Blackface Deluxe Reverb Kit?

[909one]

Hey,
So I played a vintage BF Deluxe Reverb the other day, and now I want one. I can't afford a vintage one though.

There are a few kits out there, the Weber seems to be the cheapest.

I have never built a kit, but I have experience soldering and using a multimeter. Would it just be ridiculous for me to start with a BFDR kit from Weber with no instructions? On their scale of difficulty its pretty high.

Also, what is the quality of parts in Weber kits? In comparision to something like Marsh Amps, why is Marsh charging 985.00 and Weber only $600? Is it because Marsh offers directions and support? Are the components that much different between the two?

I am not concerned with speakers and cabinets btw, I will build the cab myself.

[jay42]

To a great extent, you get what you pay for. BBQBoy kits are a great deal financially, especially if you get one with speakers. I don't know where his cabinets are made. They're a big hitter for diy project costs, and his are inexpensive...but you're not concerned with those issues. His transformers and other components are not the best, however, they're adequate. You might upgrade the output transformer but use the kit's power transformer.

An Allen Accomplice head is $950. There are some interesting options for transformers that you don't get with other kits.
http://www.allenamps.com/kits.php

The question of how hard it is, is dependent on your skills and patience. I never saw the point of starting with a Champ or some other dinky platform. That said, many have started by modifying a phonograph or PA amplifier (Bogen, Stromberg-Carlson, et al) into a guitar amplifer.

[smolder]

I have been looking at kits, reproduction, reissues and vintage units for both deluxe and princeton reverbs for a while now and haven't found any bargain sweet spots.

I think I have (or am learning) the ability to do most maintenance myself which matters a lot in choices. I also like the sound of old components... and thought the reissues are nice... I think the best value right now are the silverface versions, as they did not change significantly from the bf.

That will change radically as the economy recovers and folks stop selling the stuff in their basement for cheap.



.

[909one]

I think what i am most concerned with is grounding. The Weber layout doesn't show exact grounding method.

[909one]

I think the best value right now are the silverface versions, as they did not change significantly from the bf.
.

At what years did the silver face amps start changing drastically for Deluxe Reverbs?

[mark norwine]

I think what i am most concerned with is grounding. The Weber layout doesn't show exact grounding method.
Big, thick books can be written on the theories regarding proper grounding.

I've been designing amps for 25+ years and only "started to think I figured it all out" about 6 years ago.

[hasserl]

I would say that a bf Fender is NOT the place to start your amp building experience. The circuit is much too complicated IMO for a first time build and is a great way to have a miserable experience and give up and never take it up again. Start small and learn how to not only build the amp, but how to diagnose and trouble shoot issues, which are common on firing up an amp for the first time.

Tweed Champ style amps are a good way to start, AX84.com has some good beginner projects.

On the quality of Weber kits. it's been a year or so since I last bought one, since then I believe they've upgraded the parts I normally swapped out for better, switches, jacks and pilot light. The kits are less expensive than some others because of economy of scale and because Weber sources some components over seas where he gets some good prices on them. The quality of the main components is actually quite good, and a well assembled Weber kit amp is a very nice amp, reliable and good sounding. I can't comment on the Marsh kits as I have no knowledge of them.

[GearHeadFred]

I think what i am most concerned with is grounding. The Weber layout doesn't show exact grounding method.

You are wise to be thinking about grounding!

I built a Weber 6A40 about 2 years ago.. which is the BF Super Reverb clone.. It was my first build. I had some "issues" with working out the ground scheme. But in the end, it was a GREAT experience and I love the amp.. It's my main amp now. The only components I found "not up to snuff" were the jacks (I think he has since upgraded them), sockets, retainers.. mostly little stuff easy to upgrade.. The craftsmanship on the wood cabinet was disappointing.. I ended up getting another one made by one of the ebay cab guys.

It is pretty much a "here's the layout - go for it" deal. The Weber "kitbuilders forum" is awesome and there are smart guys always willing to help on there. But if you're looking for a step-by-step, I would suggest something different.

I found this grounding scheme (and drawing) to be very, very helpful: http://el34world.com/charts/grounds.htm

Good luck!

[guitarranch]

At what years did the silver face amps start changing drastically for Deluxe Reverbs?

They did not change DRASTICALLY but there were a few circuit changes.Don't discredit those Silverface Deluxes.They sound really good IMO.
If you buiild a Silverface kit-I have a Silverface faceplate from a late 70's Fender Deluxe Reverb.I'll sell it for $100 + $5 shipping.

[hasserl]

To a great extent, you get what you pay for. BBQBoy kits are a great deal financially, especially if you get one with speakers. I don't know where his cabinets are made. They're a big hitter for diy project costs, and his are inexpensive...but you're not concerned with those issues. His transformers and other components are not the best, however, they're adequate. You might upgrade the output transformer but use the kit's power transformer.

An Allen Accomplice head is $950. There are some interesting options for transformers that you don't get with other kits.
http://www.allenamps.com/kits.php

The question of how hard it is, is dependent on your skills and patience. I never saw the point of starting with a Champ or some other dinky platform. That said, many have started by modifying a phonograph or PA amplifier (Bogen, Stromberg-Carlson, et al) into a guitar amplifer.

Weber builds their cabs in-house. They started off outsourcing that and got burned by the guy that fell way behind in orders and basically closed shop and kept the money as I understood it. So they opened their own cabinet shop and build them themselves now. The quality seems to be hit and miss, the construction is OK, but sometimes the quality of the installation of the tolex or tweed covering is not so good.

Re PA amp conversions, I've done that too and it's a great way to build a nice guitar amp. You get all the main components you need, just replace the electrolytics and rewire it to a classic guitar amp circuit. SOmetimes it's as simple as just installing a 1/4" jack for an input and maybe one for the speaker, it all depends on the PA amp you get and what you want to do with it.

I've got a couple here waiting for me to get to them, along with an old tube stereo out of a hifi console.

[smolder]

At what years did the silver face amps start changing drastically for Deluxe Reverbs?

All my references are in transit (I'm moving)... maybe someone can weigh in with the specifics... but as I recall, the champ, princetons and deluxes were unchanged from the blackface circuitry until the later 70's... about the time that master volumes were introduced on the larger amps.

There we component changes as in different brand of the same general spec (brown bolb capacitors instead of blue blobby ones) and some will say workmanship suffered. Additionally, the cabinetry changed from solid wood to composite wood during that time period.

[TweeDLX]

The Allen Accomplice is a great amp build. It does not have the tremolo system, so it's a bit simpler to assemble. David is great at customer service, and very helpful with build questions. He sent me photos, layouts and schematics for a broken Accomplice amp I bought off eBay. Class act! The Accomplice has bias test jacks & an exterior bias pot to make biasing a snap. You can also easily change over to 6L6's if you desire. I gig with mine on a regular basis and love it!

Mike

[mbratch]

One thing to keep in mind: a kit isn't always the least expensive option, or at least not by far. When considering a kit, make sure you add up all the costs by the time you take care of the speaker, cabinet, and all of the necessary components. Labor aside, you might find that a mid-1970's silverface DR is comparable in price. Arguably, the SFDR won't sound exactly like the vintage BFDR, but neither will a kit.

To me, the value of the kit is more in the experience and learning of building an amp than it is in the cost savings. But if you haven't done one before, the Deluxe Reverb is of moderate complexity and you need to make sure you do substantial studying of grounding schemes and wiring lead dress or you could end up with an amp that you spend more hours trying to debug than play.

[JDJ]

+1 on that. I just priced out a tweed Princeton build... would easily hit $500 to $600 in parts, not including labor.