Am I Buff Enuough?

Bobo Fret

Whatchyou lookin' at?
Messages
648
As much as I hate to ask a buffer question...

I have been using a JHS Little Black Buffer (which I managed to crop out of the picture) first in line after my wah. Been working great until I expanded my board by 5 pedals. Poof...high end gone. And not really a long signal chain as far as I'm concerned.

So...

--Add a buffer at the end?
--Possible the JHS buffer isn't "strong" enough? Is that a thing?
--Pretty sure the Pigtronix Echolution 2 is buffered when on/off. so why not helping?

Other than the Echolution, I believe all the other pedals are true bypass other than a re-housed Dano Talk Back (magenta with robot graphic), but it's through a TB looper. And all but one of those wah-shaped pedals are in the signal chain.

Basic signal chain:
Plug into the wah --> buffer --> all the pedals on the silver board --> back into the Neo mini Vent and through the blue board and off to the amps out of the TC Ditto
IMG_2501_zpsgk2t9z7v.jpg

IMG_2500_zpsxqsrhpzj.jpg
 

Otter359

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
528
A couple follow up questions:
How long is the cable run from buffer to silver board? How long is the cable run from silver board back to blue board? How long is the cable run from blue board to amp?

It looks like there is quite a distance between for your signal to travel. Another thing, any time a pedal is "on" it becomes a buffer. Do you notice the high end loss only when you have no pedals engaged?
 

Chandyland

Supporting Member
Messages
2,537
Is it like a ton of high end and volume gone? Because to me that says there's a partially shorted cable. Have you checked all your cables?
 

Bobo Fret

Whatchyou lookin' at?
Messages
648
Yeah, it's a significant amount of high end loss. Heavy blanket over the amp kinda thing. Regardless of whether effects engaged or not.

I have not checked all my cables recently. I had no issues with the setup before, but maybe the new cables I made to accommodate the recent pedal additions are at fault. I'll certainly check. Not sure I've ever had a bad cable manifest as loss of high end so much as just intermittent/scratchy or no signal at all, but I suppose it's entirely possible.

From buffer to silver board - about 2 feet
Silver board back to blue board - maybe 5 feet give or take
Blue board to (closest) amp - 18 inches
 

drbob1

Gold Supporting Member
Messages
30,125
I would simply add a buffered pedal in the middle somewhere and see how it sounds. Maybe just before the new pedals? Or between the two boards?
 

blackba

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
12,184
Best plan is to start subdviding until you find the issue. I would start with just the silver board with a buffer at the front like you have. Than try just the blue board with the same buffer at the front. Compare that to the whole setup and see what you find. Hopefully you will pair it down to one board or the other. From there again just disconnect half the board and than try the other half.

It may seem tedious, but when I did this I learned a lot. On my big board, I was using a Korg dt10 tuner as my buffer, but also had a buffered Maxon od808 in line. When I compared my signal to straight into the amp is was night and day. I eventually found that either the Maxon or the Korg buffer was fine, but their combination was the issue. I also disconnected both buffered pedals and didn't like the hi end loss. I ended up modding the Maxon to true bypass and keeping the Korg dt10 as my buffer.
 

screamingduck

Platinum Supporting Member
Messages
3,069
As much as I hate to ask a buffer question...

I have been using a JHS Little Black Buffer (which I managed to crop out of the picture) first in line after my wah. Been working great until I expanded my board by 5 pedals. Poof...high end gone. And not really a long signal chain as far as I'm concerned.

So...

--Add a buffer at the end?
--Possible the JHS buffer isn't "strong" enough? Is that a thing?
--Pretty sure the Pigtronix Echolution 2 is buffered when on/off. so why not helping?

Other than the Echolution, I believe all the other pedals are true bypass other than a re-housed Dano Talk Back (magenta with robot graphic), but it's through a TB looper. And all but one of those wah-shaped pedals are in the signal chain.

Basic signal chain:
Plug into the wah --> buffer --> all the pedals on the silver board --> back into the Neo mini Vent and through the blue board and off to the amps out of the TC Ditto
IMG_2501_zpsgk2t9z7v.jpg

IMG_2500_zpsxqsrhpzj.jpg

Off topic but really dig your pedalboard choices, how are you liking the TruTron?
Checked out your music, very nice, really enjoyed all the textures you have going on,very cool stuff!
 

MrMoose

Silver Supporting Member
Messages
2,129
A decent buffer should easily drive about 100ft of cable, if not more. It could be that you need a 2nd buffer, but I think it's more likely something else is the cause
 

Bobo Fret

Whatchyou lookin' at?
Messages
648
OK...

That was tedious AS HELL, but yeah, it was a single bad cable. It didn't seem to make sense that I didn't have enough buffering - I assumed I wasn't anywhere near the ceiling for cable length, but I really didn't know for sure.

screamingduck: You sought ought my music? Damn! I'm glad you like it!!!

OverDrivenGTR: All of the expression pedals are dual-function, so lots of tweak! Most of the things they're controlling are located on a small 3rd pedalboard (not pictured) that is elevated so I can reach it with my hands. This board runs through my amps' effects loops and I use my hands/feet for real-time tweaking. Bad back made me to do it, but from a tweaking standpoint, shoulda done this years ago! Way fun! Got the idea from Gibby Haynes (Butthole Surfers singer) in the mid '80's who used to keep a multi-effects processor on a stand next to him so he could tweak in real time. Johnny on the spot that I am, it took me 30 years and a bad back to get around to doing likewise.
 

Clark GriswoId

Looks Great. Little Full, Lotta Sap.
Silver Supporting Member
Messages
3,947
Yeah, it's a significant amount of high end loss. Heavy blanket over the amp kinda thing. Regardless of whether effects engaged or not.

I have not checked all my cables recently. I had no issues with the setup before, but maybe the new cables I made to accommodate the recent pedal additions are at fault. I'll certainly check. Not sure I've ever had a bad cable manifest as loss of high end so much as just intermittent/scratchy or no signal at all, but I suppose it's entirely possible

From buffer to silver board - about 2 feet
Silver board back to blue board - maybe 5 feet give or take
Blue board to (closest) amp - 18 inches


Edit:
Glad you found the bad cable


Its a cable, one of the pedals, etc. Thats a lot man. Put a buffer at the end and see, but i think something else is going on- underpowered pedal maybe?
 




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