• The Gear Page Apparel & Merch Shop is Open!

    Based on member demand, The Gear Page is pleased to announce that our Apparel Merch Shop is now open. The shop’s link is in the blue Navigation bar (on the right side), “Shop,” with t-shirts, hats, neck buffs, and stickers to start. Here’s the direct link: www.thegearpageshop.com

    You’ll find exclusive high-quality apparel and merchandise; all items are ethical, sustainably produced, and we will be continuously sourcing and adding new choices. 

    We can ship internationally. All shipping is at cost.


6V6s in a Bassman vs 6V6s in a Tweed Deluxe - tone difference?

guitars4me

Member
Messages
64
I have a builder willing to make a Bassman that can use 6V6s. I like the idea of the bass, middle, treble control of the Bassman but the volume of the stock 6L6s would be way too loud for me to get any natural breakup from the amp.

I'm curious if anybody has any experience using 6V6s in a Bassman-style circuit and how the tone would be different from a normal Tweed Deluxe (assuming the same speaker config). Would the 6V6s in a Bassman be a cool, low volume Tweed tone with the multiple tone options or am I just better off buying the Deluxe?

I know it's all subjective but I thought maybe I could get some opinions.

Thanks!
 

mark norwine

Member
Messages
17,159
It's really not subjective at all.....

There's way more to an amp.....any amp....than the choice of output tube. A bassman (you don't say which model, but it doesn't matter) will never "sound like" a 5E3 because they're altogether different circuits.

EDIT: I guess you mean Tweed bassman (5_6 circuit) because cream, brown & black bassman amps don't have a mid control.
 

Rumblefish

Member
Messages
2,735
I'm scattershooting here. The Bassman will obviously have way more headroom than deluxe because of bigger output tranny..Different eq curve with different mid range tones etc.Probably a whole lot more bass too.
Could be a very sweet sounding rig.
 

guitars4me

Member
Messages
64
Thanks Guys! I guess I should have been more specific, it is the 5F6-A circuit. I guess I'm not really looking to make the Bassman sound like the Deluxe, I'm more looking for how the tone would be different- if that makes sense? I want a Tweedy, Keith Richards-ish sounding breakup tone which I am sure would be better through the Deluxe but would the Bassman with 6V6s be cool in a "similar" way or is there a reason Fender never made a Bassman circuit with 6V6s - too woofy, nasty sounding? Is my thinking that the additional tone controls would be cool way off base?

Thanks Again!
 

mark norwine

Member
Messages
17,159
The lack of "additional controls" in the 5E3 is the key....it's "raw" sound is due in large part to it's very simple circuit.

As circuits become more complex (adding a tone stack, for example) they become more refined [for lack of a better word]; the 5F6-A is a reflection of that.

Power tubes aside, these amps are very different; I don't think a 5F6-A with 6V6 tubes will sound much like a 5E3 at all.

Additionally, it's the power transformer (specifically its VA curve) that will dictate the ultimate power (i.e. headroom) of an amp; simply changing to V's without any concern for the PT *might* cause you some bias headaches: in order to trim them down below 70% of 14W, you may need to bias the amp cold(er) to the point that it won't sound all that grand.

Unless, of course, your amp designer is accounting for that & installing a smaller-than-spec PT, and which point all "tonal touchstones" become variable, rendering this conversation moot.....at least partially.
 

guitars4me

Member
Messages
64
Thanks again Mark! You make some "eye opening" points there. No, I don't know whether he has taken into account a smaller transformer (my fault) because I asked for it to be swappable between 6Ls and 6Vs, so I am sure he'd go with the larger transformer- which means to get the 6V6s to work, I'd have to bias it VERY cold, which you mention would probably sound bad. Hadn't considered that at all. Based on your post, I am probably better off just going with the Deluxe and be done with it. Someday, I guess I could always try a Bassman.

Thanks Again!
 

mark norwine

Member
Messages
17,159
Consider this:

If you want tone controls, take a close, close look at the schematics for 5E3 (deluxe) and 5E7 (bandmaster).

The 5E7 is very, very, very similar to a 5E3......but with some simple circuitry "in the middle" to give you treb & bass control.

The tone control circuit is far less sophisticated circuit than what you'll find in the 5F6-A, but it still works pretty darn well, allthewhile retaining the raw-ness of the 5E3.

A decent tech could easily make a hybrid 5E3 / 5E7 amp...heck, I've done it!

Just something to think about....but take a few minutes with both schematics printed out. Trace them out & look at the extreme similarities.
 

epluribus

Member
Messages
9,170
I hear ya about compact signal paths, they can change dramatically when you start stickin' pots in the circuit. How 'bout doing a Tweed without the tone controls and using a good EQ pedal? The key will be a transparent pedal that lets your guitar dynamics interact with the circuit properly--no small feat, that.

As an alternative, using a conventional Tweed-style tone control and adding some selectable bypass and coupling caps can do very useful things for you without the signal loss caused by all the pots in a three-knob stack.

--Ray
 

Trout

Member
Messages
7,551
I have a builder willing to make a Bassman that can use 6V6s. I like the idea of the bass, middle, treble control of the Bassman but the volume of the stock 6L6s would be way too loud for me to get any natural breakup from the amp.

I'm curious if anybody has any experience using 6V6s in a Bassman-style circuit and how the tone would be different from a normal Tweed Deluxe (assuming the same speaker config). Would the 6V6s in a Bassman be a cool, low volume Tweed tone with the multiple tone options or am I just better off buying the Deluxe?

I know it's all subjective but I thought maybe I could get some opinions.

Thanks!
Richter's have been selling a 22W 6V6 version of the Bassman 5E6-A which is one of the earlier narrow panel circuits.
Its a head version though.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT&item=130294678602

I auditioned one about 5 months ago, very tweed in tone but not like the later narrow panel bassman. Much more raw, but that stands to reason because its basically the 5E7 circuit as well..
I liked it a lot, but I am more a combo amp guy.
 




Trending Topics

Top