Alnico 2 vrs Alnico 4: what are the differences?

[echo unit]

I am debating whether to have some custom pickups wound with Alnico 2 or Alnico 4 magnets and want to find out what the main differences are.

Tone - brighter or darker

Harmonic Overtones

Response to delicate finger playing

Which are better for clean amp sounds

Which are better for overdriven amp sounds

Which have longer sustain characteristics

Which create more distortion from the pickup itself

Which are better for recording guitar tracks that need to sit in the mix

Which are more polite/boring and which are more complex sounding

Which are more organic and woody

[nmiller]

Alnico IV makes a stronger magnet than alnico II. Generally, a stronger magnet leads to a more compressed sound with more mid-range and fewer highs and lows. You'd probably want the weaker magnet (alnico II) for clean sounds because it won't drive the amp as hard. Alnico II would also provide more nuanced dynamics for fingerpicking (though many folks, especially country players, prefer a compressed sound for this). A more compressed sound (alnico IV) would give you more sustain.

However, there are so many additional variables in the construction of the pickup and guitar that there are myriad exceptions to these generalizations. The questions about sitting in the mix, polite/boring and organic sounds are so vague as to be meaningless; any generalization I could make would be pointless.

[bluesjuke]

"Alnico 2 vrs Alnico 4: what are the differences?"


Two, exactly 2 is the difference.


Seriously, I've read descriptions of a 4 as having qualities of both a 2 and a 5 magnet.

[echo unit]

Any sound examples anywhere on the internet that you can think of?

[RockStarNick]

This is my understanding in a nutshell:

Alnico 5: Big Bass, Powerful Treble, medium midrange.

Alnico 2: Softer subdied bass, big sweet midrange, sweet top end.

Alnico 4: Very flat EQ characteristics. Often used in bridge buckers that call for A5's, but when people want less of an extreme EQ.

[wizard333]

Actually the generally agreed upon difference is the exact oposite of whats posted above.

Alnico 2 seems to have less "highs and lows" and more of a midrange quality; Alnico 4 (or 5) has more bite and punch.

I'd refer you to examples of both: See the difference between the Duncan Custom 5 (Alnico 5, will be very close to alnico 4) and the Duncan Custom Custom (Alnico 2). They are the same wind, same construction, same wire, just different magnet. Look at the tone charts and you'll see what I mean.

I don't think you'll find a difference in 'touch sensitivity' etc.; and what you like clean is matter of taste (do you like a more "scooped" sound or a more "buttery" sound?).

The weaker magnet will lead to better sustain because the magnetic field "grabs" the string less and lets it ring. This is a VERY noticeable affect on neck pickups, and I suspect its why Gibson uses Alnico 2 on most of the burstbuckers and the 57 classic.

[echo unit]

Thanks guys. Many opinions.

I PLAY CLEAN ONLY THROUGH VOX AMPS

My thing is that I have an SG where I love alnico 2 tone in the neck pickup but the bridge pickup in the SG is too thin. I want the bridge pickup to sound thicker and closer to what an ES335 or Les Paul sound like on the bridge pickup.

Some have said that using an Alnico 4 will make the bridge pickup thicker sounding, and more like what I want to hear.

Do you think it's possible to get the same thicker sounding bridge pickup results out of Alnico 2?

Remember that I play clean with no overdrive at all. I am not looking for a thick bridge pickup for playing chunky riffs. Just the opposite. I am doing clean playing and I use the bridge pickup for volume swells with effects. I want the bridge pickup to sound full but also have lots of harmonic overtones and interesting complex sound that is full of character.

Every time I read anything about pickups, it seems that Alnico 2 is the secret ingredient to getting tone that has lots of character. I have been suggested to use Alnico 4 but I am afraid that it does not have as much character and interesting complex tone and harmonic overtones.


Please set me straight on this

[otterhound]

I realize that you are referring to humbuckers , but I just recently completed a Tele copy with Klein Alnico 4 pups . Very crisp and clean . Almost Jazz-like .

[Darth Tater]

Originally Posted by RockStarNick

This is my understanding in a nutshell:

Alnico 5: Big Bass, Powerful Treble, medium midrange.

Alnico 2: Softer subdied bass, big sweet midrange, sweet top end.

Alnico 4: Very flat EQ characteristics. Often used in bridge buckers that call for A5's, but when people want less of an extreme EQ.

This exactly how I heard it after a recent pickup test. I went with Alnico 5 because it had more lows and highs, and just more powerful overall.

[RockStarNick]

Originally Posted by wizard333

Actually the generally agreed upon difference is the exact oposite of whats posted above.

Alnico 2 seems to have less "highs and lows" and more of a midrange quality; Alnico 4 (or 5) has more bite and punch.

That's pretty much exactly what I posted... not the opposite...

[wizard333]

I was referring to nmiller's post, which is backwards.

All things kept the same, going to Alnico 4 will probably be the oposite direction as what you want; its going to be brighter and may strike you as 'more thin'.

I think you'd be better off, no matter what magnet you get, going with a higher wind, not a 'high output' pickup, but a paf type in the 8.5k -9.5k range. Thats going to balance better with the neck pickup and sound more full without sounding like a 'high output' pickup.

[echo unit]

Originally Posted by wizard333

I was referring to nmiller's post, which is backwards.

All things kept the same, going to Alnico 4 will probably be the oposite direction as what you want; its going to be brighter and may strike you as 'more thin'.

I think you'd be better off, no matter what magnet you get, going with a higher wind, not a 'high output' pickup, but a paf type in the 8.5k -9.5k range. Thats going to balance better with the neck pickup and sound more full without sounding like a 'high output' pickup.

So are you saying to stick with Alnico 2?

[Darth Tater]

Originally Posted by echo unit

So are you saying to stick with Alnico 2?

To me alnico 2 is MUCH thinner than alnico 5. Alnico 5 = fat & juicy. In my guitar, anyway.

[echo unit]

For clean guitar tones, will A2 or A4 provide more tone and harmonic overtones?

[echo unit]

Well,

just as an example of the direction I need to be going in......I listened to every single audio clip over at the Seymour Duncan website and my favorite sounding pickup both neck and bridge positions of every single pickup in their sound samples was...

The Seth Lover Model




By a country mile too.





They has the most 3D and woody tone where you could hear more of the wood of the guitar and the other pickups all sounded pinched or dampened in some way where the guitar vibration was not translating and therefore the sustain was tapering off each note too quickly whereas the Seth Lover just sings! So based on that,

Which pickups do you think I would like best from the boutique makers?