axe fx..still not convinced

[DigitalTube]

Originally Posted by mtlin

I'm aware of exactly one post (by Photios) by someone who actually played an Axe-Fx who didn't think it was excellent. That's a pretty impressive track record.

I think every guitar player knows what sounds they want to hear, and even the best tube amps won't please everyone, Dumbles included. I've had some friends play my Aiken amp as well as some of my other amps that in my opinion are very nice, and it wasn't for them, with the Axe Fx there is so much you can do with the sounds that it will please most people but you have to create your sounds, so far everyone who has tried my Axe-Fx has loved it.
E.B.

[tats_dragon]

Tone is subjective but ....wow. A JMP-1 and a G-major? There's no comparison on efx alone.


Jun

Originally Posted by mcdyas

I bought one and returned it. I didn't think it was excellent. I think my JMP-1 with a TC-Electronics G-Major is a better sounding setup. Feel free to disagree. My first preference is a good tube amp with a pedalboard.

[teefus]

Originally Posted by Jon

It's a bit like trying to assess the quality of a digital camera's images by looking at a low res jpeg.

not trying to be a smart ass or anything but, actually, you can tell a lot from a lo-res jpeg. compare 2 different cameras side by side and you can tell a whole lot from the lowest res setting the chip and software can provide.

[Leonc]

Well the problem with clips of digital rigs is you don't get the feel of the thing. Historically, half the problem with digital guitar rigs is they're missing the feel of real tubes. So, speaking for myself, I'm reluctant to make final judgments about this or any other modeler kind of gadget w/o getting to play one. Hell, same goes for any amp, really.

[mcdyas]

Originally Posted by tats_dragon

Tone is subjective but ....wow. A JMP-1 and a G-major? There's no comparison on efx alone.


Jun

Well, maybe I've stood in front of my Plexi too much. But, simply put the AXE-FX doesn't feel or sound like a tube amp, it sounds like a digital simulation and it feels like a solid state amp. Second, the effects on the G-Major compare just fine to the AXE-FX.

I was fully prepared to fall in love with the axe-fx but I tried it, listened carefully and was not impressed. Sorry, if this doesn't fit in with your view.

[Zero]

Originally Posted by Jay Mitchell

Anyone who argues that mp3s don't audibly degrade sound as compared to CDs, vinyl, or 1/2" audio tape simply doesn't know audio.

If you think "amp builders" are the arbiters of recording quality, then you don't know audio. Not in the slightest.

This is just plain silly. Noone who knows anything about audio and who has been awake for the past 20-some-odd years would take your position.

No one that knows someone who knows ANYTHING about ANY audio will diagree with my agreement
that you know NOTHING about ANYTHING to do with audio for the past 50 years of ANYTHING.

Holier than thou much? Get off your high horse.

[tats_dragon]

Tone is subjective but to me the JMP-1 sounded like a programmable distortion box. Very sterile and an overly processed 'solid state' sound. Not inspiring at all.

Regarding the G-major and AxeFX effects comparison: I'm going to guess that you didn't listen to the AxeFX thru some decent studio monitors.

For me when I audition a piece of gear it falls into two categories.
Inspiring, or not inspiring.

The AxeFX was definitely inspiring.
The AxeFX direct sounded like I was in a control room with a tube amp blasting in another room.


Jun

Originally Posted by mcdyas

Well, maybe I've stood in front of my Plexi too much. But, simply put the AXE-FX doesn't feel or sound like a tube amp, it sounds like a digital simulation and it feels like a solid state amp. Second, the effects on the G-Major compare just fine to the AXE-FX.

I was fully prepared to fall in love with the axe-fx but I tried it, listened carefully and was not impressed. Sorry, if this doesn't fit in with your view.

[Dr. Tweedbucket]

Originally Posted by Zero

No one that knows someone who knows ANYTHING about ANY audio will diagree with my agreement
that you know NOTHING about ANYTHING to do with audio for the past 50 years of ANYTHING.

Holier than thou much? Get off your high horse.

wow!


ok... .... soooo ..... no one knows someone WHO knows ANything about ANY audio ...... ..... will disagree with my agreement that you no NotHINg about Anything .......






.... to do with teh past 50 years of ANY THING

[Marcello]

Originally Posted by Zero

No one that knows someone who knows ANYTHING about ANY audio will diagree with my agreement
that you know NOTHING about ANYTHING to do with audio for the past 50 years of ANYTHING.

Holier than thou much? Get off your high horse.

agreed. It's just hair splitting. The point I was trying to make is that recorded music itself is just a representation of the sounds you hear in a room, therefore there's a loss. Hell even our 5 senses are a filter. Sure we could debate for ages on the mp3 quality but it's kinda like avoiding the real problem.

[Jay Mitchell]

Originally Posted by GuitarTone

If low quality mp3 mic'd tube amp clips are fine for judging real tube amps,

They're not. The wrong premise leads to a wrong conclusion.

[ericb]

Originally Posted by Marcello

agreed. It's just hair splitting. The point I was trying to make is that recorded music itself is just a representation of the sounds you hear in a room, therefore there's a loss. Hell even our 5 senses are a filter. Sure we could debate for ages on the mp3 quality but it's kinda like avoiding the real problem.

Hey Marcello , I typically have different views than the majority of this forum , but mine are very relevant too , as I'm a very experienced gearhead and have a valid view on items that some people might able to relate to. I own the Axe-FX. I still own about 20 amps and about 6-8 preamps. WHY?

The AXE-FX doesn't replace my amps. I have some KILLER AMPS. It replaced a lot of other guys' amps though!!! And rightfully so for them. It's a KILLER piece of gear. They don't own the amps I do , they haven't spent the time picking tubes for the amps I own , and they don't dial them in like I do , and they don't match pedals like I do.. I have that stuff down to a science and auto-pilot like and know which sounds I need for MYSELF. I like simplicity at my bands' gigs basically too , and also like variety . . To me SIMPLICITY is an amp and a pedalboard. I have to worry about PA stuff, and about remembering words, singing some etc and guitar stuff.. It's just too much for me to plan out digital programming for my gigs at this point. Someday that might change for me.. For many guys programming their AXE-FX (or substitute other midi digital gear here) and their foot controller and their expression pedals is actually just as easy as setting up their stack or combo and pedalboard. It's not for me.

Soundwise, I find the Axe-Fx to be absolutely great at NUMEROUS things.. It doesn't just have a few good amp models/sims.. It has LOTS AND LOTS... Are they as good as my tube amps? Yes and no to me. They're better than some , and not as good as others. They have DIFFERENT attributes.. .If I dial the axe-fx in 1 way , it sounds that way all the time... My tube amps are a bit different all the time. I 'm just used to the tube amps a bit more. IF someone knows how to program the AXE-FX I think they will be REALLY REALLY Overjoyed with the damn thing. Hell , I've heard time and time again where guys loved the presets, and they didn't do anything for me. Setting up basic programs FROM SCRATCH Though is an easy thing to do for someone with that inclination (like me) and it's easy to get what you love.. Hell , I haven't upgraded the firmware either and it's KILLER. As soon as 4.00 isn't Beta, I'll upgrade that .

As for direct recording, I think a lot of the clips you've heard on the net that I've heard haven't been very impressive. SO I have to agree with you ... Hate to say it, and I'm not going to point fingers, but hell that's the way I hear it too... Give me a Splawn soundclip , or an Ecstacy one , or a Cameron and they kick my ass.. .Very few of the Axe-FX ones have.. HOWEVER, some of them have too... .Guess what? It's in the capabilities of the player and the tweaker. It's totally useable as a substitue for "REAL AMPS" and it does have a way better FEEL and SOUND and TWEAKABILITY than the other modelers I've owned. I still have a Vox Valvetronix 120 2x12 that unfortunately isn't dependable worth a crud, but when I can get it working for long there are some tones in there that are great too... BUT in the Axe-FX it's dependable and doesn't have just 'some tones' it has 100's of excellent tones.

I'm sure you didn't read this whole thing but if you did, my points are this:
1) we're all different
2) Noone has to be impressed by any clip (I'm never impressed by something because someone else is!)
3) The Axe-Fx to me is virtually a PERFECT TOOL.. It's incredible.. . But for some reason I still have the comfort zone using my old-fashioned amps and pedalboards, a bit more than using the Axe-FX and programming everything with a midi pedalboard (that's just me)
4) If someone didn't like the Axe-Fx AT ALL, I'd have to think : a) it was the wrong tool for their job , or b) they don't have the incling to program patches from scratch like I do
5) Who cares what anyone else says? If you're looking for more tools, check it out.. It's TOTALLY WORTH checking out!!! If not, don't

Hope this helps , as it's another guy's perspective..

Eric

p.s. to the guy who preferred the JMP1, I owned one.. and that was the 1st (and only ) preamp I sold when I got the Axe-FX. I think the Axe-FX is 100x better than that preamp AND I liked the JMP1 a damn lot!!! (Just goes to show we all have different wants/needs/views and neither of us is right!) I still have a Mike Morin hi-gain preamp. Why? IT's rare as hell, kicks ass, and I want it! I still have a few MP1's .. Why? Only because they're not in excellent shape and I won't sell undependable stuff .. The Axe-Fx can do all they do and way better... I still have a Hiwatt preamp .. Why? I love it , as it has 1 clean sound that's just gorgeous.. Can the Axe-Fx do it? I bet I can program it pretty easily , but once again the Hiwatt has knobs and is so ez to tweak and it's rare.. I still have an Engl 520 . Why? Not sure, but I love that hi-gain tone!!! Can the Axe-fx do it? I bet I can get 25 other hi-gain tones that are similar to it, but once again , it's a killer piece of gear, and until I NEED to sell it I won't.. The JMP1 though was replaceable EASILY by the Axe-FX to me.... So were my old VHT Gp3 and my old Egnater IE4... NO problem replacing with the Axe-fx... We all like different things!

[Jay Mitchell]

Originally Posted by Zero

Holier than thou much?

So, tell me this: do you think mp3 is as transparent a medium as any that came before is, specifically, LPs, 1/2" mag tape, or CDs?

Given that it was designed from the outset to reduce data storage and bandwidth requirements, it's trivially obvious that mp3 is a seriously compromised storage medium. It's fine for kids listening to whatever they listen to on their Ipods, idle listening on your computer speakers, and learning songs prior to your band's next rehearsal (although I still prefer CDs for that purpose whenever possible), but, as a medium to convey the real sound and impact of a musical performance, it has, by its very design, always fallen flat on its face. This is not opinion, it is well-established, widely-acknowledged fact.

[Marcello]

Originally Posted by ericb

As for direct recording, I think a lot of the clips you've heard on the net that I've heard haven't been very impressive. SO I have to agree with you ... Hate to say it, and I'm not going to point fingers, but hell that's the way I hear it too... Give me a Splawn soundclip , or an Ecstacy one , or a Cameron and they kick my ass.. .Very few of the Axe-FX ones have..

Great post, agreed 100%. I've said it already but I say it again, it seems like a GREAT unit and I say hats off the designer, really. And I'm glad there's a newcomer on the modeling market. I know I need to shut up and try one

[Unabender]

Originally Posted by Jay Mitchell

Anyone who argues that mp3s don't audibly degrade sound as compared to CDs, vinyl, or 1/2" audio tape simply doesn't know audio.

Most people actually don't care about the small loss, nor have the listening equipment to actually HEAR the difference. Like people have said, hardly no one listens to clips from amp makers through a hi-fi sound system.

Oh I'm sorry, did you say 1/2" AUDIO TAPE? There's a real prime example of perfect retaining tone capabilities... I take MP3 any day, thank you sir.

[Den]

Excellent post ericb!