Tokai experts - is this legit?

[jzucker]

http://cgi.ebay.com/1983-Tokai-Love-Rock-LS-flametop-made-Japan-/120637411985?pt=Guitar&hash=item1c168cd291

[jzucker]

bump

[GuitarTone]

How does the serial number check out, Jack?

Looks legit to me, but I'm no expert on the old Tokais, I'm sure the guys at the Registry will be able to help you out.

Looks cool at a nice price.

[JaySwear]

looks great! the only thing that would worry me is that the seller left out a picture of the headstock front. kind of a strange thing to forget to include a picture of. otherwise that thing is definitely a looker.

[jzucker]

hmm...Thanks for the advice. I can't log into the registry anymore for some reason.

[Jungle Face Jake]

Looks legit but as mentioned I'd want to see a picture of the front of the headstock first. The '79-'85 Love Rock's are great LP's. The specs in '85 were a bit over the place and you can get LS60's with higher grade p/ups and tops which seems a bit odd that this is an '83 and has LS80 spec p/ups and top. As mentioned the Tokai Registry is the best place to go.

[jzucker]

unfortunately, I can't login to tokai registry to ask.

[Jungle Face Jake]

I'm not a total expert on these (I do own an '85 LS80) but it looks right to me. An easy way to tell an LS60 is that it doesn't have fret edge binding which is an LS80 and above feature. The specs did vary slightly, particularly in '85 so it's feasible that an '83 would have these p/ups. Also there seem to be quite a few LS60's with flame top, but it's not a solid top but a veneer. Also an LS60 will have a two piece back and poly finish rather than one piece and nitro which is an LS80 and above feature. It's a good guitar at this price. I'd try to ask the seller if you can see the front of the headstock.

[JMP99]

Those Japanese LPs have really caught on I see!

[jzucker]

here's a picture he sent me of the headstock

http://www.jackzucker.com/images/tokaiheadstock.jpg

[Jungle Face Jake]

The headstock looks right apart from the truss rod cover which isn't original - but he says that in the copy. If you want an original Love Rock it would be worth going for IMO. The old pre-lawsuit ones are way better than the new ones.

[hank]

The headstock looks right apart from the truss rod cover which isn't original - but he says that in the copy. If you want an original Love Rock it would be worth going for IMO. The old pre-lawsuit ones are way better than the new ones.

Having owned a ton of old Tokais and several new ones, I'd say that the new Japanese Tokais (LS150 and up) are spectacular. The new ones are not "lesser" guitars.

For me, the Golden Era is '78 through '83. Lots of transitioning between '84 to '85 .... changes in specs.

[jzucker]

bought it. Unfortunately, the neck is horrible. It's got a bad twist and needs a planing and refretting. I love ebay

[jzucker]

forgot to mention. Shipped without a case. A les paul in bubble wrap in a box. Nice...

[GuitarTone]

Surely you should have asked whether it comes with a case or not..that's not eBay's fault, Jack, it's yours?

Did the seller mention the condition of the neck, did you ask him?

[mark norwine]

I'm just awed that we're now questioning the authenticity of copies....

Strange times.

[hank57]

I once got an SG or a Melody Maker from Japan in a box with bubble wrap. I knew it was coming that way. Great condition on arrival.

List says neck straight, I'd protest this inaccuracy!

[KCWM]

forgot to mention. Shipped without a case. A les paul in bubble wrap in a box. Nice...

Truth be told, it does mention:

The guitar will be carefully double boxed, styrofoam padded and bubble wrapped for shipment.
While a case would have been nice, there was no mention of one, so I can't really fault the sender there by default.

The neck, on the other hand, is a different story.

[jzucker]

Surely you should have asked whether it comes with a case or not..that's not eBay's fault, Jack, it's yours?

Did the seller mention the condition of the neck, did you ask him?

I didn't say it was ebay's fault but



I'd never ship a Les Paul without a case
I'd disclose if an instrument had a bad enough twist to need a planing / refert
This is why I always use paypal backed with amex, so I don't have to worry about folks forgetting to disclose stuff.

[Aran]

I'm not trying to flame but are you worried about a fake of a copy?

[jzucker]

I'm not trying to flame but are you worried about a fake of a copy?

No, at this point i'm worried that it may need a neck reset, planing and refretting. I'm asking ebay for a refund.

[GuitarTone]

I'm not trying to flame but are you worried about a fake of a copy?

BORING!!!!!!!!!!!

[jzucker]

I'm not trying to flame but are you worried about a fake of a copy?

oh, duh. I didn't realize you were taking a jab.

[GuitarTone]

I'd never ship a Les Paul without a case



Only my Premium Series models come in cases.
I've received about 270 Love Rocks in boxes, from Japan to SAfrica...not one problem.
I mail them all over the country in boxes, as far as Cape Town 1600 klm from where I live, also not one problem.

Pretty upsetting that it came with a screwed up neck, get your money back and buy a 2010 model, they're just as good as the "old ones".

[jzucker]

Only my Premium Series models come in cases.
I've received about 270 Love Rocks in boxes, from Japan to SAfrica...not one problem.
I mail them all over the country in boxes, as far as Cape Town 1600 klm from where I live, also not one problem.

Pretty upsetting that it came with a screwed up neck, get your money back and buy a 2010 model, they're just as good as the "old ones".

I like the vibe of the old ones. I'll just look for another.

[Aran]

No, at this point i'm worried that it may need a neck reset, planing and refretting. I'm asking ebay for a refund.

That makes more sense.

I'd ask for a refund if you can get it.

[Aran]

oh, duh. I didn't realize you were taking a jab.

Nope otherwise I would have been more of a smart ass.

I think people tend to infer a lot guesses to what people write on forums sometimes. My question was straight up. Which is why I prefixed it with, "I'm not trying to flame".

[jzucker]

Nope otherwise I would have been more of a smart ass.

I think people tend to infer a lot guesses to what people write on forums sometimes. My question was straight up. Which is why I prefixed it with, "I'm not trying to flame".

Well, yes i was trying to authenticate a copy in the original posting. Tokai's copies are so good that often times they are better than the original and now chinese copies of the tokais are showing up on ebay.

[GuitarTone]

Well, yes i was trying to authenticate a copy in the original posting. Tokai's copies are so good that often times they are better than the original and now chinese copies of the tokais are showing up on ebay.

Let's correct the terminology being used here.

Tokai make replicas/copies of 50s and 60s Gibsons, with the Tokai decal on the headstock.
A fake is a guitar that is not made by Gibson but has the Gibson decal on the headstock.

There are Korean made Tokais that are fakes because they were not made by Tokai but have the Tokai name/decal on the headstock.

[jzucker]

Let's correct the terminology being used here.

Tokai make replicas/copies of 50s and 60s Gibsons, with the Tokai decal on the headstock.
A fake is a guitar that is not made by Gibson but has the Gibson decal on the headstock.

There are Korean made Tokais that are fakes because they were not made by Tokai but have the Tokai name/decal on the headstock.

Let's correct something else. If it's a replica of a gibson made by a company in asia it's sleazy. If it's a replica of a fender or dumble and made in the US, it's cool. :D

[Aran]

Let's correct something else. If it's a replica of a gibson made by a company in asia it's sleazy. If it's a replica of a fender or dumble and made in the US, it's cool. :D

After reading the rest of your comments I did get the point. I do apologize for not reading it all in the first place but I wasn't trying to be mean. What I initially got from your post was something other than you meant.

Did you get a refund? Hope it works for you.

[GuitarTone]

Let's correct something else. If it's a replica of a gibson made by a company in asia it's sleazy. If it's a replica of a fender or dumble and made in the US, it's cool. :D

:D..excellent.