Why do superstrats still not sound like a fender strat???

[Glowing Tubes]

Im wondering about this. The superstrats all seem to have their own sound but I have not heard any that sound exactly like a strat. There can be no doubt about the HUGE difference in quality and playability of these high quality guitars. The sonic gifts my Andersons have is just awesome. That being said they dont sound like a strat.

Any thoughts?


AG

[carlygtr56]

Some get closer than others. The Andersons I owned weren't Strats, they were Andersons. They are voiced higher.

A couple of Tylers I had were closer.
A few Suhrs I had were in the middle.......same with the Groshes I owned.

[Mark C]

When you change aspects of the guitar, you change the sound. It's of course not necessarily a matter of better or worse, but strats sound the way the do because of the way they are made.

[stark]

Big locking tuners sound different than vintage. Flatter radius neck adds more rosewood = darker than vintage. Big frets sound way different than vintage. Anything other than a 6 screw bridge sounds way different. Anything other than vintage repro pickups makes a diff. The word "Super" is not necessarily a good thing.

Adam Stark

[VaughnC]

Yup, I agree...."everything affects everything".

[Riscchip]

I don't think the headstock logo impacts tone--I've played strat clones (not superstrats) that sound just like strats and might as well have been some kind of Fender strat.

That said, I think the "super" part of a super-strat is going to, by it's very nature, start shifting you away from the classic strat tone.

Pretty much everything Adam mentions is part of that shift, but I think even more subtle things have an effect as well. Fender strats (and teles) are pretty rough-around-the-edges creatures. Once you start adding gourmet grades of ash, alder and maple, one and two piece bodies, super tight neck pockets, elaborate finishes, modern or modern-wanna-be-vintage pickup designs, etc. you're starting to mix a different cocktail.

Another big thing for me personally is playability. A strat that's setup for pristine playability like a lot of the expensive superstrats feels very un-strat-like to me. I'm not just talking about the setup, but the flatness of the fingerboard & core design features along those lines made to make the instrument play better. Fretwork comes into play, too. A real strat offers a little bit of a struggle, and I think that comes through in the tone & playing (in a good or bad way, depending on your style).

Of course, this is in my mind--other's may or may not share my take. That's the answer to the superstrat riddle for me, though.

I've certainly played plenty of non-Fender brand strat copies that have the sound and the feel, just like a genuine Fender...but they're not what I'd call "superstrats."

[phretbored]

Andersonguy,

You have a Shiva? :D
Aren't they just killer amps?!
I have a Shiva 1x12 6L6 and it has never met a guitar that it did not like!

As far as superstrats go I would buy one because it does not sound like a Fender Strat.
Tom Anderson makes amazing guitars.
Suhr are pretty cool too.
I bet the McNaught G4 and G5 sound and play great but so far I have not had the chance to check one out.

[Glowing Tubes]

Phretboard,
Yeah my shiva just kills!:dude
I especially like my Anderson hollow T through it. I love my Andersons!

I switched mine out from a combo to a head and bought two 1x12 bogner cubes. It is a great sounding rig. Easy to fit inside my little trunk, dosent weigh much, gives me some great seperation.
The combo weighs a TON!!! LOL

Im looking into another head for some different sounds. GAS always strikes when you least expect it!:confused:

AG

[Joe]

Most super strats are no two piece ash or alder bodies either, that beautiful maple top alters things as well.

[Blueser]

My Don Grosh stuff sounds pretty damn Stratty! Certainly enought for me.

[Eugene]

Originally posted by Blueser
My Don Grosh stuff sounds pretty damn Stratty! Certainly enought for me.

Agreed. My Grosh sounds as good if not better than any custom shop Fender I've owned.

Eugene

[Joe]

Also, what does "stratty" mean anyway?

If we are referring to todays American Standard, and if it is so good, why has it been changed so many times? Any why can't any of their endorsers just use it as is? Why does Clapton, Yngwie, SRV, Jimmy Vaghaun, etc...all need a custom model named after them and altered from Standard?

You can easily find as much variation from Fender themselves as these outsiders create.

Its nice to think of the Standard as being like apple pie and mom in the 1950s, but even Eric Johnson has his modded. Turns out mom was a drunk and her pie wasn't ideal. :p

[Balance]

This thread got me wondering how good the build quality was on 50s strats. Are the neck pockets as tight as a Suhr? Are the frets dressed as well as an Anderson? How much thought was given to the neck carves and how much did they vary?

If there are "flaws," do they add up to better tone? I've never played a vintage strat, and I'm curious.

[Mark C]

The Vintage strats I've played have all been well built in terms of tolerances. They aren't as tonally consistent as some would have you believe - some are magical and some are dogs. I've noticed the good ones are usually worn, so this brings up the question: Do they sound good because they've been played and worn in, or are they worn because they sounded good and people wanted to play them?

[guitarcmf]

My Grosh sounds just as stratty as my Masterbuilt J. BlackCS54 Fender
The Grosh has a more playable Neck than the fender. A little wider and more comfortable! The grosh in the sound dept loaded with Fralins Vintage Hots and pole 43 bridge is a 9.95 while my Fender ranks at 9.5 with its CS54 pups. I did replace as an experiment the cs54 pups with Fralin Blues but still the Grosh won out by a slim margin.
Larry

[mountain blues]

Originally posted by Andersonguy
Im wondering about this. The superstrats all seem to have their own sound but I have not heard any that sound exactly like a strat.

Which Strat are you using as a reference? Your question is very vague, to me.

Assuming my Callaham and Lentz Strats fall in the category of 'Superstrats' as you name them, they sound very much like Strats to me. If they didn't, I wouldn't own them.

Given the changes in Strat pickups from one decade to the next, IMHO there just isn't one Strat sound to use as a reference for this kind of question.

[Dave Paetow]

What's your basis for comparison? My 1963 Strat sounded a lot different than the 1957 Strat I used to own. My brother has a ton of Strats, they all sound different from each other in some ways. There's a lot of variables!

[matte]

My buddy Adam and I had 2 Slab board "59 Strats that were only 40 serial #s apart. Mine was mint and his was seriously played in. My guitar sounded so britttle and reflective and his had a resonant and beautiful lower mid thing going.

[Dave Paetow]

Don't you love the inconsistencies? ;)

Best Strat I ever played was a '58 that looked like it went thru a wood chipper and dragged down a gravel road, unbelieveably rich, woody, bell-like tone with no harshness. Still regret not grabbing that one.

[matte]

Originally posted by Dave Paetow
Don't you love the inconsistencies? ;)

Best Strat I ever played was a '58 that looked like it went thru a wood chipper and dragged down a gravel road, unbelieveably rich, woody, bell-like tone with no harshness. Still regret not grabbing that one. That's what makes these guitars cool. At one point I had a number of Pre CBS Strats and they were all quite different, one from the next.

[VaughnC]

I've owned & played a number of pre-CBS Strats and, while there were dogs & gems in the bunch, the one's that were obviously played a lot always sounded better to me. Did the "played in" one's sound better just because they were heavily played, because they started out better from the get go (sum of the parts thing), or a combination of both? Probably mostly the latter reason....but I also have a theory that, because we weren't so anal about taking good care of our guitars back in the 60's (going to/from a freezing/100 degree car trunk to musty old bars), the cellular structure of the wood was somehow changed, which improved the tone. To this day, I have yet to play a modern Strat that (to my ear) sounds as good or better as the best of the vintage Strat's I've played....for whatever reason.

[Glowing Tubes]

Hi Guys,
I realize this is a totally subjective question. The sound in my head is more old hendrix-ish. There is a great low end thang going on. I agree, its a sum all the parts, history and care of the guitar. Just was looking for opinions..:D

AG

[mountain blues]

Originally posted by Andersonguy
The sound in my head is more old hendrix-ish.

Then my Lentz and Callaham definitely sound like a Strat!

[Glowing Tubes]

Originally posted by mountain blues
Then my Lentz and Callaham definitely sound like a Strat!
Lentz would be great, if he still were doing strat-like guitars. Sounds like he wont be making single coil guitars anymore:(
From the Calaham thread, perhaps not a good option.:p

I guess I'll give a Suhr a try, heard nothing but great things about them....:dude :dude

AG

[mountain blues]

Originally posted by Andersonguy
Lentz would be great, if he still were doing strat-like guitars. Sounds like he wont be making single coil guitars anymore:(AG

Good news—Scott will still build single coil guitars, but only hardtails. He will have his one body shape that will serve as a base for a number of pickup setups...

[sanhozay]

Change the caps, add a blender and volume kit and those "Fenders" start sounding pretty "super".

My Grosh Retro sounds better than my old 1964 Strat - well maybe not better - but pretty dang close.

[mattmccloskey]

A suhr can get real 'authentic strat' sounding if you order it that way. Get an alder classic with no top, a maple neck and rosewood board, some kluson tuners, a 1088 bridge w/steel block, and 3 v60lps. Get it with regular nickel/brass frets, face jack, tusq nut,etc. It will sound as stratty as anything. About the only way you could get closer would be with a 6 screw callaham or similar repro bridge, but the 1088 with suhr's block is real close sonically.
On the other hand, I just built a warmoth that is very strat, using the callaham hardware, light ash body and one peice maple neck, 3 singles, etc. The only modern thing is I put on sperzels. It sounds just as much like a strat as my last 57 reissue did.

[Amit]

Originally posted by Andersonguy
The sound in my head is more old hendrix-ish. There is a great low end thang going on. I agree, its a sum all the parts, history and care of the guitar.
AG
And in that case what you are chasing is a sound of *recordings*... very old analog tube and tape compressed recordings of a guy playing an assembly line strat (pretty new) through an amp, through mikes>pre>mixer>tape.. lots of tubes in the signal chain, lots of non high tech cables... and you want to capture THAT sound with a live guitar/amp strait to your ears?

Sir that will never happen.

Just like audiophiles (but in reverse order) that try to capture, in their own house on a stereo system, through a recording, the feeling of "being there", the feeling of "live players" in their living room... and guess what:

They never will :D

On the other hand you can record a $90 Epiphone strat copy, ply body maple neck original pickups, through a sweet 60's 6V6 Princeton, record to tape or do a dump to tape, add some tube fuzziness, and you will get THAT sound... through your stereo... if you can play old hendrix-ish style:)

[Joe]

Originally posted by Andersonguy
Hi Guys,
I realize this is a totally subjective question. The sound in my head is more old hendrix-ish. There is a great low end thang going on. I agree, its a sum all the parts, history and care of the guitar. Just was looking for opinions..:D

AG

He used 5881 tubes not el-34s.

[moreeye]

Sound is subjective and you can go with whatever you want to..

[Tag]

It seems most of the "super strats" go for a real light weight. My Chapin is a feather. This makes it ring real nice, but you lose some bottom end and depth. The notes get more "difused" sounding, and that to me is the biggest difference between real Fenders and the immitators. A medium weight Strat is a good thing. It gives you more focus on the basic note, and less harmonic content around it. That is a REAL stratty sound. I think the strattiest sounds are the ones that approach a tele sound.

[OWENMUSTANG]

kind of guessing it's a little of everything (hows that for a cop out?)
weight of wood (have heard weights both ways. tend to belive a good part of the 50's stuff was lighter. virgin wood:) )
somewhat weak hand wound pick ups.
the vintage style wire and hardware..
the worn ones sounding better..guessing they just got played more..i would... the frozen guitar idea is interesting.. if you start with a moisture content of say 9-12% how much is going to freeze? and will it?
after all wood is a good insulator. not saying that is'nt something to consider but, srv's #1 was bought in texas, how often does it freeze down there?
most of the "superstrats" play with the formula to different extents, lentz & callaham seem to be closer the orginal idea(forgive me if i missed a company) others take the strat somewhere else, anderson ect. using maple tops, different bridges ect.

[Tag]

Originally posted by OWENMUSTANG
kind of guessing it's a little of everything (hows that for a cop out?)
weight of wood (have heard weights both ways. tend to belive a good part of the 50's stuff was lighter. virgin wood:) )
somewhat weak hand wound pick ups.
the vintage style wire and hardware..
the worn ones sounding better..guessing they just got played more..i would... the frozen guitar idea is interesting.. if you start with a moisture content of say 9-12% how much is going to freeze? and will it?
after all wood is a good insulator. not saying that is'nt something to consider but, srv's #1 was bought in texas, how often does it freeze down there?
most of the "superstrats" play with the formula to different extents, lentz & callaham seem to be closer the orginal idea(forgive me if i missed a company) others take the strat somewhere else, anderson ect. using maple tops, different bridges ect.

Go to Mandolin at times, 48th st guitars, and the Local GCs. You can play 30-40 Vintage Strats on a given day. They are no lighter in weight on average than new ones, and sound WORSE for the most part to my ear. Go to Mandolin and play all the vintage archtops. Play all the new ones as well. As a whole, the new ones sound better than the vintage ones.

[OWENMUSTANG]

I'm in michigan.. my local g/c only seems to get expensive garbage
strats like early 70's stuff.
i A/B tested my part-o-strat against a 73-74 strat $2800 i might add..
my part-o-strat was way better in tone,feel, lighter too! even one of the g/c's guys commented on it..
both were alder, both rosewood...
btw. later i bought an ash/maple lentz...blew my part-o-strat out of the water....1 cord was all it took, and i knew the lentz was better..

[Blueser]

Originally posted by Tag
Go to Mandolin at times, 48th st guitars, and the Local GCs. You can play 30-40 Vintage Strats on a given day. They are no lighter in weight on average than new ones, and sound WORSE for the most part to my ear. Go to Mandolin and play all the vintage archtops. Play all the new ones as well. As a whole, the new ones sound better than the vintage ones.

Hey Tag....48th Street Guitars is out of business now for about a year!

[Glowing Tubes]

Originally posted by Amit
And in that case what you are chasing is a sound of *recordings*... very old analog tube and tape compressed recordings of a guy playing an assembly line strat (pretty new) through an amp, through mikes>pre>mixer>tape.. lots of tubes in the signal chain, lots of non high tech cables... and you want to capture THAT sound with a live guitar/amp strait to your ears?

Sir that will never happen.

Just like audiophiles (but in reverse order) that try to capture, in their own house on a stereo system, through a recording, the feeling of "being there", the feeling of "live players" in their living room... and guess what:

They never will :D


This is true to a degree...
However SRV did it.. Landau does it.. You hear it on live recordings as well. Im not trying to duplicate it perfectly, I have not the talent or tone in my fingers. There is something I have not found that I am looking for. This may be the core reason for my GAS. I'll know it when I hear it.
Maybe I should be looking at the amp?

P.S. I wish I had a Lentz!! With a TREM!!:dude :dude

AG

[Tag]

Originally posted by Blueser
Hey Tag....48th Street Guitars is out of business now for about a year!

Last time I was there was there was over 3 years ago. (When I bought my E.Pro) No wonder they went out! They could not sell any of those awful sounding vintage Strats they had! :D

[the_Chris]

My Grosh Bent Top Custom that I have gets the best of both worlds IMHO (Strat and Les Paul). I like the wood combination for it: flamed maple top/ mahogany back, maple/rosewood neck. The WCR SR singles sound great with it and I like being able to coax some pretty decent Les Paul tones as well. I guess some purists will say it's not "exact", but to say it's not very close at all must mean other people must have much different ears than I do ;)

[Tag]

Not to get off topic, but this G&L tele style plays and sounds so good, it should cost 3-4 grand.

43-0786 G & L (used) ASAT electric solid body, #12953, in the classic, natural ash body with the maple fingerboard, in near mint condition with original hard shell case.
Only $825 or, at our cash discount price, $800

[loudboy]

I'm in michigan.. my local g/c only seems to get expensive garbage
strats like early 70's stuff.
i A/B tested my part-o-strat against a 73-74 strat $2800 i might add..
my part-o-strat was way better in tone,feel, lighter too! even one of the g/c's guys commented on it..
both were alder, both rosewood...
btw. later i bought an ash/maple lentz...blew my part-o-strat out of the water....1 cord was all it took, and i knew the lentz was better..

There's not much that ISN'T better than 70's Fenders. Why do you think the vintage market developed, back then?

MG

[GaryMcT]

Im wondering about this. The superstrats all seem to have their own sound but I have not heard any that sound exactly like a strat. There can be no doubt about the HUGE difference in quality and playability of these high quality guitars. The sonic gifts my Andersons have is just awesome. That being said they dont sound like a strat.

Any thoughts?


AG
I have an Anderson super strat (the blue one on my gear page in my signature.). I was pretty disappointed after the newness wore off because of its lack of strattiness. I put suhr v60lp's in it and it is 100 times closer to what I hear in my head as a strat. What pickups do you have in your anderson superstrats? Anderson's modern pickups (in my case the SA-series) aren't supposed to sound like a strat from what I can tell, although their V-series might.

The more modern pickups in my Anderson Hollow T, however, sound like a tele to my ears, although I have way less experience with tele-style guitars than with strats, so I might be off.

Here's a clip (DISCLAIMER!!!! This is a sloppy clip from a jam session where we didn't know the song very well! My recording and improv skills aren't that great either):

Butcher of Red Hot Chili Peppers' song with v60lp's in an Anderson Drop Top (http://home.comcast.net/%7Eg.mctaggart/v60lp.mp3)

Sounds pretty stratty to me even with the modern bridge, maple top, etc., at least compared to the pickups that I ordered the guitar with.

[eddyrox]

P.S. I wish I had a Lentz!! With a TREM!!:dude :dude

AG

Richard, you oughta try a D'Pergo. If Pluto wasn't so enamored with his, he'd be back at the Anderson Forum with the rest of us!
mike o.:D

[eddyrox]

Here's a clip (DISCLAIMER!!!! This is a sloppy clip from a jam session where we didn't know the song very well! My recording and improv skills aren't that great either)

Gary, FWIW, that sounds pretty "strat-like" to me! Great job!

[auratnik]

There's no way that anyone by any standard can make a guitar for everyone. I love my Anderson Classic but I met quite a few excellent guitarist that would rather bend their Vai Ibanez, Texas Fender Strats, $400 Epiphone LP or one of those Korean made PRS's... At first I was disapointed how they can't feel or hear the difference, craftmentship, versality... but I really don't care anymore, most of them don't even know who Tom Anderson is. ... all they want is new, shinning PRS hanging down the wall or new custom made Fender... because that is what they see on the stage or read about in the magazines. Who cares how they sound or feel they will used to it, must say... I knew that Anderson will go with me hiting two cords not even playing it through the amp.

[GaryMcT]

Gary, FWIW, that sounds pretty "strat-like" to me! Great job!
Thanks! I love that guitar now, and those pickups taught me how beating the crap out of the strings sounds good. :)

Actually, it's kind of funny, it doesn't sound like the clip to me now, so now I need to figure out what I did to my rig and/or pickup heights to mess it up. :)

I was pretty darn surprised what a difference a pickup change would make. I kept the original pickups though in case I end up having a really nice strat-style guitar that nails that tone and I want the different Anderson tone back in this guitar. . . not likely though.

Also, that guitar has the backplate version of the Suhr Silent Coil, which works great to get rid of 60-cycle hum.

[Lex Luthier]

My experience with SSH superstrats is that if you run true single coils thru a 500k pot, they sound horribly bright, but if you use 250k pots instead, the humbucker sounds mushy.

[eddyrox]

Also, that guitar has the backplate version of the Suhr Silent Coil, which works great to get rid of 60-cycle hum.

I saw how even tom suggested you contact Suhr for the SSC system!:Spank
cool!!
mike o.:D :AOK
:dude

[FiestaRed]

There is an easy fix for that one

I agree. John's Hum-Single-Single strats have a cool wiring scheme that allows the humbucker to see a 500k pot and the single coils to see 250K tone pots. A HUGE difference than the conventional wiring, and the tone is so much better. Vintage single coil sound, and a fatter humbucker tone when it is selected. Very versatile.

-Mark

[Glowing Tubes]

Man this is an old thread brought back to life. :p

I guess there is a "familiarity" in a traditional strat sound, not saying its good or bad or better or worse. I do find guitars like my Suhr or Andy sound especially great when recording and play much better.

I figure if anybody knows, it would be John. Thanks for the clarification.

RC

[sanhozay]

I'll tell you guys the secret, I have built my share of the real deal.
If you really want to make it sound like a Fullerton Classic there are some ingrediants you need besides the exact shape and right pickups and wood.
You need a vintage truss rod, some builders dont use them
IF it is all maple, 1 piece sounds the best IMO
You need individual pickup routes, no universal
Most important !
You need to use a real Fender Vintage bridge with steel block, it is a piece of crap but it has it's own tone:D

Well, everything in this post is the opposite of what Don Grosh brings to his Retro Classic Strat style guitar and I think his guitars consistently sound very much like a great example of a mid 60's Stratocaster.

[dharmafool]

There's not much that ISN'T better than 70's Fenders. Why do you think the vintage market developed, back then?

MG

+1 here. The '70s were the absolute nadir of bolted-neck electric guitars http://www.thegearpage.net/board/images/icons/icon4.gif

[JeffD]

The two Grosh RCs that I have sound like (very good) strats to me.

[guvnor]

My Anderson Classics give me a strat tone as does my Grosh however, for me, it became a mental issue. The Anderson's and Grosh guitars are great instruments but they were not an actual Strat. I eventually bought a '62 American Reissue to solve my issue. Many of the small guitar companies are required to change the body shape and/or thickness. They are not allowed to use a Fender headstock, etc. I suppose these builders fear Fender's legal department. Anyway, I felt that to achieve a Strat tone, I needed an actual Fender. I also learned that an Anderson fills certain sonic possibilities that a Strat can not. Same with Grosh. I mean, an Anderson Hollow T Classic has better twang than a Tele, in my opinion and for the absolute best tone live, a Hollow Cobra cuts through the mix like no other guitar. Yet, the Cobra is so much different than a Les Paul.

[PlexiBreath]

My buddy Adam and I had 2 Slab board "59 Strats that were only 40 serial #s apart. Mine was mint and his was seriously played in. My guitar sounded so britttle and reflective and his had a resonant and beautiful lower mid thing going.
I've notice this as well. My own theory is that the vintage Strats that are all beat up are because they sounded or played so good the owners couldn't put them down so they were used to death because they were inspiring to play, the pristine Strats played and sounded like such dogs no one wanted to pick them up and play them. I'm sure there a lot of exceptions, but generally this may be the reason.

[AJ Love]

Grosh Strats sound like Strats, so do Lentz Strats... I betcha Suhr could roll 'em up like that too... GVCG, same deal

[olectric]

I agree. John's Hum-Single-Single strats have a cool wiring scheme that allows the humbucker to see a 500k pot and the single coils to see 250K tone pots. A HUGE difference than the conventional wiring, and the tone is so much better. Vintage single coil sound, and a fatter humbucker tone when it is selected. Very versatile.

-Mark

Tom Anderson has had the same thing from the beginning. He calls it vintage voicing. I don't know about Tyler or Grosh, but I would assume that they also are aware of this issue and have similar passive circuits wired into their guitars.

[gretsch58]

maybe the question should be. Why doesn't a Fender Strat sound like a Super Strat? :D

[journo]

I agree. John's Hum-Single-Single strats have a cool wiring scheme that allows the humbucker to see a 500k pot and the single coils to see 250K tone pots. A HUGE difference than the conventional wiring, and the tone is so much better. Vintage single coil sound, and a fatter humbucker tone when it is selected. Very versatile.

-Mark

Hi,

Would I be totally out of line in asking how that is done?
I have two H/S/S guitars that suffer from that very problem and I would like to get that fixed.

Cheers,

Mats N

[GaryMcT]

There's a wiring diagram on my gear page that might help. It isn't a 5-way system, but the resistor values are there.

[journo]

There's a wiring diagram on my gear page that might help. It isn't a 5-way system, but the resistor values are there.

Hi Gary,

Thanks but if I'm to take it to my guitar tech I thnk I need a schematic with a 5-way switch.

Cheers,

Mats N

[olectric]

Hi Gary,

Thanks but if I'm to take it to my guitar tech I thnk I need a schematic with a 5-way switch.

Cheers,

Mats N

Here (http://www.andersonguitars.com/aboutus.html) is the contact page for Tom Anderson Guitarworks. Email Roy. He has lots of schematics and diagrams that he can email you. The vintage voicing definitely makes all the difference.

[riverastoasters]

Send me an email:D
You do need a 4 pole 5way, that way you can have the correct load for each pickup as well as the correct capacitors

That makes a lot of sense. Is there a version for H/H guitars?

[TiEsQue]

That makes a lot of sense. Is there a version for H/H guitars?
Do you mean H/S/H?

[olectric]

Do you mean H/S/H?

I think he means H/H guitars where the 'buckers split?

[TiEsQue]

Big locking tuners sound different than vintage. Flatter radius neck adds more rosewood = darker than vintage. Big frets sound way different than vintage. Anything other than a 6 screw bridge sounds way different. Anything other than vintage repro pickups makes a diff. The word "Super" is not necessarily a good thing.

Adam Stark I'll tell you guys the secret, I have built my share of the real deal.
If you really want to make it sound like a Fullerton Classic there are some ingrediants you need besides the exact shape and right pickups and wood.
You need a vintage truss rod, some builders dont use them
IF it is all maple, 1 piece sounds the best IMO
You need individual pickup routes, no universal
Most important !
You need to use a real Fender Vintage bridge with steel block, it is a piece of crap but it has it's own tone:D

OF course we do offer all these options but dont try one of my more modern setups and say it doesnt sound like one.:o
Great insights guys. Thanks.

Adam- I 100% agree about non-vintage trems completely sucking the vintage tone out of an axe, but the frets? I've always thought that any diff in tone with using larger frets was neutralized by larger strings (Just my observation and I could be wrong). How would you describe the tone diff btwn vintage frets and larger?

John - Thanks for sharing the truss rod tip!


Does anyone have experience with the titanium trem blocks? Personally, really like them in the mid and high frequencies but I do think they take a little bit of percussive "snap" off the low end, so I'm sticking with steel. Has anyone had a different experience?

[ford]

When I think of super strat I think of the metal guitars from the 80's, like Jacksons and Kramers that were a modified strat shape made to play with lots of distortion, floyd's added on, humbuckers all over the place...and lots of bad tone...at least to me...

rock

bford

[mtlin]

I've notice this as well. My own theory is that the vintage Strats that are all beat up are because they sounded or played so good the owners couldn't put them down so they were used to death because they were inspiring to play, the pristine Strats played and sounded like such dogs no one wanted to pick them up and play them. I'm sure there a lot of exceptions, but generally this may be the reason.

I'm not so sure. Players play what they got. Especially in the good old days when we weren't so obssessed with our gear. A lot of musicians are poor. In the '50's and '60's (before my time), I'm guessing that a lot of guys would have been glad just to own a strat, and would have played the crap out of theirs regardless (if they were players, that is).

But who really knows?

Martin

[TiEsQue]

I think the old guitars are so beat up because the guitar stand wasn't invented until 1976. True fact. :)

I have a friend who I'll refer to as FRG ("famous rock guitarist"). FRG had a whole bunch of 50's and 60's Strats most of which he had purchased new. FRG just didn't respect the guitars at all. He was always propping them up against the wall or against an amp instead of putting them in a stand and half the time they would fall over. To him they were $200 guitars that you could get in any music store, which is what they were when he bought them.

Come to think of it, considering the way Hendrix used his guitars as kindling, Clapton used his as a cigarette holder, Beck treated his as an anger management pillow, and Stevie Ray treated his like a skate board...maybe the reason so many old Strats are so beat up is because of heavy drug use.

[Goldstrat]

I think the old guitars are so beat up because the guitar stand wasn't invented until 1976. True fact. :)

I have a friend who I'll refer to as FRG ("famous rock guitarist"). FRG had a whole bunch of 50's and 60's Strats most of which he had purchased new. FRG just didn't respect the guitars at all. He was always propping them up against the wall or against an amp instead of putting them in a stand and half the time they would fall over. To him they were $200 guitars that you could get in any music store, which is what they were when he bought them.

Come to think of it, considering the way Hendrix used his guitars as kindling, Clapton used his as a cigarette holder, Beck treated his as an anger management pillow, and Stevie Ray treated his like a skate board...maybe the reason so many old Strats are so beat up is because of heavy drug use.

This is the best answer I have heard yet! People were more concerned about how loud their amp was than tone. I can remember playing through the home stereo and blowing up the speakers. I would kill for that stereo or the Les Paul that I used. Of course it was just a Les Paul then and every music store had em. Somewhere there is a Marketing genius in a backroom that is laughing about selling crappy 70's strats for thousands of dollars at GC. He is probably the same guy who convinced younger people that Kiss was ever good the first time.

[Guitar James]

I think the old guitars are so beat up because the guitar stand wasn't invented until 1976. True fact. :)

I have a friend who I'll refer to as FRG ("famous rock guitarist"). FRG had a whole bunch of 50's and 60's Strats most of which he had purchased new. FRG just didn't respect the guitars at all. He was always propping them up against the wall or against an amp instead of putting them in a stand and half the time they would fall over. To him they were $200 guitars that you could get in any music store, which is what they were when he bought them.

Come to think of it, considering the way Hendrix used his guitars as kindling, Clapton used his as a cigarette holder, Beck treated his as an anger management pillow, and Stevie Ray treated his like a skate board...maybe the reason so many old Strats are so beat up is because of heavy drug use.
LOL, great post!

[daddyo]

I finished what I think is a superstrat:
USA Custom alder body
Dark Indian rosewood fretboard Stainless frets
Medium C contour .83-.90
1 11/16 delrin nut
Hipshot trem
Sperzel locking tuners
Seymour Duncan vintage strat single coils RWRP middle
Callaham stainless hardware etc

Sounds just like a strat. I had an Ibanez that had a basswood body, locking Edge trem, and S-S-H Ibanez pups. It didn't sound like a strat. I suspect that between the body wood and the pups, 90% of the tone is shaped.

[Funky Monkey]

I've got to go with some Strats not even sounding like Strats. And at the same time I've seen bands live that I could've sworn were using a Fender Strat but they weren't. It's been a very, very long time since I played a FENDER Strat that souded like it was "supposed" to in my head- but it happened to cost more than my annual gross salary. Uh, sorry. Next.

Oh well...I stopped trying to seek out guitars that sound like something my ears are used to and going for something that just sounds good on its own merits. Much less disappointing.
:AOK

[sundaypunch]

I agree. John's Hum-Single-Single strats have a cool wiring scheme that allows the humbucker to see a 500k pot and the single coils to see 250K tone pots. A HUGE difference than the conventional wiring, and the tone is so much better. Vintage single coil sound, and a fatter humbucker tone when it is selected. Very versatile.

-Mark

Does anyone have a schematic for this setup?

[JkGriffin]

Does anyone have a schematic for this setup?

I know that this is bringing up an old thread, but I also am currently searching for a good H/S/S wiring schemtic that also states the values of the different components.
I am planning to install a Dimarzio DP192 Air Zone in bridge position, DiMarzio DP416 Area 61 in middle position and an DiMarzio DP415 Area 58 i neck position on my 1992 Japan Fender Stratocaster. Also planning to replace all electronics such as pots and switch.

If anyone has a good wiring schematic or can direct me to one, I would appriciate it....

[oscar100]

different beasts i think and thats a good thing

[buddastrat]

Geez... this is from 2004!

[rex kwon do]

Also, what does "stratty" mean anyway?

If we are referring to todays American Standard, and if it is so good, why has it been changed so many times? Any why can't any of their endorsers just use it as is? Why does Clapton, Yngwie, SRV, Jimmy Vaghaun, etc...all need a custom model named after them and altered from Standard?

You can easily find as much variation from Fender themselves as these outsiders create.

Its nice to think of the Standard as being like apple pie and mom in the 1950s, but even Eric Johnson has his modded. Turns out mom was a drunk and her pie wasn't ideal. :p

This is almost 4 years old, but this guys quote at the end is still priceless!

[JZWest]

oh that's rich!