Soundproofing a second bedroom in a condo!

[Scott K]

Is this possible? I'm looking to buy a condo in Chicago and use one of the bedrooms for rehearsals. Is there any way I'd be able to soundproof it so neighbors wouldn't hear anything?

If so, what would I need? I'm willing to spend whatever it takes.

[mtlin]

It would be very difficult. You would basically have to build a floating room within a room.

[testing1two]

Here's an excellent little primer course on the subject:

http://arts.ucsc.edu/EMS/Music/tech_background/TE-14/teces_14.html

Just remember two things: one-if you don't plan on staying in this condo for a substantial amount of time, be aware that most of the modifications involved for soundproofing aren't easily removed. And two-because this is a specialized application, you won't necessarily be adding any real value/equity to your condo.

And one more note: this is one area that is difficult to test until everything is done which means that minor errors in design or construction cause substantial sound leakage, undermining everything. If you are willing to spend 'whatever it takes,' then that should include a consultation from a design firm and a contractor with studio design/construction experience.

In this case, ambition and money mean nothing without a good plan IMHO.

[Bryan T]

I'm willing to spend whatever it takes.

It'll be in the tens of thousands of dollar range to do it.

[Scott K]

Thanks for the advice, guys. I'd be willing to spend around $20K, if needed. I'll check into all of this.

[tone4days]

if you have 'downstairs' neighbors, i submit that it will be absolutely impossible

if you have 'upstairs' neighbors, it will be imperative that you build a room within a room

if the music room will share a wall with a neighbor, same thing

hard enough in a stand alone home ... connected, it is really really hard

[angus99]

you said rehearsals, so you've discarded the idea of headphones or an attenuator, I take it. seems like $20K would buy a fair amount of rehearsal time somewhere . . .

[Glide]

if you have 'downstairs' neighbors, i submit that it will be absolutely impossible

if you have 'upstairs' neighbors, it will be imperative that you build a room within a room

if the music room will share a wall with a neighbor, same thing

hard enough in a stand alone home ... connected, it is really really hard

Couldn't agree with T4D more, regardless of the amount you spend. Now if you would have said a home, no problem, but a condo? I'll bet $20 to a donut you'll be disappointed. After two years of study I just built a studio in my basment by the way which ihas a room within a room with three sides of it being solid concrete wall, with double 5/8' sheetrock and green glue and you can still hear it upstairs - not enough to bother anyone, but if it were in a condo it wouldn't fly.

[gixxerrock]

If you are talking about soundproofing to the point you could have a full band in there I think it will be a crap shoot, and probably depend more on having an understanding with your neighbors.

I would recommend modest soundproofing that you could do for a few $k, then spend the rest on an electronic drum kit, modellers and decent monitoring system. There is a lot to be said for a band rehearsing at talking volume.

[thewhit]

Is this possible? I'm looking to buy a condo in Chicago and use one of the bedrooms for rehearsals. Is there any way I'd be able to soundproof it so neighbors wouldn't hear anything?

If so, what would I need? I'm willing to spend whatever it takes.

I think you might stand a better chance to get the neighbors to accept bribes for wearing ear muffs at home. Seriously the side walls in the rental condo I own are very thin and you can hear the guy next door, cough. That being said I suspect a high end building would have better insulation for sound but I suspect it would not be enough for what you're proposing.

[The bear]

A friend spent more that 30k on soundproofing and then received a noise complaint after doing a studio session in his apartment.

[Guitar Dave T]

Not likely to work, no matter how much insulation you use. Sound insulation requires air space and detachment. Even if you float a room within a room, the sound will travel through the connection points.

Couldn't you take that extra money and put it into a small house in a decent neighborhood, with good equity/resale value?

[Luke]

Cheaper way is to get yourself and bassist Axe-Fx and drummer Roland set, mix down to conversation level through self powered monitors.

ANYTHING over 80db will result in complaints when surrounded on six sides by neighbors.

Also there is no such thing as soundproof, just volume reduced. Volume reduced does not equal vibration elimination either.

When you shrink the room down by 12" in height by floating the floor and ceiling of the room in a room, it will feel cramped with 7' ceilings.

[camitchell]

Thanks for the advice, guys. I'd be willing to spend around $20K, if needed. I'll check into all of this.

For a condo, well it could be done but you'd have to do a lot of work yourself and have no idea of what the final outcome is until you've already spent the money. It would be a huge project to get it "soundproofed" and lets' not forget A/C requirements for something like that.

My suggestion.... get a rehearsal space. For 20K you could lease out a warehouse space, subdivide into a few rehearsal spaces and rent the others out. 24 hour access, etc.

[Catoogie]

Sean Pelton has a studio in his New York City apartment and it seems soundproofed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjgxaCerZpI&feature=related

[BluesForDan]

Sean Pelton has a studio in his New York City apartment and it seems soundproofed.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjgxaCerZpI&feature=related

I bet his neighbors still hear him and hate him. And that's just a drum room, not big enough for a band. Seriously, don't bother with a condo. Most HOAs probably would not allow it anyway. 20 grand would not be enough. You'll end up with a small stuffy room, and it may or may not be sound proofed enough.

Buy a house in the 'burbs, with a detached garage. Sound proof the garage, and it will still cost you big money, which you will not get back when you sell, unless a well-monied muso just happens to want to live there after you. You probably have as good an odd of winning a lottery jackpot.

If you have to rehearse at gig volume, rent a space. If you are just writing, go with the low volume solutions. The ideal total dead silent rehearsal studio in your own home is largely a fantasy, the reality is quite different. There's a reason why farms and ranches are the best choices for this kind of thing, distance = good.

[Platypus]

What about doing this in a condo just for guitar, not a full band?

I was honestly thinking of doing this in a condo myself.. the responses are not encouraging :P

[frizbplaya]

For just guitar you can build ISO cabinets and get better results but that's a different thread...

[Neill]

look at a product called quiet rock ... i forget exactly but it is like having 5 normal sheets of 1/2" drywall. that plus proper insulation and soundbar will take care of the walls; the ceiling and floor are a different story. but some sort of riser or platform that is somehow isolated from the floor and walls (perhaps with the rubber product they have in hockey arenas, or ?). just riffing here. i'll ask around and see if i can dig up any info.

[BluesForDan]

What about doing this in a condo just for guitar, not a full band?

I was honestly thinking of doing this in a condo myself.. the responses are not encouraging :P

Don't mean to be discouraging, but just trying to educate people to the reality. Silence is golden, and about as expensive per pound, too.

[Neill]

Don't mean to be discouraging, but just trying to educate people to the reality. Silence is golden, and about as expensive per pound, too.

this is true ime! but anything is possible if you have enough money. but i wouldn't suggest trying to soundproof anything if you are just a diy-er w/ minimal construction knowledge, if you want the room to actually BE soundproof.

[jharpersj]

I use a set of v drums and also everyone else can go direct with pod's or whatever, not the best way but a cheap solutions

[mattmccloskey]

This can be done, but it depends on a lot of factors:
1)How many walls/floors/ceilings are adjacent to other condos?

2)How old is the building and what is the construction?

3)How big is the room to be soundproofed?

I successfully soundproofed my basement studio in a philly row house. I can practice, rehearse, and record with a small band and have never received a complaint.
One advantage is I did not have to worry about people underneath me, and the stone/brick basement walls are obviously dense and only up against my neighbors basements.
Nonetheless I built a room within the basement, and it did not cost me near 20 grand or even 10.

The construction type has a big part in the success. In philly many condos are old converted warehouses and industrial or office buildings, or old factories,etc. These are easier to soundproof because they have steel and concrete floor frames, brick and plaster walls, tall ceilings, fire walls,etc.
If your condo is a loft type place converted from an old building like this, soundproofing is totally worthwhile.
Basically frame out walls and ceiling on 6 inch plates, make a double sided wall with staggered studs and put 5/8ths drywall on both sides, with insulation,leave a couple inches off the rooms walls and ceiling. Float the floor studs with rubber 'pucks' or similar, screw down plywood subflooring to those, lay down mass loaded vinyl over that, than a floating wood click together floor on top of that.
I put mass loaded vinyl on 5/8th drywall for my ceiling, with all the ceiling beams wrapped in a special sound cushioning dense foam.
Keep all power outlets surface mounted, no holes.
Anyway, there are lots of tricks, but you just need a big enough space to start with, and the right type of building construction to make it worth while.

[Scott K]

I've already got a rehearsal space here downtown, I just want to be able to walk into my rehearsal space whenever I want without driving.

Thanks for all the responses. I'll look into a lot of this. I'm thinking drums would be the loudest of the instruments, so if a guy can soundproof a drumroom, I might be able to pull this off.

[BluesForDan]

MattM is absolutely correct about the building's construction. When I hear the word condo, I picture what we call condos around here, made with the cheapest chipboard plywood, half inch sheet rock interior walls, aluminum frames. Cheap as shit, and yet they charged the moon for them. About as soundproof as a paper bag.

FYI, drums are not the worse offenders, the bass guitar is. Dropped tuned 7 strings with subwoofer cabs are a close second.

[JTC]

The great Joe Meek had a legendary home studio in his apartment, and a landlady living below who would pound her ceiling with a broom in an attempt to quiet him. He ended the argument with a shotgun. :bkw