Need advice for a singer who can't hear himself

[billthemountain]

My band is a 5 piece: 2 driven guitars, organ, bass, and sometimes heavy drums. I sing lead and play solos. I consider us to be a louder band simply by nature of the instruments and styles of the players. We have a mixing board, a couple stage monitors (one for me), and house speakers, but have some tech limitations to giving each of us our own mix (whether through a speaker or in-ears).

I have a problem I haven't faced in all my years of live music (even in bands with similar volume and instruments). Hearing myself.

We've gotten a lot better with volume in terms of instruments... most of the band has started working together to respect each others' volume. our stage balance is better, and our performances have been highlighting that. But sometimes the volume creeps up, and I start to lose the vocals in a mix of ear fatigue and volume. The result is singing out of key or botching harmonies.

I suggested a personal mixing system (so I could control my own in-ear or monitor speaker volume on the fly, as needed... been reading a lot about going that 'closed network' way). I don't do sound for this band, but it's pretty clear I need more than what our mixing board can give us. And I also need to be more hands on in my own sound (on the fly) without being another "captain of the board". Without being a captain, I could really mess up something in terms of what the audience hears, which is why I thought the personal mixing board would work. I'm talking a mini mixer that attaches to my mic stand or something equivalent.

Do any of you singers, who have ever been in my situation, have any advice? Vocals should be the loudest thing, but it just isn't. I'm thinking that I'd prefer a monitor mix that is JUST my vocals, clean of ambient noise and a drum kit that may be 5 feet away (in small rooms).

[ontariomaximus]

Stop singing if you can't hear yourself. Your band members should turn down. It's not negotiable.

[Pietro]

Originally Posted by billthemountain

I'm thinking that I'd prefer a monitor mix that is JUST my vocals, clean of ambient noise and a drum kit that may be 5 feet away (in small rooms).

yup.

Originally Posted by ontariomaximus

Stop singing if you can't hear yourself. Your band members should turn down. It's not negotiable.

double yup.

[Rex Anderson]

Clean up your monitor mix-hi pass filter everything in it and don't put in anything you don't need.

Try raising the monitor up off the floor-get it closer to you (make sure the null of the mic points at the monitor to avoid feedback.

[loudboy]

What's your present system consist of?

If we can have that info, we can get a better picture of what might help you out...

[jiml]

Got to learn dynamics, drummer needs to be totally on board with it. I look at it like this, when there are vocals, that is the "lead instrument" and should be the loudest, when guitars solo, they should be the loudest. Bass and drums should be the consistently the same levels...

[Bluzeboy]

Dynamics and adjusting the volume lower are your friends. Just "throwing" hardware at it doesn't fix the main issue.

[sixstringslut]

I'm not a singer...I work for singers. Your band apparently does not, get a new band.
They need to learn to work around the singer and whatever the singer needs. When the singer looses his voice the show is over.
If they cannot adapt to a moderate volume/dynamics, new gear will only make them louder. Again with IEM's, if not being used in a controlled environment they may cause more grief in the end or possibly permanent hearing loss on your end.
They just need to turn down. Tell them they can play as loud as they want at home...but not here.
Just my opinion.

[Jon C]

what the others said .... the band must .... must ... play dynamically to work with/around the singer IMO.

[lschwart]

Absolutely. If you have no trouble with the monitor mix at the beginning of the gig and creeping band volume is the only thing that changes, that's you're answer. Tell the band to stop notching up the volume. You can do little things here and there to isolate yourself more on stage and improve the vocal clarity of your monitor mix, but the main thing is the band's dynamics.

I have to keep on my electric guitarist and bass player all the time--especially the electric guitarist. I do OK for my lead vocals, and I've learned, in a pinch, to control my pitch in my own head well enough to get through a song before I turn around and give the "turn-it-down signal," but one of my back up singers often loses herself in the monitor when the guitarist's stage amp starts to creep up, and then she goes seriously off pitch. There were points at our recent NYE gig where she was even having trouble hearing her own hand-drum. I only knew because her drum got really loud all of a sudden, and I turned around to see her with her vocal mic pointed at it (and we hardly ever have to mic the drums)! She was just trying to hear herself play!

Louis

[Shiny McShine]

One thing that really makes a difference is a high quality monitor speaker. I've used the old (not made any more) Gauss ones and they were amazing. They almost were good enough for a home stereo and were so flat that they never fed back with the Audio Technica's we were using at the time. It was such a pleasure to work with that rig. We were loud too. SVT, drums, Soldano/Flagg stereo 4 X 12 guitar, keys.

The worst thing is a cheap monitor (lots on CL). Count on spending some bucks for a good one.

[Bluzeboy]

Originally Posted by blindwilliemudd

Yeah, but as Loudboy was insinuating (I think he was,) there could be something to increase performance of the system theyve got. There's also a point where a hardware investment becomes necessary.

Agreed but in this case, at least the way I read it, the volume creeps and he can't hear himself anymore. In that case all better/more equipment is gonna do it make it louder and louder.. Not sure that is the real answer.

[imguitardan]

Ear plugs help me sing on pitch better than without. I can hear myself just fine with them in.

[Phil]

I'll go along with the earplug(s) as a limited solution. Sometimes if the volume isn't too overwhelming, I'll just wear 1 and it helps me with pitch.

[The Kid]

Originally Posted by sixstringslut

I'm not a singer...I work for singers. Your band apparently does not, get a new band.
Just my opinion.

Yeah, don't try to communicate and work anything out. Just fire everybody and get a new band.