Pickup advice for SG and ESP Eclipse - PLEEZE

[Jimi D]

Okay, first a little history...

I used to gig, then I had kids and stopped... Now my kids are in late high school, college and university, and I have some extra time on my hands, and a friend of mine is in a hard rock cover band that was looking for a second guitarist. They asked me if I'd like to try out for the gig and I said "Why not?" And now I'm doing it again...

So I'm playing in this pack of rather talented 40-somethings kicking out Zepplin and Deep Purple and Aerosmith and April Wine covers in crap bars... The other guitarist plays a Strat, so right from day one I decided that I'd stay away from my Strat and Tele and go with a humbucker guitar - unfortunately, I've been playing my Strat almost exclusively for the last four years or so... Anyway, I'd picked up a Gibson SG-3 (the model with humbuckers) just before joining up, and this Christmas my wife gave me a Mesa Mark V head that's become my main amp... I have a Les Paul that is too precious and/or heavy (I can never decide which... maybe it's both) to gig, so I've been looking for decent backup to my SG...

Well, I think that I've settled on my two gigging guitars for the next little while... My Gibson SG-3 (loaded with two Classic 57s and a Classic 57+ in the bridge) and an ESP Eclipse II with EMGs... In both cases, I've picked these guitars because of their weight, playability, fit, finish, and resonance (wood!!), not because of their pickups... In fact, I'm not entirely satisfied with either pickup combo. With the ESP, it's simply that they're EMGs... Not that I have anything against EMGs, but they're just not for me... And in the SG, the Classic 57+ just sounds too weak, thin, whimpy for me (and yes, I've tweaked the pup height every which way from Tuesday) - I've got it to where it's usable (and I've been using it) but I want to try something a little ballsier...

What I'd like is to have these guitars tonally in the same ballpark - basically, interchangeable for "live" purposes. I spend 90% of my time on my bridge pickup or the bridge-neck combo, so that's the important one. I'd like something with some oomph, but not too hot. I've got a Burstbucker Pro in the bridge of my Les Paul, and that seems like a pretty nice compromise between vintage and modern humbuckers to me, so I'm toying with the idea of buying a couple BBpros and putting them in the bridge position of each of these guitars, but both the SG and Eclipse are much thinner/lighter guitars than the Les Paul, so I'd like to get some feedback from the forum I dive in... I was thinking I'd leave the 57s in the neck and middle positions on my SG-3, but I'd still need a decent neck pup for the ESP... Maybe a P94? Any other suggestions? These are live, knock-about gigging guitars, not rarified recording axes, and I really don't want to delve into the world of boo-tique pickups (it's not the principal of the thing, it's the money! :rotflmao) so I'd prefer to entertain more "mainstream" suggestions, but any and all recommendations will be gratefully considered...

thx
:dude

[Jimi D]

Anyone? Bueller?

[NativH]

I was going to say RS True 60's (Fralins) for the SG but the boutique thing threw me off. They are in the $400 - $450 range but they also have some RS Fralins in the $280 range. Both run about 7.5 for the neck and 8.5 for the bridge so they are smooth PAF's with some hair on them. Love the True 60's in my Historic SG/LP. More money than the Gibsons but also more pickup IMHO. SD Seth Lovers are also nice low output pickups and considerably cheaper. Used them in a LP for awhile and liked them alot. WCR also have numerous choices including Crossroads, Godwoods, etc in the $285 - $300 range. Once again, more scratch than the Gibsons but worth it IMHO.

[telejammer]

I have a Gibson SG with the coil taps, Burstbucker #1 in the neck and Burstbucker #3 in the bridge position. They seem to be very defined and sort of high ended to me. The neck can be pretty good in humbucking mode and decent in single coil mode too. The overall tones can be better shaped by mixing both pickups in various combinations of single and humbucker modes. I too want more of a deeper, bigger sound and was leaning toward the 57 Classics but after reading your post they may not be what I'm after either. I do not want to play the "pickup" game of buying, changing, selling and still not finding the sound I want. I have decided to wait till I get some more detailed information of various pickups and live with what came with the guitar for now. If you find something that really beefs up the sound of an SG let us know.

[Artur_I_Tis]

I'm gunning for Seymour Duncan P-Rails. Super versatile.

[thorny64]

I'm gonna get flamed here.... but I say put a duncan JB in the bridge of the SG. The SG is thinner and lighter, and the JB is a ballsier pickup. It is a higher output pickup that balances well with a traditional output pickup in the neck. It isn't really a distortion pickup either - not by todays standards. It sounds really good in the style of music that you are playing. It cleans up nicely when you roll the volume back (even PAFish). It sounds great in a single coil mode too (use the non-adjustable poles coil) if you decide to operate it that way. It can be found relatively cheap. If it is too bright, you can consider a covered model (tames a bit of the top end) - that will also look good if you have covered pickups in your guitar now. If you don't like it, it is easy to sell and get your money back. It doesn't cost $200 like a lot of boutique pickups will. You should be able to find a used one around $50 or so - even a nickel or chrome covered one.

Don't get me wrong, I have some nice PAF class pickups in some of my guitars. But a JB will do what you are wanting, and it is Duncans most popular pickup for a reason (it sounds great in a lot of guitars). I think it was the sound Gibson was trying to copy with their 500T but I don't think they got it right. If you like it in one, consider using your former bridge humbucker flipped in the neck of the Schecter, and put another JB in the bridge of it. But I would do only one guitar first to be sure I liked it.

My subjective opinion.:JAM

[Jimi D]

Thanks for the responses so far, guys!

@ telejammer - I've read a lot of good things about 57s in SGs (much of it on this board) but I just don't hear it myself... I was thinking that it maybe my rig - using Mesa amps and getting my distortion from the preamp, maybe my SG doesn't sound as full as it would if I was running a vintage Marshall full-out and getting power tube distortion... I don't know... but I do know that the 57+ isn't working for me in the bridge position in my SG... As you're no more pleased with the Burstbuckers in yours, I guess it's time to start thinking about alternatives... I was thinking maybe a Dimarzio PAF Plus, but thorny64's idea seems like a pretty good one...

As for the P-Rails, I'm considering throwing one of those in something, but I don't need that kind of "versatility" (aka complication) in these guitars - they're gonna be straight-ahead rockers, and I like to keep it relatively simple... I don't think I'll even bother with coil taps (were I to settle on a pickup with four leads)...

[Julia343]

JB/59 in the Eclipse. There are more expensive combinations out there... but this is a nice one especially if you're not going to coil tap. I swapped out the EMGs in my C-1 for these. Make sure they use the battery compartment for your ground since the EMGs don't use a ground wire.

The 59 is a nice sounding neck pickup. JB is rock in the bridge.

[Artur_I_Tis]

You don't have to wire up all the options on a four conductor. Just try them out with the switchs dangling then solder the one set up you like. Then put the switch back in the drawer, if you even bother to use a switch instead of just twisting and taping the wires for the test.

[Jef Bardsley]

Another vote for the JB/'59 combination in the Eclipse. Since that's ESP's alternate choice, I know they sound great as I've played a lot of them.

For the SG, you might try a pair of Pearly Gates. No, it won't sound the same, but it will sound better than the JB, IMHO. Nothing will make those two guitars sound the same, so I suggest making the SG sound as good as possible.

BTW, I love the P-Rails as humbuckers - just because you can coil tap them doesn't mean you have to. Then you'd always have the option of rewiring to get a P-90 sound.