Pickup replacement really worth it?

[zaddn]

Hey guys,

Was hoping you could weigh in on this.

I am looking into replacing the stock pickups in my MIM Fender 68 Reverse Headstock reissue strat. The tone I get is good, but I think I may be able to get something more out of the guitar. I am debating between a bunch of different pickup manufacturers. This question really doesn't deal with pickup makers, but if you feel you want to weigh in on it, feel free, I can always use advice.

Anyways, my dad is an old school musician and doesn't really believe in changing pickups, because in his 60's era gear, he never thought of doing that.

Would changing the pickups change my tone significantly? Aka, is it justifiable to spend a decent amount of money to change these pickups?

Thanks guys, hope to hear your opinions soon!

[shane88]

some pus will change the tone significantly ie you could put dimarzio super distortion s pus in it
but the stock pus are ok and the ans is only you can decide if it's worth it
take your time and go play some american strats with posh pus

[rydog2223]

Indeed. I never thought so "back in the day" but now I have a ear for different tones and have come to appreciate good pickups. What kind of tone are you chasing?? My I suggest for that guitar the Fender CS 69's? I think you would be happy with those. Good luck!

[zaddn]

I really like the tone of John Mayer in Good love is on the way, hendrix in little wing, anything bb king, buddy guy in feels like rain, etc... So mostly clean but something that can drive some ODs (zendrive, keeley ts9)

[lakehaus]

For a MIM Strat, most definitely! That's the single most best thing you can do changing the pups... that and change the trem block from zinc (or whatever it is) to steel. You just gotta decide what tone you want, then do the research on brands. Buying used is good! Just know who you're dealing with.

Respect your dad, but you ain't playin' his guitar!

[rydog2223]

I really like the tone of John Mayer in Good love is on the way, hendrix in little wing, anything bb king, buddy guy in feels like rain, etc... So mostly clean but something that can drive some ODs (zendrive, keeley ts9)

Try the custom shop 69's you won't regret it. Have you thought about a wiring upgrade kit at all?? Oh boy this is how it all starts!!!:love:

[dave67]

Yes it is. I have been in the game for over 20 years and have never left the stock pups in for long. I also have MIM strat and pups where gone with in hours of getting it home. I went with the SCN for now. I feel the need for more output, so a set of Hotrails are on order.

[GAD]

I pulled the SCNs out of my Am Dlx strat and replaced them with Fralins. HUGE difference in tone.

GAD

[zaddn]

Try the custom shop 69's you won't regret it. Have you thought about a wiring upgrade kit at all?? Oh boy this is how it all starts!!!:love:

wiring upgrades were actually what started this whole upgrading the pickups. I am taking my strat to a tech up in Cleveland, and he said he does these modifications to the wiring that make it sound better. But I got to thinking, if I am paying for all this work, why not have him drop some pickups in while he is at it? Anyways, I just don't see doing all this work to accentuate the sound of stock pickups, even though the tone I get isn't that bad. I have heard that new pickups can really bring a MIM guitar to life; because I love the playability of the guitar. Now I am just trying to get my dad on my side by convincing him that these really do make a huge difference, so keep on talking guys! haha.

[murkat]

For a MIM Strat, most definitely! That's the single most best thing you can do changing the pups... that and change the trem block from zinc (or whatever it is) to steel.

Agreed, the two are a must, and will change a mim to a real great strat for you. Cheap mods, huge gains in tone.

[RussB]

I am taking my strat to a tech up in Cleveland,

...and he said he does these modifications to the wiring that make it sound better. But I got to thinking, if I am paying for all this work...

I think this Tech may be BS'ing you. No matter how you re-wire that Strat, the pup's will still sound the same. I mean, what could he possibly do to make it better? Make sure you ask first, and get a detailed description of what's going to be done to your Strat.

A much better choice is to learn to do the work yourself. A small investment in quality tools (that will last a lifetime) and a bit of know-how which you can get over the 'net or in many available books is all you need. Wiring uo guitars ain;t rocket science. Common sense and a little skill will get the job done.

Another option is to order a pre-wired pickguard assembly, but the downside is that it will cost about what a new MIM Strat goes for.

To answer the question, "is it worth it?"

Unfortunately, you'll never really know until you swap out the pup's :)

[drolling]

No offense to the old man, but aftermarket parts just weren't available back in his day - Heck they weren't even available back in my day ~ If they had been, believe me, everybody woulda been doing it!

And with anything but most MiA Fenders, sooner or later, I always replace the pickups - weakest link in import Fenders.

I do it myself, too.. tho' I'm none too handy with a soldering iron. P-up swapping's about as straightforward as it gets, and there're a ton of DIY tutorials on the net nowadays.

Gotta say, while I'm at it, that this rewiring proposal sounds like large, succulent slices of Bologna to me.

Some guys go nuts & redo all the pots, caps, cloth wiring, the works - but that's a big job, with interventions like boring out the holes for larger US-made pot shafts. Not worth it for the trouble - and potential *complications* involved, IMO..

While I've got the guitar opened up, I usually line the cavities with adhesive-backed copper foil - Get mine in a stained glass craft store. Enough to do 5 guitars (the back of the pickguards, too) for 5 bucks.

But don't skimp on the pickups themselves. Buying used is a good idea, as some crazy gearheads change parts constantly and you can get something with very little playing time on it for half price.

There's some tried & true winders out there, and more & more choices every day. I've got Fralins in my Strat & it sounds AS GOOD as some of the finest vintage $$$$ guitars I've played, tho' it's just a cheap Japan-made 50s style.

I also replace the switches. Maybe it's just my luck, but I've NEVER had an MiM/MiJ Fender whose switch didn't oxidize within weeks! Be it a Telecaster, a Jazzmaster or a Stratocaster, that teeny-weeny little plastic box has gotta go. I put in a hefty Switchcraft or DiMarzio. But if yours is a big clunker w/a huge spring on it, you're probably fine.

That suggestion to swap out the trem block's also a great idea - I recommend Callaham. Was totally ASTONISHED at the difference in tone & feel. Best 50 bucks I've ever spent.

Divorced now for many years, but my wife used to love it when I'd take over the dining room table for a few days while performing the surgery.

Most importantly, have fun!

And get back to us w/a full report.

[VaughnC]

Swapping pickups can make a difference...but it is a bit of a crap shoot because they have to compliment the wood/hardware around them...but you also have to keep in mind that you can't polish a turd. A few years ago I had 6 similar Strats and I flopped the exact same pickup set in each guitar. They sounded excellent in 2, sounded horrible in 3, and sounded ok in 1. So, while my conclusion is that pickups are kind of a crap shoot, the right one's, in the right guitar, can put a guitar over the top. But, if a guitar is a turd to begin with, NO pickup will make it a non-turd.

[Dave Orban]

There are a TON of really good-sounding pickups out there today, at ALL price ranges.

Generally speaking, you can usually improve on the stock pickups in most guitars.

Read up on which pickups some folks have gone through, and do buy used wherever you can.

But remember, "good" tone is VERY subjective, and what works for someone else might not necessarily work for you.

[Michael T]

Changing pickups can make a HUGE difference.

I always suggest raising and lowering your pickups before changing them out. You would be AMAZED what a TINY adjustment can make....

[teleman1]

If you blindly put in Duncan Antiquities, you would notice a significant improvement. I am not saying get those PU's in particular. There great choices and most important, variety of sounds. Not to toot Duncans horn, but try this. Get the Stratocaster CD that Duncan puts out. Listen and compare his different Strat PU's with the lights out and headphones on. It will at least get you acquainted with the different tones available to you. But by no means discount Frailins and other boutique Co'c cause they put out a hell of a product. And Fender too!

[countmeblue]

Zaddn,
I will not mention names but if the person up in Cleveland is in a town BH and the company name starts with W and his initials are JB. Stay far far away. He really screwed up three of my guitars and took over a month to do it. I can go more into detail but it took me a while to fix what I could and Lay's guitar in Akron fixed the rest (that could be fixed). a couple of things couldn't even be fixed and he charged me more money than he quoted me. I never speak bad of anyone but this guy, I just could not believe how bad of a job he did.

As for the pickup change I say go for it. after the horror of dealing with the above mentioned I swapped out the pickups in 4 of my guitars and love the sound I am getting from them.

If you need work done go do Lay's guitar. Talk to Dan, he is a great guy and does a great job quickly. I will never have anyone else work on my guitars. http://www.laysguitar.com/

Edit: I am in no way affiliated with Lay's. I just believe in giving praise where it is do and they did a great job in fixing my guitars up after my mistake of going with the above person.

[zaddn]

I have a guitar at the BH guy's now. My dad took one in and liked what the guy said. I thought his charges were a little high (around 70 for a setup) but had heard he did good work. I am going to give lays guitar a call for sure, see what they can do, its not too far from my house. As far as pickups go, my uncle is a computer engineer and good with soldering, so I may just order some copperhead pickups and swap those in, see what I get.

[Jon Silberman]

some pus will change the tone significantly ... go play some american strats with posh pus
I prefer to keep whitish-yellow, yellow or yellow-brown substances produced during inflammatory pyogenic bacterial infections off of my guitars.

[countmeblue]

Warning long winded post, sorry.

Like I said, I hate to talk bad about someone but he REALLY screwed up my guitars. I am a computer guy but never got into the soldering, in other words my solder technique is for crap. I believed all the stuff that this guy talked. I looked at the wiring before I took it to him. He didn't change that much and he wired the coil tap wrong. Me going from knowing nothing about wiring a guitar to reading the pickup directions fixed his mistakes in wiring in about 15 min. He broke the plug for input into the guitar and then charged me for the new parts. He cracked the heal block tightening the neck plate down to hard. All this was just my MIM Tele that my fiance' bought me.

On a strat he wired correctly but I don't know what he did but the neck was unplayable whe I got it home. He was only supposed to change one pickup in it but the neck was bowing so bad that all the strings were holding to the neck and was totally unplayable. When he put the pick guard back on he payed no attention to make sure that the wires were in the routing of the body and it was bubbling up the pick gaurd. It was an easy fixed but I had payed him to do a good job and that was just a careless mistake.

My parker, he broke two of the tone pots (pulled the post out of them) and said that it was a manufacturing mistake to put them on so tight. Them wanted to charge me for the parts. He had it wired completely wrong (not even close).

All this he took 34 days to do and I had to keep calling him to get my guitars.

Again, Lay's fixed all this and two of them are now better than when I started. My strat neck has never felt the same.

I can't say this enough, I don't like to talk bad about anyone but I am only telling you this to save you some of the pain that I went through. He might have had a bad month or something and he may do a good job on your guitar (I hope so for your sake). He had any chance and if he would have even called me once to tell me he was having troubles or only messed up one of the guitars I wouldn't have had a problem with it. After the first two weeks I started calling him and I kept getting "I have some final tweeks" Then after a month, I called him and told him I was coming to pick up my guitars. He said give him a couple more days. I did and showed up and got two of them. He still the parker all torn apart. I gave him another chance and left it with him for another week. I just showed up at his house and it was in the same place as it was before, so I just took it as is and had Lay's finish it.

He does have a guy working for him that does amp repair that is supposed to be pretty good as I hear. Maybe take an amp to him but with what he has done for me he will never get any of my business.

[zaddn]

countmeblue....thanks for the heads up man..I called lays, asked him about a setup and he said he could do it while I waited, so looks like thats what I am going to do with my strat. he also said he would drop in pickups for a little extra money, so I might as well have him do that.

Do you guys know of any good places that give good discounts on the fender p/ups...I think I am going to get some CS 69s...if you have any other suggestions I would definitely value your opinions.

Thanks again everyone.

[countmeblue]

I have heard and read a lot of good things about the 69's. I went the Dimarzio route and love them. Love the Area 58's in the neck and middle and Chopper in the bridge. Also I like the Air Norton single coil size in the bridge and the neck with a 58 in the middle. They sound great to me and they are silent but I will be buying some Fralins and Joe Bardens in the future.

As for deals, I don't know of any place special. Woodsy's over in Kent might give you a good price. Other wise just order on line
http://www.musictoyz.com/guitar/index_gtrpickup.php or the other usual suspects.

[zaddn]

here's a little update:

Went with the vintage hots and had them put in saturday, along with a complete setup and fret dressing at a shop in Akron.

I won't mention names, but I am not 100% happy with the work. In fact, I am driving all the way back down there to have them redo the set up. The fret dressing was done well, along with the pickup install (they sound great btw) but I am getting some serious, serious buzzing on the A and E strings. I do not have my hex keys here, so I can't adjust the height of the saddles on my own and reintonate.

What really baffles me is that I suggested they raise the action a little bit, and I get the guitar back with more buzzing than before. Of course buzz is a common tradeoff, but I can hear the buzz in my amp and the strings sound dead. The guitar was there for only 2 hours, so I ruled out the humidity change. I am also worried about the other work on the guitar, seeing as the may have screwed up the truss rod or something.

I am pretty upset about it to be honest. Having this guitar work done was my Christmas present, and to have to run around like crazy because it wasn't done correctly the first time is very frustrating.

So this being the 2nd tech I have gone to in the past 3 weeks, and the 2nd tech whose work I am not happy with, I have to ask myself: Is there really a tech out there who can satisfy my expectations?

What are your experiences with this? Have you found that many techs are not worth the money?

[dave67]

I had a tech that did a lot of work for over the last 20 years. Last year He told me that he was done and moving out of my area. Over the years he taught many things, and I am able to most of the work myself now. I have tried other techs, but none have come close to his work.
You can find techs, but to find a good tech that will do the work right is a lot harder. I would suggest that you check out the local small shop, and stay far away from from the big stores. The small shops normally do their own work, or have someone that does their work for them, and these guy are normally better than the super stores.
I would also suggest that you get yourself some basic tools and try to do the basics yourself, once you can do this you will only need a tech for the more advanced stuff.
Once you find a good tech, keep him they are hard to come by.

[countmeblue]

Have not been in TGP for a while. Man, I am so sorry you didn't have a good exp with the place in Akron. How did the first tech work out? I was so ticked after him I couldn't believe it. The place in Akron always did a good job for me, though I got some books and am doing all my own set ups and pickup replacements now. I guess it is a crap shoot. Now to think of it, he had a couple of new guys in there that I did not rec. Maybe they are new and they did your set up. I have a third guy that comes highly recommended but I am to scared to try.

[BuckeyeBrown]

Wish I could have seen this post sooner. You've had bad luck in the both of those stores you've talked with. The Cleveland dude seemed like he was selling you BS and the Akron people don't know what the hell they are doing with a set up. I wouldn't take any BS from those morons - they need to make it right at no additional charges or give you a full refund on the set up portion of the bill.

If I read this sooner I would have pointed you toward Mike Pekar (Pekar Music) in Cuyahoga Falls (don't know if he's still there or not though?). I use to live in that area several years ago and I had him set up my American Deluxe. I asked him to set the action as low as he could without any string buzz. He did some minor fretwork to go along with the typical adjustments that took any high spots out to allow him to get really low. Actually a little too low for my tastes - but he raised back up a hair to where I wanted it - all at no additional upcharge. Later I had him do some work on an older 12 string Guild that I found and he made it awesome to play. He ended up resetting the neck on it and redoing a little of the bracing. I don't live in that part of the state anymore but I've remembered his name just in case I ever need any kind of work done. Kind of like finding a good, honest mechanic.

The other reason I wish I read this is because I've been sitting on the original Vintage Noiseless Pickups that came with my 98/99 American Deluxe that I need to finally sell. They been in a drawer for about 7 years - for no good reason. I would have given you a good deal on them.

Hope you get your MIM up and running soon! They are a great value and there are lots of upgrades that can be made to make it compete with strats multiple x's the price of a MIM. As someone stated earlier - This is how it all get's started. Dead on.

[Pietro]

Changing pickups will not fundamentally change the tone of your guitar, unless of course you put in hums where there were single coils and, to a certain extent, singles in a hum guitar, but it may improve what's already there. If you want to fundamentally change the sound of your guitar... get a new guitar. If you want a little more "spank" or whatever, change pickups.

I only own, really, higher-end guitars now, and I haven't changed any of the pickups in them. (Generally, more expensive guitars have better pickups imho.) When a guitar hasn't quite worked for me, I got rid of it.

And in the process, I arrived at a stable of guitars that totally works for me.