Here's an odd Acoustic question...

[padavis]

What is the basic strat of the acoustic world? I mean you know, that American made basic must have acoustic guitar that always gets played and is not ridiculously expensive if you buy one used and is good in generally every situation. Does that make sense? I have been thinking about this a lot recently as I want just a solid acoustic but I like some features but nothing too much.

[chaz]

J45

[Lawn Jockey]

How much coin?

[padavis]

weleetkaoutlaws -- Price is the hard part. I sort of figure acoustics, to get a good one, probably require a little more than what it takes to get a decent electric. But, gosh I dont know about price. This is mostly hypothetical pre-gas planning/dreaming. But dreaming realistically, probably less than a thousand. Is that too low?

Chaz -- I like J45s. Have you ever played the working man one? I thought I played one called the workingman or something like that... I could have bought one of those in my less than a thousand target...

[Lawn Jockey]

You'll have a tougher time squeezing in a J-45 for less than a grand.....even used.

I'd be looking at Larrivee (03 Series) or the Martin (15 Series). You can be into either of those (new) for less than a grand.

[Lawn Jockey]

Used opens up the door to Martin (D-18's maybe), Larrivee 05 Series, and a HOST of others.

[jgm]

+1 and +1 on J45's and D18's.

[padavis]

Thanks for the opinions fellers... if me and my dad would stop trading back and forth I might be able to act on the D18 advice... hmmm lots to think about here.

[nmiller]

I'd pick the D-18 over the J-45 in terms of historical precidence. In terms of tone, I wouldn't take a new Martin if someone paid me.

It's also worth looking at Taylors.

[zombywoof]

Nope
J-45 = Tele (both are plain jane, workhorse instruments)
SJ (Southerner Jumbo)= Strat (the SJ is a sexier version of the J-45)

Of the newer Gibsons, though, the one I have been most impressed with is the AJ.

[pitner]

D-18 is my current acoustic of choice. Mine is a 1968 and sounds perfect and was not that expensive.

[Beenerpro]

+1 Gibby J-45

[zombywoof]

I like J45s. Have you ever played the working man one? I thought I played one called the workingman or something like that... I could have bought one of those in my less than a thousand target...

You get what you pay for. The Workingman J-45 it not Gibson's finest moment. While I love my Gibsons - for $1,000 you could land a Taylor 300 series, a Larrivee D-04 or something like that. Ya want a good new J-45 you will have to shell out at least double that price and even there you may have to play a few to find one that can cut the mustard.

The newest Gibson I have ever owned is a 1960 J-200 cuz I love the old school Gibson tone. I still have the J-200 as well as a 1956 SJ which as I said is a duded up version of a J-45. The J-200 eats other guitars for lunch - there ain't nuttin' like it in the world. Made back when they were a custom built instrument with only 150 to 200 being made a year, finished in the same spray booths that turned out the late 50's burst Lesters, with a bracing system unique to that guitar, and tone bars individually shaped for each guitar.

The older SJ's and J-45s, however, ain't gonna be everybody's cup of tea. There is a reason you rarely see Bluegrass pickers using them.
The newer Gibsons are voiced somewhat differently - a bit more of a Martin vibe if you will (remember though, the Hummingbird was originally an out and out attempt to copy a Martin dread). Still great strummers but with a more booming bass rather than warm and chunky and even brighter highs. To my ear, they are more versatile than the originals. But if you truly want bright, shimmering highs you are still better off with a Martin or Taylor.

[mrmuzikhead]

I'd have to say a Martin D28/18 would be the "strat" of acoustics. I'm not a fan of Gibby or Taylor acoustics. I do like the Larrivees and Collings tho. None of theses are "cheap" tho. I've tried some Waldens that are amazing for the price.

[padavis]

This thread picked up a little more! Thanks for the detailed info guys. Zomby, I really appreciate your thoughts on the AJ, SJ and J45. Really made some things fit in my head. Also thanks to the fellas sort of helping guide my thoughts. I sometimes get to thinking Martin, Martin, Martin and thats what I was thinking I might go for but when I am honest with my self, like nmiller, I dont really dig any one that I have picked up new recently. But, I have really liked some Southern Jumbos and an Advanced Jumbo. I also feel like can hear the AJ sitting a Bluegrass mix in my mind as well as being a good utility guitar. So I guess I really like like the Gibson acoustic sound most and I should just wait and get one when I got the cash...
So most important lesson I picked up from this thread, girl and house and part-time jobs dont mix well with G.A.S....
oh also, new development. Acted on some advice found on this thread and went down a little. I traded my dad for a Taylor DN3 I had picked up awhile ago when I was in a similar search. He wanted a bass amp I had and just a little cash and since hes my dad I can pay him a little cash over a big amount of time haha, and then in the future I can pair this up with some more cash and get the gibby I really want.
Another thing, I have a 1961 Gibson Country & Western. That thing has no equal and I basically stole the thing... so I dont NEED a high dollar acoustic. But, I was wanting to sort of retire it from my poor college buddies apartments. One time it had condensation running down it like a coke bottle at an August picknic. I dont care what people say about these thigns being made to play. I want this thing to make it to 100 years old while I play it at home or at church with minimal repairs along the way haha! So the taylor will be okay for immediate needs. But its good to know, well kinda, that if I want a good acoustic even one that fits a lot of situations, I will need to set my bar a little higher.
SO thanks again on your thoughts about the best utility acoustic! Any more thoughts or ideas would be awesome!

[tonemeister]

IMO best Gibson off the shelf is the Blues King ... my wife bought one before they doubled in price, and it is loud, clear, well balanced, easy to play, and has that bluesy/jazzy mojo about it. Besides the AJ ($$$), which is also a great model, most of the Gibbys I try out in stores are dead logs. Very disappointing ... but then so are the Martin HD28s I have tried lately ... dead as door knobs ...

My wife also plays a Taylor Big Baby ... say what you want, it really is the best bang for the buck going. I had to do some setup work, raise the nutslots on a few strings, but it is very balanced and sounds surprisingly good.

[Jahn]

Tele = Gibson J-45 = Martin D-18
Strat = Gibson AJ = Martin D-28

Basically, the hogs are the plain jane workhorses, the rosewoods are the bling, and all of the above are the industry standards.

[BigDoug1053]

I would suggest a D-15 if you want to go new. I like the mahogany Martins a lot for an all purpose guitar - not too boomy - easy to mic. But any dreadnaught will require that you practice and build up your fingers - especially if you string with mediums. If you play an electric most of the time, you might wanna check out a classical - you can get a really nice one with good electronics for under a grand.

[apalazzolo]

Tele = Gibson J-45 = Martin D-18
Strat = Gibson AJ = Martin D-28

Basically, the hogs are the plain jane workhorses, the rosewoods are the bling, and all of the above are the industry standards.

this agrees with my experience ... for something very close and a great value consider westerly made guilds ... d-40, d-25 et al are mahogany ... d-50 and higher are rosewood ...

[chaz]

weleetkaoutlaws -- Price is the hard part. I sort of figure acoustics, to get a good one, probably require a little more than what it takes to get a decent electric. But, gosh I dont know about price. This is mostly hypothetical pre-gas planning/dreaming. But dreaming realistically, probably less than a thousand. Is that too low?

Chaz -- I like J45s. Have you ever played the working man one? I thought I played one called the workingman or something like that... I could have bought one of those in my less than a thousand target...

Yep, I've played a few but never found one I liked. J-45's are easier to find a good one in general. Blues King are very nice and SJ's are tops! J-45's have much more mids content than the maple back guitars which are sweeter sounding and more versatile for diverse music styles overall.
I just picked up a good used mahogany J-45 for under a grand. SJ's and BK's are much harder to find, and will definitely cost more. Probably used around $1500 (BK's) to $2000 and up (SJ's). It's a crap shoot if you buy something without playing it first though. Good luck in your search.

[RustyAxe]

In terms of tone, I wouldn't take a new Martin if someone paid me.
Without a "why" this comes across as just another ignorant opinion of of another guitar bigot ... :crazy

Modern USA-made Martins are among the best sounding, nicest playing, "factory" guitars you'll find ... anywhere at any price. My NEW D-35 stands up against any D-35 made in any year.

[pickaguitar]

I'd say a D-18 Martin

I wouldn't take a new Martin if someone paid me
Good! More for me :)
My newer D28 Marquis kicks frickin tonal azz!

http://www.geocities.com/jason469214/marquis/images/upper_bout_inside.jpg

[devinb]

I don't know, J-45's and J-50's seem right to me, made in huge quantities from early on, pretty industry standard...I guess I just don't see a strat being that more sexy than a tele.

[devilrob1979]

Without a "why" this comes across as just another ignorant opinion of of another guitar bigot ... :crazy

Modern USA-made Martins are among the best sounding, nicest playing, "factory" guitars you'll find ... anywhere at any price. My NEW D-35 stands up against any D-35 made in any year.

I'll agree with you there. I played all of the above guitars on a recent shopping expedition and the D-35's the one that spoke to me.

[John Mayes]

when it comes down to historical standards Martin has a big edge over Gibson in the acoustic world. Martin reshaped, and defined the modern guitar as we know it. I, personally, would take a vintage Gibby over a Martin any day of the week, but in reference to the OP question... I'd say a D-18 or a D-28.

[GuitarsFromMars]

Try an AJ,you'll buy one-that simple.