One piece body/Tone - is it a Myth?

[eddie101]

I just placed an order for a "boutique 50's Tele" and had a choice between 1 piece vs 2 piece body. I must admit that having a 1 piece body intrigued me, however, my ears probably :D could not hear a sonic difference between the two. One piece obviously cost more - about $400 - but I am not trying to cut corners by opting to go with less $ body as I just could not convince myself if the "upgrade" is worth it for me. What do you think and do we have any experts out there who can hear the difference between the two?

Also, IMHO, 1-piece body '50's tele is as rare as hen's teeth. I have personally never seen one although I hear some are out there.

[dukeh62]

Eddie...I talked to a very reputable "boutique tele builder" about that very same question. He said the difference would minimal if any. His pricing was also $400 difference between the two...Hmmmmm.

[DavidH]

More of an aesthetic consideration IMO, and nice to have a 1-piece but i wouldn't make any assumptions in terms of it sounding any better.

[mouldynudger]

$400 extra for a one piece body! They`re bending you over old chap.

Damian.

[Luke]

If the two pieces are from the same tree, assuming adjoining cuts, the only difference is a little glue line right?

However according to this the trees can get to 60 cm in diameter:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swamp_Ash

23.62", more than wide enough

[Chris Rice]

$400 extra for a one piece body! They`re bending you over old chap.

Damian.
Agreed! Watch your backside. :messedup

I hear no difference in a properly built guitar.

That said, I love the look, and recently acquired a great pile of 1-piece ash boards.

[aram]

Rick Kelly told me that he makes his body two pieces, as they're more stable.

He says one piece bodies can warp slightly over time.

I think as long as the two pieces are matched it should be fine in terms of aesthetics.

[fullerplast]

The fact is that you'll never know.....you can't do a non-destructive A/B test.

Best you can do is theorize. Every glue joint is a discontinuity or a "boundary" where the resonance of each piece of wood may change. Multiple pieces average out the good, bad, and neutral qualities of all the pieces.

For a small number of pieces, hopefully a "good" sounding piece will dominate an average or "poor" piece, if it is in the right place....so maybe that two piece body will sound better than an average one piece body.

If you extrapolate to say 10 pieces, as in a butcher block, most people would probably agree it would not resonate as well as a one piece....likewise 5 pieces probably would not...which could mean 2 pieces may not....but as the number of pieces decrease the importance of each piece increases. So IMHO that's why you just can't tell.

[fullerplast]

He says one piece bodies can warp slightly over time.


That theory would also suggest that either half of a two piece body can do the same......

[T2Russo]

That theory would also suggest that either half of a two piece body can do the same......
The explanation I've heard is that since it's highly unlikely that both pieces would want to warp in the exact same direction, the resistance put up by trying to bend the other piece helps limit movement.

[Jahn]

Ayep. My Rick Kelly Tele is a 2-piecer, as is my PRS Korina Santana. Not feeling a problem over here on my end.

[Chi]

yikes...$400 for a 1 peice body?

Personally I don't think you'd be able to tell the difference in tone of two guitars buiolt the same way with body wood from the same area of the same tree, everything else being equal

..especially when amplified...

[jfalcs]

yikes...$400 for a 1 peice body?

Keep in mind that milling a 1 piece body may present some challenges for a smaller builder. Not everyone has a 16'' jointer or a planer wide enough to handle the whole piece. It's much easier (and cheaper) to set up to run say 7-8" wide boards, glue up and do a quick clean up on the drum sander. Even the small drum sanders usually give you a solid 15". A small builder without such a large capacity must then find some way to get the wood milled. Similarly, a high price for an option may also be a way to discourage such a request (for reasons discussed). Just something to consider.

[Echo]

And if you think about it that way, although the extra cost would highly discourage the inconvenience it causes them when they have to build one, if someone DOES pay the extra money, that $400 makes it worth the nuisance as well.

[Isaac W.]

My bodies are made up of about 25-40 pieces, salvaged strips glued into first boards, then boards laminated to get the body thickness. To hide the strips, I veneer fancy wood in sheets top and bottom. You can still see the 'butcher block' around the edge. They have great sustain and to my ears sound very much like a guitar. ;)

As an aside, whenever I make any wide surface in a piece, I prefer 4-6" max width per board. This makes warping much less likely. I have often wondered if one piece ash bodies had a tendancy to warp. They certainly look like they would, they almost always contain wood near the pith.

[K-Line]

Sound, no difference really. Many say the glue joint alters the sound wave transference or some fancy worded thing like that. I am sure that it does change things but is it audible? My ears are not that good. 3 piece bodies are grat as well. Hell, I had a 5 piece Fender that I stripped back in the day and nitroed. It was a monster. I use 2 piece bodies so the peanut gallery is happy. One piece is nice and they do come along but I never recommend people pay an extra fee. $50-$75 for a one piece seem more in-line but maybe they know something I don't!

[Jim S]

I'm not a human oscilloscope. One piece for the coffee table....maybe.

[Dog Boy]

The fact is that you'll never know.....you can't do a non-destructive A/B test.

Best you can do is theorize. Every glue joint is a discontinuity or a "boundary" where the resonance of each piece of wood may change. Multiple pieces average out the good, bad, and neutral qualities of all the pieces.

For a small number of pieces, hopefully a "good" sounding piece will dominate an average or "poor" piece, if it is in the right place....so maybe that two piece body will sound better than an average one piece body.

If you extrapolate to say 10 pieces, as in a butcher block, most people would probably agree it would not resonate as well as a one piece....likewise 5 pieces probably would not...which could mean 2 pieces may not....but as the number of pieces decrease the importance of each piece increases. So IMHO that's why you just can't tell.



This sounds really reasonable to me. But if anyone decides to cut their one piece into two, glue it back together and see if its better please report to the principle's office.

[VaughnC]

When it comes to tone, eyes fall way short of the ears. You have two ears & two hands...believe in what they tell you about a guitar and leave the cosmetic arguments for the posers ;).

[RSRelic]

I'd rather have a two piece body any day of the week over a one piece for two reasons; first there is just not as much to choose from when going one piece and it's much easier to find two pieces that tap test far better, next every one piece body I have seen from the 50s has cupped and this does not happen on a two piece body that is glued up correctly. I will say very few vintage Fender guitars were really one piece, so it's more bragging rights than a tonal benefit IMHO.

[ariki]

I once asked a similar question to a reputable builder.

The answer I got was that wood has natural tension/stress built inside of it (which is why a piece of wood would warp after some) and that this tension is bad for its vibration if you'd tap it. Therefore stress in the wood is also bad for the tone of an instrument you would build out of it.

Cutting up a piece of wood into two pieces would partially release this stress, if you'd let the wood lie and rest long enough.
Then, for the final step, if you glue the wood together *in a good way*, this does not create extra stress in the wood.

It sounded very plausible to me.
The reason in cost difference is probably (also because of the above reasons) that it's easier to find a smaller piece of wood with not much stress in it than a larger one.

Cheers,
Wim

[Isaac W.]

That is very interesting regarding stress. I have often thought that what I viewed as stress in a board might translate into tone and possibly sustain.

Approaching the bodies as a veneer worker, I am interested in making the most stable platform for my marquetry. When I assemble a panel there is a center core and whatever I do to the top must be done to the bottom. Multiple laminations stabilize the whole and dramatically reduce seasonal movement.

It's funny, because I have always viewed this process as building stress into a panel, not relieving it. My view is that each individual piece is still moving seasonally but it's movement is countered with movement of the pieces around them. I liken the stress to a guy in a well, pushing with feet and hands on the surfaces that surround him. IMO a panel built as such is much stiffer than a single board. Stiffness strikes me as an essential element of sustain.

I have wondered if perhaps the legendary sustain of some guitars might be the result of their being a laminate construction such as with the LP. It looks like the gold top and painted backed bursts could conceal multiple pieces as well. Keep in mind that I have been completely wrong before. ;)

[Stefan S]

A while ago, a friend of mine stripped his good sounding shoreline gold Tele, Fender CS from the late 90´s.
Too bad, it was a five (5) piece body! (I´ve seen it.)
Now it´s seafoam green and still sounds good.
But Fender......:messedup for that price, come on.

[K-Line]

A while ago, a friend of mine stripped his good sounding shoreline gold Tele, Fender CS from the late 90´s.
Too bad, it was a five (5) piece body! (I´ve seen it.)
Now it´s seafoam green and still sounds good.
But Fender......:messedup for that price, come on.
I think what you said is right on, it sounded great. That is what matters more than anything. I can see your point on price, it is a principle thing, more wood is cheaper to manufacture. On a higher end, two piece should be a law or some kind of ordinance at least. Oops, one of my esquires is a 3 piece! Sounds very sweet.

[tdarian]

Two of my best sounding guitars (Ron Kirn Tele & a PRS IRW McCarty Standard Soapbar) have one piece bodies. And I have another 1 piece body on the way in a McCarty Korina. You guys are really starting to freak me out!

Actually, my Jimmy Vaughn strat is excellent too, and although I've not stripped off the paint, I believe the JV body is multiple pieces coated in thick poly.

I'm going to try to not worry about this too much because the clear limiting factor for me and my sound is my lack of playing skills. Time to practise....

[pcovers]

Actually, my Jimmy Vaughn strat is excellent too, and although I've not stripped off the paint, I believe the JV body is multiple pieces coated in thick poly....

Good lord, multiple piece body AND thick poly. You poor soul - having to put up with that obviously tone dead guitar. I sure hope it doesn't have one of those tone sucking bridges and one of those cheap guitar cables that leaks all the remaining tone out before it reaches the your amp.

[Isaac W.]

Good lord, multiple piece body AND thick poly. You poor soul - having to put up with that obviously tone dead guitar. I sure hope it doesn't have one of those tone sucking bridges and one of those cheap guitar cables that leaks all the remaining tone out before it reaches the your amp.

Tee hee hee.

[Punky Meadows]

it would all just depend on the wood imo. there are great multi-piece bodies and turkey one pieces, and vice verse

[testing1two]

I have a tele with a one piece body and it sounds fantastic and resonant. Is it because of the one piece body? I have no idea. And unless you have a natural finish or a nearly transparent butterscotch or blonde, you'll never see (or hear) the difference.

[Stefan S]

Two of my best sounding guitars (Ron Kirn Tele & a PRS IRW McCarty Standard Soapbar) have one piece bodies. And I have another 1 piece body on the way in a McCarty Korina. You guys are really starting to freak me out!

Actually, my Jimmy Vaughn strat is excellent too, and although I've not stripped off the paint, I believe the JV body is multiple pieces coated in thick poly.

I'm going to try to not worry about this too much because the clear limiting factor for me and my sound is my lack of playing skills. Time to practise....


There you go, we all have more lacks in skills and knowledge, than we´d allow our guitars to have (correct english?)
It makes often no difference if a body is one-or five piece.
But for all those, who don´t listen to the sound it´s easy to decide if you give them clear rules.
One piece is better that two or more.
Brazilian rosewood is better that indian.
Light is better that heavy.....etc

All you builder know what I´m talking about.