QSC K10 for my Character Series Pedals?

[Guitar100]

As there does seem to be a lot of love for the QSC K10 here, I was wondering if folks have thoughts about how this would work with my Tech 21 Character series pedals.

Against my better judgment, I've amassed a collection of three of those: Blonde, British, and Liverpool. I've gigged a couple of times running those into my Tech 21 Power Engine. I have found the results perfectly workable but a little less than inspired. Makes me wonder if something like the QSC K10 would take it up a notch or two. Any thoughts?

I should caution that I'm still someone used to having a "regular" amp on stage (and the Power Engine does approximate that quite well). I will say that my keyboard player, who also runs the sound, would be thrilled if I could lower my stage volume. That said, I wonder if I'd simply end up having as much stage volume, but just aiming back up at me from the K10 (which I imagine I'd use as a personal monitor, and also use to hear vocals) as opposed to behind me like I usually have an amp. Ideally, though, I'd be able to hear myself better with less volume. Not sure if that's a realistic expectation though. In general, with a loud drummer and usually small stages, I generally find I need to have my amp up pretty loud to hear myself. (Honestly, I don't want to blow away the rest of the band, but I really do need to hear myself to play well, and frankly enjoy it.)

At the moment, I've saved up enough money to buy a pretty nice new amp, or I could go this route of investing in a high-quality monitor and continually experiment with what I run into it, whether the Tech 21 stuff, perhaps the Line 6 HD500 down the road. (I'm NOT prepared, however, to spend as much as it would take to get Axe FX).

Anyway, any thoughts? Thanks folks.

p.s. I do appreciate that there appear to be a lot of gigging musicians on this forum, which I'm fairly new to. It's a lot different to talk about this gear stuff with folks who mainly just play at home. Also, I still wonder if I probably could do just fine with one solid clean tone plus my various OD/distortion pedals to add sonic variety, making me think that maybe a high-quality tube amp still might be my best bet for great tone and that "set and forget" approach. I have a tendency to tweak and tweak, whether at home or even at practice (or even, to a lesser extent) on stage. Maybe that won't change regardless of my setup. My sense from experience is that I tweak more when I'm using "modeling" gear (including Tech 21 even if it's NOT technically modeling), but perhaps some folks here really don't do much tweaking in the end once they get a nice batch of tones???? Sorry to keep rambling!

[ElDiabloBlanco]

A couple of ideas -
I don't know about the K12, though it will be louder and less "directional" than the Power Engine. I would suggest, assuming you're using monitors with your band, to put a bit of your guitar signal in the monitor to hear yourself better ( assume you're micing guitar) - might fix it and costs nothing.
I tried using multiple Character pedals and found it easier to just use the Liverpool set clean with an M9 in front. When the HD 500 came out, I picked one up and it's worked really well - better for my needs than the previous setup. I play with a loud band and just elevate the Power Engine on a road case so it sits closer to my head, then mic it.

[Guitar100]

Thanks for the feedack. It's funny what you say about boiling it down to one Character series pedal. I did find that even with both the Blonde and Liverpool set to fairly clean settings, they definitely responded differently to my OD and distortion pedals, which I ran into them, making me basically conclude I'd need to essentially assign each to one or the other Character pedal, further leading to what you did, which was essentially boil it down to one. And like you (I'm guessing), I actually preferred the clean/cleanish tones of the Liverpool pedal.

So, I take it you like the basic "amp tones" of the HD500 better in the end, or was it more the convenience of the all in one?

I do appreciate the suggestion about just getting more guitar in the monitor I use now. The one challenge is that I share it with the bass player, but even adding a bit extra in there combined with the power engine could well help things along.

[Mysterytrain]

One thought: you could just get a little amp-stand like this http://standback.net/ at which point you would be using your power engine more like a "monitor" such as the k10, and less like an "amp". I tilt back the PE60 at home toward my head in a kind of slapdash, homebrew method. I'll likely pick up one of those stand-backs soon.

[ElDiabloBlanco]

I actually prefer the amp tones in the HD500 at this point. I use fairy straightforward patches with a minimum of effects for the most part. I'm a big Tech 21 fan, but Line 6, to me, stepped their game up big time with this. The HD500 into the Power Engine works great, lets me cover a lot of different styles and makes my load in/out as easy as possible ( I have a Power Engine at home and one that lives in a road case on the sound company's truck, so I walk in the door with a guitar in a gig bag and a gym bag with the Pod, cables, and a huge book of charts).

[Rod]

If $$ is a bit of an issue, the HD-300 is a great piece of gear as a tone modeler and is in the $300 range...same tones as the 500...I prefer it because it's simpler and set up more like a guitar amp set up...I do think for the best tones out of a modeler you should think about getting a K10

[62Tele]

Have you tried no amp at all? This is all dependent on your PA of course, but one of the real advantages of running these pedals is getting the amp off the stage and as a result getting rid of hot spots, bleed over onto vocal mics etc. If you have a good sound guy, you could potentially end up with a much better mix.

To me, if you go to the trouble of getting amp modelers or Tech 21 analog versions, then set up a powered monitor, you're just toting another kind of "amp" in the end. I've done this with a 200 watt acoustic amp and like the sound of the PA better.

FWIW, I've tried running the Blonde and Liverpool together and the Blonde alone. If I set the Liverpool to be pretty Vox crunchy and the Blonde to be clean Fender sounding, I can push each one with my Jetdrive and get a nice range of tones. I can also use a couple of different gain pedals into just the Blonde and get a very similar set of sounds.

[Guitar100]

Unfortunately, our "sound guy" is the keyboard player in our band. He's very good and conscientious, but he's on stage with the rest of us, so we generally set things every set, take a quick listen and hope for the best. Not ideal, but that's our reality and it's not going to change any time soon.

In any case, I really do need solid monitoring of one form or another on stage, as I'm usually right on top of our drummer and often have trouble hearing my rig very well as it is. (For the record, I do wear Musicians's Earplugs, because I don't want to go deaf anytime soon. They're better than cheapo earplugs, but I'm not convinced they exactly reduce all frequencies evenly, as is claimed...)

Rod, I'll admit I'm intrigued by the new HD series from Line 6. That said, I've used digital modelers in the past and found myself spending an awful lot of time tweaking and tweaking, ... Had a Line 6 XT for a bit. Before that, a Tonelab LE (running into a Peavey tube power amp and 2x12 speaker). After working with that stuff for a while, I switched back to tubes with a Traynor YCV40. Incidentally, I may start using that onstage with the Character pedals, as they do sound quite good into the effects return. Better, in fact, to my ears, than the Power Engine. To be honest, I'm not quite sure if it's the tubes or the cabinet/speaker, but seems to sound a little fuller and with a better top-end sparkle. Downside is I need to mike it, whereas with the Power Engine I can run that with an XLR straight to the PA.

I do realize that with the Traynor, I'm probably getting more amp "opinion," even if into the effects loop, but I'm less concerned with sounding exactly like the Fender or Vox amp the pedal is seeking to emulate more concerned with just getting some great tones.

Anyway, I appreciate all the feedback here.

[FPFL]

I have its brother the QSC K12 which I love for any good modeller.

I use it for both the t21 British pedal and the AF Standard I have. Both can get great results.

As everyone says, you have to trust your ears not your eyes. I do find whacky looking eq settings often sound great with the t21 british pedal - e.g. a marshall with that much high end would be an ice pick at any volume but it works well on the brit.

[tech21nyc]

Originally Posted by Guitar100

As there does seem to be a lot of love for the QSC K10 here, I was wondering if folks have thoughts about how this would work with my Tech 21 Character series pedals.

Against my better judgment, I've amassed a collection of three of those: Blonde, British, and Liverpool. I've gigged a couple of times running those into my Tech 21 Power Engine. I have found the results perfectly workable but a little less than inspired. Makes me wonder if something like the QSC K10 would take it up a notch or two. Any thoughts?

I should caution that I'm still someone used to having a "regular" amp on stage (and the Power Engine does approximate that quite well). I will say that my keyboard player, who also runs the sound, would be thrilled if I could lower my stage volume. That said, I wonder if I'd simply end up having as much stage volume, but just aiming back up at me from the K10 (which I imagine I'd use as a personal monitor, and also use to hear vocals) as opposed to behind me like I usually have an amp. Ideally, though, I'd be able to hear myself better with less volume. Not sure if that's a realistic expectation though. In general, with a loud drummer and usually small stages, I generally find I need to have my amp up pretty loud to hear myself. (Honestly, I don't want to blow away the rest of the band, but I really do need to hear myself to play well, and frankly enjoy it.)

I play many gigs direct with either our Liverpool or Leeds pedal through a pair of the QSC K10's. That is also my PA and I'm also running backing tracks and vocals through it. The pedals sound really good through the K10's but I always prefer the sound of a regular guitar cabinet. There is nothing in the frequency range of an electric guitar amp that truly benefits from a full range system. Most guitar speakers tend to roll off most frequencies above 5k. That's just me and I'm sure others feel differently.My feeling is that if you are not happy with using the Power Engine and prefer running the pedals into the power section of your tube amp you will not be happy with the K10's. The other thing is when going direct through a PA versus monitoring yourself with an amp is that you are used to hearing more of YOU when using the amp and that won't always work in the main mix unless you have a very flexible monitoring situation.

(For the record, I do wear Musicians's Earplugs, because I don't want to go deaf anytime soon. They're better than cheapo earplugs, but I'm not convinced they exactly reduce all frequencies evenly, as is claimed...)

This may be the other part of your problem. I use these as well with a band. I have 25, 15 and 9 dB filters. For most band gigs if I'm singing I will use the 9dB filters but even they really knock down the sound level a great deal which might be why others think you are playing too loud. I usually try to run a couple of songs without the plugs to set my levels and then put them in for the night. I find those plugs still tend to make me want to turn up more than I would without them.