Kemper - need more info!

[Eric Thomas]

Originally Posted by MaxTwang

While I do really appreciate the clips, it's how the device 'feels' and 'inspires' that's most important to me. If I keep getting out of bed to play some gear and and I am miserable from lack of sleep but thrilled with the new gear - that's a good piece of equipment. If it goes right back in the box - that's a bad piece of equipment. That's my standard.

Where I'm not so open minded is claims that something blows away something else based on clips, hearsay, comparing future products to discontinued products, and any manufacturer's claims. While I have high hopes for the KPA, it hasn't blown away anything until it's been released and is sitting next to something else - blowing it away.

Agree 100% Well said.

[mdme_sadie]

Originally Posted by hoss33

I did it with my Metro and a "Redstuff Sucker" Loadboax with uncompensated DI Out. You can then pair the amp profile with a cab (+mic) profile and it sounds great.

Awesome, good to know. In that case I assume you could do some profiles such as these and use the Kemper as a pure digital pre-amp with no speaker sim side at all just running into a power amp and real cab? (instead of an fr-fr setup)

[Scott Peterson]

Originally Posted by hoss33

Sorry (Scott!) for "bashing" the Axe FX in a Kemper thread again, but what I have heared from German friends who have an Axe II and just installed Firmware 3, they have the same experience again and again:
After a FW upgrade all the sounds are different and - in this case - the amp blocks in all patches need to be readjusted.

This is something that doesn't happen on the Kemper (I have installed numerous FW upgrades during my beta tests over the last 2 months).

Send your German friends this link then: http://www.thegearpage.net/board/sho...d.php?t=984035

The KPA and the Axe-FX are very different machines with very different underlying operational concepts and designs. For all the gross oversimplifications that folks will default to, the base logical thing to remember is that not all gear appeals to or is a perfect fit for any given individual. When it comes to gear - NOTHING is universal. What constitutes good tools and good tone is insanely personal and subjective. Check any number of the 'what's your #1 guitar' or 'show your rig' to see that; we all have unique and individually subjective tastes and expectations. What works so well for one might be the absolutely wrong fit for another. That's not a bad thing; it doesn't mean one thing 'sucks' or another thing 'rules'. Just means one thing is not like another.

If you find one box (pedal/amp/cab/signal processor) is preferable for any reason, you don't need to justify it to me or anyone else. Nor do I care to debate you or engage over the wild goose chase of 'better' because that's all juvenile posturing. There is no wrong or right here; except for any given individual.

Use the gear you like. Have fun using the gear you like. But don't spend your time 'bashing' as you call it; there's nothing to be gained from engaging others in that manner. It serves no purpose in the end. As a discussion point, doesn't bother me if you hate the Fractal with a passion or not. It's your own opinion. That does not change my opinion of it whatsoever.

I think it is funny, personally, that folks expend so much time and energy shooting down competing gear in relation to the gear they choose. If I prefer a modeler, then I must hate tube amps. If I like tube amps, then I must hate modelers. If I like the Fractal, then I must hate the Kemper. If I like the Kemper, I must hate the Axe-FX. Really?

I don't talk down KPA or any other gear to prop up my opinion of Fractal. Some folks like to do that (feel the need to talk up one piece of gear by slamming another), some folks are almost rabid about doing it. No matter who is doing it or what box they are doing it to - for or against.

It's all a bit silly IMHO.

I posted on this thread to try to reach out to Crosshair; I've taken it to PM and beyond this post won't take any more time here on this thread. I do that for Axe-FX owners and have always done that. I have done that for any gear I have used and have personal knowledge of so if I can be of any help, then I try to do so. Sometimes I can't; but I make the effort as much as I can.

I answered you because you posted directed at me and brought up the "KPA vs. AXE_FX" and that's really not my game. I do not talk out of school about gear I have not tried. If you dig the KPA and for you it's the bee's knees... great! Have fun and make music with the KPA. A lot of the clips sound great. The KPA based on the opinions of those that are beta testing it sounds like a super machine and I hope KPA have nothing but success; in the parlance of DonBarzini - I hope it makes many men very happy. The world is big enough for more great modelers. I love that more companies are competing on the higher end of the market with a premium product offering. It's fantastic. There is no negative part of any of it IMHO.

But the death spiral of 'my box is better than your box' discussion isn't going to involve me because: a) I'm smart enough to not bite on that sort of discussion any more (I've fallen into that trap too many times in the past); and b) I don't discuss gear I've never tried personally. (*Note, I freely admit to often having little patience with those that don't share my standards on discussing gear they've never tried but want to get into heated debates about how that particular piece of gear 'sucks' or 'rules' based on third hand information, clips or other such 'experience').

If you've used the Axe-FX II with firmware v3.0 and the KPA; then post all you want. Posting what 'some friends' thought isn't very much to go on to be frank. Send me a KPA and I'll give it a thorough workout. If I don't like it, I will say why. If I do like it, I will say why. But I'm not contrasting/comparing anything I don't have first hand knowledge of. If you dig it or hate something - that's great. But that's not how I form my opinions of things to base discussions on.

I dig gear and have the ability to like more than one box (pedal/amp/signal processor) at a time... even competing boxes (be it competing amps, competing pedals, competing signal processors, etc). It's just gear.

[journo]

Originally Posted by Scott Peterson

Send your German friends this link then: http://www.thegearpage.net/board/sho...d.php?t=984035

The KPA and the Axe-FX are very different machines with very different underlying operational concepts and designs. For all the gross oversimplifications that folks will default to, the base logical thing to remember is that not all gear appeals to or is a perfect fit for any given individual. When it comes to gear - NOTHING is universal. What constitutes good tools and good tone is insanely personal and subjective. Check any number of the 'what's your #1 guitar' or 'show your rig' to see that; we all have unique and individually subjective tastes and expectations. What works so well for one might be the absolutely wrong fit for another. That's not a bad thing; it doesn't mean one thing 'sucks' or another thing 'rules'. Just means one thing is not like another.

If you find one box (pedal/amp/cab/signal processor) is preferable for any reason, you don't need to justify it to me or anyone else. Nor do I care to debate you or engage over the wild goose chase of 'better' because that's all juvenile posturing. There is no wrong or right here; except for any given individual.

Use the gear you like. Have fun using the gear you like. But don't spend your time 'bashing' as you call it; there's nothing to be gained from engaging others in that manner. It serves no purpose in the end. As a discussion point, doesn't bother me if you hate the Fractal with a passion or not. It's your own opinion. That does not change my opinion of it whatsoever.

I think it is funny, personally, that folks expend so much time and energy shooting down competing gear in relation to the gear they choose. If I prefer a modeler, then I must hate tube amps. If I like tube amps, then I must hate modelers. If I like the Fractal, then I must hate the Kemper. If I like the Kemper, I must hate the Axe-FX. Really?

I don't talk down KPA or any other gear to prop up my opinion of Fractal. Some folks like to do that (feel the need to talk up one piece of gear by slamming another), some folks are almost rabid about doing it. No matter who is doing it or what box they are doing it to - for or against.

It's all a bit silly IMHO.

I posted on this thread to try to reach out to Crosshair; I've taken it to PM and beyond this post won't take any more time here on this thread. I do that for Axe-FX owners and have always done that. I have done that for any gear I have used and have personal knowledge of so if I can be of any help, then I try to do so. Sometimes I can't; but I make the effort as much as I can.

I answered you because you posted directed at me and brought up the "KPA vs. AXE_FX" and that's really not my game. I do not talk out of school about gear I have not tried. If you dig the KPA and for you it's the bee's knees... great! Have fun and make music with the KPA. A lot of the clips sound great. The KPA based on the opinions of those that are beta testing it sounds like a super machine and I hope KPA have nothing but success; in the parlance of DonBarzini - I hope it makes many men very happy. The world is big enough for more great modelers. I love that more companies are competing on the higher end of the market with a premium product offering. It's fantastic. There is no negative part of any of it IMHO.

But the death spiral of 'my box is better than your box' discussion isn't going to involve me because: a) I'm smart enough to not bite on that sort of discussion any more (I've fallen into that trap too many times in the past); and b) I don't discuss gear I've never tried personally. (*Note, I freely admit to often having little patience with those that don't share my standards on discussing gear they've never tried but want to get into heated debates about how that particular piece of gear 'sucks' or 'rules' based on third hand information, clips or other such 'experience').

If you've used the Axe-FX II with firmware v3.0 and the KPA; then post all you want. Posting what 'some friends' thought isn't very much to go on to be frank. Send me a KPA and I'll give it a thorough workout. If I don't like it, I will say why. If I do like it, I will say why. But I'm not contrasting/comparing anything I don't have first hand knowledge of. If you dig it or hate something - that's great. But that's not how I form my opinions of things to base discussions on.

I dig gear and have the ability to like more than one box (pedal/amp/signal processor) at a time... even competing boxes (be it competing amps, competing pedals, competing signal processors, etc). It's just gear.

Amen!

/Mats N

[Gasp100]

Originally Posted by Eric Thomas

CrossHair, no piece of gear works for everyone. Don't sweat it if the Axe is not for you. Resale value is not a problem. Since you are playing through PA speakers and a 4x12, I would suggest simplifying and focusing on one of the other. I'm assuming you are using a power amp with the 4x12's. Set up a patch with nothing but an amp model in the Axe FX and play that through the power amp with a 4x12. Start simple, and see if you can get something you like out of an amp model. If not, it may be time to move on.

To me, the number one question I would be asking about the KPA is this: How does is respond beyond the profile? The thread with the Bad Cat clip shows that the KPA can do an excellent job capturing great profiles, but in that same thread the second AC30 slip shows some really ugly distortion, fizz, and clipping as they are adjusting settings. Now, the unit was a loaner and it very well could have been user error, or it could have also been some clipping in the recording process. I'm sure when the KPA finally hits the market and we get some users who have time to actually learn to use the unit we'll hear more great clips. But until then, I'm curious to know whether those problems when changing settings were indicative of the lack of tweaking ability that can be expected with a profile.

Ultimately, I'll eventually get a KPA to try it for myself. Just like CrossHair is struggling with the Axe, It could very well be that the KPA is not for everyone either. These preliminary KPA threads are just like the HD500 threads before that unit came out. Lots of WILD speculation....

I am prepared to tweak a Kemper profile 'within reason'. What that means to me is if I am going for a clean Vox tone I will try and find the best profile in the box (because I believe there are several). If I want to dial in some hair on it I will try to use on board options. But if I want it to snarl, spit and get the blizzard of nails tones of an AC30 about to melt, I'm going to find a better starting profile. Also, there are a number of overdrives to choose from in the box as well.
To me it's no different than the AxeFX II in that respect. Get your core tone happening, many options for tweak to a point, then if you are looking to go further, create a new patch. In the II you have what, 384 slots? Not sure how many profiles can live in the Kemper.
Please note I'm not talking about clean To mean with the volume knob on the guitar. That is hard to measure, works better with some tones than others and honestly right now is an unknown for me with the Kemper.
For my within reason comment, check out Thomas Wendt's video session on the Kemper site. He takes a Mesa Road King profile and tweaks it in a number of different ways, but never completely bastardizes the original tone with on board controls.
I am cautiously optimistic with the onboard controlling of the Kemper.
Also, I don't see how part of this thread derailed into Axefx vs Kemper (although even the OP alludes to this topic!). Hoss has owned the standard, ultra and now the Kemper. He also has friends who apparently own the II. One issue for him and others was retweaking after firmware upgrades. So far with the Kemper he has done several firmware updates on Kemper without having massive retweaking.
What is the issue? He has more experience with the products in question than anyone else, including myself and Scott. He probably should not have added the bashing comment in his post?

[sinasl1]

Originally Posted by Scott Peterson

Send your German friends this link then: http://www.thegearpage.net/board/sho...d.php?t=984035

The KPA and the Axe-FX are very different machines with very different underlying operational concepts and designs. For all the gross oversimplifications that folks will default to, the base logical thing to remember is that not all gear appeals to or is a perfect fit for any given individual. When it comes to gear - NOTHING is universal. What constitutes good tools and good tone is insanely personal and subjective. Check any number of the 'what's your #1 guitar' or 'show your rig' to see that; we all have unique and individually subjective tastes and expectations. What works so well for one might be the absolutely wrong fit for another. That's not a bad thing; it doesn't mean one thing 'sucks' or another thing 'rules'. Just means one thing is not like another.

If you find one box (pedal/amp/cab/signal processor) is preferable for any reason, you don't need to justify it to me or anyone else. Nor do I care to debate you or engage over the wild goose chase of 'better' because that's all juvenile posturing. There is no wrong or right here; except for any given individual.

Use the gear you like. Have fun using the gear you like. But don't spend your time 'bashing' as you call it; there's nothing to be gained from engaging others in that manner. It serves no purpose in the end. As a discussion point, doesn't bother me if you hate the Fractal with a passion or not. It's your own opinion. That does not change my opinion of it whatsoever.

I think it is funny, personally, that folks expend so much time and energy shooting down competing gear in relation to the gear they choose. If I prefer a modeler, then I must hate tube amps. If I like tube amps, then I must hate modelers. If I like the Fractal, then I must hate the Kemper. If I like the Kemper, I must hate the Axe-FX. Really?

I don't talk down KPA or any other gear to prop up my opinion of Fractal. Some folks like to do that (feel the need to talk up one piece of gear by slamming another), some folks are almost rabid about doing it. No matter who is doing it or what box they are doing it to - for or against.

It's all a bit silly IMHO.

I posted on this thread to try to reach out to Crosshair; I've taken it to PM and beyond this post won't take any more time here on this thread. I do that for Axe-FX owners and have always done that. I have done that for any gear I have used and have personal knowledge of so if I can be of any help, then I try to do so. Sometimes I can't; but I make the effort as much as I can.

I answered you because you posted directed at me and brought up the "KPA vs. AXE_FX" and that's really not my game. I do not talk out of school about gear I have not tried. If you dig the KPA and for you it's the bee's knees... great! Have fun and make music with the KPA. A lot of the clips sound great. The KPA based on the opinions of those that are beta testing it sounds like a super machine and I hope KPA have nothing but success; in the parlance of DonBarzini - I hope it makes many men very happy. The world is big enough for more great modelers. I love that more companies are competing on the higher end of the market with a premium product offering. It's fantastic. There is no negative part of any of it IMHO.

But the death spiral of 'my box is better than your box' discussion isn't going to involve me because: a) I'm smart enough to not bite on that sort of discussion any more (I've fallen into that trap too many times in the past); and b) I don't discuss gear I've never tried personally. (*Note, I freely admit to often having little patience with those that don't share my standards on discussing gear they've never tried but want to get into heated debates about how that particular piece of gear 'sucks' or 'rules' based on third hand information, clips or other such 'experience').

If you've used the Axe-FX II with firmware v3.0 and the KPA; then post all you want. Posting what 'some friends' thought isn't very much to go on to be frank. Send me a KPA and I'll give it a thorough workout. If I don't like it, I will say why. If I do like it, I will say why. But I'm not contrasting/comparing anything I don't have first hand knowledge of. If you dig it or hate something - that's great. But that's not how I form my opinions of things to base discussions on.

I dig gear and have the ability to like more than one box (pedal/amp/signal processor) at a time... even competing boxes (be it competing amps, competing pedals, competing signal processors, etc). It's just gear.

good post. I agree- it's all just tools. Why can't it ALL be good?

I guess back in the day it must have been like "My Marshall is better than your Fender".... haha.

Guys sometimes post nice things about the gear demos I make, saying things like "he can make anything sound good". And while I appreciate the compliment, the truth is, I feel like there is so much good gear out there, it's almost hard to NOT sound good. I've never played a Kemper, but I bet- it is really good. Just like the Axe FX is really good. One might suit a certain player more than the other, but at the end of the day, I'm willing to take a guess that both are great pieces of gear.

[journo]

Originally Posted by sinasl1

but at the end of the day, I'm willing to take a guess that both are great pieces of gear.

That would be a pretty safe guess.

Cheers,

Mats N

[Gasp100]

Originally Posted by sinasl1

good post. I agree- it's all just tools. Why can't it ALL be good?

I guess back in the day it must have been like "My Marshall is better than your Fender".... haha.

Guys sometimes post nice things about the gear demos I make, saying things like "he can make anything sound good". And while I appreciate the compliment, the truth is, I feel like there is so much good gear out there, it's almost hard to NOT sound good. I've never played a Kemper, but I bet- it is really good. Just like the Axe FX is really good. One might suit a certain player more than the other, but at the end of the day, I'm willing to take a guess that both are great pieces of gear.

Only one can be the best........................



Just kidding.
I'm curious though, will people go out of their way to try the Kemper who already own the AxeFX II?
I recall when the 11R was first out some great players jumped in the fray backing the 11R vs. AxeFX debate (Splatt, Mondoslug, come to mind).
I always wondered if they would ever actually TRY the AxeFX and apparently they never did...
Will proponents of the AxeFX / AxeFX II actually try the Kemper, make vids, etc...?

[Csgband]

I would love to have a couple weeks with both and Scuffam ,
I would do some real recording at the studio and see what happens.
I know they would all sound great but I would like to see which suits me best.

[mattball826]

Originally Posted by sinasl1

good post. I agree- it's all just tools. Why can't it ALL be good?

I guess back in the day it must have been like "My Marshall is better than your Fender".... haha.

Guys sometimes post nice things about the gear demos I make, saying things like "he can make anything sound good". And while I appreciate the compliment, the truth is, I feel like there is so much good gear out there, it's almost hard to NOT sound good. I've never played a Kemper, but I bet- it is really good. Just like the Axe FX is really good. One might suit a certain player more than the other, but at the end of the day, I'm willing to take a guess that both are great pieces of gear.

thats good pete

but from what i remember of the good ole days

many players had peavey (i had pacer and was laughed out of auditions) or local store pos solid state amps. some had converted home tube hi fi amps. then you put a cheap pedal in front. most of us played les paul or strat import copies. credit was not as easy.

fender and marshall were prime time gear.

80's if you had no marshall or mark, you sucked

90s if you play fender something was wrong with you. mesa boogie and prs guitars were the thing. now marshall and les pauls are just as good again.

these devices just experiencing same things as other gear, same musician banter. fender vs gibson debate is how old? and many still go on about those.

otoh, when some person says how is this sound? truth is not a bad thing. if its great its great. if it doesn't compare it doesnt. if its bad its bad. not all will think that.

i love samhill demos. man is great player and makes excellent demo clips. but to me he uses more gain i ever would hear in a marshall. can tell he's 80's rack fx guy too. that is fine since he likes that. for me, its a detractor from amp or amp model raw tone. others want those fx/gain detailed.

[hoss33]

Originally Posted by Gasp100

I always wondered if they would ever actually TRY the AxeFX and apparently they never did...

I soon sold the 11R and finally got and Axe Std. and later an Ultra. I had a Line 6 POD XT pro before the 11R. Always trying out the latest in modelling technology.

[CrossHair]

Well is the honeymoon already over for the Kemper BT-ers?

[hoss33]

Originally Posted by CrossHair

Well is the honeymoon already over for the Kemper BT-ers?

Nope and new news from Germany: Shipping date in 2 weeks.

[CrossHair]

Cool Did you hear that or is it posted somewhere, idk, had to ask.

Hoss33 are you playing loud & proud through a pa/cab set up?

Also I usually suffer with noise... how do you like the noise gate?

[journo]

Originally Posted by CrossHair

Well is the honeymoon already over for the Kemper BT-ers?

Oh no! Just too busy enjoying the KPA to make a lot of unsolicited comments here.

Don't want to contribute to hype.

But if you have a ny questions, I'd be happy to answer.

/Mats N