Underemployed or previously over paid?

[gainiac]

Originally Posted by jcmark611

This is why we need to get behind the High Speed Rail project here in America. It will put everyone from lawyers to janitors to work and the jobs will be plentiful. It will also be the biggest construction project since the Interstate system. For those unaware of what I am talking about..... http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/16/obama.rail

/

Landlords HATE stuff like that. I wish we had high speed rail here in the NYC metro area. Instead of running commuter trains at 60mph~ you run them at 150. Initially it will dilute residential property values close to the city center, landowners are shortsighted and see this as bad.

The damned subway system here is held together by shoestrings and bubblegum it's a transportation feat everyday they keep moving.

I'm all for infrastructure improvement. It's the bones of the country. We need more efficient transport systems. It's amazing how the Trans-Con lines have essentially converted themselves into bridge routes to carry Pacific traffic to the Atlantic & vice versa.......

[gainiac]

Originally Posted by guitarist58

^^^ This. More of the "bigger picture" if you will. Not only has the increase in wealth of the top 1/10 of 1% exponentially outstripped inflation in recent decades while all others have remained stagnant or declined, this phenomenon is being achieved through planning and concerted effort. Seems human nature hasn't changed much over recorded history. And now even some the tax dollars of many folks are going to those needy and never satisfied ones at the top.

If anyone is interested in looking into this merriment further, I recommend this book as one possible starting place. But not if you're at risk for high blood pressure.

-rocky

I think it's time for supersonic lead poisoning.

[jcmark611]

Originally Posted by gainiac

Landlords HATE stuff like that. I wish we had high speed rail here in the NYC metro area. Instead of running commuter trains at 60mph~ you run them at 150. Initially it will dilute residential property values close to the city center, landowners are shortsighted and see this as bad.

The damned subway system here is held together by shoestrings and bubblegum it's a transportation feat everyday they keep moving.

I'm all for infrastructure improvement. It's the bones of the country. We need more efficient transport systems. It's amazing how the Trans-Con lines have essentially converted themselves into bridge routes to carry Pacific traffic to the Atlantic & vice versa.......

I would think the opposite would happen concerning property values. Since most train stations will be build in or near the town center who wouldn't want to be within walking distance of the train that takes the to work?

I work in the railroad industry and I couldn't being to imagine how many dollars have been lost in production due to the inefficiency of the railroads in the US. The railroad problem isn't the union or management, it's just a 120 year old system that has had very little upgrades done to it's infrastructure during that time. If anything it was so drastically reduced in the 80's and 70's that it has come back to hurt them now.

[anxiousmofo]

I love a good union bashing political thread in disguise.

[guitarist58]

Originally Posted by gainiac

Landlords HATE stuff like that. I wish we had high speed rail here in the NYC metro area. Instead of running commuter trains at 60mph~ you run them at 150. Initially it will dilute residential property values close to the city center, landowners are shortsighted and see this as bad.

The damned subway system here is held together by shoestrings and bubblegum it's a transportation feat everyday they keep moving.

I'm all for infrastructure improvement. It's the bones of the country. We need more efficient transport systems. It's amazing how the Trans-Con lines have essentially converted themselves into bridge routes to carry Pacific traffic to the Atlantic & vice versa.......

I heard the statistic a few years ago on the news--in the 1960's California spent something like 1/3 of it's entire budget on infrastructure, now (at the time of the report) it was something like less than 3%...

[edgewound]

Back to the OP....

I'm all for higher education and have a Bachelors Degree.

But....If people haven't been paying attention....Those with the most acronyms after their name have run this country into the ground full speed.

Is that something to be proud of? The real problem of advanced degree programs is the educating of reality and common sense out the door in favor of a new algorithm that has proven to be a failure.

The real education will be keeping an employed work force that can pay INCOME taxes to support our way of living and beyond.

[guitarist58]

Originally Posted by edgewound

Back to the OP....

I'm all for higher education and have a Bachelors Degree.

But....If people haven't been paying attention....Those with the most acronyms after their name have run this country into the ground full speed.

Is that something to be proud of? The real problem of advanced degree programs is the educating of reality and common sense out the door in favor of a new algorithm that has proven to be a failure.

The real education will be keeping an employed work force that can pay INCOME taxes to support our way of living and beyond.

That reminds me of something I saw while watching CNBC back during the dot-com bust and fall (into prison in many cases) of some really big players. All of a sudden business schools were talking about incorporating ethics classes into their curriculum. What a concept! Would have made me want to laugh, but it was just a bit too tragic...

[edgewound]

Originally Posted by guitarist58

That reminds me of something I saw while watching CNBC back during the dot-com bust and fall (into prison in many cases) of some really big players. All of a sudden business schools were talking about incorporating ethics classes into their curriculum. What a concept! Would have made me want to laugh, but it was just a bit too tragic...

Funny you should bring that up. When I went to college one of my classes was "Morals and Ethics".

Eliminating this would be akin to eliminating PE in grade school...when the next stop is real life.

[HammyD]

Originally Posted by edgewound

Funny you should bring that up. When I went to college one of my classes was "Morals and Ethics".

Eliminating this would be akin to eliminating PE in grade school...when the next stop is real life.

Unfortunately, a report based upon the experience of college professors teaching the ethics classes indicated a fair amount of the students felt the class was a "how-to" class.

I can't find the article, but it indicated that a percentage of college students felt it was necessary to lie and cheat to achieve success, and that was okay.

My own experience working at a college was that a majority did not feel that way, but the others had a total suspension of any sort of ethics at all. And this was not limited to the student body, but the staff primarily under the age of 30.

The unethical ones over 30 seemed to be restrained by a fear of exposure and the reprecussions, but the under 30 seemed amazed when caught, and simply could not or would not comprehend why they were being singled out.

Back to the original topic, only the majority of those aiming for a Masters or Phd. seemed to have a chance at gainful employment. The majority with a BA have very few prospects. Even those with additional degrees are not fairing well. Last report I heard 70% of the University of South Carolina Law School Grads that had passed the BAR had not found gainful employment within a year of acceptance.

[FeloniousBishop]

This is an article I came across a couple of weeks ago:

Americans are overpaid

For the global economy to rebalance, the pay gap between Americans and the rest of the world must shrink.

By Martin Hutchinson and Edward Hadas, breakingviews.com
November 11, 2009: 3:17 PM ET

(breakingviews.com) -- U.S. workers are overpaid, relative to equally productive foreigners doing the same work. If the global economy is ever to get back into balance, that gap needs to be closed.

Of course, U.S. workers should earn more than their peers in China, Moldova, or Vietnam. The Americans take advantage of the higher productivity that makes their country rich: better education and infrastructure, abundant capital and a more developed work ethic. But how much higher should U.S. wages be?

The answer depends in large part on two measures: the difference in productivity in making goods that can be traded across borders, and the quantity of such tradable goods. Both measures point to a narrowing wage gap.

There are so many factors working to push up productivity in poor countries. Fast development, cheap capital, and more efficient shipping all help make foreign factories more competitive. Cheap global communication through the Internet reduces all sorts of costs and makes it easy to trade many more goods and especially services.

The global wage gap has been narrowing, but recent U.S. labor market statistics suggest the adjustment has not gone far enough.

One indicator is unemployment, which has risen unexpectedly rapidly in this downturn. The 7.3 million jobs lost are more than treble the 2 million of the next worst post-war recession, in 1980-82. Some of that huge increase reflects the turbulence of an unusually sharp decline in GDP, but there could be another factor: the recession has revealed many workers are paid more than they are worth.

Another possible sign is the huge surge in reported productivity, which has begun while output was still declining. That suggests that some production is being outsourced altogether, often to lower-paid foreign workers.

The big U.S. trade deficit -- cut in half but still at alarmingly high levels -- is another sign of excessive pay for Americans. One explanation for the attractive prices of imported goods is that U.S. workers are paid too much, relative to their foreign peers.

Global wage convergence is great for the poor but tough on the overpaid rich. It's possible to run the numbers to show that U.S. manufacturing workers should take average real wage cuts of as much as 20% to get into global balance.

The required cut may be smaller. But if U.S. wages get stuck above global market-clearing levels, as in the 1930s, the result could well be something approaching 1930s levels of unemployment.

Pretty well anything would be better than that. A combination of moderate inflation to reduce real wages and a further drop in the dollar's real trade-weighted value might be an acceptable combination.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/11/11/news...ex.htm?cnn=yes

[jcmark611]

Originally Posted by FeloniousBishop

This is an article I came across a couple of weeks ago:

Americans are overpaid

For the global economy to rebalance, the pay gap between Americans and the rest of the world must shrink.

By Martin Hutchinson and Edward Hadas, breakingviews.com
November 11, 2009: 3:17 PM ET

(breakingviews.com) -- U.S. workers are overpaid, relative to equally productive foreigners doing the same work. If the global economy is ever to get back into balance, that gap needs to be closed.

Of course, U.S. workers should earn more than their peers in China, Moldova, or Vietnam. The Americans take advantage of the higher productivity that makes their country rich: better education and infrastructure, abundant capital and a more developed work ethic. But how much higher should U.S. wages be?

The answer depends in large part on two measures: the difference in productivity in making goods that can be traded across borders, and the quantity of such tradable goods. Both measures point to a narrowing wage gap.

There are so many factors working to push up productivity in poor countries. Fast development, cheap capital, and more efficient shipping all help make foreign factories more competitive. Cheap global communication through the Internet reduces all sorts of costs and makes it easy to trade many more goods and especially services.

The global wage gap has been narrowing, but recent U.S. labor market statistics suggest the adjustment has not gone far enough.

One indicator is unemployment, which has risen unexpectedly rapidly in this downturn. The 7.3 million jobs lost are more than treble the 2 million of the next worst post-war recession, in 1980-82. Some of that huge increase reflects the turbulence of an unusually sharp decline in GDP, but there could be another factor: the recession has revealed many workers are paid more than they are worth.

Another possible sign is the huge surge in reported productivity, which has begun while output was still declining. That suggests that some production is being outsourced altogether, often to lower-paid foreign workers.

The big U.S. trade deficit -- cut in half but still at alarmingly high levels -- is another sign of excessive pay for Americans. One explanation for the attractive prices of imported goods is that U.S. workers are paid too much, relative to their foreign peers.

Global wage convergence is great for the poor but tough on the overpaid rich. It's possible to run the numbers to show that U.S. manufacturing workers should take average real wage cuts of as much as 20% to get into global balance.

The required cut may be smaller. But if U.S. wages get stuck above global market-clearing levels, as in the 1930s, the result could well be something approaching 1930s levels of unemployment.

Pretty well anything would be better than that. A combination of moderate inflation to reduce real wages and a further drop in the dollar's real trade-weighted value might be an acceptable combination.

http://money.cnn.com/2009/11/11/news...ex.htm?cnn=yes

BOO this man! BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[gainiac]

Originally Posted by jcmark611

I would think the opposite would happen concerning property values. .

What I meant is the folks enjoying the prime residential rents within the "magic hour" commute circle would not enjoy that ability if the circles radius is extended to twice the size.

[gainiac]

Originally Posted by FeloniousBishop

This is an article I came across a couple of weeks ago:

Americans are overpaid

For the global economy to rebalance, the pay gap between Americans and the rest of the world must shrink.

The problem is that while wages are shrinking prices here are not.

[Luke]

Originally Posted by gainiac

The problem is that while wages are shrinking prices here are not.

Prices aren't shrinking?

Ever been to the dollar store? Walmart? Home Depot?

We were in Walmart today and saw a kid's Diamondback 20" bike for $47, when I got my first 20" bike in the 1970s it was $200. Effectively, inflation adjusted, today's bike is 10% the cost.

Go price Lenox, it's half of what it cost in 1980.

The cost of living is more a function of purchasing volume than individual item inflation.

People complain they can't survive on a single income today, never taking into account their parents lived in a house 1/2 the size, only had one car, no microwave, DVD player, three TVs, 200+ channel cable service, 100+ pairs of shoes, computers, internet service, iPhones, iPods, laptops, a boat, etc.....if you are willing to live like your grandmother did, you could pull it off IMO.

[gainiac]

Originally Posted by Luke

Prices aren't shrinking?

Ever been to the dollar store? Walmart? Home Depot?

We were in Walmart today and saw a kid's Diamondback 20" bike for $47, when I got my first 20" bike in the 1970s it was $200. Effectively, inflation adjusted, today's bike is 10% the cost.

Go price Lenox, it's half of what it cost in 1980.

The cost of living is more a function of purchasing volume than individual item inflation.

What about interest rates, insurance premiums, utilities......taxes......etc???? Been going up steadily where I'm at for 10+ years.