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View Full Version : Gretsch .vs. Duesenberg


AJBoy238
12-21-2010, 07:51 AM
Anybody own or play these side by side? Seems like alot of the Gretsch players are moving onto Doozys, I'm curious what the pros and cons are.

chequepoint
12-21-2010, 08:14 AM
Doozy is throwing around endorsement cash and free guitars. They're korean guitars "assembled" in Germany.

Modern Gretsch guitars are some of the best that they've ever made. Fender isn't being as aggressive with the artist program for these because they don't have to be.

Loki
12-21-2010, 08:57 AM
I could speak for the Doozys :) On a long search for my new work-horse i went over fender strats & teles, thinlines, Gibson Semis and LP, Gretsch Semi and finally i put my hands on a Duesenberg. For me it's a dream made of wood.

I play a 49er (having a bit more versatility) but it is a great guitar with some kind of "special" sound. Great playability and not so over-techd with all those little features like the new Fender S1-Switch - purism at its best.

SKYHIGH
12-21-2010, 08:58 AM
Trend. Especially amongst worship players (Wroship player my self). IT kind of bothers me a bit to see the worship players hop from on guitar to another depending on who's playing what.

whaiyun
12-21-2010, 09:15 AM
Trend. Especially amongst worship players (Wroship player my self). IT kind of bothers me a bit to see the worship players hop from on guitar to another depending on who's playing what.

Cuz Droff is teh bombz. =D

chequepoint
12-21-2010, 09:27 AM
Trend. Especially amongst worship players (Wroship player my self). IT kind of bothers me a bit to see the worship players hop from on guitar to another depending on who's playing what.

Which is why they're throwing around the endorsement cash.

Nork
12-21-2010, 11:57 AM
Trend. Especially amongst worship players (Wroship player my self). IT kind of bothers me a bit to see the worship players hop from on guitar to another depending on who's playing what.

that mentality is in everything, though. amps, pedals, guitars, clothes, cars, etc it's how people are wired.

i'd love to play one, but if it wasn't right for me, it would go.

frisco kid
12-21-2010, 02:48 PM
The Duesy's are much more reasonable in Europe so it has to be markup from the distributor raising the price here in the USA. IMO, it's a bad business model...If these guitars were priced similarly to the Reverend Pete Anderson model, they'd sell a ton. What they lost in margin would be made up in volume. I've owned three models and liked them but in the end felt a bit foolish for paying so much for a Korean built guitar. If more folks knew about that, I doubt they could charge the prices they do. To dispel any doubt of the Korean bodies, here are the articles from Guitarist Magazine affiliates that clearly state Korean bodies...also note the EU prices round out to about $1500-1600 US for a Starplayer TV starting at $2200-2300 here in the states.

http://www.duesenberg.de/duesenberg/image/test/2007/MusicMart_0807.pdf

http://www.musicradar.com/gear/all/guitars/electric/6-string-solid-body/pomona-6-199442/review

IAE
12-21-2010, 03:13 PM
I like the DC Duesenberg dragster, in red of course!

52ftbuddha
12-21-2010, 03:25 PM
The Duesenberg must be a Euro thing, they do nothing for me. Silly shapes borrowed from other designs, and little in the way inovation or history. Mass produced third world tat at a premium price. Reminds me of Burns, well with less history that is.

IAE
12-21-2010, 03:31 PM
Yeah, that does suck about them for sure! (manufacture/price)
I like the DC shapes though as I'm a sucker for symmetrical DC guitars.

jrjones
12-21-2010, 04:25 PM
Doozy is throwing around endorsement cash and free guitars. They're korean guitars "assembled" in Germany.


Best news I've heard all day. I've been wanting a good semi-hollowbody. I'm going to start looking into that now. You're right, korean made, assembled in Germany, and stupid high prices. I've had no trouble landing a couple other endorsements...if I get endorsed, I'll sig it :)

Alistair6
12-21-2010, 04:32 PM
i had no idea they were made overseas.. totally thought they were made totally in germany.. ive played a few and although the workmanship was pretty amazing they didnt do much for me tone wise.. found them pretty flat sounding

Catoogie
12-21-2010, 04:32 PM
I played one and was HIGHLY unimpressed. I thought it was dull and lifeless and didn't feel that great. I was sorta bummed cause I wanted to like it but there was nothing about it's tone or feel I found attractive.

beNsteR
12-21-2010, 07:29 PM
these were the 'in' or 'coolest' guitars of early-mid 2010 over here where i come from.

folks bought them (for the same price as a USA les paul or MIJ Gretsch) and raved about how great a deal they were for a 'German handmade' guitar.

soon after lots of used ones appeared in the local classifieds :hide2

skintknuckle
12-21-2010, 07:39 PM
Doozy = Great workmanship, wide range of sounds (neck humbucker to strat tones to P90 bridge type), very handsome and well setup "bigsby" style trem. The 12" neck radius on a 25.5" scale guitar is a bit different than other guitars. I believe most Gretsch's are 12" radius also but 24.75" scale. Old Gretsch's are very cool and I'm still on a search for one but I have not found one yet that I would trade for my Doozy.

edgie
12-21-2010, 08:25 PM
+1 to Benster's post. Exactly my thoughts.

I haven't tried one yet but I must admit I dig how they look like. But the price tag is just too much for a Korean-made guitar. Not that I have something against Korean craftsmanship, in fact, I think they have improved by a great margin over the past few years. I can't help but compare their guitars to Joe Naylor's Reverends since they seem to have the same business model. The difference is Joe has the common sense when he priced his guitars. Yes, they are located at different parts of the world so the currency, standard of living, etc. maybe playing a large part to both brands' pricing but the margin is just way too much even if we consider these factors. Here in our area I could almost buy 3 reverends for the price of 1 Doozy.

I think Joe has proven that no matter where the guitar is made, as long as it's done by skilled people that's backed up by an efficient QC, great guitars are possible to obtain at very reasonable prices.

HerrRentz
12-21-2010, 08:40 PM
I didn't know they were made in Asia either. Like many others I thought it was a German made guitar.

I guess I'll keep shopping. That was to be my next purchase after the first of the year, but I guess I'll start looking at the Ricks again. I'm not paying that much for a Korean made guitar.

I was thinking about the Mike Campbell signature model.

AustinIsPresent
12-21-2010, 09:04 PM
I want one. I want one bad.

But even when I thought they were made in Germany, I was NOT about to drop upwards of $2,000 on one. I'd rather buy a Rick for the money; I know I'll always love one of those.

Zelja
12-21-2010, 09:15 PM
I wish that info about Deusenberg's being made in Korea would spread like fire, and folks would spout off more about how uninspiring they are, because I'd love for the price to come down enough that I could own three of the models I've been trying for the last year or so (Double Cat w/ benders, Carl Carlton, & Starplayer). I think they borrow the best traits of old & new designs and have a unique look, sound, & feel, plus they're dead sexy.

Yeah, agree. I have a Double Cat 12 in sunburst which I got used but in perfect nick for AUD$1075. Definately worth the money, regardless of where it's come from & would shell out the same & maybe more for another Doozy which satisfied me in the same way.

frisco kid
12-21-2010, 09:31 PM
Would you pay more than double for what you got the Double Cat for?
That's about how much you'd have to give for a new one here in the States.
For a grand I'd be back in the Doozy market myself...


Yeah, agree. I have a Double Cat 12 in sunburst which I got used but in perfect nick for AUD$1075. Definately worth the money, regardless of where it's come from & would shell out the same & maybe more for another Doozy which satisfied me in the same way.

beNsteR
12-21-2010, 09:32 PM
imho.. witholding the true country of origin when marketing a guitar shouldn't be allowed. at the very least it's dodgy behaviour :mob

the folks in my country are very particular about the country of origin. those who bought one (i personally know a couple) were really peeved when they found out they weren't German made..

52ftbuddha
12-21-2010, 09:38 PM
The only market this product works in is those with high import duty on US made guitars. Buy a Ric not a bad copy, they are on the order of the Korean Gretsch not bad but not worth the >2k they are asking.

Zelja
12-21-2010, 10:31 PM
Would you pay more than double for what you got the Double Cat for?
That's about how much you'd have to give for a new one here in the States.
For a grand I'd be back in the Doozy market myself...

More than double, probably not as I can't justify any 12 string for that amount. If the 12 was the cornerstone of my sound I just might. I was responding to GA20Ts post hoping for a drop in their price so I could get me some more guitars as well. I know I got a deal on mine (list price was $3600). It just seems that for a grand or more you can buy worse guitars than the one I did. I think people look at country of origin and make decisions based on a guitars worth rather than how good the actual guitar is.

The only market this product works in is those with high import duty on US made guitars. Buy a Ric not a bad copy, they are on the order of the Korean Gretsch not bad but not worth the >2k they are asking.

"Bad Copy" seems a tad harsh. I can't get along with Rics as the necks are way too narrow. I had a Ric 6 string which I sold a couple of years ago. The Doozy (that I have) is a better guitar than that Ric I had in every way. It's also better than the 70s Gretsch Rocjet I sold & much better made than the 70s tele deluxe I had (dug the sound of that but neck way too skinny again). Yes, they probably are overpriced, but they are not alone in that department...

Joe F
12-21-2010, 10:33 PM
>>Modern Gretsch guitars are some of the best that they've ever made

+1. No experience with D.

SKYHIGH
12-21-2010, 10:45 PM
We should send the link to this thread to the Mr. Dusenberg him self.:D

I gotta say, they do look cool. It's just...

beNsteR
12-21-2010, 11:09 PM
'Duesenberg Guitars is a German (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Germany) company producing high-end electric guitars (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Electric_guitars) and basses (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Bass_guitar) with a distinctive Art Deco (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Art_Deco) design since 1986[1] (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/#cite_note-history-0). The company's name alludes to the legendary car company Duesenberg (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Duesenberg).
All models are built in the Duesenberg factory in Hannover (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Hannover); all hardware, including the single-coil (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Single-coil)/vintage, P-90 (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/P-90) and humbucking (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Humbucker) pickups (http://www.thegearpage.net/wiki/Pick_up_(music_technology)), are designed in-house.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duesenberg_Guitars

:huh:dunno:huh

Chicago Slim
12-22-2010, 05:32 AM
Zelja, how are the Duesenberg necks?

I could never bond with my Gretsch guitar's, due to the thin necks. I'm currently playing MIK PRS SE's, with Retrotrons. They not only sound like a Gretsch, they sound like Gretsch hollow-bodies. My American PRSi sound close, with the same pickups. But, not really the same. The PRS necks, just work better for me than anything else I've tried. I would have never thought, that $600 MIK guitar would turn out to be my dream guitar.

http://pic70.picturetrail.com:80/VOL1887/11966943/21271517/388878691.jpg

melven62
12-22-2010, 06:05 AM
I have doozy and I LOVE IT! It sounds killer. I had a Duo Jet before I got this and I definitely play the doozy more. I just did some recording and my starplayer through my ac15 pretty cranked sounded sweet. I would like to get a reverend with rev'trons though, (flatroc or clubking).

tartanphantom
12-22-2010, 09:29 AM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duesenberg_Guitars

:huh:dunno:huh

Not sure if the info at Wiki is true, but these days I hold Wikipedia to be about as credible as Nancy Pelosi. And I wouldn't trust her to properly clean a catbox without charging a per-litter-grain tax first.

Then again, internet rumors fly hard and fast in both directions. I've seen LOTS of talk about Duesenbergs being made in Korea but assembled in Germany, but since I've seen no hard evidence of such, I'm not sure what to believe anymore.

Targ
12-22-2010, 09:39 AM
I didn't know they were made in Asia either. Like many others I thought it was a German made guitar.

I guess I'll keep shopping. That was to be my next purchase after the first of the year, but I guess I'll start looking at the Ricks again. I'm not paying that much for a Korean made guitar.

I was thinking about the Mike Campbell signature model.

One more thing about Ric's
I put up an ad listing 9 guitars on craigs list.
Within two minutes of my ad going up both Ric's were gone.
2 min!
one Ric got 4 "I'll take it's" within 5 minutes,

pennylink
12-22-2010, 10:48 AM
Not sure if the info at Wiki is true, but these days I hold Wikipedia to be about as credible as Nancy Pelosi. And I wouldn't trust her to properly clean a catbox without charging a per-litter-grain tax first.

Then again, internet rumors fly hard and fast in both directions. I've seen LOTS of talk about Duesenbergs being made in Korea but assembled in Germany, but since I've seen no hard evidence of such, I'm not sure what to believe anymore.
FWIW I've read several reviews about Duesenberg guitars and according to the articles 'bodies and necks are made in Korea, then shipped to Germany where the guitars are assembled'.

Melj
12-22-2010, 11:10 AM
I played one and was HIGHLY unimpressed. I thought it was dull and lifeless and didn't feel that great. I was sorta bummed cause I wanted to like it but there was nothing about it's tone or feel I found attractive.

:agree

That's my experience with them. Hyped a lot in the Uk but never really took off, probably because of the above.

frisco kid
12-22-2010, 11:36 AM
These reviews are from affiliates of the UK's reputable Guitarist Magazine. They confirm Korean bodies and German assembly. They had to get that info. from Duesenberg for the article, otherwise Duesenberg would've had them retract it. Probably why you won't see a review in an American mag like Guitar World or Guitar Player because they would want to list the country of origin. The first article notes that Korean bodies were an effort to keep prices 'wallet friendly', which they are overseas ($1500-1600 US for a Starplayer TV in Europe). However the same guitar starts at $2200-2300 here in the states so it appears the US distributor is likely inflating the price to reflect "boutique" German made guitars. If you're going to buy a Duesenberg, buy used or overseas for new ones...even with shipping and taxes you'll do better than buying here.

http://www.duesenberg.de/duesenberg/...cMart_0807.pdf

http://www.musicradar.com/gear/all/g...-199442/review (http://www.musicradar.com/gear/all/guitars/electric/6-string-solid-body/pomona-6-199442/review)

TB72
12-22-2010, 12:08 PM
I've played a couple...a Double Cat, and a 49er.

The Double Cat was kinda cool and quirky. It had a Gretsch meets Rickenbacker vibe. The vibrato bar was really nice...felt really smooth and held its' tuning well.

The 49er had a neat look (blue pearloid finish), but the sound and feel didn't inpire me at all. It was an absolute boat anchor too (Norlin era LP Custom-heavy)...weighed between 11 and 12 pounds.

Neither guitar convinced me to part with a couple G's in order to take them home...no matter where they were made.

Later...

RockinB23
12-22-2010, 02:26 PM
If Mr. Setzer made the switch I would consider trying one! :)

foppy
12-22-2010, 02:28 PM
"All models are built in the Duesenberg factory in Hannover (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Hannover); all hardware, including the single-coil (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Single-coil)/vintage, P-90 (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/P-90) and humbucking (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Humbucker) pickups (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Pick_up_%28music_technology%29), are designed in-house."

Some equivocation here. "Built" could well mean "assembled," and we all know that "designed" often signals "as opposed to manufactured." (Duncan Designed pickups, anyone?)

IAE
12-22-2010, 02:38 PM
Same deal as Electro-Harmonix pedals.

ALL EHX pedals have "Made In NYC" on the front of them yet I know for a fact, as the owners of EHX told me, that the PCB's (essentially the whole circuit) is populated in China then shipped to NYC for assembly. The only thing EHX does is screenprint the boxes and install the circuit and solder the pots and jacks on , that's it. YET, they still say "Made In NYC".

Only difference is EHX pedals have always been good value for money in the US not like Duesenberg in the US and AU.

And they are populated with machines, SMD, and machines all operate the same as they dont know what country they are in so they work just as good in china as they do in the US.

All the pedals,like the OG BMP etc that use thru hole components and not SMD, are still madein NYC. All vintage and up to past 2000 (until SMD hit the scene) EHX are entirely US made.

mds
12-22-2010, 03:31 PM
>>Modern Gretsch guitars are some of the best that they've ever made

+1. No experience with D.

+1 for me as well. Fender built Gretsches are great guitars. The extremely expensive US custom shop ones are phenomenally great guitars.

mds
12-22-2010, 03:33 PM
Same deal as Electro-Harmonix pedals.

ALL EHX pedals have "Made In NYC" on the front of them yet I know for a fact, as the owners of EHX told me, that the PCB's (essentially the whole circuit) is populated in China then shipped to NYC for assembly. The only thing EHX does is screenprint the boxes and install the circuit and solder the pots and jacks on , that's it. YET, they still say "Made In NYC".

Only difference is EHX pedals have always been good value for money in the US not like Duesenberg in the US and AU.

And they are populated with machines, SMD, and machines all operate the same as they dont know what country they are in so they work just as good in china as they do in the US.

All the pedals,like the OG BMP etc that use thru hole components and not SMD, are still madein NYC. All vintage and up to past 2000 (until SMD hit the scene) EHX are entirely US made.

The other thing with "assembled" in the US is the level of quality control. A company like EH can inspect the products before they leave the door. That is a big plus over something entirely done in china.

IAE
12-22-2010, 04:40 PM
True, and even though EHX are basically made in China and assembled in NYC it doesn't bother me because they are not expensive pedals and an SMD board is just as well made in china as it is in the US.

In Long Island EHX staff solder all parts & boards to assemble the pedal so they are inspecting it as they are doing it.
This however doesn't guarantee a solid (stock condition) pedal as the quality of wire EHX uses is absolute crap! I've told Scott Matthews (Mikes son) personally that it is crap and they should change it. That was almost 2 years ago...I don't know if they have or not.
Even some of their pedals made in the 70's, 80's and 90's of which I have quite a few use crap wire but its far better than todays wire which just breaks changing a battery.

First thing I do when I buy EHX pedals is open it up and inspect all the wire joints and re do them if I think its necessary.

EHX are very reliable pedals (to me as I can repair my own stuff if needed), wire issue aside, and I've never had one fail on me.
Also EHX warranty service is 2nd to none.

Also we all owe Mike Matthews a debt of gratitude for keeping the Tube alive and kicking at reasonable prices!

If EHX was charging any more than they do I'd be pissed about the made in China/assembled in NYC thing.

And Duesenbergs being Korean/German made pisses me only because of the prices!

mcdes
12-22-2010, 06:18 PM
i sold my custom shop gibson 335 fso i could get my duesy.... couldn't be happier, and don't regret it at all.

In saying that, i would recommend NOT getting one............... then i wont feel so bad about everyone having one!! hahaha (at least here in New Zealand, hardly a soul has one!)

Zelja
12-23-2010, 06:54 PM
Zelja, how are the Duesenberg necks?



I only have experience with the 12 string. It's 46mm (1.811" or close to 1 13/16 ") wide at the nut & about 20.5mm (0.807") deep at the 1st fret (measured somewhat crudely with skin fold calipers:D). The neck carve I would describe as maybe a slightly chunky C. In comparison, an American fat tele I have is 19.5 mm deep & a Hamer Korina Jr with a "Vintage Carve " neck is 20.0 mm deep.

I have trouble with 41mm necks on 6 string guitars (sold the Ric & Tele deluxe fro that reason), so a Ric 12 string is very awkward. The width of my Doozy is probably wider than I would want for a 6 string but works as a 12. I think the 6 strings are 42mm wide. Like anything, the only way to know is to try it for yourself...

Arc Angel
12-24-2010, 10:24 PM
"All models are built in the Duesenberg factory in Hannover (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Hannover); all hardware, including the single-coil (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Single-coil)/vintage, P-90 (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/P-90) and humbucking (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Humbucker) pickups (http://www.thegearpage.net/board/../wiki/Pick_up_%28music_technology%29), are designed in-house."

Some equivocation here. "Built" could well mean "assembled," and we all know that "designed" often signals "as opposed to manufactured." (Duncan Designed pickups, anyone?)

Bodies, necks are Korean. Final assembly in Germany (i.e. installation of hardware). They are not Made in Germany by Teutonic Luthiers. Although, they'd like you to think so ...

Zelja
12-25-2010, 12:19 AM
Bodies, necks are Korean. Final assembly in Germany (i.e. installation of hardware). They are not Made in Germany by Teutonic Luthiers. Although, they'd like you to think so ...

You seem to have some inside knowledge so a few questions:

Do the bodies & necks come seperately from Korea & are the necks then attached in Germany or do they already come attached from Korea?

What state are the bodies/neck in when they hit Deutschland - already painted or is there sanding, finishing, any final carving, painting etc done in Germany?

Where is the hardware sourced from especially the pickups?

Cheers.

frisco kid
12-26-2010, 10:33 AM
Anyone heard of Hank Cho? According to the gentleman at Jarrett Guitars, that's who's building the Duesenbergs in Korea....check the commentary below the article. I suspect we'll never know the mix of Asian and German involvement until Deusenberg fesses up which will likely be never.

http://www.premierguitar.com/Magazine/Issue/2008/Feb/Duesenberg_Heartbreakers_30th_Anniversary_Mike_Cam pbell_Signature_Guitar.aspx

Granted he does have an axe to grind as the Duesaenberg Campbell appears to have taken more than a passing resemblence to the Jarrett Shelby guitar:

Jack Camarda Jarrett Guitars
on 02/12/2008 It was great to see Chris Burgess' recognition of the similarities between this design and the Shelby Cobra. The Cobra design was our company's, and John Bolin served only as the sub contractor on the Shelby Series and had no input re: the cosmetic design or the license from Shelby. Hank Cho, who builds the Duesenbergs in Korea and I met at the 2003 NAMM show where he took numerous photographs. Need I say more?

melven62
12-28-2010, 07:37 PM
Everytime I bring my duesenberg out (which is all the time, this thing has came to every "gig" since I got it) people ask what it is. I tell it's a duesenberg and then at the end they all really like it. It's such a sick guitar, I love it through my vox.

pennylink
12-29-2010, 03:20 AM
You seem to have some inside knowledge so a few questions:

Do the bodies & necks come seperately from Korea & are the necks then attached in Germany or do they already come attached from Korea?

What state are the bodies/neck in when they hit Deutschland - already painted or is there sanding, finishing, any final carving, painting etc done in Germany?

Where is the hardware sourced from especially the pickups?

Cheers.
This doesn't really answer the question, but this is taken from UK's 'Guitar Buyer' magazine review of the Duesenberg Starplayer Special D6 Baritone:

"This decidedly retro-flavoured range is still going strong 15 years later, courtesy of a manufacturing method that combines Korean-origin woodworking with German assembly, while some components are sourced from even further afield, including America, Italy and Japan."

Exactly which components come from where is anybody's guess...

Zelja
12-29-2010, 05:12 AM
This doesn't really answer the question, but this is taken from UK's 'Guitar Buyer' magazine review of the Duesenberg Starplayer Special D6 Baritone:

"This decidedly retro-flavoured range is still going strong 15 years later, courtesy of a manufacturing method that combines Korean-origin woodworking with German assembly, while some components are sourced from even further afield, including America, Italy and Japan."

Exactly which components come from where is anybody's guess...

Thanks. It would be nice to know, but knowing one way or the other doesn't change the actual quality of the guitars. They are what they are.

I don't see why it should be assumed that a Korean guy with the access to the same resources & quality woods would automatically be judged to do an inferior job to somebody in Germany, the US, UK, Japan or anywhere else. As long as the right processes, training, raw materials & tooling are in place, it shouldn't make too much of a difference.

skintknuckle
12-29-2010, 08:25 AM
Thanks. It would be nice to know, but knowing one way or the other doesn't change the actual quality of the guitars. They are what they are.

I don't see why it should be assumed that a Korean guy with the access to the same resources & quality woods would automatically be judged to do an inferior job to somebody in Germany, the US, UK, Japan or anywhere else. As long as the right processes, training, raw materials & tooling are in place, it shouldn't make too much of a difference.

True. The workmanship on these guitars is really extraordinary. I bought mine at the show in Dallas a few years ago. I was out to either buy a Johnny A. sig or a vintage tele with a bigsby. Tried lots of guitars over two days. Walked by the Doozy several times. Finally went into Marc's Guitar Shop booth and told him what I wanted. He said, "...my buddy says this is the best guitar with a trem he has ever played." I played it and it beat everything else I had tried. I think it's like all other guitars...not all guitars are created equal to the specific player. You have to play lots of guitars to find what you like. This one has something special for me (and Marc's buddy, I guess.) However, I've seen Marc at these shows since and he always remembers me and this guitar. Maybe he remembers everything he sells...I"m not sure.

Anyway, another noteworthy feature is that it is easy to tune and stays in tune better than my Gibsons. I keep hoping they will make a 24.75" scale guitar with a rounder radius. I would sure like to have one of those 52 Senior's in a 24.75" scale with a Bigsby. That would be a rock & roll machine.

Arc Angel
12-29-2010, 08:59 AM
Thanks. It would be nice to know, but knowing one way or the other doesn't change the actual quality of the guitars. They are what they are.

I don't see why it should be assumed that a Korean guy with the access to the same resources & quality woods would automatically be judged to do an inferior job to somebody in Germany, the US, UK, Japan or anywhere else. As long as the right processes, training, raw materials & tooling are in place, it shouldn't make too much of a difference.

True. However, a little transparency would be good. They are being marketed (hint, hint) as German guitars.

I don't have a problem with the quality at the European price points. I think that they are overpriced (relative to prices in the EU) in the USA and Canada.

Lots of great guitars coming out of Korea so no bias there .... I was raised on Japanese guitars as a kid and, while I love USA guitars, have no problems with good guitars wherever they are made (along as they are labelled with country of origin).

74vibrolux
12-29-2010, 10:08 AM
Duesenbergs are really amazing guitars ... if you're into what they offer. Personally, I loved the neck, their tuners and their take on the Bigsby. Some really nice innovations. I also dug the pickups. I owned a Starplayer TV, a 335 and a DuoJet at the same time. It truly fell in between the two. Some unique tones, for sure. For personal reasons (unrelated to the instrument) I sold the Doozy and kept the other two. I agree they could be priced a bit cheaper. But still, it was a great, great guitar.

My DuoJet is still the finest feeling and best finished guitar I've ever owned, however. The Fender owned Gretsch is making some amazing guitars. However, you have to want that great Gretsch sound - cuz that's all you're gonna get from it.

Tonesmiths
01-03-2011, 12:54 AM
The Duesenberg mojo is evident by the list of players using them. I'm sure Keith Richards, Ron Wood, Mike Cambell, Billy Gibbons, and Keith Urban get free guitars offered to them daily. But, I've never seen any of them play anything other than a Duesy that wasn't a vintage go-to. I don't know about you, but when it comes to selecting an instrument I trust the ears that have shaped the tones we strive for.

vortexxxx
01-03-2011, 05:14 AM
But if you want that gretsch growl only a Gretsch will do.

chequepoint
01-03-2011, 06:58 AM
The Duesenberg mojo is evident by the list of players using them. I'm sure Keith Richards, Ron Wood, Mike Cambell, Billy Gibbons, and Keith Urban get free guitars offered to them daily. But, I've never seen any of them play anything other than a Duesy that wasn't a vintage go-to. I don't know about you, but when it comes to selecting an instrument I trust the ears that have shaped the tones we strive for.

Yeah, but better than a free guitar is one that comes with a check, because sheep like you respond exactly like this.

IAE
01-03-2011, 07:07 AM
I trust guitars and gear that sounds good to me, not my idols!
I never strived for anyones tone except mine, and I achieved that over 15 years ago!

I'm all about originality, not imitation.

Doug's Tubes
01-03-2011, 11:15 AM
Thanks. It would be nice to know, but knowing one way or the other doesn't change the actual quality of the guitars. They are what they are.

I don't see why it should be assumed that a Korean guy with the access to the same resources & quality woods would automatically be judged to do an inferior job to somebody in Germany, the US, UK, Japan or anywhere else. As long as the right processes, training, raw materials & tooling are in place, it shouldn't make too much of a difference.

I owned a 49'er once, great guitar! I don't think anyone can dispute the love and appreciation for a quality instruments regardless of country of origin. But good quality Korean guitars can be had for a lot less than $2k, even $1k.

Who hasn't played a great sounding mexican strat? But you wouldn't pay $1500 for one.

Tonesmiths
01-03-2011, 12:12 PM
Yeah, but better than a free guitar is one that comes with a check, because sheep like you respond exactly like this.

Easy now. I just thought it should be mentioned that the line up currently endorsing Duesenberg are all tone gurus who don't have reputations for being sell outs. That's nothing to resort to "sheep" shots over.

Zelja
01-03-2011, 03:48 PM
I owned a 49'er once, great guitar! I don't think anyone can dispute the love and appreciation for a quality instruments regardless of country of origin. But good quality Korean guitars can be had for a lot less than $2k, even $1k.

Who hasn't played a great sounding mexican strat? But you wouldn't pay $1500 for one.

I said earlier that the Duesenbergs probably are overpriced (especially in the US) but it's hard to know ny how much exactly when there is a significant amount of mystery involved in how much is done where. With a lot of Asian guitars there is also an assumption that the hardware is cheaper & of inferior quality to the top range guitars - can we level this accusation at the Duesenberg?

Still I think it is curious that we (& I include myself) seem to be quite happy to pay $2k for a guitar if it is made by a German or an American but would be loathe to spend half that for a guitar which is just as satisfying, with an inderscernible quality difference but it is made by a Korean.

chequepoint
01-03-2011, 04:57 PM
Easy now. I just thought it should be mentioned that the line up currently endorsing Duesenberg are all tone gurus who don't have reputations for being sell outs. That's nothing to resort to "sheep" shots over.

Billy Gibbons is generous, he'll pretty much lend his name to anyone. I mean that in a good way, he likes a lot of things so if he does he'll let you slap his name on your website.

Campbell is getting paid, and attention from it. The reality is that they needed a relatively high profile guy, and they went after him. Ripped off the shelby design and bobs you're uncle. Fender and Gibson wouldn't pay a guy like campbell, Fender doesn't really do advances and Gibson would want to do a small run like the Easton SG.

Ronnie Wood is getting paid as well, so he coerces his bandmate into holding a few.

Urban just likes guitars, and is also a pretty generous dude. I was here a few years ago when they were handing out guitars and opening their checkbooks to anyone with credibility that they could sign up.

As for the sheep comment, that's just the truth. It's what the whole concept of "Endorsement" revolves around.

They're cool looking guitars, they even sound pretty good, but they are the very definition of overpriced, and their marketing is deceptive at best. They're charging high prices here to infer quality. People associate a countries manufacturing abilities with their primary exports. The Duesenberg name implies opulence and luxury, a premier automobile. People think German and they think BMW, Mercedes. Then they found out what they bought was a pretty Daewoo.

datguytim
01-03-2011, 04:57 PM
I've played several Doozys - they were pretty cool, but I like Gretsches better myself.

Ogre
01-03-2011, 05:03 PM
This is not a fair fight. Gretsch by a mile.

Tonesmiths
01-03-2011, 06:10 PM
All this in defense of a Japanese Gretsch made by Fender? Sad

Billy Gibbons is generous, he'll pretty much lend his name to anyone. I mean that in a good way, he likes a lot of things so if he does he'll let you slap his name on your website.

Campbell is getting paid, and attention from it. The reality is that they needed a relatively high profile guy, and they went after him. Ripped off the shelby design and bobs you're uncle. Fender and Gibson wouldn't pay a guy like campbell, Fender doesn't really do advances and Gibson would want to do a small run like the Easton SG.

Ronnie Wood is getting paid as well, so he coerces his bandmate into holding a few.

Urban just likes guitars, and is also a pretty generous dude. I was here a few years ago when they were handing out guitars and opening their checkbooks to anyone with credibility that they could sign up.

As for the sheep comment, that's just the truth. It's what the whole concept of "Endorsement" revolves around.

They're cool looking guitars, they even sound pretty good, but they are the very definition of overpriced, and their marketing is deceptive at best. They're charging high prices here to infer quality. People associate a countries manufacturing abilities with their primary exports. The Duesenberg name implies opulence and luxury, a premier automobile. People think German and they think BMW, Mercedes. Then they found out what they bought was a pretty Daewoo.

chequepoint
01-03-2011, 06:52 PM
All this in defense of a Japanese Gretsch made by Fender? Sad

Lets be real for a second, Japan makes the best everything. Their manufacturing capabilities are second to none. American guitars, like American cars.. are more than serviceable, but if we didn't live here, we wouldn't want them. They were great designs in their day, but quality has slipped while prices went up.

That said, guitars aren't in competition with each other, I just think Duesenberg rips people off every day, until they start putting made in Korea stickers on their guitars it's hard to support them.

shawnshack
01-03-2011, 07:07 PM
I think Dozy's look cool, but I'd never spend that much on one. I would like to pick up a gretsch sometime. I had never even heard of Duesenberg until Nigel from Hillsong started using them -- now every Nigel wanna be is picking one up. I've been seeing a few pop up in the forum lately. Maybe those are people giving them a shot and finding they aren't all they are cracked up to be.

chequepoint
01-03-2011, 07:20 PM
http://mycarblog.org/wp-content/uploads/2010/03/1013.jpg

I'd take this over a Gretsch.

beNsteR
01-03-2011, 07:22 PM
i have nothing against Korean craftsmanship - it is very good.

BUT - withholding information in marketing and misleading people to believe a Korean-made guitar is German-made has to be wrong however nicely it is worded.

IAE
01-04-2011, 02:01 AM
Charging American prices for Korean guitars is a scam IMO.
They are great guitars but for where they are made are far overpriced.

I would only buy them secondhand.

mcdes
01-04-2011, 02:09 AM
When I bought my sig model, I didn't pay nowhere near full price, and I wouldn't, as suggested, you can get USA built for same price......

But, now that I have it, regardless of where it's made, I feel it is worth it, and sounds great..... But each to there own.

twofingerz
01-04-2011, 03:52 AM
I have recently purchased a Gretsch G6118T-LTV 125th Anniversary guitar and compared it with a Duesenberg Starplayer TV and C.C.. I have to say that the Doozies blew the Gretsch away! The Duesenbergs were made with so much more quality than the Gretsch. The action and intonation were flawless, thanks to the Plek technology. No fret buzz! The neck was so smooth and fast. Not to mention it had killer tone! Each pickup was unique and sounded awesome. The tuners are genius, also. They are "self-locking" which means once one puts the string through the hole and begins to tune, it "senses" the tension and locks the string in place. They stayed in perfect tune the whole time I was playing them. I was also surprised that the tremolo on the Doozies were actually better than the Bigsby on the Gretch. Don't get me wrong, the Gretsch is so sick, but there were many problems, including intonation, tuning, and buzzing issues, muddy-ness, and the overall craftsmanship was not as good as Duesenberg. I am definitely getting a Duesenberg! It's worth every penny.

Doug's Tubes
01-04-2011, 07:47 AM
I said earlier that the Duesenbergs probably are overpriced (especially in the US) but it's hard to know ny how much exactly when there is a significant amount of mystery involved in how much is done where. With a lot of Asian guitars there is also an assumption that the hardware is cheaper & of inferior quality to the top range guitars - can we level this accusation at the Duesenberg?

Still I think it is curious that we (& I include myself) seem to be quite happy to pay $2k for a guitar if it is made by a German or an American but would be loathe to spend half that for a guitar which is just as satisfying, with an inderscernible quality difference but it is made by a Korean.

True, it's all about perception. But the reality is also about the standards of living in various countries. The cost of labor and materials is significantly less in South Korea and China than the USA and Europe.

sector9
01-04-2011, 09:01 AM
I have recently purchased a Gretsch G6118T-LTV 125th Anniversary guitar and compared it with a Duesenberg Starplayer TV and C.C.. I have to say that the Doozies blew the Gretsch away! The Duesenbergs were made with so much more quality than the Gretsch. The action and intonation were flawless, thanks to the Plek technology. No fret buzz! The neck was so smooth and fast. Not to mention it had killer tone! Each pickup was unique and sounded awesome. The tuners are genius, also. They are "self-locking" which means once one puts the string through the hole and begins to tune, it "senses" the tension and locks the string in place. They stayed in perfect tune the whole time I was playing them. I was also surprised that the tremolo on the Doozies were actually better than the Bigsby on the Gretch. Don't get me wrong, the Gretsch is so sick, but there were many problems, including intonation, tuning, and buzzing issues, muddy-ness, and the overall craftsmanship was not as good as Duesenberg. I am definitely getting a Duesenberg! It's worth every penny.

So you just bought a new 125th annie without having a set up done? and now you are bashing it in favor of another guitar because you don't have the bridge set right? Your Gretsch also has locking tuners! :rotflmao

Tonesmiths
01-04-2011, 10:37 AM
So you just bought a new 125th annie without having a set up done? and now you are bashing it in favor of another guitar because you don't have the bridge set right? Your Gretsch also has locking tuners! :rotflmao

A guitar of this quality and price should be perfectly fret dressed and intonated for 10-46 when it leaves the factory (since that's the tension 75% of guitarists use). I can only imagine how many potential buyers have been turned away because Fender (unlike Duesenberg) is too inconsiderate to quality control and set up their imported guitars once they've arrived from their country of origin.

sector9
01-04-2011, 01:09 PM
A guitar of this quality and price should be perfectly fret dressed and intonated for 10-46 when it leaves the factory (since that's the tension 75% of guitarists use). I can only imagine how many potential buyers have been turned away because Fender (unlike Duesenberg) is too inconsiderate to quality control and set up their imported guitars once they've arrived from their country of origin.

No, the dealer should have done a set up on it before giving it to him. You guys can try to justify the price of these duesenberg guitars all you want but the bottom line is they are overpriced for what they. Frankly i don't belive twofingerz has a gretsch because in another thread he stated he has a strat and is looking for a hollow body, i thought he has a gretsch?? Something is fishy here, fishy indeedy

GA20T
01-04-2011, 01:09 PM
A guitar of this quality and price should be perfectly fret dressed and intonated for 10-46 when it leaves the factory (since that's the tension 75% of guitarists use). I can only imagine how many potential buyers have been turned away because Fender (unlike Duesenberg) is too inconsiderate to quality control and set up their imported guitars once they've arrived from their country of origin.

And this is one of the things that always stands out with the Duesenbergs in my experience. Every time I've pulled one down from the shelf they have been flawless, not to mention how great they sound, and if that's not testament to QC/craftsmanship then I don't know what is. The Bigsby may have been tweaked since it's inception, but it's an old design with known flaws. Dues. seems to have thought about and designed parts that improve upon their function, instead of "reissuing" their inherent design flaws; something Fender is famous for. Unpinned saddles, Jazzmaster/Jaguar bridges & the need for string trees anyone?

frisco kid
01-04-2011, 06:42 PM
What hacks me off the most is that the US prices are so out of whack with the European prices. In Europe, many of the guitar mags have already let the cat out of the bag with the Korean connection so the prices reflect that. Ever wonder why you don't see Duesy's reviewed in Guitar Player or Guitar World? They would list the country of origin...then all the high brow endorsees who wouldn't be caught dead playing a Korean guitar would jump ship. Not to mention the buyers who paid premium prices would be pissed. A shame really, had Duesenberg USA kept prices commensurate with overseas, they would've sold a ton and made more in volume. Now they've painted themselves in a corner and HAVE to keep up the charade.

IAE
01-04-2011, 08:47 PM
Same in Oz man, Duesenbergs are up to AU$3,000. I expect to pay that for some PRS and gibsons but not Korean made guitars.

ESP's are in the AU$3,000 price range too but they are Japanese and impeccable quality!
Still, if I'm gonna spend 3grand on a guitar I'll buy a Gibson!


3grand here in oz is not like having 3 grand in the states. In the states things are far far cheaper whereas here everything is expensive as. its more like having USD$1,500-$2,000. Realistically.

frisco kid
01-04-2011, 08:58 PM
yeah...the ONLY place to buy a new one is from Europe. Don't see how US and Aussie dealers sell any new Duesy's with EU prices so much lower, even with shipping?

IAE
01-04-2011, 11:19 PM
Ship a guitar mostly anywhere in the world for $150 bucks so its still cheaper hey.

UNLESS, the EU Duesenberg dealers have an agreement not to ship to us! Which some companies do have with dealers.
I can buy almost any pickup from the US but do you think I can buy a DiMarzio? Nope, because DiMarzio wont let US dealers send them out of the US. So if I want DiMarzio I have to pay out my ass locally.

josh_stone
01-05-2011, 12:46 AM
Sucks that Duesenberg's site and marketing campaign isn't truthful with country of origin, but at the end of the day, I love how my guitar sounds and feels. The component quality, craftsmanship, and tone are totally worth the inflated price tag. It may be unfair, but it is still a good buy, IMO. Oh, and the tuners are fantastic. One of the most outstanding features of the guitar.

In remembering the true purpose of this thread, I've played several Gretsches and cannot think of a single one in the $2000 range that I would trade straight up for. However, I could easily own and use both of them without much overlap.

IAE
01-05-2011, 02:00 AM
I know a place on planet earth to get me a cheap second hand Duesenberg anyways so I'll never buy new at inflated prices. Its a rip.

patdeezel
01-26-2011, 12:16 AM
I own a Starplayer TV and a 6120-1959. It may not be a great comparison since my Doozy is a semi hollow and the Gretsch is a full hollow, but I would definitely say my Doozy has the edge over my Gretsch. I don't feel like going into much detail right now but I can say it has more balls and plays really aggressive. There is also a lot more tonal variation and chime in my Doozy and it is more versatile. Don't get me wrong though, I love both and they both sound great in the worship band I play in.
And note* I did not get this Starplayer TV because of Nigel Hendroff! :p I got it because a buddy of mine owned a C.C. and I loved the sound coming out of his rig when he played. It's just they had an ugly color C.C. at the store so I bought this.
I have a friend who has a Duo Jet and these same comparisons apply also with the Starplayer TV being better.

http://i56.tinypic.com/2njkf4k.jpg

patdeezel
01-26-2011, 12:20 AM
Sucks that Duesenberg's site and marketing campaign isn't truthful with country of origin, but at the end of the day, I love how my guitar sounds and feels. The component quality, craftsmanship, and tone are totally worth the inflated price tag. It may be unfair, but it is still a good buy, IMO. Oh, and the tuners are fantastic. One of the most outstanding features of the guitar.

In remembering the true purpose of this thread, I've played several Gretsches and cannot think of a single one in the $2000 range that I would trade straight up for. However, I could easily own and use both of them without much overlap.

I second that! Duesenbergs are definitely made with some outstanding craftsmanship. It sure feels like the price it's inflated to be. The pickups sound amazing too. And the tuners...those are definitely the best tuners. My guitar hardly goes out of tune and tuning is very easy and smooth. And I especially love the Z tuner feature which allows you to just stick the string through the tuner and out through the back of the headstock which makes restringing much easier and faster.

vortexxxx
01-26-2011, 03:17 AM
A guitar of this quality and price should be perfectly fret dressed and intonated for 10-46 when it leaves the factory (since that's the tension 75% of guitarists use). I can only imagine how many potential buyers have been turned away because Fender (unlike Duesenberg) is too inconsiderate to quality control and set up their imported guitars once they've arrived from their country of origin.
The quality of the new Gretsches are stunning. You need a setup with most guitars to get them perfect. Climate change between countries can screw up a perfect setup. It's always a good idea to setup a new guitar once it acclimatizes.

dokter B.
01-26-2011, 05:29 AM
I visited a kind of european NAMM a couple of years ago , and the representatives swore that the Duesenbergs were German made.
A Dutch guitar builder let his bodies CNC in korea, end in the same factory all the Duesenbergs were at least CNC'd. He even had pictures to proof it. Whenever a company is not telling the truth , it really pisses me of. No matter how greast the instruments are , I would doubt also about : is alder really alder , is mahogany real , everything else they say. I wouldn't take those things for granted either. To make a guitar in Korea will not cost more than at the most 200 euro (250 dollar). I'd take a Gretsch , an electromatic , from wich I know were they are from.

dokter B.
01-26-2011, 05:30 AM
PS My english sucks

JimmyR
01-26-2011, 08:56 AM
FWIW I love my Gretsch 6120 Setzers - I have a flamey SSU and the faded SSLVO. Simply great guitars. I also have a couple of Historic Gibsons and rate my Gretsches just as highly. I have owned vintage Gretsches and actually prefer my recent versions. But it's like everything - I like the Setzer 6120s but don't necessarily rate the Anni, for example. I play the Setzers because I like the lack of zero fret, the electronics, the necks, etc, not because they are a Setzer particularly. I'm more a fan of RHH, but like the Setzer guitar better. And I bought my first Setzer before I'd even heard of RHH...

Anyway, I tried a few Doozies and while I thought they looked great the tone did absolutely nothing for me. In contrast the 6120s have a beautiful, characterful clear but growly tone that I will never tire of. They suit me perfectly. They won't suit everyone but I don't care! Japanese? I don't care. Better built than any of the old ones I had.

Waxhead
01-26-2011, 02:26 PM
Anybody own or play these side by side? Seems like alot of the Gretsch players are moving onto Doozys, I'm curious what the pros and cons are.

Yeah - name one hehehehe
I haven't heard of any.

These guitars are 2 entirely different beasts.
Both great obviously.
If you want the Gretsch tone you can't get it with anything else.
And Dusenbergs - I dunno - do they have a signiture sound :drink

cerichards
01-27-2011, 05:33 AM
I hate to jump on the band wagon, but....

Go play both. Buy the guitar you like.
If you're going to the "gretsch" sound, you'll most likely get a Gretsch. That's okay. Check out the Power Jet as it has a lot of upgrades that make a huge difference.
I went and played 20 or so Gretsch instruments (new, vintage, Professional Collection, USA custom) and I did not totally bond with any of them (my opinion). I was never thrilled about the fit & finish, some due to the guitar shop's lack of upkeep and some because of factory issues in the finish, bigsby issues, tuning stability, ect... but not all of them. I found a Grosh HollowTron (his take on a Duo Jet). Zero issues with quality. Zero... the Grosh was stunning. I did not buy that instrument because of the scale length, the frequency response of the Filtertrons (TV Jones, mind you), and the Bigsby. Gretsch kinda made me gunshy with the quality issues I saw across the board in all their instruments (minus the 3K+ USA customs that I just did not care for).
Every Duesenberg I found in a shop was post 2009, and they all played like a dream. Superb build quality (where ever they were built and assembled). The pickups had the frequency response I was looking for. I love the 25.5 scale. I like that the instrument is semi-hollow like a 335 rather than routed from a block of wood (the Johnny A, too... but this is an opinion). I like that it's spruce and maple, rather than mahogany. My Duesenberg Starplayer TV Mike Campbell was the right guitar for me and what I play. Church gig tested, wife approved.
Patdeezel is right… they are different. Go play them and see. (sweet pic, too!)
Chequepoint has his opinions and no tact. He digs his Gretsch (which is gorgeous).

stingrey1978
01-27-2011, 08:12 AM
This thread really makes me feel better about my judgement, ever since they came out I knew something was amiss, to me all the cosmetics just look cheap and kinda trashy, there was an Italian or some company called italia a few years ago that they reminded of and sparkly cheap looking guitars all look the same. Sadly I know a few worship guitarist that are playing them for a paycheck, and now every little 15yo wants one, makes me feel sick to my stomach. What a rip off.

buchla300
01-27-2011, 08:23 AM
Well one of the best new guitars I played was a Duesenberg Carl Carlton. Fabulous.
Gretsch seem clunky to me, but try 'em out and see which you prefer.

ScottB
01-27-2011, 08:40 AM
I've got both, so I'll chime in.

I agree that both are generally overpriced, and I'll qualify all of my comments with the disclosure that I got good deals on two Gretsches (a 6118 and a 7594 White Falcon II both bought in Tokyo at separate times) and my Duesenberg 49'er (bought in Dresden).

My Dues is a solid body, so it really isn't a direct comparison. Much more Les Paul in character than what I think of as "Gretsch". I did spend a good bit of time with a Carl Carlton on both of my Tokyo excursions where I went home with a Gretsch and it was a strong runner up both times. If I didn't already own a Dues, it might have won.

Personally, I don't like the feel of the Bigsby-type bar on the Duesenbergs. I know a lot of people love it, but I don't. I've played a few of the smaller semi-hollow Duesenbergs as well, and there is just something about the feel that doesn't connect with me. Kind of loose and flabby. The 49'er, on the other hand is a solid rock machine.

Overall, I think the pickups in the Dues are voiced quite a bit gainier than typical Gretsch pickups. The Carl Carlton is definitely the closest feel to a Gretsch that I've played in their line.

I like them both, and if you can get one for a good price, you'll be happy either way.

Zach.drummond
01-27-2011, 11:29 AM
I went to Nashville this month for a good comparison of Gretsch to Duesenbergs. I found that the Duesenbergs are just as good as everyone says in build quality. They are true pieces of craftsmanship. However, the out of phase situation in the mid pos really left me wanting.

The Gretsch guitars of today are just as good as the Duesy's in craftsmanship. They play great and they sound even better! For me...I just really like the Filtertrons. Personal preference.

Zach.drummond
01-27-2011, 11:31 AM
Oh yea, and the Duesenberg tremola is AMAZING. Period. Loved it way better than the feel of the bigsby.

The Gretsch still wins me over tho. :)

Crazyquilt
01-27-2011, 11:47 AM
I remember looking at Doozies a while back, when I first saw them on TGP. Looked interesting, but nothing I'd kill for. Nothing in their lineup could replace a good 6120. Nothing. That red hollowbody is the closest, but it looks like an Artcore to me.

I'm glad the tuners are great, but the tension bar likely makes up for the lack of complication at the head-end -- at least that's my experience with every tension-barred Bigsby I've owned.

Please be aware: Gretsch is not "made by Fender." It is "made by Gretsch." Fender distributes & markets, a fact which is readily discernible by anyone with an interest to know, and not kept hidden in order to make more money. Furthermore, Gretsch has been remarkably sensitive to players' needs, and they are making a truly unique product to high tolerances -- which certainly wasn't always the case with Gretsch!

I have nothing against Korean guitars. If I wanted a mid-level hollowish guitar, I'd be torn between the Reverend Pete Anderson & the Godin Kingpin II (yes, Canadian I know) both of which are significantly cheaper than a Doozy. "Cheaper" doesn't inherently refer to quality -- it's simply less expensive to make guitars in Korea than in Japan. (And apparently Canada's cheapest of all...but I digress.) If that difference isn't passed on to the buyer, then it seems reasonable to ask: Why not? Given that Doozy doesn't even seem interested in answering that question, in fact obfuscates it, means I'd never consider buying one. I could only wonder, reasonably or otherwise, what other corners were being cut on my nickel, without my knowledge.

Finally, on the set-up of Gretsches in shops: Even if they came out of Terada with perfect set-ups, do you think the trip to the States (for example) and being hung out to dry with little to no attention by the store is going to do good things for said set-up? Especially for a hollowbody with a floating bridge & a Bigsby. Sorry, you can't judge it like you can a Tele. I don't buy a guitar based on a set-up, and neither should you. That will tell you exactly NOTHING about the guitar, only that it's been hanging on the Guitar Center wall for six months or more. That being said, they are more involved than a Tele to set up, and Bigsby's are finicky, especially to those who don't know how to approach them. Like Jazzmasters, Gretsches just require a little more TLC. It's part of the bargain.

I have a 6120BS, a 6120 Hot Rod, a Duo Jet with Dynasonics, and a 6119-1959, and I never have problems with tuning. Pinned, not pinned, locking tuners, normal tuners -- doesn't matter. And I yank the crap out of that bar. It's all a matter of know-how and experience -- and I'd still rather deal with that than a tension-bar tremolo.

No, I haven't played a Doozy. If I ever see one in a shop (still haven't...) I'll certainly play one. And if it's as good a fit for me as a 6120, I'd consider it...but the misrepresentation the company has put forth would likely keep the guitar hanging on the wall.

Waxhead
01-27-2011, 01:59 PM
I remember looking at Doozies a while back, when I first saw them on TGP. Looked interesting, but nothing I'd kill for. Nothing in their lineup could replace a good 6120. Nothing. That red hollowbody is the closest, but it looks like an Artcore to me.

I'm glad the tuners are great, but the tension bar likely makes up for the lack of complication at the head-end -- at least that's my experience with every tension-barred Bigsby I've owned.

Please be aware: Gretsch is not "made by Fender." It is "made by Gretsch." Fender distributes & markets, a fact which is readily discernible by anyone with an interest to know, and not kept hidden in order to make more money. Furthermore, Gretsch has been remarkably sensitive to players' needs, and they are making a truly unique product to high tolerances -- which certainly wasn't always the case with Gretsch!

I have nothing against Korean guitars. If I wanted a mid-level hollowish guitar, I'd be torn between the Reverend Pete Anderson & the Godin Kingpin II (yes, Canadian I know) both of which are significantly cheaper than a Doozy. "Cheaper" doesn't inherently refer to quality -- it's simply less expensive to make guitars in Korea than in Japan. (And apparently Canada's cheapest of all...but I digress.) If that difference isn't passed on to the buyer, then it seems reasonable to ask: Why not? Given that Doozy doesn't even seem interested in answering that question, in fact obfuscates it, means I'd never consider buying one. I could only wonder, reasonably or otherwise, what other corners were being cut on my nickel, without my knowledge.

Finally, on the set-up of Gretsches in shops: Even if they came out of Terada with perfect set-ups, do you think the trip to the States (for example) and being hung out to dry with little to no attention by the store is going to do good things for said set-up? Especially for a hollowbody with a floating bridge & a Bigsby. Sorry, you can't judge it like you can a Tele. I don't buy a guitar based on a set-up, and neither should you. That will tell you exactly NOTHING about the guitar, only that it's been hanging on the Guitar Center wall for six months or more. That being said, they are more involved than a Tele to set up, and Bigsby's are finicky, especially to those who don't know how to approach them. Like Jazzmasters, Gretsches just require a little more TLC. It's part of the bargain.

I have a 6120BS, a 6120 Hot Rod, a Duo Jet with Dynasonics, and a 6119-1959, and I never have problems with tuning. Pinned, not pinned, locking tuners, normal tuners -- doesn't matter. And I yank the crap out of that bar. It's all a matter of know-how and experience -- and I'd still rather deal with that than a tension-bar tremolo.

No, I haven't played a Doozy. If I ever see one in a shop (still haven't...) I'll certainly play one. And if it's as good a fit for me as a 6120, I'd consider it...but the misrepresentation the company has put forth would likely keep the guitar hanging on the wall.

+1 with everything there :drink

ckalinec
01-27-2011, 02:18 PM
This thread really makes me feel better about my judgement, ever since they came out I knew something was amiss, to me all the cosmetics just look cheap and kinda trashy, there was an Italian or some company called italia a few years ago that they reminded of and sparkly cheap looking guitars all look the same. Sadly I know a few worship guitarist that are playing them for a paycheck, and now every little 15yo wants one, makes me feel sick to my stomach. What a rip off.

Just out of curiosity, what worship players you know are getting payed to play them?

Zelja
01-27-2011, 02:40 PM
However, the out of phase situation in the mid pos really left me wanting.



That's an easy fix. I have the DC12 with the HB & HB sized P90 in the neck. Also wasn't a fan & changed the "twang" wiring to standard - although maybe not as distinctive from the other 2 positions, I like it a lot better.

K.E.P.
02-02-2011, 11:04 PM
not a expert on either, but I have a Mike Campbell on order after hearing tons of good ones.

I also trust Vince Gill:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u355x5q9l3w

Dylan61
02-02-2011, 11:35 PM
Some Dutch stores don't sell Dusenbergs guitars as they are affraid to loose there contact with the 'major' firms, I hope I said that right.

There is a price difference between Europe and the USA, but that counts for us the other way, we have to much more on Fender Custom Guitars.

I have payed $2000 for my D49 without the D suitcase ($200),

I don't know USA prices.
Hope it is a help.

Gretschdaddy
02-09-2011, 07:06 AM
Forgive me people but you should read yourselves. All the cliches about American insularity are crystallised in this Duesenberg thread.

I love American culture, the music, the films, the cars and mostly the guitars but over here in the U.K we pay through the nose for American Guitars. Imagine a Les Paul pounds for dollars - so a custom shop Historic Black Beauty is about $5.5k or a Nocaster for $4.2k and welcome to my world! Its all because of import tax.

Duesenbergs are not American and they may be sold from Europe and made in the East but I kind of like the fact that they are overpriced in the USA, it sort of rhymes really....

Zach.drummond
02-09-2011, 09:14 AM
This thread really makes me feel better about my judgement, ever since they came out I knew something was amiss, to me all the cosmetics just look cheap and kinda trashy, there was an Italian or some company called italia a few years ago that they reminded of and sparkly cheap looking guitars all look the same. Sadly I know a few worship guitarist that are playing them for a paycheck, and now every little 15yo wants one, makes me feel sick to my stomach. What a rip off.

Have you ever played a Duesenberg? It's one solid instrument. If you don't like the style, that's your personal preference (Which you are perfectly entitled to).

Just out of curiosity, what worship players you know are getting payed to play them?

Perhaps he is referring to Hillsong? If so, I don't know where he would get the notion that they are being payed to play Duesenbergs. That's just ridiculous.

Zach.drummond
02-09-2011, 09:16 AM
Forgive me people but you should read yourselves. All the cliches about American insularity are crystallised in this Duesenberg thread....

We Americans aren't really familiar with your stereotypes of us. Perhaps you should enlighten us.

Gretschdaddy
02-10-2011, 06:03 AM
Come on Zach read the forums on here - all the snoot about Japanese Gretsches and Korean Duesenbergs......... No offence meant just trying to bring a bit of humour to this slightly Imperialist excess implict in some of the threads.

We Brits like to laugh at ourselves you see - we have had to learn to join in with everyone else I guess.

But don't you think there is an 'Emperors New Clothes' element to all this? If the guitars pass muster who cares about the country of origin? If anyone thinks they are overpriced, then don't buy....simple.

But import tax is the reason for the price hike, not just the Manufacturer profiteering -old fashioned mercantile protectionism.......

Jon C
02-10-2011, 07:38 AM
a friend who has a couple of nice newer (made in Japan) Gretsches (as I do) has played the Duesys and told me that in his opinion, they were "overpriced junk" compared to the finish quality of his Gretsches ... having heard here for the 1st time that they're Korean/German hybrids with some deceptive-sounding marketing I can understand (even though I have some excellent Korean-made guitars by Epi & Gretsch).

buchla300
02-10-2011, 08:27 AM
a friend who has a couple of nice newer (made in Japan) Gretsches (as I do) has played the Duesys and told me that in his opinion, they were "overpriced junk" compared to the finish quality of his Gretsches ... having heard here for the 1st time that they're Korean/German hybrids with some deceptive-sounding marketing I can understand (even though I have some excellent Korean-made guitars by Epi & Gretsch).

Price wise, what do I know (US pricing might be high) but he is talking crap if he says they are junk.
Gretsch are also excellent so I can see he is happy with those but IMHO Duesenbergs are on a par and I preferred the Duesenbergs I have played (about 5 of them) but no difference in quality and the Duesenberg pickups are superb. A friend has some in his ES-335 and it sounds superb.
Play one yourself. Make your own mind up. If you can't find one, then give an opinion when you have played one.

Zuhzuhzombie!!
02-10-2011, 09:19 AM
3K for a Korean made guitar is ridiculous. That's about the only issue I, as an American, would have with foreign made guitars.

You can buy a Made in Germany by a German Hofner for less than what a Korean made Deus goes for.

buchla300
02-10-2011, 09:35 AM
3K for a Korean made guitar is ridiculous. That's about the only issue I, as an American, would have with foreign made guitars.

You can buy a Made in Germany by a German Hofner for less than what a Korean made Deus goes for.

$1200 for the Starplayer where I am but who's counting.
And why is it ridiculous?

Zuhzuhzombie!!
02-10-2011, 09:39 AM
Because cost of manufacturing in Korea is ridiculously low so the ridiculously high price has to do with markup.

I can't think of any other company that builds instruments in Asia and "inspects" them in the company's native country with a price tag that high. Where it's made means nothing to me. It's not the fact that it is made in Korea that's the problem, it's the ridiculous mark up.

Dues Starplayer runs anywhere between 2 and 3k as far as I can see.

buchla300
02-10-2011, 09:58 AM
Because cost of manufacturing in Korea is ridiculously low so the ridiculously high price has to do with markup.

I can't think of any other company that builds instruments in Asia and "inspects" them in the company's native country with a price tag that high. Where it's made means nothing to me. It's not the fact that it is made in Korea that's the problem, it's the ridiculous mark up.

Dues Starplayer runs anywhere between 2 and 3k as far as I can see.

Tell me what a worker earns in Korea building guitars?
Then tell me how much cheaper the raw materials are (especially on quality guitars, not budget ones) than for a USA builder?
Then we can talk!
Korean wages have risen WAY faster than many other countries.
I am sure they still earn less than US workers, but how much?
Without this info, you can't say ridculously cheap to build.
Yamaha build many of their guitars in Korea including some of the higher end ones for example. QUality instruments.
It really is the case that if you are in the USA, they are probably overpriced because of importers and distributers. Over here, they are well priced for the quality (unlike Gibson)

Zuhzuhzombie!!
02-10-2011, 10:28 AM
they are probably overpriced because of importers and distributers


Which is what I said.

:rolleyes:


Yamaha has no 2 - 3k guitar made outside of Japan.

They had some made in Indonesia but they rarely approached 1500$. SBG's are hand crafted in Japan.

buchla300
02-10-2011, 10:49 AM
Which is what I said.

:rolleyes:


Yamaha has no 2 - 3k guitar made outside of Japan.

They had some made in Indonesia but they rarely approached 1500$. SBG's are hand crafted in Japan.

Roll your eyes if you like but I didn't disagree with that point, I did disagree with your assumption that it is ridiculously cheap to make a guitar in Korea. Do you have figures?
If you can back up your statement with fact it would be nice.
Have you actually played a Duesenberg btw?
Hardware costs too and that is not generic cheap stuff that others might use. All Duesenbergs are Plek'd. The pickups are great.

In any case, I couldn't care where they were made, they are great guitars and perhaps in your world, overpriced, but in mine they fit nicely into a bracket where they are hard to beat. The Carl Carlon I played was so much nicer than stuff at the same price, but I wasn't looking to buy..

Yamaha had some pretty pricey guitars made in Korea too..Certainly higher than the $1200 a starplayer costs (me) and nobody cared.
Not that it even matters. Individual guitars should be judged on their own merit and I have played a few Duesenbergs and on that count, they win.

Jon C
02-10-2011, 10:58 AM
Price wise, what do I know (US pricing might be high) but he is talking crap if he says they are junk.
Gretsch are also excellent so I can see he is happy with those but IMHO Duesenbergs are on a par and I preferred the Duesenbergs I have played (about 5 of them) but no difference in quality and the Duesenberg pickups are superb. A friend has some in his ES-335 and it sounds superb.
Play one yourself. Make your own mind up. If you can't find one, then give an opinion when you have played one.

I know him, know his standards and know what he (and I) like... so if he thought the quality was well below par for the price ($2000+ here), I don't doubt it. I've never seen one around locally to try out and haven't got enough interest to go looking for one esp. since I have what I need now. ;)

buchla300
02-10-2011, 11:04 AM
I know him, know his standards and know what he (and I) like... so if he thought the quality was well below par for the price ($2000+ here), I don't doubt it. I've never seen one around locally to try out and haven't got enough interest to go looking for one esp. since I have what I need now. ;)

Cool. I have my first hand experience and although I have better guitars and all I need, your friends use of the word "Junk" is surprising as I have never seen a duesenberg that could be considered anything close to junk. Some might not like it. Some might hate them but Junk just implies bad quality. No chance. Zero chance.

Ekluksdahl
02-11-2011, 02:55 AM
I'm playing out of my Gretsch Power Jet Firebird a lot lately.... No complaints here.... Love the sound and vibe.... Especially through the Britain 3.0 or Reason Grande. Hopefully will get a Duo Jet soon....

Never played a Doozy but wouldn't be opposed to trying one out. I do love the Gretsch sound tho!!!!

mcdes
02-11-2011, 04:27 AM
the difference for me between the two..... and this is just my opinion....

the Gretsch's have history and Mojo, ive played the duo jet and a white falcon, i liked the falcon alot, not so much the duo jet, just sounded bland (prob just the pickups).

the Duesenbergs are new to the market. Its always going to be hard to break into a top end market, specially being made in asia! but, the proof is in the pudding for me! i love my Carl Carlton model, and the vintage humbucker pickup in the bridge and the trem are my favourite parts, then the middle out of phase position for cleans only (dont like it with dirt), and then the finish is superb............ the P90 is not exactly doing it for me, and havent been able to bond with it yet at all (other than when mixed in the out of phase middle position).
expensive? yes, but lets be honest, who pays full price?? i bought my one for about $3300 NZdollars, which was about $1900 USdollars at the time if i remember rightly??

overall, people like different gats, and can be fiercely loyal to a certain brand, take me for instance, people like rickenbackers, i cant stand the shape so would never buy one (much like a duesy cool cat), but i wouldnt bag it, as ive never 'personally' played one. And people who played one and didnt like it, fair enough...........

just my thoughts anyway.............

IAE
02-11-2011, 02:48 PM
Duesenberg are NOT guitars of high end German craftmanship as we all know and love, and expect from Germany.
Check these headstocks out, the end....Where the binding is scrapped, this is 100% unacceptable for a brand new 3 grand guitar.(two different guitar pics included)

http://i1016.photobucket.com/albums/af286/fenderamerica/D11.png

http://i1016.photobucket.com/albums/af286/fenderamerica/D1.png

This is piss poor quality and I've noticed a few like it, well, everyone of them that I can find hi-res pics of so its shite IMO.
German craftsmanship and precision is famous the world over and these guitars are not German quality, they are Chinese quality.

If I want high end German guitar (Made in Germany by German's) I'll buy a Nik Huber (http://www.nikhuberguitars.com/)!
Totally unacceptable and Duesenberg should be damn well ashamed of itself for claiming these piss poor examples are high end German products!

These examples makes me think what we don't see in pics, like the frets etc, all the little things that make or break a guitar.
I'd be surprised if the guitars have ever even been in Germany to tell you the truth!

sharbono
03-03-2011, 12:44 PM
I love my Duesenbergs. I have two Starplayer DTVs that are great. They are built so well and look nothing like the last post. That said, it is so subjective. They just feel and sound like me.

I would like to point out the China and Korea are two different places in East Asia.

Waxhead
03-03-2011, 02:40 PM
I've never seen a Duesenberg up close but can they compete with this kind of quality - cause I've not seen any other guitar maker that can :bow

http://i221.photobucket.com/albums/dd231/newysurfer/GretschNashville6120.jpg

olihp
03-29-2011, 07:58 PM
I bought a doozy..just cause of its consistency, craftsmanship & phenomenal sound...solid feel...who cares about where its actually made? if artists use them and marked up to a certain price..theres got to be a reason...good or bad..thats up to one's liking...

playon
05-18-2011, 10:28 PM
Came to this thread late, but as a Duesy owner want to chip in.

I'll preface my remarks by saying I have owned every vintage holy grail guitar known to man, with the exception of Gretsch, and I've been a pro player for over 30 years.

Why are people comparing the Duesenbergs with Gretsch? The only thing they have in common is maybe some of the looks (Starplayer TV) and a Bigsby. Different construction, different materials, different scale length, pickups, etc. What's the point? Both guitars have their strengths and weaknesses. I would maybe play a Gretsch if they had a long scale version.


I got curious about the Duesenbergs originally because hardly anyone makes a thin hollowbody with the 25.5" scale. I don't bond with short scale guitars but like having alternatives to my Fenders. I bought a Gibson Johnny A for this reason. However for what I play, the Duesenberg Starplayer TV I bought has knocked the Gibson out of the box and in fact I just sold it. The JA handled better, was lighter and easier to play, but the Duesenberg kills it for tone. It likes being strung up with 11-50 strings.

I own this Starplayer TV Chris Whitley signature model, which I bought used but minty off of German ebay for $1900 including shipping. I

http://home.comcast.net/~playon/doozy.jpg

I bought this model because it's flashy and I like red, and hate orange and black & I think the Mike Campbell model is hideous. The same guitar would have been about $2800 here in the USA if I could have found one. I could have bought the same guitar in a more common color for $1200=1500 off of EU ebay, which I think is a fair price for them. Yes I agree they are way overpriced in the USA. Duesenberg has been genius at getting these guitars into the hands of very high profile players, they know how to market. I knew that the bodies were made in Korea before I bought mine. So what... my Toyota was made in Japan and it's the best car I've ever owned. I also own an Eastman flat top made in China which I bought used for $625 that totally competes with any Martin I've ever owned, for real.

What I don't like about them -- it is heavy (close to 9 lbs) and big. The stock pickups for me, sucked. It's not finished in nitro, for the prices they are charging it should be. The poly finish looks like it's about 1/4 inch thick. The neck is a bit thin/wide in profile, I usually prefer round full neck shapes.

What I like about it:

#1 THE SOUND. With the TV Jones pickups, it just sounds killer, but the stock PUs had no clarity and snap. I replaced them with TV Jones Classic Filtertrons and it came alive. Something about the spruce top combined with the maple block and body gives this guitar a sweetness when it breaks up into overdrive that is just the shiznit. For rock, Americana, etc it rules.

#2 It is a super heavy duty guitar, it's not going to fail or require pampering on gigs. Built like a tank.

#3 their version of the Bigsby works GREAT. I also modded mine with a Gibson tuneamatic bridge as this guitar came stock with a peizo bridge which was a tone sucker. I got rid of their stupid middle position tone circuit, which took about 5 minutes to remove. That's another nice thing about these guitars, you can pop off the pick-guard with 4 screws and take care of business, no screwing around dragging switches and controls thru the f-holes. It's even easier than working on a Telecaster.

They are made in the same factory as $800 Reverends, but they are much nicer guitars...

RomanS
05-19-2011, 03:17 AM
I would maybe play a Gretsch if they had a long scale version.




The Black/White Falcon, Country Club, and some versions of the Tennessee Rose all have 25.5" scale!

skintknuckle
05-19-2011, 06:33 AM
Playon: Great review. Cool guitar.

playon
05-19-2011, 01:02 PM
The Black/White Falcon, Country Club, and some versions of the Tennessee Rose all have 25.5" scale!

I might check them out if they aren't totally hollow bodies. The Falcon isn't my thing regardless, too many switches & too much bling.

playon
05-20-2011, 05:39 PM
http://cgi.ebay.de/Duesenberg-Starplayer-Special-Fiesta-Red-/220785113652?_trksid=p5197.m7&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26itu%3DUCI%26otn%3D5%26po%3D LVI%26ps%3D63%26clkid%3D71039763385107134#ht_988wt _1128

Looks to be going cheap... if you can talk the guy into shipping to the US it's a pretty sweet deal.

sector9
05-20-2011, 07:05 PM
I might check them out if they aren't totally hollow bodies. The Falcon isn't my thing regardless, too many switches & too much bling.

You should of bought a reverend guitar and saved yourself alot of money.

Zuhzuhzombie!!
05-20-2011, 09:27 PM
How do you spend 1800$ and love the sound of the guitars with pickups that you think suck?

james...
07-09-2011, 06:49 AM
I just want to give my experience here.

I'm from the Hillsong camp so I was on the fence on whether to get a Duo Jet or a Starplayer since the common sentiment with Hillsong fans now is to get a Starplayer.

A buddy of mine who techs for Nigel Hendroff said he was given his Starplayer for free and may or may not have received a little cash on top if he played it at public events. All he said is, "I don't know about the details of the deal, but I can tell you he never plays the Doozy in the Studio."

That was all I needed to hear. I bought a Duo Jet.

foppy
07-09-2011, 07:53 AM
I just want to give my experience here.

I'm from the Hillsong camp so I was on the fence on whether to get a Duo Jet or a Starplayer since the common sentiment with Hillsong fans now is to get a Starplayer.

A buddy of mine who techs for Nigel Hendroff said he was given his Starplayer for free and may or may not have received a little cash on top if he played it at public events. All he said is, "I don't know about the details of the deal, but I can tell you he never plays the Doozy in the Studio."

That was all I needed to hear. I bought a Duo Jet.

I know we all can be influenced by what our favorite players play but...

wouldn't playing them to decide for yourself what you like be the decisive factor?

blasius01
07-11-2011, 05:35 PM
I have a duo jet, white falcon & a duesenburg and I can honestly say that it's hard to put the duesenburg down... Maybe it's the gear I'm using but the duesenburg has everything I'm looking for in a guitar. Every time I play my other gretsches I'm like " nah doesn't sound right.... Where's my doosey " :)

sameh
07-12-2011, 08:14 AM
I just want to give my experience here.

I'm from the Hillsong camp so I was on the fence on whether to get a Duo Jet or a Starplayer since the common sentiment with Hillsong fans now is to get a Starplayer.

A buddy of mine who techs for Nigel Hendroff said he was given his Starplayer for free and may or may not have received a little cash on top if he played it at public events. All he said is, "I don't know about the details of the deal, but I can tell you he never plays the Doozy in the Studio."

That was all I needed to hear. I bought a Duo Jet.

Actually, Nigel recently posted pictures on his twitter showing a recording session he was doing, and guess what? It wasn't only a duesenberg he was using...it was 2 duesenbergs plus 2 Jackson amps...

that is not prove that a duesenberg is better than a gretsch...both are great and it is up to each guitarist to choose their preference.. having said that, duesenbergs are great guitars in every aspect, and yes, they are made in germany, not handmade, but factory made, using some components from other countries including the us and Italy...

for those who haven't heard a duesenberg in action, watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dxA1Id09SXY&feature=related

and for those who say they are not well made, watch this testimony by a world class player, who has access to any guitar he wants, watch 1:12:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka0rHrhKssw&feature=related

A list of pro guitarists who use duesenbergs doesn't prove that you need to buy one, but show that they can deliver on the highest level if somebody is asking this question...
Robb McIntosh, Peter Stroud, Shawn Tubss, Mark Baldwin, Stu G, Nigel Hendroff, Jerry McPherson, Vince Gill, etc... didn't all get it wrong...

buchla300
07-12-2011, 08:33 AM
dxA1Id09SXY

Catoogie
07-12-2011, 09:23 AM
Heavy? Check

Thick Poly Finish? Check

Dislike the Wide/Thin Neck Profile? Check

Hate stock pickups? Check

Yup, just what I look for in a guitar.


Came to this thread late, but as a Duesy owner want to chip in.

I'll preface my remarks by saying I have owned every vintage holy grail guitar known to man, with the exception of Gretsch, and I've been a pro player for over 30 years.

Why are people comparing the Duesenbergs with Gretsch? The only thing they have in common is maybe some of the looks (Starplayer TV) and a Bigsby. Different construction, different materials, different scale length, pickups, etc. What's the point? Both guitars have their strengths and weaknesses. I would maybe play a Gretsch if they had a long scale version.


I got curious about the Duesenbergs originally because hardly anyone makes a thin hollowbody with the 25.5" scale. I don't bond with short scale guitars but like having alternatives to my Fenders. I bought a Gibson Johnny A for this reason. However for what I play, the Duesenberg Starplayer TV I bought has knocked the Gibson out of the box and in fact I just sold it. The JA handled better, was lighter and easier to play, but the Duesenberg kills it for tone. It likes being strung up with 11-50 strings.

I own this Starplayer TV Chris Whitley signature model, which I bought used but minty off of German ebay for $1900 including shipping. I

http://home.comcast.net/%7Eplayon/doozy.jpg

I bought this model because it's flashy and I like red, and hate orange and black & I think the Mike Campbell model is hideous. The same guitar would have been about $2800 here in the USA if I could have found one. I could have bought the same guitar in a more common color for $1200=1500 off of EU ebay, which I think is a fair price for them. Yes I agree they are way overpriced in the USA. Duesenberg has been genius at getting these guitars into the hands of very high profile players, they know how to market. I knew that the bodies were made in Korea before I bought mine. So what... my Toyota was made in Japan and it's the best car I've ever owned. I also own an Eastman flat top made in China which I bought used for $625 that totally competes with any Martin I've ever owned, for real.

What I don't like about them -- it is heavy (close to 9 lbs) and big. The stock pickups for me, sucked. It's not finished in nitro, for the prices they are charging it should be. The poly finish looks like it's about 1/4 inch thick. The neck is a bit thin/wide in profile, I usually prefer round full neck shapes.

What I like about it:

#1 THE SOUND. With the TV Jones pickups, it just sounds killer, but the stock PUs had no clarity and snap. I replaced them with TV Jones Classic Filtertrons and it came alive. Something about the spruce top combined with the maple block and body gives this guitar a sweetness when it breaks up into overdrive that is just the shiznit. For rock, Americana, etc it rules.

#2 It is a super heavy duty guitar, it's not going to fail or require pampering on gigs. Built like a tank.

#3 their version of the Bigsby works GREAT. I also modded mine with a Gibson tuneamatic bridge as this guitar came stock with a peizo bridge which was a tone sucker. I got rid of their stupid middle position tone circuit, which took about 5 minutes to remove. That's another nice thing about these guitars, you can pop off the pick-guard with 4 screws and take care of business, no screwing around dragging switches and controls thru the f-holes. It's even easier than working on a Telecaster.

They are made in the same factory as $800 Reverends, but they are much nicer guitars...

AtomicAlive
07-12-2011, 10:00 AM
This.

Trend. Especially amongst worship players (Wroship player my self). IT kind of bothers me a bit to see the worship players hop from on guitar to another depending on who's playing what.

RomanS
07-12-2011, 02:40 PM
that is not prove that a duesenberg is better than a gretsch...both are great and it is up to each guitarist to choose their preference.. having said that, duesenbergs are great guitars in every aspect, and yes, they are made in germany, not handmade, but factory made, using some components from other countries including the us and Italy...






Nothing wrong with that, either, plenty of great guitars coming from Korea these days, just the pricing structure (esp. in the US - Duesenbergs are a lot less expensive in Europe) seems a bit exaggerated...

BTW, in the May 2010 issue of "Gitarre & Bass" (largest german guitar magazine), Dieter Gölsdorf himself admitted that only 5 luthies in Hannover assemble the guitars from parts made "all over the world" (his words) - he didn't mention any specific countries, though. But there's no way that 5 guys coul really build the numbers that the company sells...

Nope, they are not "made" in Germany - neither hand- nor factory-made.
The bodies and necks are made and finished in Korea, only the final assembly (with some parts indeed coming from Italy, as well as other places) and set-up (including PLEKing) are then done in Hannover, Germany.
A little less known outside continental Europe is that Gölsdorf also offers a line of Tele and Strat copies (originally called Diego - DIEtma GOelsdorf, get it? until he got a hold of the old Roger brand name) - those are assembled from parts built in the Czech Republic (just like Framus guitars, another "German" brand that only assembles parts made elsewhere ).

But hey, if car makers can do it, why not guitar manufacturers? You do know that a lot of Audis are built in Hungary (A3 and TT), Slovakia (Q7), Spain (Q3) Belgium (A1), all BMW engines come from either Austria (the large ones and Diesels), or the UK (the 4-cyl. ones), Porsches are built in Finland (Boxster & Cayman) and Slovakia (Cayenne) - yet they all have the price-tag of a "German-made" car?

idk
07-12-2011, 06:10 PM
Cuz Droff is teh bombz. =D
ditto

cmorockandroll
08-11-2011, 03:07 PM
I really wish the thought that they were not well made and were also made in Korea would spread like wild fire as well! Ha. I own a black Carl Carlton. Plays so great and sounds incredible through my Divided by 13 JRT 9/15. I want another Doozy really bad!

myao001
08-11-2011, 07:23 PM
Why is there such anger over paying $2000 for a partially Korean-built guitar that plays awesome and sounds great? Aren't pro series Gretsch's made in Japan and cost >$2000? I'm not understanding why so many people are upset. It seems like there's always a backlash against things that are popular...even though the doozy wasn't even that popular. I understand if you don't like the way they sound - but to be dismissive and say that they're poorly made or bad guitars sounds like you don't like the "bandwagon" players that buy the guitars rather than the guitars themselves.

djg714
08-11-2011, 08:16 PM
A little too many ornaments for my taste.

sector9
08-11-2011, 09:55 PM
Why is there such anger over paying $2000 for a partially Korean-built guitar that plays awesome and sounds great? Aren't pro series Gretsch's made in Japan and cost >$2000? I'm not understanding why so many people are upset. It seems like there's always a backlash against things that are popular...even though the doozy wasn't even that popular. I understand if you don't like the way they sound - but to be dismissive and say that they're poorly made or bad guitars sounds like you don't like the "bandwagon" players that buy the guitars rather than the guitars themselves.


To answer your questions, Japan has a history of making some of the best guitars in the world, so paying that much for a Gretsch is not a shock. There are quite a few very good guitars coming out of korea today such as Reverend guitars which cost under a $1000 with incredible build quality and sound, so why are the doozy guitars so much more?

It's a combination of the company misleading people by calling them german made, and once you find out they are actually korean made, why the hell are they $2000 when the average price of a really nice korean guitar under a grand. Bla Bla Bla who really cares.

mcdes
08-11-2011, 10:25 PM
Bla Bla Bla who really cares.

This!!

wesc
08-31-2011, 11:59 PM
A friend of mine just got the blue pearl starplayer TV. They sound amazing and are very well built. I don't really see what people base the cheapness on. The action was set up so perfectly. I really liked the Bigsby a bit better than the gretsch because it reminded me more of a strat trem. It sounds great but definitely different than a gretsch. Find a shop and play both. The pearl colors are a bit ridiculously priced considering it's the same guitar as any other starplayer but with twice the price tag. My next ax will be the Carl Carlton in white finish, but I would also take a Gretsch 6120 in orange or black any day lol.

chequepoint
09-01-2011, 10:59 AM
Have you ever played a Duesenberg? It's one solid instrument. If you don't like the style, that's your personal preference (Which you are perfectly entitled to).



Perhaps he is referring to Hillsong? If so, I don't know where he would get the notion that they are being payed to play Duesenbergs. That's just ridiculous.

The duesenberg reps came through nashville a few years ago with checkbooks open trying to sign players up,why is it ridiculous to believe hillsong didn't get the treatment? Music BUSINESS. Just because you're singing about god doesn't mean you don't need to get paid.

Zuhzuhzombie!!
09-01-2011, 11:19 AM
Hofner makes Verythin's in a 25.5 scale FYI.

buchla300
09-01-2011, 12:18 PM
The duesenberg reps came through nashville a few years ago with checkbooks open trying to sign players up,why is it ridiculous to believe hillsong didn't get the treatment? Music BUSINESS. Just because you're singing about god doesn't mean you don't need to get paid.

True. And it also doesn't have any relevance to the quality of a guitar.
Duesenbergs are great guitars IMHO.
Gibson, Fender, PRS, Martin, Yamaha, Ibanez all have signature artists and endorsees.. That's just business and marketing.

The end product is what counts and I think they are quality instruments.

Hammertone
09-01-2011, 12:45 PM
Hofner makes Verythin's in a 25.5 scale FYI.

Those are mostly discontinued, and include the Verythin Classic, JS and Standard. Hofner refers to it as a 25.4" scale in its older catalogues. There are still a few of them to be found both new and used.

Hofner's current catalogue includes:
- CT Verythin - 24.7" scale.
- Verythin Special, Custom and Singlecut - 24.7" scale.

Zuhzuhzombie!!
09-01-2011, 02:17 PM
Change in scales was this years production, IIRC. Can probably find NOS in the right scale length.

Cheaper than Dues and actually hand made in Germany to boot.

uptheweight
09-07-2011, 10:28 PM
How do you spend 1800$ and love the sound of the guitars with pickups that you think suck?

exactly...i have been looking at Duesenberg starplayers and gretsch 6128 duo jets....i DON'T wanna spend that much money and have to swap out pickups to make it sound good...im used to buying guitars that sound great already...currently playing a Mcinturff Glory Custom...its a piece of beauty!..sounds amazing...with that said, i expect the same sound and quality out of a guitar that costs what they do....im gonna keep looking though..i get what people are saying about being made in Korea...BUT the selling point to me is how much i love it...we all overpay for SO many things in this world...its supply and demand.....a local music store here has people ordering them left and right..so apparently, ALOT of people in the states dont mind spending the cash

uptheweight
09-07-2011, 10:31 PM
Cuz Droff is teh bombz. =D
yes he is!...so much of his "tone" everyone wants is in his hands and effects..there are clips from his hillsong workshops where he will play a riff w/out effect to show how much the effect makes it...when his sound is dry, its nothing special!!..i was shocked actually...but his pedalboards (and knowing how well to use his effects) makes his tone what it is!

buchla300
09-07-2011, 11:26 PM
exactly...i have been looking at Duesenberg starplayers and gretsch 6128 duo jets....i DON'T wanna spend that much money and have to swap out pickups to make it sound good...im used to buying guitars that sound great already...currently playing a Mcinturff Glory Custom...its a piece of beauty!..sounds amazing...with that said, i expect the same sound and quality out of a guitar that costs what they do....im gonna keep looking though..i get what people are saying about being made in Korea...BUT the selling point to me is how much i love it...we all overpay for SO many things in this world...its supply and demand.....a local music store here has people ordering them left and right..so apparently, ALOT of people in the states dont mind spending the cash


Don't buy one if you don't like the pups. I happen to think the pickups are excellent. The carl carlton has a great balance between the neck and bridge.
And sure used is good. Last new guitar I bought was 20 years ago!

christhurman
10-09-2011, 08:41 PM
So I own a Gretsch 6128T w/ Fltertrons... thinking about getting a doozy... bad idea???

blasius01
10-09-2011, 10:42 PM
So I own a Gretsch 6128T w/ Fltertrons... thinking about getting a doozy... bad idea???

I have both and I can honestly say my gretsch doesnt get much play now that I have the Duesy.... I LOVE IT SOOOOO MUCH

christhurman
10-09-2011, 11:57 PM
I have both and I can honestly say my gretsch doesnt get much play now that I have the Duesy.... I LOVE IT SOOOOO MUCH


How would you describe their sound difference?

blasius01
10-10-2011, 11:21 PM
How would you describe their sound difference?

Not sure if you would agree with this or not lol but.... The Duesy has more of a bright Tele/Gretsch sound... and the Duo Jet is a Gretschy/Les Paul sound...

For stuff like Jesus Culture ( heavier stuff ) the Gretsch gets some really nice lowend crunch to it... It has a very Les Paul feel to it, the neck is a little fat for my liking but it sounds sooo good

The duesy has a very Hillsong sound to it ( fancy that lol) the cleans are very chimey like a tele and the distortion is very mid heavy....it cuts through very nicely ... The thing I love about this guitar is the neck... Its sooo easy to play and fits right into my hands like a nice worn glove.

Both are killer guitars and you would be more than happy with either or but for me if I had one to choose it would be the Duesenburg no questions asked

What it comes down to is if you like Les pauls get the Gretsch.... If you like Teles get the Duesy!!!

Anyone else please chime in if you agree with my statement

Thanks

blasius01
10-10-2011, 11:22 PM
Just noticed you already own a gretsch haha

mcdes
10-11-2011, 02:50 AM
Anyone else please chime in if you agree with my statement

Thanks

true dat!

Eagle1
10-11-2011, 03:04 AM
Korean Gretschs are just as good in the woodwork and that leaves you the cash to upgrade the pickups .
The Dusenbergs are very ordinary and not good at the money.

christhurman
10-11-2011, 06:58 AM
Just noticed you already own a gretsch haha


Yeah, and I have the tele... I think I'll stick with what I got... the gretsch is a solid guitar and I absolutely love the way it sounds. I was just curious about a doozy. I feel like I have prevailed over the GAS this time though!

rocklogic
01-24-2012, 08:53 AM
I have a 6120, which I have been using quite a number of years now. She's the main staple - partially because of the tone.

I then got a Starplayer Chris Whitley (with piezo), and I'm kicking the Gretsch off; considering selling her even.

I love the Gretsch, but yeah - the Whitley fits the bill (for me anyway)!

localmotion411
01-24-2012, 08:57 AM
I played one and was HIGHLY unimpressed. I thought it was dull and lifeless and didn't feel that great. I was sorta bummed cause I wanted to like it but there was nothing about it's tone or feel I found attractive.

+1. I had a silver sparkle Starplayer TV that was beautiful to look at and nothing more. Very dull sounding and didn't play well or hold its tuning, even after two setups.

feet
01-24-2012, 07:01 PM
three quick things to add to this ancient thread:

hofner has a few guitars that are made in korea but finished in germany. they cost nothing near what a doozy does.

it took a lot of mods to make my gretsch what it is. a lot. but i'm very pleased with it now. very very.

never meet a doozy in person, but i'm not paying that much for an mik. sorry. that's just what it is. labor costs and all that. japan? sure. germany? would love to. tried to a few times but failed. if i really wanted to, i can get any old mik and have it "finished" here in america by a tech. would be a lot cheaper, too.

i'd still give one a fair shot if i came across one.

BedroomRockStar01
01-26-2012, 01:35 PM
Since this just got necro-bumbed, I suppose I'll chime in rather than start a new thread.

I just picked up a Starplayer TV+ off the forums, plugged it in, and fell in love. Very rarely do I pick up a guitar and not find something to complain about within the first 1-2 minutes. This one just played. No issues, no complaints, just played. I've only had that reaction with my Suhr Tele, a DGT, and my Martin and Bourgeois acoustics out of the countless dozens of guitars I've played.

The Starplayer is a great instrument, but that takes nothing away from Gretsch, as I've played several that were also fantastic guitars. The Starplayer just did it for me.

Label Bob
04-21-2012, 06:19 AM
Duesenberg does not pay anyone nor do they give guitars to anyone, they all pay for their Duesenberg's and the people claiming they are made in Korea are ignorant that is not the case at all.
The only time Duesenberg made anything Korea was the body of a bolt on neck guitar they made just for Sam Ash.

Label Bob
04-21-2012, 06:20 AM
Joe Walsh paid for his Doozy

Hard2Hear
04-21-2012, 08:19 AM
the people claiming they are made in Korea are ignorant that is not the case at all.
The only time Duesenberg made anything Korea was the body of a bolt on neck guitar they made just for Sam Ash.

Not what skin you have in the game to post this, but you are mistaken. Their marketing department has been working extra hard lately to cover up their tracks, though.

tamader74
04-21-2012, 09:30 AM
Feet, posted in January that he wouldn't pay that dollar for a MIK Instrument, MIJ OK,Germany OK, USA OK,..S.Korea is a free trade Country, and alot of Start-up luthiers from here, worked and some are still working there. I don't know if you heard of the Labor disputes there earlier this century, and they still make some "Fine" guitar bones. The BIGGEST difference between MIJ and CIJ is the later has "Other parts" than Japanese/USA made (Thats just their trade law) With that being said the Tereda Plant in Japan has a high % of english speaking workers/ apprentice and Pro. Luthiers under employment and the "Higher end" MIK Gretsch 'gits are Usually a cut above most in quality in most opinions. I cannot attest for Duesenburg's playability, as I've never played one nor seen one up close and personal if you will...But, I'm positive as I'm setting in this chair typing this post, They supply endorsers with gear...It's called business...Profits and taxes and taking lose's...even Percussion Mfg.'s do it. :band

Strat
04-21-2012, 10:00 AM
I picked up my first Duesenberg while on tour in Germany long before a USA item, have also had a 6120 for about 30 years and use them both extensively in live situations. I think there is very little similarities in their tone and cannot pinch hit one for the other in how I use them. The classic 6120 sound that I need is simply not in a Duesenberg with stock pickups but I LOVE what those pickups do in there own right. If you don't like the stock pickups you don't really like a Duesenberg. Swapping out would be akin to HB's in a tele; sure, people do it but.......

Hammertone
04-21-2012, 07:39 PM
three quick things to add to this ancient thread:
hofner has a few guitars that are made in korea but finished in germany. they cost nothing near what a doozy does.


Almost. They are made and finished in China, then sent to Germany; (mostly) German hardware is installed; German pickups installed; they are wired and set up by German elves. These ones all have 24.7" scales.

I've played many Duesenbergs and I think they are nice guitars, but not to my taste - I don't like the look of their hardware and decor, or the feel of their necks, but they sound fine to me and I do like the idea of a Les Paul or an ES-335-style guitar with a 25.5" scale - not a lot of options for these. I just picked up a Larrivee RS-4 (essentially a Les Paul with a 25.5" scale, but really ugly) and it's vastly superior to any Duesenberg I've ever played, in every respect.

vortexxxx
04-21-2012, 11:18 PM
No other guitars really sound anything like Gretschs. I would like to pick up a Doozy at some point but not at the current prices in North America.

frisco kid
04-24-2012, 08:26 PM
The Korean connection is well established overseas...

Music Radar says the Pomona is Korean:

http://www.musicradar.com/gear/all/guitars/electric/6-string-solid-body/pomona-6-199442/review

This used to be the tagline online retailers used in Europe:

Duesenberg Guitars is a German company producing high-end electric guitars and basses with a distinctive Art Deco design since 1986. The company's name alludes to the legendary car company Duesenberg.
Models are assembled in Hannover Germany, where Korean woodwork is combined with parts from various sources in the Far East and Germany. Most hardware, including the single-coil/vintage, P-90 and humbucking pickups, are designed in-house.
The electric guitars feature solid and semi-solid, 12 and 6 string models. The range also includes signature models for German guitarist Carl Carlton, Ron Wood and Mike Campbell (of Tom Petty's Heartbreakers); a custom '49er' was built for Keith Richards. The latest version of the Starplayer TV incorporates Duesenberg's version of the piezo bridge.
In addition, the company has designed a range of replacement bridge/vibrato units. These include one based on the famous Bigsby vibrato and incorporates a novel locking device, while another is a bolt-on version of the B-Bender.


The only time Duesenberg made anything Korea was the body of a bolt on neck guitar they made just for Sam Ash.

twangster
04-26-2012, 04:08 PM
Sooo... Bob Dylan chose to play a 'Korean' guitar! Poor man, should he have known...:sarcasm

http://www3.pictures.gi.zimbio.com/37th+AFI+Life+Achievement+Award+Show+SuRk2gv_Au0l. jpg

RomanS
04-26-2012, 04:15 PM
The problem is NOT that it is a Korean guitar (plenty of great Korean-made guitars around) - the problem is that Duesenberg charges German prices for Korean-made guitars...

Would you pay Mercedes prices for a Hyundai?

Hard2Hear
04-26-2012, 04:37 PM
Exactly. I really like done of the early MIK Deans and Schecters when they were using real Tone Pros bridges, SD pickups, and Grover tuners. But they were well under a grand.

twangster
04-26-2012, 04:50 PM
Quote: Would you pay Mercedes prices for a Hyundai?

I paid 850 EUR for my Duesenberg 49er (used). Believe me it IS a Mercedes compared to most established brands.

To put an end to that "Duesenberg is overpriced" thing, just consider this:

Here in Europe, a Duesenberg Starplayer TV costs 1444 EUR.
A Fender Am Vintage '57 Strat costs 1777 EUR
A Gibson Les Paul Standard Trad costs 1600 EUR.
A Gretsch Duo-Jet costs 2770 EUR.

I'd take the Dues anyday.

gtraddict
04-26-2012, 05:09 PM
in the US the prices are flipped around quited a bit
US Fender is 1600
Gibson Tradition is about 1800
Jets start at 2000

Duesenbergs are a lot more

RomanS
04-26-2012, 05:19 PM
Quote: Would you pay Mercedes prices for a Hyundai?

I paid 850 EUR for my Duesenberg 49er (used). Believe me it IS a Mercedes compared to most established brands.

To put an end to that "Duesenberg is overpriced" thing, just consider this:

Here in Europe, a Duesenberg Starplayer TV costs 1444 EUR.
A Fender Am Vintage '57 Strat costs 1777 EUR
A Gibson Les Paul Standard Trad costs 1600 EUR.
A Gretsch Duo-Jet costs 2770 EUR.

I'd take the Dues anyday.

You are comparing US- (and Japanese-) made guitars to a Korean-made one; Peerless guitars (as an example for very well made Korean guitars) are much less expensive.

Again: nothing wrong with the quality of Duesenberg guitars (and their styling is a matter of taste - personally, I find their pseudo-retro design to be "trying to hard" - to keep up the car analogies, they are just like a new Mini, or a new Beetle - very well made, but totally without "soul" or "mojo", compared to the real (vintage) thing), nobody is disputing that; it is the pricing that sucks, realistically they should be priced like other Korean guitars - well below 1000€ for solidbodies, and not much above for hollowbodies (and keep in mind that here in Europe Duesenberg prices are much closer to reality - in the US the are REALLY overpriced!)
And what I REALLY dislike about the brand is their beeing marketed as "German-made" when they are in fact Korean-made, with some final assembly and set-up done in Germany - I'm all for "truth in advertising" (and fair pricing!)

nkjanssen
04-26-2012, 05:20 PM
I own a Starplayer TV. I have no idea where the individual parts are made or assembled or whatever. I don't really care either. I bought it used and paid around $1,500. It's a great guitar. I've sold a ton of guitars in the past year or two, but this one's a keeper. Very different than, but every bit as good as, any of my other keepers - Gibson R8, Les Paul Jr. and ES355, Gretsch Tennesee Rose, Fender Jazzmaster and '62 RI Tele and Creston Custom Tele.

And no, I don't have an endorsement deal.

I wish I did.

twangster
04-27-2012, 12:31 AM
You are comparing US- (and Japanese-) made guitars to a Korean-made one; Peerless guitars (as an example for very well made Korean guitars) are much less expensive.


I'm comparing guitars of equivalent quality (and even so the Duesenberg beats all the guitars I mentioned in terms of quality) no matter where they were supposedly made.

Even if you wish to stick to your 'country of manufacture/value' rationale (which in my point of view is completely irrelevant), I don't see anyone complaining about the price (2770 EUR) of the Japanese-made Duo-Jet.

RomanS
04-27-2012, 12:41 AM
Well, manufacturing cost in Japan are on par with those in the US - Korean ones are not.

Counry of manufacture is indeed pretty much irrelevant when it comes to quality - but manufacturing costs are a lot different between countries, and maximizing profits by passing something off as something it is not really irks me!

twangster
04-27-2012, 01:08 AM
Quote: "manufacturing costs are a lot different between countries, and maximizing profits by passing something off as something it is not really irks me!"

It's up to you to believe in the publicity hype (or not).

As for the moral stance, I have nothing against people maximizing profits (hell this is capitalism isn't it?).

My view is simple: if I get the quality I'm expecting for the price I paid, then I'm a happy camper. And my Dues has it in spades ;-)

pennylink
04-27-2012, 01:11 AM
Well, manufacturing cost in Japan are on par with those in the US - Korean ones are not.

Counry of manufacture is indeed pretty much irrelevant when it comes to quality - but manufacturing costs are a lot different between countries, and maximizing profits by passing something off as something it is not really irks me!
'Value' often has little to do with the actual cost of manufacturing. Look at the current price of a Klon for example, or what happens/happened to house prices. It's all about demand, availability and 'perceived value'.

adkteleman
04-27-2012, 11:35 AM
I tried both and Gretsch won hands down for me. From finish and fit to tone to playability. Doozy's were ok, not bad but the Gretsch just grabbed me and hasn't let go!

firegarden
05-09-2012, 01:22 AM
Here is my humble opinion, I have both a Gretsch 6120 and a Starplayer TV.
I won't say that one is better than the other for sure. I love both of them. I do think that the Duesy is more of an all rounder, however it lacks the sparkle of the Gretsch, especially on the bridge position. The Duesy's trem beats the Bigsby on the Gretsch tho. Also since the Starplayer has a PLEKed neck I can get the action really low which is what I like...anyway I only had it for a week but its been good :)

tochiro
08-03-2012, 02:35 AM
Just another case of a company hiding facts (guitars made in Korea) and giving misleading or ambiguous information (made in Germany). I tried several Duesenberg, their build quality are neither good nor bad, they lack character and personality and are currently fashionable.

Nothing new under the sun...

buchla300
08-03-2012, 02:59 AM
The "hidden" facts from their website

Components of our instruments are manufactured by leading industry companies around the world but we don’t outsource the assembly, the conditioning with the PLEK-machine or the final setup. That’s still done at our Duesenberg headquarters in Hannover by qualified luthiers.

theryanpaul
10-05-2013, 04:56 PM
i sold my custom shop gibson 335 fso i could get my duesy.... couldn't be happier, and don't regret it at all.

In saying that, i would recommend NOT getting one............... then i wont feel so bad about everyone having one!! hahaha (at least here in New Zealand, hardly a soul has one!)
How do you like the doozy compared to the gretsch black falcon? I'm assuming you have a black Carl Carlton ? I have a gretsch and am thinking of getting a CC

mcdes
10-05-2013, 06:05 PM
How do you like the doozy compared to the gretsch black falcon? I'm assuming you have a black Carl Carlton ? I have a gretsch and am thinking of getting a CC

Here i was thinking someone dredged this thread up again....... but its a question for me!!!

it was a vintage White CC actually! lol I wanted black for sure, but got a stoopid deal on it! i couldnt refuse.

i gave it away a few months ago, like literally, because i prefer the tone i get from the falcon, so wasnt using it (but i will admit, i was also worried about resale, thinking all the talk of MIK would catch up and the bottom fall out of the market, but they are very well made guitars regardless).... but i did really enjoy the doozy! the bridge pickup and trem were my favs, then the neck was superb!

different guitars for sure.

vortexxxx
10-05-2013, 10:44 PM
I'm comparing guitars of equivalent quality (and even so the Duesenberg beats all the guitars I mentioned in terms of quality) no matter where they were supposedly made.

Even if you wish to stick to your 'country of manufacture/value' rationale (which in my point of view is completely irrelevant), I don't see anyone complaining about the price (2770 EUR) of the Japanese-made Duo-Jet.

The Japanese-made Gretsch guitars are better than the previous ones made in the USA.
I wouldn't group the Asian guitars with a Made in Japan guitar. They can be a bit expensive but but quality-wise they are better than most USA guitars.

vortexxxx
10-05-2013, 10:48 PM
Duesenberg does not pay anyone nor do they give guitars to anyone, they all pay for their Duesenberg's and the people claiming they are made in Korea are ignorant that is not the case at all.
The only time Duesenberg made anything Korea was the body of a bolt on neck guitar they made just for Sam Ash.

Duesenberg currently admits that the bodies and necks come from various other country's.

SureD
10-06-2013, 03:10 AM
Duesenberg does not pay anyone nor do they give guitars to anyone, they all pay for their Duesenberg's and the people claiming they are made in Korea are ignorant that is not the case at all.
The only time Duesenberg made anything Korea was the body of a bolt on neck guitar they made just for Sam Ash.

Here in Europe it has been clear from the start that they get their parts (including the bodies and necks) from SE Asia. Under euro-legislation they cannot use "made in Germany" that is why they state "assembled in Germany"

As has also been said, they are not that expensive here in the EU (but still steep for MIK) nor do I observe much of the hype here that seems to be going on in the US.

BTW nothing against MIK guitars though, I am the proud owner of a MIK Gretsch 5420.

Arc Angel
10-07-2013, 08:34 AM
For me, its simply a matter of price/value. I have a Starplayer TV+ and think that its a great guitar. Good it for a great price (well less than a Japanese Gretsch) and think that at EU pricing, they are fairly competitive.