Why do most amps sound the same?

[Rena Rune]

It's frustrating.

So many amps out there are basically upgraded or modified Marshalls or Fenders. Outside of that, you have the Voxes, the Mesas. Outside of that a bit again you have the Oranges and the Peaveys.

Just about everything seems to be somewhere between these 6 points(althouh very little does an Orange - they're the one sort of sound that's remained relatively unique).

How do you remedy this? As a guitar player, I love the sound of a Cranked JCM, Plexi, a nice Fender or Vox. But I kind of hate myself for it almost. I'm not denying there is a lot of territory that can be covered there, but I'm getting kind of tired of it.

Outside of that, you can throw in a fuzz or distortion pedals - but again, most fuzzes are either a fuzz face, big muff or scrambler/square wave glitch type, or some mix in between, and most distortion pedals are just trying to emulate amps, or some generic sound presented by various amps and pedals.

I love my Boss HM-2 for this reason - it's kind of what I wish my Turbo RAT had been. It actually had it's own unique voice. Rats just sound like Fuzzier JCM800s. The Turbo RAT I had was meant to be "Nastier", but mostly just sounded dry.

So what is the solution to this? One thing some guitarists do is plug into a bass amp. But I find it so hard to find information on this - most Bass amps nowadays seem to be super clean SS combos.

It just seems to me that based on the exceptions to the rule, like the Oranges and the Boss HM-2s, there should be an amp or distortion pedal that pushes out in another direction. I'm guessing it's likely to end up being a cheap SS amp instead of an expensive vintage/boutique tube amp, but then again you get more variety with tubes, most SS amps just seem to try and copy tube amps.

I get tired of modelers that only copy existing sounds or make some composite of them for their "Originals".

Is there anything out there that doesn't sound like a mainstream amp? That has a unique voicing that's usuable in a variety of different situations(unlike a lot of "crazy fuzz" pedals)?

[Donbecker]

Originally Posted by Rena Rune

...I get tired of modelers that only copy existing sounds or make some composite of them for their "Originals".

Is there anything out there that doesn't sound like a mainstream amp? That has a unique voicing that's usuable in a variety of different situations(unlike a lot of "crazy fuzz" pedals)?

I'm not sure what you're really after here... are you looking for an amp with some one of a kind voice?

Yet usable in all sorts of situations? Sounds like a contradiction IMHO.

I've put the modeling stuff thru clean Roland Jazz Chorus's before and they sound good, I think lots of guitarists get a bad impression of the modeling stuff as they run it thru an amp that colors it, then wonder why it doesn't sound right.

Just my 2 cents.

[EADGBE]

I have three Marshalls and they all sound different.

[MRscratch]

i guess its just that an amp is an amp. they all do the same thing. some better than others.
i find that by just getting a good tone, and being satisfied with it, and just concentrating on my playing is when im most at ease with all of this.
a good player will get all the tones and sounds out of his/her amp that they need.or you go the other way, like the edge, or jack whyte, or any other player in the effects player scope. nels cline ? wow.
some players seem like they dont care about tone, yet just are killer.i mean randy rhoads tone?...meh, but his playing is incredible.

[Sean French]

Dumble style amp of coarse.
They all sound different.

[nullin]

Originally Posted by MRscratch

i guess its just that an amp is an amp. they all do the same thing. some better than others.
i find that by just getting a good tone, and being satisfied with it, and just concentrating on my playing is when im most at ease with all of this.
a good player will get all the tones and sounds out of his/her amp that they need.or you go the other way, like the edge, or jack whyte, or any other player in the effects player scope. nels cline ? wow.
some players seem like they dont care about tone, yet just are killer.i mean randy rhoads tone?...meh, but his playing is incredible.

Very true. Some people literally spend tens of thousands of dollars chasing an amp that will make them sound perfect. Usually those people are uncomfortable in their guitar playing, for one reason or another (sometimes rather talented people too).

But I agree, most guitar tones are variations on the classic sounds. Maybe more compressed, more gain, or EQ'd differently, but still just a variation. I think that's because they tend to work so well in a band situation and sitting in a mix. A lot of the "off the wall tones" just don't work for very many applications. Guess you just have to try a lot of amps and see which way you lean. Oranges are great amps, and very unique (BUT still in the British amp family). For some of the heavier styles, German amps give their take on distortion as well (Diezel, Engl, Framus). I think the hardest thing to do is find a unique sound that really fits yourself as a player. But the journey sure is fun!

[rsm]

Sounds like you are ready for an Axe-Fx. The Axe-Fx lets you tweek parameters, such as the tonestack, frequencies, sag, etc. so you can essentially design your own amp. I did not do this when I had mine, however there were some people who were/are creating their own unique amp models (I think starting with an existing amp block and changing anything/everything IIRC) or blending features of several amp models to create something new/different.

Have a look at the Axe-Fx wiki for the Amp block and the advanced parameters. http://axefxwiki.guitarlogic.org/ind...#Amp_Simulator

Add to this the cab blocks, mic placement, IR's you can make something different. FWIW, you can do much more than create a composite IMO.

YMMV

But this is in the Amps & Cabs forum, so I don't know how many Axe-Fx gurus will see this to chime in.

IMO of course.

[Tone_Terrific]

Originally Posted by nullin

But I agree, most guitar tones are variations on the classic sounds. Maybe more compressed, more gain, or EQ'd differently, but still just a variation. I think that's because they tend to work so well in a band situation and sitting in a mix. A lot of the "off the wall tones" just don't work for very many applications.

+1
They are all different, a little, but it doesn't matter much because you have to stay within the realm of electric guitar sound in order to produce the desired end result.
Leo didn't get it all right but guitar tone was pretty well finished by the late 60's. Once you get to the 'good' stage and tune it to the application it is pretty predictable.

[jetstrat]

Because we all sound like ourselves no matter what we plug into.

[62Tele]

Amps can sound very different, but I figured out awhile back that I sound the same no matter what the amp. Sure, there are differences in this and that, but the basic message of my playing is pretty much unchanged. Coming to terms with that has saved me a lot of subsequent grief.

[diagrammatiks]

A lot of people like the blackface, tweed, or plexi sound. A lot boutique amp builders cut their teeth modding and hot rodding old marshals and fenders. Mesa Boogies came out of that and so did Soldanos. There are a number of builders that do plexi/fender in ways that are different and sometimes superior to the original, tone king, top hat, fargen, roccaforte.

I don't know where you are getting the 6 points from though. As for orange, they are basically a chunkier darker british voiced amp.

At the end of the day an amp is going to sound like an amp. There are parameters that a tube amp isn't going to be able to break out of by itself. It's not going to suddenly sound like a turntable. Maybe you need to be playing a different instrument entirely?

There are plenty of pedals that do awesome things. There are a lot of octave pedals out there but my death by audio robot is pretty unique in the amount of craziness it allows. The EH pog and hog basically turn your guitar into a synth. Not to mention moogerfoogers, feedbackers like the ones Dwarfcraft makes, or the truly beautiful disaster from devi ever.

Back to amps...I have 6 amps right now, a thd flexi 50 which is its own circuit, a plexi clone, a tweed clone, a blackface clone, a trainwreck clone, a dumble clone, and a high gain amp. They don't really sound anything like each other cranked. At low volumes sure but then there's not really that much tube interaction happening. Every amp takes pedals differently. It's just about whether your willing to take the time to dial in your tones.

The axe fx is cool and all but it's even harder to dial in then a stack of amps. Unless you're happy to use the presets there are an infinite number of options to tweak. That doesn't sound much fun either.

[rsm]

Originally Posted by diagrammatiks

The axe fx is cool and all but it's even harder to dial in then a stack of amps. Unless you're happy to use the presets there are an infinite number of options to tweak. That doesn't sound much fun either.

I think if you really want to get something different from the Axe-Fx it may require some effort. I recall reading a post where someone said it was like being able to test different circuits, tubes, etc., without any soldering - but you still need to understand the interaction and affect of different options / settings to get it to work i.e., enough theory/skills on how tube amps work to make this work in the Axe-Fx.

Agreed, for me this was not much fun, I spent more time tweaking than playing. The Axe-Fx was overkill for my needs, about 95% of what I want I get from my Vox tube amps; the rest from my Fender tube amp, modelers or preamps. No need for me to create my own custom amp FWIW.

YMMV

[chillerthanmost]

Weird, all the amps I have sound different and all are bass and guitar heads. Both cleans and overdrives sound different from each other and 3 of the 5 heads are neither of the "sounds" you mentioned. We even have two 70's Ampeg V4's and they both sound different from each other. My ears must be too picky

p.s. the Boss HM-2 has, by far, been my favorite distortion pedal

[Shiny McShine]

Ha ha, most amps I play just sound bad to me. Very few really ring by bell and those are always unique sounding. My current toolbox contains--Marshall 1974x with Vintage Haboers, Clark Beaufort, 65 Ampeg Gemini, 57 Twin handwired, Alamo rebuilt out of spec, and a little Univox 1 X 12. All are very unique.

[splatt]

one of my amps sounds the same.

in that case, i sound the same as me does,
even though i aim for a flurry of targets, simultaneously:
oh, well!
i guess that's just how the crackers tumble.

dt / spltrcl