A Clockwork Orange - Original Version

[DWB1960]

Got the original version on BluRay (the one that was rated X upon release in the US. Not the edited R rated version) and sat and watched it from beginning to end. Had never really given it a full viewing with 100% attention span.

Weird, surreal, brutal, funny, disturbing, ironic, strange, groundbreaking, highly influential, beautifully shot, courageously acted, filled to the brim with innuendos, and did I say weird?

Didn't realize that it was based on a novel.

Gotta love when you can watch a movie and then find it hard to think about anything else for long afterwards.

Definitely a movie that will get a few more viewings to catch all of the subtleties.

[VicAjax]

well, the original version is actually the Aldous Huxley novel.. which i highly recommend, btw.

but yes, the original version of the movie is fantastic. and the synthesized "Ludwig Van" score is pretty awesome as well.

EDIT: i had a brainfart: ANTHONY BURGESS

[hades_1123]

I saw that movie 1 year ago and I love it !!! Stanley Kunrick was doing some great movies !!

[RocksOff]

Excellent book and movie. Highly influential. Bowie = "Ah, droogie... don't crash here. There's only room for one and here she come, here she come"

[Michael Hunter]

well, the original version is actually the Aldous Huxley novel.. which i highly recommend, btw.



Anthony Burgess.

[RocksOff]

well, the original version is actually the Aldous Huxley novel.. which i highly recommend, btw.

but yes, the original version of the movie is fantastic. and the synthesized "Ludwig Van" score is pretty awesome as well.

It's actually an Anthony Burgess novel. Huxley wrote Brave New World among others.

[hades_1123]

It's actually an Anthony Burgess novel. Huxley wrote Brave New World among others.

Wow I didn't know that !

I have the Huxley version and I tought it was the original version :bonk

[VicAjax]

Anthony Burgess.

whoops! yep, i obviously have pre-senile dementia. :bonk

[DWB1960]

Excellent book and movie. Highly influential. Bowie = "Ah, droogie... don't crash here. There's only room for one and here she come, here she come"

Indeed. Terry Gillian's Brazil owes a debt to Clockwork. As does a ton of other films. The scene in Reservoir Dogs with the guys walking towards the camera in slow motion is a direct nod to the similar scene in ACO.

And of course:

http://www.nicholasdrums.com/images/influences/johnbonham68745.jpg

[Pfeister]

Didn't realize that it was based on a novel.

The book is 100x better. I read the book first and movie was crap in comparison, really.

I'm not aiming at this at anybody here, but it drives me nuts when anybody talks about how creative the movie was. They don't know what they're missing. It's not even worthy to be compared to the book, IMO. The book's language, pacing, and just about everything else about it is amazing.

[zombywoof]

I recall going to see that flick when first released. Had us all speaking speaking Nadsat afterwards.

[Whats4dessert]

....did you know that there are TWO versions of the book: the second version has a final chapter that's not in the movie??

[DWB1960]

....did you know that there are TWO versions of the book: the second version has a final chapter that's not in the movie??

And that if Malcolm McDowall had turned down the role, Mick Jagger was set to play Alex with the rest of the Stones playing the Droogs?

So glad Malcolm agreed to do the movie.

[A-Bone]

And that if Malcolm McDowall had turned down the role, Mick Jagger was set to play Alex with the rest of the Stones playing the Droogs?

So glad Malcolm agreed to do the movie.

Agreed. Having Mick and co. in there would have been really distracting.

[andrekp]

The scene in Reservoir Dogs with the guys walking towards the camera in slow motion is a direct nod to the similar scene in ACO.


Actually, this has to be one of the most "quoted" scenes in all of film and TV. I see stuff all the time that has 3 to 5 guys, walking slowmo, toward the camera ala ACO, usually carrying something. Office Space comes to mind immediately.

For another bit of trivia, all the slang is actually Russian.

Probably because at that time it was going to be the Russians that would bring things to an apocolyptic head. Just like later (Blade Runner, Firefly) it would be the Chinese.

[Frankee]

The ending in the book is different from the movie.

Great, groudbreaking film.......but you should read the book.

The book also contains a glossary of the slang that is employed by the "Nasdat".

[jimmyj]

I remember reading the book in the early '70s and then later seeing the movie when it came out.
I don't remember a lot of details about either so I'm due to view it anew. I remember the general gist of it and a lot of guys calling each droogie for a while.

[cob666]

Ending in the movie is only different from the original version of the book because the Burgess book has 3 sections of 7 chapters while the American publication omits the final chapter to more suite the tastes of the American reading public at the time, which drastically changes the tone of the story from one of self redemption to one of well... ultra violence. Kubrick's screenplay is based on the American version.

[germs]

so...without getting TOS'd:

what're the main differences between the two movie versions?

couldn't be much, i'd imagine. maybe a slo(wer)-mo 3 way and extended rape scene?

no offense, don't think i'd watch for that alone...

[chrisr777]

And that if Malcolm McDowall had turned down the role, Mick Jagger was set to play Alex with the rest of the Stones playing the Droogs?

So glad Malcolm agreed to do the movie.


Actually, Mick was pretty disturbing in Performance. I think he could have pulled it off. The rest of the band maybe not.

[DWB1960]

so...without getting TOS'd:

what're the main differences between the two movie versions?



30 seconds of sexual footage had to be replaced. Mainly the rape scenes.

And that sped up 3 way with that particular music in the background is f*cking hilarious!

[Blue Light]

I got hold of the paperback when I was around 16. I think the book's cover persuaded me.
http://blog.partners-west.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/clockwork.jpg

Later I'd find out what an amazing writer Anthony Burgess really was. Part of the backstory was that his wife Lynne was assaulted by some American GIs during the war.

I saw the movie a couple times when it came out and thought at the time that it had some clever notions but that it was really pretty superficial in the long run. That said, I'd like to see it again now through (ahem) more mature eyes. (Er, bifocals.)

[Pfeister]

The ending in the book is different from the movie.

Great, groudbreaking film.......but you should read the book.

The book also contains a glossary of the slang that is employed by the "Nasdat".

When the book came out in the US, the publisher cut the ending. He thought Americans wouldn't want the hero to be a good guy in the end, so they cut the last chapter and ended it with him unchanged. That's the version Kubrick read.

That's another reason why the movie is so much worse than the book, IMO. The meaning of the story is completely changed without the real ending. I think it ruins an otherwise incredible piece of literature.:cry:

(BTW, the glossary is only in the old versions of the book, mostly from the 70's)

I said it on the first page, but I'll reiterate: the book is 100x better in every way.



...yes, I am a little obsessed with the book.

[DWB1960]

Fast forward to 2:30.

NSFW!

EJSFItosn7s

[Blue Light]

Fast forward to 2:30

EJSFItosn7s



Hey, howza about putting a big NSFW on that!



I'm viewing from home, but hey, some amigos here aren't.

The clip reminds me how often I played the soundtrack album. Wendy Carlos (nee Walter) doing Beethoven on a synthesizer -- great stuff.
The Rossini, too.

[DWB1960]

Hey, howza about putting a big NSFW on that!


Sorry!

[MES10]

The book is 100x better. I read the book first and movie was crap in comparison, really.

I'm not aiming at this at anybody here, but it drives me nuts when anybody talks about how creative the movie was. They don't know what they're missing. It's not even worthy to be compared to the book, IMO. The book's language, pacing, and just about everything else about it is amazing.

+1

I read the book and couldn't get it out of my head so I sat down and read it again a week later. The book is awesome, but I found the movie "trying" to be weird. Also, the book was published in 1962 (I believe) before psychedelia really took off, so I think Kubric took a lot of liberties with Burgess' vision.

[A-Bone]

Kubrick made it his own, as he was familiar with the different versions of the novel. This is what Kubrick did with his adaptations. He modified them to suit his own interests and world view. He did so with The Shining, Full Metal Jacket, Lolita, Eyes Wide Shut, etc.

It has always struck me as more appropriate to treat them as fundamentally different works that share only a common source.

[RickC]

Hey, this is the "gear" page right. How about that turntable Alex had in his room. Still a fascinating looking contraption.

http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/storage/4/928797/Malcom.jpg

/rick

[DWB1960]

It has always struck me as more appropriate to treat them as fundamentally different works that share only a common source.

Exactly. If you wanted a faithful adaption you didn't sign over the rights to Kubrick.

[lochry]

I love this movie, but it is not for the squeemish. :worried

When I was 21, I took a date to see the original at a retro movie theatre. She said she loved "2001", so I said, "You've got to see C.O. on the big screen."

About halfway through the third reel she blew dinner all over my lap, then whispered in my ear, "Sorry, I was raised a pacifist."

A most memorable movie review.

[Pfeister]

Exactly. If you wanted a faithful adaption you didn't sign over the rights to Kubrick.

I love when movies are different from the book, but I think they should be at least as good as the book. For example, Where the Wild Things Are was a giant leap from the original book, but it worked.

Fight Club is my favorite examples of a movie being better than the book. They changed a lot, including the ending, in that one too, but they did it in a way that didn't change what the story about. Actually, the last minute of the film is my favorite ending of any movie ("you met me at a very strange time in my life":aok). I think the film A Clockwork Orange is not in the same league as the book. The movie might have it's good points and might be entertaining, but it's just a shadow of the genius in that book.

[Tommy Biggs]

The book is 100x better. I read the book first and movie was crap in comparison, really.


well - the book was great and much better than the movie. a bit of work to read it, but so worth it. the movie was interesting, and for a book so powerful, not a bad effort at all.

[Tommy Biggs]

(BTW, the glossary is only in the old versions of the book, mostly from the 70's)



Oh dear - that was so great - wanting to learn Nadsat! I can't imagine the experience without the lookups.

No Viddy droogie? how do they explain that? The old Bolshy Yarblockos?

[Route234]

The book is 100x better. I read the book first and movie was crap in comparison, really.

I'm not aiming at this at anybody here, but it drives me nuts when anybody talks about how creative the movie was. They don't know what they're missing. It's not even worthy to be compared to the book, IMO. The book's language, pacing, and just about everything else about it is amazing.

If it helps ya I totally agree with you. I think its a crap movie.

[Blue Light]

The film was banned in UK for a long time, wasn't it?

Of course, when it came out, the whole "skinheads lookin' for a bit of bovver" thing was at full power. In fact, that outfit was very much a skinhead outfit.

[teleharmonium]

I think the book and movie are both great, and really not so far apart from one another.

I don't think a more faithful film version would have been as good. Every change from the book makes perfect sense relative to making it into a visceral movie and making the most of the circumstances and performers. The differences are outlined well on this page -

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Clockwork_Orange_%28film%29

[taco-man]

Definitely a movie that will get a few more viewings to catch all of the subtleties.
Rob Ager does a pretty thorough job of analyzing Kubrick films. Here is a link to his in-depth Clockwork Orange analysis. (http://www.collativelearning.com/ACO%20expanded%20analysis%20.html)

[DWB1960]

The film was banned in UK for a long time, wasn't it?

Kubrick removed it from release after the public uproar against the film - blaming it for the rash of copycat crimes happening in England.

I'm familiar with Ager's writings. He does stretch it a bit sometimes, and more so with ACO than with most of his other reviews.

[dsw67]

Welly, welly, welly, welly, welly, welly, well. To what do I owe the extreme pleasure of this surprising visit?

[spookybonus]

Hey, this is the "gear" page right. How about that turntable Alex had in his room. Still a fascinating looking contraption.

http://forums.klipsch.com/forums/storage/4/928797/Malcom.jpg

/rick

i have one! transcriptor hydraulic reference
http://royceprinting.com/2006files/john/HydraulicReference/weight1.jpg

[Lution]

Is this new original version available on Netflix? Is it labeled as such?

[ungarn]

The film is just fantastic, definitely my favorite Kubrick work.
It also made me appreciate the Burgess novel that much more upon re-reading.

[The Last Rebel]

Kubrick removed it from release after the public uproar against the film - blaming it for the rash of copycat crimes happening in England.

I'm familiar with Ager's writings. He does stretch it a bit sometimes, and more so with ACO than with most of his other reviews.
I've only ever read his 2001 analysis but I can't imagine him making bigger stretches than he did there. At one point he was trying to connect what Kubrick was wearing in a production photo to the meaning of the film.

[Jim S]

I've seen it about ten times start to finish and read the book.

Timeless and provocative.


:aok

[clintb]

I would say it's a good movie, but I won't ever watch it again because it is too violent for me. It's the same complaint I have about Quentin Tarantino's films.

Now my wife loves Quentin Tarantino films and the graphic violence doesn't phase her at all. She wanted to watch "A Clockwork Orange" because it is one of those cool, cult movies. But she never finished watching it because the rape scene was too disturbing. It was the exact same story with my ex-girlfriend.

[andrekp]

Oh dear - that was so great - wanting to learn Nadsat! I can't imagine the experience without the lookups.

No Viddy droogie? how do they explain that? The old Bolshy Yarblockos?

It's just slightly Brittied Russian.

Just write down the words you don't know and find a Russian speaker. There's really not that many words.

Viddy is from Vidyet - to see
Droogie - is from droog or padruga, friend, male/female
Bolshy is from Bolshoi, meaning big
Nadsat is from words like odinnadsat (11) to devyatnadsat (19) and signifies a teenager. (means something like "1 on 10" like 11 is 1 on 10, odin na desyat).
Korova is blood
slovo is word
Chelovek or vek is man
horosho is good or well

I don't remember any of the other common one that are in there, but it's all really basic. It gets blown up as if it some sort of special coded made-up language for teens, but it's plain to a Russian speaker.

[Tommy Biggs]

thanks - I remember a surprising amount of the translations myself - i was wondering how they do it for new readers.
I enjoyed the delayed gratification of looking up the translation of those phrases, and thought that was part of the appeal of the book -we had to work at reading it.
It's surprising how many people REALLY dig that book - considering the material. not just in this post but out in the world.
(sorry for the misdirection!)

[cob666]

Kubrick removed it from release after the public uproar against the film - blaming it for the rash of copycat crimes happening in England.

According to Kubrick's biography, he had the film pulled after receiving threats.

[madvek]

Fast forward to 2:30.

NSFW!

EJSFItosn7s

Great clip as well as one of my favorites film, book.

Don't fast forward though, you'll miss a great line:

"Bit cold and pointless isn't it my lovely?"

[Lution]

Is this new original version available on Netflix? Is it labeled as such?


Still hoping for an answer to my Q. Thanks.

[Pfeister]

Fast forward to 2:30.

NSFW!

EJSFItosn7s

I don't really remember the movie, but those girls are only kids in the book. It's just a blip in the story, but it really added to his degeneracy.

[DWB1960]

Still hoping for an answer to my Q. Thanks.

Couldn't tell you. The movie is listed as 137 minutes long. Since we're only talking about 30 seconds of footage that was cut it's impossible to tell what Netflix if offering.

Re: that youtube clip, one of the funniest bits is when they first all get undressed in his bedroom, he grabs a can of deodorant and gives everyone including himself a spray under the armpits.

[captain_bob]

I've never read the book, but love the movie. I've been contemplating picking up the blu-ray but not sure if it will look any better than the dvd I already have.

[DWB1960]

I've never read the book, but love the movie. I've been contemplating picking up the blu-ray but not sure if it will look any better than the dvd I already have.

Looks amazing on a 1080P screen. I got the BR for $10.

[cob666]

i had the good fortune to see this at a small theater in Cambridge, MA many years ago. It's pretty amazing how much more enjoyable a movie can be when you see it on a big screen. I also saw 2001 at the same theater around the same time and they left the intermission in, pretty cool.

[RickC]

I love this movie, but it is not for the squeemish. :worried

When I was 21, I took a date to see the original at a retro movie theatre. She said she loved "2001", so I said, "You've got to see C.O. on the big screen."

About halfway through the third reel she blew dinner all over my lap, then whispered in my ear, "Sorry, I was raised a pacifist."

A most memorable movie review.

I made a similar mistake at a similar age. Learned the hard way that CO is not a good "date" movie. WTF was I thinking???

:bonk

[RickC]

i have one! transcriptor hydraulic reference
http://royceprinting.com/2006files/john/HydraulicReference/weight1.jpg

Soooooooooo jealous!

:aok

[DWB1960]

I also saw 2001 at the same theater around the same time and they left the intermission in, pretty cool.

The only way it should be seen IMO.

[Ted Witcher]

The chain of violence around the book/film is intriguing, though: Burgess' wife is attacked or raped by soldiers during the war and the writing of the book years later is in part his way of processing that pain. It is made into a movie which not only inspires copycat crimes in the UK that prompt Kubrick to have WB withdraw the film from release, it also "inspires" Arthur Bremer to attempt to kill George Wallace. Bremer's story inspires the young disaffected screenwriter Paul Schrader to write the movie Taxi Driver. The film then "inspires" John Hinckley to attempt to kill Reagan to prove his worth to Jodie Foster. Fortunately, this chain of awfulness seems to have stopped with Hinckley.

[Stevil]

i saw it at a 'midnight showing' at the local cheap theater a few months back. there are a few things in the background i didn't notice on the small screen that we're great cameos. the two that immediately come to mind are the wallpaper in the "what's this about a new way" scene & the albums in front of the counter when Alex first walks in the record store.

[dmb70]

One of my favorite movies!! It's pretty much spot on adaption of the US version of the book. The English version has an additional chapter at the end when compared to the US version.

Brave New World is also a fantastic book, but I haven't really liked any of the screen versions.

[Motorhed]

I would say it's a good movie, but I won't ever watch it again because it is too violent for me. It's the same complaint I have about Quentin Tarantino's films.

Now my wife loves Quentin Tarantino films and the graphic violence doesn't phase her at all. She wanted to watch "A Clockwork Orange" because it is one of those cool, cult movies. But she never finished watching it because the rape scene was too disturbing. It was the exact same story with my ex-girlfriend.

The rape scene in A Clockwork Orange is one of the strangest ones I've seen. I mean any rape scene is disturbing by nature but I've never seen one where the rapists had so much glee in their deeds. I could see where it could be unwatchable to some.

One little consequence from watching that movie, I doubt anyone who has seen it can ever hear Singin' in the Rain the same way again.

[DWB1960]

One little consequence from watching that movie, I doubt anyone who has seen it can ever hear Singin' in the Rain the same way again.

And that wasn't even in the original concept for the scene. They had filmed a few takes of that scene without singing and Kubrick thought it was too dry. He asked McDowall if he knew any songs and "Singing" was the only one he could sing well, so Stanley told him to try working it into the scene.

The rest they say is history!

[DWB1960]

The rape scene in A Clockwork Orange is one of the strangest ones I've seen.

Which one? There's really only one rape scene - the filmed one that Alex is forced to watch during his treatments.

In the scene in the broken down theater, the assault is halted by The Droogs before any rape occurs.

[FeloniousBishop]

I read the book when I was 12 (in 1975 or 76). A very interesting read. You have to learn nadsat dialect to be able to read the book. In the back of the book is a nadsat to english lookup dictionary to help you learn it.

Didn't see the film until I was about 18, watched it dosed on LSD in a double header feature followed by 2001: A Space Odyssey in a great historic old cinema. The shock of Clockwork Orange followed by 2001 was intense.

I think they are the greatest two films I've seen.

Still know nadsat pretty well.

Did anyone catch Malcolm McDowell as Mr. Linderman in Heroes?

[Motorhed]

Which one? There's really only one rape scene - the filmed one that Alex is forced to watch during his treatments.

In the scene in the broken down theater, the assault is halted by The Droogs before any rape occurs.


I do mean the one Alex and his Droogies do. The one in the old theater I think might have ranked up there if it hadn't been stopped. It's disturbing to see the start of a rape anyway but since it wasn't carried out, it ended up not being as bad. Billy Boy and his gang had some of that same insane glee that Alex and his Droogies did so it would have been nasty too.

I did know that about Singin' in the Rain. It makes for one weird and disturbing scene. It's one of the weird little accidents that worked out better than anything planned could have. Dim, I think it was Dim anyway, singing along made it even more f'd up!

The book is yet another on my long list of books I want to read but never get started on. I even have a copy, so I have no excuse for it lol.

[Zilmo]

I saw the X rated version when it first came out. Totally captivating. Probably seen it twenty times since in the last 40 years.

[RickC]

It wasn't my first time seeing CO, but I did see it once back in the day on a double feature with "If", another early Mcdowell film. That was a great combination.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Isfy08Fzunw/R5ihRaJ4P7I/AAAAAAAAAAU/6JtDaxHI8lM/s320/if_xl_01--film-B.jpg

/rick