99% of tube amp demos are being run through load + IRs

[Gasp100]

It's getting kind of ridiculous to watch amp demos nowadays, especially from most of the second tier (or less) influencers and even the main influencers themselves.
It is like NO ONE can turn up anymore and run a REAL amp into a REAL cab.
Hell, I can create these same silent videos as well in my humble home studio. Without the cab - any cab + real speaker - at volume and well mic'd, you really do not know what you are getting.
Sorry, slapping on well curated IR's is simply NOT a good representation of an amps real tone.
Please try harder or leave it up to the pro's...

 

[ACSlater]

If they'd use real cabs, they'd wake up their parents, and may need to find a place of their own.

 

[gulliver]

This forum is comparable to a photography forum where everyone talks about their new cameras but no one ever posts a picture.

Who cares about "them." We (TGP members) should be posting what we have ... sonically. A quick iPhone recording that all of us can do in 3 minutes is better than 10,000 words.

 

[tele_jas]

I used to do amp demo's, like 15 to 20 years ago, in my "guitar room" (our spare bedroom). I'd mic them up and start playing.

They weren't really professional and were more aimed for the average, weekend warrior player (but had some big names thank me for them). I had to do them when my wife and kids were out, because they were LOUD, to do them properly.

IMO, using a loadbox and IR's can still get you there... Because, when mic-ing the amp, even the slightest adjustment made a huge difference in how the recording came out. I would usually do 3 or 4 takes with different mic placements and choose the one I liked best. IR's are more consistent and more reliable, in that regard.

Recently (2022), I did a recording using an original Dr. Z Stingray through a TwoNotes Captor into a Celestion Blue IR and compared it to a recording I made in 2006 of my Dr. Z Stangray through a Weber Alnico Blue Dog. The sound was nearly identical to the original recording, or at least something that could be written off as mic placement. The biggest difference was the volume changes weren't impacted as much using an IR. On the original 2006 recording, the more I turned up the volume the "boomier" it got through the actual speaker, to where I had to roll off the low end. Through the IR, there wasn't as much tonal difference, but still some.

I think IR's get you REALLY close....But, I also agree to the point that if I'm wanting to hear an amp before buying it, I'd rather hear it through the speaker(s) it's sold with instead of an IR. But if IR's are my only choice to hear it, then that'll have to do.

***I no longer have that recording as it died with my laptops hard drive I also sold the Stingray and Loadbox last year to pay off some medical bills, so I can't currently replicate it.

 

[Gasp100]

Please understand I totally get WHY people use load box + IR. Personally, for home studio use that is the way to go and I also have volume constraints (mainly self or wife imposed) but I do have my own house and pay my own mortgage.
It's just that if I was really showcasing an amp the load + IR would not be the full picture.
It is so incredibly easily to manipulate the resultant tone changing IR's.
The sonic interaction with a cab speaker, any cab speaker imparts more and tells us a bit more about the amp.
I mean, there are guys on YT with literal amp farms but there is an imiplicit sameness to clips because they are all loaded down and using same/similar IR's.
@tele_jas mentioned about having to roll off bass when turning up amps; stuff like that is very cool to know.
With load + IR you can get as "loud" as you want silently and the amp just does not react or respond anything like how it will in the real world, onstage through a cab.

 

[wharf rat]

Isn’t this happening live too?

 

[rmconner80]

Sorry, slapping on well curated IR's is simply NOT a good representation of an amps real tone.

That’s true. As it turns out, the pros aren’t looking for a real amp tone. They’re looking for a sound that meets or exceeds the requirements of the job / song / band for which they’re hired to play guitar.

 

[Gasp100]

Isn’t this happening live too?

I honestly don't know many peers who are bringing the tube rig only to go silent stage.
I'm over invested in amps right now so attenuation, cab simulation, master volumes, loading down is definitely in my view and I've tried everything at least twice for home.
For live I still like to rock a real cab because I want backline.
That being said, we are moving back to IEMS so I am going to really put the Friedman mic no mo to test and see how it sounds in ears.
I do have a UAFX Dream 65 at the end of my board and used that at rehearsal on Thursday using IEMS (essentially "silent stage") -- it sounded flipping amazing in ears.
Anything with a built in load + cab simulation is a god send IMHO;
But, using that still doesn't showcase the real sound of the amps demo'd.

 

[Gasp100]

That’s true. As it turns out, the pros aren’t looking for a real amp tone. They’re looking for a sound that meets or exceeds the requirements of the job / song / band for which they’re hired to play guitar.

I disagree completely. The "pro's" are looking first and foremost for great core amp tone.
Then, if required they find top notch devices that help them in certain situations for low/no volume.
If not, every "pro" would be using digital modeling or Fender Tonemasters with the internal speaker defeated.

 

[NailedIntoBarrels]

It is so incredibly easily to manipulate the resultant tone changing IR's.

The exact same could be said for mic choice and position on a real cab though. With a good load box the amp responds in the same way, and an IR will sound pretty much identical to the same real cab mic'd in the same position with the same mic, minus maybe some speaker distortion. I think the Ox Box even simulates that too.

 

[Gasp100]

The exact same could be said for mic choice and position on a real cab though. With a good load box the amp responds in the same way, and an IR will sound pretty much identical to the same real cab mic'd in the same position with the same mic, minus maybe some speaker distortion. I think the Ox Box even simulates that too.

I'm talking more about a simple amp in the room demo with a decent iPhone recording.

 

[gegarrenton]

I'm glad I have no idea what anyone is talking about.

 

[Mr. Shiva]

When I had big amps and was recording for songs I have written, I ended up using a GPDI or Garageband amp sims that I took the time to make sound great. Often times listening back I wish I could get those same tones out of my real equipment.

My buddy had a Kemper, we compared it's SLO100 sim to my SLO100. My amp sounded fizzier and nastier where the Kemper sounded the same but seemed polished. I think often people don't want raw.

 

[LaXu]

Have you ever made your own IRs of your own cabs and compared them to the miced sound of that cab, with that mic, at the exact same position?

I have. The IR sounded pretty much identical to the miced sound. So I have very high confidence that IRs do sound what you would get with that cab, speakers, mic, preamp and mic position.

I think York Audio or someone even posted clips here at some point switching between the real cab and IR.

If you instead complained that a reactive loadbox is not the same thing as running the amp direct to a real cab, then I could agree to a degree, but even that is more than good enough to represent the sound of the amp.

What you hear in the room is largely hearing room reflections and the perceived effect of louder volume.

 

[erickkuhni]

Eh - its more of a made up problem than anything. Whether you mic the amp or use an IR or any other kind of cab simulation, you are always at deficit of what the actual in room sound will be. There is just sound, there is no such thing as the "true" sound, plus, most of the players who buy gear will also find themselves using IR's and other types of simulation equipment. So in that regard while this may not perfectly simulate a particular cabinet's in room sound, it will actually lead to a more consistent experience of how the demo sound is reproduced by an end user. It may not be Hendrix daisy chaining a wall of Marshalls, but it will be a what you hear is what you get type of experience.

Volume is the demon of experience. I've opted for attenuators and mics. There is no question that when you can crank it the tones feel better. But getting the guitar to sit within a mix and also keeping peace with family and neighbors is worth its weight in gold. I could never push my amps the way I like to without an attenuator, so the tonal compromise is worth it.

 

[Gasp100]

Have you ever made your own IRs of your own cabs and compared them to the miced sound of that cab, with that mic, at the exact same position?

I have. The IR sounded pretty much identical to the miced sound. So I have very high confidence that IRs do sound what you would get with that cab, speakers, mic, preamp and mic position.

I think York Audio or someone even posted clips here at some point switching between the real cab and IR.

If you instead complained that a reactive loadbox is not the same thing as running the amp direct to a real cab, then I could agree to a degree, but even that is more than good enough to represent the sound of the amp.

What you hear in the room is largely hearing room reflections and the perceived effect of louder volume.

I disagree. I feel the sounds loaded down into IR are way too controlled. See the amp demo listed above.
I would rather wade through the less than pristine recordings and surmize the effects of room reflections, damping, etc. of a "real" raw recording vs. a neutered load + IR demo.
For amps that offer those things I want to hear that AS WELL to make an informed decision.
But all loaded down + IR all the time is not an amp demo to me, sorry.
(IMHO implied)

 

[Gasp100]

BTW, never once did I mention loud, cranked, or anything else about how the amps are setup.
My Suhr Bella sounds excellent all through the wattage and volume options. I would be happy to demo it in the room at very moderate volumes because I would imagine most others would play it the same time.
Not everything needs to be freaking SILENT; it's an amplifier for godsakes.

 

[tele_jas]

Isn’t this happening live too?

Yep!

I play several shows, like casino gigs, where you aren't allowed to have amps on stage, unless you use a loadbox and don't use the speaker. Other option is using a direct option, like a; Helix, Kemper, Boss GX-100, ect... Otherwise, you have to use the house Pod 2.0

 

[gegarrenton]

I think often people don't want raw.

In a vacuum maybe they don't, but not in a mix. That is literally the main problem for me with modelers, they are way too refined. Honestly not just modelers, but a lot of newer tube amp designs. Much too uniform and smooth sounds. Needs more edge and irregularities.

 

[Goldie Glocks]

We live in an amazing time. We can watch a video on pretty much anything that we are interested in, at the expense and hardwork of the uploader. Amps, stereos, motorcycles whatever. I accept that my results may be different from the YouTuber who uploaded the video and I am more than happy with that. I am just grateful to be able to see and hear videos on stuff I'm interested in.