dirty amp+OD or Clean amp+hotter OD/Dist.

[adcard]

What's your guys take on getting the best lead/rock rhythm tone out of an amp+OD/Dist combination for amp rigs that don't have built in high gain channels. I knew some people swear by only using appropriately HOT pedals in front of a completely clean amp to get the best "high gain channel" sound on a single channel cleaner type amp.
Recently though, I have been experimenting with running my amp a little dirtier and using a lower gain OD pedal instead of running the amp cleaner with a hotter pedal. My amp is a Komet Songwriter 30 and it does a really good job of breaking up sweetly and takes pedals in front of it well. However, since my amp is in the band trailer, most of my tinkering has been on my Fender Blues Jr.
I should also note that I have noticed that there is something about my EP Booster that makes it all come together a little bit better. I get my amp to the sweet spot and then back it off about 9-10dB and compensate with getting about 9-10dB boost out of the EP which stays on all the time after OD's. End result is equal output volume but gives a bit more shimmer and makes it bit more responsive to pedals and pick attack.

I have some clips I recorded earlier today.
1) The first is my is a dirty clean type tone. Guitar==>board which is running an xotic AC Booster as a clean boost and then the EP Booster at 12 o'clock then a little delay via Carbon Copy (can't hardly hear it on the recording)==>Blues Jr set to only just start breaking up before EP and AC push it harder. EQ flat. Reverb off on the amp. The reverb is on the recording. The rhythm track is EP+stock TS9 and either none or just a tad verb from the recording.

CleanAC1.mp3


2) The second is the same rhythm track and for the lead tone its a stock TS9 gain all the way up, tone pulled back to 9 o'clock and volume around noon out to the EP then the delay then out to the amp set up the same as before.

TS1.mp3


3) Lastly its basically just like the previous one except instead of the TS9 in using a Suhr Riot Distortion pedal with the Dist pulled back to around 2 o'clock, tone down to 9'oclock and output somewhere around 11 o'clock. (the suhr is capable of some very high gain, but ive got it pulled back a good bit since im experimenting with medium gain pedals into a pushed amp.

Mixdown.mp3


I like these tones, but will have spend some time trying this particular setup at a few gigs to decide if any of these sounds are keepers based on how the rig sounds on the board recordings of our gigs.

[bh.]

Nice tones! What guitar were you using? have a blues jr. here too and I love mine with gain knob at noon, and push it further with pedals. Whenver I use less gain on the amp(around 2.5 to 3), I use the fat switch and it livens up the tone. You could check out recordings in some threads I started

[adcard]

Originally Posted by bh.

Nice tones! What guitar were you using? have a blues jr. here too and I love mine with gain knob at noon, and push it further with pedals. Whenver I use less gain on the amp(around 2.5 to 3), I use the fat switch and it livens up the tone. You could check out recordings in some threads I started

Thanks
Sorry should have mention the guitar. I was using my PRS custom 22 with Lollar PAF pickups. All the parts were done on the bridge pickup. The strings were actually way past dead, so new strings would have made it sound a bit clearer I guess.

I also forgot about the fat switch. I should have also mentioned that I was NOT using it. I was running the amp flat, maybe a tad on the bright side to compensate for the dead strings, but all in all pretty flat with no fat boost and no delay. The amp's output was divided evenly between the pregain and the master. They were both up about 1/3 of the way.

[bh.]

Cool! I also usually use a PRS, a hollowbody with stock HB pickups. On these demos with the BJr, I also used the bridge pickup.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/sho...d.php?t=996632
Personally, I've found that running the amp a bit hotter (with gain at noon as I mentioned above) and pushing it with a lower gain OD gets me the sounds I need most of the time. But running higher gain pedals into it works well too and I can use those sounds on some songs too.

[adcard]

Originally Posted by bh.

Cool! I also usually use a PRS, a hollowbody with stock HB pickups. On these demos with the BJr, I also used the bridge pickup.
http://www.thegearpage.net/board/sho...d.php?t=996632
Personally, I've found that running the amp a bit hotter (with gain at noon as I mentioned above) and pushing it with a lower gain OD gets me the sounds I need most of the time. But running higher gain pedals into it works well too and I can use those sounds on some songs too.

Oh yeah you can throw anything in front of a BJr. All the tinkering I was doing finding just the right amount of gain from a pedal and just the right amount of crunch from the amp is for when I get in front of my real rig at Gigs. At gig volumes on most any decent wattage tube amp too much pedal gain blended with too much amp crunch will sound bad.

But, the BJr is cool for a practice amp or smaller gigging amp because of the way it "absorbs" what ever you throw at it. You could run that amp sorta dirty and throw the highest gain pedal know to man into it and it just sorta compresses and gives you relatively smooth sweet low volume saturated gain. Obviously some parts of the signal are getting lost when you run something full blast into at low volume, but the end result is still pretty good sounding. particularly at very low volumes which is why I like it so much as a practice amp.

[schrom81]

I like to use a clean amp with pedals.

Main reason being that I grow tired of distorted tones after a period of use. If its a pedal that's producing the drive I can use a different one to get another tone/texture/color when it gets old to my ears. If the main gain is coming from the amp then its a lot more expansive to change amps. Plus I don't think gain amps have pure open cleans like a single channel amp. They sound thinner and two dimensional.

That being said some amps are better pedal platforms then others. I suppose it just depends on the sound your going for. One clean amp and a pedal you love will sound killer, but in front of a different type of clean amp it might sound horrible. Regardless that both amps clean sound great for different reasons.

[adcard]

Originally Posted by schrom81

I like to use a clean amp with pedals.

Main reason being that I grow tired of distorted tones after a period of use. If its a pedal that's producing the drive I can use a different one to get another tone/texture/color when it gets old to my ears. If the main gain is coming from the amp then its a lot more expansive to change amps. Plus I don't think gain amps have pure open cleans like a single channel amp. They sound thinner and two dimensional.

That being said some amps are better pedal platforms then others. I suppose it just depends on the sound your going for. One clean amp and a pedal you love will sound killer, but in front of a different type of clean amp it might sound horrible. Regardless that both amps clean sound great for different reasons.

The irony is that with all the hoopla I go threw finding the right lead tone, I'm still playing clean rhythm 90% of the time. I play in a variety band. We play a lot and we do all sorts of tunes. For me, i prefer to prioritize the lead tone, and just make sure that my clean stuff is adequate...and it is. Im only driving my amp "just" into breakup. The kind of breakup almost goes completely away with softer strumming and starts to get gnarly with hard attack. Im still getting MOST of the gain from the pedals. As I have it dialed in now, its a very fine line
Im a lead guitar player and in my mind I'm playing in front of 50,000 fans not 200 wedding reception guests or 150 bar goers..lol
I can't stand when lead tone isn't dialed in right. There's just something about the way a good lead tone that makes me connect a little better.

I dunno, all this gear talk and fascination with the tone search is not at all because my band needs anything better out of me. Its just what keeps me sane playing the same stuff every weekend. I record most gigs off our monitor mixer in to a USB flash drive so I am always trying new things and then going home and see how they sounded in action.

[phazersonstun]

I use a HR Deville 2x12 & an LP w/ Duncans most of the time.
I prefer to use the amp on the clean channel just before any break up.

Pedal wise I use a Blues Pro for my light-medium OD (on about 80% of the time)
& a Marshall Shredmaster after the BP.
The SM gets stacked after the BP for higher gain.
Then I use a Maxon EQ after that for mid / volume boost for leads.

I've been happy w/ this set up in wedding & rock bar gigs for many years now.