Right Hand Technique

[gregory70]

When I used to play a lot of fingerstyle acoustic guitar, I "braced" my right hand against the pickguard with my pinkie. This offered stability, but reduced mobility. So I started playing without using my pinkie to anchor/brace against the guitar. My playing improved dramatically within a week or two.

I've spent the last 5-6 years playing primarily electric blues with a pick. While I'm not bracing with my pinkie, I've noticed that I am forever brushing my pinkie against the pickguard as I play. In contrast, many of my favorite guitarists (e.g. SRV) have no contact with the body of the guitar as they play.

Is this a bad habit? Should I aspire to hit the strings without any additional contact with the body of guitar? Your insight would be greatly appreciated!

[dkaplowitz]

I think as long as there's no undue muscle tension occuring when you play _and_ you can comfortably play as fast as you need or want _and_ you are content with your technique, then anything goes. That said, I personally think no anchors or touching is better overall. If you can retrain yourself without much difficulty you'll be better off. But again, if you're happy and comfortable when you play, let it ride.

[gregory70]

Thanks, that's what I thought. I feel like the touching (the guitar) might be slowing me down and interfering with my playing.

Great... now to unlearn a nasty habit

[jzucker]

Originally posted by gregory70
Thanks, that's what I thought. I feel like the touching (the guitar) might be slowing me down and interfering with my playing.

Great... now to unlearn a nasty habit

I don't think there's any real concensus on that issue.

McLaughlin doesn't touch and plays with tremendous speed but Dimeola does and he also plays with tremendous speed. Steve Morse and Frank Gambale touch also as does www.rustycooley.com who is perhaps the fastest player I've ever heard...

[lhallam]

Originally posted by jzucker
I don't think there's any real concensus on that issue.

McLaughlin doesn't touch and plays with tremendous speed but Dimeola does and he also plays with tremendous speed. Steve Morse and Frank Gambale touch also as does www.rustycooley.com who is perhaps the fastest player I've ever heard...

I agree, last year I started practicing without touching at all and after a year, I have found little difference.

I barely touch the gtr and when I do, I seem to have a little better control, especically on the low strings. Also, I am able to mute the strings easier with my pinky extended.

[dkaplowitz]

I have a question for you guys with a laissez-faire approach to right hand picking technique who are also teachers. If you have a beginning student you don't examine his approach and make recommendations that might stave off bad habits down the road that might lead to undue tension or might be somewhat limiting? Do you just leave it to him to figure out?

I was always told to avoid any anchors because they were potentially limiting, and because they weren't always conducive to a nice relaxed right hand. I'd probably suggest that to anyone starting out as well, but maybe I'm missing something.

If a stiff wrist with tensed up forearm muscles and all speed picking coming from the elbow works so well for Steve Morse, does it mean it will for me? If I'm meant to be a great picker, will it matter whether I do it with tension or whether I do it with a relaxed technique?

Just curious. I know there are no hard and fast rules that work for everyone, (as I said above "if it works, anything goes"), but I'm not so agnostic about anything that remotely resembles rules that I think certain principles/guidelines can just be dismissed.

[jzucker]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz
I have a question for you guys with a laissez-faire approach to right hand picking technique who are also teachers. If you have a beginning student you don't examine his approach and make recommendations that might stave off bad habits down the road that might lead to undue tension or might be somewhat limiting? Do you just leave it to him to figure out?

I was always told to avoid any anchors because they were potentially limiting, and because they weren't always conducive to a nice relaxed right hand.

Here's a list of pickers who touch their right hand to the guitar pickguard or body while they play:

George Benson
Tal Farlow
Rusty Cooley
Frank Gambale
Steve Morse
John Petrucci
Randy Johnston
Joe Diorio
Al Dimeola
Birelli Lagrene


I don't think any of them are particularly limited, nor do the exhibit signs of right hand tension in their playing.

I recommend students do touch their hand down as a reference point but it's always useful to experiment with different techniques. I know several guys who do not touch down generally but do so when they want to play fast. Dan Hovey does that.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz
I have a question for you guys with a laissez-faire approach to right hand picking technique who are also teachers. If you have a beginning student you don't examine his approach and make recommendations that might stave off bad habits down the road that might lead to undue tension or might be somewhat limiting? Do you just leave it to him to figure out?

I was always told to avoid any anchors because they were potentially limiting, and because they weren't always conducive to a nice relaxed right hand. I'd probably suggest that to anyone starting out as well, but maybe I'm missing something.

If a stiff wrist with tensed up forearm muscles and all speed picking coming from the elbow works so well for Steve Morse, does it mean it will for me? If I'm meant to be a great picker, will it matter whether I do it with tension or whether I do it with a relaxed technique?

Just curious. I know there are no hard and fast rules that work for everyone, (as I said above "if it works, anything goes"), but I'm not so agnostic about anything that remotely resembles rules that I think certain principles/guidelines can just be dismissed.

Not sure I'd term my attitude as laissez-faire.

In my classical gtr playing, my rt hand floats free and all muting is done with fingers of both hands, the same goes for fingerpicking. I taught my classical students to use the time honored technique.

Steve Morse stresses that his technique is for him and not necessarily right for you and I agree.

Like I said, I haven't found my touching to be tense or limiting. On fast lines, I barely touch the gtr, the pinky sort of skates along with no pressure, it's not anchored or resting per se. No one taught me right hand technique so this is all from old habit.

When I found out that this was theoretically bad, I began practicing free float, no difference for me.

Most of the time, I'm using hybred technique. Sometimes I use economy picking, sometimes alternate picking, sometimes I'm floating, other times I'm touching.

If the student is a beginner I would say to use the floating technique.

For a more advanced student I would show them a variety of ways others have done it and let them suss it out.

There's a smoking player in these parts who uses a thin thumb pick and you wouldn't believe how fast and clean he is with a fine tone. He seems to break all the rules.

For all students, I stressed:

Relax
Breath
Keep you elbow by your side
Do not lean into the gtr
Do not scrunch your shoulder up and/or move it forward.

[dkaplowitz]

You guys raise good points about being open to different right hand techniques. There are plenty of great players who anchor or do weird abberant things with their picking hand.

I tried to emulate Paul Gilbert's right hand when I was going to GIT and I guess I just stuck with that style of right hand as a dogma point for picking fast. At the time he was one of the best pickers I'd ever seen for sheer fluidity. Guthrie Govan's another one with similar technique. I don't even play that kinda' music, but those guys are picking insanely clean and accurately and if you watch their right hand they're pretty relaxed. Seems to work for them. To each his own I guess.

[jzucker]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz
You guys raise good points about being open to different right hand techniques. There are plenty of great players who anchor or do weird abberant things with their picking hand.

I tried to emulate Paul Gilbert's right hand when I was going to GIT and I guess I just stuck with that style of right hand as a dogma point for picking fast. At the time he was one of the best pickers I'd ever seen for sheer fluidity. Guthrie Govan's another one with similar technique. I don't even play that kinda' music, but those guys are picking insanely clean and accurately and if you watch their right hand they're pretty relaxed. Seems to work for them. To each his own I guess.

The irony is that if you watch mclaughlin's hand, it looks incredibly tense but it's not. Looks can be deceiving. I used to float and my guitar teacher at the University of Miami switched me to touching. I always wished I had stuck with floating!

[Ed DeGenaro]

Originally posted by jzucker
The irony is that if you watch mclaughlin's hand, it looks incredibly tense but it's not. Looks can be deceiving. I used to float and my guitar teacher at the University of Miami switched me to touching. I always wished I had stuck with floating!
Why? With floating your muting is way restricted...I would think.

[dkaplowitz]

Originally posted by Ed DeGenaro
Why? With floating your muting is way restricted...I would think.
I don't find it to be so. The muting just kinda' shifts more to the area of the fat part of the thumb and your lower palm.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz
I don't find it to be so. The muting just kinda' shifts more to the area of the fat part of the thumb and your lower palm.

Not exactly sure what you're describing. With my right hand facing me I've got the fleshy part under my thumb (to the right of my lifeline) and the fleshy part near the side of my hand (to the left of my lifeline).

When you're playing the top three strings, which part are you using to mute?

[dkaplowitz]

Originally posted by lhallam
When you're playing the top three strings, which part are you using to mute?
Those strings get muted with more of the karate chop part of the palm, but if I'm playing on the lower 2 or 3, the muting is done more by the fleshy part below my thumb.

Since this thread started I got a chance to look more closely at what I was doing while I was playing. I noticed that I'm muting all the time. So, I'm basically lightly anchored to the strings at all times when playing single note lines. But any open ringing string cross picking stuff is done completely untethered.

[lhallam]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz
Those strings get muted with more of the karate chop part of the palm, but if I'm playing on the lower 2 or 3, the muting is done more by the fleshy part below my thumb.

Since this thread started I got a chance to look more closely at what I was doing while I was playing. I noticed that I'm muting all the time. So, I'm basically lightly anchored to the strings at all times when playing single note lines. But any open ringing string cross picking stuff is done completely untethered.

Same here.

[Ed DeGenaro]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz
I don't find it to be so. The muting just kinda' shifts more to the area of the fat part of the thumb and your lower palm.
I must misunderstand something here. When the palm makes contact with the strings how is the hand floating?

[dkaplowitz]

Originally posted by Ed DeGenaro
I must misunderstand something here. When the palm makes contact with the strings how is the hand floating?
It's not. Yes, it's technically anchored to the strings. But is that really "anchoring"? There would be no way to play electric without doing some kind of muting like that. Regardless, it's not anchored twice: once to the strings and another time somewhere else with the pinky or other fingers on the body of the guitar (which is what I tend to think of when I think of anchoring).

[Ed DeGenaro]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz
It's not. Yes, it's technically anchored to the strings. But is that really "anchoring"? There would be no way to play electric without doing some kind of muting like that. Regardless, it's not anchored twice: once to the strings and another time somewhere else with the pinky or other fingers on the body of the guitar (which is what I tend to think of when I think of anchoring).
That was my earlier point.
IMO any contact with the instrument isn't floating.

[EricT]

Originally posted by dkaplowitz

(...)
If a stiff wrist with tensed up forearm muscles and all speed picking coming from the elbow works so well for Steve Morse, does it mean it will for me? If I'm meant to be a great picker, will it matter whether I do it with tension or whether I do it with a relaxed technique?

Just curious. I know there are no hard and fast rules that work for everyone, (as I said above "if it works, anything goes"), but I'm not so agnostic about anything that remotely resembles rules that I think certain principles/guidelines can just be dismissed.

Just want to add that Vinnie Moore used to play with a stiff wrist and all the motion coming from the elbow. But he had to completely change his technique because of "tennis elbow" or a similar repetetive stress syndrome.
As a general rule, I guess too much tension is a bad thing no matter what technique you use.

[jzucker]

Just want to add that Vinnie Moore used to play with a stiff wrist and all the motion coming from the elbow. But he had to completely change his technique because of "tennis elbow" or a similar repetetive stress syndrome.
As a general rule, I guess too much tension is a bad thing no matter what technique you use.

There's no consensus on that either. Johnny Smith played from the elbow and Dennis Sandole advocated playing from the elbow. I don't think there's any generalization you can make about a particular technique being more prone to tendonitis.

[TopDog]

I've seen Larry Carlton and Scott Henderson do this thing where they move the pick within the knuckles of their index finger and thumb. The knuckles of these fingers are actually moving. Any comments on this?

So what's the best way to practice your right hand?

Is it a natural thing or does one work at it?

I've come to realize my right hand is inhibiting my ability to express myself.

Help....

[Lucidology]

I've seen Larry Carlton and Scott Henderson do this thing where they move the pick within the knuckles of their index finger and thumb.

The knuckles of these fingers are actually moving. Any comments on this?

....

That's an astute obsevation.. I'm going to have to out get out
one of their DVDs & take that into account ...

[Ed DeGenaro]

I've seen Larry Carlton and Scott Henderson do this thing where they move the pick within the knuckles of their index finger and thumb. The knuckles of these fingers are actually moving. Any comments on this?

So what's the best way to practice your right hand?

Is it a natural thing or does one work at it?

I've come to realize my right hand is inhibiting my ability to express myself.

Help....
As does EVH and some others like EJ at times. It's akin to the motion your knuckles make when writing with a pen. It is really good for burst of speed stuff. However the control aspect when moving across a larger area can be a bit of a head ache, that said I have a tendency to pick like that.

[KRosser]

The wonderful NYC jazz guitarist Steve Cardenas uses a very strange right hand technique that sounds like it might be close to that. It really does look a little odd in person - I saw him get asked about it in a clinic he gave - "Hey, what's up with your right hand?". He kinda looked down and shrugged his shoulders and said, "I don't know, man. It's weird. By the time I got to where I noticed it I was already doing gigs and kind of on my way, so I don't really see the point in worrying about it now."