Condensor microphone for guitar name a great one

[harryjmic]

I just entered the recording world and need to get some recommendations on condensor microphones. I will primarily use them for acoustic and low volume(electric guitar) recording. Anyone out there have luck with a brand or make? Thanks.

[Paul Secondino]

I have a few Audio Technica mics. I have a pair of 4047's and a 4040. THe 4047's have a bit of a high end peak but overall, I have gotten respectable overhead sounds out of them and ver nice 12 string acoustic sunds as well.

I was also at a mic demo where the Blue Dragonfly sounded excellent on a Martin 6 string.None of us liked the mic for vocals but it sounded really great on the acoustic. Some of the BLue mics have a thing where they sound great for one thing and not so great on other stuff.

One thing to remember is that acoustics are not very loud so getting a mic that has a large amount of gain usually helps. My 4047's aren't very hot mics so I use alot of gain from my UA 2610 mic pre.

[harryjmic]

Thanks Paul. A Guitar Center guy recommended the Neumann 103, but at $995 I need more then a little comfort.

[Greggy]

The Neuman KM184 is one of the industry standards for acoustic guitar. Costs in the neighborhood of $600 new. I own one and like it a lot. Also useful for some special effects tracking like wind chimes (did this once with good results).

[harryjmic]

Greggy,

Ever use your mic with an electric guitar? I want the mic to serve double duty. I could use my SM-57 but the condensor mics are supposed to better at picking up detail. It's difficult playing the guitar when the mic needs to be right next to the sound hole(SM-57), I believe the condensor mic would help out with this.

Thanks, Harry

[KungFuLio]

audix scx-25
+1 on the TLM103 ...dough is tall but worth it
shure ksm32
neumann km140

If the euro ever come down you'll see good neumann prices again. I got a pair of 103's a few years back $510 each .... new!

[Greggy]

Originally posted by harryjmic
Greggy,

Ever use your mic with an electric guitar? I want the mic to serve double duty. I could use my SM-57 but the condensor mics are supposed to better at picking up detail. It's difficult playing the guitar when the mic needs to be right next to the sound hole(SM-57), I believe the condensor mic would help out with this.

Thanks, Harry

Never used the Neuman with electric guitar, though I remember someone saying it was a good ambient mic (about 4 or so feet back from the cab). In my limited experience, I'm not an ambient mic kinda guy, just one mic at a time.:D I tried the sm57 once once on acoustic, kinda flat with little to no transients. Others will comment better on double duty mics, I prefer to use separate mics for electric and acoustic guitars.

[KungFuLio]

Originally posted by Greggy
Never used the Neuman with electric guitar, though I remember someone saying it was a good ambient mic (about 4 or so feet back from the cab). In my limited experience, I'm not an ambient mic kinda guy, just one mic at a time.:D I tried the sm57 once once on acoustic, kinda flat with little to no transients. Others will comment better on double duty mics, I prefer to use separate mics for electric and acoustic guitars.

using a U87 on el gtr as i type
jazz project ... not to say the guitarist is playing quietly

[Unburst]

Originally posted by Greggy
I tried the sm57 once once on acoustic, kinda flat with little to no transients. Others will comment better on double duty mics, I prefer to use separate mics for electric and acoustic guitars.

Wouldn't use a '57 on acoustic, the Neumann KM84 is a great acoustic mic.
If I had to choose one mic for both Igo with th Neumann or n AKG 414

[T.Wesley]

Harry -

I recommend the Studio Projects C1 or C3 mic. I've got a C3, which has 3 polar options, but the C1 is basically the same mic only with 1 element so it just does cardioid.

Anyway - they are quite affordable and give good sound. I've used the C3 on both acoustic gutiar (and cello!) and used it more than any other mic on electric guitar on my band's first album, so I know it sounds good for both things. They require phantom power, BTW.

Enjoy - experiment - e-live it up :)

--chiba

[LSchefman]

I'm usually a Blue mic fan, but if you're looking for an absolute bargain in a smallish diaphragm condenser, the Groove Tubes GT33 is certainly one, and I like it better on acoustic than my AKG 414.

I bought one at Guitar Center for around $200...

I liked it so much I bought another one for my son to take to college, and he even cuts vocals with it. And they sound good!

[dehughes]

Originally posted by KungFuLio
using a U87 on el gtr as i type
jazz project ... not to say the guitarist is playing quietly

Hey man! Kung Fu Bakery kicks complete ass! That place is absolutely phenominal....if I ever need to do any high-quality studio work, that'd be the place I'd do it. I just started taking guitar lessons from Tim Ellis, and he's both a super nice guy and a super great player. Small world....

Okay, back to mic talk.... :)


david

[Sebastian]

Trying to find a mic that will work on both acoustics and electrics is difficult I've found.

I've got the KM184s, and they're good, but can get a little crispy. With the right preamp, they can sound good on acoustic. I've never tried them on electric.

On electric, I like the Sennheiser MD409 and the Royer 121, and I've got an old tube mic that does well at low volumes. Check out a ribbon mic, like the Royer. It could potentially work for both acoustic and electric.

I usually like LDC tubes as distant mics on loud guitar cabs , or closer if the volume isn't too loud. Again, depends on the pre and the padding.

I sometimes think large diagphragm condensors on acoustic get too boomy and don't sit in the mix well.

[loudboy]

I'd just get 2 mics - why make compromises? The correct mic for the job is what gets it done.

An SM57 or Sennheiser 609 for electric.

An Oktava MC-012, Shure SM81, AKG 451 or Neumann Km184 for acoustic, cheapest to highest $.

Less than $200 and you'll actually be able to make a good recording of both instruments... <g>

Loudboy

[pbradt]

I like the Marshall 603S for acoustic. Very clean.

[MichaelK]

My favorite mics for acoustic guitar are KM184 and Earthworks SR-77, both small diaphragm condensers. I'm not a big fan of the TLM103. No disrespect to anyone here, but personally I've never heard a track recorded with one that's knocked me out. AT4047 is a great vocal mic for some people, but I don't think it's right for acoustic guitar. AKG 414 is good as far as large diaphragm mics go, but I really prefer the smaller mics if I'm using only one.

I have never heard the GT33, but if Les says it works well I'd consider it seriously.

[LSchefman]

>>An Oktava MC-012, Shure SM81, AKG 451 or Neumann Km184 for acoustic, cheapest to highest $<<

If you want to go higher, try a B&K, which sounds pretty amazing, too.

[GaryNattrass]

AKG 414 does it for me although I personally use an AKG C3000.

The 451 is also a great acoustic instrument mic.

[MagnumSSS]

I hope no one minds if I chime in here with some of my needs.

I am looking for a condenser mic, possibly two to use for recording vocals, acoustic guitar, and using as a 2nd mic to my Sennheiser e609 for miking my electric guitar cabinet. I'm finding that two mics for acoustic is better than one. I have a small budget. Entry level, but I'd like good quality. What mics would you guys recommend I look into for my needs/budget?

Thanks.

Mag

[KungFuLio]

Originally posted by MagnumSSS
I have a small budget.


How Much? Then I can get specific...

[MagnumSSS]

$500 or less for 1-3 mics. I don't want to get shit and have to upgrade EVERYTHING down the road. I want to buy stuff that I will want to keep as part of my collection. I'm just interested in Condenser mics. I have an e609 for close miking my electric guitar cab.

Thanks.

Mag

[seafoamer]

if i want sweet: neumann U87
if i want not so sweet: audio-technica 4050

[onemind]

Baby Blue ..... or 414ULS omni for ambience....

S.

[MagnumSSS]

Thanks for the suggestions, but I'm looking for a differently tailored response. Based on my specific needs stated above, can anyone recommend some mics that I should look into in the under$500 range? I guess I'm looking for the "SM57's" of condenser mics. I'm very interested in tube mics, fyi.

Thanks.

Mag

[onemind]

I'm starting to see used 414ULS for less than 500. though it has a dark quality that some don't like, this might be the equivalent of a "Swiss Army Condenser," Perhaps an AT3035 you could buy at least two well within the budget.

Steve

[MagnumSSS]

onemind, what company makes these mics you speak of?

[Impulse 101]

AT=Audio Technica

They are also my personal choice in bang for buck mics. I have 5 ATM29HE's and an AT4050. The 4050 is a great mic.

Don't overlook the AT4051 Small Dia. Condensor mic for acoustic, is a great mic at a good price.

The AKG C3000 is also a very good budget mic.

I also have two 414's on is a TLII and the other is a ULS. I find the the ULS is bright and not dark at all. I like it for guitar cabs when recording clean sounds and any percussion instrument, as well as acoustic guitars where it totally excells.

JT

[onemind]

The AT3035 is made by Audio Technica as JT Points out. I really like the 4051's for acoustic as well, especially a stereo pair. I'm not fond of the AKG3000 though, I think the AT is a bit more open sounding, in small diaphragm land I've never been able to coax a good sound out of an AKG C1000.

The Rodes are not bad Mics at all and you could probably get a pair of small diaphragms (NT5 which is a kit) and a Large Diaphragm NT1 within your budget. that would tackle a whole bunch of problems...

Steve

[MagnumSSS]

It seems that two small diaphram condenser mics would be ideal for miking my acopustic, and I could use the large or small diaphram mics for vocals and ambient miking of my electric guitar cab. I'll look into the Rhodes. What are some other good little packages like this?

Thanks.

Mag

[onemind]

Originally posted by MagnumSSS
It seems that two small diaphram condenser mics would be ideal for miking my acopustic, and I could use the large or small diaphram mics for vocals and ambient miking of my electric guitar cab. I'll look into the Rhodes. What are some other good little packages like this?


Octavia makes mics at an even lower price point, I would venture you could pick up a pair of MK012's for about 150. Probably a higher noise floor than the Rodes (not Rhodes! pronounced Ro-Day) some people really like their sizzle on cymbals and use them as overheads. You could then spend a bit more on a large diaphragm condenser. I've had great success using both a large and a small on acoustic guitar....the large diaphragm pointed towards the body and the small towards the neck.

On another note should we assume you ended up with the Mbox?

Steve

[MagnumSSS]

No, I don't have the Mbox. I'm struggling with deciding between either Logic Pro7 in conjuction with somethink like the M Audio Mobile Pre or M Audio Firewire 410 or.......the Mbox. Logic Pro 7 seems to offer A LOT more since I want to use soft synths, drum machines, etc. for doing one man band stuff.

Question, a firewire audio interface will allow low latency real time effect monitoring when recording right? Whereas USB will not be fast enough?

So, concerning the mics, yes, I was reading about the Oktava's. Thanks for reminding me. I was also reading damn good opinions of those Groove Tube small diaphragm condenser mics. My main concern is that I don't want to get something that I will just turn around and sell when I have more money. I'd rather get some mics that I will want to always have on hand because they are great sounding affordable mics. The problem is, this is so subjective.

The price of $150 for the pair of MK012's, is that used ebay pricing? Or, is that new internet store pricing?

[onemind]

A while back you could find Oktavas for even less than that, I haven't seen them around as much lately but I'm sure they pop up on eBay. There are more and more Chinese condenser microphones at ridiculous price points. I see now that Joe Meek has one for about eighty bucks with a shockmount that resembles an AKG. While a music store is no place to demo you really should try to get to hear some of these mics.

As far as recording devices, I've never been a Logic fan, I find the Interface really daunting (and I'm a computer teacher!) I just think Pro-Tools has the most intuitive interface, even if that means it lacks some of the features of Logic Pro. The price difference from an MBox with included software to Logic Pro with a breakout box is substantial....perhaps as much as five hundred dollars.

Latency is certainly an issue and I'm always concerned it can affect musicality, subtly messing up your timing when overdubbing, even if it's just a few milliseconds. Monitoring with effects can be helpful, especially to vocalists, but remember even a firewire pro-tools device in "low-latency" mode turns off some of the effects. A lot of people have been predicting a Firewire MBox forever, I would at least give it a couple of weeks 'til NAMM and see if it pans out.

Another intriguing option may arrive today if Steve Jobs introduces the "asteroid" breakout box for Apple Computers that many people are predicting... It's like buying a computer, there will always be bigger better cheaper faster options down the road, but you've already missed countless opportunities to be creative.

Steve

[MagnumSSS]

I think we'll find out today or tomorrow what Steve Jobs is announcing in his Keynote. I've been waiting for this day before I buy my powerbook. I'll have one within a coupla weeks.

Yeah, the learning curve of Logic has concerned me, but people have said they've not had a problem with it.

Still not sure, I might just end up with the Mbox, who knows. The thing is, I want to do Soft Synth stuff and Drum Machine stuff and it just seems that Logic is more equipped off the bat and has better sequencer/midi features that I can grow into.

Still deciding. I'll never really know until I try the stuff out....if I can figure a way to do that.

[harryjmic]

Thanks for all the replys guys, I'll keep these tips for when it comes time to do the deal.