Factorial This!!

[55bar]

Hi,

Does anyone else use "factorial rhythm" by Mick Goodrick? ive had the book a while and find it really helps my playing going through tunes and exercises, i.e the Krantz book, with these initial rhythmic permutations.

[willhutch]

Tell us more about it. I'm curious about this book. I'd like to also know, specifically, what new avenues of expression or exploration have opened up as a result of using the book.

[dkaplowitz]

I wish I had more time to go through my copy of it. Honestly, I'm still pretty well set with Bellson's 4/4 reading text and the Magadini Polyrhythm book.

[55bar]

hi,

firstly this book is a D.I.Y book. The intro is a 74 min dialogue between the Authors Mitch Haupers and Mick Goodrick. It goes on to explain firstly the meaning of factorial : The product of a number and all the numbers before it 4 x 3 x 2 x 1 =24. This idea is then extrapolated to rhythm. the example given is: 1=1 eight note 2=2 eighth notes etc. This is followed by working out the finite rhythmic permutations with these. "what this means is that 4 factorial when applied to rhythm, yields 24 new rhythms.".
These rhythms are then displaced twice before they become the original rhythm again. So there are 96 possibilities in all (24 x 4).

Basically this is a finite number and is small enough to practice all therefore giving the student the full spectrum of rhythms available.
NOTE:
for me the "Metheny lessons" freely available on the internet if you look hard enough is where the start of my exploration into this. Here Metheny helps a student become much more "Critical" about his rhythm and time. in one exercise on the tape Metheny playes over a minor blues just using chord tones. It was like a smack in the face to me! It was his use of rhythmic motives which is just amazing. From then on i decided to make the Factorial book a major part of my practice routine.

May i also add Wayne Krantz's book improvisers OS is a fantastic accompaniment to Factorial rhythm. I pick a formula then choose one of the "seed" rhythms i.e Crotchet followed by 2 quavers. and then improvise with this formula and this rhythm.

Back to the book; The four "seed" rhythms are
1 Crotchet 2quavers. Dang Danga
2 2 Quavers followed by 1 crotchet. Danga Dang
3 Quaver followed by crotchet followed by quaver.
4 4 Quavers with the last one tied to the first.

These rhythms are then Joined together to create a bar of 4 beats rather than a 2 beat bar. I.E

1 Crotchet, four quavers, crotchet
2 Crotchet, 3 quavers, crotchet, quaver

followed by every possible permutation of the original
4 "seed" rhythms.

My description doesn't do the books Beautifully simplistic layout any justice!

This is a very generalized description of the first few pages. What its done for me (so far) is it has made me aware.

1 my time feel (i play all examples straight and with a swing feel. using some of the first "Seed" rhythms over a slow blues really helped me focus on my time. before would just play lots of notes an lines not much space. my playing really started to swing.

Its like this: IMO the time is there already, what i was doing was to try and create the time with my lines rather than just letting it breath, and dropping in notes, when these notes are in the pocket (which in my opinion practicing these ideas and being critical of their placement) the time takes care of its self. (this is so hard to explain with out sounding pretentious, (i'm not even at the tip of the iceberg).

Any how Clear as mud???

Craig.

[willhutch]

Thanks Craig. You remind me of myself in the way you described the book.


...er..uh...no offense!

[55bar]

Well i hope it was of some benifit? Its worth buying if your into time and phrasing. Like has been said the louis belson books are good "modern reading text in 4/4" the beauty of "factorial rhythm" is is the intro, giving you ideas on how you may want to use it.

[willhutch]

I'm reviving this thread in the hopes of finding out more about the book. Anybody have any thing to share about their experience with their study of Factorial Rhythm?

[Lucidology]

Funny .. just the other day I was contemplating ordering the book ...
'Tis a sign I must do so now ..:-)

[pedped]

I've just got the book the other day and have only looked into it very breefly. I had fun using Belsons 4/4 stuff, playing with a drummer and then marking the rythms from the book out along with him. Actually quite difficult to sync but also very good excercise to do it with a (good) drummer, as they tend to play a lot less wrong notes and will keep the beat going. Otherwise, I tend to stop and fix the mistakes i make but this will force you to keep the music going, just as 'out there in the real world'

That being said, I actually find it somewhat difficult to make some good excercises out of this Factorial book. I hear one improvising only using specific rhythms from the book, and I will try that, but can somone come up with additional great excercices?