[StompBoxBlues]

I (with single coil guitar) usually have it higher up, because I want to be able to clean up with guitar vol rolloff, and to me the dial when set CCW gets a lot grittier at the settings I use for fuzz.

I like that super-clean rythm sound, and still be able to dime the guitar vol and get a good solid nasty fuzz.

[Dandy13]

I (with single coil guitar) usually have it higher up, because I want to be able to clean up with guitar vol rolloff, and to me the dial when set CCW gets a lot grittier at the settings I use for fuzz.

I like that super-clean rythm sound, and still be able to dime the guitar vol and get a good solid nasty fuzz.
This response pretty much mirrors what mine would have been word for word. If you want a woolier sound turn ccw.

[Geetar_Will]

I prefer it between 1 and 2:00 for a little less woolly sound than the stock setting. I do have the internal volume trimmer rolled pretty far back though. I don't like messing with my volume knob, and I preferred the sound of the fuzz rolled off for more clarity/stacking options. Love it! Especially when I turn on the other side... (it's a sunlion)

[Todd Lynch]

It's a bias control - set it where it sounds best to you.

[Franklin]

I (with single coil guitar) usually have it higher up, because I want to be able to clean up with guitar vol rolloff, and to me the dial when set CCW gets a lot grittier at the settings I use for fuzz.

I like that super-clean rythm sound, and still be able to dime the guitar vol and get a good solid nasty fuzz.

+1 :BEER

[todaystomorrow]

i think he says 12 o clock is the stock setting for a vintage fuzz face. i set mine to around 1 to 2 o clock.

[shakti]

It's also supposed to compenaste for temperature changes. I believe he sets it for "correct" bias at the middle setting at 25 degrees Celsius. When it's colder, turn it up, when it's hotter, turn it down. If I remember correctly.

But your ears decide. I usually turn mine to 1 or 2 o'clock, but where I play it's usually below 25....

[Thin Slices]

There is no right or wrong. Usually I set mine between 12 and 2 o'clock for a little less wool than the old school FF sound.

However I would strongly suggest anyone to set the fuzz to max and instead back up on the guitar vol. or internal trimmer. The sound is just so much better this way. My internal trimmer is set around 10 o'clock as far as I remember.

If I could have a change made to the pedal, I would prefere the fuzz controle to be internal and the internal back-up controle to be external.

[analogmike]

Sometimes I wish the knobs didn't have marks on them and only ears would be used for settings. But the marks are useful after you know how you like it for quick setup at a gig.

Have fun!

[JRC4558Dude]

My understanding was that the internal trimmer only effected the total amount of gain on tap. Does it change the tone at all? Sorry, if that doesn't make sense. I'm typing this with neither the pedal nor the manual at hand. Guess I'll just have to open it up and mess with the internal trimmer myself.

On Mike's site, he warns potential customers than a fuzz-face type pedal is "not any easy pedal to get a good sound out of" I always thought that was an sort of an odd statement, but its really true.

Part of the probelm for me is that I'm trying to replicate Hendrix-type tones on a very different setup. It seems to me that a big component of Jimi's sound was obviously the fact that his FuzzFace was running into a loud Marshall, not a clean Fender amp with the volume on "2", like you'll find in my music room!

When I tried out the Fulltone '69, I was disappointed by the lack of sustain, even with the gain maxed out. I passed on the '69, but got inerested in the Sunface based largely on the clips on Analogman's site and from the reputation his products have. I realize that running a fuzz at low volumes through a clean Fender amp is not an ideal approach, but I have got great results using a Fulltone Soulbender like this. I'm still trying to figure out if a FuzzFace-type fuzz can sound really good at lower volumes. Anyways, thanks for the responses so far everybody.

[StompBoxBlues]

I think that if you change gain, you also change tone. It is my experience anyway, so if you set it to gain on tap the new setting will sound different tone wise if you keep the fuzz knob where it is, or move it up.

[JRC4558Dude]

Well, i tried messing with the internal trimmer. It sounds best, to my ears, when left in the stock setting (fully CCW). I believe the manual says that the stock setting is the maximum avaliable gain. All in all, still a great sounding fuzz.

[StompBoxBlues]

For me...I'm finding out there is no ONE fuzz.

When I first got the Sundial, I liked it a lot, but I had been experimenting with some others, and even one of my own on a breadboard, and another fuzz I had cleaned up more...I don't know...hendrixy.

I kinda had the sundial on the shelf for a while. Like VERY much the MI Audio Neo and GI fuzzes especially for their tweakability...also the BJF I have (Pink Purple) is amazing, but "more than a fuzz" getting into OD territory, which also the Fulltone '69 did...etc. etc.

But just recently I cleaned up, pared down my pedalboard, and picked up the sundial again, and it was just perfect! The settings I mentioned (and..it may not be drift, temperature, but simply my ears ang gear for each day but) I find there is no one magical setting you can just leave it on. I have to tweak ALL my fuzzes, any time I am getting ready to play them. I like it, it gets me better at listening and quicker to dial in what I want every time.

That's why really...getting to know the thing (as you did with the internal trimmer...there may come a day, maybe a different guitar with more output for instance, when you might want to trim back a little...) and set the dial from scratch each time you play you start really getting to hear much better what the effect of the dial, and even fuzz knob, guitar sweet spot (changes with the fuzz knob...that is another reason you can't just keep it in one spot...impossible to keep the guitar vol exactly at its spot) etc. all change.

But then a whole new world opens up, one in which you can more quickly dial it in some days, and not at all on other days :rotflmao

At least for me.

[harryjmic]

I usually use mine with the control between 11 and 1. When it's maxed it gets too thick and bassy for me. At the lowest settings you get the most spit which can be cool but I usually set mine so when the guitar is rolled down there is almost no change between the pedal tone and the regular guitar tone. This allows me to use the pedal without comprimising the clean tone i have dialed up.

I also have my internal trimmer turned down to the point where you hear the bass drop off a lot. The pedal doesn't get as fuzzy but that's what the Beano is for.

[BluesHarp]

You HAVE to have the beano with it... ya jus gota gota

Also the sundial ( if you set it by the volts inside ) lets you go for either the 1969 FF ( about 9-10 O'clock ) or the 1968 FF ( about 7-8 O'clock ). The higher the bias, the cleaner or tighter the sound. The 1968 FF has that wooly hendrix sound, but as you turn it up it does get tighter for more controlled solo work. And when you run it into the treb side of beano and adjust that vol knob jus right... I get a grin... again and again..

[52ftbuddha]

Man you guys are killing me, I keep hoping that my sunlion will ship soon. It seems no amount of looking at Mike's site is helping me.

rob

[BluesHarp]

Fuzzy wuzzy wuzza bear... ;-)

[The Everlove]

I too love the sound of the sundial fully to the left... sounds zippery and spitty... buzzy fuzzy. I likes it. Running it on it's own its very thin sounding, but running it into the beano or an OD/ pushed amp its fantastic.

[Dandy13]

Man you guys are killing me, I keep hoping that my sunlion will ship soon. It seems no amount of looking at Mike's site is helping me.

rob
how long is the wait on a sunlion? I recently got and fell in love with the beano boost. thinking about flipping it & my sunface and getting a sunlion.

[gregory49]

how long is the wait on a sunlion? I recently got and fell in love with the beano boost. thinking about flipping it & my sunface and getting a sunlion.
+1 how long is everyone waiting?

[analogmike]

Sorry we got really backed up during holidays so people who ordered SUN LIONS from late November - end Dec or very early Jan should be getting one from this batch of 15 within a week. (sunfaces are about 2 weeks backed up).

Next batch of Sun Lions could take 2-4 more weeks. These things are too hard to build with all the hand wiring. I should make a new circuit board for them to make them easier to build. Also the graphics are too labor intensive...

Thanks for your patience!!

[JRC4558Dude]

One more Sunface query, If I may. Does anyone know why this fuzz (and a number of other fuzzes i've tried) only really work when my Strat has the pickup selector switch on neck+middle or bridge+middle. Same deal on my SGs, the fuzz sounds best if both pickups are selected.

On either Fender or Gibson, if i use just one pickup, the volume and bass drop significantly. Why? I'm sure I am not the only one to experience this. Can anyone offer an explanation?

[Geetar_Will]

One more Sunface query, If I may. Does anyone know why this fuzz (and a number of other fuzzes i've tried) only really work when my Strat has the pickup selector switch on neck+middle or bridge+middle. Same deal on my SGs, the fuzz sounds best if both pickups are selected.

On either Fender or Gibson, if i use just one pickup, the volume and bass drop significantly. Why? I'm sure I am not the only one to experience this. Can anyone offer an explanation?


That's weird man... That's not how mine has ever been.

[Dandy13]

One more Sunface query, If I may. Does anyone know why this fuzz (and a number of other fuzzes i've tried) only really work when my Strat has the pickup selector switch on neck+middle or bridge+middle. Same deal on my SGs, the fuzz sounds best if both pickups are selected.

On either Fender or Gibson, if i use just one pickup, the volume and bass drop significantly. Why? I'm sure I am not the only one to experience this. Can anyone offer an explanation?
maybe with both pick ups on you are sending a hotter signal to the fuzz:confused:
are you running the fuzz first in the chain or behind a buffered pedal? try a compressor just before the fuzz or a clean boost. It will fatten up the fuzz and increase the gain. I've done this time to time for a different shade of fuzz but in my experience it's not necessary as I haven't experienced what you're describing.

[JRC4558Dude]

maybe with both pick ups on you are sending a hotter signal to the fuzz:confused:
are you running the fuzz first in the chain or behind a buffered pedal? try a compressor just before the fuzz or a clean boost. It will fatten up the fuzz and increase the gain. I've done this time to time for a different shade of fuzz but in my experience it's not necessary as I haven't experienced what you're describing.

It shouldn't make a difference, though. Strat pickups are not running series when selected together (which would obviously sound louder/thicker). As for placement in the signal chain, my fuzz is after 5 or 6 pedals, all of which are true bypass, and are turned off anyways. Plus, it happens even if I'm just into a fuzz and straight into the amp. The Sunface isn't the first fuzz I've encountered with this odd reaction to individually selected pickups. My old (and awful sounding) Dunlop FuzzFace did this, and so does my Fulltone Ultimate Octave. However, my Fulltone Soulbender actually sounds better when i don't combine pickups. Weird.

[BluesHarp]

Do you have a buffered pedal after the fuzz or another pedal engaged after the fuzz?

[The Pup]

Mine stays typically at 2:00 to 3:00.

[JRC4558Dude]

Do you have a buffered pedal after the fuzz or another pedal engaged after the fuzz?

Yup, I have a Nova delay at the end of my chain. However, this problem occurs even if the fuzz is the ONLY pedal in the signal chain.

[BluesHarp]

Is it possible your out of phase with your pickups and its only showing for some technical reason with your fuzz pedal? Maybe your mid pup is mis wired? I dont know enough here to help but, I loose volume and punch with my fuzz if I dont have my beano ON right after it. I remember reading about something like this on a thread on fuzzes months ago, but cant remember the details. Try a pedal engaged right after it and see what happens. ??


Yup, I have a Nova delay at the end of my chain. However, this problem occurs even if the fuzz is the ONLY pedal in the signal chain.