Nut slots built up - permanent?

[Chris Scott]

+1 on the shimming.

I do it a lot. I generally don't want to replace an otherwise good nut when a proper shimming will do. I have some clear plastic sheets that are about 6-7 thou thick, as well as white plastic ("for sale" signs if you must know) that average around 14 thou, and when done with care, the repair is all but undetectable.

I first true up the bottom of the nut, then cyno it onto a section of plastic, cut it out, clean it up and back in it goes, allowing me just enough to true up all the slots.

Now when the slots are too wide, then no matter how new/nice the nut is, that sucker comes outta there...

[walterw]

Originally Posted by Soapbarstrat

Possible he did a "dental fill" on it, but most guys don't have the equipment to do that.

you're talking about that new stuff that cures with the UV gun, right? very interesting.

a good trick with the dust/glue fill is to lay down the dust, then drip in the accelerator first; once that evaporates, then wick in the thin CA glue. it seems to set a lot harder and less gummy than the other way 'round.

[Soapbarstrat]

Originally Posted by walterw

you're talking about that new stuff that cures with the UV gun, right? very interesting.

Yes. I think the hardest part would be knowing how much anesthetic to give the guitar.

[John Coloccia]

Harry Becker told me that filling with a high quality epoxy works well too. I've never tried it myself, but he suggested West Systems. I'm very familiar with West and I could well believe it works. It cures rock hard and glassy.

If I had to guess, I would guess that the next best thing to the UV cure dental filler (which is probably best but expensive) would be West mixed with bone dust. I believe the UV dental filler is very similar to epoxy with some filler mixed in, though it's not actually epoxy. It's something called Bowen's resin. That's what my dentist said, anyhow. The dental resin itself isn't too expensive (because we only use the tiniest amounts at a time), but the UV curing gun is about $1000.

[sunburst79]

My guy normally shims the Gibson nuts. Most of the vintage Fender stuff I bring him has nuts that need replaced. I'm assuming the Gibson Nut material is harder than Fenders.

[claudel]

Last couple ones of these I did I harvested some dust from the top of the nut with
320 grit paper and used it to pack the slot(s) for the CA instead of baking soda.

Seems to work fine, and looks much better with the ebony nut on my old parlor...

After I get the slot(s) right I polish the top with MicroMesh and it's turned out fine the times I've done it.

I have no expectations of a "permanent" repair, but it's easy enough so that if I have to redo it every year or so then so be it.

[bunny]

I do nut slot fillings at times, but only on cheap guitars or if it needs to be done withing minutes. Any decent guitar - we're talking a bone nut, properly profiled, slotted, glued in. Shimming is a way, but for me it's as time consuming as making a new nut and inferior both aestetically and sound-vise.

[Chris Scott]

Originally Posted by claudel

Last couple ones of these I did I harvested some dust from the top of the nut with
320 grit paper and used it to pack the slot(s) for the CA instead of baking soda.

Seems to work fine, and looks much better with the ebony nut on my old parlor...

After I get the slot(s) right I polish the top with MicroMesh and it's turned out fine the times I've done it.

I have no expectations of a "permanent" repair, but it's easy enough so that if I have to redo it every year or so then so be it.

Might be accused of being a bit anal here (I am) but I'd use a file, rather than sandpaper - grit is always being pulled off the backing of the paper, and ends up in the powder you are creating, which isn't the best stuff to have in a not slot...

[walterw]

Originally Posted by bunny

I do nut slot fillings at times, but only on cheap guitars or if it needs to be done withing minutes. Any decent guitar - we're talking a bone nut, properly profiled, slotted, glued in. Shimming is a way, but for me it's as time consuming as making a new nut and inferior both aestetically and sound-vise.

+1 on the fill as being a budget or emergency fix, but shimming? it takes you as long to throw a shim under there as it would to cut a new nut from scratch? that sounds odd.

also, true enough about the aesthetic difference (even though the shim often need be no more than a sheet of notebook paper, so barely perceptible) but we can argue about tonal differences!

after all, what is paper, or even hardwood veneer, but a thin layer of more wood? compressed flat and soaked in glue, seems to me it's gonna be every bit as hard as the wood "substrate" around the nut anyway.

[blong]

I give the customer the options and costs, and describe the pros/cons of each job. I then to what the customer requests. Most choose shimming or replacement, a few just want fills for a quick and cheap turnaround. On a rare occasion, if the customer has a great guitar (or a vintage one) and seemed unsure but indicated they would like a new nut but don't wanna pay for it, I give the guitar what it needs and charge them for what they asked me to do. I can't just let a great old guitar get a patch up or what I consider a less than the best job done, unless the customer insists on keeping the old nut on there for "originality." I recently had this old cat ask me for a fill on the nut slots b/c he "couldn't afford" the replacment with bone, but would have preferred that. I put a new bone nut on his guitar b/c it was a 1960's ES-330. That guitar deserved a new nut, and he was a veteran of the Korean war, so I did him a favor and put a new nut on and charged him for what a fill would cost. He greatly appreciated it and offered me a few more $$ and I refused.

I try to do right by the guitar, but never do anything the owner doesn't specifically ask for, unless it's a special circumstance like the one above. A fill can last a long time and be unnoticeable. I have a PRS SE I didn't want to recut a bone nut for that I had filed the high E a hair too low. I filled it a few years ago and it's still going strong.

Bob

[walterw]

yeah, sometimes i've gone the extra mile on a classic too; after all, the guitar might very well outlive the current owner and me, so it's kinda like we're all just custodians of these instruments anyway.

as for the PRS SE, is that with the black plastic (graphite, teflon, whatever) nut?

i've found that the powdered graphite in the little tube for lubricating locks makes a good fill dust for these; puff some into the slot, do the same trick i referred to earlier of dripping in some kicker first, then wicking in the CA, and it'll set up just about as good as the actual nut material.

[bunny]

I get very nice bone nut blanks from a supplier I now, cut close to most common nut & saddle sizes and almost perfectly squared. So making a new nut after I remove the old one and clean the slot doesn't take too long. A good nut making vise, a small drum sanding jig ( I currently use Dremels), a piece of marble with sandpaper glued on, a string spacing rule and a box of files.

[blong]

Walter,

No, I was changing the nut to bone. I cut the high E a little too low and it buzzed enough to bother me at the first fret. Since it was my guitar I did a quick fix b/c I couln't wait to play it with all the mods I had completed, so I filled the slot and thought the next time I change strings I'll cut a new nut. Well, I never have b/c it's just fine, still.

Thanks for the tip on the graphite for the black nut materials. I'll try that. I'll have to get the powdered graphite. I might use that with chapstick or vaseline for lubing nuts and bridge parts, as well. Have you tried that?

Bob