Ear training in the car?

[tsvaughn]

Can anyone recommend an ear training program on CD that you DON'T need a book for? I'm looking for something I can do while driving.

Thanks.

[lhallam]

Up there in Silver Spring and got a long commute on the Beltway?

David L Burge Relative Pitch Ear Training course. There is some stuff you are going to have to do while not driving, but as far as the drilling goes which is ca 95% of the course, you can do that in the car. 45 minute a day.

Got any questions, feel free to e-mail me.

[Pete2]

Originally posted by lhallam
Up there in Silver Spring and got a long commute on the Beltway?

David L Burge Relative Pitch Ear Training course. There is some stuff you are going to have to do while not driving, but as far as the drilling goes which is ca 95% of the course, you can do that in the car. 45 minute a day.

Got any questions, feel free to e-mail me.


I saw your review on this a couple months ago. Would you say that the work you've done has stuck with you, or do you need to keep drilling to stay fresh? Are you still as enthusiastic about the course as you were when you were in the middle of it?

Pete

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pete2
I saw your review on this a couple months ago. Would you say that the work you've done has stuck with you, or do you need to keep drilling to stay fresh? Are you still as enthusiastic about the course as you were when you were in the middle of it?

Pete

Still doing it. I hate to say, that I've been stuck on one drill for quite some time. I refuse to cheat and continue on without really passing it.

Yes, it sticks with you pretty much. The ability to sing intervals at moments notice hasn't stuck as much, but hearing them has. For example, I can hear all the intervals until I'm bored on that on-line interval website that Joe posted . No problem. When I got out of college I certainly couldn't.

Yes, I'm still enthusiastic. It's friggin tough, no mistake and you've got to stick it out and you've got to do what he says.

I hope that some other folks who have since purchased the course would chime in here. I'm very interested in others opinions.

[Pete2]

Originally posted by lhallam
Still doing it. I hate to say, that I've been stuck on one drill for quite some time. I refuse to cheat and continue on without really passing it.

Yes, it sticks with you pretty much. The ability to sing intervals at moments notice hasn't stuck as much, but hearing them has. For example, I can hear all the intervals until I'm bored on that on-line interval website that Joe posted . No problem. When I got out of college I certainly couldn't.

Yes, I'm still enthusiastic. It's friggin tough, no mistake and you've got to stick it out and you've got to do what he says.

I hope that some other folks who have since purchased the course would chime in here. I'm very interested in others opinions.

Can you listen to regular music and hear the intervals pop out? I read a review someplace that said outside of the environment of the drills, they were having trouble applying it.

Pete

[Pedro58]

It's like anything else taught in isolation. It requires repeated practice and failure. I can teach my students certain grammar concepts, but do they use them? Do they recognize them in other people's speaking and writing? Not right away, but eventually they do. Putting a drill into practice in the real world is ALWAYS going to involve time and intital frustration. Burge shows you a way, shows you the path, but you have to work for it.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pete2
Can you listen to regular music and hear the intervals pop out? I read a review someplace that said outside of the environment of the drills, they were having trouble applying it.

Pete

That's a little difficult to answer. Can I hear all the intervals as a melody goes whizzing by? No.

Do some intervals pop out? Yes.

Can I sing a melody and figure out the intervals and write them down? Yes, but not to 100% accuracy and it takes time. It also depends upon the melody.

Do I feel that I have a better ear as a result of the course?

Absolutely.

I was at a jam and the guitarist just hit a chord while I was setting up. Instantly I heard a G7 chord. So the keyboard player whipped out a chord and in a flash I heard Cmin6/9.

However, I can't listen to a song and immediately identify all the chords but I'm working on it.

I'm not sure how anyone could create a more comprehensive course but that doesn't mean there isn't one out there.

If there is, I'd purchase it in a flash over any amp or gtr.

[markp]

After Ihallam ear training thread I started doing The Berg in my work truck and shortly after that work got me a brand new truck that only has FM radio only and no CD and no cassett.
When I go down to the basement at home I forget the ear training and just pick up the guitar.

[jzucker]

Try singing the intervals you see on license plates.

[EricT]

Originally posted by lhallam
Still doing it. I hate to say, that I've been stuck on one drill for quite some time. I refuse to cheat and continue on without really passing it.

Yes, it sticks with you pretty much. The ability to sing intervals at moments notice hasn't stuck as much, but hearing them has. For example, I can hear all the intervals until I'm bored on that on-line interval website that Joe posted . No problem. When I got out of college I certainly couldn't.

Yes, I'm still enthusiastic. It's friggin tough, no mistake and you've got to stick it out and you've got to do what he says.

I hope that some other folks who have since purchased the course would chime in here. I'm very interested in others opinions.

I'll try to do a review of my first couple of weeks with the course in another thread. I've only done up to level 5 on both courses, been way too busy to work on it more than just now and then...:(
I can tell you, though, that my ear has really improved just from those few lessons, I feel my ear is more open and I'm much more aware of the different intervals when listening to music(i.e. the harmonies between the different instruments).
I can't name them yet, but I'm much better at hearing them and singing them out correctly.
It's all hard work, though, you get nothing for free...

[lhallam]

Originally posted by Pedro58
It's like anything else taught in isolation. It requires repeated practice and failure. I can teach my students certain grammar concepts, but do they use them? Do they recognize them in other people's speaking and writing? Not right away, but eventually they do. Putting a drill into practice in the real world is ALWAYS going to involve time and intital frustration. Burge shows you a way, shows you the path, but you have to work for it.

Well said Pedro.

Thanks Eric and Mark.

[tsvaughn]

Thanks, lhallam. I used to do singing exercises in the car and that was a great use of the time. Now that I'm not singing in a band, I'm looking for something different. I'll look into the Burge stuff.

[tsvaughn]

Wow, it's expensive. $299. Maybe after Xmas...

[TonyV]

I recommend Bruce Arnold's Ear Training for Fananatics with his Ear Training Book 1.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/189094419X/qid=1100204110/sr=8-5/ref=pd_csp_5/002-1486399-1532010?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1890944475/qid=1100204110/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-1486399-1532010?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

I don't think it is a good idea at all to do ear traing while driving, you should not be listening to something on which you are concentrating intently on.

[Pete2]

fyi - you can get the Burge course a bit cheaper on ebay-- either new for $239, or else slightly used (i.e., someone returned it with the money back guarantee) for less than that-- $180-200-ish.

Pete

[lhallam]

Originally posted by TonyV
I recommend Bruce Arnold's Ear Training for Fananatics with his Ear Training Book 1.

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/189094419X/qid=1100204110/sr=8-5/ref=pd_csp_5/002-1486399-1532010?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/1890944475/qid=1100204110/sr=8-1/ref=pd_csp_1/002-1486399-1532010?v=glance&s=books&n=507846

I don't think it is a good idea at all to do ear traing while driving, you should not be listening to something on which you are concentrating intently on.

Have you tried these books? If so, could you please elaborate?

Which book(s)?

How far have you gotten?

What you've gotten out of it?

Anything else?

Thanks,
Lance

[TonyV]

Originally posted by lhallam
Have you tried these books? If so, could you please elaborate?

Which book(s)?

How far have you gotten?

What you've gotten out of it?

Anything else?

Thanks,
Lance

Yes I am using them. Starting with the Fanatics Guide to Ear Training book.

It is pretty much standard ear training, I took a course at NGW once and the instructor taught similarly.

He plays the I, IV, V chord of a key then lets the I ring and your job is to learn the sound of different tones relative to that key. You go through all 12 keys. You start out one note at a time, he recommends the order of adding tones. So for example you learn the sound of the maj 3rd in 12 keys one week then the 2nd the next week, working through all twleve tones in twleve keys.

You then proceed to two notes in succession and then four note lines etc. (that is where you start getting into the other books)

It has definately helped me improve, probably what helped me most is just having a structured program gets me to stick with it more.

[EricT]

Yes, that's how it's like for me too. When you have lessons to follow and a structured program it's a lot easier to get better. Being a student, I'm used to homework and tests, and I that's how I learn the best.

Lately I've been too busy, but after Christmas I'm putting half an hour with ear training on my schedule each day.

[KRosser]

I used to do lots of ear training in the car with nothing but a chromatic pitch pipe (a whopping $12 investment). I would randomly play a pitch (remember to keep your eyes on the road!) and then practice singing an interval above it or below it. (More on this in the paragraph below). I also practiced randomly playing a pitch and then singing a major triad with the played note as the root, then minor, augmented and diminished triads, then I would practice the same thing with the played pitch being the third, and then the fifth. Then I moved onto seventh chords in a similar manner.

As far as finding your intervals up & down, I highly recommend a method that worked great for me, which is finding a song that has a given interval as the first two notes of the melody. For instance, an ascending diminished fifth for me was "Maria" from West Side Story, and a descending minor third was "Hey Jude". It's more important that you come up with your own song references, though, because they need to be something you can access from your memory banks easily. Once I came up with a song for every ascending and descending interval up to (and including) an octave, I would just drill them accordingly with the pitch pipe in the car (I was doing a lot of tedious driving at the time).

I also did lots of fun stuff singing rhythms against a metronome in the car, but that'll have to be for another post....

[lhallam]

Originally posted by KRosser
I used to do lots of ear training in the car with nothing but a chromatic pitch pipe (a whopping $12 investment). I would randomly play a pitch (remember to keep your eyes on the road!) and then practice singing an interval above it or below it. (More on this in the paragraph below). I also practiced randomly playing a pitch and then singing a major triad with the played note as the root, then minor, augmented and diminished triads, then I would practice the same thing with the played pitch being the third, and then the fifth. Then I moved onto seventh chords in a similar manner.


You are correct, being able to sing the chord or interval is the best way of getting intervals/chords into your ear.

This is a great idea for someone with knowledge and an established ear but I have to question this approach for the raw beginner.

A small point is accuracy & thoroughness in proper spelling. For example, a major third above D# is F double sharp (enharmonic G). Without proper guidance, folks would tend to name the pitch correctly (G) but not the theoretic correct note (F ##). Plus how often do you play a G and say to yourself, sing a major third below F double sharp?

To some I may be nit-picking about the spellings however my professor would take off points if you sang the right interval but named the wrong note.

I know plenty of people use the song association approach to learning intervals but I find it better to simply know the sound of a Major 3rd immediately than to hear it, then associate it with a song, then name the interval. The association method has been a crutch for me on some intervals.

[KRosser]

Originally posted by lhallam
You are correct, being able to sing the chord or interval is the best way of getting intervals/chords into your ear.

This is a great idea for someone with knowledge and an established ear but I have to question this approach for the raw beginner.

Sure, this pre-supposes you know how to build chords. That should be something a raw beginner would want to tackle anyway

A small point is accuracy & thoroughness in proper spelling. For example, a major third above D# is F double sharp (enharmonic G). Without proper guidance, folks would tend to name the pitch correctly (G) but not the theoretic correct note (F ##). Plus how often do you play a G and say to yourself, sing a major third below F double sharp?

Well sure, but we're confusing two separate issues here. This is not about spelling at all. The thing I am more interested in practicing is being able to hear and reproduce a major third below C, for instance. Whether you call that pitch a B#, a D double-flat, an E quadrupal flat or whatever and the corresponding enharmonically-named arrival point is not of interest to me in this exercise, only being able to hear and reproduce the interval as an auditory sensation (as opposed to how it might appear on paper)

To some I may be nit-picking about the spellings however my professor would take off points if you sang the right interval but named the wrong note.

Like I said, I do this in the car without even looking at the pitchpipes, so I'm not interested in naming the pitch I'm coming from or going to, I'm just interested in hearing the interval. It presupposes you've had a little bit of theory and enough ear training to know when you're off. I'm just throwing this out there as a very inexpensive method of advancing this practice once you've got a few basics under your belt.

I studied music at a university as well and had a theory professor that would stop me in the hall and say stuff like, "Quick, Rosser - what's a minor third above Ab?". If I said "Cb" I was cool. If I said "B" I was in big trouble, since that's obviously an augmented second. This practice I do above is strictly practical, working-world based stuff- I don't do any unusual enharmonic intervals, just all the major, minor and perfect intervals (and the diminished fifth, natch).

I know plenty of people use the song association approach to learning intervals but I find it better to simply know the sound of a Major 3rd immediately than to hear it, then associate it with a song, then name the interval. The association method has been a crutch for me on some intervals.

Me too, but it was a good way to get them in my head to begin with, and that's what I suggest it for. I had flash cards with the interval written on one side and the song title on the other, so not only would I practice the interval but I'd also use it to memorize my song associations. At a certain point it was much easier to drop the song as the interim step. I'm not saying it's the only way, or even the best way, it's just one that worked for me that I wanted to share, and it didn't cost me $300.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by KRosser


Gotcha.

I just wanted to point out to beginners that proper spelling is important.

Gonna give your in car exercise a try. Thanks.

[TonyV]

These keychain electronic pitch pipes are pretty cool

http://www.thecentralspot.com/Merchant2/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Store_Code=AI&Product_Code=PT10005&Category_Code=FEPT

Pro: Handy for tuning or ear training

Con: High Geek Factor

[proreverb68]

Try singing the intervals you see on license plates.


Old thread I know...But..

I just have to say thanks for this one.

I'm always looking for ways to train my ear. The license plate thing will remind me to practice in the car.

A friend of mine used to look at trees and the different heights of trees as melodic lines...and try to sing them.

[shihanderek]

I have "Theory for the Road" by Rich Severson. Pretty decent, and affordable. Here's a link.

http://www.guitarcollege.net/tfr.html