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GMo
04-21-2005, 05:08 AM
Looking for some opinions on 4x12 cabs.What's your favorite new,or semi-new cab? Bogner,diezel,vibroworld,marshall, divided by 13,orange,germino,etc..?
I know most love old,late 60's marshall cabs,but a bit out of my price range.What gets the closest?Let's NOT worry about speakers,just the cab.

Also,is there actually a sonic difference with a ply back,as opossed to particle board?What about insulation inside cab?Did the old 60's marshall cabs have a 2"x2" board from baffle to back of cab,or was it more like a 2"x4"?

Also,any preferences between taller cabs,and standard size?(Were the early marshall cabs 3" taller,or 6" taller?I've heard people say both.)Pref in grill material(basket ,black ,pinstripe,etc..How does this effect the tone)

And last,11 ply,or 13ply (3/4")? Front loaded,rear loaded?Tonal differences?

Lots of questions! Thanks for any answers.:eek:

Matt Gordon
04-21-2005, 08:13 AM
Dimensions, cabinet stiffness, grill cloth, dampening material, all affect the sound, so there simply isn't a best, never will be. A fuzzy grill cloth will disperse the high freq's a little more. Bigger cabinets with center braces sound better to my ears as long as it's airtight. Voodoo is doing some cool stuff with their cabinets. Hard to beat a Mesa Standard with Greenbacks, or a Marshall 1960TV, two of my favorites, since they are the only two 4X12's I own. Long time ago I had Peavey Mace 4X12's that sounded great with the Mace head. I'd look at the joints and the ply [like you already mentioned] in addition to grill cloth of a few cabinets, and then make your decision based on your budget. But the speakers are going to play a huge role, so you cannot just discount that while looking, otherwise you'll not make an informed purchase. Sticking Celestion Classic Lead 80's in a Marshall TV style cabinet would produce a overly bassy cabinet. It all works together really.

rwe333
04-21-2005, 08:23 AM
Really like the new THD 4x12 - built-in beam blockers!

Other than that, a vintage Hiwatt w/ Fanes.

Johnny Raz
04-21-2005, 08:33 AM
If you're in Chicago - go to Make N Music -- they have a special Bogner 4x12 that will knock you on your butt with great tone!

Shawn Lutz
04-21-2005, 04:08 PM
My favorite two 4x12's are the Bogner 4x12 with V30's and the VHT fat bottom with P50E's. I like full, regular sized (Marshall) cabs. I bought my Bogner cab when looking at the Mesa 4x12's (good cab too) and found it for about the same price ad the rectos were going for used on eBay so it was a no brainer. I thought the cab was a bit over-hyped but I was pleasantly surprised that it really is a great cab, it sounds great with whatever amp I use it with too.

The VHT is of equal quality sound and construction wise. I just haven't tried it with any other amps, I put my VHT 50 CL on it and it hasn't moved since Perfect match for that amp in my opinion.


The Soldano 4x12 is the loser of the bunch, its not a bad sound cab its just that the other ones just sound much better. Also the Soldano cab is a little smaller too.

The 1960A is also a great cab and I leave it paired with the 2203

Here's the current set-up

http://shawnlutz.com/Guitarroom%20ss002.jpg

martins3325
04-21-2005, 04:26 PM
Just my 2 cents.. I think most everyone agrees old marshall 4x12 cabs rule ..and i dont think it was voodoo ..the knew what they were doing and had the right formula for a great sounding cab. I understand Mojotone did a tear down,spec'd one out and builds a dead to spec basketweave replica empty for $450 empty, if i wanted a new 4x12 thats the route id go..throw in some g12-h celestions and i bet it'd stomp the aformentioned brands..look at the internal construction of a Bogner compare it to a real basketweave ..doesnt even look close in my book

Braciola
04-21-2005, 04:36 PM
I'm patiently waiting for the new Marshall 1960BHW handwired series 4X12 loaded with the new Celestion G12H Heritage series speakers:dude



http://www.marshallamps.com/images/products/handw/images/1959.jpg

Ironman
04-21-2005, 09:34 PM
I've had a few 4x12's over the years to include Marshall's, Bogner, Rivera, Boogie, Peavey (5150) and VHT. My favorite 4x12 by far was a straight VHT with V30's on the bottom and Greenbacks on top that I had in the early 90's, before the P50 speakers. I sold it in a move and nothing has compared since. I had 2 very popular Bogner 4x12's, one V30 and the other Greenback loaded. They sounded nice but not magical like the VHT, damn that VHT sounded great! From classic rock to modern and everything in between it's been my favorite.

Steve

GMo
04-22-2005, 03:31 AM
Keep em comin! Thanks.

m1911
04-22-2005, 06:25 AM
I have been considering a Germino 4x12 Birch Ply Closed Back (with a removable middle back panel) Cab loaded with 4 Heritage Greenbacks for a while.
This is strictly based on "Want"...not "Need" however.
Cause everytime I carry the Z-Best 2x12 around....I'd hate to deal with a 4x12. Also...when I HEAR the Z-best....I quickly dismiss the 4x12 idea althogether.
Although it would be REALLY cool to have!
Mark

aortizjr
04-22-2005, 11:54 AM
I haven't tried a ton of brands, just because there aren't many stores around here.

But of 4x12's I have tried the Marshall 1960 series, Mesa Rectifier Cabs, Carvin Legacy, Behringer, Avatar (w/ V12, G12H80), Splawn (w/Governor, G12T75 clone), ENGL Vintage, and a handfull of not so popular ones.

I have to say that my favorite is torn between the ENGL Vintage and the Splawn. I only played the Splawn for a little while, but it was very balanced and just sounded great. The ENGL is more aggressive and works really well with the Vintage 30's.

But I have also heard nothing but good things about Splawn for all sorts of styles. Their cabs are incredibly well made and can be customized.

martins3325
04-22-2005, 01:36 PM
Im with Braciola, price not being a big object, I'd wait for the new Marshall 1960BHW handwired series 4X12 loaded with the new Celestion G12H Heritage series speakers. They absolutely Oooze cool..and the HW stuff is REALLY well made..and those new Celestions are supposed to absolutely kill! The question is when the come out can you buy a real vintage one for the same price? lol Actually i think they'll drive the old ones up in price though..the Lead & Bass 20 heads used to be able to be gotten for around a grand if you could find one..then they reissued it at $1750 and all of a sudden guys with old ones figure if a new one is worth $1750 my vintage one has got to be worth alot more than that.

GMo
04-22-2005, 09:20 PM
Has anyone listened for the difference in solid back,ply back,composite board back in a 4x12? Does it make any tonal difference?
What about insulation inside vs. no insulation?

Tall cabs,or regular size?

Front loaded ,rear loaded tonal differences?

Thanks.

enharmonic
04-23-2005, 09:03 AM
The 4x12's I have played and loved:

Harry Joyce/George Scholz
Orange
Old Mesa metal grille cab (not the recto cabs)
Vintage Hiwatt

The 4x12's that didn't get me there

Mesa Recto
Tone King Galaxy (open back 4x12...ungodly loud)
80's Marshall slant cab

The 4x12's I cannot wait to try

VHT
Wizard

6AM
04-24-2005, 06:53 PM
There's no such thing as the "best 4x12". All speakers accentuate different frequencies which can agree or disagree with your ear, your amp, or both.

I've tried a lot of cabs, and what I ended up doing was just getting a custom 4x12 from vibroworld.com and swapping a bunch of speakers until I found a combo I liked.

loudboy
04-24-2005, 08:54 PM
Whatever would be the closest to an old Marshall (pre-1975) 4x12. Those things rule, in every way.

BTW - What's the deal about a "handwired" Marshall 4x12, I would assume that they ALL are?

Loudboy

riverastoasters
04-24-2005, 11:14 PM
Originally posted by GMo
Looking for some opinions on 4x12 cabs.What's your favorite new,or semi-new cab?

My favorite 412 is two 212s.

martins3325
04-24-2005, 11:21 PM
Mojotone claims they totally spec'd out a 68 marshall 4x12 right down to the bracing..so id say probably that is closest right now..they run $450 empty so by the time you get killer speakers in it ..its kinda pricey. I agree "handwired" is kinda silly..i mean i didnt know robots did all the other cabs in the world..or maybe they were wired by their toes..lol.. But seriously, I had a 2061CX 2x12 Handwired..and the thing wasnt that it was "handwired" its that it was really well built ..lhad total vintage styling..and had good speakers. Now they are comming out with the old 4x12 reissue and it will be similarly well built, have no chipboard in them, oooze vintage look, and have --what is antipicaped to be the best pre-rola clone speakers available in them..that why the buzz.

pfrischmann
04-25-2005, 05:47 AM
Vintage Marshall 4x12
Ampeg v-4 cab with vintage Marshall speakers

A friend on this site told me just to suck it up and buy a vintage Marshall cab ('68 basketweave) It will only go up in value...so I did. There is nothing quite like it. I'm very suprised as to how much brighter the old 25's are compared to the new stuff. (in a good way)

IMHO.

haslar
04-25-2005, 07:15 AM
This week-end, I tried a Marshall 4x12" with G12 65s as well as my Marshall '75 4x12" with blackback G12Ms.

Tried that with a CAA OD100, Rivera M60, Orange Rockerverb, VHT CL 100.

The G12Ms sounded sweeter (esp. the top end), "silkier" and warmer. More suited to bluesy and classic rock stuff .
Impressive with the Rockerverb.

However, the G12 65s were great with the VHT for mid-scooped metal sounds.

My choice?

Blackbacks anyday.

Igneous
04-25-2005, 07:25 AM
After all ive seen- even boo-tique and vintage- the mesa has this hands down both in durability and tone.
just something about em. the totally smoke. I had a bogner with gb's that I paid twic as much for and it couldnt hold a candle to the quality of the mesa.

mtc-cheers-Ig:dude

Matt Gordon
04-25-2005, 07:25 AM
I think the term handwired refers to the amp, and the name is just attached to the matching speaker cabinets. I prefer to think of the new Marshall cabinets as 1960TV Heritage, to differentiate between it and the re-issue TV cabinet with Chinese greenbacks, though absent the different speakers, I'm not sure there is a difference between the two cabinets. Can anyone clarify?

Ironman
04-25-2005, 08:49 AM
Originally posted by Matt Gordon
I think the term handwired refers to the amp, and the name is just attached to the matching speaker cabinets. I prefer to think of the new Marshall cabinets as 1960TV Heritage, to differentiate between it and the re-issue TV cabinet with Chinese greenbacks, though absent the different speakers, I'm not sure there is a difference between the two cabinets. Can anyone clarify?

I thought they were standard size. Hey, I'm not sure either...but wow! If they're going to be the tall cabs I'll have to check them out. I hear that they are supposed to be loaded with the new Celestion G12H30 vintage Heritage speakers. The 55hz ones.
The 2x12 HW cab comes with the standard G12H30's though.

Steve

Matt Gordon
04-25-2005, 12:16 PM
They might be standard size Steve, as I often pontificate on these matters to spark conversation. Still, I think the Mojo loaded 4x12 with G12M's would be an ideal cabinet for my taste. I'm gassing for a closed back Mojo 2X12 Marshall style cab.

talpa
01-01-2010, 06:37 PM
What are your opinions on the better/best 4x12's now being made....like the OP said, leaving speakers out of the discussion.:bumpbump

small axe
01-01-2010, 06:43 PM
i would recommend a bogner or an older marshall

StratTone
01-01-2010, 06:44 PM
Best 4x12 to me can't be bought. (that I know of) A Pine sides cab with ply front and back sounds the best.

gearjim
12-10-2012, 11:06 AM
I just got a used Marshall MF400a cabinet. It has FOUR Celestion G12-K100s. It sounds pretty awesome. Its got my vote. It s bigger than a 1960 cab and not as "midrangey" as V-30s.

Sirloin
12-10-2012, 11:16 AM
Vintage 4x12???

Germino
Stone Age
Metro
ScumBack
Mojotone

sleewell
12-10-2012, 11:27 AM
mako. good luck getting one though. bwahahahahaha

movingpictures
12-10-2012, 11:48 AM
I picked up a used Splawn 4x12 on CL, and its great. Emi Mon o war/ guv in an x pattern.

rburkard
12-10-2012, 02:26 PM
None of the 4x12 cabs sound as good as a 3rd Power 3x12. These cabs have a much better soundspread without noticable beam and without these nasty phase cancellations that all 4x112 cabs have.
Rene

TJSmitty
12-10-2012, 02:51 PM
Janice Cabs 4x12.
http://www.janicecabs.com/product/custom-guitar-cabinets/4x12-guitar-cabinet/
"Designing the guitar cab product line was an extensive process of trial and error. I spent three years not only trying to design the perfect cab, but also testing different speaker combinations, to discover which kinds were compatible with others. All the while, I knew that the end result had to provide different options to different players, in different sound situations. This understanding led to me to the decision to install an easily removable backboard on each cab. The use of the two piece back allows for a tight, direct, and punchy tone, while removing it gives the cab a “room-filling,” clean, tone presence. Like many of our guitar cabs, it is over sized so you get the extremely rich tone everyone is looking for.

This vertical, 4×12, tilt-back guitar cab is especially unique. This model was used as the basic template for the rest of the guitar cab product line. I really wanted to build an oversized 4×12, that was easy to transport. The tilt-back style allows for ease in transit in and out of a trailer, or into a venue. We also construct these with variable-spaced dovetailing that spans the entire 45 degree angle of the cab. you will not find this feature as a standard on any other guitar or bass cab."

Braciola
12-11-2012, 09:56 AM
Thread resurrected from 2005 :eek:

guitarvc
12-11-2012, 01:12 PM
I like the Stone Age 4x12, and all his other cabs. I have had a Bogner 4x12 and Soldano 4x12, as well as an old Marshall. The Soldano Sounded best with the SLO I had. I put my SLO on the Bogner and it had too much bass. The Bogner cab sounded great with my Shiva. The Marshall cab sounded best with an old Marshall I had. The Stone age seems to sounded great with everything. I think it depends on the way the amp is voiced for the best cab answer

StratStringSlinger
04-08-2013, 06:53 PM
Resurrecting this thread one more time. Between Germino, Metro & Mojotone, which ones sounds most like/constructed like a real 60's Marshall cab? Thanks.

woof*
04-08-2013, 07:17 PM
I like both my Mojo from 2004 and the newer reissue Marshall tall cab.
Both sound good with blackbacks in them.

fusionbear
04-08-2013, 07:26 PM
I have owned a ton (literally!) of 4x12's I can't say one is best, but my favs are:

Vintage: Scumback , germino

Semi-vintage: CAE

Modern: Diezel front loaded (I loved this one with my Carol-Ann OD2

Braciola
05-29-2013, 08:22 PM
StoneAge - notin mo betta :bow

CheeseGrater
05-30-2013, 01:01 PM
I picked up a used Splawn 4x12 on CL, and its great. Emi Mon o war/ guv in an x pattern.

I also got a splawn 4x12 off CL recently. It's got the Eminence Big Blocks. The cab has huge low end. Pretty darn thumpy overall. I haven't owned a bunch of high end cabs before, but i'm very satisfied with the splawn.

DonaldDemon
05-30-2013, 02:34 PM
I had a Bogner Classic w/ V30's that was amazing with any amp. When I got my Splawn Pro Mod I decided to sell it because I could get a new Splawn 4x12 for the same price the used Bogner sold for. The Splawn cab sounds better with that amp (V30s not the best choice w/ Splawn amps) and the two fit together perfectly but that Bogner sounded GREAT.

stratzrus
05-30-2013, 02:52 PM
For a while there was a lot of talk about the Mills Acoustics Afterburner 4x12. Has anyone tried these and if so, what's the verdict?

Classic09
05-30-2013, 03:34 PM
I've had a handful of cabs and used a number of others. My favourite is easily the Bogner 4x12. I have a 1980's Marshall cab that sounds great with V30s and the old white 25th Anniversary Marshall cab from 1997 was also great. I've had 2 modern Marshall cabs that sounded pretty poor to my ears.

I've got a Cornford 4x12 that is really good, too.

TubeStack
06-06-2013, 10:41 AM
For me, Marshall 1960BX

papersoul
07-19-2013, 09:09 PM
The best cab I have used is a Splawn 412!!!!

TubeStack
07-19-2013, 09:16 PM
Marshall 1960BX or 425B. Straight cabs rule. :)

TubeStack
07-19-2013, 09:17 PM
Ha, I see I already replied. At least I'm consistent. :D

guitarjazz
07-19-2013, 09:23 PM
West, good enough for Mark Farner good enough for me. Heaviest damn thing. Sunk my dad's station wagon to the ground.

geek-mo
07-19-2013, 09:25 PM
The best 4x12 will be the one I build from solid pine with a birch plywood baffle in front and an open back. It will be loaded with Hellatone 30s and Celestion Alnico Golds in an X pattern. This time, though, I'm buying the Golds broken in from Avatar. Those speakers take a long time to soften up!

pvlcassic30
07-19-2013, 10:41 PM
http://www.janicecabs.com/guitar-cabs/
These guys are pretty cool. I know a guy that plays through them. Sound great...quality build.

papersoul
12-23-2013, 02:32 PM
Why all slant cabs? I have always preferred straight cabs. What do you like about the slant cabs?
What year is your 1960A cab and is it stock with T-75s?

My favorite two 4x12's are the Bogner 4x12 with V30's and the VHT fat bottom with P50E's. I like full, regular sized (Marshall) cabs. I bought my Bogner cab when looking at the Mesa 4x12's (good cab too) and found it for about the same price ad the rectos were going for used on eBay so it was a no brainer. I thought the cab was a bit over-hyped but I was pleasantly surprised that it really is a great cab, it sounds great with whatever amp I use it with too.

The VHT is of equal quality sound and construction wise. I just haven't tried it with any other amps, I put my VHT 50 CL on it and it hasn't moved since Perfect match for that amp in my opinion.


The Soldano 4x12 is the loser of the bunch, its not a bad sound cab its just that the other ones just sound much better. Also the Soldano cab is a little smaller too.

The 1960A is also a great cab and I leave it paired with the 2203

Here's the current set-up

http://shawnlutz.com/Guitarroom%20ss002.jpg

cardinal
12-23-2013, 05:06 PM
^ I can't answer for him, but I like slants too. They seem to throw the sound around more evenly and give me a more honest representation of what everyone else is hearing.

Straight cabs seem to have more thump and are darker, but it's not like they magically eliminate the high end content coming off the speakers. They just redirect it away from the player. Plus turning a slant on its side gives approximately the same thing but is less directional.

Just my thoughts on the debate.

rummy
12-23-2013, 05:13 PM
I like Stagecraft cabs.

sixstringeral
12-23-2013, 05:45 PM
Bogner 4x12 w/ Vintage 30's…pending which amp, but this cab is far superior to most I've tried

papersoul
12-24-2013, 10:18 AM
^ I can't answer for him, but I like slants too. They seem to throw the sound around more evenly and give me a more honest representation of what everyone else is hearing.

Straight cabs seem to have more thump and are darker, but it's not like they magically eliminate the high end content coming off the speakers. They just redirect it away from the player. Plus turning a slant on its side gives approximately the same thing but is less directional.

Just my thoughts on the debate.

My next cab may be a slant. All mine are straight.

Maybe a Marshall, Mesa or Stage Craft....

Since I have a Stone Age 212 with V30/K100 possibly changing to Creambacks, a V30 Bogner and Splawn with Lynchbacks/Greenies, may do a Bogner slant 412 with V30s. :) If I am not playing out much......212 cabs may suffice. I prefer my Splawn with Greenbacks over all other cabs...they are just really thick, chewy and warm!

dwoverdrive
01-01-2014, 02:51 PM
I have a Bogner XTC 101B that I play through a straight recto cab with V30s. I want a Bogner cab after hearing about them. I'm intrigued with Stoneage and wonder how the two stack up

AXEnGEAR4J
01-01-2014, 08:44 PM
But so much has to do with which "AMP" will be used....

Cleet Mongaire
01-01-2014, 09:42 PM
I'm a tweed champ and tweed deluxe kine' o' hombre' but when I want to get loud, lowdown, and vegas redhead hooker style dirty I get my grunge on with a 2204 and a 1960B cab with 25w greenie's. It's a great rig for overcoming a lack of talent with wattage.

AXEnGEAR4J
01-02-2014, 10:30 AM
I'm a tweed champ and tweed deluxe kine' o' hombre' but when I want to get loud, lowdown, and vegas redhead hooker style dirty I get my grunge on with a 2204 and a 1960B cab with 25w greenie's. It's a great rig for overcoming a lack of talent with wattage.


Now we're talkin!

Even with talent.... ;)

MGSchindel
01-02-2014, 11:42 AM
I like the Stone Age 4x12, and all his other cabs. I have had a Bogner 4x12 and Soldano 4x12, as well as an old Marshall. The Soldano Sounded best with the SLO I had. I put my SLO on the Bogner and it had too much bass. The Bogner cab sounded great with my Shiva. The Marshall cab sounded best with an old Marshall I had. The Stone age seems to sounded great with everything. I think it depends on the way the amp is voiced for the best cab answer

This. I've had/still mostly have 'em all, and for me it's StoneAge for the win.

This is why:

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/showthread.php?p=16984017#post16984017

wickland111
04-19-2014, 09:31 PM
How would a Mesa Recto 412 cab sound vs a 100 watt Marshall TV 412?

I currently have the mesa and it has been an amazing cabinet, but have been thinking about venturing out of the v30 range. I play a couple Gibson R0s into a Zinky Mofo head.

Any suggestions?

Adamclayton
05-22-2014, 03:14 AM
I don't think there is no "Best 4x12 cab". Maybe a cab that sounds best to you, and that depends on what amp your using. My Bogner 20th Shiva sounds best to me with my Bogner V30 2x12 and I demo'd about every cab in Nashville that weekend.

Now to my surprise, I have a Splawn 4x12 with Small Block speakers (greenback style), and I bought it after having my Quick Rod for awhile and not liking V30's with it or any cab I used with it, until I demo'd a Splawn 4x12 in the Platinum Room at GC in Nashville. Man it made the Quick Rod just sound perfect with the best balance of punchy highs-mids-lows. So of course I naturally called Splawn and ordered one cause it's way cheaper than paying TN tax and GC prices. But now I'm liking the Bogner amp better with the Splawn.
I've demo'd almost 100's of boutique and big name cabs when I worked for WGS, and I can say that a Splawn 4x12 w/Small Blocks is one of the best cabs I've owned or played ever. But if I had to choose only to own one cab for the rest of my life it would be a vintage 60's Marshall 4x12 check cloth with Greenies.

m1911
05-22-2014, 06:23 AM
Since this thread began, we finally ordered and took delivery of these two Germino Open-Back 4x12's.
I won't speak directly for Greg, but he was almost shocked hearing how good these sound. He said they were as nice of any 4x12's he's ever heard.
We like them.....the wheels are actually more convenient than carrying a 2x12.

http://images53.fotki.com/v1502/photos/5/3236655/12798731/MontereyOutside11-vi.jpghttp://images14.fotki.com/v1625/photos/5/3236655/12798731/MontereyOustide42-vi.jpg

drewl
05-22-2014, 08:53 AM
Old thread is old.

Marshall bottom "Bass" cabs with G12H30's are the best.

There was a vote.