Ear Training question

[lhallam]

I am hoping one or two of you will try something for me.

Be sure that your guitar is in good standard tuning (ie A = 440).

With a pristine clean sound play an A on the G string and let it ring until it fades. Listen carefully but effortlessly in a relaxed manner. Now move up a 1/2 step and play a Bb on the same string and let it ring until it fades.

You may have to do this a number of times.

Try it on the D string 7th and 8th frets.

Try it on the B string 10 & 11th frets.

I swear as the Bb fades out it puts a sour taste in mouth. It sort of makes me cringe whereas the A sounds bright and singing.

What do you experience?

[Tim Bowen]

Well, I don't find a Bb at the 5th or 6th frets on the D string with my guitars! :)

I just checked it out (Tele stright into a Pro Jr.) & don't hear it. It's possible that what you're hearing is a byproduct of your gear. If you're playing typical Fender-type single coils, sometimes there are weird ghost notes if the pups are too close to the strings, in which case you could try lowering them a bit. However, my experience has been that this is most prevalent in the bass & lower registers.

It's also possible that you're encountering "cone cry" (an effect of voice coil rub) in your
speaker(s). This phenomonen can create some undesirable sympathetic overtones, & yes, it does sometimes prey on certain notes. If this were the case, you might alleviate the problem by lightly doping your speaker(s).

I could be way off base here, just tossing out ideas. It's tough to say without actually hearing what you're hearing...

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Tim Bowen
Well, I don't find a Bb at the 5th or 6th frets on the D string with my guitars! :)

I just checked it out (Tele stright into a Pro Jr.) & don't hear it. It's possible that what you're hearing is a byproduct of your gear. If you're playing typical Fender-type single coils, sometimes there are weird ghost notes if the pups are too close to the strings, in which case you could try lowering them a bit. However, my experience has been that this is most prevalent in the bass & lower registers.

It's also possible that you're encountering "cone cry" (an effect of voice coil rub) in your
speaker(s). This phenomonen can create some undesirable sympathetic overtones, & yes, it does sometimes prey on certain notes. If this were the case, you might alleviate the problem by lightly doping your speaker(s).

I could be way off base here, just tossing out ideas. It's tough to say without actually hearing what you're hearing...

Whoops, I really do know the notes. I'll edit thanks. It's very subtle and not amp related although I am using the same gtr.

[therealting]

It's not a byproduct of the sympathetic string vibrations giving the A more depth, is it?

[lhallam]

Originally posted by therealting
It's not a byproduct of the sympathetic string vibrations giving the A more depth, is it?

Could be. This is more of a feeling that something that's going to jump right out at you. As I said, my mouth got a sort of sour feeling to it.

I should've mentioned to be sure that the guitar is in good tune.

This is an ear-training exercise. I'm going to try this on a piano and see if my experience is similar. I was just wondering if anyone else felt it the same way.

[therealting]

Try muting your other strings and the A will not sustain as long.

I have perfect pitch so maybe I am not the best person for the experiment. If you are talking about the inherent tonality of the note, then yes they do sound quite different to me. A has a much more laid back sound than Bb, which is one of the more aggressive notes (to me).

[lhallam]

Originally posted by therealting
Try muting your other strings and the A will not sustain as long.

I have perfect pitch so maybe I am not the best person for the experiment. If you are talking about the inherent tonality of the note, then yes they do sound quite different to me. A has a much more laid back sound than Bb, which is one of the more aggressive notes (to me).

Actually you are EXACTLY the person I want to hear from. Hmmm, aggressive can be another word for it. It definitely gives me a feeling of gritting my teeth, but I notice it more as it fades out.
The A seems to be brighter to me than the Bb so yes, I can see it as less aggressive as it is more relaxing than the Bb.

Thanks, this helps enormously.

[mikenz66]

Hmm, aggressive...

For once I'm reading this with a guitar in hand. Bb does indeed sound more aggressive to me than A.

Dammit, now you've got me going up and down the high E string looking for aggression. The next most aggressive note appears to be D? Umm, then G? Does anyone else agree?

Perhaps we could all rate the notes (maybe someone has already done this). It's starting to remind me of a colour-blindness test I did last year where I was handed a bunch of coloured sticks and had to arrange them in whatever order seemed right (I passed --- it turned out to be the colours round the edge of the chromaticity diagram).

[therealting]

Many people have rated the notes. I have heard of people associating them with colours (which makes a lot of sense).

I find the different chords and keys sound completely different too, which is why I can hear a song and tell the key immediately. I have also heard cover versions done in different keys and just the key makes it sound completely different.

Try this - take a familiar song. For the purposes of our experiment, try a simple song like "Yesterday". As you are aware, it is a rather sad song. Try it in all twelve keys, and see which key fits the best.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by mikenz66
Hmm, aggressive...

For once I'm reading this with a guitar in hand. Bb does indeed sound more aggressive to me than A.

Dammit, now you've got me going up and down the high E string looking for aggression. The next most aggressive note appears to be D? Umm, then G? Does anyone else agree?

Perhaps we could all rate the notes (maybe someone has already done this). It's starting to remind me of a colour-blindness test I did last year where I was handed a bunch of coloured sticks and had to arrange them in whatever order seemed right (I passed --- it turned out to be the colours round the edge of the chromaticity diagram).

I do not have perfect pitch but am working on it. See my thread in here on the David L Burge perfect pitch course. Yes, color is the example of what Burge uses to equate tones to. In other words, he says that each pitch has it's own colour.

It seems you are hearing the colors, now the trick is to learn how to differentiate them.

therealting confirmed what I thought I was hearing and that's was what I was looking for.

[BBHollowbody]

Sorry to hijack the thread, but I'm interested in hearing from people with perfect pitch. Can you hear the difference in absolute pitch and pitch from a instrument with tempered tuning?
I'm serious about this, once it was pointed out to me, it affected the way I hear notes. Sometimes notes sound sour or out of tune to me even though the instrument playing them is in perfect tune.

for example, play on C on an sustaining insturment like an organ. Now sing the fifth (G) until it locks, or pops as they say. Now keep that G going and play the G on the keyboard. Its different, a little flat.

Now try that with with flat 7th. Play C and sing a Bb till it locks. Now play the Bb on the organ, its way off.

Just a little experiment to try. It won't really affect your instrumental playing, but if you sing harmonies-don't sing with a piano-use a pitch pipe and build your intervals from the root.

So if you have perfect pitch, does that G on the organ (if played by itself) sound weird? Do fifths on a piano sound a little dead? I'm not being a smartass, I really want to know, cause sometimes they do to me.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by BBHollowbody
Sorry to hijack the thread, but I'm interested in hearing from people with perfect pitch. Can you hear the difference in absolute pitch and pitch from a instrument with tempered tuning?
I'm serious about this, once it was pointed out to me, it affected the way I hear notes. Sometimes notes sound sour or out of tune to me even though the instrument playing them is in perfect tune.

for example, play on C on an sustaining insturment like an organ. Now sing the fifth (G) until it locks, or pops as they say. Now keep that G going and play the G on the keyboard. Its different, a little flat.

Now try that with with flat 7th. Play C and sing a Bb till it locks. Now play the Bb on the organ, its way off.

Just a little experiment to try. It won't really affect your instrumental playing, but if you sing harmonies-don't sing with a piano-use a pitch pipe and build your intervals from the root.

So if you have perfect pitch, does that G on the organ (if played by itself) sound weird? Do fifths on a piano sound a little dead? I'm not being a smartass, I really want to know, cause sometimes they do to me.

No hi-jack at all, interested in anything anyone has to say on the subject of perfect pitch.

It's wide open gents.

What did you hear before it was pointed out to you?

[BBHollowbody]

I would hear things that sounded out of tune, but I couldn't explain why. I would practice four part harmonies with the band that I was in, we would match notes with the keyboard, but the chord would sound a little... off. They wouldn't "pop".
Once I figured out how to adjust the intervals, things would get a little better.

I think subconsciously (before and after this was pointed out) I adjust notes on guitar when I'm improvising. Like when your jamming in E, and you hit that high B. Sometimes it won't sound exactly right. It always sounds better (to my ear) when you bend up to that note. You let your ear guide you.

Also, vibrato helps mask these inconsistencies in our tuning scale.

Sorry if I'm rambling.

[Supertgtr]

try this with a sine wave generator. I'll bet the colors and flavors will be hard to detect.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Supertgtr
try this with a sine wave generator. I'll bet the colors and flavors will be hard to detect.

Definitely harder. I don't recall all the steps, but the first step is to be able to identify the tones on your native instrument. The highest developed ears can hear the tones on any instrument, even a sine generator and can sing any note from their head.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by BBHollowbody
I would hear things that sounded out of tune, but I couldn't explain why. I would practice four part harmonies with the band that I was in, we would match notes with the keyboard, but the chord would sound a little... off. They wouldn't "pop".
Once I figured out how to adjust the intervals, things would get a little better.

I think subconsciously (before and after this was pointed out) I adjust notes on guitar when I'm improvising. Like when your jamming in E, and you hit that high B. Sometimes it won't sound exactly right. It always sounds better (to my ear) when you bend up to that note. You let your ear guide you.

Also, vibrato helps mask these inconsistencies in our tuning scale.

Sorry if I'm rambling.

Not rambling to me, I'm highly interested. Since working on my relative pitch I can hear how just out of tune a guitar is as you move up the neck. The curse or benefit of this remains to be seen.

[therealting]

Perfect pitch is a curse and blessing.

Blessing, because I can listen to a song the first time and write the chords or tune out as it is going along. I can start singing a tune before the other instruments come in without needing a prompt note. I can retune the guitar midtune without having to completely stop playing. I can play fretless solo without worrying about what will happen when I finally hit the open string. I can sing scat and play completely random notes. Numerous other benefits.

Curse, but mainly because it can make it hard to think in relative terms. I can't play instruments tuned a semitone down, because the notes don't sound like they play (a *very* confusing phenomenon. I often start okay, but then accidentally play a chord or note one position lower because that's what it sounds like it should be). I am useless with a capo if I play anything above root position because the dots drive me bananas, I forget which key I'm in, and I have to remember to play in "wrong" G lower down the neck and "correct" A further up the neck (but maybe that is an intrinsic problem with capoing anyway). I can tell when a solo guitarist is playing an instrument that is out of tune by more than a few cents. Everything else I can just about work around.

The problem with just intonation and tempered intonation is inherent to the Western 12-tone scale. You will often hear choirs and a capella groups sliding between them.

I can work out pitch on any instrument, including sine generators, computer generated signals, or music put through a transposing device. Believe me, people have gone to all kinds of lengths to try and catch me out...

[Pedro58]

I've been working on the perfect pitch thing like Lance, albeit not as diligently as I should. Different notes have different colors. And slide guitar is where you will realize how the frets are lying to you! In the key of "E," the "B" isn't a real "B" according to what the fret tells you. Your ear and your hands will push it a little. It's a funny thing, but it's a lesson in "Trust your ears."

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pedro58
I've been working on the perfect pitch thing like Lance, albeit not as diligently as I should. Different notes have different colors. And slide guitar is where you will realize how the frets are lying to you! In the key of "E," the "B" isn't a real "B" according to what the fret tells you. Your ear and your hands will push it a little. It's a funny thing, but it's a lesson in "Trust your ears."

Ultra cool Pedro58 I'm very interested in your progress.

Do you hear that A and Bb thing?

[mikenz66]

This thread is so intersting that I've started going to people's offices and asking their opinions on Bb.

Last night I asked my son (who plays Sax) and he told me to go away :-(
He did have a suggestion though. If we play guitar we tend to hear a lot of E, G, Am chords. Do those condition us to think of some notes as more "comforatable"?


[Dm, the saddest of all keys -- Spinal Tap]

[EricT]

Originally posted by BBHollowbody
Sorry to hijack the thread, but I'm interested in hearing from people with perfect pitch. Can you hear the difference in absolute pitch and pitch from a instrument with tempered tuning?
I'm serious about this, once it was pointed out to me, it affected the way I hear notes. Sometimes notes sound sour or out of tune to me even though the instrument playing them is in perfect tune.

for example, play on C on an sustaining insturment like an organ. Now sing the fifth (G) until it locks, or pops as they say. Now keep that G going and play the G on the keyboard. Its different, a little flat.

Now try that with with flat 7th. Play C and sing a Bb till it locks. Now play the Bb on the organ, its way off.

Just a little experiment to try. It won't really affect your instrumental playing, but if you sing harmonies-don't sing with a piano-use a pitch pipe and build your intervals from the root.

So if you have perfect pitch, does that G on the organ (if played by itself) sound weird? Do fifths on a piano sound a little dead? I'm not being a smartass, I really want to know, cause sometimes they do to me.

I'm interested in this as well. Since tempered tuning isn't perfect, you'd think that people that were born with perfect pitch would notice it. OTOH, if they learned perfect pitch(or something closely related to it) by playing a lot of piano, maybe the wrongness in the tuning has become second nature to them.

And since just intonation is the most "natural" way of tuning an instrument, you'd think people with perfect pitch would hear those sounds as more natural as well. Or maybe those people are just very good at adjusting their ear to different types of sound enviroments.

Just throwing out some random thoughts here, hope they make sense...

[therealting]

Originally posted by mikenz66
He did have a suggestion though. If we play guitar we tend to hear a lot of E, G, Am chords. Do those condition us to think of some notes as more "comforatable"?

Interesting question. The related other question is are we used to the voicings or the sound of the notes themselves? Does playing in G with a capo in 2nd give the same sort of colour as playing A on open strings?

Originally posted by EricT
I'm interested in this as well. Since tempered tuning isn't perfect, you'd think that people that were born with perfect pitch would notice it. OTOH, if they learned perfect pitch(or something closely related to it) by playing a lot of piano, maybe the wrongness in the tuning has become second nature to them.

And since just intonation is the most "natural" way of tuning an instrument, you'd think people with perfect pitch would hear those sounds as more natural as well. Or maybe those people are just very good at adjusting their ear to different types of sound enviroments.

Just throwing out some random thoughts here, hope they make sense...

You get the same problem when tuning your guitar using fretted notes (open string = lower string fretted at the 5th) and using harmonics (7th fret harmonic = lower string's 5th fret harmonic). The best compromise to me seems to be to find the point where both of these coexist as peacefully as possible.

Pianos are tuned using stretch tuning, with the higher notes tuned slightly sharp and the lower notes slightly flat.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by EricT
I'm interested in this as well. Since tempered tuning isn't perfect, you'd think that people that were born with perfect pitch would notice it. OTOH, if they learned perfect pitch(or something closely related to it) by playing a lot of piano, maybe the wrongness in the tuning has become second nature to them.


No one is born with perfect pitch. The tuning fork was invented by John Shore in 1711 and it had a pitch of A423.5.

Mozart and the other masters had perfect pitch however their pitches were different.

The pitch of A440 has remained the standard since 1939. Pitches have risen a little, particularly in Eastern European countries, which often wish pianos to be tuned to A 444 or even a bit above.

What is most likely inherent in people who have perfect pitch is ability to hear the subtle color differences in tones and remember them. They then associate those colors to pitches which is learned.

We all obviously hear differences in pitches, the trick is to teach the ear what it is that makes pitches sound different and be able to identify them. I conjecture that many people are on the verge of being able to do this, they just haven't found the key (pun intended).

Mikenzz66, this just happens to be a gtr centic forum. Pianists find the F# to sound "twangy". Some say the Eb has a mellow (woo woo) sound to it despite the timbre. These experiences are apparently universal.

[Pedro58]

Lance- I do hear the difference. It helps to have a partner in the Burge exercises. The difference between F# and Eb is pronounced... Twang vs. Woo! The A is bright, but I haven't gotten much farther. The funny thing is that just beginning the exercises tunes your ear up a lot. I find that slide playing becomes more natural. I can just close my eyes (sometimes) and let my hands and ears do the work. The physical part of playing is still difficult and has its limitations, but my ear is getting better!

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pedro58
Lance- I do hear the difference. It helps to have a partner in the Burge exercises. The difference between F# and Eb is pronounced... Twang vs. Woo! The A is bright, but I haven't gotten much farther. The funny thing is that just beginning the exercises tunes your ear up a lot. I find that slide playing becomes more natural. I can just close my eyes (sometimes) and let my hands and ears do the work. The physical part of playing is still difficult and has its limitations, but my ear is getting better!

Man I love hearing this (pun intended). Yeah, I wish I had a partner. I'm back into it after taking an extended time off. Sometimes I can tune my guitar pretty acurately with zero reference to other strings or tuner. I have a long way to go though.

Are you doing the relative pitch course as well?

If yes, how's that going? I've been stuck on one drill for WAY too long.

[Pedro58]

Yes, Mark C (Forumite) and I did a lot of work over the summer with Burge's system, but lately have done zero! We don't have a new version with CD's or anything and we've been through the startup a couple of times. But, it works! Like anything, it takes work, work, work, and time, time, time. Getting stuck happens, maybe from ear fatigue. I have noticed that any of my musical endeavors work like that. I move in leaps and bounds with long periods of banging my head against the wall. Mark has a better ear than I, and he has training from his BA and MA in Jazz performance. I'm a hack and feel lucky to play with him, even luckier to count him as a friend. Anyway, the course works, but it takes time and effort. I wish that there were some brainwash-me-while-I-sleep thing, but it doesn't work that way. I have only gotten to the point where I can identify three tones on the board with any degree of consistency. Mark is ahead of me at four! But he has GREAT relative pitch and hears intervals well. I'mm getting there!:rolleyes:

[markp]

Originally posted by lhallam
Man I love hearing this (pun intended). Yeah, I wish I had a partner. I'm back into it after taking an extended time off. Sometimes I can tune my guitar pretty acurately with zero reference to other strings or tuner. I have a long way to go though.

Are you doing the relative pitch course as well?

If yes, how's that going? I've been stuck on one drill for WAY too long.

I use to have a boring summer job and every year I would get out the relative pitch tapes,and every year(about 4 years) I would get rite back into it and get stuck(dont remember ,tape5 or 6)
I always felt my ear was doing better just tuning up that far.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by markp
I use to have a boring summer job and every year I would get out the relative pitch tapes,and every year(about 4 years) I would get rite back into it and get stuck(dont remember ,tape5 or 6)
I always felt my ear was doing better just tuning up that far.

Me too, looks like Pedro, you, and I all going thru the same thing.

This last time I got back into the relative pitch I swore I wouldn't stop and I won't! I'm on disc 36 and one 8 minute drill is kicking my a$$. You aren't allowed any mistakes. I keep screwing up Dominant7b5 & AugDom7 chords. I need to make my own drill of only those two. I had to do the same with m6th and m7ths intervals when I got stuck on them.

I quit the perfect pitch to get back into the relative pitch but now I'm just going to stick with both. One night just before I quit, I heard every note perfectly, no mistakes for 15 minutes and in fact I couldn't believe I never heard it before. It was THAT clear. What a feeling! I'm trying to get back there and pass it.

Pedro, can you identify the three tones on any other instruments?

Can you hear them on recordings?

Both courses definitely work. My relative pitch is far better than I ever dreamed possible. I won't go through everything I can hear so far but not only can I hear chords and intervals but I can identify them in a split second. Burge is one sharp dude.

[Pedro58]

There are 36 discs?!!:jo
I have my good days and my bad... I can sometimes hear them in songs with other instruments. I find that the A stands out, maybe because it's more common as far as key goes... I have a long way to go. I had one day where I was nailing what I had learned so far. That was a good day. Mark has suggested that we do it over the phone. A tone is a tone, right? What do you think?

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pedro58
There are 36 discs?!!:jo
I have my good days and my bad... I can sometimes hear them in songs with other instruments. I find that the A stands out, maybe because it's more common as far as key goes... I have a long way to go. I had one day where I was nailing what I had learned so far. That was a good day. Mark has suggested that we do it over the phone. A tone is a tone, right? What do you think?

More than 36 lessons, try 41! The relative pitch discs are the same as the tapes. 1 cd = 1 tape side

It's probably going to be tougher as phone fidelity is inferior. However anything is better than nothing. You got mail.

[EricT]

Just ordered both the relative pitch and the perfect pitch course!
I'll keep you posted on my progress:)

[Tomo]

Try this one.

http://www.tomofujita.com/us/lesson_2.html

Tomo

[Chris S.]

http://www.good-ear.com/servlet/EarTrainer

Self tests for ear training – including perfect pitch exercises.

What you're hearing with the A and Bb notes is indeed the pitch "colors," but that's a confusing term. It doesn't refer to colors as we visually perceive them, but to the inherent quality of the pitches.

Where it's useful is as an analogy: the difference between pitches is like the difference between colors. We know the difference between red and blue (and all their various shades) because we learned them as toddlers. Why is that red? Because it LOOKS like red. ;-) Why is that Bb? Because it SOUNDS like Bb. Had we grown up in a culture where pitch identification/ discrimination was as important as color discrimination, we'd likely all have perfect pitch. Unfortunately, due to the way our brains develop, it's a lot harder to learn after the age of 5 (but not impossible, as the Burge course demonstrates).

Anyway, check out the exercises at the above link, they're very helpful. The trouble with the perfect pitch exercises, of course, is that once you correctly identify one note, it's hard not to identify the others using relative pitch – or it's hard for me, anyway. ;-) Best of luck, CS

[Pedro58]

Lance, are you telling me that you sent me an e-mail? If so, I didn't get it. Or is "you got mail" an internet-speak term for something I haven't figured out, yet?;)

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pedro58
Lance, are you telling me that you sent me an e-mail? If so, I didn't get it. Or is "you got mail" an internet-speak term for something I haven't figured out, yet?;)

Sent it last night or this very early this depending how you look at it. Sent it via the HOTMAIL address listed under your handle.
It would be from challam2.

[Pedro58]

Hmmm... the address in my profile is correct, but I didn't get it/ I hear about this kind of stuff with e-mails all the time but this is the first time it's happened to me. Try again, I guess. If that doesn't work, try my work address: pfmorton@episd.org
I'll check later and get back to you! Thanks!

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pedro58
Hmmm... the address in my profile is correct, but I didn't get it/ I hear about this kind of stuff with e-mails all the time but this is the first time it's happened to me. Try again, I guess. If that doesn't work, try my work address: pfmorton@episd.org
I'll check later and get back to you! Thanks!

Packet could be stuck on a server somewhere.
Re-sent to both addresses.

[mikenz66]

Originally posted by therealting
Many people have rated the notes. I have heard of people associating them with colours (which makes a lot of sense).


Do you have any web references to ratings of which notes are agressive and which are restful?

[lhallam]

Originally posted by EricT
Just ordered both the relative pitch and the perfect pitch course!
I'll keep you posted on my progress:)

Best of luck my man. The key words here are dedication and perseverance. I will be very interested in your progress. If you have any questions feel free to ask. It is a great feeling when you pass a drill. Some of them are very tough. Although it's work, it's fun most of the time believe it or not.

For the perfect pitch, see if you can find a partner. Not required but better.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by mikenz66
Do you have any web references to ratings of which notes are agressive and which are restful?

I don't have PP, however I'm not sure you can say out of the 12 tones one note is the most aggressive and another the most restful.

For example, Burge says an F# is "twangy" sounding. It has sort of a "yingy" quality to it whereas an Eb has more of a "woo woo" sound to it. Like it's rounder or something. He doesn't rate all the tones, that's up to the student. He's just pointing out what he means by color hearing.

You saw how I thought the Bb made a sourness in my mouth but therealting called it aggressive. So each definition will be different. How would you describe the color blue to someone?

To me, a C sounds very vanilla and for some reason a D sounds brown. Don't ask me why, Bb = sour, C = vanilla & D = brown.
It's just the best way for me to describe it.

[Pedro58]

Yeah, and you've got a mixture of color & flavor, brown & vanilla... and whatever it takes to distinguish them is what it takes. Your vocabulary that covers the senses other than hearing starts to creep in. It's a cool thing when you begin to hear it. I'm only at the beginning. Oh, yeah. I got your mail at my work address and repiled. Still nothing at hotmail, but that's no big deal. Thanks, again Lance!

[therealting]

Some good comments going on here. As said, the notes may sound different to different people, but more importantly they sound different (relative to each other).

Interesting things start to happen when you hear certain keys as sounding different, and you find that certain keys suit a song you are writing better.

Originally posted by mikenz66
Do you have any web references to ratings of which notes are agressive and which are restful?

Here is one link:

http://www.harmonics.com/lucy/lsd/colors.html

[lhallam]

Originally posted by therealting
Some good comments going on here. As said, the notes may sound different to different people, but more importantly they sound different (relative to each other).

Interesting things start to happen when you hear certain keys as sounding different, and you find that certain keys suit a song you are writing better.



Here is one link:

http://www.harmonics.com/lucy/lsd/colors.html

Interesting link, thanks.

Did your ability grow as you got older?
Burge says there are different levels and I don't recall all of them.

First you learn on your instrument and then learn to how to hear it on other instruments until the highest level where you can recall any note and hear pitches in anything.

I'd be interested in knowing your experience when you became cognizant of the ability.

[therealting]

Originally posted by lhallam
Interesting link, thanks.

Did your ability grow as you got older?
Burge says there are different levels and I don't recall all of them.

First you learn on your instrument and then learn to how to hear it on other instruments until the highest level where you can recall any note and hear pitches in anything.

I'd be interested in knowing your experience when you became cognizant of the ability.

When I was 11 or 12, my piano teacher commented that my ear was very unusual - until then it was never something I really noticed, I thought it was something everyone had. Part of the training was "aural" training, mostly to do with listening to pieces and identifying things ("sing the top note of this three-part counterpoint", "identify this interval")... I could pick out the top, bottom and middle lines, identify the notes in the chords and I would identify the intervals and both notes used.

I started piano at 6 and guitar at 9, so I was always good on those instruments. I started playing clarinet at 14, then flute and sax. I think I have learned to adjust to any instrument that way.

I think my ability is about the same, however my confidence in it has dropped. I guess when you're young, your innocence lets you take your skills for granted - when you are older you start questioning yourself ("That sounds like an A - or does it? No it sounds higher... it's a Bb? No? It is an A? Rats...")

[Chris S.]

Originally posted by lhallam
For the perfect pitch, see if you can find a partner. Not required but better. That's why the link I posted above is so cool. Check it out:

http://www.good-ear.com/servlet/EarTrainer

Enjoy, CS :-)

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Chris S.
That's why the link I posted above is so cool. Check it out:

http://www.good-ear.com/servlet/EarTrainer

Enjoy, CS :-)

Joe posted it awhile back thanks.

The PP part is probably better for someone more advanced than me. At my stage, it's easier to hear live on your native instrument.

I have been practicing the progressions at the site which are very helpful.

Thanks again.

[Chris S.]

Originally posted by lhallam
Joe posted it awhile back thanks. Ahh, my bad. Didn't realize it had been posted before (and of course, I didn't do a search... d'oh!).

I've been working on the PP stuff, and I'm actually starting to recognize the pitches, even on the first example... but it's taken awhile. :-\

And the "Jazz Chords - all" quiz? Yipes. ;-) CS

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Chris S.
And the "Jazz Chords - all" quiz? Yipes. ;-) CS

No kidding. I'll have to get back to those b13's. :(

For the PP, I wish you could choose which notes you want to work on and add more. Going from 3 tones to 5 then to 12 is too much. You should be able to learn two, then 3, then 4, up to 12.

[Pedro58]

Absolutely! Those are HUGE leaps!

[Lucidology]

Good thread ...