Cone Cry

[jcshirke]

I've got an amp that's producing a lot of cone cry, no matter what speaker I try with it. I've tried a G12H30 (70th anniv. model), but it cries. I put a Gold in. It cries less, but still cries on one particular note. Now I've got a Weber 12A150A in there, and it cries.

I tried a different G12H30 that I had in another amp, and I didn't hear any cry, so maybe that speaker will be a winner. I didn't keep it in there too long, though, so I'm not 100% sure that all will be okay with it.

My question: Is there any chance the cone cry in any of these speakers will go away once they break in more? The Gold and the Weber are brand new. The first G12H isn't new, but I'm not sure how many hours I have on it. It's not tons, that's for sure.

Or could it be a problem with the amp? (I've talked with the builder already, but I'm curious to get any additional thoughts from those of you who have dealt with this problem.) Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Jeff

[LowellH]

How hard are you tightening the speaker nuts? Do you have an external cab you can test the speakers in?

Sometimes a rattling tube/shield can sound like cone cry. What's the amp?

[dukeh62]

Could also be an issue with the filter caps...either underfiltered or old.

[jcshirke]

Originally Posted by LowellH

How hard are you tightening the speaker nuts? Do you have an external cab you can test the speakers in?

Sometimes a rattling tube/shield can sound like cone cry. What's the amp?

I hand-tightened the speaker nuts. They are definitely tight, but not as tight as I could make them, obviously.

I don't have an external 1 x 12 cab. I do have an extra 2 x 12 that has two Webers in it. Those speakers are wired in series (16 ohms, I think). I guess I could take them out and put a single speaker in there? Is that what you had in mind? Or should I test the speaker(s) with a different amp?

I took the tube shields off. Still getting tons of cry.

Oh...this is a Louis Electric Tremoverb.

Thanks,

Jeff

[jcshirke]

Originally Posted by dukeh62

Could also be an issue with the filter caps...either underfiltered or old.

I can always ask Lou and see what he says. The amp is basically new.

Thanks.

[guitarslinger21]

When a speaker does weird things like this, the problem is usually the enclosure, for me.

[jcshirke]

Originally Posted by guitarslinger21

When a speaker does weird things like this, the problem is usually the enclosure, for me.

But I've tried 4 different speakers. Can all of the enclosures have a problem?

[jay42]

Rear-loaded, right? That helps a bit. Are the Webers light doped? It's a risk. I'd definitely test your speakers in a separate cabinet.

[jcshirke]

Originally Posted by jay42

Rear-loaded, right? That helps a bit. Are the Webers light doped? It's a risk. I'd definitely test your speakers in a separate cabinet.

Rear-loaded. The Weber has moderate dope.

Are you saying I should test the speakers in a separate cab but with the same amp? Or with a different amp entirely?

Thanks.

[phsyconoodler]

Quote: "But I've tried 4 different speakers. Can all of the enclosures have a problem?"

Sure sounds like it may be the problem.That and the amp are the constants here.
You need to make sure the tubes and bias are correct before making too much of a judgement here.

I have a Traynor YBA3 with a 1-15" speaker that cone crys like a banshee.It's the closed back and rather small enclosure that makes it do it.Plugging into a 2-12 cabinet cures it.However,the amp really drives the snot out of any speaker it's connected too.Something to consider.And of course pedals used to drive the amp.

[jcshirke]

Originally Posted by phsyconoodler

Quote: "But I've tried 4 different speakers. Can all of the enclosures have a problem?"

Sure sounds like it may be the problem.That and the amp are the constants here.
You nee to make sure the tubes and bias are correct before making too much of a judgement here.

I guess I must not be clear about what you mean by "enclosure" here. Are you talking about part of the speakers' frames, or the amp's cabinet?

Lou wouldn't send me an amp with the tubes biased incorrectly. I know there's zero chance of that. If they could drift on their own over time, though, that's a different story. Is that possible?

[Scumback Speakers]

Check to make sure you haven't bent the speaker frames, or over-tightened the bolts which would bend the frame and the cone, producing cone cry/shrill high end.

How to install your speakers: http://www.southbayampworks.com/sd/speakermounting.pdf

[jcshirke]

Originally Posted by Scumback Speakers

Check to make sure you haven't bent the speaker frames, or over-tightened the bolts which would bend the frame and the cone, producing cone cry/shrill high end.

How to install your speakers: http://www.southbayampworks.com/sd/speakermounting.pdf

I'm 99.999% sure I haven't done that. I've just tightened the bolts down by hand so the speakers sits securely, but no more than that.

I appreciate your input, though, that's for sure. Thanks, Jim.

[jay42]

Originally Posted by jcshirke

Are you saying I should test the speakers in a separate cab but with the same amp? Or with a different amp entirely?

I was saying use the combo as a head. Disconnect the internal speaker and test all your speakers in whatever you have. I think you mentioned a 2-12".

Since you mention it, connecting the combo speaker to a different amp would be worth the effort.

I actually tighten speakers with my fingers at first. A nut driver comes 15 minutes later, then wait again, and make them snug, not tight.

[pdf64]

I've had cone cry problems with my 1x12 35 watt BF Fender based combo build.
I overdrive the amp heavily, and with Gold or Vintage 30 Celestion speakers, I get that horrid harsh overtone, generally around 7-15 frets, with sustained bent notes on the plain strings.
I tried replacing the Tremolux sized Mojo OT with a beefy Hammond 1750M, which improved it a bit.
Weaker output tubes helped also, eg TAD 6L6WGC, but I prefer the beefy tone of the JAN Philips.
I suspect that the saggy B+ contributes to the problem, and that the root cause is transient spikes as the output tubes flip over from cut off the full on - the saggy B+ pushes the bias way into Class B when it's overdriving (the Geofex site gives some insight into this). But I want the clean to dirty transition compression that the sag provides.
The transient spikes may excite lightweight, lightly doped cones into that bad resonance, when driven hard.
It's ok with a Classic Lead 80, EV SRO12, Fane AXA12, Weber 12A150LD, 12F150LD, or a 4x12 with G12H30 / Vintage 30 pairs.
It's a real shame that the Gold is unusable because of this cone cry issue, because otherwise it's perfect.
I did a waranty return on it to Celestion, because of this. They said it was ok, it must be the amp, but reconed it anyway - it was just the same.
So, I'd try something beefier, with more doping, a stronger cone or higher power rating (what power rating is your Weber 12A150A)?.