Learning Hendrix-style rhythm & right hand technique

[hubbstar]

I've searched on TGP and all over the Goog, and I'm shocked that I did not find anything helpful on this topic.

I am having a really, really hard time learning to play Hendrix-style double stops with the proper rhythm/feel. It's not an issue of fretting the right notes or partial chords, which is what 99.9% of the tutorials focus on. It is instead primarily an issue of timing and fluidity, and it's killing me.

Has anyone else struggled with the feel and timing of this style? How did you eventually internalize it? It's like my right hand is too rigid, and the results lack smoothness and that flowing quality. As an example, check out this vid of a guy playing "Bold as Love." I worked on this last night for over an hour and was so frustrated at the end of it. Again, fretting the right notes isn't the issue. It's that special timing and strumming / hammer-on combo that I just can't wrap my head around.

Any suggestions?

[docbop]

You want to play like someone go to their roots and with Hendrix that is R&B bands of the 50's. Check out early Jimi with the Isley's and others playing R&B and you will hear beginnings of his rhythm playing.

[Mark Robinson]

Dude, that shit is hard! Hendrix was a master and had immersed himself utterly in guitar his whole life. The thing to do is to listen, listen, listen, practice, a ton so you don't have to think at all about the notes and strings, and look at the videos of Hendrix, look at his body involvement, how his playing extends from not just his hands, but through his whole body. There isn't a short cut, you just have to keep at it. It's like a dance in a way. Some folks, lots of folks actually never really get that close, but don't give up, it is wonderful music!

[hubbstar]

Thanks. I wasn't sure if I'm rhythmically challenged or not. It's SUPER hard. Sheesh. I've been playing guitar for 20 years and thought I had a pretty good sense of rhythm.

Um, no.

[Elektrik_SIxx]

Originally Posted by hubbstar

Thanks. I wasn't sure if I'm rhythmically challenged or not. It's SUPER hard. Sheesh. I've been playing guitar for 20 years and thought I had a pretty good sense of rhythm.

Um, no.

Don't worry. I've been playing for 30 years and noticed that my time could use some improvement as well. I've worked on it, both with a metronome and with recordings (anything that grooves, from James Brown to Bob Marley to AC/DC to Motown etc) and I'm really starting to see a difference. So much even that the top pro's that I'm sometimes playing with compliment me on it.

It's not a bad idea to check some of Jimi's roots, like one poster said. Listen to Curtis Mayfield or Pops Staples to hear where Jimi got some of his stuff from and notice what he did with it.

Bold As Love is not Jimi's easiest rhythm playing. Try some easier stuff first. Wind Cries Mary, Little Wing for example. Not that easy either but you'll get a handle on that much quicker I think. Don't forget some of his more uptempo stuff.

[muzacman]

When you listen to Jimi's playing, you feel a sense of rhythm. The bottom line is that you have to "feel" the tune first, and what I mean by that is, if you were the drummer how would you lay down the rhythm between your left hand and your right hand. I don't mean to take you way off track here, but the bottom line is rhythm, like a great drummer would play rhythm, but translate it into a natural strumming of your rhythm hand in sync with some tasty fingerings on your lead hand.

[buddastrat]

I think a lot of it, is overthinking or analyzing, because you're looking at little things and they can get magnified. They were probably barely thought of when actually doing it. If you can, in your mind, keep the big picture or feel of the overall rhythm feel. Just KiSS. I notice the more popular tablatures, lessons, and exact transcriptions become, the more this type of thing is a problem. Because folks get away from learning by ear and just strumming along, letting that stuff happen naturally. They're playing more by video lessons and reading. Heck, kids are learning Little Wing or some fast shred thing before they know how to play some basic chords and songs. It's the wrong way to learn sometimes.

I've said this so many times, if many of these the artists looked at their own transcriptions, they'd say wtf do I do with that?! I can't play this. The lessons and books can make things look so much more complicated, and then we can over focus on that, and that's when the feel gets a back seat.... and those guys whether it's Hendrix' rhythm or Yngwie shredding, are thinking much simpler. The less you think, the more you can feel. It's just guitar.

[epluribus]

Originally Posted by docbop

You want to play like someone go to their roots and with Hendrix that is R&B bands of the 50's. Check out early Jimi with the Isley's and others playing R&B and you will hear beginnings of his rhythm playing.

+1. His was a crazy-amplified extension of a very popular style from R&B and esp Gospel...a style a ton of guys can play, btw. Not that hard really, just a thing you pick up from hanging around with people. (Definitely not analytical, IMHO.) The trick is to feel the pocket, the sound, the melody, and the players...not really much analyzing going on in the moment. Kick the dance floor with your right hand.

His fills were largely based on the chord shapes he played, using free fingers to hammer and pull the other available intervals as mapped out by the chord shape. It's a big secret to Trower too. Mayer does it really well, but updated a bit. (And that guy can kick a groove.) Very simple technique once you see it done--just legato right where the chord is. (For up-neck solos, you need to be able to move the shapes and know a few pentatonic box patterns to fly around 'em.) Once you go back to that type of music and time, you fast-forward to the 60's style pizazz stuff and you're on the road to playing like Jimi.

One thing that makes Jimi and a lot of pre-metal tunes difficult for modern (or CW) players...playing off the beat. Metal and shred and a lot of modern rock are played dead on the beat, or even leading it. Guys from that time played behind it and more or less responded to it* as opposed to getting out front. Remember, Jimi came from Groove, not modern metal. It's about the dance floor.

Tech note: in the larger playing community when he was touring, he was considered a fairly fast curiosity but not a particularly stellar player, technically speaking. Good Nashville and Gospel guys could smoke him, not to mention jazzers. (Think Roy Clark or Chet.) But a heck of a lot of those same people genuinely admired his creativity, his pioneering tunes, and what he meant as a player and a guy. Nobody had a head for groove, melody, and harmony quite like Hendrix.

Anyhoo, his playing doesn't represent an unreachable peak by any stretch, you can most definitely do it. But his imagination and his heart on the other hand...we only had one Jimi...

--Ray

* Big key...they also freely altered it. Listen to the metronome, but kick around it, enhance it, tension and resolve it, but don't religiously play on it.

[rajsmooth]

Originally Posted by buddastrat

I think a lot of it, is overthinking or analyzing, because you're looking at little things and they can get magnified. They were probably barely thought of when actually doing it. If you can, in your mind, keep the big picture or feel of the overall rhythm feel. Just KiSS. I notice the more popular tablatures, lessons, and exact transcriptions become, the more this type of thing is a problem. Because folks get away from learning by ear and just strumming along, letting that stuff happen naturally. They're playing more by video lessons and reading. Heck, kids are learning Little Wing or some fast shred thing before they know how to play some basic chords and songs. It's the wrong way to learn sometimes.

I've said this so many times, if many of these the artists looked at their own transcriptions, they'd say wtf do I do with that?! I can't play this. The lessons and books can make things look so much more complicated, and then we can over focus on that, and that's when the feel gets a back seat.... and those guys whether it's Hendrix' rhythm or Yngwie shredding, are thinking much simpler. The less you think, the more you can feel. It's just guitar.

great post sir!

[Hepcat]

Ditch your pick!

[guitarz1972]

It's really hard to teach and put into a presentable form how to comp Hendrix's rhythm style. The good news is, it's the "learning how to ride a bicycle" analogy - once you get it, you've got it (sort of LOL).

Listen to stuff like "Little Wing" and "Wind Cries Mary" and plant yourself on learning and playing those tunes for a while. Those are pretty accessible tunes that pretty much cover the quintessential Hendrix playing style IMO.

Someone suggested listening to some of the players that inspired Jimi, and that's a good idea too. I might also suggest listening to some more contemporary cats who play in his vein. The late SRV, EJ, John Frusciante (definitely check out "Under The Bridge"), John Mayer, etc. You don't necessarily have to play their stuff to perfection note for note, but if you can copy their vibe a little bit, then you're a good way's there.

Good luck.


CS

[shane88]

there's a lot of funk! it's all in the wrist

[stupidmunkey214]

ALOT of good tips in here so far man. Like everyone else has said, it's just gonna take time, alot of audible input, you gotta soak that shit up. Listen, listen, listen. And don't be hard on your self when trying to learn it, it will arrive. For me, the key to playing that kind of rhythm is to just let yourself relax. The reason he could just BE the music, was because he could just relax himself and let that inner-rhythm come out through his hands.

Don't think of it at all, just relax, and consider your guitar an extension of yourself.

[dorfmeister]

I've heard that this book by Tim Quinn is good for studying this type of playing.

http://www.amazon.com/Mel-presents-M..._bxgy_b_text_c



I have yet to get a copy for myself so I don't really know if it all that great or not.

[dorfmeister]

This thread is relevant, too.

http://www.thegearpage.net/board/sho...d.php?t=478534