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1959 - 1960 : Which album was the ultimate groundbreaker in Jazz - Poll

Discussion in 'The Sound Hound Lounge' started by el greco, Feb 10, 2019.

Which album was the most important in introducing new forms in Jazz?

  1. Miles Davis - Kind Of Blue

    73 vote(s)
    57.9%
  2. John Coltrane - Giant Steps

    17 vote(s)
    13.5%
  3. Dave Brubeck Quartet - Time Out

    19 vote(s)
    15.1%
  4. Bill Evans Trio - Portrait In Jazz

    1 vote(s)
    0.8%
  5. Ornette Coleman - The Shape Of Jazz To Come

    12 vote(s)
    9.5%
  6. Charles Mingus - Mingus Ah Um

    3 vote(s)
    2.4%
  7. Duke Ellington - Anatomy Of A Murder

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. Miles Davis - Sketches Of Spain

    1 vote(s)
    0.8%
  1. coltranemi2012

    coltranemi2012 Supporting Member

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    I don’t know 2/5th of kind of blue is a blues
     
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  2. BobbyS

    BobbyS Member

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    Sorry for the mis-post, I meant there was only one new type of jazz tune on the record.
     
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  3. Bluedano1

    Bluedano1 Member

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    I LOVE Giant Steps and Time Out, but on my planet, Kind of Blue just blows all else out of the water.

    As many times as I've heard it ( the CD stays in the car- and gets played multiple times each week- I'm an Uber driver...) I can't explain but that music, the way things just came out ( every note of every player), just sounds so original. Its blues, and "simple' yet the note choices /phrasing/ rhythm of each soloist on each song is NOTHING I would or could ever conceive of, were I playing over those chord changes...just fascinates me!
     
  4. coltranemi2012

    coltranemi2012 Supporting Member

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    ah ok..Gotcha
     
  5. Tony Done

    Tony Done Member

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    I voted for Dave Brubeck, as he was the only one of those I was aware of in my late teens
     
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  6. Hack Prophet

    Hack Prophet vile mighty wretched Silver Supporting Member

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    Big fan of most of them. I selected Shape of Jazz to Come.
    I would have included A Love Supreme as well.

    My personal favorite of the bunch is Mingus Ah Um
     
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  7. Average Joe

    Average Joe Member

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    It wasnt as influential short term, but in the long term the Ornette album rival KOB and Giant Steps. GS changed how horns were played, but Ornette had a huge influence on compostions and group interplay
     
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  8. WordMan

    WordMan Member

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    I wasn’t familiar with this documentary. Wonderful!!
     
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  9. HammyD

    HammyD Member

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    I read there ins another documentary coming out about the making of Kind of Blue, too.

    The book is a good read, as well.

     
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  10. WordMan

    WordMan Member

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    Oh yeah, read that a few years ago. Kind of Blue is my favorite album, period. Thanks.
     
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  11. Bluedano1

    Bluedano1 Member

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    I have this too, as well as " The Making of a Love Supreme " ( Ashley Kahn)
    - either book, besides discussing the actual recordings of the respective records, provide a window into the bios of the musicians, engineers, and what was going on with jazz during and before these amazing albums.

    Sadly, I ( think) I lent both books to musician buddies, and they have 'evaporated ' , but I'll get them back!
     
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  12. HammyD

    HammyD Member

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    I got my copy back, but my copy of Bloomfield's Biography is still out there!

    I have to wonder about the advantage of the old technology. Or rather the potential disadvantage of newer technology.

    I have to think of Jimmy Cobb saying he hit the ride cymbal too hard, too "much for the room" at the beginning of "So What." A modern recording session may have had a compressor or limiter before the convertors and ruined the whole feel of it all.
     
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  13. Bluedano1

    Bluedano1 Member

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    And that ' hard cymbal hit 'is like opening the door to a remarkable song and album.

    If not mistaken Phily Joe Jones ( who was Mile's current drummer played on '58's Milesones- also amazing/ more bebop, right?) was supposed to be on the gig, but couldn't make it- forget if he was busy, or Miles didn't want him...so Jimmy Cobb got the gig.

    One observation, and this isn't just Kind of Blue, but other classic jazz recordings, is how all these guys ( I guess mainly the horn/sax guys, but really everyone) would record these amazing solos, one take, everyone live.
    These guys were always gigging and practicing at such a sophisticated level- so it just came out like that on record too. Wow!
     
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  14. HammyD

    HammyD Member

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    I think a contributing factor to the level of jazz at that time was that everybody was gigging five nights a week. Guys would play multiple clubs in NYC and Monday's were jam sessions.

    I had the good fortune to play upright with a group of seasoned jazz musicians, including a sax player who toured with Mingus when I was 17. They pushed me not permitting me to read charts at the gigs. I would have to "feel the changes" or listen to the trombone player mumble substitutions as we went along. They would play a tune and change keys following the circle of fifths every 16 bars just for kicks.

    I can only imagine the competition and camaraderie, as well as the level of playing during the late 50's and early 60's. You were expected to bring your best game or go home.

    It would have been an extraordinary time to be alive and an adult.
     
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  15. Oriondk

    Oriondk Member

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    Thanks! I needed that.
     
  16. marvin cobain

    marvin cobain Member

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    Bossanova songs has been used many times for jazz (for instance by Laurindo Almeida and Bud Shank already in 1954) but that album of Joao Gilberto is not jazz.
     
  17. marvin cobain

    marvin cobain Member

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    This was before time out and they also improvised in 5/4 unlike Take five, where only the head is in 5/4 (it seems Max Roach was mad because the label Mercury decided to sell this only after the success of Take five, even if it was recorded before it)


    I'm a huge fan of Sun Ra, but he started his free jazz phase in the sixties.
    For free jazz in any case it's certainly not so simple to say who was the first to play like that. There are certainly many examples in the fities besides Coleman and Cecil Taylor. Many would agree that Lennie Tristano in late forties/early fifties was the first





    but there were already things that if not strictly free were going in that direction even before (I can think of certain improvisations of Django Reinhardt and Art Tatum).
    About the relation between Sun Ra and other musicians... well John Gilmore was certainly an influence on Coltrane (probably it could be more correct to say that they both influenced each other). About Miles Davis... I don't know, there's a blindfold test with him where he dismiss a Sun Ra piece as crap.
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2019
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  18. marvin cobain

    marvin cobain Member

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    1964
     
  19. BriSol

    BriSol Member

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    When I refer to the influence of Sun Ra I'm primarily referring to the upfront African and mid-eastern themes. Miles copped that in his late 60's fusion period just going by the album covers alone (look at the cover of Liveevil). Coltrane copped it with his late period themes, and his wife basically went full on eastern mysticism mode after his death. Of course more broadly this represented the mood in certain African-American circles at the time, to reclaim African identity, and a lot of flirtation with middle-eastern stuff and reference to Egypt. I just see Sun-Ra and pushing that upfront before others in jazz.

    Miles did say a lot of weirdly dismissive things, even of Coleman.
     
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  20. Hack Prophet

    Hack Prophet vile mighty wretched Silver Supporting Member

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    Ah the time period didn't register for me
     

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