2 screws in the neck pocket heel

Discussion in 'Guitars in General' started by idnotbe, Apr 22, 2016.

  1. idnotbe

    idnotbe Member

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    i saw a few guitar makers use only 2 screws (not 4) in the neck pocket heel for their bolt-on guitars.
    what's the benefit of 2 screws? why do they use only 2 ??

    here are the neck pocket heel pics of tom Anderson and ted stevenson.

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
     
  2. Lewguitar

    Lewguitar Member

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    One that comes to mind is less distortion of the fingerboard in that area. Some call it the Fender hump and not all get badly distorted but some do and require additional fret leveling in that area due to the four big wood screws distorting the neck.

    I wonder if Anderson is using two wood screws or two machine screws?
     
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  3. atquinn

    atquinn Supporting Member

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    If you have a design that only requires 2 screws, why would you use more?
    -
    Austin
     
  4. 00JETT

    00JETT Member

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    Andersons use a tapered heel joint now that locks extremely tight. 2 screws is more than enough just to pull the heel into its joint on the body.
     
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  5. SPROING!

    SPROING! Member

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    Doesn't Taylor do it with one bolt?
     
  6. dazco

    dazco Member

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    Leo got it right the first time, EOS. :D
     
  7. Crimson Queen

    Crimson Queen Member

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    In the case of Ted Stevenson guitars, there are only two screws, but there are not the only anchoring system holding the neck in place. His fastening system is actually more solid and stable than four screws.
     
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  8. hudpucker

    hudpucker Supporting Member

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    That must be why so many Fender guitars need shims, right?
     
  9. grapeshot

    grapeshot Supporting Member

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    That Anderson A-Wedge joint is amazing. It's a joy to play.
     
  10. cardinal

    cardinal Supporting Member

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    I've heard different theories about the hump or ramp on some Fender-type bolt ons. One that makes sense to me is that the strings pull and compress the fibers in the neck, except once they hit the neck joint. That area is fixed to the body and not subject to the same amount of stress. So the fibers kinda bunch up right around that spot.

    I've experienced with first hand with a neck that was freshly leveled but played terrible. Turned out that under string tension, a hump appeared right there.

    Maybe the screws can be a separate source of distortion. I dunno.
     
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  11. Lewguitar

    Lewguitar Member

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    Erlewine's fret jig supposedly holds the neck in that distorted position after the strings are removed so that the frets can be leveled correctly. I've thought about buying one.
     
  12. edward

    edward Supporting Member

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    Correct. And their neck/body join is also tightly machined to the ten-thousandths. In other words, if the design and execution are such that all one needs is x screws, then having more not only defeats the purpose but may even yield unintended negative consequences.

    Whether it's Taylor's NT system or T.Anderson's uber-solid-yet-smooth neck joint, as well as many other fine builders, the design dictates the manufacture. And if it proves itself in the real world, then that's all the evidence one needs :)

    Edward
     
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  13. cardinal

    cardinal Supporting Member

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    Yup. I believe a similar jig was used. I think it used straps pulling around the headstock to simulate having the strings yanking on it. That neck was driving me crazy but it's all sorted out now.
     
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  14. Harsh59

    Harsh59 Member

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    I've never played one , it looks like a great idea .

    PS starting to gas for a TAG
     
  15. dansworld

    dansworld Gold Supporting Member

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    I've experienced this same phenomenon as well. My guitar guy levels the frets and then spends a little more time on the tongue end after it's under tension. It makes a HUGE playability difference! This is necessary on over half of the Strats I see.
     
  16. AdmiralB

    AdmiralB Silver Supporting Member

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    You don't need much clamping force - a string set is what, about 125-150lb total tension, of which nearly all of it is pulling the neck into the body. The screws only have to deal with the moment at the pocket's end, which a single screw could handle.

    I reckon Leo wanted the extra screws to reduce lateral shifting; since manufacturing tolerances were/are insufficient to perfectly locate the neck in the pocket, lots of clamping force was the cheapest/simplest alternative.

    Anderson, et al, have solved the locating issue, so no longer need a ton of clamping force.
     
  17. Pietro

    Pietro 2-Voice Guitar Junkie and All-Around Awesome Guy

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    The Anderson has 2 screws because it works better for that joint, which isn't a normal boxy flat neck joint.

    That neck is NOT moving back and forth. Period.

    [​IMG]

    In practice... better than any standard 4-bold neck joint on any guitar I've had.
     
  18. swiveltung

    swiveltung Member

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    I do find that as you tighten the 4 fender bolts the last little bit... things change. Even the order you tighten them if you have a shim under makes some difference. So not sure I'm sold on 2 screws.
    I wonder if you tried to slip a couple thousanths feeler gauge between the neck and the body on that guitar in pic #1 (on the side with no screw close) if it would go in?
    I cant tell, but if it's not a flat pocket and a wedge shape, it would be fine I would think. Flat Fender style pocket... maybe not.
     

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