Should Electro-Harmonix make a dedicated 'swell/attack' pedal like that of the POG2?

[yawnocfonayr19]

Originally Posted by Stratobuc

Seriously, I read the whole thread. You can do a hell of a lot more with a volume pedal and a delay than you can with one "dedicated" ADSR pedal taking up space on your board. Good hunting.

sorry man, but this comment shows that you clearly didnt read it all. Well not properly anyway

[lhama]

If they could do a nano sized swell, then I would bye it at once.

[yawnocfonayr19]

Originally Posted by lhama

If they could do a nano sized swell, then I would bye it at once.

Now its just a matter of somehow getting it to them that there are people out there wanting this pedal..

[ERGExplorer]

Just out of curiosity, since several people said they had no idea about this... but is there truly no one else reading this topic who has used a reverb pedal set to 100% wet? I know that some great and some boutique gear isn't capable of this (Hardwire RV-7, the PGS-sold Hardwire Supernatural, Neunaber Stereo Wet), but even my Verbzilla and Cathedral can do 100% wet, and a 100% wet reverb replicates that swell attack. You have to combine it with a pitch shifter and a filter, like they do with the POG, in order to get the POG sound, but I suppose if someone has never used a 100%-wet-capable reverb, or has never pushed one to the limits, one will similarly have no idea of what it sounds like....

[yawnocfonayr19]

Originally Posted by ERGExplorer

Just out of curiosity, since several people said they had no idea about this... but is there truly no one else reading this topic who has used a reverb pedal set to 100% wet? I know that some great and some boutique gear isn't capable of this (Hardwire RV-7, the PGS-sold Hardwire Supernatural, Neunaber Stereo Wet), but even my Verbzilla and Cathedral can do 100% wet, and a 100% wet reverb replicates that swell attack. You have to combine it with a pitch shifter and a filter, like they do with the POG, in order to get the POG sound, but I suppose if someone has never used a 100%-wet-capable reverb, or has never pushed one to the limits, one will similarly have no idea of what it sounds like....

I did say that I have tried a reverb pedal in this way at 100% wet. But again, its no POG2.. And like you said, you have to combine it with other effects anyway to get it to replicate the sound even more - which, like Ive stated previously, isnt the point of this exercise. Looking for less, not more.
I wont repeat it again because it will just take up space, but I have made points about this in previous comments.

[ERGExplorer]

Just to answer the subject line question: No, EHX probably shouldn't make a dedicated "swell/attack" pedal like the POG2. It would cannibalize the market for the POG2, and without the additional features of the POG2, most people would likely complain about how crippled a one-channel SOS (Single Octave Smoother) would be.

Feel free to ignore the following.

(Enteriing "Please Ignore This Part" mode...)

This next part is for those who are open to exploring other ideas, and who understand that one can gain from doing so, rather than just insisting things are always exactly as they perceive.

I understand that some want less... but if you strip away those additional things beyond the reverb tank (filter, octave pitch shifters) which make the POG what it is... then that's what's left, a reverb effect with a depth which controls the attack, and a feedback control which controls the tails, as well as (on many reverb units) a tone knob to control the top end.

That reverb tank idea is the core of a lot of the current EHX gear, the Freeze, the POG/POG2, the HOG and upcoming HOG2, the SuperEgo, aspects of the Ravish Sitar, and so on. It's not synthesis (although EHX might use that term to talk about the digital pitch shifting in the POG/HOG gear).

If anyone has both a POG/HOG and one of the EHX Microsynths, you can test the difference between the triggered Attack-Decay envelope (combined with the Sensitivity) on the Microsynth and the set-and-forget Attack/Decay slider on the POG/HOG.

The Slow Gear/Slow Attack stuff is similarly a triggered attack envelope, and therefore won't do the same as the reverb-tank idea at the core of the POG/HOG gear.

I don't think such a unit will come from EHX. The POG Attack/Decay is pretty idiosyncratic, and extends off the core of what the POG is, rather than the other way around. It's like saying one really likes how great an aspect of one's automobile works and I want it separately, but that part is an extension of something at the core of the vehicle.

(End "Please Ignore This Part mode...)

[Lolasaurus]

Originally Posted by ERGExplorer

Just to answer the subject line question: No, EHX probably shouldn't make a dedicated "swell/attack" pedal like the POG2. It would cannibalize the market for the POG2, and without the additional features of the POG2, most people would likely complain about how crippled a one-channel SOS (Single Octave Smoother) would be.

Feel free to ignore the following.

(Enteriing "Please Ignore This Part" mode...)

This next part is for those who are open to exploring other ideas, and who understand that one can gain from doing so, rather than just insisting things are always exactly as they perceive.

I understand that some want less... but if you strip away those additional things beyond the reverb tank (filter, octave pitch shifters) which make the POG what it is... then that's what's left, a reverb effect with a depth which controls the attack, and a feedback control which controls the tails, as well as (on many reverb units) a tone knob to control the top end.

That reverb tank idea is the core of a lot of the current EHX gear, the Freeze, the POG/POG2, the HOG and upcoming HOG2, the SuperEgo, aspects of the Ravish Sitar, and so on. It's not synthesis (although EHX might use that term to talk about the digital pitch shifting in the POG/HOG gear).

If anyone has both a POG/HOG and one of the EHX Microsynths, you can test the difference between the triggered Attack-Decay envelope (combined with the Sensitivity) on the Microsynth and the set-and-forget Attack/Decay slider on the POG/HOG.

The Slow Gear/Slow Attack stuff is similarly a triggered attack envelope, and therefore won't do the same as the reverb-tank idea at the core of the POG/HOG gear.

I don't think such a unit will come from EHX. The POG Attack/Decay is pretty idiosyncratic, and extends off the core of what the POG is, rather than the other way around. It's like saying one really likes how great an aspect of one's automobile works and I want it separately, but that part is an extension of something at the core of the vehicle.

(End "Please Ignore This Part mode...)

Yeah, but people were saying the same thing about the freeze function being idiosyncratic to the HOG. Honestly that's the only reason I think the OP might be on to something.

[yawnocfonayr19]

Originally Posted by ERGExplorer

Just to answer the subject line question: No, EHX probably shouldn't make a dedicated "swell/attack" pedal like the POG2. It would cannibalize the market for the POG2, and without the additional features of the POG2, most people would likely complain about how crippled a one-channel SOS (Single Octave Smoother) would be.

The rest of what you said I chose to leave for another argument...you're points are very valid and I appreciate the input, but this post isnt about creating new discussions, simply the question in the subject line.

But to respond to the above quote.. Im not really sure what you mean by it 'cannabalizing' the POG2 market. If someone wants a POG2, they are going to buy a POG2, simply because of how amazing it is - I dont think the addition of a new pedal is going to draw away any buyers from those brilliant pedals, but rather just create new buyers.
The statment about people complaning about 'how crippled a one-channel SOS (Single Octave Smoother) would be' I think is a bit much. If youre taking that stance, then you may as well apply it to almost every other single function pedal out there, because there is always something bigger with more functions. For example a single function delay pedal compared to a Stymon Timeline or Eventide Timefactor...or the EHX Holy Grail Nano compared to the EHX Cathedral - people buy what they need, whether its its a multi-faceted pedal with a thousand different possibilites or just a single function pedal that only does one thing that they really love when they turn it on - is all about preference. And ofcourse, the latter is what this swell pedal would be

[yawnocfonayr19]

anymore love for this post?

[eti]

I believe the EHX Superego does swells in a similar way.

[NHBluesMan]

i'd love to see them make a pedal that has the 'swell' feature and their Freeze pedal in one box, so you can swell into pads with a single footswitch (i've wanted to grab a freeze, but swelling in with my volume pedal and then holding the notes with the Freeze doesn't seem feasible)

[eti]

Originally Posted by NHBluesMan

i'd love to see them make a pedal that has the 'swell' feature and their Freeze pedal in one box, so you can swell into pads with a single footswitch (i've wanted to grab a freeze, but swelling in with my volume pedal and then holding the notes with the Freeze doesn't seem feasible)

See the post above yours.

[Kelfecil]

I was on the boat you are right now, and I still haven't summed up the courage to buy a POG2 (they aren't that cheap...).
So I was trying to find a cheaper solution!

At first I thought of doing a rehouse-into-1 of 2 Behringer pedals, the harmonizer and the slow-motion ones. I figured that it would be too cheap of a solution and that I should look for something better.

I looked into the bumblebee,but I couldn't justify having a compressor like it just for my swells since I really dig the philosopher's tone as far as compressors go(which I'm getting soon).

Speaking of Pigtronix, the Philosopher King does great swell from what I've heard,but that's even bigger than a POG 2! (even though cheaper...)

So it all came down to those options :
1) Buy a POG 2. OR
2) Buy a Behringer Slow-Motion (SG-1 clone) and rehouse it. OR
3) Buy a VFE Bumblebee.

The cheapest solution right now is #2, since it won't cost more than 30-40$.
Having heard the pedal,it's more than good for what it does and I wouldn't really expect more. But I am definately buying a POG 2 in the future....it's just crazy to have all those sounds in one pedal.