TGP Sellers/Traders Frustration!! [Archive]

keepitblue

03-01-2010, 10:41 AM

Had some items up for sale/trade lately and it seem like the same thing keeps happening over and over. I put items up, they are in spotless like new condition. I describe them that way. Put a more then fair price (60%) of new or so. I'm open to trades. Plus cash, minus cash, multiple items, whatever. I've always had fun buying, selling and trading.

For the last two weeks all I get is the same bs. Usually one of three things happen.

Could you send me a pic? I say ok, send any pic they want. The unit has not a scratch, in box pic confirms that and they say thanks but Ill pass. Why did you want a pic in the first place?? I can see if its a guitar or something has a blem, the item has multiple versions ect. But if you know what it looks like and a pic confirms that... makes no sense to me. If you don't intend to buy if it is as described then why waste time?

Next I get trade offers. Work out a trade, I say ok. Lets do it. Here is my phone number, here is my ebay name, pics whatever and the say Ill pass. I'm like dude you offered the trade I agree to it and u flake out. again why waste time?

Then the worst one that keeps happening. I had a pedal that sold new for $299 Listed it for $175 to try to move it. Keep getting offers to trade even for pedals that sold for well under $200 new. I say I'll trade but I cant trade even because of the difference in value. The I either get no reply of some smart a$$ comment like oops I must have read your price wrong. I'm willing to move the item for $175 but i'm not trading for something that is $175 new. Give me a break. If one pedal was in poor condition, more desirable, outdated version, different color then people like, rare, on and on, I would understand.

If I offer a trade and everything is as described I will follow through. If all things are equal and you want 60% of new for yours, Ill value mine at 60% of new. You want to do 80% or 100% fine. If mine is worth 20 bucks more Ill trade even no prob. If someone says an item is as new I know what it looks like. If I request a pic it's only because I actually want to buy it if the pic confirms that. :bkw

Jon Silberman

03-01-2010, 10:55 AM

Be strong, keepitblue. Gird your loins before entering the fray of the marketplace. Whether you're selling a home, a car, or an amp, the expected ratio of curious to buyers is 10:1. Do not harangue it - embrace it!

MudPies

03-01-2010, 10:56 AM

Why don't sellers post a pic in every ad they post? That would avoid the looky-loos

Smakutus

03-01-2010, 10:58 AM

Put your stuff on eBay and sell them for more in 7 days and forget all this.

Jeff

Jon Silberman

03-01-2010, 10:58 AM

Why don't sellers post a pic in every ad they post? That would avoid the looky-loos

Bingo! P.S. I have no trouble selling stuff here. Reasonableness and patience goes a long way ...

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL1600/682310/17528220/272824927.jpg

IN MEMORY OF BONES

XKnight

03-01-2010, 10:59 AM

Life in the Emporiumz can be teh brutalz.

DonW

03-01-2010, 11:01 AM

I understand but Jon's post is right on. I've had to develop a stomach for gawkers and the half hearted. It usually works out successfully but the economic strains of the present make trading and lower value cash sales a bit more "adventuresome". In to the gauntlet we ride!:worried

PedalFreak

03-01-2010, 11:02 AM

Put your stuff on eBay and sell them for more in 7 days and forget all this.

Jeff

I always put stuff up in the emporium first, try to help out fellow musicians. All I ever get is low ball offers, and people complaining about price. I put it on ebay, sells quick and almost always WAY more than I had it in the emporium for.

I've come to the conclusion there are a lot of people that haven't a clue what items really sell for, or are just extremely cheap.

Jon Silberman

03-01-2010, 11:02 AM

I'd just like to add that I've made some friends just through the emporium, as both seller and potential buyer, through trading PMs, emails, thoughts, etc. If you look at the banter this way, it can not only actually be fun but a good salesman knows that today's tire-kicker could well be tomorrow's purchaser.

It's all about building relationships.

clothwiring

03-01-2010, 11:10 AM

I just want someone to sell me a Demeter Comp-1. How hard is that! :) lol

It's a tough road selling/trading gear, but I try to take it with a grain of salt and not be thrown about too much by potential sales/trades.

coreybox

03-01-2010, 11:10 AM

I put it on ebay, sells quick and almost always WAY more than I had it in the emporium for.

This surprises me all the time.

I'll have something in the emporiums for 2 weeks, almost no (serious) interest. Put it on eBay, and then in 7 days I have more (sometimes pretty significant 20-50%) than my asking price.

mtmartin71

03-01-2010, 11:16 AM

Add me to the list of those that feel TGP has become TCP (The Cheap Page). Seriously though, it does make sense that Ebay will get more interest and sell the product faster because its pool of buyers is absolutely enormous compared to here. TGP is a great deal for buyers but I think everyone is expecting better deals than Ebay so sellers can really get hosed on how much they get. I'm to the point of not selling here anymore and just looking for purchase deals. Even with Ebay and PayPal fees, I think you'll get better financial results selling your gear on Ebay and you have better seller protection. It's sad, because I like the TGP community, but it's getting old for me.

JZG

03-01-2010, 11:22 AM

Moving gear in the Emporium requires great patience. It will work given time. There are really good people here to deal with.

I think ebay's hotness rating has gone up because of the Bing Cashback program. Those BIN's look a lot better with an 8 - 10% rebate.

TubeeTuberton

03-01-2010, 11:30 AM

I have to agree. Without whining about it, because I love me TGP, the emporium is rough now days. I can put items in there for half of what they are worth new, and all of my gear, like most here, is mint. Boxes, papers, cloths, stickers, etc. The whole deal. Still all I get is offers that are $50 less than what I am asking or trades that aren't even close to the value pf what I am selling and then they do not want to add cash on their end at all. In fact suggesting so makes you seem like a jerk trying to profit. Of course everyone would like to profit but, from what I know of selling here, I never make any profit. I know that when I buy. I would just rather sell here, to people I know will get the most out of this equipment, than on eBay where it could be one of you guys or not. I have gladly even met a few members to make an exchange and found out just how awesome most of you are. It just sucks that the FLEAbay has to be an option.

ToneBrokerBill

03-01-2010, 11:37 AM

Yep, but it seems to me that this is a relatively recent development. I've had similar experiences, but it seems that things were much better even just a few months ago.

BBender

03-01-2010, 11:42 AM

+100 too much low ball BS going on in the emporium.

Add me to the list of those that feel TGP has become TCP (The Cheap Page). Seriously though, it does make sense that Ebay will get more interest and sell the product faster because its pool of buyers is absolutely enormous compared to here. TGP is a great deal for buyers but I think everyone is expecting better deals than Ebay so sellers can really get hosed on how much they get. I'm to the point of not selling here anymore and just looking for purchase deals. Even with Ebay and PayPal fees, I think you'll get better financial results selling your gear on Ebay and you have better seller protection. It's sad, because I like the TGP community, but it's getting old for me.

MudPies

03-01-2010, 11:56 AM

To those who complain about lowball offers, is it really that tough to say "No" or ignore them completely?

Secondly, do you expect your potential customer to make sure you make the money you want?

Jahn

03-01-2010, 11:57 AM

I keep stuff up for around 2 weeks on TGP first. No go? A week on eBay. No go? Consignment in the shops for a month. No go? Craigslist, but tell them to go to the shop where it's on consignment. Somewhere along the chain it ALWAYS moves for what I'm happy with.

TubeeTuberton

03-01-2010, 12:12 PM

To those who complain about lowball offers, is it really that tough to say "No" or ignore them completely?

Secondly, do you expect your potential customer to make sure you make the money you want?

You are right, however it feels like a waste of time to answer 4-5 PMs with extremely low-ball offers, which happens often. I'll even sell for a low-ball price depending on my mood. And I can speak of myself when I say I don't expect people to help me make money on the item. In fact, most of the time, I will try to provide a link showing the new value of the item for sale somewhere to compare with my item. Thinking that once they see how much I am losing already with the list price that they don't drop their offer another $30-$40. No hard feelings though, just venting in my case.

Degle

03-03-2010, 07:09 AM

I find that tire kickers on TGP or Ebay take up much less time than local ones. Answering a few PM's is nothing like having someone in your house. As such, I don't list my higher dollar items on Craigslist.

Yesterday, however, I had a local guy email me about an amp I had on Ebay. He was 'ready to buy' but wanted to hear the amp first, so I gave him my phone number.

He called and wanted to see it at lunch time, so I left work and drove home. He wanted to hear the amp with some NOS tubes I had in it, and then compare the sound to the new JJ's that I wanted to sell with the amp. We switched tubes around a couple times over a couple of hours, and he played loudly while I fielded work calls in my garage and my wife delayed putting the babies down for a nap.

By 2:00, I decided I wasn't making it back to work. The tire kicker decided he wanted my amp with the NOS tubes and we worked out a price. He was going to go to his credit union, then return later in the afternoon with the cash. I commenced to re-installing the old glass and I waited....

Luckily, I decided not to end my Ebay auction until cash was in hand as the tire kicker never came back. Later, I emailed him to see what happened. The guy returned my email, said he had some kind of family emergency and was sorry he didn't call back. He was still interested in the amp, but worried that he wouldn't be able to find NOS tubes in the future without searching the 4 corners of the earth. He asked for some info on where to buy NOS tubes and I sent him an email with links to the exact tubes I had in my amp that were for sale on KCA, and told him about some local NOS tube guys.......

I have not heard back from the guy (of course)...

Anyhow, this guy wasted an entire afternoon and evening for me and my family. This kind of nonsense never happens on the Emporium. I'll gladly answer a hundred questions, take gut shots, or whatever than have another local guy ruin my day.

Sorry for the long rant, but I am still steaming about this.

Pax

03-03-2010, 09:03 AM

To those who complain about lowball offers, is it really that tough to say "No" or ignore them completely?

Secondly, do you expect your potential customer to make sure you make the money you want?

+1

I know it can be frustrating, but this really doesn't even compare to a retail environment. I can't help but feel like your expectations are unrealistic. Like someone said above, "Embrace it". Do you really expect to make a sale w/o some hassle?

Axemeister

03-03-2010, 09:15 AM

I have made a few nice buys and trades in the Emporium, but I have had another issue recently.... I will call it emporium spam. The same buyer seems to be trying to trade a certain guitar for almost anything else, so I have gotten the same trade inquiry four times. It seems he is sending the same copied trade inquiry to multiple sellers every once in awhile. It is just like finding spam in your Gear Page mailbox when you have to decline a trade on the same guitar four different times within a month

monty

03-03-2010, 09:33 AM

My beef is with flakey sellers- I've had 3 "I'll take its" in the last 3 weeks just to never hear from the seller again:bonk

ripoffriffs

03-03-2010, 01:58 PM

Hey man, I don't think it is safe to let strangers in your house to try out gear. Too many potential problems there....

But all problems aside, Emporium deals are still way way better than the local Craiglist. In my experience, CL is truly the bottom feeder of society! I listed a Marshall DSL-50, and all I got were emails from kids (or complete novices that really don't know what a tube amp is) who had no idea how to work a tube amp. One guy claims that a mesa footswitch that I was including with the amp (the one where you can detach the cable) was not the same as the (stock) Marshall footswitch where the cable is permanently attached and he would have to spend money to get one.

Craiglist is much worse!

I find that tire kickers on TGP or Ebay take up much less time than local ones. Answering a few PM's is nothing like having someone in your house. As such, I don't list my higher dollar items on Craigslist.

kurtsstuff

03-03-2010, 02:06 PM

I no longer list anything in TGP emporiums...Way too much bullshit. I'd really like to but the few times I have...frickin nightmares...I have zero issues on other forums I buy and sell on and I buy and sell alot of gear....just not here :D

gpro34

03-03-2010, 02:09 PM

Musicians are a flaky lot.

musicofanatic5

03-03-2010, 02:55 PM

I joined this forum expressly for the purpose of gaining access to the emporium for selling. I have incurred most of the hassles enumerated above, and yes, it sucks, and can leave one with the impression that the on-line human race is an uncultured cretin (like when you put "SORRY, NO TRADES" like that in all caps, bold font and italics, and some bonehead writes, offering to trade some their Agile for your custom shop even...etc).

But to the contrary, dig the happy love fest going on at my current post:

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?p=7845370#post7845370

Such positivity, and maybe someone will actually buy the goddam thing, too! As I was heard to exclaim the last time I had a handful of psychedelic mushrooms coursing through my system: I love everyone!

RRfireblade

03-03-2010, 03:07 PM

Sheesh , another one of these. You know what ?

That's private online selling , if it's too much dang trouble then give it to charity and write it off. Or drop some big bones and get your own dang store front or a website and make all the rules you want. You can't have it both ways.

I buy and sell alot online , I get it all too. Big deal , 1/2 a second to click delete and move on. What , you rather put an ad in a local paper? Post it on a neighborhood board ? Word or mouth ? Yeah right. You wanna sell something ? Put up a dang pic or 2 in the first place. Duh.

Here's another thing I hate , "No Lowballers" : You know what , kiss my butt. You know how many people are dying to get any offer cause they really need the cash ? Plenty ! Plus whose to say what's a lowball , maybe your "vintage " , "reliced" , POS isn't really worth what you think it is. Get over it. Doesn't matter if you payed a grand , its worth what people are willing to spend on it and not a nickel more. If it's not selling and your getting "lowballs" your probably out of your mind in the first place. Its probably these same guys that piss on about lowballers and then post about the great deal they scored somewhere else. Any one of you guys ever paid MORE than the asking price cause you thought they weren't asking enough ? Yeah , that's what I thought.

Here's my biggest peave, people complaining about selling online or wherever where they get A HUNDRED or even a THOUSAND times the exposure they would get anywhere else , get to do from the cozy warmth of thier bedroom and FOR ABSOLUTELY FREE !

Deal with it or next time go stick a sign in your front yard next weekend and see how that works out for you.

*Disclaimer: This is not directed at anyone in particular , just consider it a somewhat of a rant. :)

Shnook

03-03-2010, 03:17 PM

I've been buying and selling on TGP for years, and so far no problems that would warrant me to write a 'vent thread.' If I'm looking to buy, I don't contact the seller unless I'm certain I want to purchase their item. I also don't offer less than their asking price. If I think a price it too much or out of my limit, I DON'T inquire about it.

When selling I always post pics that I'd want to see when buying online. I state clearly what my shipping/payment options are, and make NO TRADES known in the posting if I'm not interested in trades. A clear ad seems to cut down on lowballers and tire kickers.

korby

03-03-2010, 03:17 PM

:beerSheesh , another one of these. You know what ?

That's private online selling , if it's too much dang trouble then give it to charity and write it off. Or drop some big bones and get your own dang store front or a website and make all the rules you want. You can't have it both ways.

I buy and sell alot online , I get it all too. Big deal , 1/2 a second to click delete and move on. What , you rather put an ad in a local paper? Post it on a neighborhood board ? Word or mouth ? Yeah right. You wanna sell something ? Put up a dang pic or 2 in the first place. Duh.

Here's another thing I hate , "No Lowballers" : You know what , kiss my butt. You know how many people are dying to get any offer cause they really need the cash ? Plenty ! Plus whose to say what's a lowball , maybe your "vintage " , "reliced" , POS isn't really worth what you think it is. Get over it. Doesn't matter if you payed a grand , its worth what people are willing to spend on it and not a nickel more. If it's not selling and your getting "lowballs" your probably out of your mind in the first place. Its probably these same guys that piss on about lowballers and then post about the great deal they scored somewhere else. Any one of you guys ever paid MORE than the asking price cause you thought they weren't asking enough ? Yeah , that's what I thought.

Here's my biggest peave, people complaining about selling online or wherever where they get A HUNDRED or even a THOUSAND times the exposure they would get anywhere else , get to do from the cozy warmth of thier bedroom and FOR ABSOLUTELY FREE !

Deal with it or next time go stick a sign in your front yard next weekend and see how that works out for you.

*Disclaimer: This is not directed at anyone in particular , just consider it a somewhat of a rant. :)

Guitar Josh

03-03-2010, 03:42 PM

Let's define "lowball". An offer of 90% of your asking price is not a lowball. It may be less than you want to sell it for, but it's not a lowball. I think anything below 85% of asking is probably within lowball territory.

I have "lowballed" on occasion, but what I do is provide multiple links to back it up. "Hey, I really like this pedal, but you are asking $150. Here are a few ads from around the web where people are asking $120, would you match that?" At least then he has the information and can do with it what he will.

People here do need to respect things like "price is firm" or "no trades please". They also need to respect things like "CONUS only". None of these things are a debate, if that doesn't work for you as a buyer, move on. Time and again, I see people offering trades in threads that say "no trades" or complaining about the price.

The reality is that buyers and sellers can be strange. The delete button comes in handy when you don't feel like dealing with something.

RRfireblade

03-03-2010, 04:01 PM

Thats fine but what I'm saying is your talking about things like respect , honor and reasonability and your dealing in a land of crazy strangers from any and all parts world and expecting 'them' to live up to your standards. What's crazy is to expect even 50% of the people online to fall into that. Not to mention getting peeved if they don't. Don't remember who but someone said that 90% of the poeple online are the crazy people in your town that never leave thier house and you'd never talk to in person but here that have the same voice as anyone else. Something like that anyway.

There are no hard rules of debate here or most anywhere in regards to offers and negotiations and your not going to get that anywhere that allows your to sell your stuff for free without paying fees or commision.

You say no trades , I say I'll trade you my '59 LP for your LTD ESP. You taking that trade or kicking me out of your thread for asking ? I usually say no trades too , I had a kid once trade me an PRS CU24 for a paintball gun. Never saw that coming. Man was I pissed he asking me about that one. Wanna see a pic of how pissed I am playing that guitar ? :)

Anyways . . .

I'm mosty just sayin it's silly to get so bothered by such trivial nonsense when the alternative is a millions times worse. Be thankful a 1000 people a day see your 4 sale stuff and you can sell almost anything in like week at worst for pretty much what you want to get for it. Be thankfull there are a ton of places online allow it to happen for nothing more than page views.

Pretty good deal if ya ask me.

RRfireblade

03-03-2010, 04:04 PM

FYI , It's the green one on the right :

http://premium1.uploadit.org/rrfireblade/Music/PRStrio.jpg

Crowder

03-03-2010, 07:59 PM

The biggest inconvenience I've incurred in the Emporium is spending a ton to ship amps that I've re-sold to fellow board members. Yeah, I get stupid trade offers. But I've also gotten some great deals. Got to give a little to get a little.

During the last year, I've trial-owned all kinds of amps and effects by buying them here then selling them when I'm done. If it weren't for TGP I probably wouldn't have traded as much gear. Some might see that as a positive. :D

fusionbear

03-03-2010, 08:09 PM

It can be brutal sometimes, but I'm learning to be patient and not feel like I lost a deal when I say no to an offer...

I have had plenty of good deals over and beyond the "low-ball, tire kickers..."

musicofanatic5

03-03-2010, 08:15 PM

FYI , It's the green one on the right :

http://premium1.uploadit.org/rrfireblade/Music/PRStrio.jpg
I'd be happier with a good 22 fret paintball gun, but hey, I'm happy anyway!

RRfireblade

03-03-2010, 08:23 PM

I'd be happier with a good 22 fret paintball gun, but hey, I'm happy anyway!

Got anything to trade ? :D

pete692

03-03-2010, 08:41 PM

I've got to be honest, and really try not to jinx myself here, but I've had nothing but 100% positive results here on the TGP classifieds. And I was really skeptical for years about dealing with strangers, but ebay shenanigans really wore me down, and I really began to feel used whenever I listed a bunch of stuff on ebay, paid my listing fees, fielded a bunch of stupid questions from people in Italy, finally sold the stuff, gave Paypal their cut, and then at the end of the month get another 180.00 bill from Ebay. That's not to mention the whole buyer holding the seller and his money hostage while he tries out the pedal that he won from you before finally leaving a feedback after having the pedal for 5 days.

OldSchool

03-03-2010, 08:50 PM

I officially Tapped out of the Empouruim for the reasons you list above and more. The serious good sellers/Traders are just tapped out. Your getting people that want to steal it . And even then I agreed to deal that was clearly not in my favor just to move it......and they flake out. I traded my last guitar to a dealer for a great amp (dealer made money on me but at least he didn't flake) and I'm done. Finished. See ya in a few years when the economy improves and the children have grown up.

Crowder

03-03-2010, 09:24 PM

On second thought, I do have one minor quibble. I really wish sellers would make a point of giving their location. If an amp is available within driving distance, I'm much more interested. I have having to ask location.

sfarnell

03-03-2010, 10:25 PM

Things are tough in the emporium because things are tough everywhere. I'm not the most patient person but I try to deal with people the way I want to be dealt with. Some people disappoint, most don't. It's nice when people follow through or do what they say they're going to do and it sucks when they don't. That's life.

I usually list things for 60% of street price new. If it doesn't sell so be it. I can choose to reduce the price or keep the item because it's worth more to me than what I can get for it. I usually would just go out and buy something of comparable value to me and end up suffering one of those "gee, I wish I didn't let that one get away" moments.

For the most part the emporium rocks. I have had the opportunity to play so many guitars and amps that I would never have dreamed of playing before TGP. I just consider any money that I lose on deals as rental fees for the use of such cool gear.

Plague Dog

03-04-2010, 12:55 AM

Yeah, I had a trade + cash worked out with a very well respected TGP member... called several times but could never work out a time to get together to make the deal, next he quits answering my calls and doesn't return any calls... I don't know, maybe he got a deal where another buyer offered all cash. That I can understand, and if he had told me that was the deal I would have said, cool, all cash is always a great deal instead of a partial trade.
Recently he had another amp for sale in the emporium and I sent a PM to make an offer, never got a reply...

keepitblue

03-05-2010, 07:29 AM

Well I do feel my original post had some validity to it. I have been buying and selling on Ebay, Harmony Central for 10 years or so and TGP for a couple. I've bought and sold at least 50 boutique or vintage, over 100 boutique pedals, a few guitars and other guitar related Items. I know what it is like to be both the buyer and the seller and have know problem answering questions as I know I have them as a buyer.

For the last year or so I've been busy and too lazy to sell Items I no longer used. When I recently jumped back into the selling I noticed a definite change in the environment which was the reason for my post. I have zero problems with low ball offers but proposing a trade where you get 105% value for your Item and I get 60% for mine is just plain stupid and I would never do it. I would calculate 60% for each and offer the appropriate cash (again, if ALL other factors are equal). Just how I choose to do it. If I say I'll take it, ill send the dough. If I ask for a specific pic (certain gut shot of an amp, bottom of a pedal ect) It is because I would like to purchase the Item but I want to make absolutely sure It is as described. If I propose a trade and the other party accepts I'm excited to do it. Should everybody be like me? Hell no! It would be a scary world to live in. I do however feel like some people have absolutely no intent to buy some Items.

I am fortunate enough to have good income but I have felt the pinch like everyone else. Consequently I have had to put the clamps on my gear buying hobby. I spend about a tenth of the time on ebay that I used to and I rarely open the TGP Amp or pedal Emporiums that are saved on my favorites. Why, because I don't want to spend the money right now so I do something else. Play guitar, post dumb threads like this, work more ect. So I fully understand if gear does not sell or it sells for a lower price. Thats just the time tested rule of supply and demand. Economics 101. My theory and cause for frustration is that there seems to be a large group of people on the TGP emporium who have given up buying but can't give up the shopping. Consequently they collect the pictures, ask the questions, propose the trades, send the "ill take it", make deals for a good price ect. Everything but the purchase and it happened to me about twice a day for a week. thats why the post.

Same day I posted this thread I listed Items on ebay. Had a wah on tgp for $90 for a week answered 7 pm's. Sold on ebay in 12 hrs for $129 +$11 shipping. No questions. Had a set of pickups on tgp for a week (new Kinmans) for a week and had one trade offer for a set that was used and sold for $100 less new. Sold the Kinmans in a day for 20% more then I was asking on tgp. Also I DID end up selling a pedal ON TGP for $170 that cost me $299 new to a cool guy and we exchanged some pleasant pm's. I was very happy to sell it to him and I really hope he enjoys it! Guess there still is hope after all!!