Did I buy a stolen guitar?

[GAD]

Mod edit: FS Link removed

Someone posted a pic of a Washburn HB35 (http://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/hb35.aspx) (http://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/hb35.aspx) and damn if it's not dead-on to what I have. I need to go see one in person to see just how similar, but from what I've read, it's too close not to worry.

Could I have been taken on this? Is it possible that someone took a HB35, cut off or refinished the headstock, replaced the plastic bits and sticker inside the body and sold it for a profit?

I'm feeling a bit sick about it all, first I might have a stolen guitar that I couldn't even return to the owner since there's no real S/N, and secondly maybe I got taken for a ride...

Thoughts?

Here's mine:
http://www.gad.net/GAD/Guitar/Barbara/_B0Z3088_800.jpg

Here's the HB35:
http://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/images/zoom_hb35n.jpg

GAD

[rockinlespaul]

Looks like the top one has more of an angle to the bridge to me, and the bridge tone knob is farther away from the f-hole on the other guit.

[rickd]

hey man, i didn't want to say anything in your for sale thread, but i think that's what happened

i asked a friend last night, after i sent him pics of both, he's quite knowledgeable about these things, and he thinks that's what happened

[2leod]

I'm going to say (IMO) that those are not the same. Look at the profile of the cutaways...

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a62/2leod/compare.jpg

the horn is pointier on the Washburn.

[GAD]

Is there any way to find out for sure? I pulled the pickups and they're not marked at all, nor is the routing. There's no serial number on the guitar, but there is on the sticker inside that says "Barbara Guitars", but I've never found any info on a company by that name.

GAD

[XKnight]

Try to track down the Luthier who supposedly built it.

[GAD]

Seems like a LOT of work to pass off a stolen guitar too... I could see if it was a $20,000 fake Strat or something, but I can't imagine the work put into this being profitable.

GAD

[GAD]

Try to track down the Luthier who supposedly built it.

I've tried with no success. The guy I got it from pretty much disappeared adding to my concerns.

GAD

[GAD]

I'm going to say (IMO) that those are not the same. Look at the profile of the cutaways...

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a62/2leod/compare.jpg

More to the point, look at the F-Holes. On mine it terminates even with the pickup, wheras on the righ it terminates above the pickup.

GAD

[rickd]

Seems like a LOT of work to pass off a stolen guitar too... I could see if it was a $20,000 fake Strat or something, but I can't imagine the work put into this being profitable.

GAD
Not really. Think about it: you can buy those for about $300 and if someone got a wholesale discount on them, let's say $200, you sell 10 of them at what, you're asking $1500 for yours, so let's just say that, then you've made 10k when you factor in the tiny changes, time etc. Seems like a lucrative scam to me.

[XKnight]

I've tried with no success. The guy I got it from pretty much disappeared adding to my concerns.

GAD

Here ya go: Alan Kenyon (615) 230-6223 1118 Belvedere Dr, Gallatin, TN 37066

[bluesjuke]

They are not the same guitar I say.
I have no doubts about that.

Sell it.

[2leod]

More to the point, look at the F-Holes. On mine it terminates even with the pickup, wheras on the righ it terminates above the pickup.

GAD
Agreed - not the same guitar.

[rickd]

While I don't think they're the same guitar, we still can't emphatically answer the OP's question. I just find it hard to believe someone would start building handmade 335 copies and make them almost EXACTLY like a $300 Asian knockoff.

Call the luthier and report back.

[Supasso]

For what it's worth, I think the story "according to the seller" does not sound believable. I don't think a former Gibson luthier in charge of the 335 would copy a Washburn right down to the inlay and headstock shape. Also, I look at the pictures on your website, and the picture of the heel clearly shows that it's a glue-on heel. That's not I expect from a custom-made guitar. http://www.gad.net/GAD/Guitar/Barbara/_B0Z3081_800.jpg

[OlAndrew]

Looking at 2Leod's pics, I see some differences, I think. Grain on the left side as you look at it, slopes down towards the outside in the left pic, no slope in the right pic, pickguard edge plain in the left pic, white layer visible in the right pic, (yeah, you can change pickguards, but you gotta find a good match and all that , not usually easy), the tops of the horns are almost pointy in the right, round on the left. Hard to say without seeing in person, but I think they're different.

[boog204]

i think they're close but different. the control layout, f-hole placement, bridge angle, horn shape... i'm no luthier but i don't think you could take a stock hb35 and tweak it like that w/out it being noticable in some way.

[tfunster]

The volume and tone controls are in completely different areas.

[Supasso]

More to the point, look at the F-Holes. On mine it terminates even with the pickup, wheras on the righ it terminates above the pickup.

GADLook at the Washburn site, even the two guitars they show don't appear the have the same placement for F-holes or the knobs either. The red one looks more like your guitar than the natural one. Those guitars are probably not very consistently made.

[Supasso]

http://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/images/zoom_hb35wr.jpghttp://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/images/zoom_hb35n.jpg

[rickd]

http://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/images/zoom_hb35wr.jpghttp://www.washburn.com/products/electrics/hollow/images/zoom_hb35n.jpg

is it me or do the bridges look different on those guitars?

[Jason_86_951]

There is one on Ebay that matches up better in regard to dimensions to the OP's one. http://rover.ebay.com/ar/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?mpt=%5BCacheBuster%5D&adtype=1&size=1x1&type=4&campid=5335828753&toolid=10001&mpre=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2FNEW-Washburn-HB35-335-Semi-Hollowbody-Jazz-Guitar-Flame_W0QQitemZ290252243497QQihZ019QQcategoryZ3304 8QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItemhttp://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Washburn-HB35-335-Semi-Hollowbody-Jazz-Guitar-Flame_W0QQitemZ290252243497QQihZ019QQcategoryZ3304 8QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem (http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-53200-19255-0/1?type=3&campid=5335828753&toolid=10001&mpre=http%3A%2F%2Fcgi.ebay.com%2FNEW-Washburn-HB35-335-Semi-Hollowbody-Jazz-Guitar-Flame_W0QQitemZ290252243497QQihZ019QQcategoryZ3304 8QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem)
I've looked at a few dozen different ones now and the F hole and control locations vary from 1 to another. I'd say someone changed a few cosmetics and pulled a fast one.
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/5340921/aview/1122466360347_IM009012.JPG http://www.gad.net/GAD/Guitar/Barbara/_B0Z3090_800.jpg

[Jason_86_951]

and the backs
http://imagehost.vendio.com/a/5340921/aview/1122469759815_IM009017.JPG http://www.gad.net/GAD/Guitar/Barbara/_B0Z3077_800.jpg

[Supasso]

is it me or do the bridges look different on those guitars?I think those cheap guitars are probably made to a tight tolerance/specification. The OP's guitar could be one of them.

[Jason_86_951]

The other thought on this is that the "builder" could be having the same factory build them with a few cosmetic upgrades.

[rickd]

I think those cheap guitars are probably made to a tight tolerance/specification. The OP's guitar could be one of them.
i meant the two guitars in your pic from washburn's website

seems kind of silly to me that washburn would have those two picture when they're so obviously different :D

what if gibson showed two 335's with their f-holes and knobs slightly askew? :jo

[gearitis]

Try contacting Alan of Barbara Guitars in Gallatin, Tennesee through his My Space page and see if he built it:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=121292960

[treeofpain]

Looks like a reworked Washburn to me...

[rickd]

Try contacting Alan of Barbara Guitars in Gallatin, Tennesee through his My Space page and see if he built it:

http://profile.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=user.viewprofile&friendid=121292960
there's a pic of a guitar that looks exactly like the OP's if it's not the same guitar on that myspace

[Quarter]

The cutaway depth on the OP's is deeper than on the posted Washburn examples.

[GAD]

there's a pic of a guitar that looks exactly like the OP's if it's not the same guitar on that myspace

Where? I don't see it.

GAD

[GAD]

I found it. Different guitar, but REALLY similar.

GAD

[gkoelling]

i meant the two guitars in your pic from washburn's website

seems kind of silly to me that washburn would have those two picture when they're so obviously different :D

what if gibson showed two 335's with their f-holes and knobs slightly askew? :jo

You're comparing US made instruments to an import line. There's nothing wrong with Washburn but I wouldn't be at all surprised if they sourced that model, as well as others, from more than one factory.

Variances in cosmetics do happen with product coming from different plants.

The OP's headstock has the Washburn shape but it depends on whether Washburn ever copyrighted the shape and whether they want to chase a guy for what might be a one-off.

[rickd]

You're comparing US made instruments to an import line.
:confused: The two pics posted of the HB35s are both import models. In fact, Washburn does not make an American HB35 that I'm aware of.

What are you talking about?

[dk123123dk]

I think the guitar you have is identical to the guitar listed on the myspace page. I cannot see any differences.

dk

[GAD]

The wood grain matches... diff knobs. Fascinating

GAD

[rickd]

I think the guitar you have is identical to the guitar listed on the myspace page. I cannot see any differences.

dk
it's the same guitar

the grain does match

[Scott Auld]

They look different to me, Gad. The grain between the pickups is straight on one guitar and v-shaped on the other.

[rickd]

They look different to me, Gad. The grain between the pickups is straight on one guitar and v-shaped on the other.
the points i've circled, color-coded, lead me to believe they're the same guitar

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/unclesmacky/guitar.jpghttp://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/unclesmacky/_B0Z2629_800.jpg

[Structo]

Maybe it's photo flame!

[gkoelling]

:confused: The two pics posted of the HB35s are both import models. In fact, Washburn does not make an American HB35 that I'm aware of.

What are you talking about?


Let me explain this to you very slowly so you don't miss any of it.

I.....don't.......know......what.......the.......$ %c&.....I'm ....talking .....about!

Sorry, reading two different posts at the same time. Somewhat like walking and chewing gum.

[Supasso]

Now the question is whether the Myspace page is a part of an elaborated scam. Creating a Myspace page is much easier than re-veneering a headstock anyway. I still find it hard to believe that a custom builder would copy a cheap Washburn guitar. I'm a sceptic for now.

[rickd]

Now the question is whether the Myspace page is a part of an elaborated scam. Creating a Myspace page is much easier than re-veneering a headstock anyway. I still find it hard to believe that a custom builder would copy a cheap Washburn guitar. I'm a sceptic for now.

I'm in that camp as well. The detailed pics look too much like a mod Washburn to me.

[jeffwith1f]

different
the notches in the flame could run through several veneers made from the same peice of wood, but there appear to be differences as well, suggesting 2 different guitars, or tricks being played in the photo graphs by the wavyness and the light

case in point, look at the photo above where you have circled the notches.
Check out the flame around the bass side F-hole.m looks almost inversed.
again, could be the photos...

[FloridaSam]

Ok, there is a POSSIBILITY that its not a Washburn. However, that possibility diminishes GREATLY when I see things like this.

Could the 12 string acoustic be a Washburn as well? Though the body shape is different, all the cosmetics are similar, especially the sound hole and fretboard.

Either he really respects the Washburn designs or shenanigans is going on.

http://images.buzzillions.com/images_products/07/66/94971_raw.jpg

http://a223.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/71/l_174844d47ceca170dd81805c13598c1e.jpg

[GAD]

Well this whole thing is making me sick. I sent an email through Myspace. I'll call tomorow if I get the time at work.

This sucks.

GAD

[ugacrow]

Ok, there is a POSSIBILITY that its not a Washburn. However, that possibility diminishes GREATLY when I see things like this.

Could the 12 string acoustic be a Washburn as well? Though the body shape is different, all the cosmetics are similar, especially the sound hole and fretboard.

Either he really respects the Washburn designs or shenanigans is going on.

http://images.buzzillions.com/images_products/07/66/94971_raw.jpg

http://a223.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images01/71/l_174844d47ceca170dd81805c13598c1e.jpg

Those two guitars look similar, but are totally different. 20 vs. 21 frets, different bodies, different headstocks, different bridges, etc.

[rickd]

Well this whole thing is making me sick. I sent an email through Myspace. I'll call tomorow if I get the time at work.

This sucks.

GAD
i sent him a message too

not to pile on, but those other guitars on his webiste, the ones he allegedly "made by hand" look like cheap asian copies too

look at the SG copy and the other 335 copy :(

sorry man

[2leod]

Those two guitars look similar, but are totally different. 20 vs. 21 frets, different bodies, different headstocks, different bridges, etc.
Agreed - the waist is not the same at all. I'm not quite sure what to make of the posts suggesting this builder's guitars are reworked Washburns, to my eye there are clear and significant differences. I don't see the photos of the other guitars on the MySpace page (do you have to be logged in?) but if there are two "B" 335s with very similar markings, it strongly suggests that the tops were cut from the same block of wood. I have yet to see how any of these guitars are Washburns.

GAD, on your F/S thread you said that the fit and finish of your guitar were superior to others you had tried, yet the suggestions of some on this thread are that this is a cheap copy, or worse, a rebrand - does that jive with your experience of your guitar?

I guess what I'm throwing in here is to try and not get wound up about suggestions, but wait to hear from the builder and go from there...

[rickd]

Agreed - the waist is not the same at all. I'm not quite sure what to make of the posts suggesting this builder's guitars are reworked Washburns, to my eye there are clear and significant differences. I don't see the photos of the other guitars on the MySpace page (do you have to be logged in?) but if there are two "B" 335s with very similar markings, it strongly suggests that the tops were cut from the same block of wood. I have yet to see how any of these guitars are Washburns.

GAD, on your F/S thread you said that the fit and finish of your guitar were superior to others you had tried, yet the suggestions of some on this thread are that this is a cheap copy, or worse, a rebrand - does that jive with your experience of your guitar?

I guess what I'm throwing in here is to try and not get wound up about suggestions, but wait to hear from the builder and go from there... since you can't see his other "custom" guitars, here are a couple of pictures from his myspace page that would make me nervous

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/unclesmacky/1525569512_l.jpghttp://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/unclesmacky/1525568121_l.jpg

[GAD]

GAD, on your F/S thread you said that the fit and finish of your guitar were superior to others you had tried, yet the suggestions of some on this thread are that this is a cheap copy, or worse, a rebrand - does that jive with your experience of your guitar?

I guess what I'm throwing in here is to try and not get wound up about suggestions, but wait to hear from the builder and go from there...

Thanks. This guitar has a better fit and finish to many of the current ES335s I tried. So did my $350 Ibanez Artcore for that matter. That's not so much a comment on this guitar as the condition of the current over-priced ES-335s (IMO).

Playability I'm not worried about. If it had a thicker neck we wouldn't be having this talk because I'd be loving it. Problem is I decided to sell it, so the possibility exists that the guitar is not worth what I paid.

GAD

[rastus]

I know one thing and other local cats will tell you as well (and I'm not saying I know FOR SURE in this case) that historically speaking, there have been plenty of "guitar building shenanigans" going on in Hendersonville TN for decades-basically from the same few hornswagglers. Looks to me as though those guitars have been bought from MIRC (musical instrument recycling corp) in Brentwood TN, and then jacked around with cosmetically. We also had Washburn toying with building a plant here a few years ago and ever since there has been an influx of weird Washburns around. MIRC is a legit business that sells and repairs imported "2nds" from asia. They are completely legit and nothing at all to fear. But I have seen some unscrupulous builders (generally up North of town) get Samicks and such and laminate some crap onto them and try to foist them off as (chuckles evilly) handbuilt.

I guess our most famous swindler would have been Rose guitars. Those axes still get respect outside town, but basically they were just parts guitars with some customization cosmetically. Man, the stories about that place would curdle your blood.

This looks like freaking bunk to me, just a buncha reworked imported so-so guitars. If it ain't true, I'm easy to find and will be glad for that "builder" to try and convince me. I am sorry for the OP though, because that guitar would be worth more with Washburn on it's headstock. I'm telling you, you gotta be careful in Music City, there are some funky con artists swimming in the waters here!

[hugodarosa]

I unfortunately don't have anything beneficial to say that would help in your investigation. I will say however that this thread is VERY intriguing. Wish the best of luck to you in finding out the facts to the guitar!

[Shemp]

The body shape looks more like a "Lawsuit" Agile AS-820 than an HB 35. The fretboard inlays pretty much nail the Washburn, but the headstock is completely off.

I don't know what you bought, but it is not a Washburn.

[EdMan57]

...not to pile on, but those other guitars on his webiste, the ones he allegedly "made by hand" look like cheap asian copies too...

Maybe the builder is Asian,as well.

:hide


Seriously,for what it's worth,my old Korean built HB35 [with Duncan Seth Lovers] was a much better guitar than my even older '71 Gibson ES335 ever was.Only after a good friend offered me much more than I originally paid for it,did I let that HB35 go.At least I still have visitation rights.

;)


Ed

[rickd]

Maybe the builder is Asian,as well.

:hide


Seriously,for what it's worth,my old Korean built HB35 [with Duncan Seth Lovers] was a much better guitar than my even older '71 Gibson ES335 ever was.Only after a good friend offered me much more than I originally paid for it,did I let that HB35 go.At least I still have visitation rights.

;)


Ed I have no problem with Asian guitars, and in fact play an Ibanez AS180, made in Japan. There are big differences though in the build quality of the guitars out of Asia.

I DO have a HUGE problem with someone passing off a cheap knock off as "custom one-off handbuilt" guitar.

[EdMan57]

...I DO have a HUGE problem with someone passing off a cheap knock off as "custom one-off handbuilt" guitar.

I agree.Especially if you paid an amount that was in line with most other American made guitars of that same genre.

:agree


Ed

[rickd]

still haven't heard from the maker

has anyone else ?

[GAD]

Nope

GAD

[rickd]

Nope

GAD
ok, well he didn't write me back but he sent me a friend request on myspace, so he read my message but dodged it

i smell a rat

[Dave Orban]

Seems like a LOT of work to pass off a stolen guitar too... I could see if it was a $20,000 fake Strat or something, but I can't imagine the work put into this being profitable.

GADMy thoughts, too.

[rickd]

My thoughts, too.
you don't think putting on a headstock veneer for a grand is good money?

even if that took a week, to me, seems like a pretty good ROI

[2leod]

While I see clear differences between GAD's guitar and the Washburns from their website, the one on eBay that Jason_86_951 linked is remarkably similar to GAD's.

I hope you don't mind GAD, I copied photos from your page to do side by side comparisons - the left is the eBay Washburn and the right is GAD's...

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a62/2leod/W-GCompare1.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a62/2leod/W-GCompare2.jpg

http://i9.photobucket.com/albums/a62/2leod/W-GCompare3.jpg

GAD, I respect your decision to put your F/S thread on hold until you have this thing straightened out in your own mind. You say you got this guitar in a trade from another forum (just so there is no confusion here) and you may have been hoodwinked (knowingly or inadvertently on their part) on this one, but your desire to give disclosure gives me confidence to deal with you here.

Maybe even on this guitar if I was looking...
:)

[Jahn]

I did a google search on Alan Kenyon, the luthier of the Barbara guitar as you were told by the seller, and didn't come up with any hits. Did the seller give you an email or website address for Alan Kenyon?

[rickd]

I did a google search on Alan Kenyon, the luthier of the Barbara guitar as you were told by the seller, and didn't come up with any hits. Did the seller give you an email or website address for Alan Kenyon?
there's a myspace link in this thread

[Memorex]

The HB35 is just a knockoff of a Gibson 335. So this one looks like a knockoff of an HB35. What's the big deal?

[Jahn]

Thanks for the myspace link, it was under Barbara Guitars. Yep I agree, next step is to contact the luthier directly.

[rickd]

The HB35 is just a knockoff of a Gibson 335. So this one looks like a knockoff of an HB35. What's the big deal?
Did you read the thread? We're trying to determine if it's a cheap copy, passed off as a one-off handmade original.

[Memorex]

I guess I did miss the point, because I had never heard of Barbara Guitars, and didn't know they were supposed to be valuable.

[Jason_86_951]

GAD- It really sucks that you got stuck in this. Do you have any recourse with who you traded with?

As far as the guitar. Either he doctored a Washburn up or ordered one with his cosmetics on it from the same factory that Washburn has theirs made at. Either way it's made by the same folks.

It does look like Washburn has been making this model for a long time and there are many variations due to what ever reasons. So while it may not match exactly to one run, it would to another.

I'd be tracking some folks down. It's straight up fraud.

[gearitis]

If the guitar was passed off as a valuable handmade original, I'd love to know when the first incidence of deception occurred.

Did Alan of Barbara Guitars modify an existing cheap guitar, disclose exactly what it was, and then sell it at an appropriate and fair price? Then at some point did someone else knowingly lie about the guitar's origin and inflate its value in the course of a sale or trade? Or is this a case of fraud from the beginning...

[fisheric]

a sure fire way to test if its hand made or not would be to take a little bit of acetone or lacquer thinner a test a spot area. somewhere inconspicuous like underneath the strap button.

I have not heard of any small boutique builders using poly on their guitars. as far as i know practically all small time luthiers use nitro.

someone correct me if i am wrong.

[aram]

there's a dude that he's friends with named ken dodge, whom he says he's custom built some guitars for.

Ken Dodge's band (in the pics) has three of this dudes guitars.

MMMMM. I wonder if it's the same guy?

[rickd]

anyone heard anything--still nothing from the luthier on my end

[GAD]

I got a reply from him:

I have built 3 of these. Yours is the first. The other 2 were slightly different. This is truly a hand built instrument. Before I left Gibson and started building guitars I was responsible for the 335 department and it quickly became my favorite Gibson guitar. There are elements of an Epiphone in here as well as elements of other instruments like mosrite and barnakay. This instrument was originally purchased for $800 in 2006. This guitar was built for somebody who considered this his dream guitar and was never going to sell it. Many of the design characteristics were dictated by him. He chose the wood, pickups etc. He ended up selling it along with several other pieces to move his family from Minnesota to Florida.

Taking him at his word, I have to assume the person I got it from screwed me, which fits since he seems to have completely dissapeard.

GAD

[rickd]

I got a reply from him:



Taking him at his word, I have to assume the person I got it from screwed me, which fits since he seems to have completely dissapeard.

GAD How would you be screwed if it's truly a handbuilt guitar as he described it? Sounds like you were telling the truth in your ad.

I still don't believe what he's saying though. I think it's a geeked up import.

[GAD]

How would you be screwed if it's truly a handbuilt guitar as he described it? Sounds like you were telling the truth in your ad.

I still don't believe what he's saying though. I think it's a geeked up import.

Because I essentially paid $1500 for it.

GAD

[rickd]

Because I essentially paid $1500 for it.

GAD Oh yeah. :(

[marcher5877]

I consider buying goods you know are stolen to be as dishonest and immoral as stealing.

[rickd]

I consider buying goods you know are stolen to be as dishonest and immoral as stealing.

Please explain this post. The thread poster had no idea what he had until recently. I can assure you he's quite upset.

[GAD]

I consider buying goods you know are stolen to be as dishonest and immoral as stealing.


Is this directed at me? If so you're way out of line.

GAD

[fisheric]

I consider buying goods you know are stolen to be as dishonest and immoral as stealing.


i consider you a jerk

[mike80]

I read the whole thread, but I'm not getting how this would be stolen?

Stolen from an individual, or a stolen design?

Someone please fill me in here.

[recto-robbie]

http://www.barbarasguitars.com/

[Schtomp]

http://www.barbarasguitars.com/
Not the same Barbara^^

[2leod]

I read the whole thread, but I'm not getting how this would be stolen?

Stolen from an individual, or a stolen design?

Someone please fill me in here.

I don't see stolen either. I suspect the OP saw how close it was to the Washburn (although it wasn't the same guitar that started the whole thing - see his F/S thread if you are inclined) and thought someone had altered it because it was hot. He's choked because he took this one in a trade, and the value of it may have been exaggerated by the trader's claim that it was a custom made guitar.

[GAD]

I don't see stolen either. I suspect the OP saw how close it was to the Washburn (although it wasn't the same guitar that started the whole thing - see his F/S thread if you are inclined) and thought someone had altered it because it was hot. He's choked because he took this one in a trade, and the value of it may have been exaggerated by the trader's claim that it was a custom made guitar.

Correct.

GAD

[edwarddavis]

Go to sleep , I would assume your ok

[Bob V]

Hmmm. Somebody "in charge" of 335's leaves Gibson, starts building one-offs, but instead of bandsawing out a chunk of wood he does it the way the mass-produced Asian guitars are made with multi-piece necks and a headstock and heel that are glued on separately? And doesn't come up with his own headstock profile - if you were going to copy the shape why would it be Washburn? And he’s only built three 335-style guitars like this since 2006? And the first custom one-off goes out the door from the boutique maker for $800? If he's for real I'd like him to make personalized custom blonde 335's for me and all my friends at that price.

However we can only speculate here as to whether it was a modded import, a likely as that may seem from the learned observations posted above. Yet there’s no real proof so far since the photos are not taken at the same angle and when reduced to two dimensions you can get a strange impression of the relative positions of things. I did notice the OP guitar does not have the veneer triangle on the back under the neck joint. You’ve got provenance from the builder, for what it’s worth, and no reason to think it was stolen, and a purchase history that gives you a reason to ask what you need to recoup on this piece. Good luck.

[The Pup]

How does it play and sound?

[The Doper]

Hmmm. Somebody "in charge" of 335's leaves Gibson, starts building one-offs, but instead of bandsawing out a chunk of wood he does it the way the mass-produced Asian guitars are made with multi-piece necks and a headstock and heel that are glued on separately? And doesn't come up with his own headstock profile - if you were going to copy the shape why would it be Washburn? And he’s only built three 335-style guitars like this since 2006? And the first custom one-off goes out the door from the boutique maker for $800?

I agree, this part smells.

[humbuster]

Lots of stories in this thread.

[teefus]

look closely at the inlays. the spacing between the 2 inlay halves towards the higher frets is very different.

[nsps]

Let me explain this to you very slowly so you don't miss any of it.

I.....don't.......know......what.......the.......$ %c&.....I'm ....talking .....about!

Sorry, reading two different posts at the same time. Somewhat like walking and chewing gum.

I believe you were actually referring to this Rickd comment: "what if gibson showed two 335's with their f-holes and knobs slightly askew?"

You were basically saying that Gibson would obviously be holding their guitars to a higher standard since they're US made, so it's not a fair comparison. Still, you think for the website they'd get it right.

[PerfectStranger]

Different guitar....probably a copy!

[gkoelling]

I believe you were actually referring to this Rickd comment: "what if gibson showed two 335's with their f-holes and knobs slightly askew?"

You were basically saying that Gibson would obviously be holding their guitars to a higher standard since they're US made, so it's not a fair comparison. Still, you think for the website they'd get it right.

Thanks, nsps, That was probably it.

[Snail]

Hmmm. Somebody "in charge" of 335's leaves Gibson, starts building one-offs, but instead of bandsawing out a chunk of wood he does it the way the mass-produced Asian guitars are made with multi-piece necks and a headstock and heel that are glued on separately? And doesn't come up with his own headstock profile - if you were going to copy the shape why would it be Washburn? And he’s only built three 335-style guitars like this since 2006? And the first custom one-off goes out the door from the boutique maker for $800? If he's for real I'd like him to make personalized custom blonde 335's for me and all my friends at that price.


I agree. It sounds off. Way off! I, for one, don't buy that story.

[devinb]

I'm fascinated by this thread, and I don't even watch Law & Order or read mystery novels.

If it were my guitar, I'd consider doing a little more detective work, and call Gibson posing as a potential employer for the guy, and see if they have any record of him.

[dk123123dk]

Any updates on this? Why would someone make a hand built Washburn? Or did Washburn copy the shape from the custom builder?

dk

[rickd]

I've heard nothing, and I emailed the builder.

[Bluzboy66]

What Asian-based manufacturer builds Washburns? It's likely that they built a batch of these to spec for Barbara Guitars. That's pretty much the norm..........think Epiphone, Micheal Kelly, Dillion, Korean PRS and Hamer.....and many others.

Mike